| 03:53.00 | pez2001 | could someone try to finger hello@leckerbrei.homeip.net ? |
| 03:53.12 | pez2001 | would be great.... |
| 03:54.32 | pez2001 | and how can i exclude the atd syslog messages? |
| 03:55.09 | pez2001 | anyone tried it yet ...or is this a ghost channel ? ;-) |
| 03:57.47 | Stripes_ | unable to resolve address |
| 04:02.02 | pez2001 | hmm then my ip.... |
| 04:02.13 | pez2001 | will check dyndns |
| 04:02.46 | pez2001 | GNU Finger Daemon |
| 04:02.52 | pez2001 | argh |
| 04:03.49 | pez2001 | 80.134.188.75 |
| 04:06.32 | pez2001 | does it work? |
| 04:11.47 | redman123 | can anyone help a newbie |
| 04:11.47 | redman123 | @find GPRS connectivity |
| 04:13.57 | pez2001 | why is using usb cradle network getting frequently crc errors??? |
| 04:14.09 | pez2001 | i mean packet crc's .... |
| 04:14.39 | pez2001 | it resends it.. but it is just irritating...is the connection so bad???? |
| 04:17.28 | pez2001 | and where can i get the todolist application source???? |
| 04:19.20 | pez2001 | anyone here wants a finger server for the zaurus??? |
| 04:19.21 | pez2001 | then i would package it .... |
| 04:22.29 | redman123 | @find GPRS |
| 04:24.22 | pez2001 | plz try this "finger pez2001@80.134.188.75" and please msg me what it shows...im debugging this crap at the moment |
| 04:53.58 | Twiun | mornin' all |
| 04:56.05 | pez2001 | morning |
| 04:56.20 | pez2001 | twiun could you test my finger server port? |
| 04:56.32 | pez2001 | finger pez2001@80.134.188.75" |
| 04:56.34 | pez2001 | finger pez2001@80.134.188.75 |
| 04:57.32 | Twiun | one sec.... need to install finger |
| 04:58.46 | Twiun | here you go... |
| 04:58.49 | Twiun | [80.134.188.75] |
| 04:58.49 | Twiun | This is a custom finger server by Mike Shanzer <shanzer@foobar.com> |
| 04:58.49 | Twiun | and Greg A. Woods <woods@planix.com>. |
| 04:58.49 | Twiun | Ported to Zaurus by Tim 'PeZ2001' <feckelburger@gmx.net> |
| 04:58.49 | Twiun | ---- |
| 04:58.51 | Twiun | this is the first .plan served from a Zaurus. |
| 04:58.57 | pez2001 | cool.... |
| 04:58.59 | Twiun | best add a final <CR> though... |
| 04:59.12 | pez2001 | thats what i wanted to see |
| 05:00.55 | pez2001 | added ;-)) |
| 05:01.01 | Twiun | cool ;-) |
| 05:01.17 | pez2001 | i really would like to package this port.... |
| 05:01.42 | pez2001 | but i never did that before .... sad story - i know ;-) |
| 05:02.25 | pez2001 | and how cool is syslog imho.... the remote feature kicks ass... |
| 05:04.56 | Twiun | Hehe |
| 05:05.20 | Twiun | I quite like doing "ssh zaurus tail -f somelog" |
| 07:09.16 | kolla | oh.. so that's why there's no pinball for zaurus |
| 07:09.33 | TheMasterMind1 | why? |
| 07:14.01 | JasonNJ | morning |
| 07:14.51 | DaJoker | morning JasonNJ |
| 07:14.58 | Twiun | hey Jason |
| 07:15.37 | Cloudchaser | 'mornin everyone |
| 07:20.07 | TheMasterMind1 | hi |
| 07:21.02 | zecke | hi bipolar |
| 07:21.08 | zecke | bipolar: feel brave? |
| 07:23.31 | mandrake | good morning |
| 07:24.43 | bipolar | zecke: always! :) |
| 07:24.51 | bipolar | zecke: whats up? |
| 07:24.58 | zecke | bipolar: I think finally one could test KitchenSync |
| 07:25.04 | bipolar | WOOT! |
| 07:25.10 | zecke | bipolar: spend the last days on fxing and rewriting |
| 07:25.16 | bipolar | zecke: but I'd need kde 3.1 for that, right? |
| 07:25.23 | zecke | bipolar: I did not test Category handling |
| 07:25.36 | zecke | bipolar: I think you really need kde3.1 |
| 07:25.47 | bipolar | zecke: damn... and sid is waito |
| 07:25.55 | bipolar | zecke: damn... and sid is waiting on a gcc 3.2 doc/plan |
| 07:26.04 | zecke | ? |
| 07:26.26 | bipolar | zecke: I don't have a build system for kde 3.1 set up. |
| 07:26.32 | bipolar | zecke: I nee |
| 07:27.06 | bipolar | I need to get 3.1 installed. I wish it was in debain unstable. |
| 07:28.11 | bipolar | zecke: I REALLY want to try that kitchensync out. |
| 07:28.39 | zecke | bipolar: I today made it sync again. Addressbook and Todolist where tested |
| 07:28.54 | zecke | bipolar: but I think it got some failures... |
| 07:29.02 | bipolar | zecke: but it would take a long time to compile kde3.1. Do you know the fastest way to get it up and running? |
| 07:29.14 | bipolar | zecke: you don't run debain by chance, do you? :) |
| 07:29.19 | zecke | sid |
| 07:29.24 | bipolar | yay |
| 07:29.32 | bipolar | zecke: did you build debs? |
| 07:29.39 | zecke | But I currently try to switch to gcc3.2... |
| 07:29.43 | zecke | no no debs |
| 07:29.48 | zecke | all in /usr/local/qt3 |
| 07:29.52 | zecke | and /usr/local/kde3 |
| 07:29.53 | bipolar | zecke: or could you make a tgz? :) |
| 07:30.06 | zecke | it's gcc2 compiled |
| 07:30.08 | mandrake | KitchenSync is an actual product name |
| 07:30.13 | zecke | mandrake: where? |
| 07:30.24 | mandrake | it's the sync device you bought to go with VideoToaster |
| 07:30.41 | mandrake | unless everybody has forgotten about video toaster :) |
| 07:30.59 | bipolar | mandrake: yep. |
| 07:31.05 | mandrake | I haven't |
| 07:31.06 | bipolar | mandrake: so has google :) |
| 07:32.06 | mandrake | tada |
| 07:32.12 | mandrake | KitchenSync TBC |
| 07:32.18 | mandrake | (time-based corrector) |
| 07:32.33 | mandrake | http://www.google.com/search?hl=xx-bork&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&safe=off&q=KitchenSync+amiga&btnG=Google-a+Seerch |
| 07:33.21 | mandrake | so if this is someone in here's project, I'd suggest renaming it |
| 07:33.43 | mandrake | since it's not even spelled differently :) |
| 07:33.55 | mandrake | and it's a fairly popular commercial product :) |
| 07:34.04 | mandrake | (I don't know anyone with a toaster without them) |
| 07:38.35 | mandrake | http://amiga.resource.cx/gallery/KitchenSync.jpg |
| 07:38.39 | mandrake | in fact, there's a pic of one :) |
| 07:39.57 | mandrake | <-- fountain of useless knowledge |
| 07:40.37 | mandrake | of course, now it's quiet in here :) |
| 07:43.50 | zecke | The KitchenSync(tm) |
| 07:44.33 | zecke | http://www.google.com/search?q=KitchenSync&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 |
| 07:44.36 | mandrake | it is trademarked |
| 07:45.07 | mandrake | zecke: I posted a link to a pic of the device itself (with the trademark notice on the name even) |
| 07:45.41 | zecke | mandrake: 'The KitchenSync(tm)' |
| 07:46.05 | zecke | Athlon is a oil in France too |
| 07:46.14 | mandrake | different market |
| 07:46.21 | mandrake | trademarks apply only to a particular industry |
| 07:46.40 | mandrake | HOWEVER, the PC industry is not big enough to have subdivided areas |
| 07:46.51 | mandrake | in fact, even trademark similarity is enough to get you in trouble |
| 07:47.16 | mandrake | company I used to work for 'IntelliPlay' got sued by 'InterPlay' for being too similar |
| 07:47.32 | mandrake | I don't think they would have won, but we settled anyways |
| 07:47.36 | mandrake | cuz it costs money |
| 07:49.11 | mandrake | not trying to be an ass, just trying to prevent future headaches |
| 07:49.16 | benmeyer | http://www.eventhelix.com/RealtimeMantra/Basics/OptimizingCAndCPPCode.htm#Don%27t%20Define%20a%20Return%20Value%20if%20not%20Used |
| 07:49.25 | benmeyer | I am cunfused by ^ |
| 07:49.31 | benmeyer | The called function does not "know" if the return value is being used. So, it will always pass the return value. This return value passing may be avoided by not defining a return value which is not being used. |
| 07:49.50 | benmeyer | Don't define a return value if not used |
| 07:49.57 | benmeyer | in other words set most things to void? |
| 07:50.22 | mandrake | your compiler should auto-cast that |
| 07:50.57 | benmeyer | ? |
| 07:51.05 | benmeyer | cast void to int? |
| 07:51.15 | benmeyer | it is very badly worded |
| 07:51.20 | mandrake | it means, do something liek (void) callSomeFunction(foo,bar) |
| 07:51.39 | benmeyer | ah |
| 07:51.53 | benmeyer | but gcc automaticly does that you say? |
| 07:52.02 | mandrake | most compilers do |
| 07:52.04 | mandrake | dunno if gcc does |
| 07:52.13 | mandrake | gcc isn't nearly as big a piece of crap as it was a long time ago |
| 07:52.16 | benmeyer | when you call a function and don't put void in front |
| 07:52.17 | mandrake | so probably |
| 07:52.46 | mandrake | benmeyer: in theory it allocates return memoryspace anyways |
| 07:52.58 | mandrake | even though you're throwing away the result. |
| 07:53.08 | mandrake | because the function doesn't know you don't care about the result |
| 07:53.27 | TheMasterMind1 | benmeyer: wassup |
| 07:53.31 | benmeyer | yah, so probably a better thing would be to try to make functions not need to return values unless that is the point of a function |
| 07:53.31 | TheMasterMind1 | benmeyer: whats new with networksetup |
| 07:53.38 | benmeyer | not much |
| 07:53.44 | mandrake | benmeyer: error codes are always handy, however. |
| 07:53.45 | benmeyer | tracking down contest winners |
| 07:53.50 | TheMasterMind1 | why |
| 07:54.09 | Twiun | benmeyer: great gui layout idea for networksetup: http://www.iarchitect.com/images/mlstab.gif |
| 07:54.30 | benmeyer | yes, but for example a function that would be called when a button is pressed would never be checked so it should always be a void |
| 07:54.40 | benmeyer | (well in qt it is required to be void, but that is something else) |
| 07:54.46 | bobstay | lmao |
| 07:55.12 | benmeyer | <insert swear word of the week> |
| 07:55.33 | benmeyer | If any of my employees ever made ... |
| 07:56.02 | benmeyer | well they wouldn't be an employee very long :-0 |
| 07:56.40 | Twiun | Hehe, that site's examples of bad gui design is hillarious |
| 07:56.43 | mandrake | oh taht's beautiful |
| 07:56.49 | mandrake | heh |
| 07:57.00 | Twiun | mandrake: all it's missing are two tab sets at the bottom |
| 07:57.22 | TheMasterMind1 | and scrollbars |
| 07:57.35 | Twiun | oh yes, mustn't forget those... |
| 07:57.46 | Twiun | how about a few 1-line high listboxes? |
| 07:57.49 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 07:57.55 | egor | can the serial port be used as a terminal and logoned into using minicom |
| 07:58.41 | benmeyer | yup |
| 07:58.46 | benmeyer | there is even a gui app now |
| 07:58.48 | benmeyer | opie-console |
| 07:58.54 | benmeyer | !=konsole |
| 07:59.34 | egor | ok thanks i tried zconsole but failed |
| 08:02.41 | benmeyer | bla ui files always generate a deconstructor |
| 08:02.56 | benmeyer | adds to bloat and decreases speed just a tiny amount |
| 08:02.58 | benmeyer | but still |
| 08:03.32 | pez2001 | anyone willing to test an ipk? |
| 08:03.43 | pez2001 | freshly made... |
| 08:04.03 | bobstay | of what? |
| 08:04.45 | pez2001 | a finger server |
| 08:05.27 | bobstay | pez2001: matte kudasai :) |
| 08:05.54 | pez2001 | should run directly after installation...no hassle with inetd ;-) |
| 08:06.08 | pez2001 | bobstay: matte kudasai ? |
| 08:07.42 | bobstay | pez2001: wait please :) |
| 08:07.55 | kolla | what use there with a finger server on the Z? |
| 08:08.06 | kolla | "still logged in" |
| 08:08.42 | bobstay | pez2001: problems: |
| 08:08.43 | bobstay | root@zaurus /mnt/cf # ipkg install zfinger-server_0.1_arm.ipk |
| 08:08.44 | bobstay | Installing zfinger-server (0.1) |
| 08:08.44 | bobstay | Configuring zfinger-server.../mnt/card/usr/lib/ipkg/info/zfinger-server.postinst: /etc/rc.d/init.d/inet: No such file or directory |
| 08:08.44 | bobstay | pkg_run_script: `/mnt/card/usr/lib/ipkg/info/zfinger-server.postinst configure' failed: Illegal seek. |
| 08:08.45 | bobstay | ERROR: zfinger-server.postinst returned 127 |
| 08:08.47 | bobstay | root@zaurus /mnt/cf # |
| 08:08.55 | bobstay | but that's on the OZ rom |
| 08:08.59 | bobstay | it may work on sharp |
| 08:09.02 | bobstay | try someone else :) |
| 08:12.43 | kolla | *shrug* |
| 08:12.59 | bobstay | hmm |
| 08:13.08 | bobstay | on openzaurus, there isn't /etc/rc.d/init.d/inet |
| 08:13.13 | bobstay | there's /etc/init.d/inet |
| 08:13.24 | bobstay | is /etc/init.d symlinked to /etc/rc.d/init.d on the sharp rom? |
| 08:13.43 | bobstay | if so, you might want to make it call /etc/init.d/inet for greater compatibility |
| 08:15.41 | kolla | rx "address tcp-stack 'service add finger stream tcp nowait nobody /usr/etc/tcpd in.fingerd'" |
| 08:20.39 | kolla | but I'm dreaming |
| 08:21.12 | kolla | no funny way to address commands on linux |
| 08:21.43 | kolla | address programs, or kernel or whatever |
| 08:22.58 | kolla | </rant> |
| 08:23.08 | BigBoss | darn, missed it |
| 08:23.14 | kolla | :) |
| 08:23.14 | Wintre | bigboss: Not really |
| 08:23.49 | pez2001 | phone ;-) |
| 08:24.04 | kolla | BigBoss: I was just making things up |
| 08:24.32 | benmeyer | how cool |
| 08:24.35 | pez2001 | on the sharp rom /etc/init.d is empty |
| 08:24.51 | benmeyer | if you remove all of the Q_OBJECT calls in uic outputed files you can reduce your binary size quite a bit |
| 08:24.59 | kolla | isnt it a symlink to /etc/rc.d/init.d ? :) |
| 08:25.08 | benmeyer | and if you remove the deconstructors, but leave them in the hearers it does a heck of a lot too |
| 08:25.28 | pez2001 | any idea bobstay how to cirumvent this inconvience |
| 08:25.36 | benmeyer | and changing just 1 copy to a ref saves 1K |
| 08:25.38 | benmeyer | cooool |
| 08:25.44 | kolla | pez2001: fingerd in init.d? |
| 08:25.59 | kolla | odds and evens |
| 08:26.04 | pez2001 | nope in /usr/sbin |
| 08:26.15 | kolla | why init.d? |
| 08:26.23 | pez2001 | because inetd restart |
| 08:26.23 | kergoth | hey |
| 08:26.35 | pez2001 | after adding finger stream.... into inetd.conf |
| 08:26.43 | kolla | killall -1 inetd |
| 08:26.55 | pez2001 | that works? |
| 08:27.05 | kergoth | yes, it does |
| 08:27.06 | kolla | no, I'm just fantasizing again |
| 08:27.11 | kergoth | well, -HUP does |
| 08:27.18 | pez2001 | -1 = restart ? |
| 08:27.31 | kolla | -1 = whatever the programmer of the program wants it to be |
| 08:27.33 | Wintre | -1 is -HUP |
| 08:27.48 | kergoth | inetd rehashes its config file on HUP |
| 08:27.51 | Wintre | Conventionally daemons reread their config files on HUP |
| 08:27.56 | kergoth | yep, inetd is one of them |
| 08:27.59 | kergoth | -1 will work fine |
| 08:28.00 | pez2001 | ah....yes remember it now.... |
| 08:28.13 | pez2001 | ok ill change that |
| 08:28.21 | Wintre | Though it's better to use the symbolic name in case you're ever on a degenerated system where -1 actually means SIGKILL for example ;) |
| 08:28.28 | kergoth | hehe |
| 08:28.37 | initq | is there a linux version of the zaurus synchronizing file transfer software? |
| 08:28.53 | kergoth | initq: qtopia desktop. yes. its on their ftp site. |
| 08:29.14 | kolla | and -HUP means --hamster_users_phux |
| 08:29.21 | benmeyer | make |
| 08:29.24 | benmeyer | heh |
| 08:29.29 | initq | cool thanks! |
| 08:29.42 | kergoth | make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found. Stop. |
| 08:30.08 | kolla | make: what? now? |
| 08:30.20 | kergoth | :) |
| 08:30.20 | kolla | (y/n) |
| 08:30.27 | benmeyer | cool, with using QMap not using the copy constructor can save 400bytes |
| 08:30.34 | kergoth | we're such a bunch of smartasses |
| 08:30.37 | kergoth | tis alright tho |
| 08:30.40 | kergoth | benmeyer: nice |
| 08:30.41 | bobstay | pez2001: eep, can I test it a bit later, something just came up... |
| 08:30.52 | kergoth | hey bobstay, any luck on the bt situation |
| 08:30.52 | pez2001 | k |
| 08:30.54 | benmeyer | is uic a exe or script? |
| 08:31.15 | pez2001 | who wants to test my ipk???? |
| 08:31.19 | kergoth | in my distro, uic calls uic-real, which is a binary |
| 08:31.21 | benmeyer | with just a little bit of post uic cleanup out binaries can be much smaller |
| 08:31.24 | pez2001 | ill send it for free ;-)) |
| 08:31.24 | benmeyer | pez2001: I can |
| 08:31.25 | initq | do many of you feel openzaurus is mora than the version installed by default? my z keeps freezing all the time when I reboot, and many times I hva |
| 08:31.28 | pez2001 | k |
| 08:31.34 | benmeyer | pez2001: meyerb@sharpsec.com |
| 08:31.34 | initq | have to to a hard reset |
| 08:31.36 | benmeyer | what does it do? |
| 08:31.40 | bobstay | kergoth: um, aside from that mail from the nokia guy, no. I'm hoping that a) he'll fix it, and b) the parcel that arrived today is my bluetooth USB dongle, which I shall get working on the desktop and test further the PCMCIA card with. |
| 08:31.50 | kergoth | initq: the reboot twice without suspending hang is kernel issue, and you'll see it in both the sharp rom and oz |
| 08:31.56 | kergoth | bobstay: ah nice |
| 08:32.05 | pez2001 | its a port of a finger server |
| 08:32.13 | initq | ahhh...ok |
| 08:33.03 | pez2001 | finger pez2001@leckerbrei.homeip.net and you'll see the zfinger daemon in action ;-)) |
| 08:34.34 | bobstay | why would you want a finger server on the Z ? |
| 08:34.54 | pez2001 | i like the .plan |
| 08:34.56 | bobstay | heh |
| 08:34.59 | pez2001 | *g* |
| 08:35.11 | bobstay | t |
| 08:35.43 | pez2001 | at the moment the finger server shows my .plan file and and my public todolist entries ;-)) |
| 08:41.05 | kolla | initq seems to have the same problem with his Z as I have with mine |
| 08:41.24 | kolla | "and many time I have to do a hard reset" |
| 08:41.24 | kergoth | the hang on reboot issue? |
| 08:41.29 | Wintre | kolla: It doesn't run amigaos? |
| 08:41.30 | kolla | yes |
| 08:41.33 | Wintre | Oh |
| 08:41.36 | kergoth | just suspend right after turning it on |
| 08:41.38 | kergoth | then you're set |
| 08:41.46 | Wintre | ;) |
| 08:41.57 | kolla | kergoth: ? |
| 08:42.19 | kergoth | kolla: its an issue with rebooting the z without having suspended it at all since boot |
| 08:42.21 | kolla | has there been some "solution" worked out? |
| 08:42.24 | kergoth | kolla: suspend it at least once |
| 08:42.28 | kolla | aha |
| 08:42.32 | kergoth | 'solution' no, its likely a kernel bug |
| 08:42.36 | kolla | ok |
| 08:42.37 | kergoth | our port to 2.4.19 will solve it |
| 08:42.42 | kergoth | cause we're redoing everything |
| 08:42.45 | kergoth | but thats a ways off yet |
| 08:42.50 | kergoth | due to a lack of time on my part |
| 08:42.54 | kolla | ok, but means that it isnt my Z that is faulty |
| 08:43.18 | kergoth | kolla: probably not |
| 08:43.21 | kolla | kergoth: sharp ought to pay you guys for doing OZ :) |
| 08:43.31 | kergoth | i wish :) |
| 08:43.37 | kergoth | i'm so in debt right now |
| 08:43.39 | bobstay | kergoth: you ought to deputize |
| 08:48.24 | TheMasterMind1 | kergoth: ! |
| 08:55.51 | Twiun | JasonNJ: another screenie http://adorphuye.com/test/rotated-test.png |
| 08:56.12 | kergoth | hey Twiun |
| 08:56.19 | Twiun | hey kergoth |
| 08:56.29 | Twiun | how goes it? |
| 08:57.02 | kergoth | not bad, pretty good day so far |
| 08:57.02 | kergoth | you? |
| 08:57.25 | Twiun | banging my head on wonka... yet again ;-) |
| 08:57.39 | Twiun | at least the buildroot works great |
| 08:58.10 | Twiun | kergoth: the low-level pixel manipulation of wonka is macroed... at the byte level... *not* word |
| 08:58.17 | Twiun | kergoth: sucks for doing screen rotations |
| 08:58.56 | TheMasterMind1 | benmeyer: you made the *creator ipks right? |
| 08:59.11 | kergoth | Twiun: ack |
| 09:01.42 | Piete | lo XavierXeon |
| 09:05.49 | XavierXeon | hello |
| 09:07.06 | Pend-Gone | this channel doesn't have a website per say correct? |
| 09:07.28 | Pendalar | dang script |
| 09:09.13 | benmeyer | TheMasterMind1: yes I made them |
| 09:09.22 | benmeyer | Pendalar: kinda |
| 09:09.25 | benmeyer | what you looking for |
| 09:09.29 | benmeyer | www.zauruszone.com/howtos/ |
| 09:09.32 | benmeyer | ibot web |
| 09:09.32 | | wish i knew, benmeyer |
| 09:09.40 | benmeyer | goto the links page |
| 09:09.53 | benmeyer | sweet, reduced my code by another 30K |
| 09:10.00 | benmeyer | The binary that is |
| 09:14.14 | hardwire | blah blah blah |
| 09:15.12 | hardwire | because WE AREN'T CONTROLLED BY THE MAN! |
| 09:15.14 | aj2911 | Hello, Had anyone got Zaurus Sync software working on Redhat 8.0 ? I will be instaling 8.0 on my desktop over the weekend. I was wondering if someone could be kind enough to provide me with tips to get Z working on 8.0 ? |
| 09:15.14 | hardwire | heh |
| 09:15.33 | hardwire | people are so polite when they are new |
| 09:15.36 | hardwire | TOO BAD THEY CHANGE |
| 09:15.41 | hardwire | like me : |
| 09:15.46 | kergoth | hm |
| 09:15.47 | BigBoss | you probably need a version of qtopia desktop that is built with gcc 3.2 |
| 09:15.50 | kergoth | i wasnt polite when i was new |
| 09:15.55 | kergoth | heh |
| 09:15.59 | hardwire | heh |
| 09:16.08 | XavierXeon | hardwire: you are the bedrock of politeness in this channel ! |
| 09:16.15 | Pendalar | no I was more wondering about the people of this channel |
| 09:16.22 | hardwire | and you sir.. are the cornerstone of funk. |
| 09:16.26 | aj2911 | ok, and which kernel-zaurus should I use ? 2.4.18.3 or 2.4.18.5 ? |
| 09:16.31 | Pendalar | I mean listening gathers who develops what, just wonder if anyone is keeping up with it |
| 09:16.40 | kergoth | aj2911: um, the one thats for the kernel you're using |
| 09:16.43 | kergoth | aj2911: uname -a is your friend |
| 09:17.04 | Pendalar | I've gathered kergoth is part of OZ in some way, and br33zy does the inetflash app.. but beyond that.. ;-) |
| 09:17.16 | hardwire | Pendalar your listening skillz are amazing |
| 09:17.24 | XavierXeon | lol |
| 09:17.25 | Pendalar | yep.. it's scary |
| 09:17.29 | hardwire | you should also just look at killefiz and check out who makes what :) |
| 09:17.35 | aj2911 | well, I have not yet installed it, so I do not know the kernel version, and I have only dialup at home, so downloading stuff would be a pain. Am planning to download from office, and take home... |
| 09:17.36 | hardwire | then you don't have to be so slow! |
| 09:17.42 | Pendalar | some people don't post their nicknames on kil |
| 09:18.19 | hardwire | Pendalar: heh |
| 09:18.19 | hardwire | true |
| 09:18.19 | hardwire | Pendalar: so.. you wanna know who is in charge of every project.. and if they are keeping up with it? |
| 09:18.19 | kergoth | aj2911: you havent installed what? |
| 09:18.20 | hardwire | you gonna pay us next? |
| 09:18.21 | kergoth | aj2911: linux? |
| 09:18.28 | XavierXeon | isnt redhat 8.0 shipping with a 2.4.19 kernel |
| 09:18.38 | aj2911 | Redhat 8.0, yes Linux (I would be installing it over the weekend |
| 09:18.52 | kergoth | aj2911: then which zaurus package you install depends on which kernel you use |
| 09:18.55 | kergoth | aj2911: -3 is stock |
| 09:19.03 | kergoth | aj2911: -5 is available via up2date or their ftp site |
| 09:19.10 | aj2911 | I believe -3 is stock for RH7.3 |
| 09:19.18 | aj2911 | hmm |
| 09:19.19 | kergoth | yeah, you're right |
| 09:19.25 | Pendalar | no.. just curious, this isn't my first venture in the PDA world |
| 09:19.28 | kergoth | so regardless, you install the one you need |
| 09:19.30 | kergoth | period |
| 09:19.31 | kergoth | heh |
| 09:19.37 | aj2911 | :) |
| 09:19.46 | hardwire | Pendalar: venture away.. just don't rag on people for being behind the times :) thats all I ask |
| 09:19.52 | aj2911 | kergoth, u helped me yesterday, right ? |
| 09:19.57 | Pendalar | of course not |
| 09:19.59 | hardwire | if you have a lot to offer.. start helping with OZ |
| 09:19.59 | kergoth | aj2911: yeah |
| 09:20.38 | Pendalar | if I continue to develop (and actually come up with something useful) I don't want it to be OZ version this or that.. I'd rather it work on both |
| 09:20.51 | aj2911 | kergoth: ok, well, I did what you told: I checked that /usr/src/linux2.4 was symlinked to linux2.4.18-3 (stock sources), and not to 2.4.19 |
| 09:20.53 | kergoth | Pendalar: apps will work on both |
| 09:20.54 | Pendalar | just from a maintainance view point |
| 09:21.09 | Wintre | Qtopia and OZ are supposed to be binary compatible |
| 09:21.13 | Wintre | That's the goal at least |
| 09:21.18 | aj2911 | kergoth: next, I copied the /boot/config.... to /use/src/linux2.4 and did makeoldonfig; make dep |
| 09:21.30 | hardwire | it does work on both.. I aws referring to not new projects.. but getting other things working overall.. using the OZ buildsystem so that everything has a common home |
| 09:21.33 | kergoth | aj2911: and you renamed it to .config? |
| 09:21.39 | kergoth | aj2911: cp /boot/config-blah /usr/rsc/linux-2.4/.config |
| 09:21.46 | Pendalar | where is the bulk of the Q fork? just GUI API? |
| 09:22.00 | kergoth | Pendalar: its not a QT fork, its a qtopia fork |
| 09:22.00 | hardwire | and mug |
| 09:22.10 | aj2911 | kergoth: everything seemed to went ok. Then I "rpm -e kernel-zaurus", and reinstall the 2.4.18.3 binary RPM. yes, I renamed to .config :) |
| 09:22.18 | Pendalar | my abbr is shorter ;-) |
| 09:22.18 | kergoth | aj2911: okay continue |
| 09:22.20 | kergoth | aj2911: hehe |
| 09:22.27 | kergoth | Pendalar: and makes no sense |
| 09:22.29 | kergoth | Pendalar: :) |
| 09:22.32 | hardwire | heh |
| 09:22.45 | Pendalar | Q, QT, QTP... bah ;-) |
| 09:22.47 | hardwire | woot.. this servo controller came DOA |
| 09:22.51 | hardwire | bastards |
| 09:22.54 | aj2911 | kergoth: After that when I did modprobe usbdnet, I still got all those errors... |
| 09:23.02 | kergoth | aj2911: unresolved symbols? |
| 09:23.19 | Piete | hardwire: thats always fun :) |
| 09:23.39 | hardwire | the micropic is covered in either flux or dog piss |
| 09:23.39 | aj2911 | kergoth: then I rpm -e kernel-zaurus again and tried ti "rpm -bb kernel-zaurus-RHsrc...rpm", yes the unresolved symbols errors |
| 09:23.42 | kergoth | aj2911: you'll probably want to edit /usr/src/linux-2.4/Makefile .. go to the EXTRAVERSION line, ensure that that matches what is after '2.4.18' on your uname -a line |
| 09:23.50 | kergoth | aj2911: i.e. 2.4.18-3 extraversion is -3 |
| 09:23.54 | kergoth | aj2911: then make dep again |
| 09:24.33 | hardwire | I have a giant hole in my pants |
| 09:24.39 | aj2911 | hmm, well, I have screwed around with RH7.3 a LOT, so I guess, reinstall would be a good option, and since I wud be reinstalling, I am planning to go with 8.0 :) |
| 09:25.46 | noda | Bah, reinstalling - no true Linux user ever reinstalls :) |
| 09:25.57 | aj2911 | :)) |
| 09:26.02 | Wintre | noda: Heh |
| 09:26.04 | kergoth | noda: yeah, they apt-get dist-upgrade |
| 09:26.06 | Pendalar | I don't fully understand why you can't upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0 w/o reinstalling... I mean you can upgrade the kernel fine, so why not a simple update |
| 09:26.16 | kergoth | Pendalar: because redhat sucks |
| 09:26.18 | Wintre | Hey, sometimes you don't have a choice |
| 09:26.19 | kergoth | :) |
| 09:26.20 | noda | Pendalar: You can. But redhat sucks. |
| 09:26.24 | kergoth | hehe |
| 09:26.27 | Wintre | Like when you install Caldera, for example |
| 09:26.31 | noda | Wintre: What do you mean? Linux is made so that everything can always be upgraded. It ALWAYS works. |
| 09:26.35 | kergoth | caldera? dear god man |
| 09:26.42 | Wintre | Pendalar: You *should* be able to. |
| 09:26.43 | kergoth | caldera is absolute crap |
| 09:26.53 | Pendalar | it does but all I need it for is a coding shell, so I really don't care.. whatever gives me the least fuss |
| 09:26.53 | hardwire | mwa ha ha |
| 09:26.54 | hardwire | DISTRO WARS! |
| 09:26.54 | kergoth | hardwire: hehe |
| 09:26.57 | noda | Wintre: Maybe your *distributer* can't help you, but hell, I ditched Slackware long ago - I just install everything myself :) |
| 09:27.02 | hardwire | boogie woogie woogie |
| 09:27.02 | benmeyer | Debian rules, but the installer sucks! |
| 09:27.05 | hardwire | blowtorch! |
| 09:27.13 | hardwire | benmeyer: haha |
| 09:27.20 | Pendalar | well I mean if you could just force RHN to see it as 8.0, then it'd send you all the package updates in theory |
| 09:27.22 | Wintre | noda: Yes, indeed, you can always make it work yourself. |
| 09:27.24 | hardwire | I think the last thing you have to worry about with a good distro.. is the installer |
| 09:27.32 | kergoth | hardwire: exactly |
| 09:27.35 | aj2911 | well, I think, the effort to upgrade 7.3 to 8.0 would be the same as re-installing 8.0, and apart from that I will get a "clean" system (hopefully) |
| 09:27.37 | Wintre | I for one have spent enough time doing that that I'm very happy to let somebody else do it. |
| 09:27.58 | Wintre | hardwire: Indeed. Mostly. You use it once every few years on any given machine |
| 09:27.58 | noda | aj2911: Bah. "messy" systems are just as fast and stable. It's not Windows. |
| 09:28.07 | aj2911 | + I do not have broadband (yet), so cannot "update" |
| 09:28.13 | Pendalar | yeah it's just annoying to backup stuff and put it back |
| 09:28.15 | kergoth | 'messy' .. install everythign with your package manager, and all is well |
| 09:28.17 | noda | Wintre: No, you use it *once* on any given machine. Debian never ever needs to be reinstalled. |
| 09:28.34 | aj2911 | noda: thats trus :) but I am desprate to get Z working and don't have a lot of time (unfortunately) |
| 09:28.42 | noda | aj2911: Heh :) |
| 09:29.04 | Wintre | noda: Uh huh. Suuuuure. I've been using Debian for a couple of years now and while I like it very much, I don't have that much faith in their perfection. |
| 09:29.06 | Pendalar | that's a good point, if I was trying to use slackware and it was whipping me left and right, I'd never have time to mess with the Z |
| 09:29.17 | kergoth | Wintre: who said anything about perfection? |
| 09:29.18 | noda | Wintre: rofl, everybody else in the world does :P |
| 09:29.20 | aj2911 | I could install (try) it on the 98 partition, but would like to completely swithc to linux over the next few months.... |
| 09:29.21 | Wintre | At least one of our machines here got trashed by the developer somehow - fucked up his libc package, I think |
| 09:29.25 | kergoth | Wintre: there are numerous things that need fixing |
| 09:29.28 | noda | Wintre: 'apt-get dist-upgrade' will always upgrade you. |
| 09:29.30 | kergoth | Wintre: but i've never had to reinstall debian |
| 09:29.45 | kergoth | Wintre: i've occasioanlly had to use as shell script to force a reinstall of every package in the system, when i hosed it bad.. |
| 09:29.49 | Wintre | It could probably have been salvaged without a reinstall, I'll grant |
| 09:29.53 | Wintre | kergoth: Heh. |
| 09:29.55 | aj2911 | so, coming back to the topic :), has anyone got Z working with RH 8.0 ? |
| 09:30.00 | Wintre | That's not exactly far from a total reinstall, buddy ;) |
| 09:30.06 | kergoth | yeah it is |
| 09:30.08 | noda | Sheesh, this is Linux. As long as the partition hasn't been overwritten, it can be recovered. |
| 09:30.09 | kergoth | i lose nothing |
| 09:30.15 | kergoth | all my code and data is intact |
| 09:30.23 | noda | Hell, even if the partitions are deleted you're okay - gpart is cool :) |
| 09:30.24 | kergoth | all my custom debian packages are intact |
| 09:30.24 | kergoth | heh |
| 09:30.28 | aj2911 | well, I have nothing to salvage anyway :) (all my data is in a seprate partitoin)... |
| 09:30.48 | hardwire | augh |
| 09:31.02 | TheMasterMind1 | gpart - Guess PC disk partition table, find lost partitions |
| 09:31.03 | TheMasterMind1 | sweet |
| 09:31.08 | hardwire | I think some people just don't have computer essence |
| 09:31.08 | Wintre | In any case, there are enough things that can go wrong (drive failures, filesystme corruption, etc etc) that reinstalls are sometimes necessary |
| 09:31.20 | kergoth | hardwire: indeed |
| 09:31.29 | hardwire | like a friend of mine.. wants to install linux and be a linux administrator.. been using it for 3 years.. still having issues thinking |
| 09:31.35 | kergoth | hardwire: haha |
| 09:31.37 | Wintre | The Debian guys have indeed done an admirable job of getting upgrades working correctly |
| 09:31.50 | Wintre | But nothing is perfect |
| 09:31.55 | Pendalar | does mounts= in network.opts work decent for wifi? or is it as buggy as dhcpcd likes to be for me |
| 09:31.56 | kergoth | Wintre: if theyd get kde3 into sid i'd be a happy camper |
| 09:31.58 | hardwire | he has been to linux classes.. but.. its just so stupid the stuff he asks me |
| 09:32.01 | hardwire | oh well |
| 09:32.02 | noda | Hehehe, just last week I've seen a system have to be reinstalled. Somebody did 'tar /home > /dev/sda' instead of 'tar /home > /dev/st0'. Big difference :P |
| 09:32.05 | hardwire | bitching time over |
| 09:32.07 | Wintre | kergoth: Me as well |
| 09:32.18 | kergoth | noda: haha |
| 09:32.31 | noda | gpart recovered the important partitions though. /home, /usr, /var. |
| 09:32.41 | noda | And that, boys and girls, is why multiple partitions are a good thing :P |
| 09:32.47 | TheMasterMind1 | heheh |
| 09:32.53 | kergoth | indeed |
| 09:33.06 | kergoth | multiple drives are often better :) |
| 09:33.16 | Wintre | LVM |
| 09:33.18 | Wintre | mmmmmm |
| 09:33.18 | Wintre | lvm |
| 09:33.24 | kergoth | lvm is spiffy |
| 09:33.35 | noda | We lost the UT server though, unfortunately. Of course, it is a production server running important reports... but hell, UT *is* the most important thing it's serving ;) |
| 09:33.38 | kergoth | hardware raid is spiffy |
| 09:34.34 | hardwire | hmm |
| 09:34.44 | hardwire | so if you lined up 8 or so strangers in a line |
| 09:34.45 | Wintre | Hardware RAID is scary. |
| 09:34.49 | Wintre | Very, very scary. |
| 09:34.50 | kergoth | i love skipping out on all employee meetings |
| 09:34.57 | hardwire | what questions could you ask to see if they are linux compatable |
| 09:35.00 | kergoth | i've got like 2 hours to sit here and do whatever |
| 09:35.19 | Wintre | You will realize how scary the day you turn off your main server, and then turn it on, and find that it won't come up because the RAID controller has died. |
| 09:35.49 | noda | What I hate most is the 2-minute wait for a raid controller to warm up. I still don't understand what they do in all that time... |
| 09:36.00 | Wintre | noda: Spin up all the disks, presumably |
| 09:36.08 | kergoth | Wintre: eh? replace it and you're golden |
| 09:36.14 | Wintre | kergoth: Hahah |
| 09:36.22 | Wintre | kergoth: Sure. What if it's three years old? |
| 09:36.31 | kergoth | Wintre: i have a 4 year old controller |
| 09:36.33 | kergoth | Wintre: its been replaced |
| 09:36.35 | Wintre | kergoth: what if it doesn't happen to write the RAID array configuration to the disks |
| 09:36.40 | kergoth | Wintre: i didnt lose a damn thing |
| 09:36.48 | kergoth | Wintre: eh? it wrote the confirugation on bootup |
| 09:36.50 | Wintre | And what do you do while you wait for a replacement to arrive? |
| 09:36.52 | kergoth | Wintre: on a previous boot |
| 09:37.02 | kergoth | you do the same thing you would do while waiting for a replacement standard scsi controller |
| 09:37.03 | Wintre | kergoth: What controller do you have, a Mylex? |
| 09:37.05 | kergoth | or an ide controller |
| 09:37.07 | hardwire | oh my god |
| 09:37.09 | hardwire | here it comes |
| 09:37.11 | kergoth | the point is, its not a raid specific issue |
| 09:37.17 | hardwire | I do that sometimes |
| 09:37.23 | kergoth | Wintre: AMI megaraid |
| 09:37.25 | kergoth | hardwire: you're scary |
| 09:37.27 | Wintre | Ah |
| 09:37.33 | Wintre | I don't assume that all RAID controllers do that. |
| 09:37.46 | kergoth | hardwire: good idea |
| 09:37.58 | hardwire | YOU JUST WANNA GET RID OF ME! |
| 09:38.10 | Wintre | I don't assume that all controllers are sufficiently compatible that you can just swap a new one in place of a three-year-old one |
| 09:38.24 | Wintre | It'd be great if they were |
| 09:38.46 | Wintre | But something you have to check for any given card, not something you can assume |
| 09:39.22 | hardwire | haha.. that would make a great commercial |
| 09:39.25 | kergoth | haha |
| 09:39.53 | hardwire | do a little animal jog like in "The Animal" |
| 09:42.38 | pez2001 | has somebody installed qtopia qt embedded development stuff and could tell what has to be done |
| 09:43.10 | pez2001 | i want to compile for arm not for x86 |
| 09:43.28 | kergoth | read the howto |
| 09:43.39 | hardwire | ibot howto do stuff |
| 09:43.39 | | hardwire: i haven't a clue |
| 09:43.40 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot xcompile |
| 09:43.40 | | hmm... xcompile is just get ftp://ftp.arm.linux.org.uk/pub/armlinux/toolchain/cross-2.95.3.tar.bz2 , un-tarbz2 in /usr/local/arm and set PATH=$PATH:/usr/local/arm/2.95.3/bin and you're set! much better than the zauruszone howto setup (faster, cleaner, newer, works with more source) or ftp://ftp.arm.linux.org.uk/pub/armlinux/toolchain/cross-3.2.tar.bz2 |
| 09:43.44 | hardwire | stupid bot! |
| 09:43.45 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot howto |
| 09:43.45 | | extra, extra, read all about it, howto is at http://www.zauruszone.com/howtos/ or see xcompile for cross compiler setup |
| 09:43.59 | pez2001 | i read that.... |
| 09:44.06 | hardwire | hey.. can we use the other toolchain ibot? |
| 09:44.13 | hardwire | the bettar more happie one? |
| 09:44.25 | pez2001 | but the link is down and i dont even think it would help me.... |
| 09:44.32 | hardwire | or is that the bettar more happie one? |
| 09:44.42 | kergoth | pez2001: yes, it helps you |
| 09:44.47 | kergoth | pez2001: wait till it comes back, read it again |
| 09:44.50 | pez2001 | but its down |
| 09:45.04 | pez2001 | the howtos are there |
| 09:45.14 | pez2001 | not the qtopia.rpm |
| 09:45.17 | hardwire | hip hop phinominal |
| 09:45.30 | pez2001 | and i think this would be a x86 version..... |
| 09:45.41 | kergoth | pez2001: um, the qtopia sdk has both x86 and arm libs |
| 09:45.56 | kolla | no leg libs though |
| 09:46.02 | kergoth | no, definately no leg libs |
| 09:46.06 | kergoth | bastards |
| 09:46.30 | kolla | americans have a constitutional right to bear arms |
| 09:46.36 | pez2001 | hmmm ok.... so i just compile the libs with standard gcc path and configure options |
| 09:46.37 | kolla | I prefer my human arms |
| 09:46.56 | kergoth | pez2001: and use teh scripts in the howto |
| 09:46.58 | kolla | allthough my name suggest I'm a black bear |
| 09:47.41 | pez2001 | you mean the rpm thats on trolltech.com? |
| 09:47.45 | pez2001 | 1.50..... |
| 09:47.51 | kergoth | pez2001: yes. the qtopia SDK |
| 09:48.35 | pez2001 | i started with the tar.gz and caught up a little..... cause the were no xcompile instructions for it.... |
| 09:54.50 | Speedy2 | Hi all |
| 09:55.09 | kergoth | hey Speedy2 |
| 09:55.16 | Speedy2 | Heya kergoth |
| 09:55.19 | Speedy2 | What's new? |
| 09:56.41 | BigBoss | yo Speedy2 |
| 09:56.48 | Speedy2 | Hi BigBoss. |
| 09:56.56 | Speedy2 | <--- hasn't slept in a long time. |
| 09:57.30 | Speedy2 | What's new with you Boss? |
| 09:57.48 | BigBoss | did you see our tkcWhiteboard? it's way cool |
| 09:58.28 | Infamous | BigBoss...are you part of tkc? |
| 09:58.33 | bipolar | heh |
| 09:58.33 | kergoth | ibot bigboss |
| 09:58.33 | | it has been said that bigboss is like the president of TheKompany |
| 09:58.37 | kergoth | heh |
| 09:58.52 | Infamous | ahh |
| 09:59.55 | Speedy2 | BigBoss: I think I saw the press release, looks very el-neato. :) |
| 10:00.30 | kolla | el presidente de la kompania |
| 10:00.43 | kolla | ke nito |
| 10:01.10 | kolla | press release? |
| 10:03.25 | Cloudchaser | hello |
| 10:04.18 | Speedy2 | Hi. |
| 10:05.39 | tux_mike | hey speedy |
| 10:06.27 | Speedy2 | Hey. |
| 10:07.46 | tux_mike | making progress on my mouse mod :) |
| 10:07.47 | kolla | what's the english term for the reflector you have on your clothes for traffic safety? |
| 10:08.08 | kolla | or in shape of small plastic cards |
| 10:08.20 | kergoth | woa |
| 10:08.26 | kergoth | actually got a bonus check for last year |
| 10:08.32 | tux_mike | wow |
| 10:08.32 | kolla | XavierXeon: hehe |
| 10:08.35 | kergoth | i'm surprised, given we didnt get raises |
| 10:08.58 | kolla | hm.. wasnt affix supposed to be in the feed? :) |
| 10:09.17 | kergoth | kolla: the affix modules ipk is |
| 10:09.21 | kergoth | kolla: the userspace utils isnt atm |
| 10:09.34 | kolla | ok, under what name? |
| 10:10.17 | sumeet_p | hello, does anybody know of a GPS receiver that works with SL-5500D |
| 10:10.33 | BigBoss | sumeet_p: www.pretec.com |
| 10:10.36 | TheMasterMind1 | hmm |
| 10:10.40 | TheMasterMind1 | some new pda on /. |
| 10:12.21 | Speedy2 | TheMasterMind1: New PDA? |
| 10:12.43 | sumeet_p | BigBoss: I can use GPSLite with the CompactGPS? (thanks a lot!!!) |
| 10:12.54 | kergoth | built in biometric auth? sweet |
| 10:12.58 | kergoth | i want one |
| 10:13.21 | kergoth | quick, someone get opie working on it |
| 10:13.26 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 10:13.29 | TheMasterMind1 | shouldn't be too hard |
| 10:13.29 | kergoth | heheh |
| 10:13.30 | Speedy2 | Wow...another PDA based on the StrongARM. |
| 10:13.33 | kergoth | nah, not hard at all |
| 10:13.42 | TheMasterMind1 | openzaurus would work on it |
| 10:13.43 | kolla | Speedy2: palm |
| 10:13.43 | kergoth | Speedy2: surprising eh. wonder how long this one was in the works |
| 10:13.48 | TheMasterMind1 | cept for the kernel |
| 10:13.49 | Speedy2 | For a processor that's more than 5 years old... |
| 10:14.06 | kergoth | Speedy2: well look at their options.. |
| 10:14.16 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 10:14.23 | Speedy2 | How strange...it's not using an IBM PPC |
| 10:14.52 | kergoth | host usb? |
| 10:14.53 | kergoth | spiffy |
| 10:15.01 | kergoth | thatll drain the battery eh |
| 10:15.02 | Speedy2 | Uh-oh...SA-1111? |
| 10:15.07 | kergoth | most likely |
| 10:15.14 | Speedy2 | I hope not... |
| 10:15.21 | kergoth | doesnt say what chip they're using for it |
| 10:15.22 | kolla | what PDA? |
| 10:15.27 | kergoth | http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT7145548309.html |
| 10:15.28 | TheMasterMind1 | kolla: /. |
| 10:15.34 | Speedy2 | kolla: Check Slashdot, it just got posted there. |
| 10:15.52 | kolla | *shrug*... the site "not to be mentioned" |
| 10:15.53 | Speedy2 | kergoth: There are options to the StrongARM, though people just aren't looking. |
| 10:15.54 | benmeyer | http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT7145548309.html |
| 10:16.14 | sumeet_p | Speedy2: what other options? |
| 10:16.17 | TheMasterMind1 | whoa |
| 10:16.24 | kergoth | Speedy2: like what? xscale? OMAP? |
| 10:16.25 | benmeyer | hehe, no damm start button |
| 10:16.27 | benmeyer | sweet |
| 10:16.29 | kergoth | benmeyer: yeh! |
| 10:16.32 | kergoth | looks nice |
| 10:16.37 | kergoth | i like the biometric auth myself |
| 10:16.44 | Speedy2 | Au1100. |
| 10:16.55 | kergoth | Speedy2: whos that from? |
| 10:18.39 | hardwire | G |
| 10:18.40 | hardwire | VATO! |
| 10:18.44 | hardwire | HomIE! |
| 10:18.47 | hardwire | MAn! |
| 10:19.23 | kolla | kergoth: the affix kernel module is in the modules ipk? |
| 10:19.39 | kergoth | kolla: all the modules |
| 10:19.42 | kolla | ok |
| 10:20.22 | JasonNJ | I'm wondering what that Paron costs |
| 10:20.37 | Speedy2 | A finger sensor can't be cheap |
| 10:27.10 | hardwire | imagine dr sbaitso saying werd up homie G |
| 10:27.17 | hardwire | I am so goddamn tired |
| 10:27.19 | hardwire | I barely have a voice today |
| 10:27.28 | Speedy2 | Hahahahah |
| 10:27.31 | Speedy2 | Dr. Sbaitso |
| 10:27.31 | Speedy2 | :) |
| 10:27.36 | hardwire | heh |
| 10:27.41 | tux_mike | iesh |
| 10:27.43 | Speedy2 | Very few people know about it |
| 10:27.49 | treke | I am Dr. Sbaitso. I am here to help you. Please tell me your problem |
| 10:27.52 | hardwire | hardly :) |
| 10:27.55 | kergoth | dr sbaitso? i miss that |
| 10:27.55 | Speedy2 | "Hello, my name is Dr. Sbaitso, and I am here to help you" |
| 10:27.56 | Speedy2 | hey! |
| 10:27.56 | tux_mike | i have some dectalks i can make say some obsenities |
| 10:27.57 | Speedy2 | Beat me to it |
| 10:27.58 | kergoth | and parrot |
| 10:28.04 | treke | or something like that |
| 10:28.08 | hardwire | where is mandrake |
| 10:28.09 | hardwire | heh |
| 10:28.23 | hardwire | he can show up dr sbaitso |
| 10:28.33 | kergoth | yep |
| 10:28.40 | Speedy2 | Funny that speech synthesis still sux today. |
| 10:28.47 | hardwire | hardly Speedy2 |
| 10:28.55 | treke | yeah, those demos are pretty good |
| 10:28.59 | hardwire | it is still quirky but it sounds a lot better |
| 10:29.01 | tux_mike | actually there are some great syths that you cannot tell are a computer |
| 10:29.07 | Speedy2 | It's no where it should be |
| 10:29.18 | Speedy2 | er...you know what I mean. |
| 10:29.52 | tux_mike | hrmmm |
| 10:30.24 | hardwire | Speedy2 your brain to text synthisizer is broken |
| 10:30.28 | hardwire | so is mine |
| 10:30.54 | tux_mike | hardwire: yours is always broken |
| 10:31.01 | Speedy2 | Heh |
| 10:31.07 | hardwire | tux_mike it needs an upgrade |
| 10:31.16 | hardwire | but nobody wants to insert things into my head |
| 10:31.22 | hardwire | I CAN'T WIN! |
| 10:31.25 | hardwire | WHY! |
| 10:31.31 | tux_mike | no one wants to go near your head |
| 10:31.35 | tux_mike | or you :) |
| 10:32.08 | Pendalar | http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT8728350077.html and people think Z is the only choice besides iPaq ;-) |
| 10:32.38 | TheMasterMind1 | that thing doesn't come close to a Z though |
| 10:32.39 | BigBoss | there is that Hitachi chip that the Kaii is using |
| 10:33.04 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: eh? it has usb host |
| 10:33.08 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: and fingerprint scanner |
| 10:33.15 | kergoth | :) |
| 10:33.16 | TheMasterMind1 | usb host is cool |
| 10:33.23 | TheMasterMind1 | fingerprint scanner isn't that big a deal |
| 10:33.23 | Speedy2 | Au1100 has USB host... |
| 10:33.32 | TheMasterMind1 | the Z has a keyboard cf and sd slot |
| 10:33.40 | kergoth | yep |
| 10:33.45 | benmeyer | twice the flash! |
| 10:33.57 | kergoth | Speedy2: what arm instruction set does that use? |
| 10:34.11 | Speedy2 | It doesn't use the ARM instruction set |
| 10:34.14 | Speedy2 | It uses the MIPS instruction set |
| 10:34.17 | kergoth | ah |
| 10:34.24 | Speedy2 | Though it was designed by the StrongARM team... |
| 10:34.25 | Pendalar | Mizi has FM ;-) |
| 10:34.46 | Speedy2 | "MIPS32" ISA |
| 10:34.48 | kergoth | Pendalar: buy a cf fm radio card |
| 10:34.50 | kergoth | Speedy2: ah |
| 10:35.11 | benmeyer | with tmake can you have depends? |
| 10:35.15 | TheMasterMind1 | CF tv would be cool |
| 10:35.19 | benmeyer | to build sub dirs first? |
| 10:35.23 | Speedy2 | That's been discussed (CF TV) |
| 10:35.25 | Pendalar | well if I got to take out my wifi or GCC CF... it really isn't worth it |
| 10:35.30 | Speedy2 | It's possible, but not without a lot of effort. |
| 10:35.32 | Pendalar | only if it's integrated |
| 10:35.35 | kergoth | i should take bets on how long it takes MIS to call me for playing a shoutcast stream |
| 10:35.49 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 10:35.53 | TheMasterMind1 | whats new in opie land btw? |
| 10:35.58 | TheMasterMind1 | any new apps/features/bugfixes? |
| 10:36.01 | Speedy2 | Poppies |
| 10:36.03 | kergoth | nah its pretty calm atm |
| 10:36.06 | kergoth | other than the new buildsystem |
| 10:36.12 | TheMasterMind1 | ah nice |
| 10:36.12 | kergoth | benmeyer: tmake is crap |
| 10:36.22 | kergoth | benmeyer: you can use a subdirs template, but you cant ensure things build in a certain order easily |
| 10:36.38 | kergoth | benmeyer: course opie wont be using tmake anymore, but i dunno about your projects :) |
| 10:36.49 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 10:37.49 | Speedy2 | If GNU/Hurd is anything like GNU/GCC or GNU/anything else, I can only wonder how it will be. |
| 10:38.04 | TheMasterMind1 | benmeyer: your hancom and other control scripts use bash. (i.e. #!/bin/bash at the top instead of #!/bin/sh) |
| 10:38.08 | TheMasterMind1 | there's no bash by default on OZ |
| 10:38.23 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot hurd |
| 10:38.23 | | TheMasterMind1: I don't know, could you explain it? |
| 10:38.36 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot die |
| 10:38.36 | | ACTION takes two shots to the head and crumples lifeless. |
| 10:38.46 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot forget TheMasterMind1 |
| 10:38.52 | TheMasterMind1 | eh? |
| 10:38.58 | TheMasterMind1 | *ibot* cannot remove factoid 'themastermind1' since it is protected by Time. |
| 10:39.12 | benmeyer | say again |
| 10:39.19 | benmeyer | my crearot something |
| 10:39.20 | TheMasterMind1 | benmeyer: your hancom and other control scripts use bash. (i.e. #!/bin/bash at the top instead of #!/bin/sh) |
| 10:39.26 | benmeyer | eh |
| 10:39.29 | TheMasterMind1 | there's no bash by default on OZ |
| 10:39.58 | benmeyer | ah |
| 10:40.06 | Speedy2 | ibot phoenix |
| 10:40.06 | | wish i knew, Speedy2 |
| 10:40.25 | Speedy2 | inot You're supposed to rise up from the ashes and then set fire to us all and laugh all the way |
| 10:40.26 | TheMasterMind1 | and at one point in time they used to depend on qpe-base =1.5.0 i think |
| 10:40.35 | Harlekin | hi * |
| 10:40.41 | TheMasterMind1 | Harlekin: sup |
| 10:41.01 | Harlekin | weekend |
| 10:41.02 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 10:41.10 | TheMasterMind1 | kergoth: was the konq-gifplugin ipk broken too? |
| 10:47.42 | kolla | bah.. I dont see any CF slot on the paron |
| 10:48.30 | kolla | RS232 seems kinda akward |
| 10:48.43 | kolla | but true USB-port is nice |
| 10:49.35 | kolla | so I guess it's ok, you can plug in a USB disk and a VT-terminal |
| 10:49.41 | TheMasterMind1 | yea |
| 10:49.43 | kolla | and network over bluetooth |
| 10:49.53 | kolla | or gprs |
| 10:50.02 | TheMasterMind1 | gprs? |
| 10:50.52 | kolla | general packet radio service |
| 10:51.16 | TheMasterMind1 | hmm |
| 10:51.19 | TheMasterMind1 | interesting |
| 10:51.27 | kolla | I use it all the time |
| 10:51.29 | TheMasterMind1 | isn't that slow? |
| 10:51.33 | TheMasterMind1 | like 1200bps? |
| 10:51.35 | kolla | heh |
| 10:51.38 | kolla | no |
| 10:51.48 | TheMasterMind1 | hmm |
| 10:51.54 | kolla | 4x9600 and thereabouts |
| 10:52.04 | kolla | depends on operator |
| 10:52.16 | kolla | theoretically it can be as fast as they like |
| 10:52.59 | kolla | http://www.gsmworld.com/technology/gprs/index.shtml |
| 10:53.26 | kolla | I use it with my Z |
| 10:53.40 | TheMasterMind1 | cool |
| 10:53.54 | TheMasterMind1 | how much is the hardware/service? |
| 10:54.05 | kolla | bluetooth between Z and my ericsson t39, which has GPRS |
| 10:54.28 | kolla | the service is free, but I pay about NOK20 per MB traffic |
| 10:54.57 | kolla | kergoth: I cant find the affix module |
| 10:55.00 | TheMasterMind1 | ah |
| 10:55.01 | TheMasterMind1 | cool |
| 10:55.15 | kolla | tried reinstalling the kernel modules...uhm.. maybe download it first |
| 10:55.39 | kolla | TheMasterMind1: yes, it very nice since I dont need any wire between the Z and the phone :) |
| 10:55.46 | kolla | can keep the phone in the belt |
| 10:59.30 | kolla | is there a way to get rid of the |Q| menu? as on the screenshots of paron? |
| 11:01.10 | TheMasterMind1 | go to the launcher settings |
| 11:01.34 | kergoth | launcher settings can disable the start menu? |
| 11:02.21 | oGMo | i don't recall so |
| 11:02.31 | TheMasterMind1 | no, but you can get rid of the tabs showing in it |
| 11:02.47 | TheMasterMind1 | hmm, its not saving settings for some reason when i press ok |
| 11:02.50 | TheMasterMind1 | sounds like a bug |
| 11:03.28 | TheMasterMind1 | hmm wtf. it showing all the applets too |
| 11:03.47 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: mantis? |
| 11:03.47 | kergoth | heh |
| 11:04.11 | TheMasterMind1 | no idea what caused that though |
| 11:04.14 | TheMasterMind1 | it was working fine before |
| 11:04.40 | TheMasterMind1 | which reminds me. you can enable irda discovery, but how do you actually use it to see what devices are around you? |
| 11:06.00 | tux_mike | ibot seen kendrick2 |
| 11:06.00 | | kendrick2 <nbs@bolt.sonic.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #zaurus, 19h 18m 58s ago, saying: 'cya's!'. |
| 11:07.27 | kolla | TheMasterMind1: you have to "reboot" |
| 11:07.43 | kolla | I have used irda to "discover" the phone |
| 11:07.45 | TheMasterMind1 | kolla: then what |
| 11:07.52 | kolla | worked ok, quite useless though |
| 11:07.59 | kolla | then nothing |
| 11:08.04 | kolla | it just showed up there |
| 11:08.06 | TheMasterMind1 | oh |
| 11:08.07 | TheMasterMind1 | hmm |
| 11:08.07 | TheMasterMind1 | ok |
| 11:08.10 | TheMasterMind1 | lemme try |
| 11:11.10 | TheMasterMind1 | well, can't find the phone |
| 11:11.11 | TheMasterMind1 | so oh well |
| 11:11.31 | TheMasterMind1 | i was trying it with one of the internet stations in the disney parks and it wasn't working |
| 11:11.35 | TheMasterMind1 | hadn't rebooted |
| 11:37.10 | kolla | kergoth: the libopenobex and ligthread libs at the affix site seem newer than the ones in OZ3 |
| 11:37.17 | kolla | which is kidna odd since they're older |
| 11:37.36 | kergoth | seem newer? |
| 11:38.06 | kolla | version |
| 11:38.16 | kolla | libgthread_1.2-10 |
| 11:38.22 | kergoth | and ours is..? |
| 11:38.27 | kolla | libopenobex_1.0 |
| 11:38.50 | kolla | libopenobex-0.9.so.8 |
| 11:39.04 | kergoth | ? |
| 11:39.11 | kolla | libgthread-1.0 |
| 11:41.02 | kolla | openobex 0.9.8-1 is installed, on the affix site there is libopenobex_1.0.0-1 |
| 11:41.24 | kolla | well |
| 11:42.42 | kolla | the lib installed is 0.9.8-4 |
| 11:44.14 | alp | how do i get a terminal with the z5500? there doesn't seem to be a terminal icon |
| 11:45.41 | kergoth | 'install it |
| 11:45.43 | kergoth | its on your cd |
| 11:45.49 | kergoth | and on myzaurus.com |
| 11:46.17 | alp | ah. better get usbdnet working first then |
| 11:48.52 | kolla | smokes |
| 11:55.28 | tux_mike | http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/28009.html ugh |
| 11:56.14 | Twiun | hah |
| 11:56.42 | Twiun | like it's been said before... if cd's were cheaper, there'd be no point in copying |
| 11:57.19 | ljp_work | but people would anyway |
| 11:57.21 | kolla | kergoth: appearently the connector works with OZ now |
| 11:57.23 | tux_mike | not only that, what about fair use!? there is /legal precident/ saying i can change medias. |
| 11:57.48 | JasonNJ | http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war.html |
| 11:58.47 | BigBoss | it's the same agrument as software copying |
| 11:59.02 | BigBoss | a lot of people that pirate wouldn't buy it in the first place, and don't even really use it when they pirate it |
| 11:59.08 | BigBoss | so the loss of revenue is trivial |
| 11:59.22 | alp | kergoth: catch 22, i can't add a route to the pc on the z until i get a shell on it. and i can't get a shell on it until i connect it. i'm sure this has been done before though.. |
| 11:59.30 | BigBoss | their problem is that not enough people are being exposed to enough music, so sales are down because the only music available is 'N sync |
| 11:59.48 | JasonNJ | http://fatb.oska.com/images/sample_boggie.gif |
| 12:00.09 | BigBoss | a commercial CD shouldn't cost more than $9.95 |
| 12:00.15 | Rince | hiho |
| 12:00.24 | numatrix | Thanks, Jason, just what I needed to blind me this afternoon. :-) |
| 12:00.26 | mark | i have bought so mcuh music after listening to a coiped album of a mate |
| 12:01.03 | alp | how do you get the terminal package in the first place? |
| 12:01.28 | alp | s/package/package installed/ |
| 12:02.47 | Neo|Work | hello etc |
| 12:03.30 | Neo|Work | JasonNJ: is that a carton portrait of you? :) |
| 12:03.40 | Rince | question: with OZ3, I do not see some applications I installed in /mnt/ram - how can I change this? and is there (already) everything ready for PPP-Connections? |
| 12:04.25 | Cloudchaser | hey...happy friday everyone! |
| 12:05.03 | Neo|Work | "There are 250 Million blank CDRs and tapes bought and used this year for copying music in comparison to 213 Million prerecorded audio media. This means the owners are only being paid for 46 per cent of the musical content." |
| 12:05.04 | Neo|Work | uh |
| 12:05.13 | Neo|Work | so all CD-R's are used to store music? |
| 12:05.16 | Neo|Work | funny that |
| 12:05.33 | JasonNJ | http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/buck.html |
| 12:05.36 | Neo|Work | I have no CD-R's with music myself. well, perhaps some, but they are scans from Cd's I own |
| 12:05.38 | JasonNJ | that is hillarious |
| 12:06.19 | alp | is it possible to install the terminal app without windows? |
| 12:06.41 | Neo|Work | and does anyone really believe "copy protected" CD's will stop music piracy? If anything I think it'll increase it |
| 12:06.49 | benmeyer | yah, I have maybe 300+ cdr that are nothing but data |
| 12:07.01 | benmeyer | maybe 6 are audio copies |
| 12:07.03 | Neo|Work | benmeyer: you are LYING YOU PIRATE! |
| 12:07.27 | benmeyer | no, I just do regular backups after one fatefull day in which I learned it really sucks not to |
| 12:07.31 | ljp_work | still doesnt make 'pirating' music legal |
| 12:07.49 | benmeyer | ? |
| 12:07.52 | JasonNJ | http://www.orisinal.com/games/snowbowling.htm |
| 12:08.18 | benmeyer | no, purly on thier argument that most cd'r are just for audio coping |
| 12:08.22 | benmeyer | most for me arn't |
| 12:08.34 | benmeyer | and the very few that are are music I own |
| 12:08.40 | chouimat | I have 1500+ CDs about 40% is copy or my audio that I copied to those cd |
| 12:08.50 | BigBoss | I don't think I've ever burnt a music CD copy |
| 12:08.52 | Rince | Neo|Work: copyrightprotected CDs will stop me buying CDs, that's all. |
| 12:08.58 | BigBoss | however I've bought thousands of CDR's |
| 12:09.17 | Rince | Neo|Work: instead, I will concentrate on the lovely artists who are not famous enough to use a big music-company |
| 12:09.22 | Rince | BigBoss: same to me |
| 12:09.36 | BigBoss | their argument just doesn't make any sense |
| 12:09.39 | XavierXeon | cdparanoia rips new universal and bmg copyprotections |
| 12:09.40 | kolla | Reconfiguring all packages installed to root .......... |
| 12:09.45 | kolla | ....... Terminated |
| 12:09.48 | kolla | ................ |
| 12:09.50 | kolla | ? |
| 12:09.50 | benmeyer | back in the day I used to copy games purly as a collector type thing. DIdn't even play them, just copied them to have them. Ended up tossing them all away a few years ago. Taking up space |
| 12:09.55 | BigBoss | it's like saying "The UN agreed to the Iraq sanctions today because Mondal lost the senate race on tuesday" |
| 12:09.59 | BigBoss | they are two unrelated events |
| 12:10.35 | BigBoss | what they haven't figured out is the more they step on innovative ways for people to be exposed to music, the more music sales drop |
| 12:10.37 | benmeyer | http://www.cartel-info.fr/pbiondi/zaurus/ |
| 12:10.42 | BigBoss | how they aren't seeing it is really beyond me |
| 12:10.50 | chouimat | BigBoss: got some CD-r with very rare or out of print artist |
| 12:11.02 | BigBoss | all they are really going to do is to make pirating a *real* problem |
| 12:11.04 | XavierXeon | pitty is i am not really intersted in copying cd, i want to listen to them nad my cd player does not like copy protection |
| 12:11.06 | treke | maybe they think they are making too much money |
| 12:11.18 | BigBoss | chouimat: see, now that is kind of cool because you can't get it any other way, there is no choice |
| 12:11.29 | benmeyer | what was really amusing was how true that was. Back in the day when audiogalaxy was running I actually bought cd's from the random artists that I found because I downloaded them by mistake when getting some other group |
| 12:11.47 | benmeyer | thus exposing me to music that I never would have found |
| 12:11.53 | chouimat | BigBoss: or band that are not bad but not enough good to buy the cd |
| 12:11.58 | kergoth | benmeyer: yep, very true. happened to me quite a bit as well |
| 12:12.07 | benmeyer | and other then techno (which is mostly in lp form) I havn't bought a cd sense |
| 12:12.23 | treke | I just want it in MP3/OGG because 1) I dont have a stereo 2) I hate switching cds 3) I dont want to listen to the CD player all day |
| 12:12.25 | BigBoss | I have bought so much music because of Napster and internet radio it's unreal |
| 12:12.37 | BigBoss | I love having the CD's |
| 12:12.41 | treke | er same CD all day |
| 12:12.43 | benmeyer | I mp3 all of my music simply so I can run sondra on them |
| 12:12.47 | BigBoss | I like having the packaging, and having this huge physical collection of CD's |
| 12:13.14 | treke | so all my cds sit on a shelf while I listen to the ogg |
| 12:13.39 | chouimat | I have spend about 5000$ for cds in the last 3 years |
| 12:13.46 | Neo|Work | rince: right, copyprotected CD's == me not buying cd's ever again |
| 12:13.53 | BigBoss | I have about 800 cd's, so I've paid my shar into it |
| 12:14.08 | BigBoss | people *will* stop buying CD's with copy protection |
| 12:14.19 | BigBoss | they will then find cracked versions on the net and CD sales will drop even more |
| 12:14.50 | numatrix | BigBoss: we can only hope. They (the ubiquitous THEY of the industry) really need to get a clue. |
| 12:14.52 | Neo|Work | I haven't bought a CD for a long time because in general Cd's in the US are boring mainstream shit |
| 12:15.09 | Neo|Work | Sweden, Germany etc have a lot better stuff that I like |
| 12:15.29 | benmeyer | See I am from Boston where there is always cool local stuff |
| 12:15.32 | Neo|Work | same thing with radio here |
| 12:15.33 | numatrix | Neo, by the way, do you have any idea which of the games you've been working on lately will be the next released? |
| 12:15.38 | BigBoss | honestly Amazon was a godsend because I was able to purchase lots of stuff I couldn't find otherwise |
| 12:15.41 | Neo|Work | numatrix: nope |
| 12:16.02 | Neo|Work | still hard to find good European (especially German) techno/trance etc |
| 12:16.04 | numatrix | Neo; ok, just curious. Do you have a mailing list where you send announcements or should I just keep checking the web? |
| 12:16.06 | chouimat | Neo|Work: mainstream CDs are about 20$ in Canada but the good stuff is between 25-45$ |
| 12:16.40 | XavierXeon | chouimat: that is us dollars i guess |
| 12:16.45 | benmeyer | Neo|Work: all depends if you are willing to buy LP or not |
| 12:16.52 | chouimat | XavierXeon: no canadian dollars |
| 12:17.20 | Neo|Work | benmeyer: I'm not of course |
| 12:17.29 | benmeyer | ok |
| 12:17.31 | Neo|Work | I haven't had (access) to an LP player for oh so many years |
| 12:17.36 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 12:17.39 | Neo|Work | besides, they are useless. :P |
| 12:17.49 | Neo|Work | I'm all for crystal clear "perfect" audio |
| 12:18.02 | Neo|Work | I find no joy in nostalgic raspy sound of an LP |
| 12:18.44 | benmeyer | well there is one LP that I will cerish. Got it from Jen's (my wife) parents. A Care Bear record and on it you can see her finger prints from when she was 5 |
| 12:19.04 | benmeyer | very cute |
| 12:20.27 | BigBoss | oh man, I've got to get a copy, that is my 2nd favorite record of all time :) |
| 12:20.29 | Neo|Work | well, that's differeny. :P |
| 12:20.46 | benmeyer | haha |
| 12:21.49 | BigBoss | my first favorite is Ice Tea Cop Killer |
| 12:21.50 | chouimat | BigBoss: some European band still release their album in LP |
| 12:22.02 | BigBoss | chouimat: isn't that illegal or impossible? |
| 12:22.55 | benmeyer | no, in fact most all beatles albums are released in LP in the us also |
| 12:22.55 | chouimat | BigBoss: I bought the last Iron Maiden, Blind Guardian and Rhapsody as LP (collector edition) |
| 12:23.26 | benmeyer | in boston there is a store that has the new albums with the LP's right next to the Cd's when they come out |
| 12:24.08 | chouimat | benmeyer: now if I can get 18000$ for the new laser turntable |
| 12:28.09 | benmeyer | http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/11/06/2157252 |
| 12:33.19 | oak | so is openzaurus 3.0 the rom of choice? just got my 5500 and wondering what to do with it :) |
| 12:33.58 | levi | oak: Install games. :) |
| 12:34.18 | oak | haha |
| 12:34.44 | oak | what are the must-have games/apps? i saw that there's a doom and a quake port |
| 12:35.33 | benmeyer | puzz-le |
| 12:35.38 | chouimat | oak: exult |
| 12:35.51 | benmeyer | volcano-man |
| 12:35.53 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 12:36.29 | levi | I've enjoyed Candy Cruncher, and if you like xpilot you'll have to get RocketElite. |
| 12:36.41 | levi | And NetHack |
| 12:37.13 | oak | nethack! |
| 12:37.15 | oak | sweet |
| 12:37.17 | numatrix | Nethack is the best ever... |
| 12:37.31 | numatrix | oak: Oh yeah, and it's using the QT interface, so you've got the same iconset as in the qt version. |
| 12:37.31 | benmeyer | ibot seen imm |
| 12:37.31 | | i haven't seen 'imm', benmeyer |
| 12:37.40 | oak | exult looks sweet |
| 12:37.50 | oak | how about as far as apps... dr. z the best media player? |
| 12:37.56 | oak | i'm not gonna pay for anything though :P |
| 12:38.00 | levi | I need to install exult. |
| 12:38.02 | chouimat | oak: but you will need Ultima 7 |
| 12:38.04 | benmeyer | puzz-le is free |
| 12:38.07 | benmeyer | kicks ass |
| 12:38.13 | benmeyer | compile knight and get chess |
| 12:38.16 | benmeyer | or buy it |
| 12:39.43 | numatrix | yeah, chess is good. |
| 12:39.53 | oak | hm need to find ultima 7 :) |
| 12:39.56 | numatrix | oak: I found a really good site with ALL the old ultima games in a game package for really cheap |
| 12:40.01 | numatrix | oak: let me find the link. |
| 12:40.23 | oak | let me search my lan first |
| 12:40.32 | numatrix | benmeyer: btw, you just sent me the question about ethereal; I never ended up doing that, I switched to the gameboyz app soon after it started. |
| 12:40.48 | levi | It's also available on some abandonware sites, if you can't find it elsewhere. |
| 12:40.59 | benmeyer | numatrix: ok where is that? |
| 12:41.07 | numatrix | ibot zsi gameboyz |
| 12:41.58 | benmeyer | numatrix: Jordan or Philippe? |
| 12:42.02 | numatrix | benmeyer: approximately the same speed as the enhanced qtopiagnuboy, but allows the use of the hardware buttons. I still need to add customization for what hardware keys to use, and include that in the launcher app, but it's working pretty well. |
| 12:42.03 | numatrix | benmeyer: Jordan. |
| 12:42.31 | benmeyer | gpl yes? |
| 12:42.47 | numatrix | benmeyer: I know you had a lot of stuff to do with it, but I did go back and make all the suggested changes you recommended after the first version as far as I can remember. |
| 12:42.49 | numatrix | benmeyer: yup |
| 12:42.57 | numatrix | benmeyer: source is available on the website somewhere. |
| 12:43.19 | benmeyer | cool |
| 12:43.35 | benmeyer | I am just going through the list making sure everyone who got a z released something |
| 12:43.44 | benmeyer | a lot didn't |
| 12:43.46 | Neo|Work | I could add that doom/quake aren't really fun to play on a handheld because of lack of buttons and hard to control etc |
| 12:43.56 | benmeyer | well quake isn't |
| 12:43.58 | benmeyer | doom can ben |
| 12:44.00 | numatrix | benmeyer: It's actually a tweaked port of gngb emulator. I'm working on getting a new version working which has a number of really nice features, including an in-game menu. |
| 12:44.04 | benmeyer | and if pen input was there... |
| 12:44.06 | numatrix | benmeyer: Yup, I understand. |
| 12:44.14 | Neo|Work | benmeyer: playable as in fun to play rather than "runs fine" |
| 12:44.15 | numatrix | benmeyer: and gngb is GPL as well. GPL is good. |
| 12:44.22 | Neo|Work | doom runs fine but I wouldn't call it fun to play or anything |
| 12:44.43 | mandrake | GPL is bad. |
| 12:44.48 | mandrake | don't go there. |
| 12:44.49 | mandrake | heh |
| 12:45.14 | numatrix | I'm kinda up in the air about doom. With the right mappings, it's not bad, but I agree neo, that it's hard to have a game like that given the interface of any pda. |
| 12:45.23 | benmeyer | mandrake? |
| 12:45.23 | chouimat | mandrake: I agree |
| 12:45.30 | mandrake | GPL is a very restrictive license |
| 12:45.32 | Neo|Work | if it was written FOR a handheld it might be different |
| 12:45.40 | mandrake | LGPL is acceptable |
| 12:45.42 | mandrake | but GPL is evil. |
| 12:45.46 | Neo|Work | but it's written for old computers (which is why it runs fine) but with the additon of a lot of keyus |
| 12:45.46 | benmeyer | depends on what you are doing |
| 12:45.50 | numatrix | mandrake: the frontend is LGPL if that helps. :-) |
| 12:46.08 | mandrake | LGPL == good |
| 12:46.08 | numatrix | Neo|Work: probably somewhat, but I still think the idea of a 3d FPS is difficult in general on a pda. |
| 12:46.09 | mandrake | GPL == bad |
| 12:46.19 | mandrake | I don't give a crap what BS RMS spews about it |
| 12:46.34 | Neo|Work | numatrix: well, perhaps, but I sitll think it can be very playable |
| 12:46.40 | Neo|Work | heck, I plan o a 3D space sim |
| 12:46.55 | benmeyer | eh, as long as I get the source I don't really care |
| 12:46.59 | numatrix | Neo|Work: just out of curiosity, you planning on using hardware keys to control it or pen input? |
| 12:47.08 | mandrake | well, to be fair I release code under BSD license most of the time |
| 12:47.17 | mandrake | and I can't use any GPL code or libraries in BSD code |
| 12:47.17 | numatrix | Neo|Work: that's one of the things I like about rocket elite; the pen input is very simple, yet powerful and intuitive. |
| 12:47.23 | Neo|Work | numatrix: hardware keys. |
| 12:47.27 | mandrake | it's easy to piss me off about the GPL |
| 12:47.32 | Neo|Work | stylus input is too slow |
| 12:47.35 | numatrix | mandrake: apparently. :-) |
| 12:47.36 | Neo|Work | but would probably work great |
| 12:47.51 | Neo|Work | the support might be in there never the less |
| 12:47.52 | mandrake | since it is still forbidden to use with anything that has a freer license than the GPL |
| 12:47.56 | mandrake | GPL libraries are the worst |
| 12:48.03 | Neo|Work | mandrake: definitely |
| 12:48.14 | mandrake | I mean, don't you want people to USE your library? |
| 12:48.17 | mandrake | sorry |
| 12:48.18 | benmeyer | well it all depends on what you do just like I said. You do a lot of bsd stuff so having non-gpl is good for you |
| 12:48.35 | benmeyer | mandrake: like qt? |
| 12:48.51 | mandrake | after I met RMS and sat down and talked to him and really understood the GPL, I realized how much I didn't want to release any more code under the GPL |
| 12:49.06 | benmeyer | what was the turner? |
| 12:49.19 | mandrake | him opening his mouth |
| 12:49.27 | chouimat | mandrake: ouch |
| 12:49.42 | mandrake | although the KICKER for me was seeing him in action at the first linuxworld |
| 12:50.03 | benmeyer | mandrake: so if you could make a pda what would you make it with? Would you want to go with gpe or somthign entirely else? Or is Qt ok? |
| 12:50.19 | benmeyer | what did he do at the first linux world? |
| 12:50.33 | mandrake | benmeyer: I've been through all 4 viable PDA platforms, palm, qpe, X, winCE |
| 12:50.54 | mandrake | from a heartfelt standpoint I prefer X, because it makes a lot of things convenient for your developers |
| 12:50.54 | oak | anyone happen to hae the dr z media player? (or a better one?) |
| 12:51.08 | benmeyer | yup |
| 12:51.11 | mandrake | but I can understand why you would want specialized apps for your PDA not for your desktop |
| 12:51.16 | benmeyer | ok what eles |
| 12:51.29 | mandrake | so I can see the argument against it. |
| 12:51.47 | benmeyer | yah the whole qtopia desktop is stupid, that is the one place where having the source is good especially on a linux desktop |
| 12:51.52 | mandrake | qpe doesn't bug me so much, except the UI has the same problems that WinCE has |
| 12:52.08 | benmeyer | hehe I don't think anyone think qpe has a good ui |
| 12:52.20 | mandrake | it's adequate |
| 12:52.26 | mandrake | WinCE is worse |
| 12:52.39 | benmeyer | a few things pocketpc does better |
| 12:52.47 | benmeyer | I lover there set time app |
| 12:52.49 | benmeyer | much better |
| 12:52.58 | benmeyer | but yes they do a lot of things wrong too |
| 12:53.31 | mandrake | killing an app is WAY overly complicated in WinCE. they want to 'hide' all the app startup/stop stuff from the user |
| 12:53.49 | benmeyer | simply to be like palm |
| 12:53.50 | mandrake | which just means you end up having to reboot your freakin device since they have the dynamic memory/disk cruft |
| 12:53.56 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 12:54.10 | mandrake | the programming guide for CE says you should never let the user exit out of your app |
| 12:54.12 | benmeyer | well when embeddedXP comes out that should all be solved |
| 12:54.26 | numatrix | mandrake: switching an app is way too complicated, not just killing. |
| 12:54.26 | benmeyer | in theory |
| 12:54.36 | mandrake | numatrix: in CE it isn't usually as big a deal |
| 12:54.45 | benmeyer | I like Matchbox's way of seeing apps |
| 12:54.47 | benmeyer | http://handhelds.org/~mallum/matchbox/ |
| 12:54.48 | mandrake | numatrix: they have the icons for the last several apps you ran in the top |
| 12:54.54 | mandrake | benmeyer: clicking on the titlebar? |
| 12:54.57 | mandrake | benmeyer: that was my idea :) |
| 12:55.00 | benmeyer | ah |
| 12:55.02 | benmeyer | very nice |
| 12:55.08 | mandrake | it's based off another app I started writing called ePAQ |
| 12:55.10 | benmeyer | the bottom bar should be nothing but plugins |
| 12:55.25 | Neo|Work | benmeyer: if the wince clock set app is better, why not clone it? :) |
| 12:55.30 | benmeyer | and there should be a plugin to hide the bar to just the bottom left or something |
| 12:55.38 | benmeyer | Neo|Work: I will |
| 12:55.38 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 12:55.44 | benmeyer | some day |
| 12:56.19 | treke | benmeyer: I took a bried looking at making task switching into an applet. It looks like the only problem would be getting qcop messages for app open and close events |
| 12:56.26 | Neo|Work | I personally think a MENU with (running) apps would be fine |
| 12:56.33 | benmeyer | I Definetly like havint X11 just for the remote desktop side of it. For example hospitals with pda's, the apps running on the server, but displaying on the pda. |
| 12:57.05 | benmeyer | yah QCop is funky, don't liek it |
| 12:57.15 | mandrake | QCop is fine |
| 12:57.30 | mandrake | it's close to the right way to do it |
| 12:57.36 | benmeyer | dcop? |
| 12:57.43 | Neo|Work | hmm, matchbox looks nice |
| 12:57.59 | benmeyer | apps should be directory based |
| 12:58.07 | benmeyer | so instllaing them is just a copy |
| 12:58.26 | mandrake | okay I will be back in a little bit |
| 12:58.31 | benmeyer | k |
| 12:58.46 | Neo|Work | dude, I think it would be awesome to develop a good GUI for pda's |
| 12:58.55 | Neo|Work | too bad there's not $100M readily available to do it. :P |
| 12:59.22 | oak | anyone got ultima7 they could send? found a couple abandonware sites but they're horribly slow |
| 12:59.26 | Neo|Work | with a nice C-based (compiler independent) widget set etc |
| 13:01.25 | tux_mike | neo: tell you what, if i win this 93 million dollars in the next lottery, i'll sponsor it :) |
| 13:01.44 | benmeyer | 100M? why not 1M? |
| 13:02.35 | Neo|Work | benmeyer: well, $1M would be plenty to get someting out there probably |
| 13:02.47 | Neo|Work | but not enough to actually manage to productize it etc |
| 13:02.52 | benmeyer | say 3 guys in ther garage for 2 years? |
| 13:04.33 | numatrix | oak: it's not abandonware. :-) I'll get that link for you |
| 13:04.43 | oak | heh |
| 13:04.44 | oak | k |
| 13:04.45 | benmeyer | As long as the core stuff is GPL type license so it could be viewed and another Qtopia_can't_have_the_code doesn't happen |
| 13:05.10 | numatrix | oak: many 'abandonware' sites are merely sites for old warez. Not that I haven't used them myself, but... |
| 13:05.46 | numatrix | oak: here's a compilation cd with it for 9$: http://www.cdaccess.com/html/quick/eacomppj.htm |
| 13:06.03 | numatrix | In fact, I used to have that compilation. I think it came with SB sound cards at one point. :-) |
| 13:06.25 | numatrix | oak: For the complete set of ultimate games up to that point and a few other games, see this one: http://www.cdaccess.com/html/quick/10for20pr.htm |
| 13:07.37 | Neo|Work | benmeyer: I don't see development as the main issue. it'd be pointless to develop something it it was never used |
| 13:07.45 | benmeyer | ? |
| 13:07.54 | benmeyer | oh you mean who will then us it |
| 13:08.09 | Neo|Work | 'who will then us it'? :) |
| 13:08.11 | benmeyer | ok, then you have a 4th marketing guy who finds companies who wants it |
| 13:08.29 | benmeyer | s/us/use |
| 13:08.30 | Neo|Work | In either case, I don't have $1M either so... :) |
| 13:08.34 | benmeyer | true |
| 13:09.01 | benmeyer | wedding sucks out your pockets :-D |
| 13:10.09 | oak | and your soul |
| 13:10.10 | oak | :) |
| 13:10.43 | benmeyer | nah, your soul gets a friends out of the deal |
| 13:12.15 | oak | i suppose |
| 13:12.17 | oak | heh |
| 13:12.33 | treke | oak sounds divorced :) |
| 13:12.41 | alp | what's the search path for ipkgs? |
| 13:12.43 | benmeyer | anyway |
| 13:12.53 | oak | treke: close, single college student :) |
| 13:13.00 | kergoth | heheh |
| 13:13.24 | scanline | hmm... wonder if that works across channels >:) |
| 13:13.25 | oak | is the opie media player 2 the mp3/etc player of choice? |
| 13:13.35 | scanline | ibot: lart #picogui anonyman[emujr] |
| 13:13.35 | benmeyer | see but in collage once the first day of spring comes around... |
| 13:13.59 | treke | nope |
| 13:14.35 | Harlekin | oak: soon it is |
| 13:14.36 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 13:15.13 | oak | what to use until then? :) |
| 13:15.22 | Harlekin | which pda |
| 13:15.33 | noda | Harlekin: What's the progress on op2 - is there a new version of the codecs now that the API is stable? Or is the API still not stable? |
| 13:15.35 | oak | 5500 |
| 13:16.12 | Harlekin | noda: its not really stable |
| 13:16.26 | Harlekin | noda: and i have a hard time to hunt hte left memory sinks |
| 13:16.43 | noda | Aw. |
| 13:17.14 | Harlekin | oak: what do you want to play |
| 13:17.25 | oak | mp3 and ogg mostly |
| 13:18.31 | oak | not sure if i'll ever need/want to watch mpeg/avi on it |
| 13:18.46 | noda | oak: You will at some point :P |
| 13:18.55 | Harlekin | op2 works |
| 13:18.59 | oak | yeah, once 1GB flash cards are cheap :) |
| 13:19.01 | noda | It's just so COOL. You can show off your Z and say how much better it is than other PDAs :) |
| 13:19.02 | Harlekin | but there are segfaults |
| 13:19.10 | oak | haha |
| 13:19.12 | Cloudchaser | and so does tkc player |
| 13:19.18 | Cloudchaser | (works that is) |
| 13:19.19 | Harlekin | and it uses a lot of mem corruently |
| 13:19.28 | noda | oak: What? Divx5 can fix a 2-hour movie onto 256 meg without much difficulty. |
| 13:19.38 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot mencoder |
| 13:19.38 | | mencoder is probably an excellent mpeg4 encoder that can be used to encode movies for the zaurus, see http://www.mplayerhq.hu and for a frontend use kmencoder http://sourceforge.net/projects/kmencoder/ or use this simple script to convert ibot's movies http://63.194.216.219/zmencoder.sh.txt |
| 13:19.44 | oak | that's true |
| 13:19.44 | treke | or a 128mb CF card :) |
| 13:19.51 | noda | And hell, you could encode the audio with ogg or something, right? No reason op2 wouldn't be able to read it... oh, right, would be too slow to decode though :( |
| 13:19.58 | chouimat | hmmm a 2GB CF card |
| 13:20.27 | oak | 256mb seems to be by far the best buy right now |
| 13:20.33 | oak | 512 and 1gb are horribly overpriced |
| 13:20.35 | noda | Those things consume lots of power since they actually have to spin up. (microdrives) |
| 13:20.48 | chouimat | oak: I paid 65$ for my 64MB |
| 13:20.51 | Neo|Work | ah |
| 13:20.52 | Neo|Work | heh |
| 13:20.58 | Neo|Work | ibot lart ibot |
| 13:20.58 | benmeyer | ksirc is way too bugy |
| 13:21.02 | oak | yeah i have a 64mb right now, but i found 256 for $85 |
| 13:21.04 | benmeyer | someone send me what was just sent |
| 13:21.07 | benmeyer | when I left |
| 13:21.25 | noda | I use SD for storage, so I can use my CF for wireless :) |
| 13:21.27 | chouimat | oak: a 256MB is 229$ here |
| 13:21.38 | Harlekin | noda: ? |
| 13:21.47 | Harlekin | noda: what would be to slow to decode |
| 13:21.48 | oak | yowch |
| 13:22.11 | noda | Harlekin: Well, encoding with Divx5 and vorbis for audio... that'd take a bit more CPU than the Z has to decode, wouldn't it? At the moment, anyway. |
| 13:22.24 | Harlekin | no |
| 13:22.30 | oak | noda: i was pondering going the SD route, but i use CF for my camera and printer, and i dont think i'll need mp3 and wireless at the same time too often |
| 13:22.30 | Harlekin | right now its divx5 and mp3 |
| 13:22.39 | Harlekin | and mp3 uses more cpu then vorbis |
| 13:22.45 | noda | Harlekin: it DOES? Oh, wow :) |
| 13:22.51 | chouimat | oak: they are expensive in Canada |
| 13:23.20 | benmeyer | Harlekin: you sure about that? |
| 13:23.25 | benmeyer | I thought it was the other way around |
| 13:23.27 | noda | Harlekin: Well I'd better start encoding with vorbis then! After all, smaller files and better quality. Is there any reason a Divx5/vorbis video file couldn't be decoded? (or encoded) |
| 13:23.29 | benmeyer | depending on the encoder etc |
| 13:23.31 | chouimat | oak: a 128MB is 99$ and a 512 MB is about 470$ |
| 13:24.15 | noda | Come to think of it, do any encoders let you encode with vorbis? Seems they're all lame or just audio passthrough. |
| 13:24.19 | Harlekin | benmeyer: vorbis 14 % |
| 13:24.25 | Harlekin | mp3 18% |
| 13:24.27 | Harlekin | on ipaq |
| 13:24.29 | benmeyer | offtopic: can anyone guess what this girls favorite color is: http://www.weddingprints.com/mainnew/NewFormWindow.cfm?wid=1634&CFID=199603&CFTOKEN=98609497&image=r01f022.jpg&wpath=0190638&mysize=b |
| 13:24.46 | Harlekin | noda: ogg audio and video in ( windows people call it ogm ) should work too |
| 13:24.52 | Harlekin | most at least |
| 13:24.56 | noda | Cool :) |
| 13:25.02 | Harlekin | just that good encoders for that are still missing for linux |
| 13:25.12 | noda | mencoder? transcode? |
| 13:25.15 | chouimat | Harlekin: my brother use ogm now |
| 13:25.16 | noda | ffmpeg... |
| 13:26.06 | chouimat | benmeyer: black? |
| 13:26.06 | TheMasterMind1 | noda: these fonts are great.. |
| 13:26.06 | TheMasterMind1 | benmeyer: orange? |
| 13:26.06 | Harlekin | noda: i ment that put it together in a ogm / ogg |
| 13:26.06 | benmeyer | haha |
| 13:26.06 | noda | Harlekin: Ah. |
| 13:26.11 | Harlekin | noda: with vorbis sound |
| 13:26.14 | noda | That shouldn't be all that hard to write... |
| 13:26.24 | noda | ogm just means the file is an ogg and it has video, right? I hate file extensions... |
| 13:26.30 | Harlekin | transcode is close at least |
| 13:26.34 | Harlekin | yes |
| 13:26.43 | Harlekin | windows people "invented" that |
| 13:27.19 | noda | God damn, I hate file extensions. |
| 13:27.19 | Harlekin | and xigth hates it |
| 13:27.20 | noda | Naturally. |
| 13:27.20 | noda | It's missing the whole POINT. |
| 13:28.53 | treke | oh man. hancomm sheets word conversion sucks |
| 13:32.25 | zecke | treke: I once were able to duplicate the Deadline click and Complete problem |
| 13:35.03 | chouimat|nap | bbl |
| 14:06.58 | George- | hey |
| 14:07.04 | George- | on release on OZ 3.0 |
| 14:07.09 | George- | well done!!!!! |
| 14:07.54 | kergoth | :) |
| 14:07.56 | kergoth | hey george |
| 14:08.22 | George- | I got linux to connect up to my school network |
| 14:09.17 | mark | hey George- |
| 14:09.19 | mark | blue yonder? |
| 14:09.42 | George- | no |
| 14:09.45 | George- | i'm at school |
| 14:09.51 | George- | and I'm using a fake ident |
| 14:09.57 | George- | for no apparent reason |
| 14:12.08 | George- | re |
| 14:12.34 | George- | the reason I'm called PhAnToM at first is cos I'm using a friend's (ahem) account who's nickname is PhAnToM |
| 14:12.35 | raja | so they are releasing new handhelds on tuesday eh |
| 14:12.58 | George- | Hmm sounds fun |
| 14:13.00 | mark | raja: seeminglyu so |
| 14:13.07 | George- | that was my friend |
| 14:19.47 | George- | oh |
| 14:19.51 | George- | whoops |
| 14:20.24 | JasonNJ | btw I have the scoop on that new linux pda |
| 14:20.31 | JasonNJ | its not in mass production |
| 14:20.37 | JasonNJ | and its not made by IBM |
| 14:20.43 | JasonNJ | ibm did contract work 2 years ago |
| 14:20.46 | raja | and it doesnt have a cf slot |
| 14:20.48 | JasonNJ | on that thing |
| 14:21.00 | Cam___ | go on? |
| 14:21.18 | George- | and? |
| 14:21.22 | George- | looks cool |
| 14:21.32 | George- | but I'm drooling over the next generation 640x480 zaurus |
| 14:21.34 | mandrake | what new linux pda? |
| 14:21.36 | JasonNJ | yeah, well, the company is not particularly stable financially |
| 14:21.43 | mandrake | did I miss something big? |
| 14:21.49 | mark | JasonNJ: are the presumptions that the 640x480 z is for the japanese market at the moment correct? |
| 14:21.52 | JasonNJ | I called them up and the president answered the phone |
| 14:21.55 | George- | mandrake: check slashdot |
| 14:22.38 | mandrake | ahh |
| 14:23.20 | George- | cya all |
| 14:23.20 | George- | I'm off |
| 14:23.47 | Cam___ | it doesn't look as nice as a Z |
| 14:24.00 | Cam___ | even the current one (never mind the clamshell one or a300) |
| 14:54.05 | TheMasterMind1 | anyone using jeod on oz? |
| 14:54.34 | Cloudchaser | no but i'd like to |
| 14:54.47 | Cloudchaser | nice little port scanner app i had before |
| 14:54.50 | TheMasterMind1 | it works, but has to be installed manually |
| 14:55.01 | TheMasterMind1 | i need someone to submit an faq on how to do it |
| 14:55.12 | TheMasterMind1 | or better yet, fix the creator script |
| 14:55.23 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: we should fix the scripts in the buildroot to rip it out of the romimage too |
| 14:55.28 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: for after the fact |
| 14:55.33 | kergoth | (fact being flash of oz) |
| 14:55.34 | kergoth | heh |
| 14:55.34 | TheMasterMind1 | yea |
| 14:55.51 | Cloudchaser | i read some stuff on how to do it once |
| 14:56.05 | Cloudchaser | looked liked a huge pita and my z borked so i don't have any way to get it |
| 14:56.12 | Cloudchaser | unless i re-install sharp rom |
| 14:56.19 | Cloudchaser | and if i do that, i'll just stay with it |
| 14:56.52 | DaJoker | it works just fine with the creator script |
| 14:56.56 | benmeyer | See you all monday! |
| 14:57.09 | kergoth | later ben |
| 14:57.24 | DaJoker | I've been using the same jeod package from creator since oz2.9.someoldversion |
| 14:57.26 | TheMasterMind1 | ok lemme see if i have a jeode ipk |
| 14:59.26 | TheMasterMind1 | DaJoker: how do i tell if its working or not |
| 14:59.41 | DaJoker | run evm |
| 14:59.49 | TheMasterMind1 | ok |
| 14:59.51 | TheMasterMind1 | it runs |
| 15:00.00 | TheMasterMind1 | doesn't do much |
| 15:00.05 | TheMasterMind1 | No initial class specified |
| 15:00.07 | kergoth | TheMasterMind1: install a java app |
| 15:00.18 | DaJoker | the problem that people are probably seeing is more than likely that the java apps rely on sharp specifics |
| 15:00.29 | kergoth | there shouldnt be any sharp specifics |
| 15:00.31 | TheMasterMind1 | yea probably |
| 15:00.35 | DaJoker | they have shell scripts that import sharp crap before running evm |
| 15:00.36 | kergoth | most of our paths have symlinks to fool em |
| 15:00.40 | TheMasterMind1 | last time i tried to test java apps it didn't go too well |
| 15:00.42 | TheMasterMind1 | suggest one i can try |
| 15:00.43 | DaJoker | it's shell logic |
| 15:00.57 | DaJoker | TheMasterMind1: try wapaka.. wap browser |
| 15:01.07 | DaJoker | good for a stripped down ebay.com ;) |
| 15:01.42 | DaJoker | kergoth: like I said..it's the shell scripts needed to run the things that are borked |
| 15:01.55 | DaJoker | they import sharp functions to get env vars like QT dir and crap.. |
| 15:02.01 | kergoth | eh? |
| 15:02.04 | kergoth | what sharp functions? |
| 15:02.11 | kergoth | some script buried in /etc? |
| 15:02.16 | kergoth | find it, we'll include it to fuck with em |
| 15:02.16 | DaJoker | probably |
| 15:02.23 | DaJoker | I haven't looked too hard |
| 15:02.23 | Harlekin | ibot: seen Sniper |
| 15:02.23 | | i haven't seen 'sniper', Harlekin |
| 15:02.42 | DaJoker | I just rip out the env and hard code the scripts the fix em |
| 15:03.01 | DaJoker | but it's something that does need fixed if jeod is 'going to work on oz' |
| 15:03.01 | DaJoker | blah |
| 15:03.04 | numatrix | ibot seen benmeyer |
| 15:03.04 | | benmeyer <~ben@gatekeepernj3.sharpsec.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #zaurus, 6m 8s ago, saying: 'See you all monday!'. |
| 15:03.49 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot: die |
| 15:03.49 | | ACTION takes two shots to the head and crumples lifeless. |
| 15:04.00 | DaJoker | crap.. gotta go pick up my son.. bbl.. |
| 15:17.37 | kryhme | yo yo yo |
| 15:21.34 | TheMasterMind1 | kryhme: sup |
| 15:23.53 | kryhme | TheMasterMind1: how's it goin? |
| 15:24.17 | TheMasterMind1 | kryhme: good |
| 15:31.23 | tux_mike | woah. |
| 15:31.33 | tux_mike | 40 ft sinkhole on lake shore drive |
| 15:39.05 | kolla | thiis Was Funnny |
| 15:39.12 | kolla | hehe |
| 15:43.08 | Com[Plex] | jeesus |
| 15:43.52 | hardwire | http://homokaasu.org/404.html |
| 15:44.12 | kolla | just testing a nice plugin for amirc :) |
| 15:44.19 | kolla | drunk modus |
| 15:44.45 | kolla | drunk, tipsy, morse, kewl and various colours |
| 15:45.05 | kolla | ¯\_/\\_//>\_/_/¯ |
| 15:45.13 | kolla | that was like.. "zaurus" |
| 15:45.27 | kolla | leet :) |
| 16:00.02 | tux_mike | boogie! kdelibs is done! |
| 16:01.35 | Pendalar | guys I was wondering... if I were to code a game |
| 16:01.42 | hardwire | heh |
| 16:01.48 | Pendalar | and it needed a lot of swap, etc... say a 3D sort |
| 16:02.08 | Pendalar | would it run faster with a x11 port to Z, or qtopia? |
| 16:02.28 | tux_mike | if it needs swap it's gonna be slow |
| 16:02.29 | Pendalar | I'd think x11 would have less overhead |
| 16:02.35 | hardwire | I think this question depends on your abilities as a programmer |
| 16:03.02 | Pendalar | that's very true, but I'd just like to see if anyone's done benchmarks of x11 vs qtopia |
| 16:03.20 | Pendalar | if I go through with it, I can't say I want to maintain 2 codes |
| 16:03.38 | tux_mike | i'd say go with qtopia, because that's the user base |
| 16:03.41 | hardwire | they both write directly to the framebuffer |
| 16:03.42 | kergoth | Pendalar: what makes you think X has more overhead? you still have to use a toolkit |
| 16:03.49 | hardwire | X11 requires a bit more overhead for the parsing |
| 16:03.56 | hardwire | use SDL |
| 16:04.02 | hardwire | heh.. and just don't worry about it |
| 16:04.08 | Pendalar | I figured x11 was more streamline as it's been around longer |
| 16:04.15 | hardwire | you gonna use fastGL? |
| 16:04.24 | Pendalar | and would be easier for porting from linux to Z |
| 16:04.26 | tux_mike | just because somethign's older, doesn't mean it's more streamlined |
| 16:04.35 | hardwire | sure it does |
| 16:04.36 | kergoth | in fact, old things get crufty |
| 16:04.40 | kergoth | and often its worse |
| 16:04.40 | hardwire | take joan crawford |
| 16:04.41 | kergoth | not better |
| 16:04.49 | kergoth | hardwire: yep, like i said. crufty. |
| 16:04.50 | Pendalar | I really haven't decided hardwire, as I'm not sure I have enough time on my hands to do this... |
| 16:04.51 | kergoth | :) |
| 16:04.53 | hardwire | heh |
| 16:04.54 | tux_mike | apis usually don't change and get slimiar |
| 16:05.00 | Pendalar | lol |
| 16:05.02 | tux_mike | s/similar/streamlined |
| 16:05.24 | Pendalar | plus most of my coding experience is C |
| 16:05.26 | hardwire | right now X11 is much faster than OPIE/QTopia blah |
| 16:05.32 | br33zy | hey all |
| 16:05.34 | Pendalar | and all this is like 'Java! Java!' bah |
| 16:05.37 | Pendalar | hey br33zy |
| 16:05.43 | br33zy | hey Pendalar |
| 16:05.44 | Harlekin | hardwire: lol |
| 16:05.45 | kergoth | hardwire: wait for gcc3.2 + glibc 2.3.1 + libelf with prelinking |
| 16:05.47 | kergoth | hardwire: :) |
| 16:05.52 | kergoth | hardwire: opie will fly |
| 16:05.58 | hardwire | I said right now |
| 16:06.03 | kergoth | i'm building it atm |
| 16:06.05 | Harlekin | kergoth: and it does not has to do anything with X |
| 16:06.06 | tux_mike | yum yum |
| 16:06.10 | kergoth | Harlekin: i know |
| 16:06.18 | Harlekin | kergoth: that was the best part |
| 16:06.22 | kergoth | :) |
| 16:06.41 | hardwire | X11 does a much better job with utilizing the framebuffer in a rotated state |
| 16:06.47 | Pendalar | wouldn't it be much harder for a port from x with linux to qtopia ? rather than x to x |
| 16:06.49 | hardwire | which if you use an off the shelf zsaurus.. its rotated |
| 16:06.59 | kergoth | Pendalar: depends on what toolkit you used in X |
| 16:07.04 | Harlekin | hardwire: no |
| 16:07.08 | ljp_work | rotate this! |
| 16:07.19 | hardwire | Harlekin ? |
| 16:07.25 | tux_mike | ljp: ever try hancom on OZ? |
| 16:07.28 | Harlekin | hardwire: you maybe want to read about what X is |
| 16:07.34 | hardwire | your right |
| 16:07.37 | Pendalar | heh |
| 16:07.39 | hardwire | I don't know what X is |
| 16:07.40 | Harlekin | or moew what its not |
| 16:07.41 | hardwire | :) |
| 16:07.47 | hardwire | Harlekin what the fuck are you talking about |
| 16:07.51 | hardwire | and if its theory .. you can bite me |
| 16:07.54 | Harlekin | kergoth: explain him |
| 16:08.05 | kergoth | hey dont look at me, i dont know much about X :) |
| 16:08.29 | Harlekin | kergoth: they where talking about display speed |
| 16:08.36 | tux_mike | I know what X is!!! |
| 16:08.41 | kergoth | tux_mike: congrats! |
| 16:08.41 | br33zy | ME TOO!!!! |
| 16:08.44 | Harlekin | kergoth: and hardwires argument was that X is faster then qtopia |
| 16:08.46 | tux_mike | It's the 24th letter of the alphabet :) |
| 16:08.46 | br33zy | so does my dog, I think |
| 16:08.46 | kergoth | you should be so proud |
| 16:08.47 | Pendalar | could I get away with a decent game in qtopia with only c++? and the speed would be decent |
| 16:08.51 | kergoth | Harlekin: ohhh. hah. |
| 16:08.52 | br33zy | i still need to teach her 'ls though.. |
| 16:08.53 | Harlekin | tux_mike: bingo |
| 16:09.15 | Harlekin | tux_mike: and there is a quite famous tv show featuring that letter |
| 16:09.28 | kergoth | hehe |
| 16:09.39 | tux_mike | X Files! |
| 16:09.42 | hardwire | Harlekin so far X is faster than opie in scrolling and rotation |
| 16:09.45 | Harlekin | wow |
| 16:09.48 | br33zy | tux_mike: /etc/x11 |
| 16:09.50 | hardwire | X gives programs a transparent layer to write to |
| 16:09.57 | hardwire | so X takes care of the rotation on a pda |
| 16:09.58 | Harlekin | tux_mike is on a winning trip |
| 16:10.04 | hardwire | and interfacing to the hardware |
| 16:10.07 | hardwire | just like opie |
| 16:10.08 | tux_mike | can I get the files assoicated with X on my system into an X File? |
| 16:10.15 | hardwire | thats why I was compoaring X and Opie |
| 16:10.22 | hardwire | instead of say.. gTK and opie.. which is nothing the same |
| 16:10.22 | Harlekin | hardwire: run qtopia on X |
| 16:10.28 | Harlekin | and you will see its not any faster |
| 16:10.36 | ljp_work | tux_mike: nope, never tried handcom on oz yet |
| 16:10.42 | tux_mike | damn |
| 16:10.53 | Harlekin | as long as shitty gcc compiler is used |
| 16:10.59 | hardwire | Harlekin: run X :) |
| 16:11.00 | Harlekin | as one part of the problem |
| 16:11.07 | Harlekin | hardwire: yeah, did |
| 16:11.10 | Harlekin | with opie on it |
| 16:11.46 | Harlekin | and scrolling is sure not more fluent |
| 16:11.50 | hardwire | but thats sorta adding extra layers there |
| 16:11.52 | hardwire | :) |
| 16:11.55 | Harlekin | no |
| 16:12.01 | Harlekin | read about qpe arch |
| 16:12.04 | Harlekin | itecture |
| 16:12.10 | hardwire | compare scrolling speed in like.. any opie application running on the framebuffer |
| 16:12.10 | Harlekin | understand first |
| 16:12.15 | hardwire | to X scrolling in say dillo |
| 16:12.24 | Harlekin | *sigh* |
| 16:12.47 | hardwire | sigh my fucking ass |
| 16:12.48 | hardwire | :) |
| 16:12.59 | kergoth | hardwire: what extra layers? gtk on X on fb. qtopia on qt on fb. i dont see anything extra. |
| 16:13.08 | hardwire | nonono |
| 16:13.09 | hardwire | heh |
| 16:13.14 | hardwire | nevermind |
| 16:13.19 | hardwire | none of us understand anything |
| 16:13.22 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 16:13.24 | hardwire | truth be told :) |
| 16:13.25 | kergoth | i can count though |
| 16:13.29 | kergoth | and both come up to 3 |
| 16:13.37 | tux_mike | Harlekin: when you run qpe on top of X, arent you eliminating qws? |
| 16:13.51 | Harlekin | replacing |
| 16:14.13 | tux_mike | so therefore, no more layers are added |
| 16:14.20 | Harlekin | yeah |
| 16:14.23 | Harlekin | as i said |
| 16:14.26 | Harlekin | he should read first |
| 16:14.29 | tux_mike | how long till opie can be run stabiliy in this fasion? |
| 16:14.32 | ljp_work | wonk-eye |
| 16:14.39 | Harlekin | tux_mike: not sure, some apps have problems |
| 16:14.49 | Harlekin | tux_mike: and matchbox need more adjustment |
| 16:14.49 | tux_mike | qcop working? |
| 16:14.50 | Harlekin | kittke |
| 16:14.55 | Harlekin | tux_mike: yes |
| 16:15.06 | Harlekin | replaced |
| 16:15.28 | tux_mike | i'd like this, because it would allow for both Qtopia and X apps :) |
| 16:15.36 | Harlekin | still |
| 16:15.42 | Harlekin | a normal customer would not want it |
| 16:15.48 | tux_mike | any screen shots of what you have done so far? |
| 16:15.55 | Harlekin | zecke done a lot |
| 16:16.11 | Harlekin | tux_mike: and you can use our great new compile system to just build it |
| 16:16.12 | tux_mike | shouldn't he be working on kitchensync? :) |
| 16:16.16 | tux_mike | ah |
| 16:16.24 | tux_mike | bbiaf... gonna get food |
| 16:16.30 | Harlekin | http://handhelds.org/~zecke/screenshots/opie/images.html |
| 16:16.58 | Harlekin | http://handhelds.org/~zecke/screenshots/opie/opie-x26-5.png <- there you see (x) and (ok) |
| 16:21.47 | hardwire | when did the opie apps on X thing roll around? |
| 16:21.52 | hardwire | is that with qvfb? |
| 16:22.03 | ljp_work | no real x |
| 16:22.10 | ljp_work | I think. |
| 16:22.12 | hardwire | real x vs? |
| 16:22.15 | hardwire | fake x? |
| 16:22.18 | ljp_work | ya |
| 16:22.30 | ljp_work | zecke converted it and added an x11 build makefile |
| 16:22.35 | hardwire | neat |
| 16:22.37 | Harlekin | its called XNest |
| 16:22.38 | Harlekin | man XNest |
| 16:22.46 | hardwire | Harlekin I know its Xnest |
| 16:22.52 | hardwire | god damnit dude :) |
| 16:22.53 | Harlekin | not qvfb |
| 16:23.04 | hardwire | man Stopbeingaprick |
| 16:23.10 | hardwire | fucking a |
| 16:23.11 | Harlekin | 00:24 < hardwire> is that with qvfb? |
| 16:23.14 | kergoth | man XNestisnotqvfb |
| 16:23.28 | Pendalar | hmm does Quake for Z use swap? |
| 16:23.28 | Harlekin | man getalife .-) |
| 16:23.32 | hardwire | so are you saying qvfb cannot run under xnest? |
| 16:23.35 | ljp_work | man peopleneedtomellowoutdude |
| 16:23.41 | kergoth | man noshitsherlock |
| 16:23.46 | hardwire | thats sorta my question |
| 16:23.56 | kergoth | hardwire: the opie apps are running against qt/x11 |
| 16:23.58 | kergoth | hardwire: not qt/e |
| 16:23.59 | hardwire | but.. it got answered.. by ljp :) |
| 16:24.08 | Harlekin | kergoth: man sherlockisthemacosxfinder |
| 16:24.44 | Pendalar | anyone tried quake yet then? |
| 16:25.20 | Harlekin | Pendalar: it would need serious work to be usefull |
| 16:25.20 | Com[Plex] | hey kergoth., is there a java machine in oz3? |
| 16:25.22 | Harlekin | kergoth: maybe we should include doomorifice |
| 16:25.46 | kergoth | Com[Plex]: kaffe, but only console. twuin has wabba working on direct FB, or you can just swipe Jeode off your sharp rom |
| 16:25.49 | Pendalar | harlekin do you know if it uses swap directly? |
| 16:25.55 | kergoth | Pendalar: eh? |
| 16:25.57 | Harlekin | no idea |
| 16:26.02 | Pendalar | as in if I give it say 32mb extra on a CF... |
| 16:26.17 | Harlekin | kergoth: doomorifice would be cool |
| 16:26.26 | Harlekin | running arround wifi killing explorers |
| 16:26.33 | ljp_work | man whenisxinegoingtogetfixed |
| 16:26.37 | Com[Plex] | okay.. what parts do I have to grab or jeode from the rom? or should it be pretty obvious? |
| 16:26.51 | Harlekin | ljp_work: not sure, current cvs has 2 more serious bugs |
| 16:27.35 | Harlekin | ljp_work: i think i will visit guenther for a hacking session |
| 16:27.49 | ljp_work | hmm ok. |
| 16:28.03 | ljp_work | wont op2 need a xinecontrol change also? |
| 16:28.28 | Com[Plex] | op2 is working great on my z right now. |
| 16:28.44 | Com[Plex] | once I zimaged to 32mb ram. no more mem erors. |
| 16:28.46 | ljp_work | ya, we're talking about opie cvs |
| 16:28.58 | ljp_work | and xine cvs |
| 16:28.59 | Harlekin | ljp_work: not really |
| 16:29.12 | Harlekin | ljp_work: i have it allready adapted and running here |
| 16:29.17 | ljp_work | weren't there xine api changes? |
| 16:29.25 | Harlekin | ljp_work: yeah |
| 16:29.34 | Harlekin | ljp_work: but xine itself is wrapped into lib.cpp |
| 16:29.42 | Harlekin | ljp_work: xine control then uses that |
| 16:29.49 | Harlekin | nice abstraction |
| 16:29.50 | kergoth | hmm, how to get the buildroot to build two toolchains.. |
| 16:29.55 | kergoth | in the same build |
| 16:29.57 | Harlekin | so only lib need to be modfied each day |
| 16:30.02 | kergoth | will need to force it to wipe glibc and rebuild again |
| 16:30.03 | kergoth | hmm |
| 16:30.17 | ljp_work | hmm.. well.. bbl.. |
| 16:30.18 | noda | Build two glibc's? |
| 16:30.32 | kergoth | noda: er, i'm dense, we need one only, but it needs to install it into both locations |
| 16:30.48 | noda | kergoth: Ah, I just did a double-take on that sentence before :) |
| 16:30.54 | kergoth | Harlekin: adding an option to build the C apps with 3.2, and the c++ apps with 2.95.4, to gain optimizations on the c apps while retaining BC |
| 16:31.03 | Harlekin | kergoth actually we could make a oz release, featuring a double set |
| 16:31.07 | kergoth | yep |
| 16:31.09 | Harlekin | will will need a cf |
| 16:31.16 | Harlekin | so people can still run the old apps |
| 16:31.24 | kergoth | hmm, you have the details on how to make that work? |
| 16:31.31 | Harlekin | but our stuff is on qt3, glibc2.3.1, gcc.3.2.1 with prelink |
| 16:31.40 | kergoth | yeah |
| 16:31.45 | Harlekin | kergoth: you need everthing double |
| 16:32.05 | Harlekin | the linker is intelligent enough to find the right stuff during runtime |
| 16:32.12 | kergoth | libqt, libqpe, libopie? |
| 16:32.26 | kergoth | well, not libopie really, dont know of any apps outside opie tha tuse it |
| 16:32.29 | Harlekin | glibc, gcc |
| 16:32.37 | Harlekin | kergoth: yes |
| 16:33.06 | kergoth | now i have to teach teh buildroot to build multiple qts and qpes |
| 16:33.07 | kergoth | hehe |
| 16:33.20 | kergoth | Harlekin: thinks .. considers.. |
| 16:33.38 | Harlekin | to ponder |
| 16:33.38 | Harlekin | |
| 16:33.39 | Harlekin | abwägen |
| 16:33.41 | Harlekin | ah |
| 16:33.42 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 16:33.52 | Harlekin | "grübeln" |
| 16:34.53 | kergoth | this is going to be a pain, i need to make the buildroot know how to build multiple copies of the same thing, but with different opts/vars |
| 16:34.55 | Infamous | you know how too encode movies using virtualdub? |
| 16:34.58 | Harlekin | kergoth: or we switch to a good compiler .-) |
| 16:35.07 | kergoth | :) |
| 16:35.24 | Harlekin | the intel compiler looks promising |
| 16:35.35 | Harlekin | and has nice libs to use all the featured stuff on xscale |
| 16:36.56 | Techie2000 | ibot slashdot |
| 16:54.20 | tux_mike | what do you fear? taco bell. |
| 17:18.58 | Twiun | rehi |
| 17:30.22 | hardwire | relodown |
| 17:30.28 | kergoth | eh? |
| 17:30.28 | hardwire | that just didn't work |
| 18:24.19 | godsmoke|other | can the included media player (original SharpOS) play wmv files? |
| 18:24.54 | badalex | godsmoke|other: i dought it |
| 18:25.26 | godsmoke|other | badalex: is there a 3rd party player that might? |
| 18:25.33 | badalex | godsmoke|other: not yet... |
| 18:25.37 | godsmoke|other | I want to play the bmwfilms movies on mine |
| 18:25.56 | badalex | godsmoke|other: what version of wmv? |
| 18:26.06 | godsmoke|other | badalex: I don't know |
| 18:26.11 | godsmoke|other | how do I find out |
| 18:26.11 | godsmoke|other | ? |
| 18:26.32 | badalex | godsmoke|other: i dont know much anything about wmv |
| 18:26.38 | badalex | godsmoke|other: rencode them..? |
| 18:26.42 | godsmoke|other | badalex: neither do I :) |
| 18:26.43 | badalex | godsmoke|other: windows or linux? |
| 18:26.55 | godsmoke|other | hah ... I'm not going to reencode them |
| 18:26.58 | godsmoke|other | I'm using linux |
| 18:27.15 | badalex | well do you have anything on your linux that will play them? |
| 18:27.16 | badalex | like mplayer, xmms ? |
| 18:27.21 | godsmoke|other | yes |
| 18:27.27 | badalex | what... xine? |
| 18:27.31 | godsmoke|other | yeah |
| 18:27.52 | badalex | well opiemedia player 2 might.. be able to play them then |
| 18:27.54 | badalex | ibot op2 |
| 18:27.54 | | hmm... op2 is a media player which is currently in beta stage, which will be able to play streaming mp3, ogg, and MPEG4 (DivX/XviD) movies, and other formats. The backend uses the xine libs. http://www.adamhooper.com:4242/zaurus/op2_howto.php |
| 18:28.08 | godsmoke|other | badalex: yeah ... I can't use openzaurus |
| 18:28.14 | badalex | it is based on xine soo.... your guess is as good as mine |
| 18:28.19 | badalex | godsmoke|other: you dont need oz |
| 18:28.20 | godsmoke|other | I need some e-mail features that it can't handle yet |
| 18:28.30 | godsmoke|other | oh ok |
| 18:28.51 | badalex | godsmoke|other: rom version? |
| 18:29.17 | godsmoke|other | hmm ... lemmie check |
| 18:29.28 | godsmoke|other | bbl |
| 18:30.42 | badalex | godsmoke|other: well when you get back... go to http://arachni.kiwi.uni-hamburg.de/~harlekin/op2/ and get the opie-mediaplayer2_0.9.1-20020905_retail_rom_arm.ipk and opie-mediaplayer-codecs_0.2.2_arm.ipk |
| 18:30.53 | badalex | godsmoke|other: then install them from the consel |
| 18:31.00 | godsmoke|other | yeah ok |
| 18:31.03 | godsmoke|other | one sec |
| 18:31.32 | badalex | ok |
| 18:31.46 | badalex | consle or however you spell it... |
| 18:31.46 | godsmoke|other | before I install I need to know if it supports wmvs |
| 18:31.49 | godsmoke|other | which is not likely |
| 18:31.55 | badalex | i dont know... |
| 18:32.04 | ElzWhere | anyone know how to start fluxbox on OZ? |
| 18:32.11 | badalex | all i know is it is based on xine |
| 18:32.11 | TheMasterMind1 | ElzWhere: hmm, yes |
| 18:32.20 | TheMasterMind1 | ElzWhere: grab the X script from tjhsst.edu/~agupta/tinyx/ |
| 18:32.30 | TheMasterMind1 | and you probably want xmonobut installed |
| 18:32.39 | ElzWhere | i got it installed both tinyx and fluxbox |
| 18:32.50 | TheMasterMind1 | get monobut too |
| 18:32.55 | ElzWhere | k |
| 18:33.00 | TheMasterMind1 | then change /usr/bin/X to be the same as the one in that link i gave you |
| 18:33.24 | TheMasterMind1 | http://tjhsst.edu/~agupta/tinyx/X |
| 18:33.31 | ElzWhere | http://tjhsst.edu/~agupta/tinyx/X |
| 18:33.35 | ElzWhere | opps |
| 18:36.04 | nagROM | http://www.antisquirrel.com/home.html |
| 18:54.24 | sjborch | Anyone chatting on a Zaurus right now? |
| 18:54.43 | kryhme | often times a lot of people are |
| 18:54.52 | sjborch | cool. |
| 18:55.06 | kolla | I'm not right now |
| 18:55.08 | TheMasterMind1 | why do you ask |
| 18:55.21 | kryhme | i think i would if i had a wap |
| 18:55.33 | kolla | wap? |
| 18:55.39 | sjborch | just curious. I'm most often running Gaim. |
| 18:55.42 | kolla | wireless access point? |
| 18:56.17 | sjborch | I burned up a few bucks at Starbucks testing my Socket WLAN card. |
| 18:56.55 | kryhme | yeah, wireless access point |
| 18:57.36 | sjborch | how do I type the "pipe" on the Z keyboard? |
| 18:57.53 | TheMasterMind1 | shift space |
| 18:57.55 | kolla | fn-space |
| 18:58.01 | kolla | or shift space yes |
| 18:58.28 | kolla | depends wether you're in the opie terminal console or on plain console |
| 18:58.57 | sjborch | thanks, but /nick isn't supported |
| 18:59.13 | sjborch | shift space it is |
| 18:59.16 | sjborch | | |
| 19:00.01 | sjborch | brb |
| 19:04.15 | sjborch|desk | Has anyone tried Xandros Linux? |
| 19:04.36 | kolla | the lindows that works? :) |
| 19:05.15 | sjborch|desk | Can you imagine the flak they'd get if they printed that on the box? |
| 19:06.53 | TheMasterMind1 | xandros? |
| 19:06.58 | sjborch|desk | I've been happy with it so far, but other users don't like it when I lock up the printer. |
| 19:07.23 | badalex | sjborch|desk: so would it run on a 350mhz machine? |
| 19:07.27 | sjborch|desk | The resurrected Corel Linux bundled with Crossover Office. |
| 19:07.30 | TheMasterMind1 | ooh, its debian based |
| 19:07.46 | sjborch|desk | I'm at 500 here, but it should. |
| 19:07.58 | badalex | sjborch|desk: ok, |
| 19:08.11 | badalex | sjborch|desk: what $99 ? |
| 19:08.17 | sjborch|desk | Yes. |
| 19:09.20 | sjborch|desk | I've installed it here at work, and it lets me run LookOut (Outlook) and connect to my helpdesk queue. |
| 19:09.35 | badalex | just use evolution... |
| 19:09.36 | badalex | lol |
| 19:09.40 | badalex | :) |
| 19:09.48 | badalex | well ill bet its nice though... |
| 19:10.26 | sjborch|desk | I'm still too much of a newbie to figure out how to use Samba, etc. |
| 19:10.46 | badalex | me too... |
| 19:10.49 | badalex | lol |
| 19:11.08 | sjborch|desk | It's the "pay as you grow" plan to learn Linux. |
| 19:11.19 | badalex | ... |
| 19:12.21 | sjborch|desk | The graduation test is a blank hard disk, an ethernet card, and tomsrtbt on a floppy. "Download, compile and run your own linux from scratch." |
| 19:12.29 | badalex | sjborch|desk: so is it nice? |
| 19:12.46 | badalex | sjborch|desk: lol |
| 19:12.50 | badalex | sjborch|desk: never done that... |
| 19:12.51 | jbwiv | hello all... |
| 19:13.10 | sjborch|desk | So far it is closer to letting me run Linux at work and still get things done. |
| 19:13.26 | badalex | thats a + then |
| 19:14.10 | sjborch|desk | It's a little "dumbed down" like when you install Ximian's desktop and your computer gets GNOME'd. |
| 19:14.37 | badalex | sjborch|desk: so is mandrake... and redhat a little. |
| 19:14.50 | badalex | i would say mandrake is the dumbed downer of the too |
| 19:14.51 | badalex | lol |
| 19:14.54 | sjborch|desk | Xandros comes with two CD's. One that just "works" and the bleeding edge with KDE 3.0, etc. |
| 19:15.19 | sjborch|desk | I'm going to install the second one at home. |
| 19:15.36 | ljp | gentoo rox |
| 19:15.46 | badalex | proabaly... lol |
| 19:15.51 | badalex | im still scared of it |
| 19:16.07 | sjborch|desk | At least we're starting to have a choice. |
| 19:16.54 | badalex | sjborch|desk: a choice, ill say. there are too many distros to know em all... lol |
| 19:17.14 | sjborch|desk | I liked the comment of "spending a week flogging debian to life" |
| 19:19.11 | badalex | well g2g to a lan party c you guys later... :) |
| 19:19.41 | sjborch|desk | I'd better head home, too. |
| 19:33.29 | Infamous | can anyone help me encode movies to fit on the Z? |
| 19:33.49 | TheMasterMind1 | ibot mencoder |
| 19:33.49 | | rumour has it, mencoder is an excellent mpeg4 encoder that can be used to encode movies for the zaurus, see http://www.mplayerhq.hu and for a frontend use kmencoder http://sourceforge.net/projects/kmencoder/ or use this simple script to convert ibot's movies http://63.194.216.219/zmencoder.sh.txt |
| 19:34.27 | Infamous | well i have virtualdub...i know i can use that....but i'm not sure |
| 19:34.39 | Infamous | and what's better mpeg-1 or mpeg-4 |
| 19:35.44 | TheMasterMind1 | guess |
| 19:43.48 | Infamous | well what are the differences |
| 19:45.13 | treke|home | Infamous: mpeg 4 is usually smaller |
| 19:45.23 | treke|home | mpeg1 is larger and easier to decode |
| 19:45.32 | treke|home | mpeg4 is smaller and harder to decode |
| 19:46.26 | Infamous | ahh |
| 19:47.39 | ljp | and mpeg11 is still top secret |
| 19:47.45 | Infamous | I read on zauruszone.com that the new sharp PDAs will be presented next week.....i still can't decide whether to buy the Z now or wait for the new one :-/ |
| 19:48.07 | ljp | the new one I think is more like a small laptop |
| 19:48.26 | Infamous | well they're presenting 2...one is like a mini laptop |
| 19:49.00 | ljp | ahh maybe an a-300 for US |
| 19:49.14 | ljp | or 5600 |
| 19:49.31 | treke|home | ljp: JasonNJ has said quite a bit that its basicallu 5500 with different hardware |
| 19:50.02 | oGMo | hey, anyone know of a barcode scanner that would work with the Z? |
| 19:50.11 | oGMo | attaching to the serial port is preferable to CF |
| 19:50.21 | oGMo | since i want 802.11b in the CF |
| 19:51.00 | br33zy | whats that one graphical app that can configure x? |
| 19:51.40 | patryk | Has anyone here been able to install software to their Zaurus from linux? |
| 19:51.48 | patryk | (linux on their desktop?) |
| 19:52.38 | oGMo | patryk: ftp myzaurus 4242 |
| 19:52.50 | oGMo | log in as root, put your package in Documents/ and go |
| 19:53.14 | oGMo | with OZ3 you can just scp it over, even easier, or do it over the network (i've never tried that) |
| 19:53.18 | patryk | [patryk@tanooki patryk]$ ftp 192.168.129.201 |
| 19:53.18 | patryk | ftp: connect: Connection refused |
| 19:53.42 | oGMo | er |
| 19:53.48 | oGMo | see the 4242 part :P |
| 19:53.52 | patryk | haha! |
| 19:53.52 | patryk | Sorry! |
| 19:53.53 | patryk | =) |
| 19:53.59 | oGMo | heh ;) |
| 19:54.20 | patryk | heheh |
| 19:54.29 | patryk | excellent |
| 19:55.04 | oGMo | much easier than sync stuff imho |
| 19:55.16 | patryk | absolutely! I mean, I've looked at prolly half a dozen pages |
| 19:55.23 | patryk | and no one mentioned that ftp was running |
| 19:55.29 | patryk | (on that port, etc) |
| 19:55.51 | patryk | How do you get the Documents folder to refresh? |
| 19:56.01 | patryk | restart? |
| 19:57.10 | patryk | Ah |
| 19:57.20 | patryk | looks like the package installer sees it anyway. |
| 19:58.29 | patryk | oGMo-- thanks a lot! |
| 19:58.33 | TheMasterMind1 | USE OPENZAURUS |
| 20:00.27 | patryk | TheMasterMind1: I may give that a whirl. =) |
| 20:06.30 | oGMo | hrmm |
| 20:08.58 | ljp | meow |
| 20:09.08 | oGMo | ljp. |
| 20:09.22 | oGMo | i need to find some info about barcode readers |
| 20:09.50 | oGMo | i have the potential of getting the University of Washington to purchase a number of Z's and some related gear |
| 20:10.30 | ljp | hmm.. |
| 20:10.52 | ljp | barcode reader for Z sounds familiar.. |
| 20:11.04 | oGMo | something i could plug into the serial port would rock |
| 20:12.58 | kryhme | anyone ever mess with frodo? |
| 20:13.18 | oGMo | hmm i see a CF barcode reader |
| 20:13.39 | kryhme | there was one written for that developers challenge |
| 20:13.45 | kryhme | i think it's on zsi |
| 20:14.22 | oGMo | kryhme: hmm |
| 20:15.10 | kryhme | oh, are you talking about hardware |
| 20:15.18 | kryhme | i miessed half the conversations |
| 20:15.31 | oGMo | that too, but the software OUGHT to have pointers to working hardware ;) |
| 20:15.39 | kryhme | true |
| 20:18.56 | hardwire | kryhme doesn't pay |
| 20:18.57 | hardwire | I asked |
| 20:20.09 | kryhme | kryhme does not pay |
| 20:20.20 | oGMo | ah hah |
| 20:20.23 | kryhme | i wish i could get this frodo to work |
| 20:20.35 | oGMo | scanchamp reads crap right off a serial port from one of these |
| 20:20.43 | DaJoker | oGMo: I think prpplague is doing barcode reading with Z's.. IIRC |
| 20:20.51 | oGMo | however, $249 is fucking insane |
| 20:20.59 | ljp | my cat really really wants to eat the cursor |
| 20:21.07 | oGMo | DaJoker: rule, thanks, i'll ask him |
| 20:22.07 | ljp | this si too fun |
| 20:22.53 | ljp | she must be hurting her mouth by slamming the screen |
| 20:24.32 | chouimat|away | ljp: 19" monitor? |
| 20:25.44 | ljp | heheh on one box yes |
| 20:26.35 | chouimat|away | ljp: my cat follow the cursor on my 19" (1920x1440) |
| 20:26.56 | ljp | this one trys to eat it |
| 20:29.01 | hardwire | http://www.bitmicro.com/products_adide.html |
| 20:29.07 | hardwire | $3,950 |
| 20:29.12 | hardwire | sheebidyhoobidy |
| 20:31.20 | ljp | aqwsolid state drives are the future |
| 20:31.24 | ljp | ak |
| 20:40.50 | ljp | this cat is going to break a tooth on my monitor |
| 20:41.45 | Cloudchaser | she trying to chew on it? |
| 20:42.51 | ljp | chasing the cursor.. trying to eat it |
| 20:44.14 | Cloudchaser | hehe |
| 20:55.30 | Cloudchaser | ack! something just dropped me to a login prompt on my z |
| 20:55.43 | Cloudchaser | i think it was opie irc maybe |
| 20:55.51 | ljp | you've been rooted |
| 20:56.09 | Cloudchaser | whats that mean? |
| 20:56.13 | kryhme | lol |
| 20:56.35 | ljp | I'm kidding |
| 20:56.54 | ljp | rooted means someone hacked in and logged in as root |
| 20:57.14 | Cloudchaser | lovely |
| 20:57.19 | kryhme | h4x0r3d |
| 20:58.17 | ljp | there's been quite a few reports of opie crashes lately |
| 20:58.32 | Cloudchaser | hmm |
| 20:58.39 | Cloudchaser | any ideas as to why? |
| 20:59.07 | ljp | not sure |
| 20:59.49 | kryhme | += gayness |
| 21:01.28 | Saurian | Evening all |
| 21:01.34 | ljp | hi] |
| 21:02.00 | Cloudchaser | hi |
| 21:02.42 | Saurian | Anyone know if anyone plans on porting the Perl/QT stuff to the Z? |
| 21:03.19 | TheMasterMind1 | perl is enourmous |
| 21:03.34 | ljp | there is a perl for arm |
| 21:03.47 | Saurian | Yes, but are they porting the QT bindings? }:) |
| 21:03.55 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 21:03.56 | TheMasterMind1 | "they" |
| 21:04.00 | ljp | havent heard |
| 21:04.45 | ljp | someone did PyQt |
| 21:05.13 | TheMasterMind1 | really? |
| 21:05.15 | TheMasterMind1 | where's that at |
| 21:05.20 | DaJoker | riverbank |
| 21:05.23 | DaJoker | ;) |
| 21:05.27 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 21:05.52 | TheMasterMind1 | DaJoker: you think its possible to port phoenix to opie? |
| 21:05.57 | TheMasterMind1 | qt |
| 21:05.58 | TheMasterMind1 | whatever |
| 21:06.04 | DaJoker | TheMasterMind1: have at it |
| 21:06.25 | TheMasterMind1 | what gui does it use |
| 21:06.27 | TheMasterMind1 | i wonder |
| 21:06.29 | DaJoker | gtk |
| 21:06.39 | TheMasterMind1 | bah |
| 21:07.09 | ljp | theres a qt mozilla |
| 21:07.18 | TheMasterMind1 | yea, but its huge |
| 21:07.24 | DaJoker | ljp: yep.. but I couldn't get it small enough to be useable.. |
| 21:09.26 | ljp | start over, and just use the mozilla engine |
| 21:10.33 | DaJoker | the engine alone is pretty large |
| 21:10.42 | DaJoker | 2+ meg |
| 21:11.37 | ljp | strip jacascript |
| 21:11.45 | ljp | javascript |
| 21:11.52 | DaJoker | that's without javascript |
| 21:12.24 | DaJoker | javascript lib alone is 1.6M |
| 21:12.28 | DaJoker | crazy stuff |
| 21:12.33 | TheMasterMind1 | heh |
| 21:12.46 | TheMasterMind1 | did you strip debugging from all libs/binaries? |
| 21:12.53 | DaJoker | of course |
| 21:13.21 | ljp | did you strip before you started writing code? I hear sometimes that helps |
| 21:13.40 | DaJoker | yeah, but only when my wife wasn't around |
| 21:13.59 | TheMasterMind1 | lol |
| 21:14.05 | TheMasterMind1 | was or wasn't ? |
| 21:14.08 | TheMasterMind1 | ;) |
| 21:14.30 | DaJoker | wasn't.. I'd never get any coding done.. she'd just want sex.. |
| 21:14.38 | DaJoker | ;) |
| 21:14.39 | TheMasterMind1 | lol |
| 21:48.26 | jb_ | any QT people out there know if there's a way to find the x/y position of a particular row/column in a QMultiLineEdit? |
| 21:51.46 | rikkus | move the cursor there, then do cursorPoint() |
| 21:51.54 | rikkus | and move the cursor back if you need to |
| 21:53.23 | jb_ | rikkus: cool! thanks man.... |
| 21:53.53 | rikkus | jb_: note that QMultiLineEdit is deprecated. I'm not sure what you're supposed to use now, if you want to do the same thing. |
| 21:54.36 | rikkus | QTextEdit (which it inherits from) doesn't seem to have anything to help with finding the cursor x/y pos (or indeed the x/y pos of a column/row) |
| 21:55.15 | jb_ | rikkus: I wish I could use QTextEdit (for the nice color syntax capabilities), but afaik it's not included in the version of qt/e |
| 21:55.22 | rikkus | ah yes |
| 21:55.31 | jb_ | rikkus: thus, QMultiLineEdit. ;-( |
| 21:55.54 | rikkus | well, QMultiLineEdit isn't likely to disappear under you for a while if you're using Qt/E :) |
| 21:56.07 | jb_ | exactly ;-) |
| 21:56.28 | jbwiv | rikkus: course, I'd *gladly* give it up for QTextEdit :) |
| 21:57.05 | rikkus | well, you could always copy the necessary stuff into your project... but that might make it a bit large :} |
| 21:58.05 | jbwiv | rikkus: I looked at that awhile back. Turned into a real pain in the ass real quick :) |
| 21:58.15 | rikkus | yep |
| 21:58.28 | rikkus | when I first started doing embedded stuff, I had to copy lots of Qt 3 stuff in |
| 21:58.33 | jbwiv | rikkus: in hindsight, tho, it may have saved me some time. oh well, you live, you learn. |
| 21:58.36 | rikkus | I've got rid of it all now, thankfully |
| 21:59.06 | jbwiv | why does qt/e lag behind so much I wonder? QT 3 can't be *that* much more resource intensive... |
| 21:59.28 | rikkus | no idea |
| 22:01.00 | jbwiv | rikkus: ah...cursorPoint worked nicely. much appreciated :) |
| 22:37.24 | kryhme | whenever i load up eide or minide, i get the hour glass, but neither program ever comes up.... is there something i didn't install??? |
| 22:51.46 | kryhme | if i chmod +x something, how do i reverse that>? |
| 22:52.09 | treke|home | just a guess... -x? |
| 22:52.19 | kryhme | busybox doesn't take it |
| 22:52.27 | kryhme | and i forget the 3 digit number stuff |
| 22:52.44 | kryhme | -rw-r--r-- |
| 22:52.46 | treke|home | that seems highly unlikely to me |
| 22:53.55 | kryhme | if you're on oz, try and chmod +x something and then try and -x it |
| 22:54.01 | kryhme | doesn't take |
| 22:54.25 | treke|home | go bug kergoth then |
| 22:54.59 | kryhme | i'll just work around it for now, maybe try and learn the 755 crap, i'll tell him when i see him |
| 22:55.51 | treke|home | probably doesnt like just -x. try u-x |
| 22:56.30 | SirPsycho-home | the way it works is u(ser) g(roup) and o(ther).. you can chmod ugo+x or ugo-x or whatever you want |
| 22:56.41 | SirPsycho-home | numerically it is three octal numbers |
| 22:57.57 | SirPsycho-home | 777 is all bits on.. 654 would be rw.r.x.wr.. |
| 22:58.29 | kryhme | yeah, i got it goin, thanks |
| 22:58.55 | kryhme | has anyone ever gotten minide or eide to run on oz? |
| 22:59.04 | kryhme | it's really giving me a hassle |
| 22:59.11 | codemnky | what kinda hassle |
| 23:00.11 | kryhme | they're both giving me permission denied errors, which is why i was messing with the +x stuff. but then even when i find the binarys and make them executable and run them they start looking for stuff that isn't there |
| 23:00.44 | kryhme | or errors like /bin/sh can't open eide |
| 23:01.15 | kryhme | can't open /home/QtPalmtop/bin/installdir.sh |
| 23:01.42 | codemnky | i see alot of stuff in google about it, personally i have'nt used it |
| 23:02.17 | codemnky | sorry |
| 23:02.24 | kryhme | what about when it looks for /opt/QtPalmtop/bin/evm |
| 23:02.49 | kryhme | any idea what that is |
| 23:02.52 | treke|home | kryhme: sounds like you dont have everyhing installd |
| 23:02.55 | codemnky | eide needs java doesn't it? |
| 23:03.16 | codemnky | and oz doesn't come with java |
| 23:03.19 | codemnky | i thought |
| 23:03.29 | codemnky | or maybe i don't know what i'm talking about |
| 23:03.39 | kryhme | no, you're right |
| 23:04.29 | codemnky | maybe that's part of the problem |
| 23:05.13 | kryhme | possibly, the eide page has a tar file on it with the compiler libraries and stuff you need. i probably didn't get that part installed right |
| 23:05.41 | kryhme | i don't think either of those programs need the compiler stuff to function though, just to compiler |
| 23:05.45 | kryhme | compiler |
| 23:05.48 | kryhme | crap |
| 23:05.52 | kryhme | compile |
| 23:06.03 | codemnky | hmm |
| 23:06.07 | kryhme | i'm just gonna scrap this one tonight |
| 23:06.33 | codemnky | i don't know anything about edie but it looks like a java editor? |
| 23:06.36 | codemnky | is that right? |
| 23:06.43 | codemnky | so you can code java apps on the Z? |
| 23:06.57 | kryhme | yeah, code and compile |
| 23:07.19 | codemnky | man that's crazy, but cool. you're thumbs will get tired ;) |
| 23:08.16 | kryhme | yeah, i use my z to take notes in class sometimes, so i get used to it.... it's not the most ideal thing... but it's awesome if you're somewhere where you don't have anything else to do, and you've got your z in your pocket |
| 23:09.40 | codemnky | heh |
| 23:10.04 | codemnky | i broke down and also got the thera |
| 23:10.10 | codemnky | heard of that? |
| 23:11.14 | codemnky | it does run pocket pc which isn't ideal, but has a built in phone and verizon has a 144k network, so i can aim or ssh, terminal services to my machines |
| 23:14.00 | treke|home | eew. Pocket PC |
| 23:14.23 | treke|home | not ideal is an understatement :) |
| 23:15.41 | codemnky | yea |
| 23:15.45 | codemnky | but it's cool |
| 23:15.56 | codemnky | i wish the Z had a built in modem |
| 23:15.59 | codemnky | i'm waiting |
| 23:16.21 | codemnky | hey |
| 23:16.28 | codemnky | treke |
| 23:16.39 | codemnky | it does have the same ARM proc |
| 23:16.41 | codemnky | hmm |
| 23:16.53 | treke|home | codemnky: It also doesnt have any specs released |
| 23:18.27 | codemnky | yea bastards |
| 23:19.10 | codemnky | the reason i got it is if i'm at the movies and something breaks i can fix it without driving to work |
| 23:19.14 | treke|home | a built in phone would be nice, but Qtopia is worth carrying my nokia around :) |
| 23:19.33 | treke|home | hehe. I just ignore the phone in that case |
| 23:19.37 | codemnky | heh |
| 23:19.50 | codemnky | have you see the wap shell? |
| 23:19.52 | codemnky | seen |
| 23:19.58 | codemnky | i thought that was need |
| 23:20.00 | treke|home | nope |
| 23:20.00 | codemnky | neat |
| 23:20.03 | codemnky | 1 sec |
| 23:20.10 | badalex | ibot seen chip86 |
| 23:20.10 | | badalex: i haven't seen 'chip86' |
| 23:20.38 | badalex | ibot seen chipx86 |
| 23:20.38 | | badalex: i haven't seen 'chipx86' |
| 23:20.51 | codemnky | check this out |
| 23:20.53 | codemnky | i used it |
| 23:20.57 | codemnky | it's neato |
| 23:21.00 | codemnky | on a wap phone |
| 23:21.02 | codemnky | http://www.exolution.de/wapsh/index.html |
| 23:21.48 | treke|home | cool |
| 23:22.13 | treke|home | not that my phone can do any of that cool shit :) |
| 23:22.14 | codemnky | you can have a special startup rc file with short cut aliases |
| 23:22.28 | codemnky | like ra = reboot apache |
| 23:22.35 | codemnky | not that you would need to do that |
| 23:23.29 | codemnky | i went from one job having 30 linux systems in miami, fl to having to move to la, ca where i have 30 nts |
| 23:23.32 | codemnky | i'm in hell |
| 23:23.55 | treke|home | could be worse |
| 23:24.00 | codemnky | true |
| 23:24.06 | treke|home | could be in florida maintaining 30 nt boxes |
| 23:24.38 | codemnky | heh |
| 23:25.08 | codemnky | yea i was glad to get out of there, was there 10 years |
| 23:25.18 | codemnky | i'm slowly converting these nts to linux |
| 23:26.08 | codemnky | this place has 4 class Cs with each domain on it own ip instead of virtual names |
| 23:26.20 | codemnky | yea, it's not to bad - i moved to pasadena |
| 23:26.22 | codemnky | it's cool |
| 23:26.34 | codemnky | but i use used to it in miami |
| 23:27.20 | codemnky | where's that |
| 23:27.37 | codemnky | i'm new to ca |
| 23:28.14 | codemnky | north |
| 23:28.16 | treke|home | a short ways north |
| 23:28.30 | jbwiv | Under QT, I'd like to take the substring of a QString beginning at pos and ending at end. Don't really see a substring function. Anyone know what to use for this? |
| 23:28.53 | treke|home | jbwiv: might be called mid |
| 23:29.23 | treke|home | http://doc.trolltech.com/2.3/qstring.html#3b1493 |
| 23:29.25 | jbwiv | treke|home: ok. I'll take a look at mid(). Thanks! |
| 23:30.36 | codemnky | why would they call it mid |
| 23:30.40 | codemnky | interesting |
| 23:30.46 | codemnky | does anyone else call it mid? |
| 23:32.20 | SirPsycho-home | used to be called mid in basic =) |
| 23:32.35 | codemnky | like commodore 64 basic? |
| 23:32.49 | Saurian | Yep |
| 23:32.56 | codemnky | that i did not know, cool |
| 23:32.59 | jbwiv | treke|home: did the trick. thanks. |
| 23:33.43 | SirPsycho-home | atari 400 =) |
| 23:35.10 | codemnky | timex sinclair 1000 |
| 23:35.15 | codemnky | :) |
| 23:35.58 | codemnky | http://web.wt.net/~damoore/oldcomp/ts1000/ts1000.html |
| 23:36.53 | codemnky | oh those were the days |
| 23:41.51 | codemnky | is sum of all fears good? i'm thinking of renting tonight? |
| 23:55.46 | Speedy2 | Yo |
