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| 14:12.37 | keldwud | so... if you had 7 years worth of email stored. Would there be anything super important that you'd want to retreive from it if you were going to delete all of them? |
| 14:21.40 | tristanbob_h | I'd save it forever, and most likely never look at them again. |
| 14:22.41 | keldwud | new question, let's say you live in a surveillance state where you can lose your freedoms for things you said in emails |
| 14:22.56 | keldwud | would you try and keep anything from 7 years worth of emails? or just ditch them all? |
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| 14:23.22 | keldwud | s/surveilance/surveilance-police-prison state |
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| 14:39.34 | jsmith | keldwud: Obviously, that depends on what you may or may not have said :-p |
| 14:39.49 | jsmith | keldwud: Are you more worried about what you might have said, or what you haven't said? |
| 14:40.20 | keldwud | just concerned in general that one can be investigated or jailed for their words |
| 14:40.27 | keldwud | precatuion |
| 14:40.35 | keldwud | s/precatuion/precaution |
| 14:41.26 | keldwud | I mean, how long before employers and landlords will be able to access this stuff? |
| 14:41.41 | keldwud | my personal life makes me unemployable and un-rentable |
| 14:41.52 | keldwud | because of my lifestyle |
| 14:41.55 | jsmith | If I were afraid of being investigated or jailed for what I'd said, I'd delete my mail after say six months |
| 14:42.32 | jsmith | If I were afraid of someone saying that I'd said something (that I actually didn't), I'd encrypt everything older than six months and keep it off-site and off-line |
| 14:42.34 | keldwud | I'm just wondering if there is anything important that I'm going to say "oh crap, I needed x" |
| 14:43.04 | keldwud | well, all my mail is google |
| 14:43.16 | keldwud | I'm deleting my google accounts after deleting all the contents |
| 14:43.37 | keldwud | I know I sound like a paranoid person |
| 14:43.40 | keldwud | but I don't care :) |
| 14:44.54 | Q_Continuum | I have a goal to move to self-hosted stuff, its a long-term thing. Also encryption and SSL on all of the things. |
| 14:45.12 | keldwud | Q_Continuum: yeah, I've been doing that the last couple months |
| 14:45.25 | keldwud | getting trucrypt and vpns set up and stuff |
| 14:45.54 | keldwud | and splitting my identity up into several |
| 14:46.23 | keldwud | including switching bills and payments to walmart prepaid debit cards paid with cash |
| 14:46.33 | keldwud | which is a bit overboard for most people |
| 14:46.40 | keldwud | but it would make me feel secure |
| 14:46.55 | keldwud | although I'd need *some* bills and payments for my true identity |
| 14:47.12 | keldwud | in order to make enough noise so that it doesn't appear there is more to me than first glance |
| 14:47.42 | keldwud | if you have an algorithm that tracks people, it would easily pick out somebody who *didn't* pay bills with their credit card |
| 14:47.58 | keldwud | but I want to make it minimal so a profile can't be built on me based on what music or games or books I buy |
| 14:48.16 | manithree | keldwud: If you live in a surveillance state, the copies you can delete are probably the least of your worries |
| 14:48.39 | keldwud | if I start that process now, then in five years, I will already have a "legitimate" and "normal" profile built |
| 14:48.47 | keldwud | I want to appear as normal as possible |
| 14:49.09 | keldwud | so that there aren't any major deviations from popular opinion according to whomever is in power |
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| 15:22.11 | goozbach | Jayce^: neybar_work and other shooting fans: http://www.woot.com/ |
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| 15:46.15 | shalkie | meh. Woot hasn't been the same since the amazonation of it. |
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| 16:06.26 | manithree | http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ooPzr1vzmGY |
| 16:13.44 | goozbach | hurray? I just got to a circular dependancy |
| 16:13.54 | goozbach | I'm gonna need a stiff drink when I figure this thing out |
| 16:14.07 | goozbach | (shoulda listened to sjansen) |
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| 16:21.30 | levi | You should always listen to sjansen. ;) |
| 16:23.38 | jlp_znc | shalkie: "reboot your computer"... arg. "have you tried turning it off and on again? are you sure it's plugged in? |
| 16:30.50 | jxqz | sjansen: universal demagogue |
| 16:31.01 | jxqz | jlp_znc: haha |
| 16:31.48 | jxqz | Q_Continuum: me too |
| 16:38.08 | jlp_znc | I just subscribed to schmoyoho's channel on youtube. after watching "Songify the News #1 - GET MONEY, TURN GAY", I just felt I must. |
| 16:38.31 | jlp_znc | thanks manithree... thanks a lot. |
| 16:38.46 | jlp_znc | like I don't have enough to distract me. |
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| 16:50.02 | manithree | jlp_znc: I do what I can |
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| 17:37.16 | eightyeight | ~seen sjansen |
| 17:37.22 | infobot | sjansen <~sjansen@ip65-46-62-182.z62-46-65.customer.algx.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 1d 18h 39m 19s ago, saying: 'If I had to do address verification today, I'd look seriously at http://blog.mailgun.com/post/free-email-validation-api-for-web-forms/'. |
| 17:38.46 | goozbach | that's not what I should have listened to |
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| 18:03.59 | jlp_znc | "His mind is like a steel trap... full of mice." -- Foghorn Leghorn |
| 18:04.13 | keldwud_ | wooohoooo! |
| 18:04.16 | keldwud_ | got a raise |
| 18:04.35 | keldwud_ | life is no longer shitty or depressing or so stressful that I get dizzy trying to figure out how to manage it |
| 18:09.11 | eightyeight | ~blame work |
| 18:09.11 | infobot | ACTION blames work (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 18:10.38 | keldwud_ | haha |
| 18:11.03 | keldwud_ | did you know that Shel Silverstein had the "and canada" thing down way before it was even cool? |
| 18:11.29 | keldwud_ | http://shelsilverstein.yolasite.com/rudy-felsh.php |
| 18:11.44 | keldwud_ | "Someday he will go to hell Or jail" |
| 18:11.51 | keldwud_ | "or Canada" |
| 18:12.50 | ldav15 | No. Take him to Detroit! |
| 18:13.45 | keldwud_ | haha |
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| 18:14.22 | Gate | http://i.imgur.com/X5wgFW8.jpg |
| 18:14.57 | goozbach | amen! |
| 18:16.31 | ldav15 | Ow. But true! |
| 18:17.34 | keldwud_ | this was me 20 minutes ago http://youtu.be/pFlcqWQVVuU when I heard I was getting a raise |
| 18:21.04 | jlp_znc | did you paw the box like a mad man, too? |
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| 18:30.56 | keldwud_ | I almost did |
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| 19:00.19 | Tene | goozbach: I find that I've never regretted listening to sjansen. |
| 19:01.31 | jsmith | Tene: Never, not even once? |
| 19:01.57 | jsmith | Tene: What about when sjansen was saying "It'll be done once there's a solid release of Harfbuzz"? |
| 19:02.01 | Tene | jsmith: Not that I can remember, so if I have, his recommendation probably involved memory loss. |
| 19:02.32 | Tene | What was he saying would be done? I don't remember him saying that. |
| 19:02.44 | goozbach | I need food |
| 19:02.54 | goozbach | I did get a root beer float last night |
| 19:03.14 | Tene | That's like food... |
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| 19:08.13 | goozbach | disconnected thoughts |
| 19:10.35 | jsmith | goozbach: We expect nothing less from you these days |
| 19:10.47 | jsmith | Tene: The secret project that was waiting on harfbuzz, obviously |
| 19:14.09 | Gate | keldwud_: how sad. We gave our intern a $3/hr raise yesterday and I didn't hear *any* screaming. |
| 19:14.30 | keldwud_ | three dollar raise!?!?! |
| 19:14.32 | keldwud_ | OMG |
| 19:14.38 | keldwud_ | I would faint |
| 19:14.41 | keldwud_ | srsly |
| 19:14.46 | Gate | keldwud_: from $12 -> $15 |
| 19:15.09 | keldwud_ | can I work for you? |
| 19:15.16 | keldwud_ | heh |
| 19:15.28 | keldwud_ | before my raise, I would have interned for 12 bucks an hour and been making more |
| 19:15.43 | keldwud_ | than I was prior to my raise |
| 19:16.02 | Gate | keldwud_: yup. Assuming you have iOS or ruby dev skills :) |
| 19:16.13 | Gate | or dev skills in general and are willing to learn. |
| 19:16.16 | keldwud_ | I've beginner noob ruby |
| 19:16.22 | Gate | You might have to move to St. George though ;) |
| 19:16.24 | keldwud_ | and I have novice dev skills |
| 19:16.35 | keldwud_ | I've done c# projects for my company |
| 19:16.42 | keldwud_ | and have been learning python and ruby on the side |
| 19:16.45 | Gate | keldwud_: the reason is that $15 is our normal intern rate. This guy was just super early in college |
| 19:16.46 | keldwud_ | :) |
| 19:16.53 | keldwud_ | waaaaat? |
| 19:17.10 | keldwud_ | you mean I could quit my sysadmin job and make even *more* money for an intern position!? |
| 19:17.25 | keldwud_ | that's CRAZY TALK |
| 19:17.26 | Gate | keldwud_: methinks this is our latest job ad: http://stgeorge.craigslist.org/sof/3959362287.html |
| 19:17.26 | keldwud_ | ;) |
| 19:17.42 | Gate | that's for a full time guy, but interns work :) |
| 19:17.45 | keldwud_ | oh yeah, I'm definitely not a full stack developer |
| 19:18.09 | keldwud_ | I hear real full stack developers get 75k minimum |
| 19:18.21 | Gate | also http://stgeorge.craigslist.org/sof/3909450581.htmlb |
| 19:18.26 | Gate | also http://stgeorge.craigslist.org/sof/3909450581.html * |
| 19:19.16 | Gate | keldwud_: not entirely true if you are fresh out of college or just starting out. Or living in St. George. |
| 19:19.49 | keldwud_ | hell, I'd be happy with 15/hr for an intern position for a chance to learn full stack |
| 19:20.05 | keldwud_ | but that's because I'm old, and I know better. Your intern is young and doesn't know how good he has it :) |
| 19:20.16 | Gate | keldwud_: :) always welcome to drop us a line. But like I said, we are all in St George and I'm guessing you aren't. |
| 19:20.24 | keldwud_ | nope :) utah county |
| 19:20.37 | keldwud_ | and just got a raise here, so I should stay with current company :) |
| 19:20.55 | keldwud_ | but in 8 months when we are out of money, and I have stronger ruby skills, I might hit you up ;) |
| 19:21.01 | Gate | also, the picture in that second ad makes me look like jabba the hut. |
| 19:21.03 | keldwud_ | st george is good for raising kids, no? |
| 19:21.34 | Gate | keldwud_: so I'm told. I grew up here OK but have no plans of creating any spawn of my own ;) |
| 19:22.17 | keldwud_ | $intern should be forced to watch nintendo 64 kid |
| 19:22.23 | keldwud_ | $3 raise is a big one |
| 19:22.31 | Gate | lol |
| 19:22.48 | keldwud_ | especially when you're only in the low tens |
| 19:22.59 | keldwud_ | that's, like, a 25% raise |
| 19:23.04 | Gate | He's proven his metal. |
| 19:23.32 | keldwud_ | who does your infrastructure? or do you just use amazon? |
| 19:24.03 | Gate | keldwud_: amazon mostly, one of my business partners and I do the maintainance and provisioning work. Mostly via Chef. |
| 19:24.17 | keldwud_ | yeah I hear ruby devs always choose chef over puppet |
| 19:24.20 | Gate | I just spun up a digitalocean server (and I'm impressed, so far) |
| 19:24.35 | keldwud_ | are you using vagrant yet for your VMs? |
| 19:24.39 | Gate | keldwud_: always is far too strong a word. Puppet is still very strong in the ruby community. |
| 19:24.43 | keldwud_ | we use vagrant for our devs |
| 19:24.56 | keldwud_ | to fire up their vms |
| 19:25.08 | keldwud_ | Gate: I tend to generalize a lot ;) |
| 19:25.17 | Gate | keldwud_: we've used vagrant but most of the time its just an annoyance. We are all on OSX so rbenv+bundler is all the seperation we need |
| 19:25.26 | keldwud_ | I see |
| 19:25.30 | Gate | vagrant is for people too lazy to move to a real OS |
| 19:25.34 | keldwud_ | haha |
| 19:25.47 | keldwud_ | most of my colorado devs are osx |
| 19:25.59 | keldwud_ | I think I've about half and half. |
| 19:26.08 | Gate | Yeah. I was hardcore desktop linux until I fell into these people, then I conformed. |
| 19:26.10 | keldwud_ | all around the board ebtween windows and mac |
| 19:26.15 | Gate | s/into/in with/ |
| 19:26.23 | keldwud_ | we actually just started teaching some of our devs how to use vim |
| 19:26.28 | keldwud_ | the interns really got into it and loved it |
| 19:26.36 | Gate | lol |
| 19:26.38 | keldwud_ | the "experienced" devs said "meh" |
| 19:26.46 | keldwud_ | because I guess they were too good for it |
| 19:26.56 | Gate | keldwud_: I say meh to vim. I'm happy with emacs for the moment. |
| 19:27.24 | keldwud_ | well that's a whole different debate than text based editors vs IDE |
| 19:27.30 | Gate | my peers used emacs and are switching to vim, most of our employees and interns came out of college having been taught vim |
| 19:27.38 | keldwud_ | but yeah, I think every developer should be able to program without an IDE |
| 19:27.47 | keldwud_ | they teach vim in college!? |
| 19:27.55 | Gate | keldwud_: Our bread and butter is iOS development, unfortunately that means tons of xcode. |
| 19:28.08 | keldwud_ | yeah, my friend showed me xcode |
| 19:28.11 | keldwud_ | he does iOS |
| 19:28.23 | Gate | keldwud_: not as a class, but several of the professors there are hardcore vim users. They outnumber the poor emacs guy 3 to 1 |
| 19:28.29 | keldwud_ | what is that object oriented that is used in macs? |
| 19:28.39 | Gate | Objective C |
| 19:28.41 | keldwud_ | objective c? |
| 19:28.41 | keldwud_ | yeah |
| 19:28.44 | keldwud_ | that's it |
| 19:29.03 | keldwud_ | that's the one my friend was using |
| 19:29.10 | keldwud_ | good to hear there are professors that are really into vim |
| 19:29.21 | Gate | It has its good points but I'm not a fan. Its verbose and inelegant, despite being message passing with a solid OO layer. |
| 19:29.22 | keldwud_ | and not vim, per se, just text editors in general |
| 19:29.38 | keldwud_ | yeah, I wasn't excited about objective c when I saw it, either |
| 19:30.00 | keldwud_ | hell, I wasn't too happy with c++, I figured I'd just learn c# and c, skip the c++ |
| 19:30.35 | Gate | I would choose it in a heartbeat over C or C++, but I like the elegance and cleanness of Ruby. Not that Ruby is perfect, but its my weapon of choice. |
| 19:31.08 | Gate | I used C# for 3 years in my first job. |
| 19:31.56 | Gate | keldwud_: so I've been doing the math, I think I've averaged a 15% raise every year since I got out of college |
| 19:32.19 | keldwud_ | I managed that until 2010 |
| 19:32.25 | keldwud_ | -er 2009 |
| 19:32.31 | keldwud_ | then I was out of work for three years |
| 19:32.41 | keldwud_ | and my next job paid $8/hr |
| 19:33.13 | keldwud_ | and then interned here for $10/hr and doubled down at vivint for $11/hr both full time jobs |
| 19:33.34 | keldwud_ | so I guess I've been hitting 15% again |
| 19:33.46 | keldwud_ | just had to set the bar really low to get back into the workforce |
| 19:34.07 | Gate | understood |
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| 20:18.55 | jlp_znc | heh, I remember when I learned vi (not vim). it went something like this: "we put unix on the vax this quarter. the editor is called 'vi'. it's not pronounced 'vye', but 'vee eye'. the manual is online... type 'man vi' to read it." |
| 20:19.38 | jlp_znc | it took a little while to get comfortable with it after using EDIT/EDT on VMS |
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| 20:38.52 | Tene | I remember when I learned vim; fozzmoo told me "Hey, you should learn vim. Run vimtutor." |
| 20:58.35 | Gate | I remember when I tried to learn vim. "Wait, I have to do *what* just to actually edit?" |
| 20:58.54 | Gate | Calling vim an editor is I think an insult to both vim and editors. vim is a text manipulator. |
| 20:58.56 | goozbach | how do you generate random numbers? |
| 20:59.07 | goozbach | put a newbie in front of vim and tell them to save and exit |
| 21:00.41 | jsmith | Gate: Emacs is a great operating system -- I just wish it had a decent editor :-p |
| 21:00.48 | Gate | jsmith: concur ;) |
| 21:00.58 | goozbach | ya'll should be using Acme :D |
| 21:01.16 | Gate | Real programmers use a needle and a steady hand. |
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