| 00:00.09 | Kensan | good night everyone |
| 00:00.09 | john | Just cause I bought several QT programming books. |
| 00:00.10 | techiem2-r | night |
| 00:00.15 | john | nite |
| 00:00.16 | Dave | nice :p |
| 00:00.24 | Dave | Wonka - kinky |
| 00:03.24 | john | I've got FSO-20080911 on SD, but can't even add contacts in it }-: So I stick with 2007.2 till something better comes along. |
| 00:03.35 | Wonka | Dave: i liked that design... |
| 00:04.28 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-59-47.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 00:04.36 | Wonka | Dave: especially the idea of the power button and aux button menus |
| 00:04.53 | Wonka | Dave: i'm just missing "lock now"... |
| 00:05.03 | Wonka | Dave: and "dim, but stay unlocked" |
| 00:06.55 | *** join/#openmoko alvarezp (n=alvarezp@201.139.193.235) |
| 00:07.48 | *** join/#openmoko Isajha (n=Isajha4@wrzb-4d00cb65.pool.mediaWays.net) |
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| 00:22.34 | Dave | Wonka, yeah, awesome |
| 00:22.40 | Dave | that's a good reason to go for it, certainly :) |
| 00:23.11 | phobie | Is the microsd-card hotplugable? |
| 00:23.54 | BobOfDoom | phobie: yes, if you can figure out a way to hotplug it without losing power :p |
| 00:24.13 | Dave | haha, I have |
| 00:24.16 | phobie | BobOfDoom: yes with usb-cable... |
| 00:24.16 | Dave | and it doesn't work |
| 00:24.37 | Dave | also if the SIM loses contact, it fucks up the GSM modem |
| 00:25.05 | BobOfDoom | ah really? |
| 00:25.06 | BobOfDoom | hmm |
| 00:25.15 | phobie | since gsm, does not work I moved my sim to the old phone |
| 00:25.17 | BobOfDoom | kernel SD card driver must be a trigger to rescan it then |
| 00:25.32 | BobOfDoom | need* |
| 00:25.34 | phobie | what is the name of the sd driver? |
| 00:26.34 | BobOfDoom | s3cmci |
| 00:26.44 | BobOfDoom | yeah, if you build it as a module I guess you could rmmod and insmod it again |
| 00:26.46 | BobOfDoom | that might work |
| 00:27.15 | phobie | root@om-gta02:/# modprobe s3cmci |
| 00:27.17 | phobie | FATAL: Module s3cmci not found |
| 00:27.53 | BobOfDoom | yeah, it's probably builtin, you'd have to compile it as a module |
| 00:28.13 | BobOfDoom | have a poke around in /sys too |
| 00:28.24 | BobOfDoom | there might be some way to power on and off the SD |
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| 00:31.15 | Dave | Bob, after swapping SDs with power ON, I wasn't even able to remount it. |
| 00:31.17 | phobie | the sd was not in during boot, and the module is missing |
| 00:41.26 | Dave | phobie - yep! |
| 00:42.41 | *** join/#openmoko jadams__ (n=jadams@rrcs-67-78-235-192.se.biz.rr.com) |
| 00:46.11 | hipitihop | waves late good morning to the inmates |
| 00:46.26 | techiem2-r | frantically tries to scale the wall |
| 00:48.02 | Dave | Hippityhop! :D |
| 00:48.07 | Dave | haha, techie :p |
| 00:53.28 | phobie | How can it be that the FR sees 12 satelites but get no fix? |
| 00:53.45 | techiem2-r | it doesn't like them? |
| 00:54.01 | Dave | huhu |
| 00:54.56 | phobie | #openmoko-smalltalk ? |
| 00:55.16 | thseiler_ | phobie: it needs a higher signal level to properly decode the messages than to detect that there is a signal |
| 00:55.26 | Dave | #openmoko-offtopic |
| 00:55.45 | Dave | thseiler, of course :) |
| 00:56.07 | hipitihop | phobie, only if we get the Squeak VM running on the FR |
| 00:56.09 | Wonka | i am so happy the GTA03 will have u-blox 5 GPS... |
| 00:56.29 | Wonka | and also EDGE |
| 00:56.30 | phobie | On [[GPS_Problems]] someone wrote that the fix-data can be saved before shutdown and than reloaded after reboot. |
| 00:56.37 | *** join/#openmoko ChandleWEi (n=chandle@210.13.121.62) |
| 00:56.42 | phobie | Anyone knows something about that? |
| 00:57.09 | Wonka | phobie: frameworkd's ogpsd has support for saving and restoring assist data, yes |
| 00:57.22 | Wonka | phobie: but almanach data is only valid for about 4 hours |
| 00:57.50 | phobie | not bad |
| 00:57.59 | hipitihop | rwhitby, you about ? |
| 00:58.12 | Wonka | and afaik "assist offline" is not supported by the antaris 4... |
| 00:58.36 | Wonka | at least, i always got negative replies on my commands to tell me what almanach package it wanted... |
| 00:58.53 | Wonka | "don't know what you want from me"-type replies |
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| 01:00.39 | phobie | how is fso-gpsd (which runs here) related to ogpsd |
| 01:00.42 | phobie | ? |
| 01:01.21 | Wonka | ogpsd provides a gypsy interface |
| 01:01.26 | Wonka | which is via dbus |
| 01:01.45 | Wonka | fso-gpsd is a gypsy client and gpsd-style server |
| 01:02.27 | Wonka | when a gpsd client connects to fso-gpsd, it itself connects to the gypsy interface and converts the data it receives there to the gpsd protocol |
| 01:03.49 | phobie | ok, in my scripts I read from the fso-gpsd via tcp, so it would be better to access the access the gypsy interface directly. |
| 01:04.07 | phobie | is that documented somewhere? |
| 01:05.09 | phobie | -1x"access the" |
| 01:05.23 | phobie | oh it's too late |
| 01:05.26 | Wonka | around http://folks.o-hand.com/iain/gypsy/ |
| 01:05.56 | sicu | why is it too late ? |
| 01:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko jeffszusz (n=jeffsz@d57-97-215.home.cgocable.net) |
| 01:06.23 | sicu_ | anyone got numptyphysics working on fso/shr ? |
| 01:06.25 | phobie | only because the clock says that... |
| 01:06.35 | Sascha | phobie: http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=framework.git;a=blob;f=examples/ogpsd_signals.py |
| 01:07.01 | phobie | sicu_ it is preinstalled on my fso image and it works |
| 01:07.11 | sicu_ | i keep getting dependency issues: http://pastebin.com/d34020ed2 |
| 01:07.20 | sicu_ | running shr |
| 01:07.25 | *** part/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.123.60) |
| 01:08.08 | Dave | :o |
| 01:08.09 | phobie | I think shr is very incomplete, you could also install fso-testing and install some software with opkg |
| 01:08.50 | sicu_ | phobie: k, thx |
| 01:09.31 | Wonka | regarding numptyphysics: is there a way to restart a level? how to exit it cleanly? any way to save and restore states? |
| 01:09.51 | phobie | sicu how about "opkg update;opkg install libsdl-1.2-0 libsdl-image-1.2-0" ? |
| 01:10.06 | phobie | Wonka cursor up |
| 01:10.17 | Dave | hah |
| 01:10.18 | phobie | needs a keyboard... |
| 01:10.23 | Dave | It's pretty terrible, yeah |
| 01:10.31 | Dave | It's playable in 2007 after some hax |
| 01:10.56 | Dave | whee |
| 01:11.02 | Wonka | hm. hm. keyboard should even fit below it... |
| 01:11.03 | phobie | yesterday I build a recent debian package for that game |
| 01:11.07 | Dave | yeah |
| 01:11.11 | sicu | hax are good |
| 01:11.13 | phobie | much fun to play it on my desk |
| 01:11.17 | Dave | Yep :D |
| 01:11.29 | Dave | man, video is so awesome on the freerunner, when it works. |
| 01:11.43 | Dave | I still think that so far, it's best as an image displayer. |
| 01:11.52 | Dave | the screen is tiny, but awesome. |
| 01:12.09 | phobie | better than all deskto-tfts |
| 01:12.23 | phobie | +p |
| 01:12.32 | Wonka | phobie: *want* |
| 01:12.40 | Wonka | phobie: when does it go into debian? |
| 01:12.41 | sicu | phobie: same issue as before (the pastbin i posted) |
| 01:13.04 | phobie | Wonka: it's missing a manpage, beside of that it is lintian clean... |
| 01:13.39 | phobie | I already uploaded to mentors |
| 01:13.39 | phobie | http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=numptyphysics |
| 01:13.48 | Dave | heh |
| 01:13.50 | phobie | but mentors only hosts sources |
| 01:13.54 | Dave | weak sauce |
| 01:14.15 | sicu | guess i'll just play openmoocow instead |
| 01:14.20 | phobie | so I but it on http://debian.zaubberer.net/ and launchpad (for ubuntu users) |
| 01:14.39 | phobie | https://launchpad.net/~phobie/+archive |
| 01:14.44 | Dave | hells yeah! |
| 01:14.46 | Wonka | sicu: lol, that name is awsum |
| 01:14.51 | Dave | bows |
| 01:14.52 | phobie | sicu: did the opkg command work? |
| 01:15.20 | Dave | what the fuck, why did my keys remap themselves. |
| 01:15.45 | Dave | møøs at sicu |
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| 01:19.23 | sicu_ | phobie: yes it did: http://pastebin.no/60857 |
| 01:20.02 | phobie | Wonka: I'm unsure about if I understand this right. gypsy reads the inerface and parses the nmea-code, than fso-gpsd gets the parsed code and generates nmea again? |
| 01:21.00 | Dave | hmm, perhaps when the girl comes in and asks what smells so nice, and notices the candles, I shouldn't follow it up with, "unlike you" :p |
| 01:21.02 | phobie | sicu: you numptyphysics has bad dependencies |
| 01:21.23 | phobie | sicu: or you libsdl package has bad provides |
| 01:21.29 | phobie | take what you want ;) |
| 01:21.44 | Dave | :D |
| 01:21.50 | sicu | phobie: thx, i'll take it all :p |
| 01:21.52 | Dave | I think sicu just sucks at packaging. |
| 01:21.55 | phobie | could be that opkg, unlike dpkg, does not offer "provides" |
| 01:21.58 | Dave | no offense, sicu :D |
| 01:22.19 | cjb_ie | wow. i need to get a life. glanced at my screen and read 'numptyphysics' as 'nymphomaniacs' |
| 01:22.24 | sicu | lol ... i didnt do the packaging |
| 01:22.28 | Dave | hahaha |
| 01:22.31 | Dave | fucking cjb |
| 01:22.38 | sicu | and you're right .. i do ... a lot more would've failes |
| 01:22.43 | sicu | s/s/d |
| 01:22.43 | cjb_ie | nymphomaniacs with bad dependencies! |
| 01:23.00 | Dave | fears |
| 01:24.07 | *** join/#openmoko pb_ (n=pb@88-111-134-150.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 01:24.30 | sicu | +s eyes glaze over as he pictures nymphomaniacs with bad dependencies |
| 01:24.46 | sicu | calls for timeout |
| 01:25.34 | phobie | sicu: perhaps you should write the maintainers of those packages |
| 01:25.35 | phobie | opkg info libsdl-1.2-0 |
| 01:25.49 | Sascha | phobie: ogpsd uses the ubx binary format, not nmea... |
| 01:26.36 | phobie | opkg info numptyphysics |
| 01:26.47 | Dave | Segmentation fault |
| 01:27.03 | cjb_ie | ponders nymphophysics |
| 01:27.19 | phobie | Sascha: but the gps-device sends nmea, doesn't it? |
| 01:27.54 | Sascha | ogpsd switches the device to ubx mode |
| 01:27.55 | phobie | sicu: try a other source for your numptyphysics package, mine has correct dependencies |
| 01:28.22 | sicu_ | phobie: http://pastebin.no/60861 |
| 01:28.37 | sicu_ | ok, will do |
| 01:28.45 | Sascha | one reasen, why you should never read /dev/ttySAC directly ;) |
| 01:28.48 | phobie | Sascha: ah, how to dump the ubx-stream? |
| 01:28.56 | Dave | boggles |
| 01:29.05 | Sascha | enable debugging in frameworkd |
| 01:29.40 | phobie | Sascha: that means there is no intended way |
| 01:30.52 | phobie | sicu: that menas numptyphysics is not available from the repositories in /etc/opkg/ |
| 01:32.12 | Wonka | phobie: gpsd does not spit out NMEA, afaik... |
| 01:32.35 | phobie | ? |
| 01:32.38 | Sascha | phobie: maybe you want to look into subsystems/ogpsd/ubx.py |
| 01:32.39 | phobie | gpspipe |
| 01:33.07 | sicu_ | phobie: well, i used opkg install http://www.opkg.org/packages/numptyphysics_0.2_armv4t.ipk |
| 01:33.24 | phobie | Sascha: I read nmea from fso-gpsd. |
| 01:33.30 | Wonka | phobie: "man gpsd", start reading at "The request protocol for gpsd clients is very simple." |
| 01:33.35 | sicu_ | phobie: whats the uri to your package? |
| 01:33.44 | sicu_ | that came out wrong |
| 01:33.58 | Dave | Who set me up the opkg bomb!? |
| 01:34.04 | sicu_ | :o |
| 01:34.14 | phobie | sicu: http://downloads.freesmartphone.org/fso-unstable/feeds/armv4t/numptyphysics_0.2+svnr45-r0_armv4t.ipk |
| 01:35.28 | Sascha | phobie: ah ok, fso-gpsd doent know anythink about ubx... |
| 01:36.54 | Sascha | its too late... :/ |
| 01:37.00 | phobie | Sascha: I just lookt what tangogps sends and sent the same thing (a "r") |
| 01:38.01 | sicu | phobie: great, that worked ... thx =] |
| 01:38.01 | sicu_ | spank spank opkg.org for having louzy numpty package |
| 01:38.24 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 01:38.26 | Sascha | the gpsd protocol is specified in man 8 gpsd |
| 01:38.47 | phobie | sicu: now write to the maintainer on opkg.org and tell him about that problem! |
| 01:38.52 | Sascha | r Sets or toggles ´raw´ mode. |
| 01:38.56 | Sascha | => nmea |
| 01:39.06 | phobie | Sascha: just read that... |
| 01:39.51 | sicu | phobie: on it =] |
| 01:42.00 | Wonka | O.o |
| 01:42.07 | Dave | heehee |
| 01:42.09 | Wonka | "raw" is... ugly. |
| 01:42.56 | Wonka | should usw "w", i think |
| 01:42.56 | Wonka | use, even |
| 01:42.56 | Wonka | anyway, i'm going to use my bed now. |
| 01:43.14 | techiem2-r | lol |
| 01:45.18 | Dave | don't you mean usw |
| 01:45.43 | phobie | I will stop with alls that nmea and generate GPX from the debus interface |
| 01:46.03 | phobie | -s |
| 01:48.22 | Dave | mwester, still up? |
| 01:52.58 | sicu | just a few more rounds of openmoocow and i'm off to bed |
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| 02:03.53 | Dave | :D |
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| 02:30.55 | dskippy | I'm having a problem typing on the 2008.09 keyboard. I'm trying to type the phrase "agoodone" with no spaces. I type 'a' and an 'a' comes up. I type 'g' and 'ah' appears above. I can't figure out how to keep the keyboard from guessing. I also can't figure out how to hit enter or space. |
| 02:32.38 | phobie | change the keyboard to terminal? |
| 02:32.54 | slaxxin | go ahead a try to blind type the whole word an see what it comes up with |
| 02:34.45 | dskippy | slaxxin, it says "explains" and "adoptive" as guesses and I have no enter key. |
| 02:35.19 | dskippy | slaxxin: Also, the wifi password entry field gets a character (presumably 'a' but it's stared out) when I hit 'a' first. |
| 02:35.20 | Dave | omg |
| 02:35.25 | slaxxin | rake up or down with your fingernail |
| 02:35.36 | Dave | creates the first pokemon application for the freerunner |
| 02:35.53 | Dave | Wait, I hope that's not going to bring down my rep... |
| 02:36.02 | slaxxin | to flip the keybard |
| 02:36.17 | gmaxwell | I hate predictive entry. It's useful when you're hunting an pecking and are slow enough to run closed loop, but you can't run even partially open loop that way. |
| 02:36.47 | slaxxin | illume keyboard |
| 02:38.12 | phobie | I think we need a T9-keyboard |
| 02:38.26 | dskippy | slaxxin, I'll try that when it comes back on. |
| 02:38.38 | dskippy | I think the battery keeps dying when it sleeps after 30 seconds. |
| 02:39.23 | slaxxin | sounds like u need fdom |
| 02:39.35 | Dave | :p |
| 02:40.02 | dskippy | slaxxin, Actually I was just reading about FDOM since it was just release. |
| 02:40.10 | dskippy | Does it solve some power issue? |
| 02:40.57 | dskippy | There's no .bin for FDOM. Do I just flash the file system onto the most recent version of 2008.09? |
| 02:41.17 | slaxxin | there is too |
| 02:42.16 | dskippy | here? http://compartida.net/openmoko/FDOM/ |
| 02:42.22 | dskippy | Oh! |
| 02:42.25 | dskippy | I'm dumb. NM |
| 02:42.33 | slaxxin | well |
| 02:42.46 | dskippy | ssssssh. Don't tell anyone. |
| 02:44.27 | dskippy | Raking my finger up and down doesn't seem to do anything. |
| 02:44.35 | dskippy | Where am I supposed to do this? |
| 02:44.38 | dskippy | On the keyboard? |
| 02:44.44 | dskippy | It's supposed to change the keyboard? |
| 02:45.16 | slaxxin | yes |
| 02:45.46 | dskippy | I must not be doing it right. |
| 02:47.12 | slaxxin | is there an emblem to the right middle of the screen? |
| 02:47.46 | slaxxin | right edge |
| 02:48.28 | dskippy | Oh got it. |
| 02:48.34 | dskippy | I was going way too fast. |
| 02:48.36 | slaxxin | what |
| 02:49.56 | dskippy | Okay, well I think I typed the correct passwd for my WPA but it's unable to join the network. |
| 02:50.07 | dskippy | I think I'm just going to try downloading FDOM and try again. |
| 02:50.23 | dskippy | That's for the keyboard-switch trick though. |
| 02:50.25 | dskippy | Very good to know. |
| 02:52.08 | Dave | holy network revision batman! |
| 03:08.38 | sicu | robin to the rescue |
| 03:09.21 | sicu | battyboy and robin |
| 03:09.24 | sicu | :o |
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| 03:10.23 | Dave | ;D |
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| 03:22.51 | lambda | someone already experimented bad issue with a telstra prepayd load, please ? |
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| 06:14.45 | CM_work | Go Harald! http://laforge.gnumonks.org/weblog/2008/10/20/#20081020-nand_speed |
| 06:16.24 | raster | go hazzaaaaa! |
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| 06:16.41 | CM_work | :) |
| 06:16.56 | DocsSrutinizer2 | moo |
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| 06:22.30 | geaaru | hi, i installend 2008.8 release with enlightenment, but how can i disable turn off of screen ? |
| 06:22.50 | geaaru | because when a turn off of the screen is done i lost usb connection |
| 06:22.58 | geaaru | is there a way to do that? how? |
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| 06:32.07 | Kred | geaaru: you mean it suspends? You can change that from Settings->Suspend = off |
| 06:32.23 | geaaru | ah k thanks |
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| 06:34.10 | geaaru | and still a stupid question, how i close program with enlightenment? power button doesn't work with e |
| 06:34.30 | Kred | You can use the top shelf Remove command |
| 06:34.49 | Kred | doesn't know the proper name for the top :) |
| 06:34.57 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 06:35.06 | Kred | Morning :) |
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| 06:35.18 | geaaru | ok works :) thank you very very much |
| 06:35.25 | raster | Kred: in e its the slipshelf |
| 06:35.31 | raster | that remove is silly |
| 06:35.32 | Kred | ah ok :) |
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| 06:36.07 | raster | i disavow myself of the design of having a home in a lsit of app iwnodw |
| 06:36.10 | raster | sand a remove to close the app |
| 06:36.25 | raster | i point at illume in svn now that by default has the good old 3 buttons back |
| 06:36.47 | Kred | :) |
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| 06:44.22 | geaaru | but why i can't see gsm, bluetooth applet with enlightenment? is a problem with my environment? |
| 06:44.30 | geaaru | or is under development |
| 06:44.31 | geaaru | ? |
| 06:45.39 | raster | bluetooth is bny default (i think) on the top hidden away. |
| 06:45.45 | raster | u see it when the slipshelf slides out |
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| 06:45.55 | raster | gsm and wifi are there on the main bar |
| 06:46.06 | raster | always visible at the bottom of the slipshelf |
| 06:46.12 | raster | (near clock/battery) |
| 06:46.18 | raster | if u have no gms singal all u see is a tiny |
| 06:46.20 | raster | "*" |
| 06:46.26 | raster | or its low signal |
| 06:46.37 | raster | u may see a à |
| 06:46.40 | raster | if u have no network |
| 06:47.36 | geaaru | my problem is that i see nothing on slipshelf (only battery, clock and a very small star) |
| 06:47.51 | geaaru | if i go to settings i have |
| 06:48.09 | geaaru | bluetooth unknown, gsp unknown. |
| 06:48.29 | geaaru | enlightenment environment is compliant with neo 1937 |
| 06:48.30 | geaaru | ? |
| 06:49.07 | raster | the * is gms |
| 06:49.12 | raster | wifi will be blank until wifi is on |
| 06:49.33 | raster | never tried it on a 1973 |
| 06:49.39 | raster | but no reason it shouldnt work |
| 06:49.43 | geaaru | on neo1937 there isn't wifi |
| 06:49.55 | raster | i run it on my n800, zaurus c860 and my treo650 |
| 06:50.03 | raster | then u'll never see a wifi signal |
| 06:50.05 | raster | it'll always be 0 |
| 06:50.07 | raster | ie empty |
| 06:50.08 | raster | :) |
| 06:50.27 | geaaru | :) how can i enable gsm? from e i can't see power menu |
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| 06:51.05 | Kred | You can remove the applet (if that's the proper name) by opening the slipshelf and from upper left click on the tool image.. |
| 06:51.26 | Kred | I don't know the proper name in english for the tool :P |
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| 06:55.05 | geaaru | tool image is an application that maybe i haven't installed because i can't see it |
| 06:55.34 | methril | G'Morning |
| 06:56.42 | raster | geaaru: enabling/disabling gsm is not e's thing |
| 06:56.50 | raster | thats up to qtopia to do it |
| 06:56.56 | raster | e doesnt pretend to do that |
| 06:57.08 | raster | just listens for dbus messages telling it of signal strength changes for gsm |
| 06:57.15 | raster | and operator name |
| 06:57.57 | geaaru | k, maybe i have some problem with dbus.... i will see thanks at all for support |
| 06:59.04 | raster | is qpe running? |
| 06:59.36 | geaaru | no |
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| 07:01.09 | raster | there is the problem |
| 07:01.18 | raster | qpe is what does all the telephony stuff on asu |
| 07:01.23 | raster | (2008.08/09 etc.) |
| 07:02.33 | geaaru | qpe or gpe? |
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| 07:08.21 | raster | qpe |
| 07:09.21 | geaaru | can you supply name of the package that contains qpe program, please? |
| 07:09.34 | geaaru | s/supply/supply me |
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| 07:18.35 | raster | qtopia-x11-... something |
| 07:18.39 | raster | not sure |
| 07:18.43 | raster | i dont use 2008.x |
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| 07:19.02 | geaaru | k i search, thanks |
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| 07:58.42 | Kred | Is /media/ram really what I think it is, a ram disk? |
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| 07:59.10 | rhkfin | Kred: what mount and df -h tell you? |
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| 07:59.49 | Kred | Nothing about /media |
| 07:59.54 | Kred | So apparently it's not |
| 08:02.33 | lindi- | Kred: /proc/mounts? |
| 08:03.33 | Kred | lindi-: nothing of /media over there either |
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| 08:29.23 | Kensan_ | raster: ping |
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| 08:30.53 | raster | pong |
| 08:31.05 | ColdFyre | dong |
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| 08:56.49 | geaaru | what is package of samegame, pegs, rect, sixteen games ? how can i remove its? |
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| 08:59.05 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * racaae4f6926b 10/etc/dbus-1/system.d/frameworkd.conf: Fix a few typos in dbus-1/system.d/frameworkd.conf |
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| 09:06.13 | Kensan_ | raster: the boottime of my image is around 1min 24 now |
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| 09:06.33 | Kensan_ | raster: bare illume without fso, nand patches applied. |
| 09:06.57 | DocScrutinizer | nand should speedup things noticeably |
| 09:07.58 | Kensan_ | DocScrutinizer: it's not that noticeable on boot with sysv init. Maybe parallel bootupt could benefit. |
| 09:09.53 | evolux | can anyone open https urls on midori or openmoko-browser? |
| 09:10.03 | evolux | i'm especially talking about loggin into google |
| 09:10.34 | raster | Kensan_: what have u been doing? |
| 09:10.36 | ieatlint | wasn't it you who was telling me that that paralleling init wouldn't do much of anything? :) |
| 09:11.27 | Kensan_ | raster: I took your latest illume image, removed all fso stuff, stripped some kernel configs and applied laforges nand patches. |
| 09:11.47 | raster | hmm |
| 09:11.49 | raster | what kernel configs? |
| 09:12.13 | Kensan_ | ieatlint: yes, because I said IO was the issue. Since IO should be considerably better now it might be worth a shot. I reckon harald has upstart working in his setup... |
| 09:12.19 | raster | (and i know fso will add bloat to startup - not much to be done other than replace fso... whihc is a tall order right now) |
| 09:12.36 | ieatlint | i haven't followed much since friday... what IO changes were made? |
| 09:12.48 | Kensan_ | raster: I just deactivated some unneeded stuff (yaffs for example) nothing dramatic. |
| 09:13.06 | raster | hmm |
| 09:13.07 | raster | ok |
| 09:13.08 | ieatlint | raster, just get porting it to c... that should help :) |
| 09:13.11 | Kensan_ | ieatlint: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/005917.html |
| 09:13.16 | ieatlint | thx |
| 09:13.25 | raster | ieatlint: if someone paid me to - i'd look aat it |
| 09:13.51 | ieatlint | i will give you 1 million zimbabwean dollars |
| 09:13.54 | raster | but they're competing for my time so they'll have to pay better than my current clientset :) |
| 09:14.07 | Kensan_ | raster: next up is mdev but I don't have all that much time (only evenings) |
| 09:14.17 | raster | Kensan_: join the club |
| 09:14.21 | raster | i need to woprk on elementary |
| 09:14.26 | Kensan_ | raster: hehe |
| 09:15.46 | ieatlint | raster ... come on, $1m ZWD ... you'd be a millionaire |
| 09:17.06 | raster | ieatlint: already am a millionaire |
| 09:17.08 | raster | in yen |
| 09:17.09 | raster | :) |
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| 09:18.10 | ieatlint | hmmm |
| 09:18.21 | ulf | how can i see if i have Om 2008.8 or Om 2008.9? |
| 09:19.10 | raster | seriously |
| 09:19.12 | raster | would love to |
| 09:19.18 | raster | but priorities are just that |
| 09:19.27 | raster | clients pay me to look after them and their needs |
| 09:19.34 | raster | and that is what i do. |
| 09:19.51 | raster | i have already spent some time on fso and oe images |
| 09:19.54 | raster | patching up builds |
| 09:19.56 | raster | portign patches |
| 09:19.57 | ieatlint | how about $600 billion ZWD using July 30 black market exchange rates? |
| 09:20.00 | raster | maintaing efl packages |
| 09:20.04 | rhkfin | Any release date guesses for 2008.10? |
| 09:20.27 | ieatlint | (which is something like $4 USD) |
| 09:20.44 | ieatlint | you might be able to get a pint for that... |
| 09:21.05 | johncylee | raster: any idea about https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2071 ? |
| 09:21.52 | raster | johncylee: ecore_con issue |
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| 09:21.56 | raster | i hit it too |
| 09:21.58 | raster | fixed in upstream |
| 09:22.09 | raster | and in my FSO (OE) updates and patches |
| 09:22.19 | raster | so basically u updated and chose a bad svnrev |
| 09:22.20 | raster | :) |
| 09:22.23 | johncylee | ok what svn rev do you use |
| 09:22.32 | raster | the upsteram oe packages + my patches for fso work |
| 09:22.39 | raster | just a sec |
| 09:22.47 | raster | let me add some thngs and commit todays updates |
| 09:23.34 | johncylee | raster: so it only works if 1. correct svn rev + 2. your patches ? |
| 09:23.35 | Kensan_ | raster: did you finally get commit access to oe? |
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| 09:25.09 | XorA | johncylee: hola |
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| 09:26.12 | johncylee | XorA: raster just told me fixed in upstream, in my FSO (OE) updates and patches, just a sec, let me add some thngs and commit todays updates |
| 09:27.00 | johncylee | XorA: so.. seems OE/OM.dev updated and chose a bad svnrev |
| 09:27.58 | raster | johncylee: |
| 09:27.59 | raster | svn co http://svn.enlightenment.org/svn/e/trunk/TMP/oe |
| 09:28.05 | raster | all patches, etc. etc. there |
| 09:28.08 | raster | 21 of them |
| 09:28.34 | raster | EFL_SRCREV ?= "36882" |
| 09:28.37 | raster | for me |
| 09:28.40 | raster | (very recent) |
| 09:28.54 | raster | and i have eina .bb files for the new lib dep |
| 09:29.16 | raster | anything i have in my oe svn tree "works" |
| 09:29.19 | geaaru | what means this message: Unknown HZ value! (91) Assume 100. |
| 09:29.22 | XorA | raster: libeina already exists |
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| 09:29.26 | geaaru | where i can set hz? |
| 09:29.26 | raster | as i do builds for multielp platforms |
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| 09:30.09 | XorA | raster: is you eina the same gstreamer library? |
| 09:30.16 | raster | XorA: no |
| 09:30.20 | raster | eina data type lib |
| 09:30.28 | XorA | name collision then :-D |
| 09:31.10 | raster | oh fuck |
| 09:31.27 | raster | well |
| 09:31.28 | XorA | packages/libeina/libeina_0.96.7.bb in OE |
| 09:31.32 | raster | for now u'll have to live with the collision |
| 09:31.35 | raster | yes |
| 09:31.36 | raster | found it |
| 09:34.33 | raster | looks like we need to argue over a new name |
| 09:34.35 | raster | hooray |
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| 09:48.57 | geaaru | xserver of om2008.8 works still with neo1937? Because i have updated xserver and now there are problem on refresh splitshelf and keyboard |
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| 09:49.21 | Kensan_ | raster: ah another very minor thing I changed was to pass lpj (loops per jiffy) as kernel argument. Should save a measely ~250 msec |
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| 09:51.58 | *** join/#openmoko mickey|ICE621 (n=mickey@92.116.153.195) |
| 09:53.27 | pb__ | hi mickey|ICE621 |
| 09:53.42 | pb__ | where are you going? |
| 09:53.52 | mickey|ICE621 | hi pb__ |
| 09:54.02 | mickey|ICE621 | munich, to the SYSTEMS computer exhibition |
| 09:54.27 | pb__ | ah, very good |
| 09:54.31 | mickey|ICE621 | sharing a booth with one of the Openmoko distributors in germany |
| 09:54.31 | mickey|ICE621 | spreading the word... ;) |
| 09:54.36 | pb__ | :-) |
| 09:55.36 | Kensan_ | raster: btw, I have hwecc disabled which should speed things up a bit more. |
| 09:55.59 | raster | Kensan_: see how much u get then |
| 09:56.33 | Kensan_ | raster: yeah will do but I think I will first try to get mdev running. That should bring -10 secs |
| 09:56.55 | raster | mickey|ICE621: spread the werd-up |
| 09:57.04 | raster | Kensan_: yeah. XorA is alive |
| 09:57.06 | raster | ask him |
| 09:57.09 | XorA | Kensan_: you might want to look at poky |
| 09:57.23 | Kensan_ | XorA: oh hi there :) |
| 09:57.25 | XorA | Kensan_: hrw reported similar speedups using udev with their init script changes |
| 09:57.53 | XorA | we lose some feature with mdev :-( |
| 09:57.55 | Kensan_ | XorA: I understand they simply untar /dev or something similar so dev initialization is skiped which cost a lot of time. |
| 09:58.14 | Kensan_ | XorA: ah ic. Yeah I thought udev would be prefered... |
| 09:58.23 | XorA | Kensan: yes, untar then they run udev-trigger for 2 subsystems that still need to be hotplugged |
| 09:58.41 | XorA | Kensan: in my early experiments doing that, I got same time saving as mdev |
| 09:58.47 | raster | damn dev jungle |
| 09:58.53 | XorA | Kensan_: so poky way is certainly prefereable |
| 09:58.54 | Kensan_ | XorA: the source is here http://svn.o-hand.com/repos/poky/trunk/ right? |
| 09:59.10 | raster | ponders his notepad widget |
| 09:59.12 | Kensan_ | XorA: right, sounds good. |
| 10:00.11 | XorA | Kensan_: yes that should be it |
| 10:00.50 | Kensan_ | XorA: ok, will take a closer look at it. Do you happen to know what else hrw did to speed up boot time? |
| 10:00.50 | geaaru | i confirmed, on neo1937 i have some problem with refresh with Xglamo |
| 10:00.54 | *** join/#openmoko xiangfu (n=xiangfu@125.96.9.48) |
| 10:01.08 | geaaru | while with Xfbdev problem with refresh aren't visible |
| 10:01.44 | XorA | Kensan_: no, I was busy with other stuff |
| 10:02.39 | Kensan_ | XorA: ok, I will ask him directly if I need some input :) |
| 10:02.50 | Kensan_ | XorA: thanks for the pointers. |
| 10:02.56 | XorA | Kensan_: no probs |
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| 10:10.40 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * r35cda1825a7c 10/tests/ (test.py tests.conf): |
| 10:10.40 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: tests: Added some tests for gsm |
| 10:10.40 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: this patch also add a way to request manual operations during a test, |
| 10:10.40 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: using the 'operator' object. |
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| 10:33.15 | Kred | raster: this is probably proper channel.. but do you happen to know on what basis kernel decides to write to disk from ram? |
| 10:33.57 | flexd_ | arrr |
| 10:34.03 | flexd_ | My Qtopia install has gone loco. |
| 10:34.23 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * rf9b5fe964176 10/framework/subsystems/oeventsd/trigger.py: |
| 10:34.24 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: oeventsd: Split arguments in DbusTrigger |
| 10:34.24 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: This way we can just match on the first argument of a DBus signal with |
| 10:34.24 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: HasAttr(arg0, "foo") |
| 10:34.53 | *** part/#openmoko ptitjes (n=didier@93.2.7.240) |
| 10:35.55 | raster | Kred: when its bored |
| 10:35.59 | raster | after a timeout |
| 10:36.04 | Kred | :D |
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| 10:36.13 | raster | when memory needs to be freed up in cache to make way for other daya form other files or apps |
| 10:36.13 | Kred | Good answer :) |
| 10:36.20 | raster | or when u call sync() |
| 10:36.28 | raster | or fsync on the particular file handle |
| 10:36.39 | Kred | So I shouldn't be too much worried about it? |
| 10:37.08 | raster | u do know tho |
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| 10:37.17 | raster | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:37.19 | *** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:37.30 | raster | tmpfs |
| 10:37.42 | raster | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TMPFS |
| 10:37.43 | raster | :) |
| 10:38.13 | raster | so as such... |
| 10:38.21 | raster | just write to /tmp |
| 10:38.25 | raster | it ONLY stays in ram |
| 10:38.28 | raster | :) |
| 10:38.41 | raster | just remember to clean up the files when done |
| 10:38.45 | raster | or u keep using ram |
| 10:38.51 | raster | even after u exit |
| 10:39.12 | Kred | Thanks a lot. That lifts a huge rock from my shoulders |
| 10:40.47 | raster | even better |
| 10:40.56 | raster | write it direct to tmpfs as u download |
| 10:41.00 | raster | mmap() a file in tmpfs |
| 10:41.07 | raster | and just expand it as u get more data |
| 10:41.22 | raster | write direct to the mmaped file (or read from socket directly) |
| 10:41.26 | raster | if its raw image file data |
| 10:41.32 | raster | then u save to tmpfs with zero-copy |
| 10:41.53 | raster | but it probably wont make much of a difference compared to the image load/decode overhead |
| 10:41.56 | raster | or the slowness orf download |
| 10:43.18 | flexd_ | is choosing a new image to use again |
| 10:43.50 | flexd_ | basic dialing/sms'ing and somewhat usable battery time is the only requirement atm, anyone have any suggestions? |
| 10:44.51 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@dyn202-230.ph.ic.ac.uk) |
| 10:46.39 | flexd_ | silence suggests buying an iphone.. :P |
| 10:48.19 | BobOfDoom | well if all you want is basic dialing, SMS and battery life, I'd recommend getting the cheapest bog standard nokia you can find, not an iphone ;) |
| 10:49.55 | flexd_ | I already have a FR, i just need a image that *works* |
| 10:51.31 | toggles_w | an i want a pet leprechaun... |
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| 11:01.53 | raster | i want yo momma |
| 11:03.23 | raster | XorA: yo |
| 11:03.36 | raster | pokes XorA |
| 11:03.54 | johncylee | pokes XorA |
| 11:04.39 | CVirus | pokes XorA |
| 11:04.43 | raster | fun.. isn't it? |
| 11:04.44 | raster | :) |
| 11:06.08 | XorA | is feeling a bit violated now |
| 11:06.33 | raster | XorA: libeina changed name to liblomo in july 2007 |
| 11:07.52 | XorA | raster: ah cool, so the name is yours for the taking :-) |
| 11:09.41 | raster | XorA: yeah. the libeina .bb probably needs renaming to llomo |
| 11:09.42 | raster | and fixing |
| 11:09.43 | raster | :) |
| 11:09.58 | *** join/#openmoko Mek (n=marijn@93.157.1.37) |
| 11:10.48 | *** join/#openmoko Xilent (n=mnskv@unaffiliated/xilent) |
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| 11:11.41 | XorA | raster: if its borken, just move it to nonworking |
| 11:11.48 | XorA | raster: someone who cares can fix it |
| 11:11.53 | raster | :) |
| 11:11.57 | raster | nb |
| 11:12.06 | raster | at some point u really want to snarf my patches |
| 11:12.11 | raster | i'm up to 21 of them pending... |
| 11:12.12 | raster | :) |
| 11:12.19 | XorA | raster: I didnt realise you werent committing them |
| 11:12.25 | XorA | raster: didnt we give you write access? |
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| 11:14.56 | raster | no |
| 11:15.05 | raster | thats why i have to do my bizarre svn tree thing |
| 11:15.10 | raster | so i can publish the stuff sanely |
| 11:15.11 | raster | :) |
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| 11:15.29 | raster | i have fixed for palm kernel builds fo rexample |
| 11:15.34 | raster | the kernel doesnt build at all without them |
| 11:15.39 | raster | no one is fixing/maintaing that |
| 11:16.01 | raster | :) |
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| 11:18.18 | XorA | raster: hmm, we should fix that, you should send ssh keys to zecke/mickeyl I think |
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| 11:19.01 | raster | ok |
| 11:19.03 | raster | will do |
| 11:19.06 | raster | :) |
| 11:19.26 | XorA | Im not really sure what the new developer policy is now we are on git |
| 11:19.40 | raster | well it is just the dev branch |
| 11:19.54 | raster | so i assume that is the playgoind to just commit stuff u are pretty sure is right |
| 11:20.01 | raster | and that later gets merged into oe stable |
| 11:20.08 | XorA | and its not like you dont have a whole load of commits cherry picked from OM already :-) |
| 11:20.22 | raster | :) |
| 11:20.26 | raster | i ned to cherry pick more from om |
| 11:20.34 | raster | i cant do everything tho |
| 11:20.37 | raster | thats your job to do that! |
| 11:20.38 | raster | :) |
| 11:24.22 | *** join/#openmoko kishore (n=quassel@218.248.35.118) |
| 11:25.13 | XorA | raster: whats still missing, I find it hard to check because FILE_PR in OE obscures all changes :-( |
| 11:25.40 | *** join/#openmoko alephnull_ (n=alok@122.167.97.217) |
| 11:26.27 | raster | yeah |
| 11:26.29 | raster | i merged that though |
| 11:26.32 | raster | my patches |
| 11:27.07 | raster | svn co http://svn.enlightenment.org/svn/e/trunk/TMP/oe |
| 11:27.09 | raster | in patches/ |
| 11:27.17 | XorA | raster: yeah I saw them |
| 11:27.24 | raster | the aux and power butotn in x is one |
| 11:27.33 | raster | i htink a lot of kernel stuff tho i havent looked into that |
| 11:27.42 | raster | in some ways my changes to oe are better |
| 11:27.48 | raster | i split off x splashscreens into their own package |
| 11:27.54 | raster | and not part of kdrive-common |
| 11:28.14 | *** join/#openmoko jave (n=user@79.138.133.212.bredband.tre.se) |
| 11:28.54 | XorA | yeah, definately need to get you OE access :-) |
| 11:29.03 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201.45.49.162) |
| 11:30.09 | raster | i know my way around oe reasonably well now |
| 11:30.16 | raster | i may do some thigns a bit strangely at times |
| 11:30.28 | raster | but i do want to just make stuff better |
| 11:30.29 | raster | :) |
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| 11:57.36 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * r41d30e38d48e 10/tests/ogsmd2.py: tests: Added ogsmd2.py |
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| 12:16.08 | Kensan_ | XorA: the kernel config for linux-openmoko should be changed because currently oe has it's own kernel config... |
| 12:17.07 | XorA | Kensan_: I know, the "official" one is in the kernel git, but the FSO guys don't like that one |
| 12:17.43 | Kensan_ | XorA: Andy posted to devel about that: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/devel/2008-October/002722.html |
| 12:18.08 | Kensan_ | XorA: I agree, those configs have unneeded stuff active by default... |
| 12:18.21 | Kensan_ | XorA: I don't know what the FSO don't like about that though. |
| 12:19.40 | Kensan_ | XorA: if I might ask: are you "responsible" to get the OM things merged into oe? |
| 12:19.45 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host52-51-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:20.39 | XorA | Kensan_: kinda |
| 12:20.59 | XorA | Kensan_: I am waiting for a FILE_PR to dissapear in OE, so I can actually see what is missing |
| 12:21.12 | MrShleee | So, qi is expected to take over uboot.. and 2.6.27 is expected to take over 6.24 |
| 12:21.30 | Kensan_ | XorA: ah I see. |
| 12:22.16 | XorA | Kensan_: but I also have other tasks to take care of in OE |
| 12:23.52 | Kensan_ | XorA: ok. well it's good for me to know, since now I know who to ping if something comes up there :) I am sending my (few) patches to raster atm. |
| 12:24.31 | Kensan_ | XorA: is there a "official" way on how to get a recipe (bb for bootchart-lite by fred chien) into oe? |
| 12:24.34 | XorA | wonders if he actually has pain killers in the house |
| 12:24.48 | XorA | Kensan_: file a bug in bugs.openembedded.net |
| 12:24.59 | Kensan_ | XorA: ok thanks. |
| 12:25.03 | Kensan_ | will do |
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| 12:28.24 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r19e4f65a7868 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/ubx.py: |
| 12:28.24 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Report height above mean sea level, not above ellipsoid |
| 12:28.24 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: NMEA height is reported as height above mean sea level, this fixes #188 |
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| 12:31.51 | wurp2|working | Does anyone have experience putting their kernel on flash, and their rootfs on sd? |
| 12:32.21 | wurp2|working | I have a gta01 and an 8gb card, and apparently uboot on gta01 won't mmcinit an 8gb card |
| 12:36.24 | *** join/#openmoko mrmoku (n=mok@ppp-88-217-60-153.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
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| 12:45.38 | Cervajz | Hello everyone :) |
| 12:46.19 | beni_ | hi |
| 12:46.52 | Cervajz | What is the best filesystem for SDHC card? Only for store data (Mp3, ...), not for booting system. |
| 12:47.15 | lindi- | Cervajz: what makes you think there is best? |
| 12:47.18 | XorA | fat32 is the easiest to deal with on pretty much all OSs and devices |
| 12:50.02 | dns53 | fat works well unless you have lots of small files or lots of small writes etc |
| 12:51.16 | Cervajz | I have default Om2008.9 system and I have big problems with my 4GB Kingston card. |
| 12:51.46 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@adsl-62-167-56-4.adslplus.ch) |
| 12:52.21 | Cervajz | I don't see my files which I was upload on my notebook |
| 12:52.43 | Cervajz | I have tried three filesystems (ext3, FAT16 and FAT32) :/ |
| 12:56.20 | *** join/#openmoko xiangfu (n=xiangfu@125.96.14.15) |
| 12:56.49 | dns53 | is it a hdsd card? |
| 12:56.56 | dns53 | hdsd |
| 12:57.49 | dns53 | try formatting it on your phone and not on your computer |
| 12:58.38 | *** join/#openmoko jtickle (n=jtickle@ip-152010152154.ess.appstate.edu) |
| 13:05.33 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 13:09.47 | *** join/#openmoko Mercury_ (n=goldenha@printer.systems.golden.net) |
| 13:10.30 | Mercury_ | Hello all :) I updated the testing tree on my freerunner and all the icons disappeared off my 'Home' |
| 13:10.46 | *** join/#openmoko unlotto (n=unlotto@ip114.rev112.brygge.net) |
| 13:11.11 | Mercury_ | Anyone else have that problem? |
| 13:12.49 | *** join/#openmoko datachaos (n=datachao@189.6.250.25) |
| 13:15.06 | XorA | Mercury_: everyone does |
| 13:18.10 | *** join/#openmoko ChandleWEi (n=chandle@61.170.246.173) |
| 13:18.19 | *** join/#openmoko Lijian (n=lijian@218.58.59.73) |
| 13:18.28 | *** part/#openmoko ChandleWEi (n=chandle@61.170.246.173) |
| 13:18.47 | beni_ | XorA: well, then i do not upgrade. |
| 13:19.07 | beni_ | the last time i tried it (two days ago) the phone hanged on the laoding screen of x |
| 13:21.42 | Lijian | Hello ,Can anyone tell me how to reset my Neo1973's boot menu to the default one? |
| 13:22.18 | XorA | whats the git command to drag in a directory of patches? |
| 13:22.26 | XorA | suffers memory loss |
| 13:23.03 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 13:23.43 | Mercury_ | XorA: Any solutions? |
| 13:23.54 | XorA | Mercury_: dont upgrade |
| 13:24.00 | Lijian | hello ,Could anyone tell me the uboot command to reset my neo1973's boot menu to the original one?Is there such an command? |
| 13:24.05 | Mercury_ | XorA: Any OTHER solutions? |
| 13:24.16 | XorA | Mercury_: no, there isnt one |
| 13:24.52 | SpeedEvil | Lijian: i think it's the uboot environment you need to reload. |
| 13:25.07 | SpeedEvil | Lijian: I don't think there is a standard command |
| 13:25.07 | Mercury_ | Lijian: I just struggled with this same thing last night. |
| 13:25.20 | Lijian | Yes ,maybe ,how to? |
| 13:25.50 | Mercury_ | Lijian: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/U-boot (Section: What if I borked my bootloader environment and don't get a prompt anymore? ) |
| 13:26.10 | Lijian | I can't find a command to reload the environment.Is there one? |
| 13:26.15 | Mercury_ | Lijian: Yes. |
| 13:26.31 | Mercury_ | Lijian: Look at that link I just sent you. It shows you how to use dfu-util to do that. |
| 13:27.03 | Mercury_ | Lijian: There's also one from the serial uboot prompt.. but it sucks.. it puts it back to a totally stripped down blank menu. |
| 13:27.28 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@91-113-119-63.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 13:29.14 | Lijian | I can access to the uboot with cu ,but just can't find the right command. |
| 13:29.29 | Mercury_ | Lijian: defaultenv will do it, but don't... because it sucks. |
| 13:30.09 | Mercury_ | Lijian: Use the method I linked you. It also has the advantage of letting you mess with it using a text editor instead of the clunky serial interface. |
| 13:30.14 | Lijian | Hmm,and I don't have defaultenv command. |
| 13:30.26 | Mercury_ | Lijian: Ah.. must be on newer u-boots only. |
| 13:31.00 | Mercury_ | Lijian: There's probably a way to load the environment from NOR and then save it to NAND on that prompt.. that's beyond me. |
| 13:32.00 | Mercury_ | So, does anyone know what's wrong with illume in the testing tree? |
| 13:32.28 | Lijian | However ,I can change them one by one,manually. |
| 13:32.28 | Lijian | I will explore the wiki again.Thanks all you guys. |
| 13:33.36 | SpeedEvil | neo1973 - only one flash |
| 13:33.46 | SpeedEvil | Lijian |
| 13:34.18 | Lijian | ? |
| 13:34.25 | bumbl | does opkg support something like --depclean |
| 13:40.28 | mwester | XorA: quiilt? |
| 13:41.24 | XorA | mwester: git-am |
| 13:41.31 | XorA | mwester: the geniusly labelled command |
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| 13:44.23 | mwester | scratches his head and goes to look that command up... |
| 13:44.43 | XorA | git-ApplyMailbox |
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| 14:05.12 | Lijian | The "Qtopia update for Neo" found here http://qtextended.org/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=7 doesn't contain a shell script like before,why? |
| 14:06.46 | *** part/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 14:06.56 | bumbl | has someone an actual svn navit build? |
| 14:08.28 | Lijian | And I use the old shell script ,but it leaves me out of the X interface after it's procession. |
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| 14:26.51 | kdubois | i have a "really dead battery" how can i fix it? |
| 14:27.11 | kdubois | without access to a charged battery |
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| 14:28.48 | leinirAWAY | kdubois: Try plugging it into the wall charger, then do the aux+power thing :) |
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| 14:28.57 | bumbl | what would be the best kernel to use with fdom? |
| 14:29.00 | CIA-49 | openmoko: 03dp 07org.openmoko.dev * rd6ffba905d1d 10/ (7 files in 2 dirs): [efl] updates from E17 svn courtesy of raster so we can use later SRCREVS |
| 14:29.21 | kdubois | leinirAWAY: nothing happens |
| 14:29.22 | jhass841 | Hey everyone, mind if I ask a few questions about the freerunner? |
| 14:29.52 | bumbl | don't ask if you should ask, ask |
| 14:30.00 | Kred | There's interesting buzz after a call |
| 14:30.17 | Kred | Sounds like there's continuous output to the speaker |
| 14:30.23 | *** join/#openmoko surf2me (n=surfer@194.208.141.212) |
| 14:30.48 | Kred | Does anyone else experience this? |
| 14:30.50 | kdubois | leinirAWAY: does it have to charge for a while or something? |
| 14:30.50 | jhass841 | I'm considering getting the freerunner for my birthday, how usable is it at this point? |
| 14:30.57 | leinirAWAY | kdubois: Sometimes yeah |
| 14:31.15 | leinirAWAY | jhass841: Well, i'm using it as a day-to-day phone with Qt Extended, but your mileage may vary :) |
| 14:31.29 | kdubois | this seems like a really dumb hardware bug, "once it runs out of power, you cant charge it" |
| 14:31.39 | bumbl | jhass841: when do you have birthday |
| 14:31.48 | Kred | jhass841: I got mine last friday. I'd say it's usable for calling and sms, but it's not a iPhone killer at the moment (will not be for years? :) |
| 14:32.06 | jhass841 | November 27th (actually, birthday or christmas) |
| 14:32.07 | Kred | Now the buzzing went away |
| 14:32.30 | bumbl | in ~2-3 months and it should be usable for anyone |
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| 14:33.13 | jhass841 | I mean I'm a little worried because although I've heard a lot of good things about it, I'm afraid to get it if it won't be a reliable primary phone |
| 14:33.28 | Kred | jhass841: if you have any programming skills then I'd say get one now |
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| 14:34.09 | Kred | Well it does seem to eat battery, but if you have a wall socket or usb connection you're good. |
| 14:34.48 | Kred | If you follow the community list you'll see, that there's optimizations going in for boot and battery time |
| 14:35.19 | jhass841 | I do have programming skills, and that's why I want one. Honestly, how well does it work just as a phone? As in, does it reliably do all of the things a phone should do? I've heard that there's an echo problem when making calls... |
| 14:35.21 | Kred | I changed from HTC S730 to FR last Saturday and I like it :) |
| 14:35.42 | Kred | No, I love it. |
| 14:36.17 | jhass841 | Because if I get this phone, I'm getting rid of my other phone |
| 14:36.22 | Kred | jhass841: there's definetly audio quality problems. I just 5mins ago made a long call with FR and it's definetly a lot weaker in quality than the HTC one for example |
| 14:37.13 | jhass841 | Is it awful though, I mean I have a little bit of an echo problem with my current phone sometimes but for the most part the calls come through clearly |
| 14:37.56 | Kred | The last call that I made had no such problem. If you want to make perfect calls, then hold on to your money and wait a month or two. Get a xmas present of it. |
| 14:38.43 | jhass841 | Is the freerunner your primary phone? |
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| 14:39.08 | Kred | If you want to be on the edge (not GPRS) and want to code at the same time, then get it now. But if you must have a phone that simply works, then I'd say this is not for you just yet. I wouldn't buy it for my computer savy friends :) |
| 14:39.19 | Kred | But then again, they don't use Linux.. Windows ppl.. :) |
| 14:39.27 | Kred | It is my primary phone. |
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| 14:40.04 | jhass841 | and you can make calls normally most of the time? |
| 14:40.23 | Kred | Sure! No problems so far. |
| 14:40.49 | Kred | But now I have to run. bbl |
| 14:41.02 | jhass841 | thank you very much |
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| 14:41.14 | jhass841 | Alright, well I think I'm sold then |
| 14:42.01 | jhass841 | Thanks a lot everyone, I appreciate your patience. I think I'm gonna go bug the qtopia people for a bit. |
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| 14:55.32 | diegows | hi |
| 14:55.51 | diegows | question, is there a camera devices compatible with freerruner? |
| 14:59.12 | BobOfDoom | diegows: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Webcam |
| 14:59.56 | BobOfDoom | diegows: any random USB webcam that works with Linux in general should work with the FR |
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| 15:06.25 | bumbl | is pulseaudio needed on om2008.9 or could i disable it? |
| 15:06.43 | *** join/#openmoko MrTuttle (n=hklein@i59F705BC.versanet.de) |
| 15:06.49 | bumbl | because pulseaudio = waste of resources |
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| 15:09.38 | diegows | BobOfDoom: thanks! |
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| 15:20.15 | bumbl | anyone running fdom? |
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| 15:37.19 | zash | hm, android source |
| 15:37.33 | zash | and the sites front page lies |
| 15:38.45 | bricode | zash: how does it lie? |
| 15:39.29 | zash | "Android is the first free, open source, and fully customizable mobile platform." |
| 15:39.54 | *** join/#openmoko Quadduc (n=quadduc@90.149.196.137) |
| 15:39.55 | zash | first? |
| 15:40.00 | cjb_ie | ...that actually lets users make phone calls ;) |
| 15:40.23 | viq | :D |
| 15:40.34 | zash | cjb_ie: it says that where? |
| 15:40.57 | nyu | they say fully customizable, but not fully free |
| 15:42.41 | Wonka | hey, i already have made a call from my fr, and i had not a single problem. |
| 15:42.53 | zash | nuclear_eclipse: customizable .. for who |
| 15:43.04 | Sup3rkiddo | is it 100% FOSS, as in dalvik as well |
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| 15:43.10 | Sup3rkiddo | (or whatever that is) |
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| 15:46.07 | wurp2|working | Sup3rkiddo: I don't think much of it is OSS yet |
| 15:46.34 | zash | get source, steal good parts .. profit |
| 15:47.35 | Sup3rkiddo | wurp2|working, ah ok |
| 15:47.36 | Sup3rkiddo | http://android.kernel.org/?p=platform/dalvik.git;a=summary |
| 15:48.19 | wurp2|working | Sup3rkiddo: wow! |
| 15:48.43 | wurp2|working | That's the first actual open source I've seen from Android |
| 15:49.41 | Sup3rkiddo | the code is under apache 2.0 license if it matters |
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| 15:49.55 | summatusmentis | wurp2|working: http://source.android.com/ |
| 15:50.00 | summatusmentis | they just released everything |
| 15:50.12 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, ola |
| 15:50.17 | summatusmentis | hi Sup3rkiddo |
| 15:51.13 | bumbl | summatusmentis: everything? |
| 15:51.18 | bumbl | i don't think so |
| 15:51.49 | bumbl | i bet the parts for branding and locking down are closed after all |
| 15:52.10 | *** join/#openmoko khorben (n=raw@nat/af83/x-29e52a0ed6439bed) |
| 15:52.34 | summatusmentis | bumbl: http://source.android.com/projects |
| 15:53.12 | Kensan_ | seems like a whole lot of source to me... |
| 15:54.21 | wurp2|working | summatusmentis: Yeah, I just read that, fucking awesome |
| 15:54.26 | wurp2|working | Who's porting it to neo? |
| 15:54.48 | Hire | http://source.android.com/ |
| 15:55.01 | summatusmentis | wurp2|working: if I had time and a neo, I would |
| 15:55.01 | zash | who's porting dalvik vm to openmoko, so we can run their apps, but they cant run ours? |
| 15:55.19 | mwester | wonders why so many people are freaking out over android right now. *sigh* |
| 15:55.57 | *** join/#openmoko tsdogs (n=tsdogs@net70-17.metalit.net) |
| 15:56.24 | bumbl | it seems as koolu will ship it |
| 15:56.39 | bumbl | mwester: android works on the htc |
| 15:56.51 | *** join/#openmoko The_Osterhase (n=unknown@6.233.80.212.static.versanetonline.de) |
| 15:56.54 | wurp2|working | mwester_: 'cause they just opened it, and we expect it to work better than the OM stuff? |
| 15:57.00 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * rec176497bb6a 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/om.py: ogpsd: Fix aiding data time generation bug (time.time honors DST flag) |
| 15:57.00 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * rfcf5855bfa6b 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/om.py: ogpsd: Don't send ephemeris since this seriously screws up the GPS chip |
| 15:58.23 | tomboy64 | ok |
| 15:58.34 | tomboy64 | now when will android be available for the fr? |
| 15:59.03 | Kensan_ | wurp2|working: Koolu as far as I know |
| 16:00.04 | zash | tomboy64: screw that, om on g1 |
| 16:00.06 | wurp2|working | Kensan_: Koolu is working on a port? |
| 16:00.26 | wurp2|working | Yeah, I care more about the g1 |
| 16:00.29 | Kensan_ | wurp2|working: yes, as far as I know. |
| 16:00.31 | wurp2|working | since I have one |
| 16:00.35 | wurp2|working | that's great news |
| 16:00.52 | bumbl | wurp2|working: koolu wrote that they will ship freerunners with android in november |
| 16:00.55 | summatusmentis | wurp2|working: you have a g1? :( |
| 16:01.06 | *** join/#openmoko Batchy (n=batchy@AVelizy-155-1-45-2.w83-204.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 16:01.11 | wurp2|working | Yeah |
| 16:01.14 | Kensan_ | wurp2|working: afaik there's alreadby been sucess with the kernel since that source has already been available |
| 16:01.17 | wurp2|working | Wow, I'm out of the news loop |
| 16:01.27 | wurp2|working | gotta go for a while |
| 16:03.38 | tomboy64 | what's g1? |
| 16:03.55 | bumbl | tomboy64: the tmobile htc android phone |
| 16:04.11 | tomboy64 | :-D |
| 16:04.13 | tomboy64 | ahh |
| 16:04.54 | *** join/#openmoko thrang_6 (n=thrang_@91-65-231-221-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 16:05.01 | mwester | wurp2|working: ;) When -- and the most important part: IF -- someone actually gets the android sources to run in any fashion at all on the Neo, THEN I'll do something other than yawn about the google sources. I'm just suffering from too may empty promises when it comes to the Om hardware. |
| 16:05.24 | tomboy64 | :) |
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| 16:06.15 | Kensan_ | mwester: koolu seems to have ported the kernel specifica already. I believe they are quite serious about the port... we will see. |
| 16:08.03 | bricode | wurp2|working: I am porting it to FR. |
| 16:08.05 | zash | full linux freedomness vs sandboxed java vm |
| 16:09.04 | Hire | bricode: what is the state of the porting? |
| 16:09.14 | *** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@dsl081-165-076.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 16:09.16 | Kensan_ | bricode: busy days ahead ;) |
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| 16:11.28 | bricode | Kensan_: Indeed. |
| 16:11.36 | bricode | Hire: Working kernel. |
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| 16:15.45 | mwester | Kensan_: So I assume that means that they have solved the GSM problems, and that they have a solution to the WSoD as well? ;) |
| 16:16.09 | Kensan_ | mwester: hehe no. That's not part of porting, that would still lie with OM to fix :( |
| 16:16.32 | mwester | wishes people would focus on the fact that no amount of good intentions or user space software will fix Om's broken hardware, and that's the blocking issue right now. |
| 16:17.21 | mwester | Add to that the observation that the only person at Om who HAS been working on the WSoD problem seems to be doing nothing but Qi and bootloader stuff for the GTA03. |
| 16:18.00 | mwester | Somebody at Om needs to PROVE that the GTA02 isn't going to end up just like the GTA01 -- abandoned and left to the community. :( |
| 16:18.11 | Kensan_ | mwester: Isn't Harald going to look into Wsod? Judging by Werner's mail it *seems* that there's some move on the subject of gsm but who knows... |
| 16:18.38 | mwester | Kensan_: who shipped their broken GTA02 to Harald, then? |
| 16:18.52 | Kensan_ | mwester: yeah, I don't understand, why they are pushing GTA03 that much... I though it was "back to basics". |
| 16:19.22 | Kensan_ | mwester: Wasn't he going to meet up with mickey and the gang? |
| 16:19.35 | mwester | Last I saw, Harald was asking for a broken GTA02 so that he could take a look. I will volunteer to send my working one to whomever sends a busted on to Harald. |
| 16:19.37 | bumbl | mwester: yeah it seems as if om more or less dropped the freerunner but swisscom is doing a good job |
| 16:20.18 | Kensan_ | bumbl: well let's not go that far to say that they dropped it. But they should follow through with what they announce (weekly engineering news 41)... |
| 16:20.58 | Kensan_ | bumbl: and swisscom's commitment only goes that far... |
| 16:21.28 | mwester | swisscom's access to documents and Om's suppliers also only goes so far. |
| 16:21.33 | bumbl | Kensan_: communism was not good at all but the openmoko software department should adopt a kind of "ten years plan" which guids them to stable software for the freerunner |
| 16:21.54 | lindi- | bumbl: huh? ;) |
| 16:22.16 | mwester | bumbl: The problem is that Om lacks certain fundamental software engineering disciplines that even the smallest startup usually contracts or hires to get. |
| 16:22.24 | Kensan_ | bumbl: they should start actually paying attention to the community... everything is there but they need to actually move into the right direction. |
| 16:22.36 | bumbl | mwester: yeah that's what i mean |
| 16:22.36 | nyu | the soviet stuff was not communism, only a really poor attempt at it |
| 16:22.55 | nyu | same for cuba and china. you can flame me now ;-P |
| 16:23.02 | mwester | No ten year plan needed, just common sense and someone who has read things like the mythical man-month and other industry texts! Even better if they had someone who actually did basic software management. |
| 16:23.26 | *** join/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu (n=Leachim@78.43.158.223) |
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| 16:24.06 | mwester | is done with complaining for today, and goes to look for some good news... ... somewhere. |
| 16:24.07 | toggles_w | so who wants to port this? http://android.kernel.org/ |
| 16:24.18 | mwester | groans again. |
| 16:24.34 | mwester | toggles_w: what would that fix? |
| 16:24.35 | kd8ikt | heh |
| 16:24.40 | toggles_w | oh, crap.. my windows was stuck |
| 16:24.50 | vinicius | are you hiring or something? |
| 16:25.04 | toggles_w | lol, no, but nice try |
| 16:25.06 | mwester | Ooh! that would be good news. |
| 16:25.07 | kd8ikt | have you seen "airpwn"? |
| 16:25.21 | kd8ikt | or something wait it was "neopwn" |
| 16:25.30 | mwester | I don't even look at projects or web sites that can't spell. |
| 16:25.40 | mwester | Especially the cracking ones. |
| 16:25.41 | kd8ikt | basicly just backtrack compiled for the openmoko |
| 16:26.00 | kd8ikt | and the butthead is charging for it |
| 16:26.15 | bumbl | mwester: hmm penetration testing is nice |
| 16:26.22 | mwester | is "amazed" at just how many people are "Pen testers" these days. |
| 16:26.28 | kd8ikt | heh |
| 16:26.32 | vinicius | I believe they can't do wireless testing because of no raw-mode? |
| 16:26.47 | kd8ikt | yeah just like since 9-11 everyone gets a say about "security" |
| 16:27.05 | mwester | Shouldn't be a single site anywhere that is insecure, since every pimple-faced kid on the streen with a laptop is a fully-qualified professional who is not cracking networks, he's doing pen testing. |
| 16:27.05 | bumbl | i am not a "pen tester" - but i tried to get into my own wlan a while ago |
| 16:27.19 | kd8ikt | that makes you a pen tester |
| 16:27.28 | TAsnn | vinicius, they can, cause they use an external wifi dongle |
| 16:27.29 | kd8ikt | heres your certificate |
| 16:27.32 | mwester | vinicius: they use an external wifi chip |
| 16:27.38 | vinicius | oh |
| 16:27.51 | bumbl | my wlan seems to be save - brute forcing a wpa key >20 characters length takes ages |
| 16:28.03 | kd8ikt | wipes his butt then brandishes the "certificate" |
| 16:28.29 | kd8ikt | my wlan is open ;) hack that :P |
| 16:28.48 | bumbl | kd8ikt: too much law insecurities here |
| 16:28.49 | mwester | Well, I'm an pen-tester-tester -- I test to see if pen-testers can resist my testing with items such as baseball bats. Park outside my house with your laptop or FR... |
| 16:29.05 | bumbl | lol |
| 16:29.39 | kd8ikt | yeah hook up your firealarms to a script that detects changes in the dhclient table |
| 16:30.10 | mwester | Honestly, it's the script kiddies and juviniles like that who give Lunix hackers a bad name in the industry. |
| 16:31.03 | Sup3rkiddo | mwester, hey, i am pimple faced! ;o |
| 16:31.25 | mwester | Do you break into other peoples networks too? |
| 16:31.48 | Sup3rkiddo | mwester, noooo |
| 16:31.57 | mwester | Well, good, then I can talk to you! |
| 16:31.58 | mwester | :) |
| 16:32.02 | *** join/#openmoko everslick (n=clemens@91-113-122-56.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 16:32.33 | *** join/#openmoko ale__ (n=ale@monitor.interfree.it) |
| 16:32.42 | kd8ikt | you know my linksys openwrt router now uses opkg |
| 16:32.47 | Sup3rkiddo | mwester, does innocently stealing neighbours' wifi count? |
| 16:33.10 | mwester | depends on how "innoccent" :p |
| 16:33.22 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84.226.249.245) |
| 16:33.24 | pb__ | "innocently stealing"?! heh. |
| 16:33.24 | mwester | clearly cannot spell. |
| 16:33.30 | kd8ikt | i kinda hate the "rebranding" of ipkg |
| 16:33.39 | *** join/#openmoko fale_ (n=fale@89-96-108-175.ip12.fastwebnet.it) |
| 16:33.44 | *** part/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84.226.249.245) |
| 16:33.44 | *** join/#openmoko vinicius_ (n=vininim@189.26.206.16.adsl.gvt.net.br) |
| 16:33.44 | pb__ | kd8ikt: yah, welcome to the land of trademarks |
| 16:33.46 | mwester | kd8ikt: Yeah, politics in the linux world is alive and well. |
| 16:33.56 | *** join/#openmoko marcels (n=marcel@mstoop.xs4all.nl) |
| 16:34.20 | pb__ | it is a bit of a pain, but you can just symlink opkg to ipkg and forget about it. |
| 16:34.21 | bumbl | mwester: alive? overhealthy |
| 16:34.23 | mwester | What I find sad is that opkg is just as poor as ipkg ever was, and adding certificates only made it worse, not better. |
| 16:34.35 | kd8ikt | but on a lighter side both my phone and openwrt router now use opkg so... a success in a sense being i wanted one inbetween both... just not opkg ;) |
| 16:34.45 | mwester | bumbl: I see your point :) |
| 16:35.04 | pb__ | mwester: that is sad, but not entirely surprising. I think the opkg codebase is still 95% identical to the old ipkg sources. |
| 16:35.09 | kd8ikt | yeah i hate that certificate crap |
| 16:35.54 | bumbl | why the hell are they using ipkg/opkg at all - there are tons of good package managers (even for low res) out there |
| 16:36.13 | lindi- | bumbl: just start using something else? |
| 16:36.14 | kd8ikt | blah blah checksum mismatch.. maybe you should "opkg update"? |
| 16:36.27 | *** join/#openmoko dougt_ (n=dougt@c-69-181-65-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:36.37 | bumbl | lindi-: how? all the repos contain .ipks |
| 16:36.47 | kd8ikt | ugh maybe you should execute the cmd i told you to!? |
| 16:36.49 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@vpne041.ugent.be) |
| 16:36.57 | bumbl | except debian |
| 16:37.06 | bumbl | and debian is too bloated for a phone |
| 16:37.20 | lindi- | bumbl: well create your own? |
| 16:37.37 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 16:37.38 | pb__ | well, it would be easy enough to rebuild the repo for a different package format if necessary. |
| 16:37.42 | pb__ | what package manager would you propose? |
| 16:39.13 | Kensan_ | mwester: well the meaning of hacker has long been lost and beaten to death by the media *sigh* |
| 16:39.35 | mwester | True. Connotations... |
| 16:39.55 | kd8ikt | mwester is a real haX0r |
| 16:40.00 | mwester | But as a community we don't do ourselves any favors; the Linux community could use a good PR agent. |
| 16:40.09 | mwester | And spelling like that has GOT to go! |
| 16:40.11 | mwester | :O |
| 16:41.04 | mwester | What is that, and where did that start, and most importantly, WHY do certain people continue to do that??? "I'm l33t!" <-- No, that's not -- that's just juvinile and foolish! |
| 16:41.09 | Kensan_ | mwester: true... well everybody seems be an expert in FOSS etc. as long as you have installed Openoffice your in! |
| 16:41.12 | Kensan_ | :( |
| 16:41.13 | *** join/#openmoko Zorkman_ (n=zork@78-22-123-127.access.telenet.be) |
| 16:42.20 | Kensan_ | should get back his white-orange Neo1973... |
| 16:42.21 | kd8ikt | on a lighter offtopic note i compiled the latest openwrt svn for my Wrt54GS<linksys> and the b43 driver works! pretty good exccept for all the logs it produces |
| 16:42.36 | mwester | native driver? |
| 16:42.44 | kd8ikt | 2.6 kernel yup |
| 16:42.44 | mwester | or Linksys driver? |
| 16:42.48 | mwester | Ah |
| 16:42.54 | mwester | I had no luck with that at all. |
| 16:43.03 | kd8ikt | broadcom b43 (not the proprietary thingy) |
| 16:43.05 | *** part/#openmoko tschuder (n=tschuder@catv-133-219-static.tbwil.ch) |
| 16:43.45 | *** join/#openmoko esthar (n=esthar@student164-128.hampshire.edu) |
| 16:43.46 | mwester | But since I did pick up a bundle of three Intel wireless cards on eBay for a ridiculous price, I just tossed the broadcom cards in my laptop, and that fixed that part. So I only have the broadcom stuff in my router. |
| 16:43.52 | Kensan_ | have to run. |
| 16:44.08 | mwester | Yeah, me too -- appointment with client in 16 minutes. |
| 16:44.11 | mwester | Best prepare. |
| 16:44.12 | bumbl | lindi-: give me a server with enough bandwith and power - i have time next week |
| 16:44.51 | *** join/#openmoko nicfer (n=redstarl@168.226.104.1) |
| 16:45.52 | nicfer | one question, how good works openmoko installed on a Motorola A1200 phone? |
| 16:46.11 | nicfer | there is a link, but its a about an old version |
| 16:46.28 | bumbl | pb__: apt, pacman, emerge + binhost - all better than opkg |
| 16:47.38 | pb__ | apt should pretty much "just work" with the existing ipk repos, no need to rebuild. |
| 16:47.53 | d-b | bumbl: hardly. opkg is very similar to apt. |
| 16:48.33 | pb__ | but, apt is significantly heavier than opkg. it's basically just a tradeoff between resources and number of bugs, the underlying behaviour is roughly the same in both cases. |
| 16:48.33 | bumbl | d-b: opkg lacks some features apt has |
| 16:48.49 | d-b | bumbl: yes. but if you want debian on your phone. run debian. |
| 16:48.52 | bumbl | at least apt is well documented |
| 16:49.03 | bumbl | d-b: but i don't want debian on my phone |
| 16:49.13 | bumbl | i just want a sane package manager |
| 16:49.21 | d-b | bumbl: that is what debian provides. |
| 16:49.37 | d-b | its not the package manager its how its being used here i think. |
| 16:49.37 | pb__ | well, like I say, if you want to use apt, you should be able to go ahead and do that right away. |
| 16:49.54 | pb__ | even the status file formats are basically the same so you should be able to have apt inherit your current opkg status. |
| 16:50.12 | esthar | How should I wake my FR up? If I don't use it for a while it seems like it turns off and the screen and aux button do nothing. |
| 16:50.19 | esthar | It's plugged into the wall so I know it has power. |
| 16:50.49 | d-b | esthar: hope it turns on otherwise you will need to find an old nokia / other battery / method to kick start it. |
| 16:51.11 | esthar | d-b: well the power button works |
| 16:51.20 | esthar | It's just that I have to shut it off |
| 16:51.26 | esthar | then restart from scratch |
| 16:51.33 | esthar | I left it on, overnight, plugged into the wall for power |
| 16:51.44 | d-b | mmm. om2008 ? |
| 16:51.46 | pb__ | bumbl: if you wanted to use pacman then that should be pretty straightforward too, you'd just need to rebuild the repositories in the right format. |
| 16:51.46 | esthar | then in the morning it's off or in a state where I need to boot it up from scratch again |
| 16:51.49 | esthar | FDOM |
| 16:51.53 | d-b | no idea. |
| 16:51.55 | esthar | so 2008.9 kernel |
| 16:52.23 | d-b | i assume its the power button. |
| 16:52.31 | d-b | for a short period of time. |
| 16:52.56 | lindi- | bumbl: sounds like bloat, i can develop debian without that :) |
| 16:54.44 | d-b | debian has nearly all the software you want ever. just not made for the phone format really so its not ideal in some respects. in others its fine. |
| 16:55.27 | d-b | there is no point in making a wide repo of sources if there are already some out there in a perfectly working order with a sane package manager as you put it. |
| 16:55.34 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-75-74.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 16:56.28 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@unixboard/users/neldoreth) |
| 16:56.39 | bumbl | debian lacks e and illume - debian lacks daily builds - but debian on the freerunner is extremly interesting |
| 16:56.53 | bumbl | if you use the neo as a pda |
| 16:57.32 | d-b | esthar: um lacks e ? yes and no. e17 ? (it has real e). illume yes it lacks daily builds lacks. makes phone calls tick sms tick address book tick. voip tick. |
| 16:59.51 | d-b | lindi-: however, my alsa settings are now for voip and so the echo is crazy :) |
| 17:01.37 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-035.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 17:01.44 | *** part/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-035.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 17:05.46 | *** join/#openmoko dougt_ (n=dougt@c-69-181-65-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 17:06.24 | kd8ikt | osip? |
| 17:07.49 | nyu | how do you launch apps in debian/freerunner ? |
| 17:08.32 | d-b | nyu: um. via xfce i guess / other means. |
| 17:08.52 | nyu | you just install xfce and that's it? |
| 17:09.29 | *** join/#openmoko noaXess (n=noaXess@gw.ptr-80-238-209-47.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 17:10.24 | *** join/#openmoko Kero (n=kero@i66203.upc-i.chello.nl) |
| 17:12.09 | ezekiel-v3 | nyu: you would launch apps in debian/freerunner the same way you would launch apps in a typical debian installation on a desktop system |
| 17:12.26 | ezekiel-v3 | you use a desktop environment with menus, or you use a terminal, etc |
| 17:14.51 | *** join/#openmoko TeLLuS_ (n=Johan@179.108.227.87.static.f.siw.siwnet.net) |
| 17:15.46 | *** join/#openmoko niki (n=niki@0x5553169c.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 17:16.40 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey-t (n=emonkey@84-74-83-242.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 17:17.49 | *** join/#openmoko rmblr (n=rmblr@whit01.sec.vt.edu) |
| 17:18.38 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host81-159-3-252.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:19.21 | rmblr | i know it's early, but has anyone started trying to get android running on the freerunner? |
| 17:19.37 | *** join/#openmoko Blastur (n=kebab@kr-lun-168-149-233-83.3.cust.bredband2.com) |
| 17:20.08 | *** join/#openmoko jopk (n=chatzill@p5B166B94.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:20.13 | Zorkman_ | bumbl said kooly was on it |
| 17:20.16 | Zorkman_ | *kooly |
| 17:20.20 | Zorkman_ | *koolu |
| 17:22.48 | *** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=RedFlash@82.60.40.33) |
| 17:23.35 | *** join/#openmoko Wiedi (n=wiedi@2a01:30:90ae:6:217:f2ff:fe51:7099) |
| 17:23.36 | *** join/#openmoko dougt_ (n=dougt@c-69-181-65-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 17:24.24 | bumbl | rmblr: koolu will ship their freerunners with android in november |
| 17:27.03 | *** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:27.24 | rmblr | bumbl: i'd like to get it running myself before then... does anyone know how much porting has to be done? |
| 17:27.35 | nyu | ezekiel-v3: which desktop envs are well suited to the 480x640 constraint? |
| 17:27.38 | bumbl | rmblr: kernel |
| 17:27.41 | rmblr | will koolu be releasing their source changes back to google? |
| 17:27.51 | rmblr | bumbl: just drivers though, right? |
| 17:27.58 | bumbl | yes |
| 17:28.12 | bumbl | android kernel + om drivers i think |
| 17:28.15 | nicfer | other question, is android really free? |
| 17:28.21 | bumbl | the rest of the sources was released today |
| 17:28.44 | bumbl | nicfer: android is gpl (kernel) and apache (rest) |
| 17:29.43 | d-b | bumbl: yes but will it run at a decent speed. |
| 17:29.54 | *** join/#openmoko tomer (n=tomer@89-138-68-196.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 17:30.02 | bumbl | d-b: don't ask me - ask koolu |
| 17:30.14 | bumbl | armv4 vs. armv5 |
| 17:30.17 | d-b | bumbl: i just think the answer is going to be no. |
| 17:30.20 | rmblr | bumbl: do you think koolu will release their kernel patches before they start selling the freerunner's w/ android? |
| 17:30.25 | nicfer | I've heard that google were doing some nasty moves like being able to uninstall your apps remotely |
| 17:30.39 | d-b | nicfer: only to their only apps. |
| 17:30.39 | bumbl | rmblr: i don't know |
| 17:30.51 | *** join/#openmoko epictetus (n=pattm@static-71-174-73-53.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:31.01 | epictetus | http://www.efactusa.com http://www.greatestate.com http://www.cyberoppression.org http://www.westonmass.net |
| 17:31.08 | d-b | spam |
| 17:31.08 | ezekiel-v3 | nyu: xfce is one of them |
| 17:31.09 | epictetus | I'm all about the symbian |
| 17:31.15 | *** part/#openmoko epictetus (n=pattm@static-71-174-73-53.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:31.52 | nicfer | hmmm, how's that? Only apps developed by google? |
| 17:32.54 | *** join/#openmoko dougt_ (n=dougt@c-69-181-65-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 17:32.56 | toggles_w | it would only be devices running their core, give me the ability to reflash the device i remove the remote hooks |
| 17:33.50 | Dave | TOGGLES |
| 17:34.01 | toggles_w | Dave: !! |
| 17:34.14 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@94.36.121.222) |
| 17:34.24 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 17:34.32 | *** join/#openmoko Ainulindale (n=ainu@calaquendi.org) |
| 17:34.46 | phobie | Which mobile phones have the same displaysize as the FR? |
| 17:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko ab0oo (n=johng@c-71-56-43-121.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 17:35.19 | zash | phobie: VGA or 2.8" ? |
| 17:35.38 | phobie | size not resultion |
| 17:36.08 | phobie | (for display protection) |
| 17:36.34 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.84-48-212.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:37.02 | phobie | 43mm x 58mm |
| 17:37.22 | phobie | 2,8" could also mean something else |
| 17:37.31 | nicfer | I'll wait until expandible phones before I change mine |
| 17:37.44 | toggles_w | phobie: i went to screenguardz and had them cut 44x58 and it's slightly small |
| 17:38.04 | Kensan | rmblr: you could ask bricode about android port. |
| 17:38.07 | ab0oo | any uber-hackers willing to take on the porting duties? http://source.android.com/posts/opensource |
| 17:38.19 | ab0oo | beat me to it.. |
| 17:38.52 | Kensan | jebus, this is probably going to get worse. I can hear mwester scream inside *hehe* |
| 17:39.53 | rmblr | Kensan: bricode is involved with koolu? |
| 17:39.58 | Kensan | rmblr: yes. |
| 17:39.59 | ab0oo | I think it's slightly ingenuous of google to hold it closed source until the Tmobile phone hit the market, then say "olly-olly oxenfree" and start asking for people to develop apps |
| 17:40.08 | bricode | For the record, Koolu will be releasing the kernel source (and perhaps integrating it into the OM tree) as well as pushing fixes back to Google. |
| 17:40.23 | Dave | cthulhu? |
| 17:40.44 | ab0oo | ingenuous, disingenious, same same |
| 17:40.56 | rmblr | bricode: will the kernel patches be released before koolu starts selling androidized freerunners? |
| 17:40.56 | Dave | toggles - screenguardz? is that what they sell on the street now? |
| 17:40.57 | *** join/#openmoko foQ_ (n=fo_Q@85.124.101.75) |
| 17:41.13 | bricode | rmblr: That's a requirement, yes. |
| 17:41.18 | Dave | BRIAN |
| 17:41.26 | bricode | I'm in the process of setting up a public git with the patched OM kernel. |
| 17:41.39 | rmblr | awesome |
| 17:41.41 | Dave | Oh, are we talking about Android here? |
| 17:41.44 | bricode | Dave: DAVE! My time has come... |
| 17:42.00 | Dave | We wish... |
| 17:42.10 | toggles_w | Dave: http://screenguardz.com |
| 17:42.16 | rmblr | wonders how easy it will be to walk into a provider's store and get a sim card for his freerunner |
| 17:43.16 | cjb_ie | rmblr: most countries it's the norm to be able to buy a sim card from any cellco |
| 17:44.27 | ab0oo | rmblr: easy as pie, unless you live in the UK and need a passport and a DNA sample |
| 17:44.27 | Dave | toggles, is that like warez? |
| 17:44.27 | rmblr | is in the usa |
| 17:44.27 | toggles_w | no, i just like printing it so mwester screams |
| 17:44.27 | Dave | yeah sim cards are essentially hax in the us |
| 17:44.27 | toggles_w | actually they were fairly cheap and decent covers |
| 17:44.28 | *** join/#openmoko weiles (i=christia@HSI-KBW-091-089-050-172.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 17:44.28 | weiles | hi |
| 17:44.28 | Dave | Hallo Germany |
| 17:44.28 | weiles | as i have seen with the freerunner you use a comparatively cheap wolfson codec |
| 17:44.48 | weiles | now you have disassembled the iphone 3g and have found that the audio codec costs 2$ there |
| 17:45.44 | weiles | maybe you could try to get the audio quality of the gta03 as good as the iphone/ipod/cowon please! |
| 17:45.56 | Dave | heh |
| 17:46.29 | Dave | it'd probably be great quality (potentially), but we couldn't hear them because the audio was set too low, and they would still not be able to hear us because of echo and/or lack of microphone gain. |
| 17:46.33 | Dave | laughs |
| 17:46.58 | weiles | i definetly would like to get rid of all the fluctuant and expensive toys (not want to buy another mp3 player) |
| 17:47.04 | *** join/#openmoko zouzou (n=zouzou@unaffiliated/zouzou) |
| 17:47.09 | nicfer | try to get an audio codec with vorbis en/decoding capabilities |
| 17:47.13 | weiles | Dave, you mean the iphone chip is not working in openmoko? |
| 17:47.25 | Dave | I'm knocking the freerunner for known issues. |
| 17:47.36 | weiles | nicfer, i guess the phone has the power to decode in cpu hasn't it? |
| 17:47.41 | Dave | and how they'll never go away, because freerunner (OM) development is hilarious. |
| 17:47.55 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g227068248.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:47.56 | bumbl | weiles: yes but not the battery |
| 17:47.59 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@xsftbnupc02.upc.es) |
| 17:48.15 | Dave | sicu, I challenge you to more openmoocow! |
| 17:48.26 | nicfer | hmm ok |
| 17:48.27 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r8ceac3fe112d 10/fsod/ (README autogen.sh configure.ac vapi/fsod.vapi): Cleanup autogen.sh and check for python in configure script |
| 17:48.28 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r794393e44598 10/fsod/m4/python.m4: Add python.m4 |
| 17:48.56 | weiles | maybe but a bit of audiophile enthusiasm could give the phone a broader range and make it much more a replacement for all those guys investing a few hundred bucks only for a decent mp3 player+touch screen |
| 17:49.32 | nicfer | and is the FR's CPU capable of decoding theora video? |
| 17:49.39 | Dave | true, true |
| 17:49.40 | mwester | The problem with the audio quality on the Freerunner is about USD 0.05 worth of capacitor and resistor. |
| 17:49.43 | Dave | we need a media player app too |
| 17:49.50 | Dave | mwester, haha :D |
| 17:50.01 | Dave | Also, it's been how many years? and we still have ... what? |
| 17:50.31 | weiles | now since you can really measure the quality of the audio output and you have all that equipment in your labs you could spend some time into get this rocking which would give the phone a great value |
| 17:50.44 | weiles | mwester, but it shows that nobody cared during development |
| 17:50.49 | vinicius_ | I don't have a lab yet |
| 17:50.49 | mwester | Yeah, Jeorg identified the bad component values almost a year ago or so, I think? But nobody in Om's manufacturing ever changed the parts. |
| 17:50.57 | Dave | Right |
| 17:51.15 | Dave | Makes me want to strangle someone, when issues like this are reiterated. |
| 17:51.27 | weiles | and the iphone is not so much about phoning but about great multimedia capabilities and it is almost an ipod touch |
| 17:51.34 | weiles | so this is important not only to me |
| 17:51.46 | weiles | Dave, me too :( |
| 17:52.00 | mwester | The funny/sad part, Dave, is all the folks who seem to think that Android on the FR will somehow fix all this. |
| 17:52.06 | Dave | I think I'll plan a trip to taiwan and Joerg and I will produce our own spinoff model. |
| 17:52.11 | Dave | Mwester - hahaha |
| 17:52.14 | Dave | I scoff at them! |
| 17:52.15 | mwester | "Android installer: Detecting Freerunner." |
| 17:52.16 | weiles | i am now stuck with my e61 and don't want to spend that much money for the freerunner although the e61 is horrible with its audio quality |
| 17:52.28 | weiles | and an mp3 player costs another 70-100⬠|
| 17:52.43 | mwester | "Android Installer: Unsoldering bad chips and replacing them (please place phone on a non-flammable surface, and press any key to continue..." |
| 17:52.58 | Dave | :D |
| 17:53.04 | weiles | ^^ |
| 17:53.13 | Dave | basically |
| 17:53.13 | vinicius_ | an spinoff of FreeRunner would sure help more than irc bashing |
| 17:53.17 | vinicius_ | *a |
| 17:53.35 | weiles | vinicius_, why is a spinoff necessary to get a 2$ part right? |
| 17:53.45 | weiles | and a spinoff wouldn't help with the software either |
| 17:54.04 | vinicius_ | chatting will not do that either |
| 17:54.24 | mwester | vinicius_: So what do you suggest? Talking to Om doesn't seem to work. |
| 17:54.24 | weiles | vinicius_, i'll spend the money to buy a device, this should be enough |
| 17:54.26 | Dave | weiles, because it's not just that! |
| 17:54.31 | Dave | Mwester, indeed! |
| 17:55.19 | vinicius_ | I suggest a more engineering approach to it |
| 17:55.29 | weiles | and i might think about porting some apps i need over to it, but you cannot expect to get a diploma in electro technics just because you want the audio chip fixed |
| 17:55.35 | mwester | vinicius_: please elaborate? |
| 17:55.35 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.84-48-212.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:55.43 | bumbl | weiles: i personally hate it using the phone as mp3 player |
| 17:55.47 | Dave | I suggest voting the current OM team designers off the island. |
| 17:55.56 | bumbl | i have my cowon flac player and am happy with it |
| 17:56.03 | bumbl | a phone is for phoning and gps |
| 17:56.10 | mattl | anyone ported android to the openmoko yet? |
| 17:56.15 | Dave | mattl - haha |
| 17:56.22 | Dave | rolls his eyes at mattl |
| 17:56.26 | mattl | come on! it's been like... 4 hours! |
| 17:56.28 | weiles | bumbl if you compare the hardware you have 95 double the hardware and double the price |
| 17:56.28 | mwester | mattl: yes -- see the log messages from the installer that I posted a few lines above. |
| 17:56.32 | Dave | haha |
| 17:56.40 | Dave | smirks at mwester |
| 17:56.48 | vinicius_ | evaluate options, gather resource and implement the solution |
| 17:56.49 | mattl | mwester: i'll get my soldering gun now. |
| 17:56.56 | mwester | As soon as my phone cools down, I'll power it up and see if the new GSM chip works. |
| 17:57.13 | Dave | Mwester ;D |
| 17:57.17 | weiles | bumbl, phone is only an oldschool name |
| 17:57.24 | Dave | vinicius - yes! |
| 17:57.24 | *** join/#openmoko niki (n=niki@0x5553169c.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 17:57.31 | vinicius_ | If talking to OM doesn't help, why babbling on irc would? |
| 17:57.34 | Dave | weiles - what do you want, smartphone? |
| 17:57.37 | weiles | call it portable multimedia device and you are ok with all the stuff the iphone does |
| 17:57.48 | Dave | Vinicius, we can form our own group and make it cooler than theirs! |
| 17:57.52 | Dave | nyah! :P |
| 17:57.54 | weiles | Dave, play *.mp3, *.ogg *flac |
| 17:57.58 | Dave | wiles, I think that's somewhat blasphemous |
| 17:58.10 | bumbl | weiles: might be oldschool but it's british english |
| 17:58.10 | weiles | Dave, why? |
| 17:58.11 | mwester | vinicius_: You're right. We should all say nothing then, and go away with our non-functioning phones, and leave you on the channel to talk to yourself. |
| 17:58.13 | vinicius_ | Dave: I hope you have some chinese proverb to sell =P |
| 17:58.14 | Dave | I would not consider any of the devices out there presently that are also phones to be multimedia devices |
| 17:58.28 | Dave | Vinicius, why, in fact I do :D |
| 17:58.31 | vinicius_ | mwester: sounds like an idea! just kidding ;) |
| 17:58.39 | bumbl | has gsm chip == phone |
| 17:58.47 | Dave | non-functional gsm chip? |
| 17:58.48 | *** join/#openmoko samgee (n=samgee@105.170-240-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 17:58.51 | Dave | then what does it make it? |
| 17:58.53 | mwester | vinicius_: I don't think you know the history with Om. |
| 17:58.54 | weiles | bumbl, i just want to point out that the minimalistic functionalistic approach being tight to a name is something one can rethink in respect to current hardware capabilities |
| 17:58.55 | Dave | a piece of crap? |
| 17:59.00 | Dave | a signal jammer? :D |
| 17:59.09 | Dave | it's already proven to be someone useful in that sense. |
| 17:59.12 | bumbl | Dave: non-functional gsm chip == freerunner |
| 17:59.17 | Dave | an em-distorter |
| 17:59.18 | Soulnoob | The gps thingies work nice |
| 17:59.18 | Dave | haha |
| 17:59.21 | Dave | hot |
| 17:59.23 | Soulnoob | oh,lol |
| 17:59.28 | *** join/#openmoko Ramblurr (n=rmblr@amarok/developer/Ramblurr) |
| 17:59.29 | *** join/#openmoko lloyd_fedora (n=darkstar@86.99.34.14) |
| 17:59.39 | vinicius_ | mwester: I'll possibly get grumpy in 2 days (after paying customs and getting my freerunner), just wait and I might join you guys =D |
| 17:59.54 | Dave | Vinicius: one of us, ONE OF US!! |
| 17:59.54 | mwester | Ah, understand then. |
| 17:59.58 | Dave | chants |
| 18:00.07 | weiles | Dave why is this blasphemous? |
| 18:00.08 | mwester | vinicius_ -- good luck. |
| 18:00.30 | Dave | because I don't believe you could in any way call MOST smartphones multimedia devices |
| 18:00.41 | Dave | since they barely function at those features (if they even support them) |
| 18:00.54 | Dave | but that's a rant/sermon for another time :] :p |
| 18:01.09 | Dave | eyes mwester |
| 18:01.10 | *** join/#openmoko micm_ (n=micm@p50871791.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:01.15 | bumbl | and: |
| 18:01.18 | weiles | i am really happy with foss software on all of my computers but i have to spend a hell lot of money to get some good mobile devices just to get recent applications/software flexibility and sound quality |
| 18:01.26 | Dave | Will you be writing another entry for your "website" soon, MWester? :) |
| 18:01.47 | vinicius_ | It's just that I don't think complaining in irc will solve it. Unless you create a competitor company and do bad PR to sell more of your devices, but I don't see you guys with a company. =P |
| 18:01.50 | weiles | Dave, well i'd like to have a good sound chip in the freerunner so it has the value of spending a few hundred bucks for me |
| 18:01.57 | bumbl | if not support_flac/ogg == true: fail |
| 18:01.59 | Dave | weiles, mobile anything sucks, big time. and it's unlikely to ever change any time soon. especially in the US |
| 18:02.09 | zouzou | after reading all of your comments about FR, i guess i am staying away for now |
| 18:02.14 | Dave | where they providers enjoy tentacle raping all their customers. |
| 18:02.15 | bumbl | not a multimedia device |
| 18:02.27 | weiles | vinicius_, than in what aspect is openmoko more open the process you describe, the commercial one? |
| 18:02.27 | *** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor) |
| 18:02.28 | Dave | bumble, use the ternary operator! |
| 18:02.41 | Dave | Weiles, I totally agree with your original statement. |
| 18:03.15 | bumbl | openpandora + dvi would be perfect |
| 18:03.21 | Dave | and honestly, the freerunner is a better multimedia device than most. it's funny because the sad part is that my tinier cellphone from 3 years earlier has better video playback :p |
| 18:03.31 | Dave | but blame the glamo on that, I suppose. and lack of drivers |
| 18:03.33 | *** join/#openmoko ayeuu (n=ayeuu@AOrleans-151-1-63-167.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 18:03.43 | Dave | bumble, woohoo |
| 18:03.50 | vinicius_ | weiles: I don't see other cellphones companies giving insight into parts/process/etc. |
| 18:03.56 | weiles | Dave, thx |
| 18:04.21 | weiles | vinicius_, yes but insight only makes sense if their is way to give feedback |
| 18:04.22 | zouzou | I believe OM should use the apple approach for development until they get a solid device |
| 18:04.25 | Dave | the freerunner makes a decent image device, since it's got a great screen |
| 18:04.36 | Dave | that's about it... in the multimedia department :P |
| 18:04.37 | vinicius_ | weiles: there is some, but you have compromises |
| 18:04.42 | weiles | vinicius_, for software it is foss, but for hardware there is not much more an average tech guy can do than comment |
| 18:04.49 | vinicius_ | what the hell, I'm not going to defend OM without having inside info |
| 18:05.11 | vinicius_ | but it's the best you can get, unless someone creates a more open company |
| 18:05.14 | mwester | vinicius_: neither do we see any other product manufacturer drop support for a product before it ever works as it was originally designed (Neo), and continue to ignore the obvious fatal flaws with the replacement device (FR). |
| 18:05.17 | Soulnoob | Dave: What's multi about that. :) |
| 18:05.19 | Soulnoob | ? |
| 18:05.37 | weiles | vinicius_, well symbian is stable, i wouldn't run linux/openbsd if they would be unstable and unable to do tcp |
| 18:05.55 | vinicius_ | weiles: best in the open sense =P |
| 18:05.58 | bumbl | anyway: why doesn't openmoko use the same cpu as the openpandora |
| 18:06.00 | nicfer | GTA03's camera should be on front side, so it can be used also as a webcam if an high speed connection is available (currently only wifi) |
| 18:06.07 | bumbl | it's quite powerful |
| 18:06.17 | weiles | vinicius_, sure and i hope gta03 + good software gets better |
| 18:06.23 | zash | gta03, when? |
| 18:06.35 | weiles | but for that i personally (and most likely many others) would like to have good sound quality |
| 18:06.35 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-092-154.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 18:06.42 | PBeck | ahoi |
| 18:06.46 | vinicius_ | I hope gta03 takes a lot more to release |
| 18:06.59 | vinicius_ | because gta02 will possibly have the same fate of gta01 =P |
| 18:07.07 | zash | should i buy gta02 now or wait for gta03 and be bored? |
| 18:07.28 | zouzou | that would depend when gta03 will be released? |
| 18:07.30 | mwester | I hope they test the basic parts of the gta03 before they sell it, but even so what we already know about it, it has one major flaw already designed in (the same broken PMU chip as the GTA02) |
| 18:07.39 | bumbl | i hope gta02 does not die like 01 |
| 18:07.41 | weiles | zash, no idea, but if it does not get better then i will not buy it either, really not |
| 18:07.56 | *** join/#openmoko LuYu (n=whatever@118-168-235-253.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 18:08.04 | viq | GTA03 should be ready by christmas. Maybe '09, maybe '10 ;) |
| 18:08.17 | zouzou | hehe, that's nice |
| 18:08.34 | zouzou | maybe 09 or 10, but definitely by christmaz |
| 18:08.41 | mwester | Yeah, right. |
| 18:08.59 | weiles | i can even live with not having hdspa although it would be really amazing, but getting no sound and having to buy another mp3 player + carrying it is stupid for me |
| 18:09.04 | *** join/#openmoko drath (n=vmaster@p5B07F41D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:09.11 | mwester | :D And originally, the Om software stack and the GTA02 were going to be ready for the average consumer by Christmas of 2007 |
| 18:09.16 | CVirus | I heard they're bundling GTA03 with Duke Nukem Forever |
| 18:09.17 | *** join/#openmoko tdobson (n=a_lead_f@dobsad.plus.com) |
| 18:09.20 | mwester | hehe |
| 18:09.31 | bumbl | CVirus: yeah and they switched to gnu hurd |
| 18:09.36 | weiles | well ok now i have yelled enough hopefully the future brings better openmoko products |
| 18:09.49 | mwester | weiles: I hope so too. |
| 18:09.58 | CVirus | LOL |
| 18:10.04 | zogg_ | CVirus, that could be entry line of OM marketing ;) |
| 18:10.20 | mwester | Because they can't possibly survive if they continue to manufacture devices that cannot register with the cellular phone network. |
| 18:10.21 | zouzou | bumbl: what do you mean by gnu herd? they still have qtopia, no? |
| 18:10.34 | *** join/#openmoko Zero_Dogg (n=zerodogg@mandriva/developer/Zero-Dogg) |
| 18:10.46 | bumbl | zouzou: is that question serious? |
| 18:10.52 | zouzou | yes |
| 18:11.04 | Zero_Dogg | Is it possible to use the 2007 multitap pad on 2008.8? |
| 18:11.26 | Dave | nicfer: SWIVEL! (re: camera) |
| 18:11.32 | bumbl | gnu hurd = microkernel = alternative to linux kernel = is always said to get usable/released next year |
| 18:11.36 | weiles | maybe now that nokia will release symbian under epl and deliver qt on top of it this will raise the pressure |
| 18:11.39 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g227068248.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:11.44 | Dave | Man, I fear the gta03 will be vaporware |
| 18:11.46 | bumbl | zouzou: yes they use qtopia at the moment |
| 18:11.57 | Dave | Also, I hope there is a regime change before that happens. |
| 18:12.05 | bumbl | they will switch to freesmartphone.org and tichy + paroli |
| 18:12.45 | mwester | bumbl: They've tried every other software stack so far. I wonder when they will figure out that it's not JUST the software that's the problem, maybe they should fix the hardware or the kernel instead. |
| 18:12.46 | zouzou | bumbl: is that a bad thing? i mean switching to freesmartphone.org? |
| 18:12.48 | vinicius_ | Dave: don't think so, OM company only makes profit from selling devices so far, iiuc |
| 18:12.55 | bumbl | zouzou: not at all |
| 18:12.55 | weiles | by the way is gsm now working reliably on fr? does the phone still crash or is telephony safe? |
| 18:13.06 | Dave | they suck |
| 18:13.21 | weiles | Dave, :-( |
| 18:13.22 | mwester | weiles: No, telephony is still broken for many people, for unknown root causes. |
| 18:13.23 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-035.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 18:13.39 | Dave | mwester - indeed |
| 18:13.45 | *** part/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-035.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 18:13.47 | zouzou | mwester: that's scary |
| 18:13.50 | Dave | mwester - likely too many root causes ~_~ |
| 18:14.02 | Dave | or rather, more than one. |
| 18:14.27 | weiles | i am really wonderung what the true target of openmoko is. it looks a bit more like an industry platform project than targetting end users, using foss enthusiasts only as beta testers who spend a lot of money |
| 18:14.30 | Dave | It'd be funny if for the gta03 specs, they just selected all new hardware (without any consideration for previous experiences) |
| 18:14.33 | Dave | that'd be rich. |
| 18:14.43 | mwester | One and a half years after the first problems (bug 666) were reported, and at least a year since the first reports of the bouncing problem (1024), FINALLY this week, Openmoko announces, with great fanfare, that they have assigned/contracted with someone to TRY to fix it. |
| 18:15.05 | Dave | hahaha |
| 18:15.18 | vinicius_ | weiles: GTA01 and GTA02 were target at developers |
| 18:15.19 | Wonka | hell yeah! |
| 18:15.20 | Dave | Mwester, I bet after hearing that, we had the same look on our faces. |
| 18:15.25 | vinicius_ | *wered |
| 18:15.30 | vinicius_ | err *targeted |
| 18:15.31 | mwester | vinicius_: GTA02 was targeted to end consumeres. |
| 18:15.42 | vinicius_ | mwester: lol no |
| 18:15.44 | mwester | it changed when it became apparent that the GTA02 was broken. |
| 18:15.45 | bumbl | vinicius_: at first gta02 was targeted at developers and patient massmarket users |
| 18:16.00 | Dave | I believe that patient is an understatement there. |
| 18:16.12 | weiles | Dave lol |
| 18:16.17 | mwester | vinicius_: Source for your information? (historical source, current web sites have all be "re-marketed") |
| 18:16.40 | vinicius_ | exactly? |
| 18:17.04 | nicfer | would be too hard to add a directional pad and two buttons to the next freerunner so they could be used for games? |
| 18:17.16 | Dave | If they end up using the same stupid fucking case design for the next hardware revision, I'm just going to throw my freerunners out and move into another field. |
| 18:17.28 | mwester | Nah, I'm not going to argue with you any more vinicius_ -- you want to believe something that isn't the case. |
| 18:17.30 | weiles | ok thx guys i'll have a look in a year or so, maybe sth. has dramatically changed by then, but i don't think so... |
| 18:17.38 | *** join/#openmoko ccube (n=ccube@ssh.ccube.de) |
| 18:17.55 | Dave | weiles, I wise decision. |
| 18:18.00 | *** join/#openmoko andrenarchy (n=andrenar@dslb-088-065-107-031.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:18.09 | *** join/#openmoko cheesy (n=cheesy30@mnch-5d85a591.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 18:18.29 | vinicius_ | mwester: I don't? |
| 18:18.43 | vinicius_ | I bought from koolu, and I knew it was for development |
| 18:18.58 | nicfer | also, the next revision should use two TRS connectors, one for audio output and one for mic in |
| 18:19.08 | *** join/#openmoko vallor_ (i=scott@eva.wba.ponzo.net) |
| 18:19.12 | vinicius_ | I've been following the ml, planet and wiki since GTA01 |
| 18:19.42 | nicfer | as you are going to use 3.5" TRS instead of 2.5" ones |
| 18:19.51 | *** part/#openmoko weiles (i=christia@HSI-KBW-091-089-050-172.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 18:20.16 | *** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor) |
| 18:20.27 | vinicius_ | GTA02 had a developer phase followed by a mass-market phase |
| 18:20.33 | Dave | ahaha nicfer |
| 18:20.38 | mwester | vinicius_: If that's the case, then you know that when the GTA01 began shipping, the GTA02 and the software stack were described by Om as being targeted for end consumers. |
| 18:21.15 | vinicius_ | mwester: it doesn't matter as long as what happened before GTA02 beginning shipping |
| 18:21.18 | mwester | But it matters not, what matters is that Om has ignored the GSM problems |
| 18:21.27 | vinicius_ | it got changed BEFORE it started shipping |
| 18:21.33 | Dave | Do or do not, there is no try. |
| 18:21.39 | vinicius_ | schedulles got rearranged, but in nowhere they said it was mass-market |
| 18:21.44 | mwester | and that Om has assigned developers to work on the GTA03 and ignored the WSoD problem on the GTA02 |
| 18:21.45 | Dave | Yoda > OM |
| 18:21.52 | Blastur | WSoD? |
| 18:21.55 | Dave | Mwester, that's so stupid. |
| 18:22.02 | Dave | How can they be so fucking ignorant? |
| 18:22.02 | nyu | anyone got tangogps working on debian? |
| 18:22.04 | vinicius_ | it's possible that there won't even be a mass-market for GTA02, but anyone who bought GTA02 should know it from official channels |
| 18:22.14 | Dave | Watch as the first gen 03's have WSOD :D |
| 18:22.17 | mwester | vinicius_: What are you on about? |
| 18:22.22 | Dave | that'd be classic |
| 18:22.29 | Dave | mwester: s/about// |
| 18:22.42 | lindi- | nyu: works here |
| 18:22.46 | nyu | or got any idea where to debug lack of gps input? what are the primitives accessed by the app? |
| 18:22.54 | lindi- | nyu: but your question is really hard to see in this channel |
| 18:23.05 | nyu | lindi-: why? |
| 18:23.07 | lindi- | nyu: strace |
| 18:23.08 | vinicius_ | well, the "remarketed" thing made it sound like GTA02 was sold as a ready phone. |
| 18:23.12 | nyu | lindi-: or you mean unusual |
| 18:23.25 | lindi- | nyu: you'll see that it has been patched to use gupsy dbus interface |
| 18:23.41 | lindi- | nyu: ignore previous line |
| 18:23.47 | mwester | keeps silent, because he doesn't want to bother lindi- in any way. |
| 18:23.50 | lindi- | nyu: you'll see that it tries to use tcp to talk to gsmd |
| 18:23.53 | nyu | lindi-: which one? ;-) |
| 18:24.02 | mwester | Shhhhhh everyone. |
| 18:24.03 | lindi- | nyu: apt-get install fso-gpsd? |
| 18:24.11 | nyu | lindi-: yeah, got that one running |
| 18:24.19 | lindi- | nyu: does it work via netcat? |
| 18:24.21 | nyu | I followed the instructions in the wiki |
| 18:24.33 | *** join/#openmoko mrmoku (n=mok@ppp-88-217-60-153.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 18:24.34 | nyu | netcat to gpsd's port, and then what do I send? |
| 18:24.42 | lindi- | nyu: send "rw\r\n" |
| 18:25.02 | nyu | echo rw | todos ? |
| 18:25.08 | Dave | hah |
| 18:25.29 | nyu | wonders how did Microsoft get its tentacles into this |
| 18:26.32 | Dave | microsoft!? |
| 18:26.37 | Dave | Where did they come from? |
| 18:26.51 | Dave | mwester :P |
| 18:27.54 | lindi- | nyu: echo rw | netcat localhost $port_of_gpsd |
| 18:28.47 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.84-48-212.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:29.06 | Dave | 2947 |
| 18:30.28 | *** join/#openmoko mangr (n=manu@AGrenoble-257-1-82-166.w86-219.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 18:34.26 | nyu | yeah, I get a lot of weird output |
| 18:34.45 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@93-138-25-222.adsl.net.t-com.hr) |
| 18:34.48 | nyu | but when I click on the map icon, I get "N/A" in each field |
| 18:34.57 | nyu | and tangogps doesn't do anything "GPSish" |
| 18:35.27 | Dave | heh |
| 18:35.40 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey-t (n=emonkey@static-pro-212-101-27-121.adsl.solnet.ch) |
| 18:35.44 | nyu | i.e. won't tell me where am i |
| 18:35.47 | nyu | just displays maps |
| 18:36.00 | nyu | which is nice as a "google maps in your pocket" anyway ;-) |
| 18:37.37 | nyu | stdout just reads: |
| 18:37.38 | nyu | ** cb_gps_timer() |
| 18:37.42 | nyu | every second or so |
| 18:38.14 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@nat/redhat/x-f64adc9e90dee8c9) |
| 18:41.55 | alphaone | nyu: There are some issues with the warm start code, specifically if you send ephemeris it sometimes seems to take several minutes for a first fix |
| 18:42.26 | alphaone | I worked around this by not sending ephemeris data on startup any more. |
| 18:42.47 | alphaone | Commit is from today so you might not have got it yet |
| 18:42.48 | nyu | alphaone: you mean after several minutes of running tangogps it'll work? |
| 18:42.49 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl_ (n=bumbl@212-183-117-119.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 18:43.06 | alphaone | nyu: If you are suffering from this problem, yeah |
| 18:43.07 | nyu | alphaone: ah, nice. which repo? |
| 18:43.34 | alphaone | nyu: You're using debian on a freerunner? |
| 18:43.37 | nyu | yes |
| 18:43.40 | alphaone | hmm |
| 18:43.46 | nyu | the source will do though |
| 18:43.48 | alphaone | I have OE feeds |
| 18:43.51 | nyu | I have a build env |
| 18:44.12 | alphaone | http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=framework.git;a=tree;f=framework/subsystems/ogpsd;h=4c9eb94d57727dd816a4d0daceb258cdd3ce028d;hb=fcf5855bfa6b71515f841dad007e86a2015e11af |
| 18:44.26 | alphaone | copy over the om.py and ubx.py |
| 18:44.57 | alphaone | you could even just copy them to your device |
| 18:45.00 | nyu | or I could apply http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=framework.git;a=commitdiff_plain;h=fcf5855bfa6b71515f841dad007e86a2015e11af ? |
| 18:45.04 | alphaone | quick and dirty :-) |
| 18:45.28 | nyu | debian has 0.9.3 |
| 18:45.45 | nyu | ah, gpsd not tangogps |
| 18:46.21 | alphaone | http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=framework.git;a=commitdiff_plain;h=ec176497bb6a460142efb80d6ab0ba4f8f321861;hp=19e4f65a7868b0d52a1e4eb647316df2a781f675 |
| 18:46.31 | alphaone | That one will also help |
| 18:46.42 | alphaone | As the time send was off by one hour before |
| 18:47.05 | nyu | <PROTECTED> |
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| 18:48.52 | nyu | grm, all hunks rejected :-/ |
| 18:50.32 | nyu | connection to gpsd SUCCEEDED |
| 18:50.34 | nyu | well |
| 18:50.45 | nyu | too bad restarting frameworkd killed my X session ;-) |
| 18:51.28 | alphaone | heh |
| 18:51.43 | alphaone | nyu: I suspect your frameworkd ist way old.. |
| 18:52.36 | nyu | alphaone: 0.2.0-git20080909-6 |
| 18:53.09 | alphaone | 20080909? |
| 18:53.18 | alphaone | over a month... |
| 18:54.59 | nyu | is the map supposed to center automaticaly to my current position? |
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| 19:00.15 | j4p13j0 | Hey, I just read source for android was released, including kernel bits. It should also include changes to the kernel for improved battery life. I guess openmoko could benefit from it too, what do you guys think ? |
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| 19:02.19 | ab0oo | j4p13j0: I think I came here 30 minutes ago to say the same thing, and I've discovered that the guys that are REALLY working to make the freerunner better don't give two poops about google, android, or google's double pump-fake on the "its GPL, not it's not, now it is..." manuevering |
| 19:02.38 | ab0oo | but that's just my take |
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| 19:03.13 | mattl | ab0oo: was it ever going to be GPL? |
| 19:03.45 | ab0oo | no. I don't think so. My verbiage confused "open source" with "GPL". My bad. |
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| 19:04.01 | ab0oo | I'll go face Boston and do 20 "Hail RMS"s |
| 19:04.23 | mattl | ab0oo: heh, i think he's in Chicago today. |
| 19:04.43 | ab0oo | I don't think it will affect the outcome if I'm off by a few degrees... |
| 19:05.40 | sicu | Dave: openmoocow challenge accepted! |
| 19:05.47 | j4p13j0 | ab0oo: Well I'm as sceptical as you are on android, but wonder if any of their kernel patches would be of any use to openmoko or embedded linux in general ... |
| 19:06.10 | sicu | Dave: though somewhat late in accepting :p (nerves you see) |
| 19:06.38 | ab0oo | they very well may be. I have to say, I'm tickled pink with my battery life (using the mw kernel distributed with QT Extended 4.4.1) |
| 19:06.51 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt (n=chomwitt@athedsl-84320.home.otenet.gr) |
| 19:07.00 | ab0oo | either the battery icon is lying, or suspend sleep time is >3 days |
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| 19:09.40 | j4p13j0 | ab0oo: I ran QT 4.4.1 +mw kernel a while from the SD card, and battery life was very good indeed. My OM2008.9 is very bad, so I'm tempted to try OM2008.9 with the mw kernel and see what that does |
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| 19:10.30 | ab0oo | I think as long as your modules line up with the kernel version, the distribution and the kernel are fairly independent |
| 19:11.20 | CIA-49 | openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * re164a3ab620a 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): [mokoko] Add mokoko recipe |
| 19:11.41 | j4p13j0 | Yes, I figured so as well, haven't had time for creating a jffs2 image with the right modules in place |
| 19:12.56 | j4p13j0 | Oh silly me, I just figured I could add them to the running image and only replace kernel image ..... |
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| 19:14.02 | ab0oo | there you have it. I just did that with my QT4.4.1 version. I put the testing sources in my opkg.conf and did an opkg update && opkg upgrade |
| 19:14.31 | ab0oo | it flashed a new kernel, downloaded new modules, and basically scared the bejeezus out of me. But, it did just finish booting, so I guess I didn't break anything too bad |
| 19:16.08 | j4p13j0 | lol ... so the feed replaced the kernel meta-package or something ? |
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| 19:18.38 | ab0oo | it looks like it. |
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| 19:21.58 | Cervajz | Hi everyone :) |
| 19:22.11 | Cervajz | Is there anybody from Czech Republic? :) |
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| 19:32.27 | sicu | so ... is android gonna fix my FR or not ? |
| 19:32.31 | sicu | hides |
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| 19:33.13 | Kensan | waits for mwester |
| 19:33.38 | mickey|munich | depending on the meaning of "fix" |
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| 19:35.06 | sicu | hehe .. i was just trying to pull mwester's leg ... but having read 2hrs overleaf, i believe mwester's legs have been ripped off their sockets a long time ago :p |
| 19:35.48 | *** join/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.123.60) |
| 19:35.55 | Kensan | sicu: he went out to buy a pair of pants with longer legs. |
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| 19:36.43 | nyu | alphaone: no joy :-/ |
| 19:37.53 | FilipLinux4BE | anyone looked at http://android.kernel.org/ already ? |
| 19:37.57 | *** join/#openmoko Arhuaco (n=n@190.144.139.50) |
| 19:38.29 | sicu | perhaps if I buy another 10 FRs, i might get lucky and end up with one that suffers from the WSoD syndrome so I can ship it off to Harald =] |
| 19:38.57 | *** join/#openmoko nikolajsheller (n=nikolaj@0608ds1-amb.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 19:39.07 | sicu | though the prospect of having another 10 toasters in the house downright frightens me |
| 19:39.44 | sicu | Kensan: haha ... he'll have to get them custom tailored :p |
| 19:40.26 | Kensan | FilipLinux4BE: yes, koolu is working on a port. They will publish their code and push their patches upstream (android/google/om...) |
| 19:40.35 | Kensan | FilipLinux4BE: and no, you are not the first to ask ;) |
| 19:40.40 | ab0oo | I dunno.. the diffs I ran show that the google guys have just been ripping off the mwester kernel mods and rebranding them... :) |
| 19:41.00 | Kensan | Somebody should put up a wiki site and change the channel subject accordingly. |
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| 19:42.26 | sicu | FilipLinux4BE: or you could just check out the 24hr # log and read up on the heated discussions on that matter: http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/openmoko.txt |
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| 19:45.24 | sicu | so what's the best suited distro for driving me crazy |
| 19:45.32 | sicu | i'm bored and need something to do =] |
| 19:45.51 | viq | sicu: make *BSD run on FR ;) |
| 19:46.09 | sicu | ah, challenge accepted |
| 19:46.31 | tomer | sicu: http://source.android.com/ |
| 19:46.35 | phobie | sicu: install illume and frite a dailer |
| 19:46.43 | phobie | -f+w |
| 19:47.25 | sicu | haha, guess i let the dogs out with that one |
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| 19:47.59 | Kensan | sicu: you know how to work the crowd ;) |
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| 19:49.35 | viq | sicu: that should keep you busy for a bit more than a year I guess ;) |
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| 19:50.01 | sicu | Kensan: i just read 2hrs worth of irc log and found a recurring pattern :p |
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| 19:53.48 | FilipLinux4BE | Kensan: have you got some details on the koolu port ? (url or so) |
| 19:53.50 | sicu | viq: i'm sure i would aquire a deranged state of the mind without anything useful coming of it :p |
| 19:54.21 | viq | sicu: right, exactly what you were looking for ;) |
| 19:54.28 | sicu | haha ... true |
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| 19:55.12 | ab0oo_ | phobie: speaking of dialers, are there any dialers other than zhone and QT? |
| 19:55.18 | Kensan | FilipLinux4BE: they are preparing a community site/portal but it's not up yet I think. |
| 19:55.52 | FilipLinux4BE | ok, did they already check of the android it is complete ? |
| 19:55.58 | FilipLinux4BE | of=if |
| 19:56.48 | Kensan | FilipLinux4BE: ehm... I don't know. But you can check for yourself. |
| 19:57.37 | FilipLinux4BE | that's not as easy as it sounds. There is a lot of code, but difficult to tell if there is no small piece missing. |
| 19:58.13 | Kensan | FilipLinux4BE: well you could ask bricode, he is working on the Android port. |
| 19:58.25 | bricode | FilipLinux4BE: Currently there is a working patched kernel. |
| 19:58.40 | Kensan | FilipLinux4BE: just don't hammer him with questions since he is actually working (as in doing the port) ;) |
| 19:58.43 | bricode | FilipLinux4BE: It appears all the sources are there to build an image. |
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| 20:03.36 | nikolajsheller | I've just compiled a package "illume" an want to install it on my FR |
| 20:04.06 | nikolajsheller | but i get at md5sum error, probably beckayse the existing illume package has another checksum |
| 20:04.15 | *** part/#openmoko sandman (n=s@CPE-24-208-55-92.new.res.rr.com) |
| 20:04.20 | nikolajsheller | how do I bypass this? |
| 20:04.33 | FilipLinux4BE | I still haven't decided which way to go: Qt Extended or Android. Those seem to be the only viable choices on short/mid-term to reach a critical mass |
| 20:04.48 | Kensan | nikolajsheller: when exactly do you get the checksum error? |
| 20:05.27 | nikolajsheller | when issuing opkg install illume-yada-yada.ipk |
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| 20:08.37 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * re5faf9797640 10/framework/subsystems/odeviced/kernel26.py: odeviced: binding to the kobject socket only works as root |
| 20:08.38 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r251535c0f81b 10/framework/resource.py: resource.py: use own bus object |
| 20:08.38 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r9f0ced185490 10/tools/cli-framework: use interface, so that we can run cli-framework as non-root |
| 20:08.39 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * rae96cb023acd 10/ (6 files in 4 dirs): |
| 20:08.40 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: * [ousaged] Remove dummy resources encapsulating odeviced objects |
| 20:08.42 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: * [odeviced] Add ResourceAwarePowerControl class and use it |
| 20:08.44 | CIA-49 | freesmartphone.org: * [odeviced] Add powercontrol_ibm.py for IBM ACPI Resources |
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| 20:15.42 | FilipLinux4BE | bricode / mwester : android kernel was modified (amongst other things) to reduce battery consumption. If there is a patched version available for FR, it might be interesting to see if we can use it for the other distro's as well |
| 20:16.15 | nikolajsheller | ahaa. removing the repositories from /etc/opkg allowed me to install without getting checksum error |
| 20:18.34 | bricode | FilipLinux4BE: I haven't looked at the kernel patches extensively save for making sure they could be cleanly applied, built, and run. Most of the Android PM stuff seems to be Android specific at the moment. There still needs to be power management support from OM and the community. |
| 20:19.13 | bricode | To for example get a finalized set of sleep/resume timings/sequence, which isn't an easy task. |
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| 20:37.10 | flexd_ | Is FDOM remotely stable? (as in remotely useable as a daily basic phone?) |
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| 20:45.58 | jadams_ | so android's open source and available now, has there been any discussion on what bits could be re-used from that-a-ways? |
| 20:47.11 | flexd_ | Do i have to flash the kernel (i flashed mwesters kernel a few days ago before i flashed my phone with qtopia) before i flash it with FDOM? |
| 20:47.16 | flexd_ | Or can i use the same kernel? |
| 20:47.26 | wolfmanjm | working on it, see thread on community ML, bricode says he has already compiled Kernel |
| 20:47.56 | wolfmanjm | jadams_: working on it, see thread on community ML, bricode says he has already compiled Kernel |
| 20:48.08 | bricode | I'm setting up a forum where people can post questions and discuss Android. |
| 20:48.15 | jadams_ | wolfmanjm, awesome :) |
| 20:48.38 | jadams_ | and bricode I'll be interested in that, as android is my break from openmoko, but I'll be coming back for the next device |
| 20:49.02 | bricode | I'm just putting some touches on the forum now. |
| 20:49.54 | wolfmanjm | bricode: great a low noise forum will really help. Please post location here and to the community ML so we know where to go. |
| 20:50.50 | *** join/#openmoko Tig| (n=tigger@82.153.215.237) |
| 20:53.00 | almien | links for 2007.02 for GTA02 - what would they be called? download page links to listings of hundreds of files |
| 20:53.13 | phobie | Why does feed-administrators include git-hashes into version numbers? |
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| 20:57.18 | flexd_ | phobie: to make it look cryptic for the average man? :p |
| 20:57.26 | Tig| | phobie: usually when there is not an official release by the programmers and it is identifing the exact code used for the build |
| 20:58.04 | Tig| | so if you file a bug it is easier to identify if it has been fixed by a later code change |
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| 20:59.28 | Tig| | sadly not a witty or interesting reply but if you could explain why brown cows eat green grass and give white milk I would appreciate it :) |
| 21:01.13 | viq | Would you drink it if it was red or green? ;) |
| 21:01.28 | *** part/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu (n=Leachim@78.43.158.223) |
| 21:03.14 | Tig| | viq: interesting question, people do have some built in / cultural issues with oddly coloured food stuff, iirc some people had great problems eating bread that had been coloured green :) I remember as a student adding black food colouring to milk to test this theory and it did stop my housemates nicking my milk :) |
| 21:04.16 | *** join/#openmoko arzej (n=arzej@dfn39.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 21:04.19 | viq | hehe |
| 21:04.45 | Tig| | it also put me off my cornflakes :( |
| 21:04.53 | viq | :P |
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| 21:05.37 | *** join/#openmoko kirun (n=kirun@91.125.88.207) |
| 21:05.46 | Tig| | if you get bored on a wet afternoon, try adding colours to your foods and see if it affects your perceived taste of them, might require a blindfold and assistant to do control tests :) |
| 21:06.33 | almien | some places that margarine has to be sold without colouring, people won't buy it when they see it white instead of yellow |
| 21:07.21 | Tig| | almien: I can see that, I assume it is only coloured yellow so it looks like butter which is what people expect |
| 21:07.34 | *** join/#openmoko nicfer (n=chatzill@201.255.121.196) |
| 21:07.38 | cjb_ie | heck, some places butter is practically white |
| 21:08.15 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@121.215.167.161) |
| 21:08.33 | Tig| | cjb_ie: hmm I wonder how they would respond to yellow margerine there |
| 21:08.44 | nicfer | hmmm how possible would be to include a tv out in some future revision of the GTAxx? |
| 21:08.55 | Tig| | assuming I could spell it properly :P |
| 21:09.23 | Tig| | nicfer: this is going to sound daft but why would you want tv out? |
| 21:10.14 | Tig| | unless a GTAxx had silly amounts of diskspace then you would not want to be putting high quality videos on it |
| 21:11.21 | nicfer | hmmm, gaming? |
| 21:12.46 | techiem2-r | picture slideshows? |
| 21:13.14 | nicfer | still, there are not standarized small connectors to be used with phones |
| 21:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko arzej (n=arzej@dfn39.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 21:13.44 | Tig| | the way things are moving often TVs now are not dumb devices and are frequently connected to another more intelligent device |
| 21:15.00 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 21:15.03 | Tig| | so I can see things more to do with media transfer than using a TV as an external monitor attached to a mobile. That would require a totally different set of support from the gfx |
| 21:16.21 | *** join/#openmoko datachaos (n=datachao@201.22.213.114.static.gvt.net.br) |
| 21:17.15 | almien | nicfer: 3.5mm jacks are sometimes used in digital cameras for output to TV |
| 21:17.41 | almien | with an adapter to (phono?) plugs |
| 21:18.35 | Tig| | would you want your mobile trying to drive a large display like that? |
| 21:18.46 | *** join/#openmoko Nameeater (i=subspace@priss.segfault.nl) |
| 21:19.26 | nicfer | how many contacts use those 3.5mm jacks? |
| 21:22.05 | nicfer | the ideal would be 4 contact to be after adapted to S-Video or component video |
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| 21:22.34 | F4t | hey all, did someone already compile android for arm4? :) |
| 21:23.34 | sicu | or just get a pandora for you tv-out needs |
| 21:25.46 | sicu | F4t: check the the past few hrs of the irc log to see android related discussions: http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/openmoko.txt |
| 21:26.14 | mwester | chuckles as he reviews the logs... |
| 21:26.45 | sicu | mwester: as long as you're not crying ;p |
| 21:27.42 | sicu | F4t: a quick search for android or koolu will get you what you're looking for |
| 21:28.28 | mwester | sicu: good luck with the bsd thing, by-the-way. :D |
| 21:31.21 | F4t | sicu, thanks checking it out |
| 21:31.28 | *** part/#openmoko lloyd_fedora (n=darkstar@86.99.34.14) |
| 21:33.25 | sicu | mwester: heh ... i'd need more than just luck =p |
| 21:34.03 | nyu | Tig|: I don't think so; once the "more intelligent device" becomes smart enough, those TVs will be replaced by mere monitors |
| 21:34.08 | *** join/#openmoko jadams_ (n=jadams@71-12-188-209.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com) |
| 21:34.19 | nyu | at least that's my plan for my home TV set ;-) |
| 21:35.24 | *** join/#openmoko jeffszusz (n=jeffsz@d57-97-215.home.cgocable.net) |
| 21:35.49 | Tig| | nyu: well in the UK most tv sets now are plugged into either Sat or cable decoders or freeview boxes, there are some that have embedded freeview but generally a tv set is now more or less a monitor connected to another device |
| 21:36.34 | Tig| | not here though as I don't have a TV, just monitors :) |
| 21:37.20 | *** join/#openmoko esthar (n=esthar@student164-128.hampshire.edu) |
| 21:37.46 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@212.98.171.13) |
| 21:41.10 | mwester | found that his Sony has a usb port hidden on the back. |
| 21:44.22 | kirun | My old Samsung SyncMaster monitor had a USB port, I never bothered with it as all it did was replaced the front controls with a PC control panel |
| 21:45.03 | mwester | I've been unwilling to plug anything into the Sony USB port though; my wife would be REALLY unhappy with me if I did anything to injure that TV. |
| 21:45.06 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 21:46.46 | Kensan | mwester: good thing you have not lost your humour ;) |
| 21:47.31 | *** join/#openmoko peppertarts_ (n=peter@strapp.plus.com) |
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| 21:54.54 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@vpnj069.ugent.be) |
| 21:56.37 | mwester | notes that Kensan spells humor correctly, unlike himself. |
| 21:57.18 | dolf1074 | bravo |
| 21:58.04 | Tig| | but it is spelt humour in all parts of the civilised world :P |
| 21:59.06 | mwester | I started school in Canada, and finished in the US -- and I recall one professor who had an interesting approach: she said I could use either spelling, but she insisted that I at least be consistent! :) |
| 22:00.28 | mwester | Since the other profs insisted on the American spelling, I learned to do it that way. |
| 22:04.51 | Kensan | mwester: well it was 50/50 and if I was wrong I have an excuse: english is not my native tongue ;) |
| 22:05.31 | *** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07F7BE.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 22:27.50 | *** part/#openmoko gargoyle-grin (n=randerso@gentoo/contributor/gargoyle-grin) |
| 22:30.15 | Dave | heh |
| 22:30.33 | Dave | Mwester - good. |
| 22:30.42 | Dave | Cross over to the dark side. |
| 22:30.45 | Dave | >:) |
| 22:31.27 | *** join/#openmoko nicfer (n=chatzill@201.255.81.79) |
| 22:32.00 | Kensan | Dave: damn, you are always here. When do you sleep? |
| 22:32.53 | Dave | Sleep? |
| 22:32.55 | Dave | What's that? |
| 22:33.52 | Kensan | Dave: oh right... |
| 22:34.06 | *** join/#openmoko guerby (n=guerby@46.196.98-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 22:38.33 | Dave | :p |
| 22:38.37 | *** join/#openmoko ssweeny (n=scott@pool-72-95-253-254.pitbpa.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:39.58 | *** join/#openmoko jeffszusz (n=jeffsz@d57-97-215.home.cgocable.net) |
| 22:43.52 | *** join/#openmoko KenYoung (n=Ken@pool-151-199-35-186.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:44.48 | Dave | Kenyoung! |
| 22:45.21 | KenYoung | Hi Dave, how are you doing tonight? |
| 22:45.52 | *** join/#openmoko uhsf (n=uhsf@modemcable136.213-20-96.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 22:46.10 | rwhitby | morning |
| 22:46.22 | Kensan | rwhitby: good morning :) |
| 22:46.44 | *** join/#openmoko Daverix (n=daverix@c-09abe655.148-7-64736c12.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 22:46.49 | sicu | ~bed |
| 22:46.50 | apt | extra, extra, read all about it, bed is a thing programmers have never heard of, ask me about shower |
| 22:46.58 | rwhitby | Is Jim Morris here? |
| 22:47.37 | Dave | hah |
| 22:47.52 | Dave | Rwhitby, were you genuinely asking? |
| 22:48.07 | rwhitby | yes. |
| 22:48.12 | Dave | Oh. |
| 22:48.29 | rwhitby | Jim Morris, http://blog.wolfman.com |
| 22:48.36 | Dave | Aha! |
| 22:48.45 | Dave | Ah, that's right - I didn't know his last name :p |
| 22:48.46 | rwhitby | said he had trouble accessing android-internals.org, which I run. |
| 22:48.54 | *** join/#openmoko Staticwave_Ace (n=Ace@d57-135-60.home.cgocable.net) |
| 22:50.21 | Daverix | Someone started to look at the android code? Perhaps started to port it to the freerunner? :) |
| 22:50.26 | *** part/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.123.60) |
| 22:51.29 | Robot101 | thus far, many people I respect have said it's an utter pile of fail |
| 22:51.40 | *** join/#openmoko twolife (i=twolife@omikron.twolife.org) |
| 22:52.06 | Kensan | Daverix: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/005966.html |
| 22:52.10 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.148.252) |
| 22:52.23 | *** join/#openmoko workingnorm (n=workingn@186-212-231-201.fibertel.com.ar) |
| 22:53.17 | Daverix | oh thanks Kensan :P |
| 22:54.04 | Daverix | cool! :) |
| 22:54.47 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-59-47.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:55.53 | Kensan | points Dave to the fact that raster just got up |
| 22:56.07 | raster | Dave: COMPLY! |
| 22:57.27 | Kensan | raster: tz he said he would never sleep and there he is: head on the keyboard... |
| 22:58.01 | *** join/#openmoko Veggen_ (n=vegard@213-187-177-230.dd.nextgentel.com) |
| 22:58.10 | raster | tz? |
| 22:58.43 | Kensan | tztztz like the english *tsktsk* or |
| 22:59.07 | raster | ooooh |
| 22:59.08 | Kensan | wow that's actually hard to translate |
| 22:59.09 | raster | rsk tsk |
| 22:59.10 | raster | err |
| 22:59.12 | raster | tsk tsk |
| 22:59.13 | raster | :) |
| 22:59.44 | Kensan | right you got it ;) |
| 23:00.00 | raster | i see |
| 23:01.38 | raster | well he's not complying! |
| 23:01.45 | Kensan | raster: you missed all the rave about Android source release (and thus mwesters rants) ;) |
| 23:02.03 | Kensan | raster: we shall ridicule him until he complies |
| 23:02.04 | raster | i read the mail list |
| 23:02.05 | mwester | :) |
| 23:02.18 | mwester | T'wasn't on the mail list! |
| 23:02.18 | raster | mwester: ranting about android? |
| 23:02.22 | raster | anything specific |
| 23:02.23 | Kensan | raster: pha, mailinglist in here it was like a live sports event! |
| 23:02.24 | raster | or just the |
| 23:02.27 | Dave | RASTER |
| 23:02.45 | raster | "get realistic guys. android is not the solutiopn to it all and if u read the fine print u'll be a bit shocked" |
| 23:02.46 | raster | ? |
| 23:02.47 | Dave | Who are we ridiculing? |
| 23:02.57 | Dave | oh haha, more of that silliness! |
| 23:02.59 | Kensan | damnit, couldn't even make one funny remark about Dave. |
| 23:02.59 | raster | Dave: you. |
| 23:03.01 | raster | :) |
| 23:03.01 | *** join/#openmoko Veggen (n=vegard@213-187-177-230.dd.nextgentel.com) |
| 23:03.05 | Dave | Mwester and I joked about it enough this afternoon. |
| 23:03.13 | mwester | I'm SOOOO tempted to create "android.bb" in the OE repo... |
| 23:03.14 | Dave | Raster - in that case, I hope you could do better! |
| 23:03.15 | Kensan | Dave: in #openmoko the channel ridicules you! |
| 23:03.15 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 23:03.21 | Dave | Mwester - muwahahaha |
| 23:03.22 | Dave | >:) |
| 23:03.30 | Dave | Kensan - dude, that'd be awesome |
| 23:03.36 | Dave | It'd be like #openmoko's roast of me! |
| 23:03.55 | raster | Dave: ridiculing you to try and get your attention. it worked! :) |
| 23:04.18 | Kensan | mwester: we finally know what Sean was up to ;) |
| 23:04.32 | mwester | Oh yeah! |
| 23:04.33 | Kensan | high fives raster |
| 23:05.13 | mwester | I rather suspected, if you read the last few emails he and I exchanged on the list -- I was trying to see if he would "cough it up" so to speak. |
| 23:05.28 | phobie | are the daily om images bootable? |
| 23:05.37 | mwester | But he was too good for that. Good for him. |
| 23:05.50 | Kensan | mwester: yeah, you and andy did the good cop bad cop thing. |
| 23:05.51 | phobie | It freezes ond only shows some boots |
| 23:06.11 | Kensan | ;) |
| 23:06.15 | *** join/#openmoko jancona (n=jancona@pool-70-22-136-131.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:07.02 | mwester | The boots. |
| 23:07.33 | raster | om just updated to an efl svn rev that was broken |
| 23:07.36 | mwester | Behind the boots is text that would explain what REALLY happened to prevent it from booting up. |
| 23:07.45 | mwester | Ah, raster knows then. goood. |
| 23:07.47 | raster | i know i didnt update to that svnrev myself until i fixed it |
| 23:07.58 | raster | so my OE patches never used it |
| 23:08.04 | raster | thus it was stable... if you get your E from me... |
| 23:08.05 | raster | :) |
| 23:08.20 | raster | get your e's here. reliable. no bad trips! |
| 23:08.44 | phobie | hm |
| 23:08.46 | Kensan | true |
| 23:08.52 | Kensan | ;) |
| 23:08.55 | phobie | your e is not the newest |
| 23:08.59 | mwester | So... what's the fix then? |
| 23:09.29 | *** join/#openmoko mgregson (n=mgregson@artsnaa112.uwaterloo.ca) |
| 23:09.34 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=rudi@dsbg-4db5f59b.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 23:10.06 | *** join/#openmoko vinicius_ (n=vininim@189.26.197.157.adsl.gvt.net.br) |
| 23:11.04 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo1 (n=paul@76-10-173-74.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 23:11.52 | Kensan | great the OM mailserver is not serving haralds mails to me. |
| 23:12.04 | Kensan | mwester: did you receive http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/005964.html |
| 23:12.07 | Kensan | ? |
| 23:12.17 | raster | phobie: it was as of yesterday :) |
| 23:12.34 | raster | mwester: upgrade of course! |
| 23:12.41 | rwhitby | mwester: I'm working on the AndroidMakefile right now ... |
| 23:12.45 | raster | mwester: see my ow svn tree. |
| 23:12.48 | phobie | raster: I thought 20081012 http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/Freerunner/2008-10-12/ |
| 23:12.59 | raster | i should get around to putting into oe dev git sometime soon |
| 23:13.05 | CVirus | http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7136726850.html |
| 23:13.17 | raster | phobie: oh thats just the image i build. the source tree gets updated much more often |
| 23:13.28 | raster | svn co http://svn.enlightenment.org/svn/e/trunk/TMP/oe |
| 23:13.44 | phobie | rrr |
| 23:13.55 | phobie | and I need to build it for myself? |
| 23:14.13 | phobie | why doen't you just publish your build? |
| 23:14.57 | raster | because it takes a while to upload it all |
| 23:15.04 | raster | and it takes my time to do it |
| 23:15.11 | raster | i havent made an auto-public script |
| 23:15.13 | raster | err |
| 23:15.14 | raster | publish |
| 23:15.19 | raster | so i scp the stuff by hand |
| 23:15.45 | phobie | hm |
| 23:15.45 | raster | and that takes a while |
| 23:15.54 | phobie | how long is the buildtime? |
| 23:16.09 | raster | as i keep an already built tree |
| 23:16.16 | raster | for me on updates its maybe 30mins |
| 23:16.21 | raster | but u'll need to build everything |
| 23:16.23 | raster | once u do it once |
| 23:16.25 | raster | its fast |
| 23:16.32 | raster | as it only builds changes after that |
| 23:17.00 | *** join/#openmoko Gamara (n=Gamara@nat/google/x-e4068574e93f2a2a) |
| 23:17.15 | rwhitby | if there was an _svn OE recipe for it, with an entry in moko-autorevs, it would be publicly built every 15 minutes ... |
| 23:18.28 | mwester | adds that if the Treo 650 stuff could also be autobuilt... |
| 23:18.53 | phobie | that would be nice |
| 23:19.07 | raster | rwhitby: i have .bb's for everything |
| 23:19.10 | rwhitby | mwester: agreed. I can add that to autobuilder once there is a stable OE recipe ... |
| 23:19.16 | raster | just not all are in upstream oe |
| 23:19.26 | rwhitby | raster: do you have OE commit privs? |
| 23:19.29 | raster | so i keep my changes as an svn tree with patches as an overlay |
| 23:19.35 | raster | umm. thats in progress |
| 23:19.55 | rwhitby | ok, so this is just a temporary situation in the process of being resolved :-) |
| 23:20.36 | phobie | raster: Updating takes 30 minutes for you. How long takes building everything? |
| 23:21.52 | raster | depends on your box |
| 23:21.54 | mwester | is trying to count how many folks have recommended that raster get OE commit privs -- three so far? |
| 23:21.54 | raster | a day? |
| 23:21.57 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan_ (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-175-25.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 23:22.03 | raster | rwhitby: yes. |
| 23:22.20 | raster | mwester: i sent micky ssh pub key already |
| 23:22.22 | Kensan_ | raster: seems like a different bootmisc.sh gets sucked in... |
| 23:22.26 | raster | holger said he'd add my key |
| 23:22.31 | raster | i need to check if it works |
| 23:22.35 | phobie | so I won't do it. |
| 23:22.57 | raster | Kensan_: hmmm really? i checked. my bootmisc.sh has my commented out ldconfig secion.. |
| 23:23.25 | raster | ooh wait |
| 23:23.28 | raster | it DID.... |
| 23:23.32 | raster | hmm |
| 23:23.34 | raster | not anymore |
| 23:23.34 | raster | ok |
| 23:23.39 | raster | i need to check. |
| 23:24.35 | Gamara | RASTER! |
| 23:25.00 | Kensan_ | raster: it's commented out but the one that makes it to the image doesn't have the changes... |
| 23:25.56 | raster | Kensan_: i swear i did build an image and it had it commented out |
| 23:25.58 | raster | odd |
| 23:26.01 | raster | i will need to look |
| 23:26.02 | raster | but nto today |
| 23:26.43 | Kensan_ | Kensan_: yeah I thought so too I just saw it in the bootchart... |
| 23:27.20 | Kensan_ | raster: it is commented out in files-dir of the initscripts package of the image I just built. but it's not on the bootmisc.sh on the device. |
| 23:27.32 | Gamara | Cripes, Raster, when was the last time we chatted. Are you still in Japan? I'll be in sydney in december. |
| 23:27.43 | raster | Gamara: yo yo |
| 23:27.49 | raster | i'm in sydney atm |
| 23:27.53 | Dave | Hey Chris! What brings you here? |
| 23:28.04 | raster | will be in korea mid-nov |
| 23:28.05 | Gamara | I was lurking cause we just released that -other- phone thing. |
| 23:28.10 | raster | will be moving house in december |
| 23:28.21 | Dave | Heh, oh yeah. |
| 23:28.21 | Gamara | I'll be in syd december 2 through the 5th or so. |
| 23:28.32 | Gamara | give or take a few days. |
| 23:29.03 | Dave | Where's the party at? |
| 23:30.09 | Kensan_ | hm my uboot just froze |
| 23:30.19 | Dave | Wonderful. |
| 23:30.47 | raster | Gamara: i will have to play it by ear |
| 23:30.48 | Kensan_ | Dave, the bootloader not the ship... |
| 23:30.50 | raster | i need to move ouse |
| 23:30.55 | Dave | hah |
| 23:30.57 | raster | so that wil suck up 2-3 days |
| 23:31.06 | raster | sometime bteween now and dec 15 |
| 23:31.19 | Dave | Raster, where you going? |
| 23:31.31 | raster | just some other place in sydney |
| 23:31.37 | Dave | oh |
| 23:32.05 | Dave | Shall I send you a house-warming gift? |
| 23:32.37 | Dave | Perhaps a few more recruits for your gang ;) |
| 23:33.35 | raster | hahahahhaha |
| 23:33.37 | Kensan | already 1:30... not enough hours... |
| 23:33.43 | raster | oh some of your z72's? |
| 23:33.44 | raster | :) |
| 23:33.49 | raster | Kensan: go schleep! |
| 23:34.06 | Kensan | raster: testing the udev speedup thingy. |
| 23:34.10 | Kensan | right now |
| 23:34.17 | raster | cool |
| 23:34.21 | Kensan | let me get at the bootcharts :) |
| 23:34.48 | raster | i will put any of my bootup patches on hold |
| 23:34.54 | raster | they were a bit quick |
| 23:34.59 | Dave | Raster, indeed |
| 23:35.02 | mwester | opens a package, and does not find a Z. |
| 23:35.11 | Dave | Aw |
| 23:35.24 | Dave | Damnit, I still need to build illume! arrgh |
| 23:35.26 | Dave | damn work |
| 23:35.28 | Kensan | btw I have harald's nand patches applied without hwecc and I get almost the same results as he posted. |
| 23:35.35 | raster | well i'm more than happy to have a z72 and flahs it |
| 23:35.42 | raster | tho i suspect my treo650 will do the job just fine for you |
| 23:35.42 | Dave | Raster, okedokey |
| 23:35.43 | raster | :) |
| 23:35.49 | Dave | aha |
| 23:35.50 | Dave | Okay |
| 23:36.02 | raster | Kensan: u mean raw IO speedup results? |
| 23:36.03 | Dave | Yeah I was kind of wondering if I could just flash your treo image on it |
| 23:36.12 | raster | or boto speed reductiosn the same (ie almost none)? |
| 23:36.24 | raster | rav the rootfs may actually "just work" |
| 23:36.30 | Kensan | raster: I will see to reshuffle your init patches. I think exquisite is complaining about some missing sockets... |
| 23:36.31 | Dave | hmm |
| 23:36.31 | raster | kernel will be the difference |
| 23:36.35 | Dave | oh |
| 23:36.35 | raster | i think |
| 23:36.39 | Dave | Should I try it? ;) |
| 23:36.50 | Kensan | raster: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/005917.html |
| 23:37.04 | raster | Kensan: race condition - exqusitie "dameon" starts, and there is an exquisite-write "waiting" for the daemon to start |
| 23:37.05 | Dave | Raster, I mean, it couldn't hurt - I do have five more! ;) |
| 23:37.05 | Kensan | raster: the results for new 2.6.24 kernel (using my timing related patches): |
| 23:37.10 | raster | Kensan: have u tried installing prelink? |
| 23:37.18 | raster | Kensan: build and install prelink and see if it helps |
| 23:37.33 | raster | Dave: well if u really want to. |
| 23:37.38 | raster | as long as it has a usb data cable |
| 23:37.40 | Kensan | raster: not yet. btw do you have that list handy of boot optimisation things we wanted to take a look at? |
| 23:37.42 | raster | and power adaptor |
| 23:37.44 | raster | i'm happy |
| 23:37.44 | raster | :) |
| 23:37.58 | raster | Kensan: they're all in patches |
| 23:37.59 | Dave | yep |
| 23:38.03 | raster | in my ow svn patches set |
| 23:38.03 | raster | :) |
| 23:38.07 | Kensan | raster: hehe right |
| 23:38.35 | raster | Dave: if u really want... but it's probably hassle |
| 23:38.47 | Dave | okay |
| 23:38.54 | raster | but if u want |
| 23:38.54 | raster | sure |
| 23:38.56 | *** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA40A9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:38.57 | Dave | I should probably just do it the -right- way. |
| 23:39.02 | Dave | right? :P |
| 23:39.06 | raster | will need to go to ikea and find some stand/setup to hold his homies |
| 23:39.15 | Dave | hell yeah! |
| 23:39.27 | *** part/#openmoko Gamara (n=Gamara@nat/google/x-e4068574e93f2a2a) |
| 23:39.54 | Kensan | raster: a crib ;) |
| 23:39.58 | Kensan | raster: for the gang |
| 23:40.04 | Dave | they're not necessarily babies... |
| 23:40.09 | Dave | though they may be HIS babies ;) |
| 23:41.09 | raster | yeah |
| 23:41.12 | raster | a crib! |
| 23:41.13 | raster | :) |
| 23:41.23 | roh | funny rtc driver this android has |
| 23:41.28 | roh | only supports reading time |
| 23:41.30 | roh | http://git.source.android.com/?p=kernel/common.git;a=commitdiff;h=a045dfc4f8f311fb934c2d5fcc628ae96e11886b |
| 23:41.32 | roh | no write |
| 23:41.43 | Dave | nice |
| 23:41.44 | roh | no alarms, no ioctl |
| 23:41.45 | Kensan | raster: hm I don't see why the old bootmisc.sh gets sucked in... need to take a look tomorrow |
| 23:41.57 | Dave | roh, are you really surprised? |
| 23:42.00 | nicfer | I think that a GSM-free version of the freerunner should be made so it becomes 100% free |
| 23:42.01 | raster | i'll worry about it after i move |
| 23:42.01 | raster | :) |
| 23:42.05 | rwhitby | roh: goldfish is the dummy emulator machine |
| 23:42.08 | *** join/#openmoko Openfree (n=df@222.65.132.11) |
| 23:42.10 | nicfer | like Apple did with the ipod touch |
| 23:42.13 | raster | Kensan: possibly a such-distro specific bootmisc.sh |
| 23:42.26 | Kensan | raster: hm doesn't seem that way |
| 23:42.30 | rwhitby | goldfish is not a real device. the emulator gets it's time from the host OS of course. |
| 23:42.37 | Dave | launches cocoboot |
| 23:43.18 | roh | aaah. |
| 23:43.33 | roh | rwhitby thats where i took the wrong turn ;) |
| 23:44.13 | Kensan | raster: hm 80 secs until batget is up :( |
| 23:44.22 | raster | gah |
| 23:44.23 | Kensan | raster: that's just for init. |
| 23:44.52 | crib | ? |
| 23:44.53 | raster | thats a good measuring stick actually |
| 23:44.54 | *** join/#openmoko centaur5 (n=fishman@209-33-197-88.dsl.infowest.net) |
| 23:45.03 | Kensan | raster: need to tweak udev though |
| 23:45.04 | nicfer | wait, would become cheaper a non-phone version of the freerunner? |
| 23:45.08 | Kensan | raster: and all the other stuff |
| 23:45.16 | nicfer | s/would/how |
| 23:45.17 | Dave | man, can we just have coco for the freerunner? |
| 23:45.24 | Kensan | ah dangit portmap still gets loaded |
| 23:45.25 | Dave | it'd sure simplify a lot of things |
| 23:45.43 | nicfer | argh, how much cheaper will become it |
| 23:45.48 | Kensan | raster: but it's ~8 unti exquisite is up |
| 23:45.55 | Dave | whoa now yoda :P |
| 23:45.55 | raster | Kensan: try prelink |
| 23:46.13 | Kensan | raster: that's without the 20 s from uboot and kernel |
| 23:46.22 | Kensan | will do |
| 23:46.27 | *** join/#openmoko openstandards (n=vir@92.8.210.116) |
| 23:46.51 | tomboy64 | is resolvconf provided for a special purpose? |
| 23:46.53 | *** join/#openmoko Mek (n=marijn@93.157.1.37) |
| 23:46.58 | Kensan | raster: so all in all 100s without fso or anything else for that matter |
| 23:47.02 | tomboy64 | e.g. do i have to setup dns'ing in a special way? |
| 23:47.10 | *** join/#openmoko hipitihop (n=denis@97.91.221.203.static.comindico.com.au) |
| 23:47.13 | Dave | not really |
| 23:47.16 | Dave | Hey Hippityhop :D |
| 23:47.22 | tomboy64 | or is http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Om_2008.8 with networking the way to go? |
| 23:47.27 | hipitihop | Hey Dave |
| 23:47.52 | openstandards | Hi now that android's sourcecode has been released does that mean it can now be ported over to the fic freerunner? |
| 23:47.54 | rwhitby | hey hipitihop |
| 23:47.55 | Dave | Hallo :) |
| 23:47.56 | tomboy64 | dave, was that "not really" aimed at me? |
| 23:48.00 | Dave | yes |
| 23:48.04 | tomboy64 | ok, thanks |
| 23:48.07 | Dave | SHouldn't be much conf |
| 23:48.08 | rwhitby | openstandards: someone has already done it. |
| 23:48.11 | Dave | just maybe a nameserver config |
| 23:48.14 | Kensan | openstandards: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/005966.html |
| 23:48.14 | tomboy64 | ok |
| 23:48.16 | tomboy64 | thks |
| 23:48.16 | hipitihop | hey rwhitby |
| 23:48.30 | *** join/#openmoko Ainulindale (n=ainu@calaquendi.org) |
| 23:48.35 | raster | Kensan: try prelink :) |
| 23:48.42 | raster | it may help the exqusitie start |
| 23:48.44 | *** join/#openmoko batti112 (n=batti@p5B14C3CB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:48.49 | raster | exquisite is a little bit of a problem |
| 23:48.49 | hipitihop | rwhitby, I left a message for you on linkedin, seems to have gone into the ether |
| 23:48.56 | Kensan | raster: right |
| 23:49.00 | raster | that 8 seconds - almsot all of it is the dynamic linker i think |
| 23:49.11 | openstandards | blimey nice work |
| 23:49.11 | raster | searching for shared lins and hunting symbols |
| 23:49.13 | raster | BUT |
| 23:49.34 | raster | it also is an avantage to anything later using those libs (x libs mostly) |
| 23:49.42 | raster | as they now are already pre-lloaded/cached |
| 23:49.50 | *** join/#openmoko kristian-m (i=kristian@217.13.205.113) |
| 23:49.58 | raster | so removing lib linkage for exquisite will just put the extra work later in the boot |
| 23:50.10 | raster | so u wont gain much |
| 23:51.26 | Kensan | raster: but the splash will be up earlier |
| 23:51.34 | raster | yes |
| 23:51.37 | Kensan | raster: which is good |
| 23:51.38 | raster | prelink may help there |
| 23:51.42 | raster | and help a lot of thnigs |
| 23:51.42 | raster | maybe |
| 23:51.44 | Kensan | raster: to fool the user ;) |
| 23:51.51 | raster | ie it avoids symbol hunting |
| 23:51.56 | centaur5 | Are there any easy solutions to use a laptop via bluetooth or USB to send/receive SMS instead of the onscreen keyboard? Gnome-phone-manager doesn't seem to be compatible. |
| 23:51.57 | Kensan | raster: well there's a ton of other things |
| 23:52.08 | rwhitby | hipitihop: don't see your message there |
| 23:52.34 | raster | it can help anything that starts with linking |
| 23:52.40 | raster | it speeds up c++ stuff a lot |
| 23:52.45 | raster | c stuff not much - on a desktop |
| 23:52.53 | raster | havent benchmarked on a fr tho |
| 23:53.13 | hipitihop | rwhitby, might explain something..checking.. |
| 23:53.26 | *** join/#openmoko Kinetic (n=mike@pool-70-109-71-32.hag.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:53.40 | *** join/#openmoko Tetracomm (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) |
| 23:54.09 | Kensan | raster: ok one last try for tonight |
| 23:54.42 | Kensan | oh boy I am going to be grumpy tomorrow morning... |
| 23:55.43 | *** join/#openmoko jadams_ (n=jadams@rrcs-67-78-235-192.se.biz.rr.com) |
| 23:56.16 | hipitihop | rwhitby, hmm is there in sent dated 13th anyway, may I send to your openmoko list e-mail ? |
| 23:56.43 | raster | Kensan: btw - prelink if installed needs to run first and prelink everything |
| 23:56.44 | ronny | raster: how about prelinking? |
| 23:56.46 | raster | fyi |
| 23:56.56 | raster | ronny: thats what i was just telling Kensan :) |
| 23:57.14 | ronny | i was slow :( |
| 23:57.36 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 23:59.28 | Kensan | :( |
| 23:59.37 | Kensan | while rebuilding initscripts |
| 23:59.39 | Kensan | *** glibc detected *** opkg-cl: double free or corruption (!prev): 0x0000000000630c40 *** |