IRC log for #openmoko on 20090412

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04:15.21kinneh<PROTECTED>
04:16.05kinnehis it still true that the performance is worse when booting from sd ?
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04:21.20re-peatkinneh: you could test the write speeds of both mount points like "time dd if=/dev/zero of=./testlocation.file bs=1024 count=1024"
04:22.23re-peatbut if i remember correctly uSD is slower than flash
04:23.10kinnehok
04:24.46re-peatpluss that doesnt measure read speed but i'd think they are relevent
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06:19.19b0efwas there some application daemon that could send gps data over the network. I'd like to run some gps software on my laptop and access the freerunners' gps data
06:21.54b0efah, right, found an example using netcat
06:24.49cjb_ietangogps will also do it
06:25.05cjb_iedunno if it's been ported though
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06:52.59ecloudthat's gpsd's main purpose
06:53.07ecloudclients connect to it via socket
06:54.02cjb_ieecloud: well, it defaults to only allowing connections from localhost; and many, many cellcos don't assign a routable IP to phones
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08:09.24create_vibehello
08:09.35create_vibecan someone help me get an internet connection to my neo over usb?
08:09.46create_vibeI'm running ubuntu 8.10
08:10.04create_vibelatest build on the neo, afaik
08:10.40create_vibeI have ssh'd into the neo
08:14.27create_vibeoh, I got it
08:14.29create_vibesweet
08:15.21ndnihilget it going?
08:15.45ndnihilhas an earthsplitting headache
08:15.51ndnihilfucking migranes
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08:16.05create_vibeya, I had to set up masquerading on my ubuntu
08:17.58ndnihiljust got your phone recently I take it?
08:18.12create_vibewell, I got it a while back, but I can't it to recognize the SIM
08:18.16create_vibeso I haven't messed with it
08:18.18ndnihilah
08:18.24create_vibeI just found the debian install script, so I wanted to install that
08:18.30ndnihilyou checked the wiki for sim compatibility?
08:18.31create_vibebut I couldn't get the internet going
08:18.37create_vibeya, it says it should work
08:18.37ndnihilalso, have you upgraded the GSM firmware yet?
08:18.42create_vibeyes
08:18.47ndnihilto moko11?
08:18.48create_vibei believe so
08:18.50create_vibeumm
08:18.57create_vibehow do I see the current?
08:19.16ndnihilhrm, if I remember right, its settings->gsm->modem info
08:19.38create_vibesettings>gsm isn't there
08:19.39ndnihilwhat dist do you run?
08:20.14create_vibeU-Boot: Neo1973 Bootloader U-Boot 1.3.2-moko12
08:20.30ndnihilthats just the bootloader
08:20.43ndnihildid you flash a new image/filesystem to your phone when you got it?
08:20.57create_vibeya
08:21.01ndnihilwhich one?
08:21.08create_vibe2008.12 or whatever that was
08:21.15ndnihilgotcha
08:21.25ndnihilI'm currently running SHR-testing
08:21.39ndnihilom2007/om2008 were kinda lacking when I tried them
08:21.54ndnihilqt was pretty but boring
08:22.00ndnihilFDOM was horrid
08:22.09ndnihilbut I'm liking SHR so far
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08:22.37create_vibei'd like it a lot more if I could use it
08:22.50ndnihilwhat sim do you have?
08:23.00create_vibeatt 3g
08:23.06ndnihilme too, which version?
08:23.07create_vibethey said it falls back
08:23.12create_vibethe latest
08:23.23ndnihilI yanked mine out of the blackberry work gave me
08:23.28ndnihilthere's numbers on it
08:23.33ndnihilwhat numbers are they?
08:23.38create_vibeya, there's number on it
08:23.41create_vibeidk, it's in
08:23.55create_vibeit's one of the pictures of the working att sims
08:23.57create_vibeon the wiki page
08:24.29create_vibei'm about to attempt installing debian
08:24.33create_vibecan I do it over ssh?
08:24.46create_vibeor do I need to be in flash or whatever
08:24.53ndnihilI tried installing it to SD, but couldn't get it to boot
08:25.02ndnihilthere are a couple different methods
08:25.09create_vibehttp://wiki.debian.org/DebianOnFreeRunner
08:25.15create_vibethat's where I am
08:25.20ndnihilbut really, you should try getting the phone to work first
08:25.25ndnihilyeah that's the one I tried
08:25.31ndnihilwith the modified uboot env
08:25.33create_vibewell, how would you suggest I do that?
08:25.41create_vibei just managed to get it connected
08:25.52ndnihilwell, most people in here seem to run SHR testing, or SHR unstable
08:25.59create_vibewhat's that?
08:26.02ndnihilso you're more likely to get accurate support if you run that
08:26.10ndnihilstable hybrid release
08:26.17ndnihilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Distributions
08:26.59ndnihilfor me it worked the best out of all of them I tried
08:27.37create_vibeshould I do testing or unstable?
08:27.43ndnihiltesting for sure
08:27.48ndnihilunstable is just that, unstable
08:27.56create_viberight
08:28.27ndnihilbut, you should figure out exactly which sim you have too
08:28.37create_vibei did at one point
08:28.38ndnihilmine is a 3g fireball, 73000
08:28.40create_vibeI made sure it was compatible
08:29.02ndnihilI had to stick a couple layers of clear tape on the back so it would sit more firmly in the carrier
08:29.29ndnihilthat, and updating GSM firmware to moko11 helped a lot
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08:29.49ndnihilhavent had any issues with that part of it since
08:30.21blokkie_hi
08:31.18blokkie_when I connect my neo  in linux the usb0  network interface allways dissapears .  First it pops up and then when the neo go's into  sleep mode the connection is gone. How can I make it always active ?
08:31.48ndnihilblokkie_: depends on what dist you run
08:31.54blokkie_archlinux
08:32.10ndnihilon the phone?
08:32.20blokkie_no , on  my laptop
08:32.31ndnihilwhat do you run on the phone?
08:32.33blokkie_on the noe  it's still the standerd version
08:32.37blokkie_2008  I guess
08:33.24blokkie_is there an easy fix for it ?
08:33.30ndnihildoes ifconfig usb0 return a device?
08:33.35blokkie_yes
08:33.41blokkie_I can ssh into it from windows
08:33.50blokkie_and do ipk installs and everything
08:34.14blokkie_but I want to install a new distro , with the neotool .. but that only runs in linux
08:34.20ndnihilifconfig usb0 192.168.0.200 netmask 255.255.255.0 broadcast 192.168.0.255
08:34.33ndnihilyou dont need networking when flashing a new dist
08:34.40create_vibehey ndnihil, how do install this thing
08:34.48ndnihilcreate_vibe: SHR?
08:34.51create_vibeya
08:34.53blokkie_I don't  ?
08:35.06ndnihilblokkie_: no, you flash it from the bootloader
08:35.18ndnihilcreate_vibe: you flash it from the bootloader
08:35.22ndnihilgets dejavu
08:35.28create_vibecan you walk me through it?
08:35.32ndnihilsure
08:35.36blokkie_I'll follow as well :)
08:35.39ndnihilbut
08:35.46ndnihilgive me a minute to grab something to stuff in my face
08:35.52ndnihilhungry :)
08:36.04blokkie_create_vibe:  what flash image did you download ?
08:36.57create_vibeI haven't
08:37.04create_vibei'm jsut reading the wiki page
08:37.50create_vibecool, I'll be chillin
08:38.09ndnihilbagel and bananna
08:38.11ndnihilyum
08:38.42ndnihilok, http://build.shr-project.org/shr-testing/images/om-gta02/
08:38.58create_vibeok i was there
08:39.01ndnihiluImage-om-gta02-latest.bin
08:39.15ndnihilthat is the latest kernel image for the phone
08:39.23ndnihilget it and put it somewhere convenient
08:39.23create_vibeok, saved
08:39.47ndnihilshr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
08:39.57ndnihilthat will be the latest filesystem image
08:40.07ndnihilget it, and put it next to the kernel image
08:40.19ndnihilwhile that's downloading
08:40.25ndnihilmake sure you have dfu-util
08:40.34ndnihil(you can also use neotool, but I've never use it)
08:40.44create_vibei have dfu-util
08:40.49create_vibei used it last time, but I don't remember how
08:41.06ndnihilblokkie_: do you have it?
08:41.24blokkie_sec
08:41.36ndnihiloh, and make sure you are both booted into linux on the machine you will be doing this from
08:41.39ndnihil:)
08:41.57create_vibegot usb connection established, should I log out of ssh?
08:42.09ndnihilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util
08:42.12ndnihilin case you dont have it
08:42.34ndnihilcreate you'll be restarting the phone in a minute
08:42.40create_vibeahh
08:43.08blokkie_sec .. I'm getting http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util
08:43.21ndnihilblokkie_: take your time
08:45.33blokkie_ok , I have it  but the jffs2 is still downloading
08:45.34ndnihiloh, and just to confirm, and make it explicitly clear:  THIS WILL DESTROY ANY DATA YOU CURRENTLY HAVE ON THE PHONE, BACK IT UP
08:45.38ndnihil:)
08:45.45blokkie_ok :)
08:45.59blokkie_even the sexy pictures ?  ... *grin*
08:46.03create_vibelet's do it
08:46.29blokkie_in 6 minutes my jffs2  download is done
08:46.44ndnihilok, we can get started before that's done
08:46.50ndnihiljust to familiarize you with the process
08:46.56ndnihilpower your phones off
08:47.41create_vibek
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08:48.05reisioany hardware reqs?
08:48.08reisiomy phone's getting old
08:48.23ndnihilreisio: yes, all of it, I need a spare
08:48.25blokkie_k
08:48.37reisiondnihil: well maybe a bit more specific than that :p
08:48.56blokkie_mine is booting again :)
08:48.56reisiodoc|home: what was that link you gave me earlier?
08:48.58reisiolooked rad
08:48.59ndnihilok, both of your phones are off?
08:49.04ndnihilblokkie_: keep it powered off
08:49.12create_vibeyes, off
08:49.21blokkie_ok
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08:49.29ndnihilso both off now?
08:49.39reisiodoc|home: hallo?
08:49.41blokkie_yes
08:49.59ndnihilok, hold the aux button, and then press power for a couple seconds (until it starts doing stuff)
08:50.12ndnihilthat will take you into uBoot
08:50.15blokkie_where is the aux button ?
08:50.17create_vibek
08:50.22create_vibein the boot menu
08:50.23ndnihiltop left
08:50.32blokkie_the light ?
08:50.38reisiodoc|home: ugh, okay stop pm'ing me
08:50.39ndnihilyeah I think it lights up too
08:50.45blokkie_ok second
08:50.53reisiodoc|home: STOP ffs...
08:50.57reisioheaddesks
08:50.59blokkie_ok .. in
08:51.20ndnihilok, letting it sit there will power the phone off after ~15 seconds or so
08:51.24ndnihilas mine just did
08:51.31create_viberight
08:51.36create_vibeback in
08:52.04ndnihilso hop over to your PC, and type:    dfu-util -l
08:52.09ndnihilwhen its in the uBoot menu
08:52.24ndnihilthat should return something like this:
08:52.26create_vibefound runtime
08:52.27blokkie_ok
08:52.28ndnihilFound Runtime: [0x1d50:0x5119] devnum=57, cfg=0, intf=2, alt=0, name="USB Device Firmware Upgrade"
08:52.35blokkie_indeed
08:52.38ndnihilboth of you get that?
08:52.39ndnihilgood
08:53.43ndnihilfirst we're going to flash the kernel image
08:53.52blokkie_ok
08:53.52*** join/#openmoko der-lehmann (n=stefan@95.89.148.250)
08:53.53ndnihilso cd into the directory where you stuffed your images
08:53.56reisiodoc|home: I came on your mom earlier...
08:54.25blokkie_ok
08:55.20ndnihilthen boot the phone into uBoot menu again, and run:  dfu-util -a kernel -R -D uImage-om-gta02-latest.bin
08:55.46blokkie_it's running
08:55.48ndnihilthis will flash the kernel image to the appropriate section of the phone
08:55.59ndnihilkernel will only take a few seconds to flash
08:56.08create_vibestarting download
08:56.17ndnihilbut the root filesystem will take much longer, up to ~20 minutes or so
08:56.20*** part/#openmoko reisio (n=reisio@unaffiliated/reisio)
08:56.28create_vibesays it's done
08:56.31ndnihilso dont get impatient, it will be doing its thing
08:56.34blokkie_DFU switching back to runtime mode
08:56.39doc|hometard
08:56.41create_vibeso now do the rootfs
08:56.58*** join/#openmoko polymar_ (n=polymar@vpn.yellowpages.com)
08:57.03ndnihilyep, for rootfs the command is:  dfu-util -a rootfs -R -D shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
08:57.27blokkie_so  after I see DFU switching back to runtime mode  I should do  dfu-util -a rootfs -R -D shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
08:57.30blokkie_<PROTECTED>
08:57.40ndnihilblokkie_: you should do it from the uBoot menu
08:57.47ndnihilsame as kernel
08:58.23blokkie_ok ,
08:58.30blokkie_so this takes about  20 minutes ?
08:58.33create_vibeya, on the device I see Starting DPU DOWNLOAD to RAM (0x...)
08:58.35ndnihilroughly yes
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08:58.41create_vibewhat after?
08:58.49ndnihilthen you boot the phone, it's done :)
08:58.58create_vibeand u think my SIM should work?
08:59.07ndnihildepends on your sim
08:59.09blokkie_ndnihil:  so that will then be a complete new distro on the phone ?
08:59.18ndnihilblokkie_: yep, that will be the SHR testing dist
08:59.25blokkie__AWSOME_
08:59.38blokkie_xdcc send ndnihil a virtual hug
08:59.41ndnihil:)
08:59.47ndnihilthis thing is painless to flash
09:00.04ndnihiland rumors are, it's very difficult to brick
09:00.13blokkie_it's almost "sexy" :)
09:00.32ndnihilbut with bot NOR and NAND available, not hard to believe, fuck up one you can rescue from the other
09:00.51blokkie_ndnihil:  the sdcard now I have is 256mb
09:00.57*** join/#openmoko DerHorst (n=Horst@e176103096.adsl.alicedsl.de)
09:00.57ndnihilsorry to hear that
09:00.58blokkie_can I put one with 2G  in ?
09:01.03create_vibeoh, I have a 8gb
09:01.06ndnihilyes, I run a 2 gig uSD in mine
09:01.17*** join/#openmoko DorX (n=freak@p5B3B1AD3.dip.t-dialin.net)
09:01.25create_vibeit's cool, it came with a little usb thing
09:01.27ndnihilwill be picking up a 16 gig next time I'm near a place that has them
09:01.44blokkie_aha ,  so I can just go buy a big ass micro sd  and ut it in , and flash it like we just did ?
09:01.54create_vibeI would too.  where do you get them?
09:02.03ndnihilnot just like we did, but you can use it
09:02.19create_vibeError during download
09:02.25ndnihilthe way we just flashed uses the phones internal flash
09:02.34create_vibedfu_download error -110
09:02.39ndnihildoh
09:02.47ndnihildid you mess with it while it was doing its thing
09:02.48ndnihil?
09:02.52create_vibeno
09:02.58create_vibeshould I try again?
09:03.01ndnihilyes
09:03.05create_vibestart all over?
09:03.08create_vibeor just the rootfs?
09:03.13ndnihilmake sure you're root to be sure it's not a device permissions error
09:03.21ndnihiljust the rootfs, the kernel flashed successfully no?
09:03.24blokkie_I run it as root
09:03.31create_viberoot on ubuntu or root on the neo?
09:03.36blokkie_and it's still downloading :)
09:03.41create_vibeya, the kernel was fine
09:03.41ndnihilroot in ubuntu
09:03.46create_vibeya, I was root
09:03.48ndnihilyou aren't logging into the neo just yet
09:03.49create_vibewell, sudo
09:03.50ndnihilok
09:03.55ndnihiltry it again and see what happens
09:04.13create_vibeCannot set alternate interface
09:04.21ndnihilhrm
09:04.25ndnihilpower phone off
09:04.30ndnihilunplug usb cable
09:05.00create_vibeseems like it's frozen
09:05.12ndnihilhrm, that's no good
09:05.24ndnihilpop the battery out
09:05.33create_vibei can get that sim number now :)
09:05.45ndnihilyes do that
09:05.55ndnihiland try leaving the sim out for next flash
09:06.44create_vibehttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:ATT_simcards_small.jpg
09:06.49create_vibemine is the one on the left
09:06.55create_vibehttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:ATT_simcards_small.jpg
09:06.56create_vibeerr
09:07.03create_vibehttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FreeRunner_unable_to_work_with_3G_SIM_cards
09:07.27create_vibeoh
09:07.29create_vibeno
09:07.32create_vibeit's the one on the right
09:07.46create_vibeya
09:08.00create_vibeso it says it should work
09:08.13create_vibeSome AT&T cards have same vendor/ID number, but different contacts (Josh posted at 2008/8/24), following image shows that card that working (right) and not working (lef
09:08.34ndnihilhrm, does it sit loosely in the carrier?
09:08.35ndnihilwell,
09:08.39ndnihillets worry about that later
09:08.46create_vibeno
09:08.47ndnihilfirst lets get a filesystem on your phone
09:08.50create_vibesits ok
09:08.53create_vibei guess
09:08.55create_vibeok
09:09.17create_vibeya, maybe a little loose
09:09.36ndnihilleave sim out, battery back in, boot to uBoot menu, then run the flash again
09:10.01ndnihiloh, and plug USB back in :)
09:10.07create_vibeok, it's going
09:10.20create_viberight
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09:10.21create_vibe:)
09:10.31ndnihilgo grab a drink and watch porn for 20 minutes
09:10.36create_vibelol
09:10.41create_vibeaka, don't fuck with it!
09:10.42ndnihilblokkie_: yours done yet?
09:10.49blokkie_going steady :)
09:10.52ndnihilyes, leave it alone, it knows what it's doing
09:11.08blokkie_I talk to it , use gentle words ..  :-)
09:11.21ndnihilthats fine, but no caressing it
09:11.29blokkie_hehe
09:11.29ndnihilno poking it with anything
09:11.31ndnihiletc...
09:11.46blokkie_which software is included in this image ?
09:11.52*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
09:11.55ndnihiljust basic stuff
09:12.06ndnihilyou can add software later
09:12.12blokkie_coz I had lots of dificulties trying to get software on it
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09:12.50blokkie_like I said , in lunux the usb network connection gets disconnected when the phone go's in sleep mode
09:12.58blokkie_s/lunux/linux/
09:13.10ndnihilwith SHR it doesnt sleep when USB is plugged in
09:13.18create_vibelol
09:13.18ndnihilrather, it doesnt suspend
09:13.18blokkie_oh , cool
09:13.23blokkie_then I can  use repo's
09:13.25create_vibecool bot
09:13.32ndnihilstabs apt
09:13.37blokkie_Resetting USB to switch back to runtime mode
09:13.41blokkie_it's done  I think
09:13.42create_vibehaha
09:13.55blokkie_can I now restart it ?
09:13.57ndnihilyep
09:14.12*** part/#openmoko der-lehmann (n=stefan@95.89.148.250)
09:14.20blokkie_restarting
09:14.58blokkie_startng udev
09:15.01create_vibesame thing
09:15.06create_vibeerror
09:15.08ndnihilcreate: same error?
09:15.10ndnihilhrm
09:15.18ndnihilare you going through a USB hub?
09:15.20create_vibethis didn't happen last time I flashed it
09:15.24create_vibea hub?
09:15.32ndnihilyes, a USB hub
09:15.39ndnihilone of those little boxes that give you extra USB ports
09:15.41blokkie_create_vibe:  maybe a bad  image download ?
09:15.43create_vibeno
09:15.52create_vibedirect to the computer
09:15.55ndnihilok good
09:16.00ndnihilsome hubs suck balls
09:16.21blokkie_ndnihil:  is it normal that it is like compiling the kernel ?
09:16.30create_vibeya, I'll try downloading a new image
09:16.33ndnihiluh, no that's not very normal, and not very possible
09:16.36create_vibecome to think of it, it did download pretty quick
09:16.45ndnihilcreate: it should be about 85M
09:16.53ndnihilgrab a fresh one if it's not
09:17.12ndnihil85M     shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
09:17.12ndnihil1.9M    uImage-om-gta02-latest.bin
09:17.14blokkie_[blokkie@Archlap tmp]$ du -sk shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
09:17.14blokkie_87004   shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
09:17.16ndnihilis what I get
09:17.19create_vibeok, this looks better
09:17.20blokkie_create_vibe:  same size ?
09:17.34create_vibesame file, but I'm watching it this time
09:18.19blokkie_ow enlightenment !!
09:18.19ndnihilblokkie_: booted yet?
09:18.21ndnihilyep
09:18.22ndnihil:)
09:18.31blokkie_awsome
09:18.41blokkie_whcih profile should I select ?
09:18.46ndnihildefault
09:18.56blokkie_illume  or illume SHR
09:19.05ndnihilillume SHR I think
09:19.22create_vibetrying again
09:19.31blokkie_good luck create_vibe
09:19.42*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
09:20.54blokkie_ndnihil:  it did not ask for my pin code  for GSM
09:21.01ndnihildidn't ask me either
09:21.25ndnihilgood thing too, I have no idea what my pin is (swiped the sim from my work brokeberry)
09:21.36blokkie_ok , now it did .. just took a bit of time
09:21.58blokkie_ndnihil:  you lied .. there are tons of apps installed already :-)
09:22.17ndnihilhah, that's just basic stuff :)
09:22.48blokkie_it does not 'rotate'
09:22.55ndnihilnot by default
09:23.05ndnihilbut you can grab the omnewrotate package
09:23.21ndnihilit should be listed on opkg.org if I remember correctly
09:24.00blokkie_so you say ,  that now i should keep  the usb0 connection while I'm in linux right ?
09:24.06ndnihilyep
09:24.14create_vibeheh
09:24.19blokkie_what is the best way to install apps ?  use a repo ?
09:24.19create_vibedifferent error code this time
09:24.24create_vibe84
09:24.44ndnihilblokkie_: yeah, or just download them and install
09:25.01ndnihilcreate: strange, did you get the full rootfs image?
09:25.17ndnihiland you grabbed the .jffs2, not the .tar.gz right?
09:25.21create_vibe84.9 MB (88997888 bytes)
09:25.31create_vibeshr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
09:25.32create_vibeyes
09:25.51ndnihiland the phone showed up in dfu-util -l?
09:25.56ndnihilbefore flashing
09:25.58create_vibeyep
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09:26.14ndnihildo you have anything odd hogging your USB bus?
09:26.27ndnihilon the PC/laptop
09:26.34create_vibehttp://pastebin.ws/ccfyol
09:26.39create_vibeumm
09:26.55create_vibeI have two external usb drives connected
09:27.03create_vibeand a usb wirless keyboard mouse
09:27.07create_vibelogitech wave
09:27.17*** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-078-042-071-198.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de)
09:27.20PBeckahoi
09:27.24ndnihiltry dropping off whatever USB devices you can before trying again
09:27.37create_vibesure, I can unmount them
09:27.41ndnihilperhaps even give your machine a reboot
09:27.58create_vibeumm
09:28.02create_vibewhy
09:28.24ndnihilgood mojo
09:28.31blokkie_:-)
09:28.50ndnihilthis workstation still runs debian sarge, and sometimes if I fuck around the USB subsystems locks up
09:28.59ndnihilonly thing that will fix it is a reboot
09:29.55create_vibemeh
09:30.04ndnihilunplugging a mounted USB block device while accessing another is a sure way to trigger it on this machine
09:30.29ndnihilI really need to upgrade
09:30.36d-bndnihil: yes you do.
09:30.40ndnihil:)
09:30.51create_vibedownloading again
09:31.18ndnihild-b: other than the USB thing, and lack of glibc2.4, it has been quite nice all these years
09:31.31d-bndnihil: upgrade.
09:31.47ndnihileventually
09:31.49d-byou are really needing security updates etc.
09:31.59ndnihilno I'm not :)
09:32.02d-bif this machine is going on the netz ... upgrade...
09:32.10ndnihilits vulnerable locally for sure
09:32.13ndnihilbut I'm the only user
09:32.24d-bndnihil: use a browser ?
09:32.27ndnihilyup
09:32.32d-biceweasel ?
09:32.39ndnihilno, firefox
09:32.43d-bndnihil: which firefox ?
09:32.44d-b2 ?
09:32.47ndnihilno from packages
09:32.53ndnihilyes, 3 requires glibc2.4
09:33.07d-bndnihil: oh did firefox get renamed only in etch+
09:33.20ndnihilrunning through a filtering proxy outbound
09:33.21d-banyways id upgrade lest you get pwned.
09:34.00ndnihilwhen I upgrade, it will be solely for newer software and features
09:34.17ndnihilsecurity is good, it's my job btw ;)
09:34.56blokkie_ndnihil: SHR  has QT Extended ?
09:35.31ndnihilno, shr and qt extended are different dists, but I believe you can install qt software on shr, though I've not tried myself
09:36.17ndnihilcreate_vibe: how it is coming along?
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09:37.37create_vibeerror 110 again
09:38.17*** join/#openmoko RedDog (n=reddog@mastersword.de)
09:38.20ndnihilcreate: is this a gta01 or gta02?
09:38.25Serdargood morning
09:38.39ndnihilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util#Troubleshooting_notes
09:38.49ndnihilIf during flashing of an image using dfu-util you're consistently getting an error -110 message, check that the size of the destination NAND partition is big enough to hold the image.
09:38.51create_vibecv@cvserv:~/Desktop$ sudo dfu-util -R -D shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2
09:39.06ndnihilright, but which phone, the gta01 or gta02?
09:39.10create_vibeoh
09:39.16ndnihilneo freerunner, or neo 1973?
09:39.17create_vibethe freerunner
09:39.20ndnihilok
09:39.21ndnihilgood
09:40.10ndnihildid you repartition your phone at all?
09:40.12blokkie_ndnihil: I can't see all my apps .. I can't scroll down . Which app do I need for that ?
09:40.20ndnihiland did you make sure your -a switch was rootfs and not kernel?
09:40.23create_vibenot that I recall
09:40.28ndnihilblok: press and drag
09:40.52create_vibeoops, there's no -a there
09:40.56create_vibe:|
09:41.01ndnihilcreate: you'll need that
09:41.44create_vibe:D
09:41.51ndnihil03:57 < ndnihil> yep, for rootfs the command is:  dfu-util -a rootfs -R -D
09:41.51ndnihil<PROTECTED>
09:42.13create_vibei know, my bad...
09:42.15create_vibehigh
09:42.41ndnihilno excuse, I've popped a few vicodin and smoked a bit in the past couple hours
09:42.46ndnihil(migranes)
09:43.09create_vibe242am ?
09:43.18ndnihil04:43 here
09:43.27create_vibedamn
09:44.06ndnihilwell, you should consider that I didn't wake up until 23:00
09:44.11ndnihilI keep strange hours
09:44.40create_vibei woke up at 3pm today
09:44.47create_vibeI needed the sleep
09:45.32ndnihilyou should probably re-flash your kernel just to be on the safe side
09:45.35ndnihilafter rootfs is done
09:45.41ndnihildont forget the -a switch
09:45.50create_vibethe kernel went good
09:45.52create_vibeI had the -a
09:46.01ndnihilyeah, but forgetting the -a for rootfs could have overwritten it
09:46.05create_vibeoh
09:46.07create_viberight
09:46.12ndnihilI dont know what addresses dfu-util defaults to
09:46.38ndnihilbut with -110 meaning not enough space for the image
09:46.46create_vibeman doesn't say
09:46.48create_vibeya, true
09:46.51ndnihilits quite possible it was trying to write to the kernel partiton
09:46.56ndnihilpartition
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09:51.02blokkie_ndnihil:  * Failed to download http://build.shr-project.org/shr-testing/ipk//armv4/Packages.gz, error 404
09:51.09blokkie_I can not do  opkg update ?
09:51.10ndnihilthat's normal
09:51.15ndnihilyou can ignore it
09:51.27ndnihilthe rest of the package lists likely came down without issue
09:51.45blokkie_I'm doing an upgrade now :)
09:51.47ndnihilremove it from /etc/opkg if it annoys you (I did)
09:52.27blokkie_SHR  is definatly a more stable, responsive and complete distro compared to the default that was installed
09:52.28*** join/#openmoko gfather (n=gfather@77.241.65.48)
09:52.31gfatherhello guys
09:52.36gfatherwhats this
09:52.36gfatherYour APN:  ?
09:52.49ndnihilblokkie_: it seems to be the most popular of the bunch
09:52.49gfatherwhat does APN reffer to
09:53.06create_vibewell now I'm excited
09:53.09ndnihilapn = access point name
09:53.25Wonkagfather: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Access_Point_Name
09:53.50gfatherthanks :) , needed to know what it is to translate :)
09:54.07ndnihilhttp://www.flexispy.com/Mobile%20APN%20Setting%20to%20use%20GPRS.htm
09:54.41ndnihilactually
09:54.44ndnihilthose dont look correct
09:54.49ndnihilmy at&t was different
09:55.02ndnihiloutdated perhaps
09:55.59ndnihilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GPRS#Some_APN_names_for_reference
09:57.07ndnihilcreate_vibe: still going?
09:57.22create_vibegood so far
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10:00.03s_pdoes shr-testing use e16 or e17 ?
10:00.44create_vibeok, both done
10:00.47create_vibefinished
10:00.58create_vibeshould I put my card back in when I reboot?
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10:01.25ndnihilyeah, maybe stick a piece of tape on the back to add just a little bit of thickness to it
10:01.58ndnihilwith the different pad shapes, I wanted to make sure mine was seated firmly in the right position
10:02.12ndnihilit may or may not help you
10:02.16ndnihilbut worth a shot
10:02.38ndnihilI just laid it down on some clear tape and cut around it with a razor blade
10:02.50ndnihilthe non-contact side that it :)
10:02.51ndnihiler
10:02.53ndnihilthat is
10:04.34create_vibei don't know
10:04.38create_vibeit's not locking in place any more
10:04.40ndnihilmight be worth cleaning the contacts with a pencil eraser too
10:04.49create_vibeoh
10:04.51create_vibejust kidding
10:05.22ndnihiland I guess the obvious check, is it inserted the right way around? :)
10:05.39create_vibei'm assuming
10:06.27ndnihilthe notched end faces the open side
10:07.02create_vibethe notch is on the top of the silver holder or bottom?
10:07.11ndnihilon the sim
10:07.16ndnihilthe end with the corner cut off
10:07.19create_vibethe notch on the sim, yes
10:07.45ndnihilthat is exposed when inserted
10:08.07create_vibeya
10:08.08ndnihilif its laying face down, and the little metal carriage is sticking up, the notch sticks up too
10:08.36create_vibeit's configuring gnome-vfs
10:08.43create_vibeoh that's done
10:08.53ndnihilyeah it'll run through some setup stuff
10:08.53create_vibetook a sec
10:09.01ndnihillet it do its thing
10:09.05create_vibefor sure
10:10.40create_vibeok, now which profile did you guys say?
10:10.42create_vibeillume shr?
10:11.03ndnihilyeah
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10:11.46create_vibecool
10:11.47create_vibeit's up
10:13.18create_vibeya, that's pimp
10:13.42create_vibeok, the sim is in, so the notch is sticking up towards the left, when standing up
10:13.51create_vibegold facing down
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10:14.55ndnihilsounds right
10:16.48create_vibeok, how do I know if this is gonna work
10:16.55create_vibedo I need to set anything up?
10:17.10ndnihilyes, check out the SHR tweaks wiki page
10:19.34create_vibeok, what's this date stuff
10:19.37create_vibeI don't quite understand
10:19.49ndnihilset the date/time and timezone
10:20.15create_vibeI understand that, but setting the date is confusing me
10:20.47ndnihilset up the timezone, and when it registers with the network it should auto-set the date
10:20.55create_vibeahh
10:21.00ndnihilassuming you can get your sim to work
10:21.17ndnihilany bars or carrier name at the top yet?
10:22.29create_vibenope
10:23.01ndnihiltry going into settings->GSM
10:23.32PaulFertserndnihil: there's exactly no reports about any 2G-compatible sim not working (using the latest gsm firmware).
10:23.38create_vibecan't connect to dbus
10:23.47create_vibeophonekitd it's not running! start it?
10:23.49create_vibeI clicked yes
10:24.02ndnihilpaul: was going to get him to check his firmware revision next :)
10:24.21PaulFertserndnihil: if he never flashed it, he must flash. It's easy like that :)
10:24.46ndnihilyeah, the uSD method was cake
10:25.25PaulFertserndnihil: i meant the decision to flash is easy. Never flashed -> flash.
10:25.41ndnihilyeah that too
10:25.56ndnihiljust walked him(them) through sticking SHR testing on
10:26.00ndnihilboth of them are booted into it now
10:26.22ndnihilblokkie_ has been quiet, so I assume he's installing software
10:26.28PaulFertserndnihil: cool :)))
10:27.34ndnihilso yeah, create, settings->GSM->modem information
10:27.51ndnihilyou should see the string 'moko' followed by a one or two digit number
10:28.03ndnihilif it's not 'moko11'
10:28.07ndnihilfix it :)
10:28.17create_vibeit says: gsm settings: can't connect to dbus
10:29.00ndnihilhrm, I got that a couple times, but forget what (if anything) I did to fix
10:29.19create_vibe:|
10:29.34PaulFertsercreate_vibe: check if frameworkd is running. Check syslog.
10:29.44create_vibecan u walk me through it?
10:30.42PaulFertsercreate_vibe: hm, check logread?
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10:32.16create_vibeok
10:32.19create_vibewhat would I look for?
10:32.52create_vibegreping frameworkd didn't give me anything
10:33.06PaulFertsercreate_vibe: try to start it from /etc/init.d/
10:33.15PaulFertsercreate_vibe: though it should have started automatically.
10:33.31PaulFertsercreate_vibe: i hope you've already rebooted at least once, have you?
10:33.37create_vibeya
10:33.40create_vibeok, it restarted
10:33.43ndnihil/var/volatile/log/frameworkd.log
10:34.14create_vibeok, I have a lot in there, ndnihil
10:34.46create_vibeget a WARNING  Attempted to send something while serial is not open.
10:35.04PaulFertsercreate_vibe: btw, do you have ophonekitd running?
10:35.21create_vibei enabled it, but when I looked at it again, it didnt' say it was enabled still
10:35.24PaulFertsercreate_vibe: because without it nobody enables gsm subsystem and therefore you can't get modem information.
10:35.50PaulFertsercreate_vibe: try to start it from command line (if you're doing it via ssh, export DISPLAY=:0 first).
10:35.52create_vibeok, I told it to start on the gui
10:35.53create_vibeoh
10:36.13create_vibeGSM is not available.  because no SIM card is present
10:36.47PaulFertsercreate_vibe: if you haven't upgraded your GSM firmware, do it now :)
10:36.54ndnihildefinitely
10:37.04create_vibehow?
10:37.14PaulFertsercreate_vibe: GSM/Flashing page on the wiki.
10:37.48*** join/#openmoko s_p (n=digy@77.241.163.216)
10:37.55ndnihilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM/Flashing
10:39.56*** join/#openmoko gDD (n=gDD@125.116.9.139)
10:40.36create_vibethis says moko11
10:40.43create_viberoot@om-gta02:/usr/sbin# FLUID_PORT=/dev/ttySAC0 fluid.exe \
10:40.43create_vibe-oo -od13,13 -b 115200 \
10:40.43create_vibe-f $HOME/calypso-moko11.m0
10:40.49create_vibewould I have moko12?
10:41.18PaulFertsercreate_vibe: why do you think moko12 is already released?
10:41.31create_vibeoh, I thought I saw it on the screen here
10:42.08PaulFertsercreate_vibe: moko11 is the latest atm.
10:42.33PaulFertserWe have some hope that some bugs will be fixed soon though.
10:42.53create_vibesays fluid.exe is not found
10:43.13ndnihiluse the uSD method
10:43.18ndnihilit's much easier
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10:43.39create_vibe?
10:43.55ndnihilat the very bottom of that page
10:44.01create_vibeahh
10:44.02ndnihilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM/Flashing#uSD-card_Image
10:44.17PaulFertsercreate_vibe: you haven't installed fluid yet, why do you hope to find it? ;)
10:44.38create_vibei thought it would be something built in
10:44.39create_vibeidk
10:44.39create_vibe:)
10:45.01PaulFertserndnihil: imho downloading 100M, saving existing uSD contents, dd'ing (especially when you don't have a card-reader), rebooting, restoring uSD contents etc is much harder than the manual method.
10:45.27ndnihilI had a spare uSD card not doing anything
10:45.38ndnihilstuck it in, booted, pulled it out, done
10:45.54PaulFertserndnihil: i just don't understand the concept of using a complicated method when a simple is available.
10:46.12ndnihilit's more idiot proof
10:46.30ndnihilkeeps people from forgetting to add command line switches :)
10:47.02PaulFertserndnihil: i hope om-users do not consider themselves idiots.
10:47.14ndnihileh "idiot proof" in a general sense
10:48.26ndnihilcompared to the general public I'd say we're far from idiots
10:48.53PaulFertserndnihil: to be honest i sometimes doubt it ;)
10:49.11ndnihilwell, every village has one, or two, or more
10:49.13create_vibeso I have to put this on my card?
10:49.21create_vibeI can remove it right?
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10:49.36ndnihilcreate_vibe: yes, it's just a one-time bootable image that upgrades the firmware for you
10:49.47create_vibecan I scp it?
10:49.54create_vibehehe
10:49.59create_vibei don't wanna take it out
10:50.02PaulFertserndnihil: you see ;)
10:50.04create_vibeok
10:50.40ndnihilhahahah
10:50.58ndnihilcreate: you dont have to take it out, you just dd it from the phone itself
10:51.02ndnihilbut read that readme
10:51.09ndnihilI have to go out for a bit
10:57.08create_vibei don't understand this
10:57.09*** join/#openmoko poco (n=neil@vau06-1-89-85-32-52.dsl.club-internet.fr)
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10:59.25PaulFertsercreate_vibe: just use the uSD image per instructions provided with it then.
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11:01.16PaulFertsercreate_vibe: the idea is that you need to copy byte-by-byte the image to any supported uSD card (not to a card partition, to the card itself). You can do that however you like, even by booting your freerunner from NAND and using its uSD port as a card-reader.
11:02.21*** join/#openmoko Deubeuliou (n=Deubeuli@AFontenayssB-151-1-24-106.w83-114.abo.wanadoo.fr)
11:05.49create_vibehey, some bars on the phone came up
11:05.51create_vibethey say sos only
11:06.11create_vibehas a * over the bars
11:07.10*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
11:07.54*** join/#openmoko dns53 (n=dns@ppp246-215.static.internode.on.net)
11:10.57*** join/#openmoko emacsian1 (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
11:13.20create_vibedoes that mean I need to register it or something?
11:14.30*** join/#openmoko emacsian2 (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
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11:22.55PaulFertsercreate_vibe: imho if you don't have moko11 yet, you should flash it.
11:23.39*** join/#openmoko jonsmith1982 (n=jon@82-38-88-58.cable.ubr01.donc.blueyonder.co.uk)
11:23.43create_vibewell, I'm following the steps here
11:23.47create_vibeI don't understand the usd shit
11:24.07create_vibeBootloader: (reset target) (fluid, version 3) ok
11:24.07create_vibeChecksumming (0 * 8kB = 0kB):  ok
11:24.07create_vibeFlash Detect: (0xEC, 0x22A0) Samsung K5A3240CT ok
11:24.07create_vibeProgram: (0 sectors, 0*8k=0k) () ok
11:24.07DocScrutinizergo flash moko11 now!!! hehehe
11:24.17create_vibeI'm not sure what I did wrong
11:24.28DocScrutinizermuahahaha you already got moko11
11:24.34create_vibepfft
11:24.59PaulFertserDocScrutinizer: either that or he copied the output from the wiki ;)
11:25.06create_vibeno
11:25.09create_vibethat's what I see
11:25.11DocScrutinizerhehehehe giggle
11:25.24create_vibeoh, I didn't read further
11:25.26create_vibeI guess I already did it
11:25.28DocScrutinizerU used "my" uSD image?
11:25.32*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
11:25.32create_vibeok, so now what?
11:25.33DocScrutinizerto flash?
11:26.05PaulFertsercreate_vibe: now reboot (and don't forget to insert your sim)
11:26.13create_vibeit's in
11:26.24DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: did you use uSD-image for GSM-flash?
11:26.44create_vibeno
11:26.48create_vibewell, not that I recall
11:26.50DocScrutinizerpfft
11:26.53create_vibeit was a while ago
11:26.58create_vibei might have
11:28.03DocScrutinizer[2009-04-12 13:24:09] <create_vibe> Program: (0 sectors, 0*8k=0k) () ok
11:28.05DocScrutinizer[2009-04-12 13:24:18] <create_vibe> I'm not sure what I did wrong
11:28.19DocScrutinizermemory disorder ?
11:28.41*** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=ibex@d51A515D7.access.telenet.be)
11:28.45create_vibe:)
11:29.23ndnihilwhat does settings->GSM->modem information->revision say?
11:29.32DocScrutinizerfeels like wasting time
11:30.08CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libframeworkd-glib * r9765f6989d09 10/ (ChangeLog NEWS): remove bogus content from ChangeLog and NEWS
11:30.45mickeylwhy is libframeworkd-glib not shipping a .vapi ?
11:30.58create_vibendnihil, it's not there right now
11:31.03create_vibesays can't connect to dbus
11:31.50DocScrutinizerndnihil: if he had used uSD image he easily could log in via mickeyterm... but he can't remember how he managed to install FLUID on FR, nor about the command resulting in Program: (0 sectors, 0*8k=0k) () ok
11:32.12ndnihilshakes his head
11:32.24DocScrutinizermickeyl: geh ostereier suchen! ;-)
11:32.54blokkie_how do I install assassin ?
11:32.56mickeylheh
11:32.58create_vibeok, I can modem informatino now
11:32.59blokkie_the om-installer
11:33.01create_vibecan *see
11:33.13create_viberegistration says unregistered
11:33.22ndnihilwhat does revision say?
11:33.34ndnihilthere should be the string 'moko' followed by a one or two digit number
11:33.48blokkie_ndnihil: you know how do I install assassin ?
11:33.50ndnihilmine says moko11, yours should too
11:33.54create_viberevision is umm: "HW: GTA, GSM: gsm_ac_gp_fd_.......-Moko9-beta1"
11:34.03DocScrutinizermuahahaha
11:34.05ndnihilok, you need to update that firmware
11:34.16create_vibemeh
11:34.16create_vibewtf
11:34.20PaulFertserDocScrutinizer: i told you :)
11:34.23DocScrutinizer[2009-04-12 13:24:08] <DocScrutinizer> go flash moko11 now!!! hehehe
11:34.28ndnihilhehehe
11:34.32create_vibeI thought I just tried to do that
11:34.33DocScrutinizer[2009-04-12 13:24:09] <create_vibe> Program: (0 sectors, 0*8k=0k) () ok
11:34.57ndnihilcreate_vibe: it didn't work, do it right this time :)
11:35.01DocScrutinizerI thought you can't remember as it is so long ago
11:35.11create_vibeno, I just tried to do it
11:35.21create_vibehmm, it just powered down
11:35.32create_vibeoh
11:35.34create_vibecool
11:35.50DocScrutinizeris putting n his red nose and a silly hat
11:35.51blokkie_ndnihil:  before I flashed my neo , it had a nice gui installer . Now I don't have that anymore
11:35.53ndnihildid you read the readme that came with the moko11 image?
11:35.57create_vibehehe
11:36.07ndnihilblokkie_: quite so
11:36.09create_vibeyes, but I don't understand it
11:36.12create_vibeI followed the steps
11:36.15create_vibeon the manual way
11:36.30DocScrutinizerobviously not
11:36.38ndnihiluse the uSD image method
11:36.42ndnihilit's foolproof('ish)
11:36.58blokkie_ndnihil:  how do i install the gui then ?
11:37.09create_vibeReading image file: WARNING(58): No input file name supplied
11:37.14create_vibei got that
11:37.19ndnihilblokkie_: grab it from <whatever repository has it for armv4t> and opkg install it
11:37.39blokkie_ndnihil:  but I don't know it's name :S
11:37.45ndnihilnor do I
11:37.50ndnihilI use opkg cli
11:37.56blokkie_k
11:38.18*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
11:38.42ndnihillook around opkg.org
11:38.49ndnihilI'm sure they have a gui package thing listed
11:38.50create_vibeany more ideas?
11:39.00ndnihilcreate_vibe: follow the instructions in the readme
11:39.03DocScrutinizerget the uSD-image!!!
11:39.05ndnihilit works great when you do what it says
11:39.10create_vibei don't understand this
11:39.10create_vibedd if=flash-moko11-2.image of=<your_uSD_device>; #this is NO partition
11:39.37DocScrutinizerok, insert your uSD to your PC cardreader
11:39.42ndnihilok, dd interacts with devices on a more raw level than you're probably accustomed to
11:39.54create_vibein the device or my computer
11:40.00ndnihilon your computer
11:40.03DocScrutinizerPC
11:40.05create_vibeso I have to take it out
11:40.07ndnihilthat was the PC part he mentioned :)
11:40.09create_vibek
11:40.33ndnihilgives create_vibe some ritalin
11:40.34DocScrutinizerwatch syslog
11:40.43DocScrutinizerthere should appear some device name
11:41.06plhardydmesg ...
11:41.14DocScrutinizeror maybe even some konqueror or other requester pops up in card insertion
11:41.41ndnihilhe's in ubuntu, so it'll likely automount
11:41.56create_vibek, got the card in my usb
11:41.57plhardyif there is soemthing to automount
11:41.59DocScrutinizerthat might show the name of your card (like /dev/sdc)
11:42.04ndnihilplhardy: true
11:42.18henkdmesg shows the new device...
11:42.35DocScrutinizerthat's what I meant with "watch syslog"
11:42.49create_vibeya, it's mounted
11:43.04DocScrutinizer`less +F /war/log/messages`
11:43.17DocScrutinizerwhat'S the name
11:43.19DocScrutinizer?
11:43.32create_vibehuh
11:43.33DocScrutinizer`mount`
11:43.46plhardyand i thnik you will need to unmount everything to not confuse your system
11:43.56DocScrutinizertell us the output of mount command
11:44.19create_vibeof what mount command?
11:44.22DocScrutinizerplhardy: that's written in detail in the readme for uSD-image
11:44.28create_vibeit mounted automatically, like ndnihil said
11:44.43create_vibeok, the rest is unmounted
11:45.00DocScrutinizergo to a console or xterm. type m, then o, then u, then nt
11:45.07DocScrutinizerthen <enter>
11:45.15plhardyidea is to copy a raw content on a uSD card, whatever is mounted is something that existed before and that will be totally erased
11:45.29DocScrutinizerndnihil: your ritalin was old it seems
11:45.34create_vibewhat are you looking for?
11:45.44create_vibeu jsut want the entire output?
11:45.55Dave:]
11:46.03create_vibehttp://pastebin.ws/3r6338
11:46.07plhardywhat gives a mount command ?
11:46.40plhardyi bet for /dev/sde
11:46.42DocScrutinizer<PROTECTED>
11:46.49DocScrutinizeryup exactly
11:46.54create_vibeya, I could have told you that if you asked me
11:46.58create_vibeso now?
11:47.06*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
11:47.17DocScrutinizerdd if=flash-moko11-2.image of=/dev/sde
11:47.19plhardy<PROTECTED>
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11:47.23create_vibeahh
11:47.25create_vibety :)
11:47.51blokkie_how do I check my revision ?
11:48.05DocScrutinizerblokkie_: use mickeyterm
11:48.22create_vibeoh, /dev/sde instead of sde1
11:48.28DocScrutinizerblokkie_: nah, nevermind
11:48.33create_vibe?
11:48.39DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: YEEES
11:49.28plhardycreate_vide: /dev/sde1 was the first partition of your previous system here we are interested in full uSD not only to first partition
11:49.32DocScrutinizerbut unmount /dev/sde1 BEFORE!!!
11:49.59DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: cmd: `umount /dev/sde1`
11:50.05plhardysince /dev/sde1 is a part of /dev/sde ...
11:50.15DocScrutinizerTHEN dd if=flash-moko11-2.image of=/dev/sde
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11:50.23create_vibewell shit
11:51.37DocScrutinizerprepares a create-usd.bat
11:51.47ndnihilheheh
11:52.00create_vibe:)
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11:52.24shellevilDocScrutinizer: US congress got there first.
11:52.30create_vibeok, 283 MB copied
11:53.24DocScrutinizerlooks good
11:53.24DocScrutinizerinsert uSD to FR
11:53.24create_vibeput it back in the neo?
11:53.24create_vibekk
11:53.24DocScrutinizerhold AUX button, press POWER button
11:53.29DocScrutinizerpush AUX to highlite "boot from uSD"
11:53.42DocScrutinizerpush POWER
11:53.56DocScrutinizerhere you go
11:55.32DocScrutinizeryou should see some blue writing on the screen
11:55.49DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: do you?
11:56.34DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: do you?
11:56.51create_vibeya ya
11:56.53create_vibeit's working
11:57.17DocScrutinizerwait until color changing to green - - > done
11:57.21DocScrutinizerMOKO11
11:57.33create_vibefailed on something
11:57.35create_vibebut it's still going
11:57.43create_vibebtusb....
11:57.44ndnihillet it do its thing
11:57.54DocScrutinizerit's normal to fail on first shot
11:58.13DocScrutinizertakes 3 min, then another 3 for successful 2. shot
11:58.26ndnihilmine went through first run
11:58.36DocScrutinizerif it's green you may login via ssh if you like
11:59.17DocScrutinizerstart `mickeyterm` - -talk to modem, have fun
11:59.22DocScrutinizer;-)
11:59.49create_vibeok, I'm at a login screen
11:59.52create_vibeit said done in green
12:00.33create_vibeso, it's done?
12:00.36create_vibeI can reboot normally?
12:00.38DocScrutinizernow you have two options: take out uSD and reboot
12:01.06DocScrutinizeror login to the running FSO-console image and try mickeyterm
12:01.22DocScrutinizervia usb and ssh
12:01.38DocScrutinizeractually mickeyterm is fun
12:02.00saracenwhy?
12:02.25ndnihilhe likes to watch noobs struggle
12:02.29ndnihil;)
12:02.38DocScrutinizercause it's easy to talk to modem, without concern about switching on modem, setting up tty etc
12:03.05DocScrutinizeror short version: because it 'just works'
12:03.15saracenah, i never tried it
12:03.29DocScrutinizerand at least you can check for sure you got moko11 now
12:04.05DocScrutinizerby asking the subsystem that should know: calypso modem
12:05.10DocScrutinizerand you know for sure it's not the modem or tty-hw, *if* anything fails with GSM in any arbitrary distro later on
12:06.38DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: so after all, was that easy, or was that easy?
12:06.55create_vibeya, got moko11
12:06.58create_vibeyes
12:07.34create_vibeit said no sim card is present again tho
12:07.38create_vibeand I show no service
12:08.29DocScrutinizermake sure your sim is inserted correctly. and locked
12:08.38create_vibewell it's in and locked
12:08.44create_vibeI'm not sure how 'correctly' is
12:09.03create_vibeI'll try adjusting it
12:09.21blokkie_are people working on  a new release like  om 2009 ?
12:09.26DocScrutinizerif it is inserted correctly, there is no way to adjust anything
12:10.22DocScrutinizercut corner is to the outside of FR, away from holder. that's correct
12:13.02*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
12:13.04create_vibecant 'connect to dbus
12:13.27DocScrutinizerthat's a distro problem. dbus isn't up for some reason
12:13.38DocScrutinizer~docscrutinizer
12:13.39apti guess docscrutinizer is jOERG, a HW-developer and engineer of Openmoko
12:13.46*** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@91-113-121-206.adsl.highway.telekom.at)
12:13.54DocScrutinizerso you see, SW is another department ;-)
12:13.57create_vibeI figured :)
12:13.58gfatheranyone here did localization for shr ?
12:14.56*** join/#openmoko apol_ (n=apol@81.184.58.107.dyn.user.ono.com)
12:15.29create_vibei see bars now
12:15.32create_vibewith a *
12:16.30plhardygfather: at least there is english localization :-)
12:16.30*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.110.169)
12:17.19create_vibewhat does the * mean?
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12:18.10gfatherplhardy :) loool
12:18.29create_vibegsm seems to be locked up
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12:30.07saracenDo I need a special screwdriver to take the front cover off my freerunner?
12:31.28mickeylyes
12:31.29mickeyltorx
12:31.36mickeyl6 iirc
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12:37.27shellevilAn axe,
12:37.42mickeylor that, yes.
12:37.49mickeylbut only once...
12:37.56shellevilThe exact right sizee of flat screwdriver can also work
12:38.07shellevilone that fits in the torx flutes
12:40.13Weissa Nectar card works very well for levering the case off - just the right combination of springiness and firmness
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12:42.43shellevilhaz fingernailz.
12:43.34re-peatafter i took my two screws out... i threw them out ;)
12:43.50re-peatnow i can open it anytime
12:43.56re-peatwith just my fingers
12:44.50saracenSay I wanted to complete disassemble my freerunner, whats all the tools I'd need? :)
12:44.54saracencompletely*
12:45.17ndnihila dremel with a cutting wheel
12:45.25cjb_iewhat do you mean by complete?
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12:45.40gfatherre-peat i dont think that is safe :)
12:45.46saracenha, in way of there being other weird screwdrivers I'm not likely to have
12:45.52gfatherif it fels down , i think it will do more damege
12:46.21saracenI mean, I'm not saying I'm going to. But I dont want to have to order another tool down the road and pay more p&p. I'm cheap.
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12:49.18shellevilebay has _lots_ of appropriate screwdrivers
12:49.36shellevilas they are pretty much the  commonest size in mobile phones
12:50.14DocScrutinizersaracen: you need a torx6  -hat's all
12:50.29DocScrutinizers/h/- th/
12:51.09saracenThanks guys :)
12:53.54DocScrutinizerfinding a flat blade screwdriver that fits into the torx so snuggly you can open them is quite rare - chances to ruin the torx are high, so it's NOT recommended
12:53.59shellevilyeah
12:54.46shellevilhowever - modifying a slightly larger one is quite easy
12:55.13shellevilThough as always with screws - pressing harder will almost never damage the screw, but not pressing hard enough will
12:56.05DocScrutinizershellevil: if you got the file, a screwdriver with *good* steel, lots of time and a skill to do metalworks. Then yes
12:56.36re-peatscrew this
12:56.47DocScrutinizerthen modding a flat driver is easy indeed
12:56.54re-peatoi joerg hows it hanging
12:57.15DocScrutinizerhuh?
12:58.52DocScrutinizersorry my colloquial English isn't up to par with this I guess
13:00.16DocScrutinizers/up to/on a/
13:00.20DocScrutinizerQED
13:00.25DocScrutinizer:)
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13:19.51create_vibewell I got the bars up but I can't seem to make a phone call
13:22.29DocScrutinizercreate_vibe: ping ndnihil
13:27.55create_vibeoh well it's time for me to crash anyways
13:27.59create_vibethanks for all the help
13:28.01create_vibeI'll be back :)
13:29.22ndnihilhrm?
13:29.28ndnihilsorry, watching high school girls stab each other
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13:33.05mwesterbad neighborhood, huh?
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13:33.39ndnihilbad movie on hulu
13:33.50ndnihilgood ending though, all the main characters died
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14:34.23CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libgsm0710mux * r164afc81aef8 10/ (ChangeLog gsm0710mux/serial.vala): Handle all known speeds for which Posix speed constants exist.
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14:38.55CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libgsm0710mux * r373d07b09a25 10/gsm0710mux/multiplexer.vala: Handle all known speeds for which Posix speed constants exist.
14:40.00CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libgsm0710mux * ra58c669913ef 10/ (ChangeLog configure.ac): this is libgsm0710mux 0.3.2
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14:43.53der-lehmannany news on projekt B?
14:44.54mickeylim Juni oder Juli dann
14:44.59mickeylggfs. auch erst später
14:45.12CViruslame
14:45.25CVirusclosedMoko
14:45.36CVirusMicroMoko
14:45.40mickeyl:D
14:45.42CVirusbut not OpenMoko
14:46.51mickeylsince the new device will not be moko at all
14:46.58mickeyli don't think it makes a difference ;)
14:47.11mickeylwell it's going to be 'mo'
14:47.13mickeylbut not 'ko'
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14:48.01CVirusmickeyl: stop it before you vioate your NDA :-
14:48.02CVirus:-p
14:48.05CVirusviolate*
14:48.20mickeyl*nod*
14:48.25mickeyli'm bound by that for 2 more years iirc
14:48.36CVirushehe
14:48.47mickeyli don't actually know whether it terminates when the company ceases to exist
14:48.48mickeylhmm
14:48.50mickeyl*shrug*
14:49.03CVirusLOL
14:49.17mwesterMost don't, if well written, at least in my experience.
14:49.52mwesterThe lawyers don't want anyone saying anything that would decrease the value of even a dead corporate carcass.
14:49.58mickeylright
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15:15.22alphaonemickey|bbq: We should write a book about the openmoko experience :-)
15:16.40mwesterwould buy that book.
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15:16.57Defiant-would download it on piratebay
15:16.58mwester"The Soul of  BrokenMoko"
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15:18.37CVirusLOL @ Defiant-
15:18.50CVirusthis was just added to my favorite quotes on facebook
15:18.54shellevilfails parsing.
15:19.06shellevilI parsed that as 'Pi Rat eBay'
15:19.15shellevilwhich confused me
15:19.34mwestershows where you've been spending time online... too much shopping!
15:19.37mwester:D
15:20.19Defiant-<--outsider, never used ebay
15:21.06mwesterwonders if Defiant- is independently wealthy then!
15:21.16mwestercouldn't afford his hobby without eBay
15:22.08Defiant-get cheaper hobbys :D
15:22.21mwesterI'm going to have to.
15:22.51mwesterEither that or become a politician; they're the only people making money in this country anymore.
15:23.16Defiant-try working as manager of a bank
15:23.31shellevilmwester: I bought a really big bag of grass the other day.
15:23.40shellevils/ss/ss seed/
15:23.41re-peathobbies are the first to go in a recession
15:24.08mwestershellevil:  thanks for the clarification ;)
15:24.13shellevilAnd I'm bidding on a broken hedgetrimmer.
15:24.19mwesterI have one of those.
15:24.22re-peatwill end up getting a big bag of grass
15:24.29mwesterI'm hoping oil and a file will fix it.
15:24.32re-peathappy easter
15:24.46shellevilAnd looking for some solar-thermal tubes in singles to play with.
15:25.02shellevilI want to try using them with mirrors, for added output.
15:25.05mwesteralso needs to fix his lawnmower.
15:25.30Chockyso you can use your FR to remote control it?
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15:25.57mwesterNo, so I can run the lawnmower OVER the gta0x's
15:26.06shellevilAlso need to replace my breadmaker pan.
15:26.18shellevilNote to anyone with a breadmaker.
15:26.29mwester:)  It's really quite astonishing how powerful the forces of entropy are...
15:26.35shellevilMaking bread with a teaspoon in the mix does not do the anti-stick coating any good.
15:26.43mwesterPpphhhhht!
15:29.38shellevilIt's annoying - no easy spares for this model, because it's about 5 years old.
15:29.49shellevilBut it's a nice one with programmable times.
15:30.22shellevilSo you can set it for 54 minutes warm, 5 minuted knead,, 45 minutes rise, 5 minutes knead, ...
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15:31.46Raazeerhi all, got a question regarding debian on freerunner.
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15:32.42PaulFertserRaazeer: go ahead
15:32.45Raazeerthe fso-stage fails, it requests i install xserver-xorg-core, but then complains it conflicts with xserver-xorg-input-2 which I can't seem to opt-out
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15:33.50PaulFertserRaazeer: have you tried to install the packages you need manually?
15:33.51Raazeeradding "xserver-xorg-input-2-" in the FSO_PACKAGES variable doesn't seem to have any effect
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15:34.10Raazeerthat doesn't seem to work either, it won't recognize apt-get
15:34.20PaulFertserRaazeer: also, there's a special openmoko debian IRC channel (sorry, i can't remember exactly)
15:34.27Raazeerthough it uses it
15:34.46RaazeerI'll try to find it.
15:35.01PaulFertserRaazeer: try to remove xserver-xorg-core from the list?
15:35.20re-peat#openmoko-debian
15:35.37Raazeerthen it complains about unmet dependencies of xserver-xorg-fbdev an some other starting with t...
15:36.11Raazeerxserver-xorg-tslib
15:36.24re-peati recently installed neovento on my phone its debian based and flashable
15:36.40re-peathttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neovento
15:36.44re-peati gotta say i love it
15:37.03Raazeerif I can't get Debian to work, I might as well try that
15:37.15re-peatleast till that issue is fixed
15:37.20Raazeerbut I'm kind of a debian-fan
15:37.27ChockyThey keep chaing the name of it :p
15:37.38Raazeerthat's fan with capital F.
15:37.39Chockyis working on an emdebian version, bit it's going slow
15:37.42Raazeerand A.
15:37.50Raazeerand N, for that matter^^
15:38.19PaulFertserRaazeer: if some part of install.sh doesn't work, just install what you need by hand. You'll be able to install/configure xorg later (via ssh over usb).
15:38.34re-peatchroot in
15:38.46*** join/#openmoko Cervajz (n=Cervajz@opensuse/member/Cervajz)
15:38.46Raazeercan I just skip the fso stage and do that later?
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15:40.28PaulFertserRaazeer: why not? All you need is to get a rootfs you'll be able to ssh to.
15:40.55PaulFertserRaazeer: read the script, you'll see what is really needed and what is not.
15:41.04Raazeerok, if the guys over at openmoko-debian don't know more, I'll try that.
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15:42.28PaulFertserRaazeer: i installed debian on my freerunner by hand, following the script as the reference as at that time it didn't support Qi yet.
15:42.35PaulFertserRaazeer: was very easy.
15:44.25Raazeerhm. apparently they're all asleep over in -debian
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15:46.32Raazeerall rigtht, gonna do it manually later.
15:46.41Raazeerthanks for your help guys
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16:10.42plhardyi just discovers that uSDcard is not a MTD device even if it contains a flash chip.
16:11.02lindi-plhardy: yep
16:11.18plhardyfor me it was so bvious that a microSD was just a flash device...
16:11.29lindi-plhardy: it has its own controller for the wear-leveling
16:12.05plhardythere are many good explanation, but i didn't know there was a problem then i didn't read solutions :-)
16:12.20lindi-problem?
16:12.53plhardynot really, i just undestrstand why my SHR didn't boot on my SDcard
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16:13.11plhardyjust because i have to create a good ext2 system first
16:14.05plhardyfor me jffs2 was just like ext2 or vfat, it is not, it is on top of MTD device and not on top of block device.
16:14.36lindi-plhardy: yep
16:15.02plhardynever too late to be smarter...
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16:25.15transylvaniaHi, I'am trying to test android on the freerunner but I have some troubles: I made the env setup for big kernels, flash the neo with freerunner-v14.6-cupcake.jffs2 and tried uImage-v14.bin and v17 kernel but it don't seem to boot
16:25.19transylvaniaany clue ?
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16:27.26DaveSelig
16:27.29Davepokes SeligArkin
16:27.35SeligArkinmeows
16:29.19plhardytransylvania: i hava a working anrdoid on my sdcard, i installed Qi boot to replace bootloader and on sd card i created an ext2 parititon where i put all root content + image in /boot/uImage-GTA02.bin + ad append file /boot/append-GTA02
16:29.42plhardybut i didn't install it in internal system
16:30.45plhardyroot was androidfs-koolu-beta3.jffs2
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16:33.01transylvaniaplhardy: I have read that installing on internal is better for performance
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16:33.31plhardyi was too shy to try :-) ( sorry i have to go now )
16:33.47transylvaniano problem
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16:41.14SeligArkinpoked Dave
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17:38.25slaxxerhows the latest shr upstable working
17:38.38wizkoderhy everybody
17:38.56slaxxerim, still on 03252009
17:39.15slaxxerhi
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17:41.46b0efslaxxer: I'm getting alot of segfaults with EFL
17:41.57b0efthere should be a button to restart it
17:42.11slaxxerlatest unstable?
17:42.28b0efthere's just a recover, which never works and a exit button, which leaves the screen black
17:42.33b0efwell, yeah, a few days ago
17:42.57slaxxerok
17:43.35bruce_cb0ef: I've just built an image from shr-unstable and it seems to be running really well
17:44.12b0efbruce_c: you've built it by compiling it?
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17:44.18bruce_cb0ef: yup
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17:45.07bruce_cand it seems to be the best install I've seen on this phone so far
17:45.15b0efbruce_c: how long have you been running it for?
17:45.49bruce_cb0ef: just a few hours today, but I was previously seeing enlightenment crashing after just a few minutes
17:46.24CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * re97515197ae1 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/abstract/mediator.py:
17:46.24CIA-41freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: Fix logic to show the correct operator name
17:46.24CIA-41freesmartphone.org: This fixes a logic error in finding out the best operator name. Before
17:46.24CIA-41freesmartphone.org: the result from the SIM query would always be overwritten with the
17:46.24CIA-41freesmartphone.org: result from the network.tab.
17:46.28CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Fixes a problem that was also exposed in FSO #375.
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17:49.19CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * rf3c98ef999c3 10/tests/dtest/ (dbus_test.py tests/__init__.py): Add preliminary dtest infrastructurAdd preliminary dtest infrastructure
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17:52.53b0efis there a catchall command to restart efl and friends?
17:53.05b0ef..like something in init.d?
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17:53.36lindi-b0ef: isn't that like asking if there's a way to restart gtk?
17:53.37bruce_cb0ef: there should be an X11 script in init.d
17:54.31b0eflindi-: right, I mean something like /etc/init.d/gdm restart
17:55.00b0efbruce_c: xserver-nodm
17:55.09bruce_cb0ef: that's it
17:55.22b0efI did a restart on that and got the same segfault;)
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17:56.47b0eftried restarting frameworkd and then xserver-nodm, but still segfaults
17:57.48b0efit's actually enlightenment segfault, btw
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18:04.47eMBeegood evening
18:05.39eMBeejust received a freerunner that was bought half a year ago, so it has a really old system installed
18:05.50Dave:P
18:05.57eMBeei am unable to make a backup or flash a new image. getting errors
18:06.15*** join/#openmoko doc|home (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007)
18:06.18ndnihilbackups (by way of dfu) dont work with some versions of uboot
18:06.20plhardyeMBee: welcome to freerunner owners
18:06.41plhardynormaly there should be a usb net working
18:06.51b0efnational freerunner owners association
18:06.54eMBeeyes, usb networking works
18:07.18plhardyeMBee: and does it has ssh connectivity ?
18:07.21eMBeei can log in, boot into nor, run dfu-util, etc...
18:07.28eMBeeyes, ssh is fine
18:07.57*** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@91-113-112-126.adsl.highway.telekom.at)
18:08.08eMBeewhen trying a backup i don't get the amount of data i should be getting
18:08.26plhardyyou try to run dfu-util wfrom wihtin the FR ?
18:08.36eMBeeFR?
18:08.43plhardyFreerunner
18:08.57eMBeeno, from another machine
18:09.33plhardywhat is the error when trying a backup ?
18:09.59eMBeeNo such Alternate Setting: "rootfs"
18:10.00plhardyin fact if you have usb net working that mean you go to far, since dfu works withn the u-boopt
18:10.10plhardytoo far.
18:10.42plhardydfu tools works when freerunner iis in u-boot
18:10.48eMBeeno, i got that right, ssh works only if i fully boot, i am running dfu while in the NOR boot menu
18:11.01plhardyafter it switch the usb connection to a usb net one once system is started
18:11.27plhardyNo such alternate setting... uhm
18:11.30b0efis opkg update supposed to work?
18:11.34b0ef* Failed to download http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-unstable/ipk//armv4/Packages.gz, error 404
18:11.49bruce_cb0ef: it works, but it fails to find/fetch the signatures
18:12.06plhardysome problem with MTD patrtionning or naming ?
18:12.31b0efbruce_c: aiight, thanks
18:12.54eMBeehmm?
18:13.02bruce_ceMBee: you're running this on x86 linux, right?
18:13.11eMBeeyes
18:13.30eMBee(an olpc xo running fedora 9)
18:13.44ndnihileMBee: what error do you get when trying to write to flash?
18:13.58bruce_cdoes dfu-util -l show "USB Device Firmware Upgrade"?
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18:14.13plhardy<PROTECTED>
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18:15.06plhardyare kernel , u-boot , splash working and only rootfs failing ?
18:15.28eMBeethe same: No such Alternate Setting:
18:15.48*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.119.50)
18:16.02eMBeeneither kernel nor rootfs work, didn't try u-boot yet
18:16.07plhardydo you a NAND u-boot ?
18:16.22plhardydo you -have-
18:16.27ndnihilare you going this from NOR or NAND uboot menu?
18:16.42plhardy( i am really tired with my fingers tonight )
18:17.08plhardyNAND might by more recent...
18:17.46eMBeei am trying this while in NOR, but i can boot into NAND
18:18.09plhardyif you can boot it NAND try it from NAND
18:18.18eMBeeok
18:20.11eMBeegives the same no alternate setting error
18:20.23bruce_ceMBee: dfu-util -l    ?
18:20.43eMBeeFound Runtime: [0x1d50:0x5119] devnum=21, cfg=0, intf=2, alt=0, name="USB Device Firmware Upgrade"
18:20.48bruce_cok
18:21.31*** join/#openmoko DrRabbit (n=xchat@ip68-99-219-29.ph.ph.cox.net)
18:21.48ndnihilare you plugged into a USB hub? or straight into the PC?
18:21.56eMBeedirectly
18:22.58b0efhmm, I thought that when I downloaded the shr-unstable image some days ago, it was pretty up to date, but after opkg-upgrade has been running for 10 minutes now, I wonder..?
18:23.00plhardycan blocks have another name than rootfs ... ?
18:23.24ndnihilthey can, but wouldnt it have to be defined in the uboot env?
18:24.21plhardyis there a way to dump u-boot settings from dfu-utils ?
18:24.22eMBeeu-boot version is 1.3.2-rc2-dirty-moko12 (apr 2 2008)
18:24.44plhardyit's is because it is dirty, you should clean it :-)
18:24.54plhardy(sorry)
18:25.14eMBee:-)  well, the nor version is the same without dirty
18:25.20kinneheMBee: hi you also got a moko ?
18:25.43eMBeekinneh: fancy seeing you here, yes a friend gave me one to play with
18:25.57kinnehoh nice, I got a gta01
18:26.05kinnehrunning shr testing
18:27.19PaulFertsereMBee: if you're trying to read data _from_ freerunner via dfu, then you need to use a recent u-boot, there was a bug preventing this from working.
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18:27.54PaulFertsereMBee: so NOR u-boot is not an option for performing a back up.
18:28.00eMBeewell, first of all the problem is that the names kerneel,rootfs etc don't work
18:28.37eMBeei considered updating u-boot, if i knew which alt setting to use
18:29.00plhardyeMBee: you might just dump mtd partitions ? no sure how to proceed like scp /dev/mtd... to your host ...
18:29.03PaulFertsereMBee: to update u-boot (or flash Qi), you need to boot into NOR and use "-a u-boot" setting.
18:29.03ndnihilhave you tried specifying the -d arg to dfu-util?
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18:29.53PaulFertsereMBee: and yes, as ndnihil suggesting it might be an issue of having another dfu-capable device in the system, you might want to specify the freerunner explicitly.
18:30.22bruce_cwouldn't the listing have shown it?
18:30.26eMBeePaulFertser; read the chatlog: i keep getting No such Alternate Setting:  errors
18:30.29ndnihileh longshot, if only the one is showing up with a -l
18:30.43ndnihilbut worth trying at any rate to be sure
18:30.43thrasholdHow can I ensure that my Neo1973 phone is drawing 500 mA from the USB port? (Debian)
18:30.47PaulFertsereMBee: i've read about it, but i can't (yet?) guess what's going on wrong.
18:31.07eMBeewell, i am using the -d argument because for reading dfu otherwise tries to access 0000:0000
18:31.09b0efbruce_c: it segfaults, too
18:31.10b0efDownloading http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-unstable/ipk//om-gta02/kernel-module-ip6t-reject_2.6.28-oe1+gitr119783+901d73fe51f33032b34b2ae5612eb863ec90532a-r3.1_om-gta02.ipk
18:31.12b0efSegmentation fault
18:31.22ndnihilhave you tried it without?
18:31.37ndnihiler, yes I suppose you have if you know its trying to access 0000:0000
18:31.47ndnihildoes it error when doing so?
18:31.48eMBeeyes, get the same no alt error too
18:31.49bruce_cdoesn't linux have a usb config utility to list the interfaces?
18:32.00plhardyhttp://kerneltrap.org/mailarchive/openmoko-community/2008/11/6/4073764
18:32.15plhardyeMBee: what version of dfu-tuil do you run ?
18:32.17eMBeelsusb lists the devices
18:32.35thrasholdchrcur is 575, chrmode is pre, chgstate is "fast_enebled present error"
18:32.39eMBeethe one from downloads.openmoko.org/distro/releases/Om2008.9/dfu-util
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18:33.24plhardyi installed this provided with ubuntu...
18:33.38PaulFertsereMBee: iirc when you try to just list the devices, u-boot can show as a single device, without alternate names. And upon uploading dfu-util sends some special commands to switch modes first and then to access alternate.
18:33.47ndnihilwhat does -V return?
18:33.59ndnihilI'm using 0.1+svn4160 with great success
18:34.19eMBeePaulFertser: yes, i gathered that, and once i even managed to see that list
18:34.31bruce_cPaulFertser: that's right - dfu-util switches it into DFU mode then does a USB reset
18:34.57eMBeendnihil: i got 0.1+svn4160
18:35.07eMBeesame then
18:35.11ndnihilhrm
18:35.20PaulFertsereMBee: any idea why dfu-util finds 0000:0000 without -d? It doesn't look right, can it influence somehow?
18:35.36eMBeei have no clue
18:36.18ndnihilyou're doing this as root, correct?
18:36.24eMBeeyes
18:36.35ndnihilsorry, had to ask
18:36.40eMBee:-0
18:37.36ndnihiltell us more about the PC side, could it have a crippled USB bus in some way?
18:37.56eMBeehmm, no idea, it's an olpc xo
18:38.05eMBeei could try another machine...
18:38.07ndnihilhrm, the $100 thing?
18:38.16eMBeeyup
18:38.25ndnihiltry a full workstation/laptop
18:38.43bruce_cdmesg doesn't show any warnings/errors?
18:38.52ndnihilI almost ordered a couple of those, but had serious doubts about the quality of the hardware for that price
18:39.38bruce_cb0ef: fantastic. I had opkg segfaulting for a while, not good that you can't even install software :/
18:39.50eMBeeno dmesg errors from what i can tell
18:40.10eMBeendnihil:the xo hardware is quite good as far as i can tell
18:40.28ndnihilit's $100, it can't be -that- good ;)
18:40.48ndnihilyou have to compromise somewhere along the line
18:40.54PaulFertsereMBee: 0000:0000 looks like some strange host issue to me.
18:41.37ndnihilI doubt they considered kids in namibia would attempt to program firmware
18:44.40eMBeehmm, plugged into my other laptop i now get a list of 7 things all with the expected names
18:44.59ndnihil7 DFU devices?
18:45.03eMBeeyes
18:45.12ndnihilsounds like quite the toybox
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18:45.30eMBeehmm?
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18:46.21ndnihildoes writing work on your laptop?
18:46.45eMBeehold on, i accidently booted the phone
18:47.37*** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@81.184.58.107.dyn.user.ono.com)
18:48.19b0efbruce_c: ran it again and it completed; hope it runs when I reboot;)
18:48.58PaulFertserndnihil: yes, it looks like 7 distinct devices (all have different names), you select the device you need with "-a" setting.
18:49.22ndnihilI only get one device
18:50.45PaulFertserndnihil: you only get one device until it's forced into DFU mode.
18:50.53ndnihilah
18:52.38ndnihilhrm, marvell libertas 88w8386
18:52.41ndnihilnever heard of it
18:52.47eMBeeok, reading appears to work now
18:53.01ndnihil(the USB chipset on the xo1)
18:54.01ndnihiloh wait, that's wifi hanging off the USB
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18:55.03ndnihilI do see mention that the xo1 usb is forced into low speed mode to save power in some cases
18:58.32*** join/#openmoko PierreN (i=pierre@mar06-1-88-167-174-249.fbx.proxad.net)
18:58.36PierreNhi
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19:00.10PierreNi'm trying to build openmoko on my debian system to try openmoko with qemu. I'm following this : http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU but when i run openmoko/download.sh
19:00.22PierreNi can't find a Kernel
19:00.24PierreNit says
19:00.31PierreN<PROTECTED>
19:00.31PierreN<PROTECTED>
19:00.31PierreN<PROTECTED>
19:00.50PierreNand then nothing... does anyone know how to solve this please ?
19:01.12eMBeeok i guess i am stuck working with that other laptop then, i was hoping to keep everything with the xo since that isthe machine i carry around with me
19:01.27ndnihilso it works with the other machine?
19:01.41eMBeebut then i am not going to flash the phone that often
19:01.57eMBeereading seems to work, so i am making image backups now and then i'll tryflashing
19:02.25ndnihilwell, if it's reading, it made it past the bit where it couldnt find the alternate tag
19:02.34eMBeeyes
19:02.35PaulFertsereMBee: and btw you can flash NAND from inside a running system (boot from uSD).
19:02.40ndnihilso I'd guess writing will work
19:03.12eMBeePaulFertser: ah, good to know
19:04.06PaulFertsereMBee: and in fact all flashing i did in my life is bootloader flashing (debugging Qi). I hope you won't need to do it too often. I just run from uSD all the time.
19:05.51PierreNany help please ?
19:06.09*** join/#openmoko freerunnerlive (n=ernst@p57B5D66C.dip.t-dialin.net)
19:06.59TeLLuS<PROTECTED>
19:08.03eMBeeok, getting therootfs will take a while, thanks for the help
19:08.17ndnihilglad it was something simple
19:08.54PierreNTeLLuS: do you know which image should i choose please ?
19:11.00TeLLuSPierreN: Then put in exit 0 in a line before . openmoko/env in file build/qemu/openmoko/download.sh    Image.. well I get u-boat to work but I fail loading linux.. But one step at a time..
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19:13.20thrasholdHm, I hope I manage to upgrade the software on my phone soon... The battery got exhausted 5 times today while I was trying to do so... :D
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19:14.02ndnihilthrashold: er, the USB cable should power it
19:14.03*** join/#openmoko Fale (n=Fale@93-36-128-103.ip60.fastwebnet.it)
19:14.45thrasholdndnihil: I thought so. However, at some point the phone just switches off, and I have to charge it for a hour or so, until it can boot again.
19:15.05ndnihilif I'm not mistaken, it wont charge unless it's booted
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19:15.37thrasholdNow it did reboot instead of switch off, I took the battery out to stop qtopia from booting, and now it won't boot again :)
19:15.52ndnihilit wont boot from USB power
19:15.56ndnihilit needs the battery for boot
19:16.10ndnihildoesnt provide enough current for powerup
19:16.13thrasholdYup, so I'm waiting for it to charge again..
19:16.19ndnihils/doesnt/usb doesnt/
19:16.23ndnihilstabs apt
19:16.33ndnihilhow are you charging it, if it wont boot?
19:16.48thrasholdWell, it should be charging at 100 mA now
19:17.00thrasholdWhile it's off
19:17.24TeLLuSPierreN: And edit the env file to match the filenames you download..
19:18.21ndnihilthat's the thing, I remember reading somewhere that the battery wont charge (in the phone) unless it has booted
19:18.36slaxxerchange to a newer os
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19:23.15TeLLuSPierreN: What filenames to download..  This and other u-boot for gta01 load fine. qi do not work here, only a real device.. http://downloads.openmoko.org/distro/unstable/daily/om-gta01/20090411/u-boot-gta01bv4-1.3.1+gitr650149a53dbdd48bf6dfef90930c8ab182adb512-r1.bin
19:25.03blokkie_are a lot of apps beeing ported to the moko ?
19:25.09blokkie_is it difficult ?
19:25.44ndnihilyou can cross compile pretty much anything you'll need, within hardware restrictions anyway
19:26.00slaxxerhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Applications
19:26.10blokkie_so .. ipk's are not realy needed  ?
19:26.12PaulFertserblokkie_: moreover, almost all debian apps are available.
19:26.28blokkie_ok cool :)
19:26.36blokkie_did not know all this :)
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19:34.44eMBeehmm, backup of rootfs ends with dfu_upload error -84, but the resulting image is 258076672 bytes, that seems to be the right size
19:35.13ndnihilbacking up requires a new'ish uboot
19:35.45ndnihilwriting to the device works fine though
19:35.56eMBeewe,, thebackup did seem to have worked though, unless the data i got is all rubbish :-)
19:36.14eMBeei'll flash u-boot now and then get the kernel again, see if it is any different
19:36.28ndnihiltry flashing kernel and rootfs before flashing uboot
19:36.58eMBeeif i do that i can't back up  the old kernel with the new u-boot
19:36.59ndnihilscrewing up uboot would suck, while screwing up kernel and rootfs is not a big deal
19:37.16ndnihilyou can tar everything up on the phone and transfer it
19:37.21ndnihilscp
19:37.29ndnihilor pipe it through netcat
19:37.31ndnihiletc..
19:38.16eMBeehmm
19:38.34slaxxerwhy to backup filesys anywayss    something important?
19:38.54ndnihiltrue, I didn't bother backing up the original image on the phone when I got it
19:39.10slaxxeror just an exercize
19:40.19eMBeeit's more of an exercize. since its not my phone
19:42.01blokkie_when will htere be a new version of OM 2008.12     ?
19:42.06eMBeewhat damage can messing up the u-bootflashing do? i understand that i boot into NOR and flash NAND, NOR shouldremain as is soi should be able to repeat as often as i want...
19:42.18shellevilnone really
19:42.32shellevilyou can't mess it up without the debug board past all hope of recovery.
19:42.58shellevil(well, you can in principle flash u-boot/Qi >1000 times, and break the initial block of flash)
19:43.02shellevilDon't do that.
19:43.09eMBeelol, sure
19:43.43slaxxerunless its a neo 1973
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19:46.05eMBeehere goes nothing...
19:46.06*** join/#openmoko nslu2-log_ (n=nslu2-lo@limax.nslu2-linux.org)
19:46.58eMBeenew u-boot in nand running
19:48.51slaxxer/usr/share/applications
19:49.11eMBeeboth old and new kernel backup are identical, looks ok...
19:49.14slaxxerthis is where all desktop icons are located?
19:49.30slaxxeron shr?
19:49.46eMBeewill skip testing another rootfs backup...
19:50.18slaxxeri have all these settings icons all over my desktop:(
19:50.59slaxxeror maybe they are ust linked
19:51.03slaxxerj
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19:53.25thrasholdAh, damn. Again, I boot up my phone, choose my SD card from the boot menu... and after a minute qtopia has booted from the flash. I take the battery out, boot from my SD card again, fsck finds errors, reboots and I'm in Qtopia again. :D I should take the award for most injuries I've done to my hands while trying to boot my phone :D
19:54.31thrashold(Of course, the phone didn't boot at the end, because the battery ended before the fifth try :D )
19:55.06spydonhej hopp negersnopp
19:55.34PaulFertserblokkie_: never
19:56.34eMBeecan't wait to actually have some software on this thing...
20:03.54blokkie_PaulFertser: how come ?
20:04.58PaulFertserblokkie_: ASU was a dead-end. Qtopia-on-x wasn't the solution.
20:05.00blokkie_PaulFertser:  looking at the mailinglist I've seen that somebody is working on the 2009 version
20:05.28blokkie_PaulFertser:  what can be expected then ? What is the other solution ?
20:05.32PaulFertserblokkie_: it bears no resemblance to om2008, completely different.
20:06.07PaulFertserblokkie_: om2009 will be OE + FSO + Paroli. You can try Paroli even now, either from unstable images Angus builds or install it manually on SHR.
20:07.07blokkie_oh , I'll wait  .. I've just bought the toy . I'll need to get used to it a bit more. But I'm happy people are working on a new om2009 version
20:07.31blokkie_thx PaulFertser
20:07.42PaulFertserblokkie_: you're welcome.
20:07.56eMBeeyay, new image booted
20:08.25blokkie_who is Franky Van Liedekerke   ?
20:08.36blokkie_Coz I live 3 km from Liedekerke :)
20:09.22plhardyand you live in a Van ?
20:09.23*** join/#openmoko azaghal (n=azaghal@212.178.230.58)
20:09.40blokkie_van  == from  in duthc :)
20:09.58Davehahahaha
20:10.13slaxxerdave has more injuries
20:10.17plhardy( yes i know, i can't reain miyself to do stupid jokes )
20:10.27Dave:D
20:10.32Davedwaze
20:10.55blokkie_ls
20:11.15PaulFertserls: not found
20:11.27PaulFertserThat's your nightmare!
20:11.39Dave:D
20:11.42Daveomfg
20:11.44Daverootkit?
20:12.07slaxxerfdisk
20:12.13*** join/#openmoko blokkie (n=blokkie@unaffiliated/blokkie)
20:12.15blokkievoila
20:12.25blokkieat least now I'm regged
20:12.33Daveo.O
20:12.38eMBeehmm, that is not nice, the new image seems to not be able to recover from sleep mode
20:13.03PaulFertsereMBee: what image are you trying?
20:13.11slaxxerdave u have shr?
20:13.21eMBeehttp://downloads.openmoko.org/distro/releases/Om2008.12/
20:14.32PaulFertsereMBee: bee-eep. Wrong.
20:14.45eMBeehuh?
20:14.52slaxxer/usr/share/applications shows some icons ,,yet the extra settings icons dont show there
20:14.58DaveWhat you want?
20:15.14slaxxerare they linked or something/
20:15.41slaxxeri want to remove all these extra settings icons from desktop
20:15.53slaxxer8-9 of them
20:16.08eMBeePaulFertser: what's wrong?
20:16.13PaulFertsereMBee: om2008.x is dead
20:16.18PaulFertsereMBee: using it is wrong :)
20:16.31slaxxeruse shr
20:16.36eMBeewell, it isstill listed as the latest official image on the wiki
20:16.40slaxxerdebian
20:16.47TAsneMBee, even the wiki can't keep up
20:16.59TAsnwith the speed om switches official images ;]
20:17.08eMBeeheh
20:17.11slaxxeri like om 2008.12 also
20:17.14PaulFertsereMBee: it's still latest "stable" "official" image, true. But it never made sense.
20:17.20blokkieyou all use QI   instead of u-boot ?
20:17.25slaxxerno
20:17.32TAsnblokkie, I do.
20:17.40slaxxerunless u dont want it to wake up
20:17.58blokkieTAsn:  what is your biggest reason to use it instead of u-boot ?
20:18.19slaxxerhad qi unsuspending for a very shortr time
20:18.20TAsnblokkie, easy to configure
20:18.29*** join/#openmoko Big-Pat (n=Big-Pat@c-24-118-242-237.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
20:18.38TAsnand just tested it and was glad.
20:18.54TAsnfurthermore the moko boots fast with it.
20:18.57TAsnnight.
20:19.04blokkie*night*
20:19.22slaxxermay depend on your device
20:19.23bruce_cgot to keep users guessing, eh?
20:20.10slaxxeri know thats been the case for as long an i been around here
20:22.04slaxxerall i know is that something is said  then not very long afterwards it changes   ,, kinda like the weather here  
20:23.10eMBeePaulFertser:sowhich image do you recommend?
20:23.12PaulFertserDon't like the weather? Well, have a patience, wait for 15 minutes!
20:23.30bruce_ceMBee: SHR seems to be what people are using around here
20:23.34PaulFertsereMBee: either the latest unstable OM2009 image (Paroli) or SHR.
20:23.37slaxxeru guys need a set of judges       since   u dont want to have a dictator  like Pat V.
20:23.40PaulFertsereMBee: or Debian.
20:24.17thrasholdHm, I think I got why my phone behaves like this. The charging is "fast_cccv" in Qtopia, and "pre" in Debian :/
20:24.51slaxxermaybe the kustomizer script if u wanna test since u have 2008.12 on currently
20:24.53bruce_ceMBee: SHR seems to be best for using it as a phone: I found even things like shutting down didn't work on Debian
20:25.18bruce_cit kept popping up a grid of buttons and then clicking on them didn't do anything
20:25.24PaulFertserbruce_c: hm, works for me. Worked all the time (except when i was using some old kernel).
20:25.41PaulFertserbruce_c: i mean shutting down via "shutdown -h now"
20:25.55Defiant-bruce_c: shutdown works fine
20:26.00bruce_cPaulFertser: shutting down via commandline worked. But who wants to launch a terminal just to shut down?
20:26.04slaxxer<PROTECTED>
20:26.18Defiant-bruce_c: shutdown via o-p-p also works fine
20:26.41bruce_con SHR I just click the close button on Illume and it gives me the option of powering off. Nice and simple
20:26.46eMBeehow unstable is paroli?
20:26.48bruce_cDefiant-: o-p-p?
20:26.55Defiant-bruce_c: openmoko-panel-plugin
20:26.59bruce_cah
20:27.04PaulFertsereMBee: can't say for sure. Not as mature as SHR certainly.
20:27.17PaulFertsereMBee: both are using FSO as middleware btw.
20:27.23kinneheMBee: shr will include paroli when it's ready
20:27.49eMBeeok, so  shr seems to be the preffered option then
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20:28.01slaxxeryup
20:28.13TAsnkinneh, who said that?
20:28.25*** join/#openmoko dagger__ (n=dagger@piasek.co.uk)
20:28.42PaulFertserTAsn: why not include Paroli?
20:28.50kinnehTAsn: I've read that on the shr somewhere, but dont shoot me I could be wrong
20:28.54slaxxer03252008 works great an doesnt have all these damn settings icons all over the place
20:29.01TAsnPaulFertser, python is slow on the moko
20:29.03eMBeeom2008.12 seems to hang when sleeping while connected to usb
20:29.36*** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@logan.freelock.com)
20:29.44*** join/#openmoko DorX (n=freak@p5B3B1AD3.dip.t-dialin.net)
20:29.46TAsnand I honestly, I don't see Ainulindale giving up on libframeworkphonegui anytime soon ;]
20:30.16slaxxer04092009 shr unstable works ok though
20:30.19PaulFertserTAsn: paroli starts only once. And SHR have python installed anyway. I'm not talking about giving up anything. I'm about giving a choice.
20:30.40TAsnPaulFertser, oh, a choice.
20:30.43blokkieis fdom still active ?
20:30.46TAsnI'm talking about default.
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20:31.37TAsnwell, everything using the framework is actually fine with me. now for real, night... ;]
20:33.14*** join/#openmoko badcloud (i=5914ef8f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-98d3fec9c242b5cd)
20:33.44slaxxerwhen they do come out with the "next" os    im ready
20:34.06slaxxer09092009
20:34.50slaxxerrandom non liscence plate #
20:35.09blokkie*night* TAsn  :)
20:36.21bruce_cshouldn't that be 20090909 ?
20:36.21lstorHello, I'm having problems ssh-ing into my FR running Om 2008.12. I can ping it using 'ping -I usb0 192.168.0.202', but 'ssh root@192.168.0.202' (as described on wiki/USB_Networking) tells me "No route to host". I can't seem to find any help on the mailing list, and ssh's man page doesn't help me out either. Anyone have any ideas?
20:36.23Dave;D
20:36.50PaulFertserlstor: pastebin "route -n" output.
20:37.04PaulFertserlstor: and "ifconfig usb0"
20:37.20slaxxerreboot atleast 1 time?
20:37.42PaulFertserslaxxer: "No route to host"
20:37.46blokkiePaulFertser:  who is working on paroli ?
20:37.54PaulFertserblokkie: mirko-paroli :)
20:38.03blokkieonly one person ?
20:38.37blokkieit looks like heavy usage of EFL , is rasterman helping ?
20:38.42PaulFertserblokkie: only one still sponsored by OM, not long ago i guess Charlie helped him. And he hopes community will help him.
20:38.52lstorPaulFertser: http://rafb.net/p/7ZX5Rq54.html
20:39.02PaulFertserblokkie: raster helps everybody when he has time
20:39.12blokkieyeah
20:39.56PaulFertserlstor: conflicting network addresses. Both eth0 and usb0 are 192.168.0.0/24
20:40.34PaulFertserlstor: route del -net 192.168.0.0 eth0 (or smth like that) should do the trick.
20:41.15PaulFertserlstor: sudo of course.
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20:44.37blokkiePaulFertser: besides Paroli , you said it would run on  EO + ???  
20:44.57blokkieis just reading the paroli docs and hello world stuff
20:45.12lstorPaulFertser: Hmm, I get 'SIOCDELRT: Invalid argument', even though the man page seems to confirm the syntax. From playing around with it a bit, it seems that the '-net' part is the offender
20:45.49lstor-v doesn't give any additional information
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20:48.18PaulFertserblokkie: OpenEmbedded, a bit gentoo-like system to build distributions.
20:48.58blokkieand what was the third ?
20:49.26lstorPaulFertser: Never mind, got it
20:49.30lstorPaulFertser: Just had to supply netmask too
20:50.00PaulFertserblokkie: FSO, freesmarphone.org
20:50.07lstorPaulFertser: So, thanks :)
20:50.12PaulFertserlstor: got it working?
20:50.34lstorPaulFertser: Yup :)
20:51.12PaulFertserlstor: i wonder why you have that extra route in the first place.
20:51.12badcloudwhich kernel would you guys recommend for 2008.12? hopefully stable and with working wifi
20:52.13lstorPaulFertser: Probably left there after trying to get it all working. It took a while before I figured that I had to reboot the FR
20:52.57PaulFertserlstor: you could probably execute some relevant ifconfig command on FR itself without rebooting.
20:54.39bruce_cit seems the build system is very linux-centric. Should I just give up and run it on linux, or is there an interest in getting in working on non-linux systems?
20:54.50blokkiebadcloud:  you don't have usb-network disconnection in 2008.12 when it go's into sleep mode ?
20:55.09badcloudI do
20:55.13PaulFertserbruce_c: ask mickey|bbq , i guess he'll be interested.
20:55.20badcloudincidently, wiki.openmoko.org is down
20:55.24blokkiebadcloud:  me too ,  I have now  SHR
20:55.39badcloudI find SHR to be soooooooooooooo slow
20:56.23blokkieyou use u-boot or QI ?
20:56.42badcloudqi, always
20:57.07blokkieI use u-boot
20:57.41badcloudanyone know any om 2008.12 image mirrors?
20:57.43blokkieslaxxer said the suspend does not work ,  can you confirm this ?
20:57.51badcloudwhy, blokkie?
20:57.57blokkiedunno
20:58.07blokkieslaxxer: I can but the images online if you want ?
20:58.13*** join/#openmoko reinouts (n=reinout@s559355fe.adsl.wanadoo.nl)
20:58.22blokkieerr badcloud  :)
20:58.47badcloudI'm trying to download the 2008.12 jffs release file
20:59.22slaxxerbytestore has a good image
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21:01.13slaxxerhttp://openmoko.spb.ru/download/file.php?id=13
21:01.23slaxxerwell
21:01.40slaxxerhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:Bytestore
21:02.00badcloudneither are responding
21:02.08slaxxerbuild 2008.12 11012009
21:02.27slaxxersecond 1 does
21:03.52badcloudneither for me...
21:05.36slaxxeralrightythen
21:06.23badcloudthanks though
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21:12.21badcloudk, got it
21:12.23badcloudthanks
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21:19.54Dave:]
21:21.52*** join/#openmoko DrRabbit_ (n=xchat@ip68-99-219-29.ph.ph.cox.net)
21:23.44slaxxerdave how do i remove unwantes settings icons from shr desktop?
21:24.00kinnehjow
21:24.35kinnehisn't this correct to accomplish kernel on nand and rootfs on mmc part2 ?
21:24.37kinnehsetenv menu_9 Boot from nand rootfs on sd: setenv bootargs \${bootargs_base} rootfstype=ext2 root=/dev/mmcblk0p2 rootdelay=5 \${mtdparts}\; nand read.e 0x32000000 kernel; bootm 0x32000000
21:28.48Dave:o
21:32.31PaulFertserkinneh: You can do that, why not.
21:33.51PaulFertserkinneh: don't forget about the trick to boot kernels >2M if you need it.
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21:57.17blokkiehow is android on the neo ?
21:58.03lindi-blokkie: doesn't know how to cope with bugs of calypso afaik
21:58.38blokkiewhat is calypso ?
21:58.46kinnehthe problem was the ; after kernel wasn't escaped
21:59.01lindi-blokkie: the gsm chip
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22:00.29blokkieso it would be "bold" to just even try androind on neo  I guess
22:00.42lindi-blokkie: bold in what way?
22:00.47blokkies/androind/android/
22:03.31*** part/#openmoko rozzin (n=rozzin@209-20-69-211.slicehost.net)
22:04.04blokkieanyone see advantages in having a archlinux + paroli  available ?
22:04.23blokkie*distro*
22:04.43mwesteris of the opinion that one of theproblem with the Om devices is _too many_ distros.
22:05.18blokkietakes note of this statement :)
22:05.20lindi-is of the opinion that upstream should produce software and distros should package it :)
22:07.26blokkiebut if all of linux software "can" run on neo .. what does upstream still have to do ?
22:07.47lindi-blokkie: upstream just has to make their software easy to package
22:08.00shellevilA coherent user interface
22:08.06shellevilusable by fingers
22:08.22blokkies/fingers/finger/
22:08.24lindi-blokkie: we need to cope with the bugs of the gsm chip if we want reliable calls :)
22:08.41shellevilWhile you can run xfig on the phone, it probably won't really work well.
22:08.57mwesterAnd deal with the fluid, constantly-changing kernel API to manage the various bits of hardware.
22:09.05blokkielindi-:  you mean with upstream == kernel dev ?
22:09.13lindi-blokkie: for example
22:09.50blokkiewho\how many   kernel developers are working on the neo ?
22:09.53mwester"Ah, it's 2.6.29-rc3 -- so use this sysfs node, unless the kernel is git id 98683098657893478967983478, then use this other sysfs node, and if its 2985798235789237985982958237 then no node work, so instead......."
22:10.20blokkieyuck :S
22:10.21lindi-mwester: i have a script to detect this on bootup ;)
22:10.29lindi-mwester: and cache the results
22:10.30mwesterlindi-:  I have a better solution.
22:10.42lindi-mwester: yeah?
22:10.59mwesterlindi-:  Now that Om no longer has any developers, we can take charge of the kernel, and do it correctly.
22:11.12mwesterA) make it work.
22:11.17mwesterB) test that it works.
22:11.22mwesterC) let the distros use it.
22:11.50mwesterD) consider changing the API if all distros require it, and if upstream requires it, and if one really wishes to bother pushing stuff upstream.
22:12.19lindi-mwester: how about offering a userland tool that'll hide changing kernel api?
22:12.25mwesterThat's they way it should have been done to start with, but instead Andy went off all half-cocked on a raging ride to chase the upstream kernel.
22:12.41lindi-mwester: sysfs paths are pretty long to type to terminal anyway
22:12.41mwesterlindi-:  Why?
22:12.57mwesterlindi-:  that's wallpapering over a problem, what' the point?
22:13.15lindi-mwester: ok but it'd be useful for other purposes too
22:13.21mwesterlindi-:  And the sysfs stuff is one example.
22:13.23lindi-mwester: now everyone is writing their own scripts
22:13.27mwesterPlease don't assume that it's limited to sysfs.
22:13.59mwesterWe've had joy and fun with rfkill as well, and we've played the fun game of "what shall we make a module today?"
22:14.08blokkieso no kernel developers anymore to hunt down / fix  HW chip problems in the linux kernel for our precious neo ?
22:14.34mwesterWe've enjoyed Andy leading on a trip down dumper lane to all do "Qi" for no reason at all, now it turns out...
22:15.35mwesterIn short, Om has wasted the majority of their developers time, and screwed the community, just because somebody thought pushing code upstream was the measure of success. And now we see that instead, the measure of success would have been a phone that worked!  Surprise!  :D
22:16.36mwesterblokkie:  There is one Om employee who works on the kernel. His stated goal is to push code upstream.  We need to convince him that he should work to make the kernel function correctly as a priority, but I rather doubt that he will be convinced.  
22:18.24blokkieis it that hard to make / fix a kernel  when one has all the info about the hardware ?
22:19.02lindi-blokkie: we don't have all info actually. some is NDA'd. also it takes a lot of experience to do it
22:19.09mwesterIt is when you spend all your time merging your partially-completed work with the latest alpha and beta test kernel code.
22:19.17blokkieI would think it should be dificult to make something for a black-box. But this is not the caseere
22:19.32blokkielindi-:  I understand that completely
22:19.38mwesterIf Om had just stuck with the 2.6.26 kernel, it would have been done a long time ago.
22:21.39mwesterSigh - we _almost_ had everything working on 2.6.24 -- some glamo suspend/resume problems, and the wifi chip was a problem.... but Andy refused to work on the final glamo issues, instead claiming that 2.6.28 would have better support for it -- and in the end, he never did fix it, it was someone from the community who found the problem -- and discovered that it had nothgin to do with 26/28 at all.  That was just all just a smoke-screen beca
22:21.39mwesteruse Andy had orders to work on GTA03 code in 2.6.28 kernels.
22:21.56blokkieI've worked 2 years for a company that build Satelite modems based on RedHat . The stuff was still running 2.2.19  when 2.4.19 was allready out. But they stayed with it and developed on it further. Not moving to the newer one. But that limited them implementing new stuff. So ..   mwester you've got a very good point  I think  (NOTE: they went bankrupt - )
22:23.07blokkieGTA03 == new NEO ?
22:23.13mwesterYes, there's a risk if you fall too far behind.  But there's a huge difference between falling behind a few dot-dot versions, versus falling behind a couple of major versions.
22:23.15blokkienew chip .. ?
22:23.38mwestergta03 WAS the new hardware; it got cancelled.
22:23.55mwesterSo all the kernel-chasing, and the work on Qi turned out to be for nothing.
22:24.38*** join/#openmoko arfmarf (n=arfmarf@c-d2b4e355.016-70-6f72653.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)
22:25.50lindi-mwester: but wasn't the wifi stack rewrite something that we needed anyway?
22:26.36mwesterdebatable.
22:26.54mwesterIt worked, poorly, on 2.6.26.
22:26.59mwesterBut it did work.
22:27.11lindi-mwester: at least bug fixing a different sdio stack than mainline does not sound very useful
22:27.38mwesterAnd given the choice of where we are right now (everything works, but works poorly) vs the alternative of everything except wifi working very well, I think I would rather have everything but wifi.
22:27.51mwesterlindi-:  Wrong thinking!
22:28.06mwesterlindi-:  bug fixing the old sdio stack would have been useful to the community.
22:28.35lindi-mwester: but more people would have been bug fixing the new sdio stack since it has more users?
22:28.36mwesterIs the goal to put a driver for an obsolete product upstream, or is the goal to make the product work, while it is still a viable saleable product?
22:28.53mwesterlindi-:  I don't think any bugfixes to the sdio stack were done by anyone but Om.
22:29.29lindi-now those bug fixes at least can help somebody :-)
22:29.32mwesterAFAIK, the interface for the wlan chip is unique.
22:30.03mwesterI don't think they'll help anyone except those who have an AR6000 on a glamo.  Know anyone doing that?
22:30.20bruce_cisn't the problem that the kernel is changing too quickly for external code to keep up, whether closed or open?
22:30.33mwesterbruce_c is exactly correct.
22:31.11mwesterThe only viable strategy is to either use hardware that is already in mainline, or to get the hardware working in whatever is the current release and catch up later.
22:32.09mwesterYou cannot split development efforts for such a small company into bug-fixing, hardware bug chasing, and tracking -rc version of upstream kernels.  There was no way Andy could be successful -- it is a credit to his skill that he did as well as he did.
22:32.42mwester(even though I didnt' get along with Andy, there's no doubt about his skill; the issue is really Om's management)
22:33.56*** join/#openmoko wurp2 (n=wurp@65.111.180.216)
22:34.12wurp2Hello
22:34.23wurp2Anyone running a recent-ish build on gta01?
22:34.41mwesterA ghost from the past!
22:34.58wurp2:-)
22:35.04wurp2Hey mwester!
22:35.13wurp2I just updated my 01 for the first time in ages
22:35.18shellevilvaguely remembers wurp2
22:35.22mwesterAnd I bet didn't work.
22:35.23wurp2(updated it at the request of Julian)
22:35.35wurp2mwester: right :-(
22:35.50wurp2I can revert, but I would much prefer to find a recent version that does work
22:35.56wurp2shellevil: Hi :-)
22:36.07wurp2mwester: How have you been?
22:36.11mwesterYeah, nobody has worked on the gta01 recently.  SHR is looking good, but Ainulindale took a break, and I got busy, and that's about all there is left of the gta01 developers
22:36.19wurp2yeah
22:36.43wurp2OK, I will back off to an earlier version
22:36.52mwesterI still have the debug board on mine, and have been meaning to find out what's left in terms of the bugs in the latest kernel...
22:37.04mwesterbut it seems pointless when the old kernel works so well on it.:)
22:37.17wurp2ah, do you happen to know what kernel you're using?
22:37.30wurp2And if it should be expected to work with the latest rootfs from SHR?
22:37.53mwester(which goes back to the original discussion lindi- and I were having, about kernel APIs changing -- which is why people are wanting to upgrade the gta01 kernel, I suspect)
22:38.05shellevilwurp2: Not so great - mum died, and all the emotional and paperwork shit following on from that. But...
22:38.05wurp2With the Apr 1 build of 2.6.28, I hang at "Starting kernel..."
22:38.19wurp2shellevil: Oh fuck.  I'm very very sorry to hear that
22:38.23shellevilneeds to put something moderately recent on my GTA01.
22:38.25mwesterI'm not using any kernel on the gta01 right now; it's been powered off for months.
22:38.32wurp2mwester: O
22:38.34wurp2damn
22:38.35shellevilATM I've got a scaredycat image  on it.
22:38.39shellevilwurp2: thanks
22:39.03wurp2shellevil: Yeah, I used scaredycat exclusively before SHR
22:39.19mwesterI'll take a look at the kernel this week, I'm sort of being forced to get back to it anyway)
22:39.27wurp2shellevil: Do you know what kernel?  If it's at all recent, that is.
22:39.37shellevilVery not.
22:39.41shellevilmost of a year old
22:39.46wurp2mwester: OK, I'll back off a revision & see how that looks
22:40.05wurp2shellevil: Ah, OK, I have a working set for a scaredycat build that old
22:40.11wurp2but that's not my first choice :-)
22:40.38wurp2mwester: I know it's a stupid question, but do you know offhand what's the last message the kernel starting kicks out?
22:40.40mwesteranyway, back in a bit... good to see you back.
22:40.50wurp2So I can know when I'm past kernel issues and into rootfs
22:40.58wurp2mwester: Thanks - I'm not sure how 'back' I am
22:41.08wurp2but I'm at least upgrading to the new image ;-)
22:41.11shellevilAt the moment, my neo SIM is in one of these: http://www.emporialife.co.uk/ - I needed a phone that 'jyust worked'
22:41.23mwester(don't know the last message, but you should be able to see the first message from init: would be something involving "init" and then it should launch "udev"
22:41.25wurp2shellevil: I understand that
22:41.25mwester)
22:41.40wurp2mwester: thanks again!
22:42.55shellevilI'd really like that to be my neo - even with poor battery life - with web-browser and call functionality at minimum - but...
22:43.40shellevilI've been spending the last weeks largely clearing up the garden. Today I chipped about 150Kg of branches - and that's 1/10th of it.
22:44.42wurp2shellevil: That's funny - we've been doing the same thing lately
22:44.53shellevilAnd my workroom looks like http://www.mauve.plus.com/bedroom-wall.jpg
22:44.55wurp2Cleaning out the side yard in preparation for selling our house
22:45.09shellevilnot selling in the forseeable future
22:45.29wurp2shellevil: :-(
22:45.38wurp2re: you're workroom, not re: selling
22:45.42shellevilis reinsulating the house.
22:46.00shellevilIt's currently 50cm stone walls, 5cm air-gap, plasterboard.
22:46.14wurp2You can probably improve on that ;-)
22:46.18shellevilyeah.
22:46.32*** join/#openmoko emmentaler (n=emmental@10-59-239-77-pool.cable.fcom.ch)
22:46.32shellevil8cm or so of good fibreglass. And maybe 15 under the floor
22:46.57shellevilBut it's a big job - though it pays back fast - given the stupid energy prices
22:47.08*** join/#openmoko d-b (n=alias@124-171-8-198.dyn.iinet.net.au)
22:47.31wurp2shellevil: Your garden is fantastic!
22:47.44blokkiemwester: how come an employee can chose what he wants to work on ?
22:48.03wurp2blokkie: I think he's out for a big
22:48.08shellevilwurp2: Trying to keep it that way is going to be fun - not knowing much about plants.
22:48.24blokkieI'm good at php , though I'm paid to be a websphere admin. My paying customer (boss) does not let me code on php
22:48.33wurp2s/big/bit/
22:48.49DaveWURP!
22:48.54blokkiewurp2:  thx ,   I have screen on, so I'll read his comment when he's back
22:48.54wurp2DAVE!
22:49.16shellevilRandom hardware of the day
22:49.33wurp2My wife is asking me to go fix the toilet...
22:49.47wurp2I'll probably have to go after I test this new kernel image
22:50.14Dave:P
22:50.17shellevilhttp://bifferos.bizhat.com/
22:50.21Daveaw
22:51.05wurp2shellevil: Yeah, I think microcomps are coming of age
22:51.08CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r0d158bbad410 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/device.py:
22:51.08CIA-41freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: Send out o.f.GSM.Network.Status after resume
22:51.08CIA-41freesmartphone.org: When we resume we now immediately query the network status and send a
22:51.08CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signal. This fixes FSO #248.
22:51.13wurp2There seem to be a lot of nice options out there now
22:51.54wurp2So, everyone bought my iphone app, right?
22:52.19shellevilBuy me an iphone, I'll buy your app.
22:52.42DaveDid I hear something about gardening? :)
22:52.49Davewurp2, fuck that :P
22:53.20wurp2shellevil: That doesn't sound like a good trade
22:53.42wurp2Well, the new kernel boots, but now it looks as if I have a bootarg issue
22:53.50wurp2bbiab
22:55.54*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.153.211.239)
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23:16.05RuyukHi there! I am wondering if you quit Runescape and still have your account? If so, please PM me. I am in desperate need of one! Thanks.
23:16.07RuyukHi there! I am wondering if you quit Runescape and still have your account? If so, please PM me. I am in desperate need of one! Thanks.
23:16.11*** part/#openmoko Ruyuk (n=doomuser@h16.4.40.69.dynamic.ip.windstream.net)
23:16.24Davehahaha
23:19.35Chockylaughs also
23:21.15CVirusLOL
23:21.28CVirusI guess I do have an account .. LOL
23:21.40ChockyI LOL. LOL.
23:21.59CVirusthe retard left the server
23:23.23Dave:p
23:23.28Dave"left" ... yeah
23:23.38Daveshines his boot
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23:26.25Chockyis that the one we see when your FR starts up?
23:26.34mwesterHi there! I am wondering if you have a million dollars that you don't need?  If so, please PM me, I am in desperate need of it.  Thanks.
23:26.40mwesterwonders if this really works.
23:26.49mwesterwaits for his money. :)
23:26.49Chockymwester: this is not Craigslist, ktb
23:27.00mwesterhehe!
23:27.25wurp2|goneDoes anyone have the output of printenv from a gta01 handy :-/
23:27.25mwesterHey, did raster ever 'fess up as to who thought the silly boots were a good splash screen?
23:27.47wurp2|gonemwester: I thought that was his idea
23:28.05Chockyit's stoopit.
23:28.05mwesterThat might explain why he's never admitted to it... :)
23:29.02wurp2|gone:-)
23:29.09Davewonders if mwester is a banking specialist from nigeria
23:29.10mwesterSo... where would be a good place to look for low-cost solar cells/panels for a project?
23:29.52wurp2|goneWhat's the minimum watts/m^2?
23:30.00*** join/#openmoko batti112 (n=batti@blfd-4db1dddf.pool.einsundeins.de)
23:30.15wurp2|gone(assuming direct sunlight, of course)
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23:30.50mwesterAt a minimum a Freerunner and an n800, but I'd really like to have enough to keep a small laptop running for at least 8 hours out of day.  I estimate 40W would be ideal.
23:31.04wurp2|goneI mean, corroded copper is a solar cell if you can tolerate extremely low wattage :-)
23:31.12mwesterarea is of less concern, as it's not really all that portable.
23:31.30wurp2|goneIsn't 40W at least 200 m^2?
23:31.46mwesterYes, but copper is rather expensive.  We have people that are tearing the copper plumbing out of houses as they are being built.
23:32.07mwester200 m^2 for 40W ? Wow, that's rather inefficient
23:32.22wurp2|gonemwester: Yeah, I just wasn't sure if you wanted to play with it or use it for real power
23:32.36b0efis it a common problem with tangogps not downloading tiles, often, keeping them white until you pan or zoom some more?
23:32.38mwestercalculates the square footage available on his roof.
23:32.42wurp2|goneI thought 1 w / m^2 was the typical estimate for the power of bright sunlight
23:32.58wurp2|goneand 20% the max expected efficiency of reasonable costing solar cells
23:33.00mwestergoes off to google, this project may not be so practical.
23:34.05wurp2b0ef: yeah, I always have to refresh
23:34.14wurp2of course, I'm 6 months out of date
23:34.19mwesterwikipedia claims a 12% efficient cell can do 1.2 W per 0.01 m^2
23:34.22wurp2it might be that it's supposed to work now
23:34.34wurp2holy shit
23:34.46wurp2I was WAY off in my recollection of W/m^2
23:35.08mwesterThank goodness!
23:35.10mwester:)
23:35.30b0efwurp2: there's a refresh button?
23:35.46wurp2100W per m^2
23:35.46mwesterSo, a 1 m^2 cell should be 100W in full sunlight - that's more than enough, and will easily fit inside the vehicle.
23:35.52wurp2b0ef: Nah, I drag it a tiny bit :-)
23:35.53max_posedonwurp2, wrong!
23:36.15max_posedon100W per 0.1m^2
23:36.37wurp2max_posedon: Yeah, for full power
23:37.40max_posedonit is not about full/not full, its about calculation 1m^2 = 10'000 * (0.01m^2)
23:37.58max_posedon)
23:38.18mwesterhttp://www.siliconsolar.com/global-solar-flexible-panels-62w-p-16362.html  <---- that'll keep me and my neo happy!   (if I could afford it!!!)
23:39.38wurp2max_posedon: It is about full/not full when you're considering power you can extract vs. power that's there
23:40.17wurp20.01m^2 almost never means (0.01m)^2
23:40.50wurp2and oddly, you gave the right answer, then the wrong explanation...
23:41.48max_posedonoh, see now...
23:42.39wurp2No wonder I keep seeing those "solar powered bags", etc. that are totally useless.  They're not useless, I just somehow memorized a figure that was off by 1000 for solar power :-O
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23:48.08Sharwin_FI can't open gif files with neon.. :O
23:50.11max_posedonWe hope this is your biggest problem...
23:50.27wurp2Woohoo, it boots!
23:54.27Sharwin_Fnot the biggest, but another one to the list of problems :P
23:54.41wurp2crap, calls don't work :-(
23:56.29mwesterSigh.  Lots of really cool solar technologies out there, especially the flexible film... but waaaaaaaaay too pricey.
23:56.49mwesterI guess I'll have to haul along a lot of AA cells.
23:57.37wurp2mwester: Did you look on ebay?
23:57.44wurp2I've heard of people getting great deals
23:57.51DaveEBAY?
23:57.51wurp2and remember that it's tax deductible
23:58.08wurp2Dave: It's a website where people buy/sell stuff
23:58.19mwesterI will, but I'm concerned about rip-offs; I can spot them with things I am familiar with, but I'm not so confident about solar stuff.
23:58.19wurp2;-)
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23:58.42wurp2mwester: Yeah, I certainly understand that
23:59.02Daveit's the last resting place of most peoples' freerunners
23:59.03Dave:P
23:59.15mwesterhehe!
23:59.24Daveso what's your big thing into solar, wester?

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