| 00:05.53 | *** join/#openmoko tunys (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 00:09.35 | rwhitby | alphabeat: since anyone can create any distribution, it would be best not to rely on /etc/issue for anything |
| 00:09.55 | rwhitby | but yes, that's really the only place where you'll get a hint |
| 00:11.22 | alphabeat | hmm ok thanks |
| 00:11.59 | nyu | ShellEvil: so thay can use a ROM, and put free software in it |
| 00:12.06 | nyu | it's no excuse |
| 00:12.18 | ShellEvil | nyu: and who's going to develop that free software? |
| 00:12.37 | nyu | ShellEvil: it's already developed, just needs to be freed |
| 00:12.56 | ShellEvil | nyu: that's not always as simple as it sounds. |
| 00:13.10 | nyu | ShellEvil: they want to retain their ability to modify the software you're running, but not give that ability to you. it sounds like a scam |
| 00:13.11 | ShellEvil | nyu: it's probably not been developed under a contract which'd allow it to happen. |
| 00:13.34 | ShellEvil | nyu: in some countries, giving that ability to users legitimately will attract jailtime. |
| 00:13.38 | nyu | ShellEvil: so they should use proper contract terms |
| 00:13.44 | nyu | ShellEvil: so use a ROM |
| 00:14.06 | ShellEvil | I fail to see how the user benefits from an opensource code running on ROM. |
| 00:14.41 | nyu | ShellEvil: all freedoms apply except modification inside the ROM itself |
| 00:14.59 | nyu | ShellEvil: you can reuse it for other hardware, study it, audit it, etc |
| 00:15.21 | nyu | there's no need to blobify things and turn them into secrets |
| 00:15.36 | rwhitby | there is if you want to keep it a secret ... |
| 00:16.02 | nyu | I don't feel it's legitimate for them to keep it a secret what my hardware is doing |
| 00:16.18 | ShellEvil | nyu: then don't buy any hardware with hidden blobs. |
| 00:16.19 | rwhitby | nyu: that's a valid opinion for you to hold |
| 00:16.20 | nyu | but if you do, how would it hurt you to know? |
| 00:16.26 | rwhitby | but it's not the only valid opinion |
| 00:16.37 | nyu | rwhitby: right, except I'm denied it |
| 00:16.47 | ShellEvil | nyu: however - if you truly hold this opinion, then you should probably log off now. |
| 00:16.53 | rwhitby | nyu: you have the choice to buy hardware from someone else that doesn't keep the secret from you. |
| 00:16.59 | nyu | ShellEvil: why? |
| 00:17.04 | rwhitby | or develop it from scratch yourself (the phone network that is) |
| 00:17.12 | ShellEvil | cnwdup: as your keyboard firmware is almost certain to be not-open, as is your BIOS, your modem firmware, ... |
| 00:17.16 | ShellEvil | nyu: |
| 00:17.26 | nyu | rwhitby: sure, I exercise this choice whenever I can |
| 00:17.30 | nyu | which is not always, sadly |
| 00:17.36 | ShellEvil | nyu: wherever it is convenient to you. |
| 00:18.06 | nyu | ShellEvil: you're turning a discussion about violation of my rights into a discussion on convenience |
| 00:18.14 | rwhitby | nyu: excellent. do you accept when others don't share the same opinion as you, or do you zealously state your opinion as absolute truths that everyone must uphold? |
| 00:18.25 | nyu | if you don't feel you have those rights, you don't have a problem at all. I do, because I feel I have them |
| 00:18.55 | ShellEvil | nyu: I have the right to a large tub of chocolate ice-cream. _right_now_ |
| 00:19.03 | ShellEvil | waits for tub of ice-cream to appear. |
| 00:19.37 | rwhitby | gives ShellEvil a tub of ice cream, since it's his right. |
| 00:19.41 | nyu | ShellEvil: this discussion is silly. you seem to put the status quo above opinion |
| 00:20.00 | nyu | then we needlessly argue about what's an opinion, what's an absolute truth, etc |
| 00:20.07 | rwhitby | nyu: no, a discussion which doesn't include pros and cons of blobs is silly. |
| 00:20.08 | nyu | but the status quo is above all that |
| 00:20.29 | ShellEvil | Opinions are completely irrelevant unless you bring current fact into it. |
| 00:20.32 | nyu | you might as well say that I have this right, but I won't get it |
| 00:20.37 | ShellEvil | There are reasons why binary blobs exist. |
| 00:20.48 | ShellEvil | They are not solely because bigcorp wants to screw you. |
| 00:20.59 | rwhitby | a discussion with someone who can only see the pros of a certain position, but is not able to see and discuss the cons, is not useful, since it will go nowhere. |
| 00:21.06 | nyu | does it matter? even if I could argue that they're wrong as an absolute truth, it'd be meaningless to you |
| 00:21.31 | nyu | since you accept blob producers are above this discussion |
| 00:21.41 | rwhitby | I think you've taken a leap there. |
| 00:21.55 | rwhitby | one can discuss the pros and cons of blobs |
| 00:22.06 | rwhitby | one can do so without taking a zealous position |
| 00:22.24 | nyu | no, truly it's the same. you even compared it with your natural unability to get an icecream right not |
| 00:22.33 | nyu | as if binary blobs were an act of god |
| 00:23.01 | ShellEvil | You started arguing that it was a right. |
| 00:23.08 | rwhitby | ShellEvil can always get ice-cream, if he has the money to buy it, or the ability to make it himself, or if society has changed to the point where everyone gets free ice cream. |
| 00:23.08 | nyu | it is my right |
| 00:23.29 | rwhitby | nyu: there lies the problem with this discussion |
| 00:23.37 | ShellEvil | If it's your right, then only buy hardware without binary blobs. |
| 00:23.39 | nyu | but you put "rights" of producers above it. producers don't have rights, only people do |
| 00:23.42 | rwhitby | why is it your right? |
| 00:23.45 | ShellEvil | I note you're not doing this. |
| 00:24.04 | rwhitby | how does one get a "right"? |
| 00:24.43 | nyu | rwhitby: good question. I suppose one gets a right by self-determination |
| 00:24.45 | ShellEvil | rwhitby: have a large army/navy to enforce such. |
| 00:24.51 | nyu | but then it needs to be claimed |
| 00:24.54 | rwhitby | Are rights given to you by someone, are they "god-given" (what if you don't believe in god?). Are they given to you by your state of nationality (what if you change states?) |
| 00:25.16 | rwhitby | nyu: is a "right" still a "right" if you're not getting it in practise? |
| 00:25.26 | nyu | so I have this unclaimed right, which is what puts me in the process of full-filling it |
| 00:25.33 | nyu | rwhitby: even more so |
| 00:25.40 | rwhitby | if you've not powerful enough to claim it, is it still a "right"? who says that it is? |
| 00:25.42 | nyu | rwhitby: because it means my karma is to fight for it |
| 00:25.58 | *** join/#openmoko jkyro (i=jasu@cs181095056.pp.htv.fi) |
| 00:26.14 | rwhitby | nyu: so ShellEvil self-determined that he has a right to free ice-cream. |
| 00:26.27 | rwhitby | why is that less valid than your claimed right to no blobs? |
| 00:26.37 | nyu | rwhitby: no, it's plainly confusing |
| 00:26.47 | ShellEvil | nyu: why? |
| 00:26.48 | johngay | The only right anyone has is to die. |
| 00:26.59 | rwhitby | why - he has claimed that right with no more or less authority than you have claimed your state right? |
| 00:27.05 | nyu | rwhitby: having right to privacy is on a completely different level than having right to 1 being != to 1 |
| 00:27.05 | mwester | has determined that he has a right to his neighbors very nice powerboat. (and the trailer upon which it is currently sitting) |
| 00:27.20 | rwhitby | johngay: in my country, you don't even have that right under law |
| 00:27.34 | mwester | suspects that attempting to act on his belief of that right might get him a nice comfy jail cell... :) |
| 00:27.39 | rwhitby | nyu: why? who gave you the former but not the latter? |
| 00:27.44 | nyu | rwhitby: there exists the concept of a conflict of rights, but having free icecream has nothing to do with that |
| 00:27.49 | nyu | icecreams don't have rights |
| 00:27.54 | johngay | Of course you do. Anyone can die. Everything else is a priviledge. |
| 00:27.56 | nyu | I thought this was obvious, oh well |
| 00:27.57 | ShellEvil | nyu: but I have the right to free ice-cream. |
| 00:28.08 | nyu | ShellEvil: I'm fine with that. go get it? |
| 00:28.23 | nyu | ShellEvil: I don't care as long as you don't mess with mine |
| 00:28.27 | rwhitby | nyu: you see how silly it is to discuss things based on "rights"? There is only pros and cons, not rights, when it comes to free software. |
| 00:28.38 | ShellEvil | nyu: No - the government has to give me it. |
| 00:28.47 | nyu | rwhitby: what's really silly is having a value system that is not fundamentally based on moral |
| 00:29.01 | rwhitby | nyu: ah, now please define "moral"? |
| 00:29.04 | johngay | Again, that's not a right, its a priviledge. |
| 00:29.11 | rwhitby | your morality may not be the same as my morality. |
| 00:29.16 | johngay | There are no rights except the right to die. |
| 00:29.20 | nyu | rwhitby: moral is not a logic system, I can't define it to you in the terms you expect me to |
| 00:29.39 | rwhitby | nyu: if you can't define it, then it has no meaning in a discussion about rights |
| 00:29.42 | johngay | Can we discuss 2007.2? |
| 00:29.52 | nyu | rwhitby: when you don't step on grey areas, it's pretty clear |
| 00:29.57 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@91.65.91.60) |
| 00:30.03 | white_gecko | hello |
| 00:30.04 | mwester | But it's all grey, really. |
| 00:30.11 | rwhitby | nyu: every area is grey, for various values of morality |
| 00:30.19 | rwhitby | cannibalism is quite ok in some cultures |
| 00:30.20 | nyu | mwester: is it? so you let strangers enter your home? |
| 00:30.23 | white_gecko | how can i change the gtk theme on 2008.8update ? |
| 00:30.55 | rwhitby | nyu: it's quite possible that your morality and my morality are quite similar, but you can't transfer that to everyone. |
| 00:30.56 | nyu | mwester: what about your computer? do you give anyone a shell in it? |
| 00:31.00 | mwester | nyu: yes. If they procure the correct id, with the correct document, I will open the door. |
| 00:31.02 | *** join/#openmoko tunys (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 00:31.05 | *** part/#openmoko sohail (n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail) |
| 00:31.15 | nyu | rwhitby: it's based on humanity in all cases |
| 00:31.21 | rwhitby | nyu: both of those arguments come down to pros and cons. I don't see a pro for doing either of those things, so I don't. |
| 00:31.25 | nyu | rwhitby: so there must be somrhing similar in them |
| 00:31.28 | rwhitby | No morality or rights are involved. |
| 00:31.34 | johngay | No point, white_gecko. Everyone's comparing their penis' right now. |
| 00:31.53 | ShellEvil | I have the right to compare my penis! |
| 00:32.01 | white_gecko | hm |
| 00:32.17 | rwhitby | nyu: so there is only pros and cons and personal choice. No rights or morality is required. |
| 00:32.23 | ShellEvil | declaims 'Shall I compare thee to a summers day?' |
| 00:32.24 | nyu | rwhitby: ok then. are there any pros of me using blobs that don't involve someone else's rights? |
| 00:32.36 | white_gecko | has the longest, there is no chance for anybody else |
| 00:32.42 | rwhitby | nyu: *now* we can have a discussion, without involving "rights" |
| 00:33.00 | nyu | rwhitby: if you think we can, answer that.. |
| 00:33.01 | mwester | nyu: Yes -- their existence in the first place may be because they remain "blobs" |
| 00:33.22 | rwhitby | nyu: did you see the email on the mailing list about the guy who lost his daughter in the shopping mall, and couldn't get her back quickly cause his FR was not working properly? |
| 00:33.34 | nyu | mwester: their existence without the existence of source code to generate them is completely implausible |
| 00:33.51 | rwhitby | nyu: the source code exists, it's just not available to you |
| 00:34.05 | nyu | rwhitby: I'm sorry about that. how is this related to the discussion? |
| 00:34.09 | ShellEvil | So you have a 48+10V=58V supply |
| 00:34.10 | ShellEvil | oops |
| 00:34.11 | nyu | rwhitby: why not? |
| 00:34.20 | white_gecko | so again: how can i change the gtk theme on 2008.8update ? |
| 00:34.21 | nyu | rwhitby: what are the pros of source code not being available to me? |
| 00:34.25 | mwester | nyu: What I'm pointing out is that the author of that source code may not have written it, if they had to give it up without any opportunity for personal gain, for example. |
| 00:34.55 | rwhitby | well, extend the inability to receive an emergency phone call to the point where someone with the source code to the GSM firmware is able to bring down the whole network |
| 00:35.03 | johngay | The Pro is the company who foolishly bought the source without redistibution rights won't get sued. |
| 00:35.08 | rwhitby | and then you see the con of everyone having gsm firmware source code |
| 00:35.19 | mwester | nyu: I am, for example, very protective of my employer's source code, because if it was freely available, then I would be unemployed. |
| 00:35.20 | nyu | rwhitby: not if the firmware is in a ROM |
| 00:35.40 | rwhitby | nyu: the secrets in the source code can enable exploits |
| 00:35.46 | nyu | mwester: but that's not because of a natural process, only because of society |
| 00:35.50 | ShellEvil | In many cases, the firmware is the hard part of the design. |
| 00:36.01 | ShellEvil | If you give away the firmware, it's easy to copy. |
| 00:36.02 | mwester | nyu: irrelevant. |
| 00:36.12 | nyu | rwhitby: bugs enable exploits. obfuscation doesn't prevent them |
| 00:36.29 | nyu | mwester: nature doesn't know "rights". society does |
| 00:36.31 | rwhitby | nyu: yes, but it's not *your* decision whether obfuscation may delay them or not |
| 00:37.09 | nyu | rwhitby: correct. my decisions only concern my own ownership |
| 00:37.13 | rwhitby | the decision has been made by the producers of the GSM network, that source code will not be shared. Either live with that, or create your own competing network. |
| 00:37.18 | nyu | such as the devices I own, and what they do |
| 00:37.37 | rwhitby | you have no other choice, since you don't own the asset which is the source code |
| 00:37.59 | nyu | rwhitby: so if I reverse-engineered it, and exploited the flaws, shutting down the whole network, you think this is perfectly fine, because I was able to do it? |
| 00:38.20 | nyu | rwhitby: it's in my device, therefore I own it |
| 00:38.21 | rwhitby | no, the system relies on laws as well to slow down the occurance of that situation |
| 00:38.47 | ShellEvil | nyu: radio is _not_ a private uncontended medium. |
| 00:38.50 | johngay | Can we quit comparing penis' and get back to discussing FRs???? |
| 00:38.51 | rwhitby | nyu: if you own the source code, why do you not have it yet? |
| 00:39.03 | ShellEvil | nyu: the impacts of users have effects that cannot be mitigated in software. |
| 00:39.04 | nyu | rwhitby: someone stole it from me |
| 00:39.08 | nyu | rwhitby: a pirate |
| 00:39.12 | rwhitby | nyu: you didn't have it in the first place |
| 00:39.23 | nyu | rwhitby: I was entitled to it |
| 00:39.27 | rwhitby | if you had already had it, then you should have copied the source before they stole it |
| 00:39.41 | ShellEvil | nyu: if someone transmits on a frequency they are not allocated, that affects all of the allocated users. |
| 00:39.44 | rwhitby | nyu: ah, now you've brought "rights" back into the discussion - you can't do that remember. |
| 00:40.25 | *** join/#openmoko RayDar (n=raydar@c-67-171-26-100.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 00:40.26 | nyu | rwhitby: ok, want the reverse? I break into bigcorps' hq and copy the source code |
| 00:40.36 | nyu | do I have rights now? |
| 00:40.38 | johngay | What about people's right to discuss FR on this list?????????????? |
| 00:41.18 | *** join/#openmoko RayDar (n=raydar@c-67-171-26-100.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 00:41.21 | nyu | rwhitby: do you see a problem in that situation? |
| 00:41.26 | rwhitby | nyu: you have the right to die when someone with greater force (the government) puts you in jail for breaking the law |
| 00:41.50 | nyu | rwhitby: but I could escape from jail. does that mean it's my right to escape? |
| 00:41.53 | rwhitby | but that's discussing rights, which has no place in this discussion |
| 00:42.13 | johngay | This discussion has no place on this list!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 00:42.47 | nyu | rwhitby: your whole argument line is based on the assumption that the only absolute moral is the law of the strongest |
| 00:43.01 | rwhitby | nyu: that is the way of nature, yes. |
| 00:43.22 | rwhitby | everything else is personal choice and pros and cons |
| 00:43.22 | nyu | rwhitby: indeed, but it has nothing to do with rights or moral |
| 00:43.44 | mmontour | notes that there is an "#openmoko-offtopic" channel on freenode... |
| 00:43.44 | rwhitby | johngay: you're absolutely right, my apologies to you. |
| 00:43.48 | niklauz | besides, the way of nature is not something that is perfectly understood |
| 00:43.51 | nyu | heh |
| 00:43.55 | *** join/#openmoko mmaestri (i=c9fe56a5@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-e83bac4afaff9a69) |
| 00:43.57 | nyu | johngay is right |
| 00:44.02 | nyu | that's funny :-) |
| 00:44.20 | nyu | rwhitby: so we finally agree. I can go to sleep now |
| 00:44.25 | johngay | Some people here would like to discuss problems with their phones, not the world. |
| 00:44.35 | nyu | johngay: sorry about that |
| 00:44.48 | rwhitby | I'd like to get the GSM source code too. I'm just realistic about my chances of doing so outside of an NDA. |
| 00:45.36 | nyu | aww, 2:44 |
| 00:45.46 | rwhitby | (Since the entity that owns that source code has made a choice based on personal pros and cons not to give it to me) |
| 00:45.47 | johngay | <white_gecko> how can i change the gtk theme on 2008.8update ? |
| 00:46.20 | mwester | johngay: You could just post your comments; this isn't like a telephone where only one party can be heard at a time, you know! :) |
| 00:47.07 | johngay | white_gecko posted twice in less than two minutes. He was drown out but the noise. |
| 00:47.10 | rwhitby | mwester: no, johngay is completely correct - this dicussion was so far offtopic that it should have moved very early on. |
| 00:47.10 | nyu | mwester: does this really happen? :-/ |
| 00:47.44 | rwhitby | a discussion of pros and cons of releasing gsm source code, without any mention of rights or morals, however, would be completely on-topic |
| 00:48.14 | johngay | No, because discussing it won't change the fact that it won't happen. |
| 00:48.23 | mwester | Well, feel free to answer his question, johngay. I certainly saw his post, but since I don't know that answer, it's not as if he was ignored, at least by me. |
| 00:48.58 | rwhitby | johngay: yeah, there is that point. Somehow those who are zealous proponents of getting it don't understand that aspect of it. |
| 00:49.04 | nyu | rwhitby: I think the problem in this case is not really for who makes that decision, but about laws that prevent it |
| 00:49.20 | nyu | it's pretty understandable that one doesn't want to go into jail |
| 00:49.32 | ShellEvil | nyu: radio is a shared resource. |
| 00:49.40 | rwhitby | nyu: then write to your lawmakers and get the law changed, or run for a position in your government :-) |
| 00:49.41 | johngay | I don't know the answer either, but his question scrolled off sreen so fast that I doubt anyone who might know the answer saw it. |
| 00:49.46 | nyu | (and yes, I do understand that aspect - assuming you call me zealous) |
| 00:50.11 | ShellEvil | nyu: if someone chose to write a 'send file between FRs' app, that used a radio channel, they'd get maybe 256K of data bandwidth between two handsets within a kilometer. |
| 00:50.24 | mwester | johngay: That's probably true. I must have missed the IRC rules about ensuring that questions don't scroll of the screen ;) |
| 00:50.25 | ShellEvil | nyu: this however would knock 8-16 people off calls. |
| 00:50.31 | rwhitby | nyu: you're only mildly zealous in my opinion (and that's just my opinion :-) |
| 00:50.35 | ShellEvil | nyu: some of which may be emergency calls. |
| 00:50.47 | nyu | rwhitby: you're entitled to your opinion! ;-) |
| 00:51.08 | rwhitby | nyu: no I'm not. people only choose whether to hear it or not. |
| 00:51.09 | nyu | ShellEvil: indeed. then we have a conflict of rights. see? :-) |
| 00:51.13 | ShellEvil | nyu: The primary reason that phones work so well is that other phones don't transmit on the same frequency/allocation at the same time. The towers schedule this. |
| 00:51.23 | johngay | I've been trying to upgrade 2007.2 from the repositories set in the filesystem, but it seems to be slightly broken. |
| 00:51.42 | rwhitby | johngay: since no-one is maintaining 2007.2, why do you expect it to work? |
| 00:51.45 | mwester | 2007.2 hasn't been maintained by Om for a loong time, |
| 00:51.46 | ShellEvil | nyu: remove this constraint, and you break the mobile phone system. |
| 00:51.49 | johngay | Does anyone know a more reliable source and where I edit it? |
| 00:52.21 | rwhitby | johngay: I'm not aware of a tested 2007.2 to 2008.8 upgrade path, so the answer from me is "unfortunately, no". |
| 00:53.04 | nyu | ShellEvil: how deeply has this been analized technically? I.e. tried to design it in a way that a mallicious node wouldn't be disruptive |
| 00:53.04 | nyu | cope with noise, etc |
| 00:53.04 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z7337.z.pppool.de) |
| 00:53.04 | mwester | AFAIK nobody has been maintaining it, so if there are any updates, they have not been tested with the rest of the 2007.2 components, so it may or may not work. |
| 00:53.04 | tunys | I can't get on an unsecured wireless network with 2007.2 :/ |
| 00:53.04 | ShellEvil | nyu: you fundamentally cannot - without seriosly complicating the system. |
| 00:53.04 | johngay | But yesterday, someone pointed out a source with a working libtododb. |
| 00:53.05 | ShellEvil | nyu: and reducing range. |
| 00:53.05 | *** join/#openmoko cnwdup_ (n=harlekin@hnvr-4dbd4d0b.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 00:53.28 | tunys | keeps saying "Sending discover..." |
| 00:53.28 | johngay | I can, tunys. |
| 00:53.33 | tunys | johncylee: what did you do? |
| 00:53.34 | mwester | tunys: You would need to manually install and configure the software to do it - iwconfig, wpa if necessary. :( |
| 00:53.34 | ShellEvil | nyu: the reason the towers are able to pick up distant small transmitters is simply because they are coordinated by the tower not to interfere with each otehr. |
| 00:53.55 | ShellEvil | nyu: there is nothing 'smart' you can do with the protocol that makes it resistant to this fact. |
| 00:53.58 | johngay | I didn't need to install anything. |
| 00:54.02 | nyu | ShellEvil: security by obfuscation. seen this before... |
| 00:54.15 | ShellEvil | nyu: It's a contended resource. |
| 00:54.24 | kgoetz | so is everything |
| 00:54.25 | johngay | But you need to discover the ESSID of your network, then set it with iwconfig. |
| 00:54.27 | ShellEvil | nyu: there has to be security measures. It is _NOT_ the internet. |
| 00:54.28 | nyu | and it'll eventually break, with or without source code |
| 00:54.40 | nyu | oh well |
| 00:54.55 | ShellEvil | nyu: the internet is point-point (largely) |
| 00:55.10 | ShellEvil | nyu: radio is point-all-points in range |
| 00:55.22 | nyu | ShellEvil: I understand that this makes it a very difficult problem to solve |
| 00:55.23 | ShellEvil | nyu: what works for the internet does not work with radio. |
| 00:55.45 | nyu | then again, I'm guessing no serious effort has been put into solving it |
| 00:55.51 | mwester | Actually, yes. |
| 00:55.58 | mwester | The problem is $$$$$$$$$$ |
| 00:56.07 | mmontour | nyu: if you want to play around with DIY/open-source radio communication, I suggest getting an amateur radio license |
| 00:56.21 | mwester | In order to make the handset affordable, compromised have to be made. |
| 00:56.25 | nyu | mmontour: well, I'm not really into that |
| 00:56.55 | mwester | Secure protocols *do* exist (think of public safety trunking radios, and military comms). |
| 00:57.13 | nyu | ShellEvil: then again, I bet it'll be amusing when kids can create jamming devices that shut down entire cells |
| 00:57.14 | ShellEvil | But security protocols are _not_ the problem. |
| 00:57.20 | ShellEvil | But security protocols are _not_ the problem. |
| 00:57.32 | mmontour | nyu: or create some interesting applications using the ad-hoc WiFi capabilities of the Freerunner |
| 00:57.47 | nyu | mmontour: mesh networking? |
| 00:57.49 | ShellEvil | The problem is jamming cannot be countered without going to _much_ larger antennas. |
| 00:57.49 | nyu | sounds cool |
| 00:57.52 | Toaster` | hrm... my settings won't close |
| 00:58.02 | ShellEvil | And mesh networking does _not_ fix this. |
| 00:58.18 | rwhitby | nyu: yeah, very amusing when someone dies because of it |
| 00:58.48 | mwester | Toaster`: depending on your firmware image, I don't think it's supposed to - just bring the "home" application to the foreground instead. |
| 00:59.19 | Toaster` | mwester: interesting. |
| 00:59.22 | ShellEvil | nyu: think of it not as a security problem - unregulated users - it's not. It's a DDOS problem |
| 00:59.22 | nyu | rwhitby: if a resource is unreliable, I call it an irresponsability to put human lifes in it |
| 00:59.42 | rwhitby | nyu: there you go with zealous responses again ... |
| 00:59.46 | ShellEvil | nyu: you cannot counter a DDOS from a local node if it's swamped. |
| 01:00.03 | nyu | rwhitby: you use that work a lot. it was just an opinion... |
| 01:00.19 | nyu | rwhitby: your comment was more zealous than mine |
| 01:00.20 | rwhitby | every single resource in the world is unreliable. yet we use a range of things to save human life |
| 01:00.23 | mwester | nyu: "reliability" is always measured on a continuum. |
| 01:01.01 | nyu | 2:59 am |
| 01:01.02 | nyu | dammit |
| 01:01.09 | ShellEvil | Emergency whistles for use in mountains are useless if people get into the habit of blowing them randomly, forex. |
| 01:01.14 | nyu | my internal clock, _that_ is unreliability |
| 01:01.29 | nyu | good night all ;-) |
| 01:01.57 | rwhitby | good night nyu |
| 01:02.12 | Toaster` | Anyone know of a good pre-paid SIM/company in Italy? |
| 01:02.51 | *** join/#openmoko hklein_ (n=hklein@i59F743B6.versanet.de) |
| 01:03.54 | *** join/#openmoko azmodie (n=azmodie@92-233-163-159.cable.ubr09.dund.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 01:05.14 | *** join/#openmoko everslick (n=clemens@212-183-119-124.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 01:07.23 | *** join/#openmoko TeLLuS (n=Johan@179.108.227.87.static.f.siw.siwnet.net) |
| 01:14.12 | johngay | tunys, you still here? |
| 01:14.27 | tunys | yeah, got it working |
| 01:14.37 | johngay | Glad I could help. |
| 01:14.40 | tunys | what's the opkg for the web browser? openmoo-browser? |
| 01:14.43 | tunys | yeah, thanks! |
| 01:14.57 | johngay | openmoko-browser2 |
| 01:16.05 | johngay | I can't get todo or timesheet to work, and now I've broken messages too. |
| 01:21.40 | *** part/#openmoko Quadduc (n=quadduc@90.149.196.137) |
| 01:21.52 | *** join/#openmoko BLAAAAAHHH (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 01:23.21 | johngay | I keep running opkg upgrade, and it keeps opgrading more stuff? Unfortunately, it fails to re-start X so I have to reboot it manually. |
| 01:24.23 | Toaster` | johngay: are you upgrading over ssh? |
| 01:24.41 | johngay | No. Via the terminal on the phone. |
| 01:25.19 | Toaster` | ok, I was having issues with dropbear updating, ending my connection, and killing the sessions/upgrade. But I guess that wouldn't affect you |
| 01:25.27 | johngay | I don't have ssh on my desktop, though I do have PuTTY on my daughters Vista laptop /-= |
| 01:25.46 | johngay | That's mentioned on the getting started wiki page. |
| 01:26.20 | mwester | uses putty even on his linux systems - excellent terminal emulator |
| 01:26.39 | white_gecko | so, does now somebody know how i can change the gtk theme |
| 01:26.57 | white_gecko | i want the gtk theme of 2007.2 on 2008.8update |
| 01:26.59 | johngay | I putty available for FR? or it's equiv? |
| 01:27.04 | Toaster` | johngay: I know, I was just tired at the time and didn't put 2 and 2 together |
| 01:27.19 | white_gecko | because the png's are to slow |
| 01:28.05 | mwester | There's a "putty" recipe in OE, but I don't know that it's in the feeds for Om |
| 01:29.05 | johngay | I want to get a USB to Serial cable so I can use my phone to log into IBM and Sun server's via their serial managment port. |
| 01:29.32 | mwester | I guess how useful it would be depends a lot on how useful the keyboard app turns out to be, and the discussions around that have been somewhat worrisome. |
| 01:29.33 | johngay | Then I can ask the smug SA's if they can do that with their crackberries? |
| 01:30.23 | mwester | Use one of the bluetooth serial ports paired with the freerunner -- then you don't even have the cable. |
| 01:30.30 | Dave | hrm |
| 01:30.37 | Dave | needs a gamepad |
| 01:30.39 | Dave | :) |
| 01:30.54 | johngay | Dave? Dave's not here, man. |
| 01:31.24 | Dave | Fuck you, John. |
| 01:31.34 | mwester | Looks like minicom or microcom shouild be in the feeds, though -that'll work. |
| 01:31.48 | johngay | You're not my type. |
| 01:31.55 | Dave | Good. |
| 01:32.19 | AntonTakk | woot! |
| 01:32.43 | mwester | sounds like somebody dropped the freerunner on their toe |
| 01:33.13 | AntonTakk | contacts app can add and view, deleting uses the same info as view just with a different function |
| 01:33.23 | johngay | Sounds like I realy got under Dave's skin. |
| 01:34.42 | AntonTakk | anyone around that might be able to help with edje guis later? |
| 01:35.20 | Dave | mwester, it hurts! |
| 01:35.23 | *** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@91.65.91.60) |
| 01:35.31 | Dave | damn thing is quite weighty :p |
| 01:36.14 | Jozo | mwester: or just screen |
| 01:36.36 | rwhitby | mwester: putty in OE doesn't build (at least on FSO) |
| 01:36.49 | Dave | rut roh |
| 01:37.08 | Dave | rwhitby, what sort of twisted experiments are you up to now? :) |
| 01:37.18 | johngay | tosses Dave a Scoobie snak |
| 01:37.28 | rwhitby | Dave: I just try and add to the fso feeds any apps that people mention. |
| 01:37.51 | rwhitby | on the basis that I'll probably need them at some point, so if they are there already then I win. |
| 01:38.53 | Dave | ah! |
| 01:39.08 | Dave | So, did you win? :P |
| 01:39.25 | rwhitby | always do |
| 01:39.27 | mwester | rwhitby: I shall add it to my list of package to take a look at fixing. |
| 01:42.10 | johngay | If 2007.2 hasn't been opdated in ages, then what's it the daily-feed that keep upgrading on my phone? |
| 01:44.01 | Dave | packages? |
| 01:44.05 | Dave | There are updates. |
| 01:44.19 | Dave | Maybe you're just not examining the changes/output carefully. |
| 01:45.13 | johngay | OK, so when someone earlier told my that it hadn't been updated in months, they were mis-informed? |
| 01:45.25 | *** join/#openmoko BLAAAAAHHH (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 01:46.14 | johngay | I've just been running opkg upgrade trying to get my phone up to date so I can start digging into what's broken and why. |
| 01:47.31 | Dave | there was a couple distro fuckups |
| 01:47.33 | Dave | (hiccups) |
| 01:47.41 | Dave | actually, yeah, fuckups |
| 01:48.00 | Dave | so that may have been what led you to believe that it was no longer under development |
| 01:48.03 | Dave | which is crazy :p |
| 01:48.28 | johngay | Is there a better place to upgrade 2007.2 from that daily-feed? |
| 01:48.49 | johngay | *than |
| 01:53.46 | hipitihop | has nyone fixed the 'init' to '_init' in /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/gtk-2.0/gtk/__init__.py |
| 01:53.53 | johngay | I mean, at some point, opkg should quit installing thing, right? |
| 01:54.36 | hipitihop | johngay, it does for me I'm on 2008.8 upgraded |
| 01:55.45 | rwhitby | johngay: the daily-feed is a set of isolated package updates, which could have come from changes based on requirements from any distro in OE (not just Openmoko) |
| 01:56.07 | rwhitby | it is not a coherent feed for 2007.02 (or any other distro for that matter) |
| 01:56.09 | *** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-75-73-28-183.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 01:56.44 | rwhitby | there is no coherent place to upgrade 2007.2, since no-one is maintaining that release. |
| 01:57.32 | johngay | Then why did Dave just tell me it was? And why are there new packages for it in daily-feed? |
| 01:57.33 | rwhitby | there are coherent places for Om2008.8 and FSO as far as I know. Qtopia (Trolltech) also has a coherent upgrade place, but it contains no non-qtopia-specific packages. |
| 01:58.29 | rwhitby | what did Dave tell you |
| 01:59.08 | rwhitby | (I wouldn't believe half of what Dave says most of the time anyway, since I can never tell what is serious and what is not) |
| 02:00.07 | rwhitby | johngay: daily-feed was never stated as an official update place for 2007.2 - all official upgrade places are on downloads.openmoko.org |
| 02:00.40 | rwhitby | it's just that people saw that individual package updates were happening there, and assumed that someone was managing it in a coherent way, which is an invalid assumption for buildhost |
| 02:01.15 | rwhitby | so whilst you will see individual package updates there, it is very likely that using it as an upgrade feed will break the consistency of the OS on your phone. |
| 02:02.05 | johngay | But it was already set in the rootfs? |
| 02:02.38 | johngay | So buildhost.openmoko.org/daily-feed is NOT a good place to update from? |
| 02:03.24 | rwhitby | buildhost was never set in the rootfs as far as I know |
| 02:03.53 | johngay | I never changed anything. I only ran opkg update && opkg upgrade. |
| 02:04.11 | rwhitby | have you seen the emails from OM stating that the http server on buildhost is going to be turned off? |
| 02:04.31 | johngay | no. |
| 02:05.06 | johngay | So, where should I point opkg? |
| 02:05.21 | mwester | I just checked; it looks like at least the snapshot builds of 2007.2 did indeed point to buildhost. They should not have done so, but at the time I don't think that any proper feeds existed. Seems nobody ever fixed that. :( |
| 02:05.36 | rwhitby | Subject "Repository and Images", from julian_chu@openmoko.com to community@lists.openmoko.org and devel@lists.openmoko.org on 26/08/2008 10:37 PM |
| 02:06.10 | rwhitby | johngay: as I said, there is no coherent feed available for 2007.2 |
| 02:06.21 | rwhitby | OM wants you to use 2008.8, and only supports that. |
| 02:06.22 | mwester | johngay: I don't think there are or will be any official Om feeds for 2007.2; they've abandoned that source base. Perhaps someone in the community will create one (or has done so already?) |
| 02:07.21 | johngay | OK. But 2008 doesn't have a terminal, and suspend keeps dropping PuTTY and can't be turned off )-: |
| 02:08.02 | johngay | 2007.2 mostly works for my. 2008.8 doesn't. |
| 02:10.11 | mwester | The fact that there currently are no reasonably functional images for the device is why I've pretty much stopped working on the Om kernel suspend/resume stuff for a while -- it's rather pointless, and it's also very difficult when there's no stable user-space stuff to test the kernel with. |
| 02:11.23 | mwester | Frankly 2008.8 smell to me like one of those releases where the developers just get tired of the pressure, and take something that's obviously un-usable, and fling it at the Marketing people who are driving the release date. |
| 02:12.13 | mwester | I'm waiting for either Om to get it right (very soon), or for the SHR release. |
| 02:13.24 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org) |
| 02:14.17 | johngay | I think you'll be waiting a long time for Om to get it right. They're waiting on us to fix it for them. |
| 02:17.15 | johngay | Funny though. Yesterday, before I tried 2008.8, opkg update && opkg uprade got to the point of complaining that it couldn't install ncurses due to a conflict and didn't try to install anything else. Now it just keeps going and going and going . . . |
| 02:18.04 | johngay | I would think I'd get back to the same point. |
| 02:19.26 | rwhitby | mwester: that's why I'm using FSO |
| 02:19.57 | rwhitby | (as well as the fact that nothing else recent runs on a GTA01) |
| 02:22.13 | jadams_ | rwhitby, yeah, I suffer the gta01 troubles as well. did you ever try fso-pkg/debian again on it? |
| 02:22.25 | jadams_ | the debian installer failed for me on the gta01 as well |
| 02:22.37 | rwhitby | jadams_: nope. |
| 02:22.48 | rwhitby | jadams_: there is a gta01 debian installer script now |
| 02:22.48 | mwester | rwhitby: is bearstech building FSO images right now? |
| 02:23.05 | rwhitby | mwester: http://tinderbox.openembedded.net/builders/shr.bearstech.com/ |
| 02:23.23 | rwhitby | and http://shr.bearstech.com/README |
| 02:23.23 | tkep | so, did today's updates break everyone's enlightenment? |
| 02:23.47 | mwester | Cool. I'm going to add a third OS image to my SD card then, and have a quad-boot GTA01. :) |
| 02:24.18 | rwhitby | mwester: 0,15,30,45 * * * * nice /home/shr/admin/start-autobuild |
| 02:25.05 | rwhitby | mwester: and I can get you access if you desire |
| 02:25.22 | rwhitby | (but you can already affect it directly through OE commits) |
| 02:25.38 | mwester | Well, that's pretty much "game, set, and match" -- looks like SHR and FSO have a better build infrastructure than Om does right now! I love the stats... |
| 02:26.04 | rwhitby | mwester: well, what do you expect? Om hasn't employed me ;-) |
| 02:26.14 | tkep | so, did today's updates break everyone's enlightenment? (x2) |
| 02:26.17 | tkep | :-D |
| 02:26.21 | rwhitby | tkep: which distro? |
| 02:26.22 | mwester | The road to ruin and despair: employment by Om! :D |
| 02:26.25 | tkep | om2008 |
| 02:26.32 | tkep | i get a fatal error when i boot now :) |
| 02:26.34 | rwhitby | dunno then, sorry. |
| 02:26.53 | tkep | segv'd enlightenment :) |
| 02:26.54 | mwester | tkep: error message? |
| 02:27.12 | mwester | Ah, ok. thanks. |
| 02:27.40 | tkep | This is very bad, Enlightenment Segv'd |
| 02:27.45 | tkep | and no real info |
| 02:27.53 | tkep | what a lame error, it feels like i'm in windows |
| 02:28.02 | tkep | haha |
| 02:28.32 | mwester | You should be able to ssh into the device, and start it from the ssh session -- or perhaps see if there's a log file, of course. |
| 02:28.42 | mwester | (Can't do that with windows ;) |
| 02:28.42 | johngay | You sure you didn't install WinCE by mistake? |
| 02:28.48 | tkep | mwester, yeah, i'm checking that right now :) |
| 02:28.59 | tkep | but i'm upgrading right now |
| 02:29.05 | tkep | let's see if these new packages fix that |
| 02:30.33 | johngay | So what's the state of FSO? |
| 02:31.18 | AntonTakk | pre-alpha? |
| 02:31.29 | tkep | ok, here is likely my issue.... |
| 02:31.42 | AntonTakk | but generally usable (ime) |
| 02:31.51 | tkep | it looks like the problem is from files being provided by older packages... |
| 02:31.58 | tkep | i'm going to try to force the installs |
| 02:33.55 | johngay | OK. Looks like only timesheet, todo and messages is broken on my 2007.2 install. I can live with that for a little while, though I do prefer to txt than talk, but I don't have any txt's on my SIM ATM anyway. |
| 02:34.58 | AntonTakk | woo, as soon as i get editing a contact working i'll be ready to start on the gui :) |
| 02:35.45 | AntonTakk | that will be difficult, i'm not goot at designing interfaces |
| 02:38.15 | johngay | Nite all. I guess I'll just take 2007.2 for what it is. It works enough for me to get started. |
| 02:38.45 | johngay | Just wish I didn't need to keep it plugged in all the time (-; |
| 02:40.19 | tkep | i think a -force-overwrite will fix my issue |
| 02:40.25 | tkep | if it doesn't, i'll look into it more |
| 02:40.27 | tkep | :) |
| 02:41.17 | hipitihop | anyone know if there is a TomeRaider like ebook reader, sur would be nice to have offline version of wikipedia and the like |
| 02:41.22 | *** join/#openmoko rooly|away (n=chris@ip70-188-121-225.lf.br.cox.net) |
| 02:43.06 | tunys | what is bricode doing in South America? |
| 02:45.05 | tkep | we're booting, let's see if i can get by without an enlightenment error |
| 02:45.06 | tkep | nope |
| 02:45.09 | tkep | fucking hell |
| 02:45.18 | tkep | errrrr, freaking heck |
| 02:45.19 | tkep | sorry |
| 02:46.26 | tkep | where does it log? i've never really looked at logs...there's no messages file |
| 02:46.39 | tunys | bricode was last seen on a highway in San Jose |
| 02:46.46 | tunys | it's fun to stalk people with TangoGPS! |
| 02:47.23 | *** join/#openmoko unknown_lamer (n=clinton@cpe-071-065-238-103.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 02:48.15 | tkep | what is the equivalent of /var/log/massages for om2008? |
| 02:49.53 | *** join/#openmoko charlie137 (n=charlie@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 02:52.21 | mwester | wonders if tkep is in the right part of town for what he's looking for... |
| 02:52.35 | tkep | ? |
| 02:52.44 | mwester | spelling... |
| 02:53.00 | tkep | hahaha |
| 02:53.00 | mwester | try "logread" |
| 02:53.05 | tkep | messages that is |
| 02:54.10 | mwester | At least "logread" gets me all sorts of stuff; can't say if enlightenment actually logs to syslog, though. |
| 02:54.18 | rwhitby | johngay: fso is stable, but with limited functionality. their goal is to produce a stable framework, and just enough gui on it to test the framework. |
| 02:54.28 | tkep | yeah, logread was good, thanks mwester...grepping to see what i find |
| 02:55.25 | tkep | hmmmm....found some bad blocks, that's really weird |
| 02:55.30 | *** join/#openmoko RobSims (n=robsims@dilbert.robsims.com) |
| 02:57.14 | tkep | eh---it'll probably be quicker to just flash it...i have some things i need to do (like make phone calls :)) |
| 03:18.52 | *** join/#openmoko hanez (n=hanez@c198214.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 03:19.36 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-254.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 03:20.44 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org) |
| 03:25.38 | *** join/#openmoko slaxxin (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net) |
| 03:25.41 | slaxxin | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:25.56 | slaxxin | is that a new qtopia? |
| 03:27.18 | hipitihop | slaxxin, ?? |
| 03:27.56 | slaxxin | the qtopia 4.3.2 |
| 03:28.04 | slaxxin | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:28.37 | slaxxin | did i miss it? |
| 03:29.05 | hipitihop | depends on your reference point, yes they recently updated it but seems to have same version number |
| 03:29.21 | slaxxin | o |
| 03:29.45 | slaxxin | so what did they change |
| 03:30.16 | kgoetz | look at teh changelog? |
| 03:30.55 | slaxxin | i might need to flash although im having ok luck with my 2008.830 |
| 03:31.09 | slaxxin | ok |
| 03:31.11 | slaxxin | sorry |
| 03:32.34 | *** join/#openmoko rooly|awa1 (n=chris@ip70-188-121-225.lf.br.cox.net) |
| 03:32.41 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-72-53-89.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 03:45.40 | slaxxin | anybody running the qtopia update? |
| 03:48.16 | ljp | yes |
| 03:49.02 | *** join/#openmoko vk5foss (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 03:49.22 | mwester | yep |
| 03:53.53 | johnsu01 | yes |
| 03:54.04 | johnsu01 | very nice except for I still can't make phone calls that the other person can here |
| 03:54.05 | johnsu01 | hear |
| 03:56.32 | RobSims | Anyone have 11G working? I can connect to B or BG access points, but can't connect to my 11G - only AP. Am I missing a setting somewhere? I've tried iwconfig, qtopia's interface, and various dbus hacks |
| 03:57.55 | vk5foss | sounds like you can only connect to B, if its a BG ap, it'll do what you can (which sounds like not-g |
| 03:58.13 | RobSims | The AP is set to G only |
| 03:58.55 | RobSims | The AP talks to several other clients, and is visible via iwlist and the GUI apps |
| 03:59.35 | *** join/#openmoko Bambi_BOFH (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 04:02.36 | *** join/#openmoko daten (n=daten@e178185232.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 04:04.25 | slaxxin | several other linux clients? |
| 04:04.45 | RobSims | Yes, and Windows |
| 04:05.15 | *** join/#openmoko milos_ (n=milos@92.36.155.230) |
| 04:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-38-16.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 04:07.14 | slaxxin | what the freerunner capable of on wiofi?/ |
| 04:07.35 | RobSims | Says a/b/g |
| 04:07.49 | raster | giggles |
| 04:07.54 | RobSims | Chip a/b/g, circuits b/g |
| 04:08.05 | ljp | wow. the default gsmhandset.state thinks I am deaf and talk really loud |
| 04:08.14 | slaxxin | then its just a b/g |
| 04:08.36 | slaxxin | i might be wrong |
| 04:09.11 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=shakthim@61.16.248.242) |
| 04:09.15 | slaxxin | ok im stupid |
| 04:09.45 | RobSims | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FreeRunner_Overview#Specifications says b/g |
| 04:10.46 | slaxxin | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:12.33 | RobSims | Netgear WGR614v5 |
| 04:13.28 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77_ (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 04:14.04 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1562: 12 hour time format does not work ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1562 ) |
| 04:15.10 | *** join/#openmoko kgoetz (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 04:16.25 | slaxxin | i seem to have to plug an unplug then replug my freerunner to get it to start charging |
| 04:16.51 | slaxxin | gonna wear me plug out |
| 04:18.16 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.183.148) |
| 04:19.17 | slaxxin | on 2008.8 i cant figure out how to copy from notes an paste to terminal |
| 04:22.30 | mpr | raster: seems that installing anything through the repository installer reverts the keyboard to the qtopia one in your image |
| 04:22.52 | mpr | got any idea how to fix that easily? |
| 04:24.28 | rooly | restart x |
| 04:25.29 | slaxxin | it could be that the time is not set on that router have u checked that? |
| 04:26.16 | slaxxin | that might sound stupid |
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| 04:30.22 | RobSims | The time is set, but to some time in 2003 |
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| 04:33.11 | slaxxin | well |
| 04:33.48 | slaxxin | good security probly uses timestamps |
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| 04:34.41 | slaxxin | so would it hurt to set it to THE CORRECT TIME? |
| 04:38.13 | tunys | slaxxin: yes, very much so |
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| 04:39.43 | RobSims | There is no way to set the time on the router. It's hard coded to fetch the time from the net, and the WAN port of the router is not connected. |
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| 04:44.51 | lindi- | wonders of proprietary software :) |
| 04:46.27 | RobSims | It gets worse: http://www.networkworld.com/news/2003/0901wisconsin.html |
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| 04:55.47 | hipitihop | If it is of any interest to anyone, but I have been using 2008-updated for the last few days and so far any calls made or received have been clear and echo free |
| 04:59.04 | Dave | Thanks Hippityhop, though I believe even now, people [using the same distro] have experienced bad calls, or their calls have just been fucked up in general. |
| 04:59.11 | Dave | It seems to vary from person to person, etc. |
| 04:59.19 | Dave | Though thanks for letting us know :) |
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| 05:06.17 | AntonTakk | I suddenly realize the elements for the contacts are horribly small for using a finger, but otherwise - opinions?: http://poolofdespair.net/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=110 |
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| 05:25.28 | AntonTakk | almost have contact editing working :) |
| 05:26.47 | beni_ | cool |
| 05:26.51 | rooly | making your own contact manager? |
| 05:27.07 | rooly | is it sql or evolution |
| 05:28.05 | raster | man being an unemployed bum feels good |
| 05:28.19 | raster | feels himself just to rub it in |
| 05:29.08 | Sup3rkiddo | raster, no longer with Om? |
| 05:29.16 | raster | aye |
| 05:29.22 | raster | fweedom |
| 05:29.52 | Sup3rkiddo | raster, i bet you stole some Freerunners..:D |
| 05:30.00 | raster | well - i have 2 |
| 05:30.03 | raster | didnt steal |
| 05:30.09 | raster | they havent been asked for back |
| 05:30.18 | raster | if they want them.. they can have them |
| 05:30.18 | AntonTakk | rooly: evolution |
| 05:30.32 | raster | but it will pretty much mean i'll not support the FR |
| 05:30.41 | raster | as i just lost my hardware platform |
| 05:30.43 | raster | :) |
| 05:30.46 | Sup3rkiddo | lol |
| 05:31.04 | pabs3 | anyone know if there is a way to export an sd card or internal flash as usb-storage? |
| 05:31.12 | raster | om: "hey we have a bug with *whatever*" |
| 05:31.26 | raster | me: "you figure it out - you are the ones with the hardware" :) |
| 05:31.46 | edistar | raster: hi raster, your OM days should be over today, right? |
| 05:32.11 | pabs3 | they switching away from e17 ?? |
| 05:32.21 | raster | not that i know of |
| 05:32.30 | raster | that'd be a fair bit of work to do |
| 05:32.31 | raster | :) |
| 05:32.43 | raster | either way i plan to continue work on it |
| 05:32.50 | raster | but now my priorities are important |
| 05:32.56 | raster | not om's |
| 05:32.56 | Sup3rkiddo | raster, you will be still spending time on illume and friends, wouldn't you? |
| 05:33.02 | edistar | what are you planning to do now? |
| 05:33.05 | raster | if they happen to coincide - great |
| 05:33.15 | raster | Sup3rkiddo: yes. but i'll work on FSO |
| 05:33.23 | raster | not OM/ASU/2008.* |
| 05:33.26 | Sup3rkiddo | chweet |
| 05:33.38 | edistar | any specific plans? |
| 05:34.24 | raster | not really |
| 05:34.39 | raster | i have 2 leads for contracts directly related to FR |
| 05:34.41 | pabs3 | heh, your last blog entry was when you joined om :) |
| 05:34.49 | raster | another related to embedded graphics |
| 05:34.52 | AntonTakk | rooly: did you check out my concept ui? |
| 05:34.52 | edistar | raster: I bet you won't tell us what job you'll take next |
| 05:35.04 | raster | and some other offers also embedded/gfx related |
| 05:35.10 | raster | that i should chase up |
| 05:35.18 | edistar | good luck anyway |
| 05:35.27 | raster | AntonTakk: can i steal some of it? :) |
| 05:35.32 | raster | edistar: tnx |
| 05:35.33 | raster | :) |
| 05:35.49 | AntonTakk | raster: tbh - i'd be honored :) |
| 05:36.40 | edistar | what we need is cool guis for FSO |
| 05:36.41 | raster | AntonTakk: where can i take a squiz? |
| 05:36.53 | raster | if there be good ideas... i am always willing to snarf |
| 05:36.54 | pabs3 | edistar: indeed |
| 05:37.21 | edistar | fso is quite good, the base system is too |
| 05:37.25 | raster | ponders what he should do today |
| 05:37.39 | raster | maybe i should work on my new theme for FSO/E/Illume |
| 05:37.42 | AntonTakk | raster: http://poolofdespair.net/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=110 |
| 05:37.48 | edistar | raster: a new theme? spill |
| 05:38.07 | raster | edistar: looks like e's new default |
| 05:38.13 | raster | let me work on it a bit |
| 05:38.14 | raster | :) |
| 05:38.29 | raster | AntonTakk: ummmmm..... that all? |
| 05:38.30 | edistar | okey |
| 05:38.44 | edistar | do you actually like you illume keyboard btw? do you like illume generally? |
| 05:38.51 | edistar | *your |
| 05:39.04 | raster | edistar: i like some bits of illume |
| 05:39.08 | raster | i like the keyboard |
| 05:39.12 | raster | for english |
| 05:39.14 | raster | it can be tuned more |
| 05:39.18 | raster | but its pretty decent |
| 05:39.25 | raster | especially with dictionary backing |
| 05:39.55 | edistar | I hope we'll see future versions of illume and the keyboard that are interesting |
| 05:40.14 | AntonTakk | raster: that is the one concept image i have done, other than that, i have a chunk of messy c code with no gui (yet) that is being developed to get the contact management functions down before continuing |
| 05:41.00 | raster | edistar: you will. :) |
| 05:41.09 | raster | edistar: i may redo the dictionary |
| 05:41.15 | raster | but the kbd is well split up into many layers |
| 05:41.21 | raster | so its onyl redoing a portion |
| 05:41.29 | raster | the interfaces between the kbd portions are well worked out now |
| 05:41.43 | raster | but i think my dict code is good for english dicts |
| 05:41.46 | edistar | sounds very 'durchgedacht' |
| 05:41.48 | raster | but for other langs.. not so good |
| 05:41.51 | raster | i need tyo work at it |
| 05:42.11 | raster | as this is the 2nd time ever i have wirtten a dict lookup/matching system - i'm not that good yet |
| 05:42.15 | raster | but i'll get better |
| 05:42.19 | edistar | will you also write standalone apps in e* for sms/dialer or so? |
| 05:42.23 | *** join/#openmoko Zoup (n=Zoup@78.110.121.1) |
| 05:42.23 | raster | i think this is a "3rd time is the charm" thing |
| 05:42.24 | raster | :) |
| 05:42.32 | Zoup | is there any IRC client in repository ? |
| 05:42.32 | raster | as for dialer etc. |
| 05:42.39 | raster | i actually have a long tyerm plan to make them e modules |
| 05:42.44 | raster | not even apps |
| 05:42.54 | raster | because then 1. u dont need to exec them - they are always available |
| 05:43.00 | raster | but they dont need "setup" code |
| 05:43.07 | raster | as they just piggyback of e's existing setup |
| 05:43.20 | AntonTakk | that would benefit speed |
| 05:43.24 | edistar | hmhm, interesting concept |
| 05:43.30 | raster | because of FSO's dbus stuff this all gets rather easy as all the moduel does it create a ui and talk dbus |
| 05:43.45 | raster | AntonTakk: well it woudl save a bit of ram and startup time |
| 05:43.55 | raster | but the downside is stability |
| 05:44.00 | raster | a moduel can crash all of e |
| 05:44.03 | AntonTakk | raster: and on a phone startup time is quite noticable |
| 05:44.07 | raster | as its within the same process |
| 05:44.14 | raster | but then again - e has its little white box of death |
| 05:44.20 | raster | at worst u hit "restart" on it |
| 05:44.21 | raster | :) |
| 05:44.28 | raster | u dont lose your desktop |
| 05:44.35 | edistar | it would be such a big module, would it>? |
| 05:44.41 | raster | not really big |
| 05:44.46 | raster | e already has a mountain of modules |
| 05:44.47 | raster | some big |
| 05:44.49 | raster | some small |
| 05:44.57 | raster | illume is a module for e |
| 05:44.59 | raster | probably the biggest |
| 05:45.00 | AntonTakk | hehe - theme the white box of death :) |
| 05:45.08 | rooly | lol |
| 05:45.09 | raster | AntonTakk: actually can't |
| 05:45.12 | rooly | yeah, make it blue |
| 05:45.16 | raster | as its a bit of incredibly lean small code |
| 05:45.17 | rooly | with white text |
| 05:45.22 | raster | that is intended to be ugly and simple |
| 05:45.28 | AntonTakk | ah |
| 05:45.29 | raster | because e is in a segv'd state |
| 05:45.32 | raster | it is still executing |
| 05:45.37 | raster | WITHIN its own segv handler |
| 05:45.43 | AntonTakk | good point |
| 05:45.44 | rooly | nice |
| 05:45.49 | raster | its just ebcause its carefully done that this works 99.999% of the time |
| 05:45.52 | AntonTakk | never actually thought about that |
| 05:46.11 | raster | (ie on startup e starets a 2nd x display connection - sets up everything it needs for the WBOD - fonts etc.) |
| 05:46.28 | raster | so ALl it does when u segv is create a window (whihc is write some bytes to x) |
| 05:46.36 | raster | and then draw the buttons (again just write() bytes to x) |
| 05:46.42 | cjb | raster: hey, good luck for your future work |
| 05:46.47 | cjb | which will hopefully involve FR :) |
| 05:47.09 | raster | and then sit and wait for you to do something (just read()/select() on x) so no alloc or free work there - thus it happens to be ok from a segv handler |
| 05:47.11 | raster | cjb: :) |
| 05:47.13 | raster | tnx |
| 05:50.44 | AntonTakk | rooly: can i ask what your interest is in contact management apps - or opinions on my concept image? |
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| 05:51.25 | rooly | i'm simply interested in simple sync-ing with a desktop app |
| 05:51.34 | AntonTakk | ah |
| 05:51.35 | rooly | like evolution |
| 05:52.07 | AntonTakk | well, that shouldn't be a problem, given it uses evolution-data-server to store the contacts |
| 05:53.50 | rooly | and it has to be easier than the crap microsoft puts forth |
| 05:54.09 | rooly | with their latest phone being unable to talk with their latest os |
| 05:54.13 | AntonTakk | "easier" - to sync, to use, ?? |
| 05:54.43 | rooly | a liberal definition |
| 05:54.47 | rooly | you pick |
| 05:54.49 | rooly | i don't care |
| 05:54.52 | rooly | it's just gotta work |
| 05:54.53 | AntonTakk | heh |
| 05:55.40 | AntonTakk | well, on the rare occation that i code, reliability and protecting the computer from the user are my first concerns |
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| 05:58.26 | AntonTakk | seems i need to learn how to do some things in c- my code works, but it's messy, would like to split the add/del/view/edit functions in to subroutines |
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| 06:08.59 | tunys | How manly would it be to write a shell script using strictly the neo? |
| 06:09.28 | Tm_T | nah, it's daily |
| 06:15.25 | pabs3 | cool, looks like it might be possible to export the internal flash as usb storage: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=blob;f=drivers/usb/gadget/file_storage.c |
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| 06:21.34 | pabs3 | http://www.linux-usb.org/gadget/file_storage.html |
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| 06:24.04 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1940: 'opkg -noaction upgrade' does not work as expected ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1940 ) |
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| 07:05.53 | phrozen77_ | is there a way to move qtopia, installed on sd, to the flash? |
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| 07:31.39 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 07:31.55 | lpotter | phrozen77: cp :) |
| 07:32.26 | phrozen77 | lpotter, uhm? |
| 07:32.31 | phrozen77 | ah |
| 07:32.54 | phrozen77 | anyways, i'd still prefer a triple boot :) 2007.2 flash, qtopia and debian on sd |
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| 07:34.35 | phrozen77 | lpotter, is there a way to accomplish that? |
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| 07:42.25 | Zorkman | raster did you see http://wendt.se/software/openmoko/screens/keyboard-layer.png and the mails about it on the community ML? |
| 07:42.45 | Zorkman | we were wondering if it is a realistic thing to hope for |
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| 07:43.04 | pabs3 | got a link to the mail? |
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| 07:43.30 | Zoup | any idea module-x11-bell.so is part of which package ? |
| 07:45.02 | Zorkman | pabs3: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-August/028831.html |
| 07:46.00 | pabs3 | I think that idea could work well, possibly better than the illume keyboard |
| 07:47.10 | raster | Zorkman: a keyboard that is a semi-transparent overlay? |
| 07:47.16 | Zorkman | yes |
| 07:47.34 | Zorkman | and press-and-hold to click through the keyboard on layer beneath it |
| 07:48.41 | Zorkman | base the layout on matchbow keyboard or on the full qwerty |
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| 07:49.24 | harnir | hello |
| 07:49.29 | Zorkman | there was a lot of animo for it here in the chan yesterday, but not really anyone who wsa good enough to make it (or predict if it is feasable on the FR (for example the tranparancy) |
| 07:49.34 | Zorkman | hi harnir |
| 07:50.23 | harnir | so, does anyone have usable image of om2008.8, ie. without it suspending every 30 s? |
| 07:51.05 | Zorkman | I have harnir (I downloaded the 2008.8-upgrade a few hours after it was released on the net and have opkg upgraded it since) |
| 07:51.23 | raster | Zorkman: until u have a compositing enviornment - it's not possible |
| 07:51.27 | pabs3 | harnir: um, did you try turning off suspend in the settings? |
| 07:51.29 | raster | Zorkman: BUT.. if you do.. then it is |
| 07:51.51 | raster | this is one of the things i think needs to be dealt with in vkbd hints in future |
| 07:52.09 | raster | an app should be able to hint if it wants they keyboard overlayed on the app or not |
| 07:52.16 | raster | and if overlayed what region can the keyboard use |
| 07:52.17 | raster | or better |
| 07:52.17 | Zorkman | raster: will there be a compositing environment in the near future? (and does that have drawbacks?) |
| 07:52.23 | raster | what region should it not use (if any) |
| 07:52.39 | raster | so the kerneial would give the region over the text as a keyboardable region |
| 07:52.47 | raster | as for compositing - unlikely |
| 07:52.49 | raster | not at vga res |
| 07:52.52 | raster | and not on the fr |
| 07:52.55 | raster | not enough grunt |
| 07:53.06 | raster | and glamo wont handle it - missing acceleration primitives |
| 07:53.06 | Zorkman | :( |
| 07:53.09 | harnir | pabs3: yes, did not help |
| 07:53.20 | raster | ie cant render to argb destinations |
| 07:53.20 | Zorkman | so it will never be on the FR? |
| 07:53.22 | harnir | raster: where's your image, and does it work ? :-) |
| 07:53.28 | raster | (ie the keyboard would be an argb buffer rendered to) |
| 07:53.34 | raster | well u coudl software-render the argb buffer |
| 07:53.37 | raster | and composite is possible in hw |
| 07:53.41 | raster | but no accel for glamo for that |
| 07:53.48 | raster | arn havent worked on it |
| 07:53.54 | *** join/#openmoko ||Leto|| (n=tomboy64@e178013116.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 07:53.57 | methril | nmorning |
| 07:54.03 | *** part/#openmoko Zoup (n=Zoup@78.110.121.1) |
| 07:54.16 | Zorkman | do you have any idea if it would be usable or just to darn slow with sw-render of the argb buffer? |
| 07:54.25 | raster | darn slow |
| 07:54.29 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@78-20-187-243.access.telenet.be) |
| 07:54.33 | raster | it may be barely usable |
| 07:54.35 | Zorkman | bugger |
| 07:54.36 | harnir | Zorkman: any chance of getting your image over http? |
| 07:54.38 | raster | but fr is already quite slow |
| 07:54.43 | raster | this will just exacerbate it |
| 07:54.51 | Zorkman | harnir: what do you mean? |
| 07:54.52 | raster | at qvga - maybe |
| 07:54.59 | raster | this is a reason i started that whole qvga htread |
| 07:55.04 | raster | everyone insisting they must have vga |
| 07:55.11 | raster | qvga would make this usable |
| 07:55.18 | harnir | Zorkman: images os 2008.8 have bug with 30s suspend, do you have previous one? |
| 07:55.19 | raster | as u have 1/4 the pixels to composite |
| 07:55.36 | Zorkman | harnir: lemme check if I still have it |
| 07:55.53 | Zorkman | raster: but we can just switch to gqva, no? |
| 07:56.03 | harnir | and why there is no archive of previous images? bugs like that could be easily avoided... |
| 07:56.48 | raster | Zorkman: right now - try it. it screws up |
| 07:56.48 | raster | :) |
| 07:56.54 | *** join/#openmoko dns53 (n=dns@ppp246-215.static.internode.on.net) |
| 07:57.11 | Zorkman | bah, I just knew you we're gonna spoil all the fun ;-)) |
| 07:57.17 | Zorkman | *were |
| 07:57.36 | raster | hehehe |
| 07:57.39 | raster | u could run at qvga |
| 07:57.43 | raster | but also it will look blocky |
| 07:57.45 | raster | trust me |
| 07:57.45 | raster | it does |
| 07:57.56 | raster | and again a lot of apps will just not work right |
| 07:58.00 | raster | as they have been writtne with vga in mind |
| 07:58.30 | Zorkman | harnir: sorry, can't find it |
| 07:58.40 | Zorkman | yeah i know raster... it sucks |
| 07:58.52 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan_ (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-206-107.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 07:59.03 | raster | and also its a waste of an expensive lcd |
| 07:59.04 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1941: Qtopia Contact cannot shows utf8 correctly ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1941 ) |
| 07:59.12 | raster | could have gotten a cheaper qvga one |
| 07:59.12 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@lbcsi.fri.uni-lj.si) |
| 07:59.18 | raster | whihc is again - why i asked |
| 07:59.22 | raster | cot a cost of lcd |
| 07:59.34 | raster | make sure everythnig works in qvga too |
| 07:59.38 | raster | and then allow compopsiting |
| 07:59.42 | raster | whcih allows for this kind of thing |
| 07:59.45 | raster | i might play with it |
| 07:59.49 | raster | in future |
| 07:59.59 | raster | but it will come with the "performance will suck" gotcha :) |
| 08:00.17 | Zorkman | raster: true, but a keyboard that uses 25% of the lcs is also a waste of expensive lcd :) the transparent keyboard seemed to rock... :( |
| 08:00.23 | harnir | Zorkman: ok, thx anyway :-) |
| 08:00.33 | Zorkman | someone proposed a nokia keyboard (fullscreen) |
| 08:00.40 | Zorkman | i think that might also be usefull |
| 08:00.49 | harnir | fullscreen keyboard would rock |
| 08:00.56 | harnir | and relatively small input field |
| 08:01.01 | Zorkman | two lines of small font text to soo what you've typed, and the rest of the screen keyboard |
| 08:01.04 | harnir | and no prediction |
| 08:01.13 | Zorkman | and the moon! |
| 08:01.30 | harnir | we like the moon! |
| 08:01.31 | lloyd_fedora | harnir: r u the one that made the compressed keyboard ? |
| 08:01.33 | raster | Zorkman: i know. |
| 08:01.45 | harnir | lloyd_fedora: yes |
| 08:01.50 | raster | but a transparent keyboard is minimally useful |
| 08:02.07 | raster | only useful for parts of the screen that u cant do anything useful with with your fingers |
| 08:02.09 | raster | ie select text |
| 08:02.11 | raster | place cirsor |
| 08:02.14 | raster | cursor |
| 08:02.16 | Zorkman | raster: no |
| 08:02.20 | raster | press buttons/scrollbars etc. |
| 08:02.30 | Zorkman | raster: I would like to add a "press and hold" function |
| 08:02.31 | raster | whihc really makes it a narrow usage set |
| 08:02.38 | raster | terminal - u can live without text selection |
| 08:02.40 | Zorkman | raster: if you press and hold it goes "through" the keyboard |
| 08:02.50 | raster | and that stuff |
| 08:02.57 | Zorkman | so you can select and press underlying buttons/textfields |
| 08:03.01 | raster | that now gets tricky as x's event infrastructure now is being fucked with |
| 08:03.06 | raster | only 1 window gets a mouse event |
| 08:03.08 | raster | 1 only |
| 08:03.13 | lloyd_fedora | harnir: thank u ..it rocks |
| 08:03.14 | raster | so eithe the overlayed keyboard gets it |
| 08:03.16 | raster | or the app window |
| 08:03.18 | raster | you choose |
| 08:03.24 | harnir | lloyd_fedora: thanks :-) |
| 08:03.25 | raster | once its gotten u cant pass it on |
| 08:03.39 | raster | (u need to then fake an event if u want to do that and life gets ultra-messy) |
| 08:03.45 | Zorkman | well, the keyboard receives a long-press on x1,y1 |
| 08:03.55 | Zorkman | and the keyboard passes it on to the other window |
| 08:03.57 | harnir | lloyd_fedora: do you use it with stylus or fingers? |
| 08:04.08 | raster | Zorkman: that is problematic |
| 08:04.16 | raster | as now u hve a delay |
| 08:04.29 | raster | and the mous eis not grabbed to the app |
| 08:04.33 | raster | tis grabbed to he keyboard |
| 08:04.42 | raster | check up on implicit (passivE) grabs in x11 |
| 08:04.46 | raster | welcome to a world of hurt |
| 08:04.48 | lloyd_fedora | harnir: finger .. ive been lookin for something like this |
| 08:04.55 | *** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@wnn73232.wireless.dtu.dk) |
| 08:04.58 | Zorkman | hmmm |
| 08:05.10 | raster | u might be able to do this sanely if u use xevie and an input redirection client (or the wm/keyboard/compositor does this) |
| 08:05.14 | raster | but again - its tricky |
| 08:05.18 | CM_work | raster: A qvga screen with multi touch would have been a better match :) |
| 08:05.29 | raster | i would basically worry about this .. once u have nothing left to improve in the standard stuff |
| 08:05.36 | raster | CM_work: imho - i agree |
| 08:05.37 | harnir | lloyd_fedora: I see, so maybe I have big fingers after all, I prefer it with stylus :-) |
| 08:05.56 | Zorkman | ok, thanks for the info raster, I will keep on dreaming :) |
| 08:05.59 | CM_work | raster: Done any tests on the GTA03 yet? |
| 08:06.25 | niklauz | raster: i saw you speaking breifly about your time at OM earlier, what you said confirmed my suspicions. |
| 08:06.39 | niklauz | i'm wondering are you optimistic? |
| 08:06.56 | lloyd_fedora | harnir: its very usable .. just the delete key is a problem .. left a note bout that on yr site |
| 08:08.28 | harnir | let me check |
| 08:09.18 | harnir | lloyd_fedora: ok, I'll think about it :-) |
| 08:10.05 | lloyd_fedora | harnir: cool :) |
| 08:11.07 | phrozen77 | hm |
| 08:11.13 | raster | Zorkman: btw - i do think its a neat idea. it just has a whole can of worms attached to it that will be manageable only if you solve 1. compositing to be fast and sane, 2. input redirection via something like xevie in the same layer doing the keyboard. (xevie redirection i have been thinking of in general for doing things like faking right-mouse presses etc.) |
| 08:11.20 | phrozen77 | wonder why i cant ping ip's when connected to the fr via usb |
| 08:12.01 | Zorkman | raster: I understand; I asked you about it because you know 21654531times more what is feasable and what the problems will be then I can even imagine |
| 08:12.29 | Zorkman | do you think 1. and 2. will someday be solved? (I suck at programming :(( ) |
| 08:13.11 | raster | CM_work: gta03 diesnt exist.. there are some prototype dev boards about - but as such... nothgn to work on. |
| 08:14.17 | raster | niklauz: i'm hopeful om will get with it and realize what it needs to do - as i really want an open phone to exist. if om doesnt i can bet you someone will do it and fill their shoes. it's a question of time. |
| 08:14.18 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@vpnb098.ugent.be) |
| 08:14.19 | *** join/#openmoko pengu1n (i=7c108a34@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-35f8c241282a78e9) |
| 08:14.23 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@ip-217-18-181-130.static.reverse.dsi.net) |
| 08:14.28 | lloyd_fedora | gta03 .. i just got a gta02 .. :-( |
| 08:14.28 | pengu1n | hi there, |
| 08:14.42 | pengu1n | Can flash my gta01 with OM.2008.8 ? |
| 08:14.54 | raster | Zorkman: and yes 1. and 2. can be solved |
| 08:15.02 | raster | but 1. will probably mean different hardware to solve |
| 08:15.02 | dolf1074 | pengu1n: no, not yet |
| 08:15.02 | phrozen77 | anyone has an idea why i cant ping ip's when connected via usb? i can ping the host (.200) but nothing on the interwebs |
| 08:15.09 | niklauz | raster: you worked for neuros briefly as well right? how would you compare the two? |
| 08:15.11 | raster | software wise its just a qeustion of more code |
| 08:15.15 | raster | its mostly sovled already anyway in software |
| 08:15.20 | raster | so awaiting hardware that can handle it |
| 08:15.22 | raster | and drivers |
| 08:15.44 | raster | niklauz: nah - i didnt. i talked with them but didnt want to go that way |
| 08:15.44 | dolf1074 | phrozen77: you don't have set the dns |
| 08:15.46 | rwhitby | phrozen77: routing problem on host - see the iptables settings for your host OS on the usb networking wiki page |
| 08:15.52 | raster | so i cant comment on neuros |
| 08:16.06 | raster | i do knwo they are making a nice osd set-top-box doobie and its going well for them |
| 08:16.09 | raster | and thats great |
| 08:16.11 | dolf1074 | phrozen77: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#DNS |
| 08:16.39 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@vpn1-20.tu-graz.ac.at) |
| 08:17.05 | phrozen77 | dolf1074, dns has nothing to do with ip's being unpingable |
| 08:17.10 | niklauz | raster: ah ok, just wondering. I get a sense that they know how to make open-source/community-driven product devices happen and OM kinda doesn't |
| 08:17.19 | *** join/#openmoko BDo (n=bdonnett@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) |
| 08:17.36 | phrozen77 | rwhitby, its setup according to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#Debian.2C_Ubuntu_and_others second part |
| 08:17.43 | raster | niklauz: they are doing well at it i do have to say... and thats positive |
| 08:17.47 | raster | it can be done |
| 08:17.55 | raster | u just need to think like the oss community |
| 08:17.59 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@vpn1-25.tu-graz.ac.at) |
| 08:18.01 | raster | basically have to be part of them and probably from them |
| 08:18.03 | rwhitby | phrozen77: pastebin the output of ifconfig and iptables -L -v and iptables -L -v -t nat then |
| 08:18.06 | raster | within om there is a divide |
| 08:18.11 | viq | phrozen77: I would suspect routing first, and second, I would try telnet to say port 80 somewhere, ping doesn't always work (say, qemu with user mode) |
| 08:18.12 | raster | engineers who are part of the oss community |
| 08:18.20 | dolf1074 | phrozen77: you said, you can't ping the interweb, if you ping google.be, you need the dns set (on ubuntu it does) |
| 08:18.21 | raster | and managemtn and other enigneers not from it |
| 08:18.30 | raster | the engineers not from it are not a problem at all |
| 08:18.38 | rwhitby | dolf1074: he said he can't ping ip's. |
| 08:18.44 | phrozen77 | indeed |
| 08:18.49 | rwhitby | (I'm assuming he's using real IPs, not fqdns) |
| 08:18.54 | phrozen77 | i do |
| 08:19.01 | phrozen77 | rwhitby, on the host? |
| 08:19.03 | niklauz | raster: i admire the way neuros handles that stuff, i kinda wish they hired joeborn as a consultant or something like that :) |
| 08:19.09 | rwhitby | phrozen77: yep |
| 08:19.11 | raster | management etc. are the schism right nwo that needs to align itself with its userbase or find a new cutomerset as i am not sure the community will be happy in the position it is in now for long. |
| 08:19.14 | phrozen77 | k, hold on |
| 08:19.30 | raster | niklauz: and they dont need to hire joeborn. they have/had all the people they need |
| 08:19.49 | raster | niklauz: the problem is there is just no will from those directing the decisions at om to let it be so. |
| 08:19.55 | raster | that is the position i found myself in |
| 08:20.02 | raster | i wanted to do right by the users |
| 08:20.03 | niklauz | raster: oh i just mean from a management/philosophical point of view |
| 08:20.11 | raster | i know what u guys want- i read a lot of the email on the lists |
| 08:20.36 | raster | i've been in the user set long enough - i also know the techynical realities, limitations and i understand perfectly the commercial realities and needs |
| 08:20.47 | raster | i've had my fingers in every pot for many years |
| 08:20.51 | niklauz | it seems like mickey was pretty well on board from what i've read as well |
| 08:20.54 | raster | but i was left with no abilty to do anything |
| 08:21.42 | CM_work | :-( |
| 08:22.04 | pabs3 | any ideas about the touchscreen latency? is that likely to be a hardware thing or an xorg thing? |
| 08:22.05 | phrozen77 | rwhitby, http://pastebin.ca/1190291 |
| 08:22.19 | raster | anyway - i hope they sort it out |
| 08:22.29 | raster | the community wants to have a hand in shaping the default software |
| 08:22.38 | niklauz | raster: amen |
| 08:22.39 | raster | its look, design, feel, usage and everything |
| 08:22.41 | phrozen77 | lets hope they listen |
| 08:22.46 | raster | not just fork their own images/packages |
| 08:23.07 | CM_work | raster: What will you be doing from now on? |
| 08:23.10 | raster | of coruse there are times om has to say "no - u cant have that" |
| 08:23.20 | raster | but every time it does - it'd better have a damn good reason |
| 08:23.25 | raster | and make the community understand why |
| 08:23.32 | raster | ie explain it in detail |
| 08:23.32 | niklauz | raster: the thing thats frustrating is the community seems to have no influence whatsoever |
| 08:23.46 | raster | "we can't do X because X, Y, Z, etc. please understand" |
| 08:23.46 | niklauz | raster: i completely agree |
| 08:24.33 | niklauz | neuros is excellent w/ that imho |
| 08:24.37 | raster | invariably the onlky reasons should be: 1. lack of manpower, 2. lack of $, 3. affect it would have on release schedule, 4. sheer technical impossiblity (or close to it). |
| 08:25.17 | raster | i personally think a "patches accepted" policy is always the best |
| 08:25.20 | lindi- | pabs3: how large is it? |
| 08:25.27 | raster | just a q of "how should those patches be" |
| 08:25.39 | raster | CM_work: right now.. taking a break. |
| 08:25.47 | raster | some e stuff |
| 08:25.54 | niklauz | i actually asked joeborn if he had dismissed the idea of making a phone, he kinda laughed at it and said it's not really on his radar but no |
| 08:25.55 | raster | and sorting out my next adventures |
| 08:25.55 | raster | :) |
| 08:25.57 | niklauz | hehe |
| 08:26.09 | raster | niklauz: making a phone is nasty |
| 08:26.15 | raster | as it basically invovles a massive set of hw |
| 08:26.21 | raster | a set tobp box is simple |
| 08:26.33 | niklauz | o didn't realize that |
| 08:26.36 | pabs3 | lindi-: hard to estimate, but feels like 0.25 sec or so - pla^Wdocumenting pingus usability issues :) |
| 08:26.43 | raster | at least a phone that has more than gsm |
| 08:26.56 | *** join/#openmoko Rakshasa (n=rakshasa@a88-113-66-241.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 08:26.57 | raster | u have 4 different rf signals on the FR |
| 08:27.04 | pabs3 | perhaps it is just the cursor rendering |
| 08:27.06 | raster | gps, gsm, bt and wifi |
| 08:27.10 | raster | that alone is problematic |
| 08:27.14 | lindi- | pabs3: read directly from event device |
| 08:27.15 | raster | in such a small formfacvtor |
| 08:27.23 | raster | the multi-layer boards (6+ layer) are harder to make |
| 08:27.28 | raster | u have size constraints |
| 08:27.28 | lindi- | pabs3: and perhaps correlate against mic input? |
| 08:27.33 | raster | battery and pwoer is a big issue |
| 08:27.44 | raster | making a set top box is almost childs play :) |
| 08:27.50 | raster | as u have no size contraints (really) |
| 08:28.01 | raster | and pwoer is irrelevant |
| 08:28.05 | raster | as is rf |
| 08:28.12 | raster | u have fewer devices too |
| 08:28.13 | niklauz | all true |
| 08:28.15 | raster | and no screen |
| 08:28.33 | raster | not saying that anyone can do a stb - but compared to a phone - its much harder |
| 08:28.35 | dolf1074 | we can put a petition on the mailing list asking for om to give use more insight and decision rights |
| 08:28.51 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178013116.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 08:29.10 | phrozen77 | rwhitby, found anything wrong? |
| 08:29.30 | raster | dolf1074: you can. |
| 08:29.38 | *** join/#openmoko fale (n=fale@host196-133-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 08:29.39 | raster | the question is - willit change anything |
| 08:29.41 | raster | i dont know |
| 08:29.48 | raster | i would hope so |
| 08:29.48 | dolf1074 | it's worth the shot |
| 08:29.55 | raster | i really do wish om all the best |
| 08:29.58 | raster | and hope it succeeds |
| 08:30.08 | *** join/#openmoko bipak (n=bip@p57B842C6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:30.27 | niklauz | aye |
| 08:30.38 | pabs3 | lindi-: hmmm |
| 08:30.40 | CM_work | We all do, or we wouldn't still be around in here |
| 08:30.51 | Zorkman | true :) |
| 08:31.00 | niklauz | i'm just frustrated because it seems to get in it's own way sometimes, lol |
| 08:32.02 | dolf1074 | can everybody formulate his problems/frustrations about om (and how they would solve it) and send it to me, than can I make a summary for on the mailing list |
| 08:32.21 | phrozen77 | uhm |
| 08:32.31 | phrozen77 | that wont have the impact that having each and everyone mail the list |
| 08:32.43 | niklauz | like a petition? |
| 08:33.07 | dolf1074 | you will only have to sign on the mailing list |
| 08:33.51 | dolf1074 | btw my mail: info attt alasal.b |
| 08:33.57 | Zorkman | i'll send you a mail |
| 08:34.10 | Zorkman | isn't it .be? |
| 08:34.14 | dolf1074 | yes |
| 08:34.37 | dolf1074 | I will make and post the summary tonight very late or tomorrow |
| 08:36.30 | *** join/#openmoko ||Leto|| (n=tomboy64@e178013116.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 08:37.09 | phrozen77 | pokes rwhitby :) |
| 08:37.51 | kwek | hey there.. is http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily-feed/ a good location for ipkg updates by now? been on vacation for a while |
| 08:38.09 | kwek | im a bit confused to use which feed |
| 08:39.13 | *** join/#openmoko sledgeas (n=leleiva@217.77.80.29) |
| 08:39.20 | sledgeas | hi everyone! |
| 08:39.26 | beni_ | hello |
| 08:39.28 | sledgeas | how can I access terminal in Om2008.8 ? |
| 08:39.30 | kwek | ill move to downloads.openmoko.org |
| 08:39.49 | beni_ | kwek: why do you do that? |
| 08:40.01 | kwek | beni_, http://admin-trac.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1524 |
| 08:40.03 | beni_ | sledgeas: you must instal one |
| 08:40.10 | sledgeas | ok |
| 08:40.17 | beni_ | kwek: thank you very much |
| 08:40.17 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@c3lab.poliba.it) |
| 08:40.31 | *** join/#openmoko prjktdtnt (n=trash@ip24-253-22-70.lv.lv.cox.net) |
| 08:41.07 | sledgeas | can i install the terminal without internet? (copying required pkgs over sd card?) |
| 08:41.40 | kwek | sledgeas, yeah just scp it, then 'ipkg install x.ipkg' |
| 08:42.00 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 08:43.37 | rwhitby | phrozen77: is ip_forward set in /sys/... ? |
| 08:43.47 | phrozen77 | hold on |
| 08:43.49 | rwhitby | 1 pkt for POSTROUTING seems small |
| 08:44.27 | phrozen77 | phrozen77@phrozen77-laptop:~$ cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward |
| 08:44.27 | phrozen77 | 0 |
| 08:44.28 | phrozen77 | meh |
| 08:44.53 | sledgeas | thanks huge kwek, where can i find the .ipkg files' repo? |
| 08:45.09 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm2 (n=Mathias@vpnj165.ugent.be) |
| 08:45.37 | sledgeas | (for Om2008.8) |
| 08:45.52 | phrozen77 | rwhitby, works now - my hero ;) |
| 08:45.59 | *** part/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 08:46.46 | rwhitby | kwek: buildhost is not a good ipkg update location for any distro |
| 08:47.05 | sledgeas | found one here, http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/ipk/armv4t/ -- no good? |
| 08:47.16 | kwek | rwhitby, yeah i saw the ticket.. now moving to downloads.openmoko.org - unstable |
| 08:47.25 | sledgeas | im downloading just and only openmoko-terminal2_2.1.1+svnr3352-r2_armv4t.ipk from there for now |
| 08:47.32 | rwhitby | sledgeas: buildhost is not a coherent feed for any distro |
| 08:47.43 | rwhitby | downloads.openmoko.org is the only maintained openmoko feeds |
| 08:47.49 | sledgeas | ok, its simply that google gave it out as first :) |
| 08:47.51 | rwhitby | and shr.bearstech.com for fso |
| 08:47.55 | sledgeas | splendid |
| 08:50.31 | beni_ | downloads.openmoko.org |
| 08:50.44 | beni_ | sorry, should go to my browser |
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| 08:54.04 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1942: Openmoko-calculator does not work correctly ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1942 ) |
| 08:54.22 | rwhitby | oh, that's new. Hi OMBugsBot |
| 08:54.53 | nyu | morning |
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| 08:56.06 | phrozen77 | rwhitby, thats my bot :) |
| 08:56.23 | sledgeas | guys, what web browser could i install myself for Om2008.8 ? |
| 08:59.46 | *** part/#openmoko pabs3 (n=pabs@d122-105-78-204.per9.wa.optusnet.com.au) |
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| 09:02.46 | lloyd_fedora | sledgeas: you have 2 of them in the installer |
| 09:03.05 | sledgeas | ok i found them |
| 09:04.14 | sledgeas | now i have a problem: i don't have internet (for this i need terminal (for iwlist etc) and browser (for login-pwd for my workplace's ISP) installed) - but i don't have USB networking because my work PC i got no root access there, so cannot install/config usb0 etc |
| 09:04.39 | sledgeas | any other solutions for how i could install terminal+browser while being at work today? |
| 09:04.59 | sledgeas | ;) |
| 09:05.00 | beni_ | sledgeas: copy it over via SD card if you have a card reader available |
| 09:05.07 | sledgeas | and how do i launch it? |
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| 09:05.17 | sledgeas | w/o terminal |
| 09:05.20 | sledgeas | (ie install) |
| 09:05.23 | beni_ | ah, yes. i see |
| 09:05.51 | sledgeas | is the package installer able to install from local files? |
| 09:05.55 | beni_ | it is one of my most hated things that 2008.8 doesnt feature a terminal by default. |
| 09:05.59 | sledgeas | yes |
| 09:06.00 | beni_ | and not a usable keyboard. |
| 09:06.07 | sledgeas | or a file-browser |
| 09:06.12 | beni_ | yeah |
| 09:06.27 | sledgeas | yea, with the keyb i couldnt figure out how to delete a character!! :D |
| 09:06.33 | sledgeas | so, no other solutions? |
| 09:06.44 | beni_ | i think you have to wait. |
| 09:06.47 | Mononoke | anyone is it safe to use dfu-util on 64bit fedora ? :/ |
| 09:06.49 | sledgeas | (booting in ssh from NAND u-boot, or something else?) |
| 09:07.18 | pabs3 | wireless maybe sledgeas? |
| 09:07.21 | beni_ | ask your sysadmin to setup your usb networking |
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| 09:07.47 | sledgeas | pabs3: i cannot connect to wifi because there's no terminal |
| 09:07.53 | sledgeas | %) |
| 09:08.29 | pabs3 | and no network to get it :/ |
| 09:08.58 | sledgeas | ;) |
| 09:09.06 | pabs3 | fun |
| 09:09.17 | sledgeas | im f_#[$*cked up :) so, i'll just lay it off for today's workday :) |
| 09:09.19 | dns53 | Mononoke i do it from my 64 bit ubuntu |
| 09:09.32 | sledgeas | or i will revert to the old Om2007, because for usb flashing i need no root account |
| 09:09.42 | pabs3 | Mononoke: works for Debian amd64 |
| 09:10.12 | Mononoke | ok so note in http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_the_Neo_FreeRunner#Download_the_DFU-util_program is probably outdated |
| 09:10.20 | Zorkman | sledgeas: you can install it on your SD? |
| 09:10.26 | Zorkman | don't think you need root for that or do you? |
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| 09:10.55 | sledgeas | if it is writing to /dev/mmc* then i need |
| 09:11.01 | sledgeas | for boot sectors |
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| 09:50.23 | opendeep | For my application spin arrow buttons are minute on device, So how to change the size of arrow spin button? |
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| 09:55.49 | opendeep | I looked into usr/share/themes/Moko/gtk-2.0/gtkrc but from where device will recognise themes |
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| 10:17.20 | ftnt | Hi. Is there any command to switch off the screen while, for example, playing music until I press one button to save energy?, please |
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| 10:21.18 | lindi- | ftnt: find /sys|grep bl_power? |
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| 10:21.57 | harnir | ftnt: xset dpms force suspend ? |
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| 10:30.51 | Rupert_ | Morning all, Quick question on Contacts on OM2008.8. I've looked a the wiki on contacts and that looks like a good application but it must have been on 2007.02 can it be installed on the 2008.08? |
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| 10:32.09 | Bubbi | Rupert_: Yes, it can be found in the "installer" on 2008.8 named "Openmoko contacts2" i believe |
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| 10:37.10 | Rupert_ | Bubbi: Thanks for that. I've had the phone a few weeks and only now trying to customise a bit. Still have to work out how to import contacts from the SIM bit of searching required |
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| 10:42.21 | Bubbi | Rupert_: We all are still trying to work all the small bits out.. :P So don't worry |
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| 10:44.50 | b0ib0t | w00t |
| 10:44.56 | b0ib0t | so excited about my new car!!! http://tinyurl.com/5nvzrm |
| 10:45.12 | b0ib0t | now if only my freerunners would hurry up and get here in the mail |
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| 10:47.12 | Xilent | i cant backup my rootfs |
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| 10:47.24 | Xilent | dfu-util throws -110 |
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| 10:47.31 | Xilent | tried it 20 times |
| 10:47.31 | dns53 | it has been broken for months, no one has fixed it |
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| 10:50.02 | timo2k | hello there, im trying to install a new keyboard on 2008.08 which is usable in terminal. Is there any way to do it??? matchbox dont work, illume-config-illume dont work :( writing sms is pain .. terminal is unusable :( |
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| 10:50.51 | timo2k | thanks for any help |
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| 10:54.07 | dolf1074 | you can ssh into your phone and use that terminal |
| 10:54.32 | dns53 | there is a page on the wiki, let me look |
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| 10:55.12 | timo2k | yes but I can only do this at home, or anywhere where I have a computer |
| 10:55.56 | dolf1074 | I didn't install illume-config-illume on my 2008.8 yet, so I can't help you yet |
| 10:56.50 | dns53 | have a look at the bottom of http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Om_2008.8_Keyboard |
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| 10:57.45 | timo2k | ok I take a look.. tnx! |
| 10:58.29 | Rupert_ | Can you potentially damage a PC by charging the FR at 500mA? |
| 10:59.04 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1634: [Assassin]"Update"&"Uninstall" button didn't lock up while installing ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1634 ) |
| 10:59.11 | dns53 | nope, 500ma is standard usb power |
| 10:59.18 | timo2k | yes I've tried that, but i dont have a Full-QWERTY.kbd on my freerunner?! and QTOPIA_NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD=1 doenst work too :( dont know what I'm doing wrong |
| 11:00.04 | dns53 | just ignore that and install the package linked |
| 11:00.13 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * rfe0d23b838ac 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-bare.bb: [openmoko] Change the order of illume-theme in Openmoko Bare Image. |
| 11:00.29 | timo2k | ok Ill try |
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| 11:03.57 | timo2k | while installing the illume*.ipk I get : ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for illume: libcurl4 (>= 7.18.2) |
| 11:04.04 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1943: [Installer] install package time out take 15min. please reduce the Time ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1943 ) |
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| 11:05.57 | dns53 | opkg install libcurl it and you could try opkg -nodeps |
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| 11:18.21 | Mononoke | what does dfu_upload error -84 mean ? |
| 11:30.21 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * rbeb827c2fd9a 10/framework/subsystems/oeventsd/ (5 files): |
| 11:30.22 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: [oeventsd] Use metaclass to create rules function from Action and Trigger class |
| 11:30.22 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: Every Action or Trigger class that has a 'function_name' attribute will automatically be accessible from the rule file using that |
| 11:30.22 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: function name. So that we don't need to create the function in parser.py. |
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| 11:34.05 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1944: [Location] The tag saved at wrong place while moving ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1944 ) |
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| 11:35.14 | xMDKx | morning |
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| 11:39.46 | timo2k | im sorry, but it dont work.. even if I do "cp Full-QWERTY.kbd Terminal.kbd" from a other image |
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| 11:41.37 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * rc3d0c94dbeb9 10/odeviced/src/plugins/input/input-helpers.h: remove static properties |
| 11:41.37 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r9e456bcf95e4 10/odeviced/src/plugins/input/ (input-helpers.c input-helpers.h): change held_key_payload. |
| 11:42.07 | ftnt | timo2k, matchbox worked for me installing illume-config and matchbox-keyboard and restarting the system |
| 11:42.24 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * r5e28750d81e7 10/packages/meta/distro-feed-configs.bb: [openmoko] Bump up the PR of distro-feed-config |
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| 11:45.04 | timo2k | hello ftnt, if I'm installing matchbox it looks like the matchbox keyboard is behind the standard keyboard. Matchbox only blinks up for a short time |
| 11:45.38 | timo2k | I'll try it another time |
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| 11:46.42 | Bubbi | On the 2008.8 distribution, how is it possible to install tangoGPS? I can't see it on the list of applications, but as I read it, it should be in the community repository, or am I wrong about that? |
| 11:47.00 | Zorkman | Bubbi: opkg install tangogps |
| 11:47.05 | Zorkman | opkt install gpsd |
| 11:47.18 | Zorkman | *opkg |
| 11:47.33 | Bubbi | Zorkman: It shouldn't be shown in the Installer..? |
| 11:47.50 | Zorkman | then edit /etc/default/gpsd: change GPS_DEV="/dev/ttyS3" to GPS_DEV="/dev/ttySAC1" |
| 11:47.58 | Zorkman | Bubbi, in an ideal world: yes |
| 11:48.12 | Zorkman | at the moment almost nothing is being displayed in the graphical installer |
| 11:48.31 | Zorkman | I always install it through opkg update, so I don't know if it is in the community repository |
| 11:50.40 | Bubbi | heh, yeah at some point we all want the ideal world.. ;) But for now we will happily hack away.. :) What does the change to the /etc/default/gpsd do..? |
| 11:51.00 | Zorkman | it tells gpsd where to look for GPS data |
| 11:51.27 | Zorkman | our gps data is being recieved on /dev/ttySAC1, while the default one for gpsd is ttyS3 |
| 11:51.30 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@ozone.rtvslo.si) |
| 11:52.14 | Bubbi | okay, and I have to change that, only because tangoGPS needs it..? |
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| 11:53.08 | Bubbi | I'm just trying to understand why it have to be done. :) but thank you very much Zorkman |
| 11:53.19 | Zorkman | because tangogps uses gpsd |
| 11:53.47 | Zorkman | otherwise tangogps will report "no gps found" |
| 11:53.50 | Zorkman | and you don't want that :) |
| 11:54.02 | *** part/#openmoko El_Senator (n=El_Senat@wartburg.auh.dk) |
| 11:54.13 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * re7a879b2c5bd 10/odeviced/src/plugins/input/input-helpers.c: Send 'pressed' signal irrespective of reportheld secs value |
| 11:54.15 | Bubbi | heh, nope definitely not :) but doesn't Locations use the same gpsd..? |
| 11:54.27 | edistar | no |
| 11:54.29 | Zorkman | nope |
| 11:54.40 | edistar | hi Zorkman! how is the weather? |
| 11:55.13 | Zorkman | better, not so hot anymore :) |
| 11:55.16 | Bubbi | alrighty :D Always good to know.. Thanks guys.. I'll see if I can make it work :) |
| 11:55.43 | Zorkman | it'll work |
| 11:57.10 | Bubbi | ;) |
| 11:57.46 | Bubbi | Zorkman: It doesn't mean that I can get it to work.. :D (mostly because of me, not the instructions) |
| 11:59.07 | timo2k | installing illume-config, matchbox-keyboard doesnt work.. i only have the normal not usable standard keyboard which pops up in terminal and in messages :( have restarted X and done a complete reboot. Using OM image from last Thursday (little disappointed.. glad for any help :) |
| 12:00.00 | Zorkman | timo2k: have you added export QTOPIA_NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD=1 in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89qtopia ? |
| 12:00.10 | timo2k | yes have added it |
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| 12:00.21 | Zorkman | echo 'E_PROFILE="-profile illume"' > /etc/enlightenment/default_profile ? |
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| 12:00.32 | Zorkman | (don't know if it is nescessary but it worked for me.. |
| 12:00.45 | timo2k | oh i'LL try that Zorkman .. Thanks |
| 12:00.55 | cga`work | Zorkman: stop saying zorkshit!!! XD |
| 12:00.56 | Zorkman | don't thank me yet :) |
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| 12:01.20 | Zorkman | cga`work: i know that was for the illume keyboard stuff, but I did all that and installed the matchbox one and it worked... |
| 12:01.34 | timo2k | restarting X now |
| 12:01.49 | cga`work | Zorkman: i was just kidding , don't even know / read what you are talking about. :P |
| 12:01.55 | Zorkman | :D |
| 12:01.59 | cga`work | ggb work |
| 12:02.05 | cga`work | laters folks |
| 12:02.08 | Zorkman | bye |
| 12:02.18 | Zorkman | timo2k: maybe you need to reboot |
| 12:02.41 | timo2k | ok i'll try both.. |
| 12:03.41 | raster | Zorkman: u may want to also make sure u rm -rf ~/.e/e/config/illume too before the reboot |
| 12:03.46 | raster | in case u have an old illume config dir |
| 12:04.24 | Zorkman | timo2k: i also added a desktop shortcut to launch the keyboard in case it was misbehaving |
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| 12:05.00 | Zorkman | timo2k: after installing the matchboxs keyboard (and if it works) I suggest you install http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Switching_Keyboards_on_Om_2007.2#Modified_Matchbox_Keyboard:_finger_friendly |
| 12:05.34 | *** join/#openmoko Esben (n=esben@77.233.226.18) |
| 12:05.45 | timo2k | hey that looks good! |
| 12:06.36 | Zorkman | not as good as the full qwerty-keyboard (the "style" is totaly different) but it's the best option we've got so far |
| 12:06.49 | *** join/#openmoko polz_ (n=polz@ozone.rtvslo.si) |
| 12:07.35 | *** join/#openmoko quickdev (n=quickdev@p5B0553DD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:07.47 | harnir | :-) |
| 12:08.26 | Zorkman | yeah harnir, you're becomming popular :P |
| 12:08.34 | harnir | Zorkman: scary ;-) |
| 12:08.42 | harnir | Zorkman: http://fvwm-crystal.org/ - my other "stuff" |
| 12:09.09 | Dave | eh? |
| 12:09.23 | harnir | hi Dave :-) |
| 12:09.40 | Dave | ja? |
| 12:11.15 | timo2k | reboot didnt work :( now I'm trying the hint from raster and rebooting |
| 12:11.31 | Dave | huh? |
| 12:12.39 | timo2k | if it works sometime i'll try the fingerfriendly version :) |
| 12:12.55 | raster | fish fingers |
| 12:12.58 | Dave | :D |
| 12:13.05 | Dave | bursty barnacles! |
| 12:13.16 | alx___ | timo2k: tell me if it wrks with rasters hint, i'd like to make it work too :) |
| 12:13.39 | Dave | raster gives hints now? |
| 12:13.53 | alx___ | "raster: Zorkman: u may want to also make sure u rm -rf ~/.e/e/config/illume too before the reboot" |
| 12:14.41 | raster | iof u had old illume confgi it wouldnt puck u the new default one but use your old existing one in ~/ |
| 12:14.51 | timo2k | oups .. now I a standard enlightment desktop ?! I think something is broken now |
| 12:14.53 | raster | e is rabidly all about user config being king |
| 12:15.03 | raster | so your users config always takes precedence |
| 12:15.04 | Dave | woo? |
| 12:15.10 | raster | it can be overridden |
| 12:15.21 | *** join/#openmoko cgerum (i=christop@vpn2781.extern.uni-tuebingen.de) |
| 12:15.35 | raster | but that involves bumpign the major version in the config - and i only do that as a last resort for stuff working |
| 12:15.42 | Dave | wonders when and if it will reach a point of critical configurability. |
| 12:17.49 | *** join/#openmoko polz__ (n=polz@ozone.rtvslo.si) |
| 12:18.26 | *** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:18.34 | timo2k | hmmm I'm sorry don't understand what you mean. ehm if I remove these dir and reboot I get an enlightment desktop?! dont know whyt to do now I'm rebooting another time :) |
| 12:19.02 | raster | did u install the illume config pachacke |
| 12:19.07 | raster | ie illume-config-illume |
| 12:19.08 | raster | ?> |
| 12:19.22 | *** join/#openmoko giantHogweed (n=Frank@P9546.p.pppool.de) |
| 12:19.50 | timo2k | illume-config-illume isnt available in my repo, Ive tried to install the direct link in testing but it didnt show up |
| 12:19.53 | *** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@82.49.167.91) |
| 12:20.24 | raster | then... u have problems :( |
| 12:20.36 | *** join/#openmoko l403 (n=l@85.132.159.231) |
| 12:20.49 | *** join/#openmoko kaindad (n=kaindad@168.167.143.237) |
| 12:21.05 | *** part/#openmoko cgerum (i=christop@vpn2781.extern.uni-tuebingen.de) |
| 12:21.23 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@212-183-113-12.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 12:21.46 | timo2k | oh.. I see it.. I think I have to flash a new image over .. :) |
| 12:21.54 | Dave | o_O |
| 12:22.06 | timo2k | alx___ do nor issue this command ;) |
| 12:22.09 | bumbl | Davy |
| 12:22.31 | alx___ | timo2k: thanks :) |
| 12:22.36 | rwhitby | raster: someone's asking about illume on the fso channel #openmoko-cdevel |
| 12:24.16 | raster | cdevel? |
| 12:25.32 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=mbarre@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:25.45 | quickdev | raster, I was the one asking ;) |
| 12:26.03 | quickdev | raster, you did some work on illume? |
| 12:27.04 | *** join/#openmoko renato (n=renato@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:27.11 | raster | nah |
| 12:27.13 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@212-183-113-12.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 12:27.13 | raster | i dodn't touch it |
| 12:27.16 | raster | didnt |
| 12:27.25 | raster | ljp did it! :) |
| 12:28.23 | quickdev | raster, do you know if it's the standard openembedded package with a different config? |
| 12:29.04 | raster | yes |
| 12:29.07 | raster | different config |
| 12:29.14 | raster | FSO uses illume+e |
| 12:29.17 | raster | saner config |
| 12:29.42 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@118-169-100-95.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 12:30.53 | *** join/#openmoko aleix (n=aleix@mail.jad.es) |
| 12:31.13 | *** part/#openmoko aleix (n=aleix@mail.jad.es) |
| 12:31.34 | rwhitby | raster: #openmoko-cdevel is the community development channel, as opposed to this channel which is not limited to development talk |
| 12:31.43 | raster | aaaah |
| 12:31.50 | raster | gotcha |
| 12:32.02 | raster | i should add that to my already longish list |
| 12:32.39 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=mbarre@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:33.06 | raster | pants on |
| 12:33.06 | Dave | raster, is this, help everybody get your keyboard working and convert the heathens morning? :) |
| 12:34.52 | raster | hahahaha |
| 12:35.00 | raster | actually.. need to do some email morning |
| 12:35.05 | Dave | ;) |
| 12:35.34 | rwhitby | http://www.angstrom-distribution.org/sugar-running-%C3%A5ngstr%C3%B6m <- wonder what it will look like on a GTA0x ... |
| 12:35.57 | *** join/#openmoko charlie137 (n=guillaum@220-136-180-115.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 12:36.09 | rwhitby | starts a sugar build for gta01 ... |
| 12:36.14 | *** join/#openmoko mmaestri (i=a8e2286f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-d7a8770243256d7d) |
| 12:36.23 | Dave | gah |
| 12:36.25 | *** join/#openmoko KenSentMe (n=KenSentM@ip-145-93-88-15.fontys.nl) |
| 12:36.44 | Dave | fucking crm fanatics! :) |
| 12:37.10 | *** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@host91-167-dynamic.49-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:38.11 | rwhitby | sugar fails in do_configure ... |
| 12:38.47 | Dave | wah wah |
| 12:39.16 | rwhitby | looks like it's just a missing dependency for python headers, but I'm too lazy to fix it |
| 12:39.30 | Dave | :p |
| 12:40.14 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:46.18 | Dave | haha, uggh, I hate when I have this problem... :p |
| 12:49.11 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1945: om2008.8: Sometimes I can't call my FreeRunner when it is in suspend (with logread/x.log/dmesg) ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1945 ) |
| 12:49.48 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=mbarre@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:54.52 | Dave | Ombugsbot you suck |
| 12:55.13 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@win4077.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de) |
| 12:55.35 | bumbl | he sucked even more when he flooded the chan by reporting every single bug from #1 on |
| 12:55.54 | Dave | :) |
| 12:56.01 | Dave | Hmm, where is sicu :| |
| 12:59.36 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host75-33-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 13:05.00 | lloyd_fedora | using 2008.8 update . installed illume-config it does not install the 'wrench' .. does anyone know what packages contain that |
| 13:05.08 | *** join/#openmoko norro_ (n=norro@e181118147.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:05.30 | Bubbi | lloyd_fedora: Did you reboot the phone..? |
| 13:05.52 | Bubbi | It should be there when you have rebooted and all.. |
| 13:06.24 | *** join/#openmoko subtwo (i=c33a6164@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c52874fe33fb32c1) |
| 13:06.27 | lloyd_fedora | Bubbi: yeah rebooted... its not there |
| 13:07.22 | Dave | oh well |
| 13:07.54 | beni_ | is that config tool the same installed by default on FSO? |
| 13:07.55 | Bubbi | And you are sure that it's been installed correctly, checked that it's no longer in the install menu? |
| 13:08.30 | lloyd_fedora | beni_: yeah .. i think so .. Bubbi: its no mo in the menu |
| 13:09.41 | Bubbi | alright, hmm.. weird... I'm not sure I can be of any more help then.. I haven't had any problems with it myself on the updated 2008.8 |
| 13:09.59 | Dave | You are on the 2008! |
| 13:10.26 | lloyd_fedora | Bubbi: this is the only problem im havin .. other than that alls good |
| 13:10.51 | Dave | :) |
| 13:11.00 | Dave | Well, that's good to know at least, right? |
| 13:11.01 | Bubbi | Dave: ? |
| 13:11.06 | Mononoke | okay 2008.9 is quite unusable -,- |
| 13:11.17 | Dave | Monoke, what did you expect? |
| 13:11.26 | Mononoke | nothing else :) |
| 13:11.32 | Dave | FOOLISH HUMONS! |
| 13:11.52 | CVirus | Mononoke: what problems are you facing ? |
| 13:11.55 | Bubbi | bahh.. Well.. I just called it what it's named.. Not my idea of the name.. I would've givin' it another name, if it was up to me.. :9 |
| 13:11.56 | Bubbi | :) |
| 13:12.07 | Dave | So, rename it! |
| 13:12.19 | Bubbi | There... George it is.. |
| 13:12.19 | *** join/#openmoko qtonion (n=ogrande@88.116.110.149) |
| 13:12.28 | Dave | eh? |
| 13:12.33 | Bill_ | what's the realistic time for fso m3? |
| 13:12.35 | Bubbi | renamed.. :) |
| 13:12.41 | Bill_ | still end of week? |
| 13:12.50 | Mononoke | CVirus: mostly keyboard and sleep (trying to find where is best place for DISPLAY=:0 xset s off ) |
| 13:12.58 | Bubbi | week, month, year... what's the different..?! |
| 13:13.11 | Bubbi | .. difference.. |
| 13:14.10 | *** join/#openmoko Ark1 (n=chatzill@pool-71-254-82-200.lyncva.east.verizon.net) |
| 13:15.21 | geocode | So anybody here recommend 2008.8/testing over the standard repositories? |
| 13:15.43 | Dave | ~_~ |
| 13:15.43 | apt | STOP DOING THAT! |
| 13:17.42 | *** join/#openmoko hipitihop (n=denis@97.91.221.203.static.comindico.com.au) |
| 13:17.44 | lloyd_fedora | Bubbi: whats exquisite .. its in the installer > updates |
| 13:18.12 | hipitihop | waves to the residents |
| 13:18.15 | Dave | hahaha |
| 13:18.19 | Dave | Hippityhop :) |
| 13:18.55 | geocode | So I did an install of testing/illume-config-illume over top of my standard 2008.8-updates distro. I added the export QTOPIA_NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD=1 and rm -rf my ~/.e stuff (as listed above). As before when I added the NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD stuff I get no keyboard at all... I'm trying to decide if I should try the testing repository and do a full update from it, or give up on the keyboard for now... Anyone have any suggestions? |
| 13:19.16 | Dave | Don't explode! |
| 13:19.30 | hipitihop | anything exciting to report |
| 13:19.30 | geocode | btw, now I have a super cool X screen saver :-) |
| 13:19.44 | hipitihop | screenshot |
| 13:20.02 | Bubbi | lloyd_fedora: ah :) Well, then it works, when you've updated the config..? |
| 13:20.12 | geocode | I have the wrench back, so that's super cool |
| 13:20.20 | Dave | heh |
| 13:20.26 | Dave | wrench wrench! |
| 13:20.35 | lloyd_fedora | Bubbi: no this is in the installer list |
| 13:21.02 | lloyd_fedora | geocode: how did u get the wrench back |
| 13:21.17 | hipitihop | is there a way to brink up the entire fr ui up on host via ssh ? |
| 13:21.22 | geocode | opkg install http://....testing/illume-config-illume... |
| 13:21.33 | Zorkman | geocode: doesn't work for me :) |
| 13:21.53 | geocode | I did them rm -rf ~/.e/e... from above |
| 13:21.57 | geocode | and rebooted |
| 13:22.00 | Zorkman | do you run raster's image or 2008.8 pr 2008.8-upgrade? |
| 13:22.07 | geocode | I'm using 2008.8-upgrade |
| 13:22.29 | geocode | And I added the NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD stuff but I don't think its related |
| 13:22.48 | geocode | also when I tried to do the install, it fails because of illume so I did a -force-overwrite |
| 13:22.50 | Dave | NO_VIRTUAL_EXPLOSIONS |
| 13:22.59 | hipitihop | geocode, I have 2008 updated with testing/illume-config-illume but no wrench |
| 13:23.10 | geocode | Do you get the X screen saver? |
| 13:23.14 | Dave | man, sounds retarded, someone should package this mofo properly. |
| 13:23.36 | geocode | Dave: its just not in the main repository |
| 13:23.37 | Dave | opkg install --force-everything rasterman |
| 13:23.46 | hipitihop | asking me geocode ? |
| 13:24.03 | geocode | That's out of the control of the fine developer who did it |
| 13:24.05 | Dave | geocode, my opinion, is if it requires all this external manual tweaking, the package wasn't done properly |
| 13:24.05 | geocode | yeah |
| 13:24.16 | geocode | Sorry hipitihop, did you get the X screen saver |
| 13:24.18 | Dave | It should do it for you, even if it asks questions. |
| 13:24.24 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1946: gtk+ and tangogps ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1946 ) |
| 13:24.25 | *** join/#openmoko KenSentMe (n=KenSentM@ip-145-93-88-15.fontys.nl) |
| 13:24.50 | hipitihop | geocode, not that I'm aware, apart from the obvious, how do I know |
| 13:24.52 | *** join/#openmoko Sebast1an (n=sb@p5B375D38.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:24.55 | Dave | I especially can't stand the the packages which require you to externally fetch and install someone elses software, configure and set that up first, in a chain. |
| 13:25.01 | Dave | Oh, and it's "non-free" |
| 13:25.05 | Dave | -_-; |
| 13:25.30 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 13:26.15 | geocode | So I have my freeloader set to not suspend, but after 10 seconds or something it goes to the X screen saver. |
| 13:26.18 | geocode | Its super cool |
| 13:26.37 | geocode | Makes me want to switch to the testing repo, but last time I did that I had to re-image... |
| 13:27.02 | Zorkman | which x-screensaver? |
| 13:27.05 | Zorkman | blank? |
| 13:27.16 | geocode | It's just a big X that jumps around on the screen |
| 13:27.34 | hipitihop | hmm never seen that |
| 13:27.41 | Dave | no xsnow? :) |
| 13:28.22 | geocode | But with the NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD=1 I get no keyboard at all and I couldn't figure out how to make one appear. And with it commented out I still get the original one |
| 13:28.46 | Zorkman | geocode: you can add a *.desktop file to launch the kb :) |
| 13:28.55 | alx___ | soomeone knows how to tell tangogps to use an http proxy? |
| 13:29.01 | hipitihop | goes to get usb-led light so he can see his keyboard in bed .. brb |
| 13:29.13 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 13:29.44 | geocode | Although I see now, that in the wrench config there is a keyboard option, it offers Default and None. None was selected. Time to go turn that VIRT KEYBOARD option again and restart |
| 13:29.45 | *** join/#openmoko trod (n=trod@59.163.121.1) |
| 13:30.31 | geocode | Zorkman: Thanks! I may have to do that |
| 13:30.34 | Dave | I already made a sweet little miniusb worm light :P |
| 13:30.40 | geocode | You know what I run to launch the keyboard? |
| 13:30.51 | Dave | geocode, what, TELL US WHAT YOU USE! |
| 13:31.07 | Zorkman | the force? |
| 13:31.17 | geocode | Use the source, luke |
| 13:31.33 | geocode | Dave: I did. Or are you just messin? |
| 13:31.39 | geocode | 2008.8-updates |
| 13:31.41 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@surfvtk.ugent.be) |
| 13:32.07 | geocode | standard repos, except for the stuff I've downloaded for the gsm muxd and the keyboard stuff |
| 13:32.09 | Dave | :P |
| 13:32.28 | Zorkman | i'm not suprised the FR is still a bit unstable, when you have apps like assassin and exposure running, maybe someone should program pestilence? |
| 13:32.48 | hipitihop | ahh that's better .. better to see you with says the wolf to... |
| 13:33.01 | *** join/#openmoko Gnutoo (n=gnutoo@80.125.172.55) |
| 13:33.53 | trod | hi..is it possible to read layer 3 messages from gsm modem programmatically in openmoko? |
| 13:34.39 | hipitihop | so dave, any decent games for the Fr yet |
| 13:34.45 | Zorkman | trod: my eightball says "all signs point to yes" |
| 13:35.05 | Zorkman | but the eightball runs on the FR, so not very reliable :) |
| 13:35.07 | Bubbi | hipitihop: decent or not.. There's sudoku :) |
| 13:35.14 | trod | Zorkman: any pointers links where I can get more info about it |
| 13:35.19 | *** join/#openmoko larry_jr (n=Larry@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:35.24 | Zorkman | trod: not the slightest clue, sorry |
| 13:35.41 | hipitihop | dave, the om-sudoku ? |
| 13:35.46 | Zorkman | it looks like debian is having all the game-fun lately... |
| 13:36.48 | hipitihop | Zorkman, what are you running at the mo ? |
| 13:36.50 | trod | zorkman: is it possible to read layer 3 messages in the first place?....my application's input is a log of layer3 msgs retrieved from 3rd party software |
| 13:37.01 | *** join/#openmoko charlie137 (n=guillaum@220-136-180-115.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 13:37.06 | Zorkman | trod: honestly, I don't know... |
| 13:37.18 | Zorkman | hipitihop: i'm running 2007.2 and 2008.8-upgrade |
| 13:37.24 | quickdev | ljp, did you some work on illume? |
| 13:37.58 | *** join/#openmoko cb22_ (n=federico@dsl-245-166-247.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 13:37.59 | trod | Zorkman: thanks anyways |
| 13:38.16 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@gtsgw.ttc.cz) |
| 13:39.32 | *** join/#openmoko Rakshasa_ (i=pkorva@apollo.sigmatic.fi) |
| 13:40.07 | *** join/#openmoko l403 (n=l@85.132.159.231) |
| 13:40.56 | hipitihop | trod, I don't know either but there is probably a difference between the distros, e.g. fso uses dbus |
| 13:41.17 | Zorkman | i thinl it will be possible in FSO but not sure though |
| 13:42.59 | Shlee | Zorkman: What one would you recommend using most of the time? |
| 13:43.37 | Zorkman | depends on what you want to do... |
| 13:43.48 | *** join/#openmoko sledgeas (n=leleiva@217.77.80.29) |
| 13:43.58 | sledgeas | ahoy there! |
| 13:44.01 | Zorkman | FSO seems to be the future |
| 13:44.11 | Zorkman | aaaaarghhhh matey |
| 13:44.33 | Shlee | Zorkman: FSO is the future but I want calls in/calls out/sms |
| 13:44.47 | Zorkman | qtopia I guess in that case |
| 13:44.54 | Zorkman | but i haven't use qtopia for a looong time |
| 13:45.07 | sledgeas | is there an image of <512MB debian ready somewhere? (like from http://rabenfrost.net/debian/ according to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manual_Debian, because i have no internet on my FR to perform http://wiki.debian.org/DebianOnFreeRunner ..) |
| 13:45.09 | *** join/#openmoko noaXess (n=noaXess@gw.ptr-80-238-209-47.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 13:45.32 | hipitihop | how have you found 2008.8-upgrade Zorkman ? mine has been pretty reliable for calls both ways |
| 13:45.47 | Zorkman | hipitihop: due to the gsm buzz i can't use it as a phone at the moment :( |
| 13:46.00 | Zorkman | that really sucks :( |
| 13:46.06 | hipitihop | Zorkman, you on gta02 ? |
| 13:46.51 | Zorkman | jup |
| 13:46.55 | Zorkman | gta02v5 |
| 13:47.27 | Bill_ | Zorkman: yup.. same issue here.. you can get it down but then the volume levels are really low |
| 13:47.28 | phrozen77 | Zorkman, tried turning down the volume of the speaker? |
| 13:47.30 | phrozen77 | helped me |
| 13:48.04 | Zorkman | phrozen77: it helps a little bit (I don't ever hear the buzz, it's always on the other side) but it was still very annoying to the other person and call volume was really low |
| 13:48.04 | Bill_ | phrozen77: yeah.. but then you can't hear the other side in evel lightly noisy environment |
| 13:48.25 | Shlee | Still makes me wonder how they missed the buzzing. |
| 13:48.43 | hipitihop | Zorkman, interesting, I have had no such issue. I assume you have tried the fixes mentioned on the list recently regarding gsm echo etc |
| 13:48.44 | phrozen77 | ok |
| 13:48.49 | phrozen77 | anyways, gotta go |
| 13:48.50 | phrozen77 | cu laters |
| 13:48.51 | Bill_ | i've noticed that there are situations where there is no buzz.. |
| 13:48.57 | Zorkman | hipitihop: that is about echo, not the buzz |
| 13:49.06 | Zorkman | the buzz is caused by RF interference |
| 13:49.16 | Bill_ | it seems to be quite specific to some frequencies |
| 13:49.19 | phrozen77 | hands Zorkman some tinfoil |
| 13:49.20 | phrozen77 | :) |
| 13:49.23 | Zorkman | Bill_: me too, when calling to landline, call quality is everall much better |
| 13:49.34 | hipitihop | I see, I have experienced neither |
| 13:49.41 | Zorkman | lucky sob :) |
| 13:49.50 | Bill_ | i haven't fount that connection.. but it surely works better in some places than others |
| 13:49.50 | hipitihop | is there a software way to know what revision I have ? |
| 13:49.53 | Zorkman | hipitihop: you have v5 or v6? |
| 13:50.07 | hipitihop | scratches his head |
| 13:50.14 | Zorkman | btw: anyone seen this: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/c71fce895ca1e3628278ea85cc17ed3a.png ? themes for 2007.2 |
| 13:51.09 | hipitihop | Zorkman, is there a software way to tell v5 from v6 ? |
| 13:51.36 | Zorkman | yeah there is, trying to remember it :) |
| 13:51.49 | hipitihop | just don't want to power down |
| 13:52.08 | raster | Zorkman: try and arm v5 and v6 instruction |
| 13:52.13 | *** join/#openmoko mammoth (n=e2031@ip-62-143-179-222.hsi.ish.de) |
| 13:52.15 | raster | set a sigill signal handler before u do |
| 13:52.18 | raster | if it gets tripped |
| 13:52.26 | raster | u know u cant do that v5 or v6 instr |
| 13:52.28 | raster | :) |
| 13:53.01 | beni_ | what happens if i have my freerunner on FSO and i let the battery drain? will the FR shutdown prior sucking out all energy of the battery? or will it just turn off without shutting down? |
| 13:53.09 | Zorkman | it's not about arm raster, it's about gta02v5 or gta02v6 |
| 13:53.12 | beni_ | i ask because i search a way i can measure the uptime |
| 13:53.14 | raster | beni_: n suck suck suck |
| 13:53.32 | raster | Zorkman: ooooh |
| 13:53.39 | raster | ummm |
| 13:53.42 | beni_ | raster: no energy-low detection?? |
| 13:53.42 | raster | not sure actually |
| 13:53.44 | beni_ | still not? |
| 13:53.51 | *** join/#openmoko ascot (n=ascot@vpn1-14.tu-graz.ac.at) |
| 13:53.52 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * r3a428de00afb 10/odeviced/src/plugins/input/input-helpers.c: refactor code, remove a goto http://xkcd.com/292/ ;) |
| 13:53.57 | beni_ | hm |
| 13:54.11 | Zorkman | I know it's printed inside the case, but I also think there is a software command for it, just can't remmeber it.. |
| 13:54.38 | Zorkman | hipitihop cat /proc/cpuinfo |
| 13:54.40 | beni_ | can i get the current charge level from /sys somewhere? then i will write a script that wakes up every n seconds writing the current time and energy level to a file on SD |
| 13:54.49 | Zorkman | I "think" that is the one |
| 13:54.53 | Sup3rkiddo | beni_, sys/class/power_supply |
| 13:55.04 | Sup3rkiddo | beni_, sys/class/power_supply/bat/capacity to be exact |
| 13:55.06 | beni_ | Zorkman: inside the case is only GTA02, no minor revision afaik |
| 13:55.11 | beni_ | Sup3rkiddo: thanks! |
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| 13:55.33 | *** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@knet-gip124.prod.bolignet.dk) |
| 13:55.43 | Zorkman | hipitihop: i don't have my fr near me, but if it says 0350 it means gta02v5 |
| 13:56.40 | hipitihop | Zorkman, indeed it is |
| 13:57.10 | *** part/#openmoko sledgeas (n=leleiva@217.77.80.29) |
| 13:57.18 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@118-169-100-95.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 13:57.19 | Zorkman | can't wait to use my FR as a phone :( |
| 13:57.39 | hipitihop | where are you based Zorkman |
| 13:58.51 | RedFlash | hi, somebody knows where tangogps saves its configuration ? |
| 13:58.51 | Bill_ | i think all of us, who got their FR's before mid august are on v5 |
| 13:59.16 | RedFlash | found something in /.gconf/apps/tangogps/%gconf.xml |
| 13:59.17 | Zorkman | hipitihop: belgium |
| 13:59.27 | Bill_ | that's most of it |
| 13:59.28 | Zorkman | RedFlash: correct: ) |
| 13:59.39 | RedFlash | but this is overwritten whe i restart tangogps |
| 13:59.45 | RedFlash | maybe i have to reboot |
| 13:59.47 | RedFlash | ? |
| 13:59.55 | Bill_ | kill gconfd2 first |
| 13:59.58 | RedFlash | k |
| 14:00.00 | RedFlash | thanks |
| 14:00.03 | Bill_ | then modify your conf |
| 14:00.27 | hipitihop | Zorkman, whats gsm band is used in belgium ? aus is 900 afaik |
| 14:00.29 | Bill_ | gconf2 caches configurations |
| 14:01.31 | Zorkman | in whole europe it's the same |
| 14:01.38 | Bill_ | i'm in estonia and we have both.. 900 and 1800 here.. |
| 14:01.41 | Bill_ | Zorkman: yup |
| 14:02.02 | Zorkman | it happens everytime when my gf calls :) |
| 14:02.04 | *** join/#openmoko ritz (n=ritesh@nat/redhat-in/x-3f429b359b0d497e) |
| 14:02.09 | Zorkman | some other people do not get the buzz, some do |
| 14:02.23 | Bill_ | i wonder.. how difficult it would be to enable logging for calls.. to save tx power levels and channles/frequencies per call |
| 14:02.52 | Bill_ | that could give pretty good overview about the issue |
| 14:03.10 | Zorkman | true... |
| 14:03.14 | Zorkman | good idea |
| 14:03.20 | Zorkman | need to go now |
| 14:03.27 | hipitihop | Zorkman, I'm one of the lucky ones I guess, but you did not want to hear that |
| 14:03.28 | Bill_ | ttyl |
| 14:03.35 | hipitihop | bye Zork|gone |
| 14:03.37 | Zork|gone | i'm happy for you :) |
| 14:03.38 | RedFlash | thanks Bill_ killing gconfd2 worked fine |
| 14:03.50 | Bill_ | RedFlash: that's what the cmmunity is for |
| 14:03.53 | Zork|gone | but I assume when come to beglium an try to call my girlfriend you will have the same problems :p |
| 14:04.00 | Zork|gone | *when you |
| 14:04.20 | Bill_ | Zork|gone: while you're at it.. a phonenumber of your gilfriend would be nice :P |
| 14:04.33 | Bill_ | just for testing pourpuses ofc :) |
| 14:04.41 | Zork|gone | :D |
| 14:05.06 | hipitihop | heh |
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| 14:08.16 | *** part/#openmoko subtwo (i=c33a6164@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c52874fe33fb32c1) |
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| 14:19.00 | Rupert_ | My FR 2008.08 won't boot any more. All it gets to is a totally black screen except for a '-' character in the top left of the screen. Anybody seen this behaviour before? I'm using Raster's images |
| 14:21.10 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@118-169-100-95.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 14:21.27 | hipitihop | Rupert_, seen this but only as an interim phase prior to complete boot |
| 14:23.37 | CVirus | Rupert_: bad luck ... raster left 10 minutes ago |
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| 14:25.10 | Rupert_ | I'm not suggesting that it's Raster's fault or anything just letting you know what image I'm using. I've never noticed it as the interim boot screen I thought that was totally black but obviously missed the '-' Seems to get stuck booting X then |
| 14:27.01 | CVirus | no clue |
| 14:28.16 | geocode | Wow, so I was so happy and then I realized that even though my phone rings I can't answer, send busy or make calls... |
| 14:28.32 | *** join/#openmoko akriegisch (n=adi@stargate.vrvis.at) |
| 14:29.13 | geocode | oh crap I've got the good keyboard!!!! |
| 14:29.15 | geocode | woooo hoooo |
| 14:30.55 | geocode | Now if the phone only worked at the same time... |
| 14:31.04 | geocode | This seems to be the battle I face daily |
| 14:32.30 | Mononoke | geocode: how ? |
| 14:32.34 | *** join/#openmoko baku (n=b@host213-120-116-149.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 14:32.50 | Mononoke | geocode: I'm atm fighting with it :/ |
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| 14:34.17 | hipitihop | anyone have upto date google maps url that works with tangogps ? |
| 14:34.59 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTu1y (n=maarten@195-241-125-243.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 14:35.19 | geocode | yeah its been a weird one |
| 14:35.22 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 14:35.34 | geocode | Okay so to start with I have 2008.8-updates |
| 14:35.49 | geocode | Then I also did the gsmmuxd stuff for gprs and services |
| 14:35.59 | geocode | So its not quite a base install |
| 14:36.09 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-95-238-79.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 14:36.34 | geocode | Then I did an opkg install -force-overwrite http://downloads.openmoko..../testing/illume-config-illume |
| 14:36.41 | *** join/#openmoko BabelO_ (n=fcr@unaffiliated/babelo) |
| 14:37.02 | Mononoke | ah illume from testing |
| 14:37.06 | geocode | I did the rm -rf ~/.e/e/[something] as raster suggesting further up in the chat |
| 14:37.25 | geocode | and I did the 89qtopia NO VIRT KEYBOARD=1 thingy |
| 14:37.35 | geocode | I can paste these exacts if you need them |
| 14:37.42 | geocode | and I rebooted |
| 14:37.52 | Mononoke | no need I'll find out |
| 14:38.00 | geocode | I got a screen saver that has an X floating around (I have suspend off) |
| 14:38.07 | kwek | http://pastebin.com/d4f45d2fb - thats from the mailinglist.. was it that? |
| 14:38.19 | geocode | But no keyboard, then I see I finally have the wrench back |
| 14:38.43 | *** part/#openmoko Esben (n=esben@77.233.226.18) |
| 14:39.00 | geocode | yeah wish I'd had that! That's all right in one spot |
| 14:39.18 | geocode | The only thing left was I wen to the wrench config :-) and there's a keyboard option |
| 14:39.37 | kwek | well i tried it.. but still a bit lost - where is that wrench supposed to be |
| 14:39.48 | geocode | It was set to none. I changed it to default and now I have a keyboard and I can select through a bunch of different keyboards |
| 14:40.03 | geocode | above the qwerty |
| 14:40.13 | geocode | I had to rm -rf everything and reboot before I saw it |
| 14:40.21 | geocode | ahhh, not everythign :-) |
| 14:40.26 | kwek | hmm must have something wrong then |
| 14:41.32 | *** join/#openmoko mac2k (n=mac2k@ip-88-152-141-93.hsi.ish.de) |
| 14:42.42 | geocode | I don't know if it matter's but I bet i have the libdbus from the wiki's "fix" for the keyboard |
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| 14:44.27 | Rupert_ | I'm back in business reflashed the FR and it's now booted an locked up. Just wondering is there anything useful that I can do with a locked FR? Could I look at a log file and see some information that might be of use in determining the cause of the problem and providing something useful to more knowledgeable people? |
| 14:45.08 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178013116.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 14:45.14 | geocode | You reflashed and it locked on boot? |
| 14:45.25 | geocode | Are you sure your battery is fully charged |
| 14:45.34 | *** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E15471.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:45.45 | geocode | because even plugged in you can have problems if you battery is too low |
| 14:46.11 | Mononoke | yay seems to work >.> |
| 14:46.27 | geocode | Aw, super cool |
| 14:46.35 | geocode | did you get the screen saver also? |
| 14:46.39 | *** join/#openmoko arzej (n=arzej@dfy209.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 14:46.44 | geocode | I haven't even found a setting for that |
| 14:46.50 | Dave | Heil! |
| 14:46.52 | Mononoke | I'm setting xset s off so no |
| 14:47.08 | Mononoke | geocode: DISPLAY=:0 xset s off |
| 14:47.16 | Mononoke | should work but dunno where to put it |
| 14:47.51 | Dave | What are you people still going on about? |
| 14:48.09 | geocode | getting the free runner rocking out |
| 14:48.10 | Rupert_ | Sorry I should have said the battery is fine. I got the FR booted but it locked up when I read a TExt message that I had send to myself to test out things. So it's now locked in a test sms message. It's accepting no input form its user. |
| 14:49.10 | Rupert_ | It seems to lock all to regular in various places and wondered how to use this to be of use to people. |
| 14:49.18 | Mononoke | ok I can type password for wifi now, let's see if it can connect |
| 14:50.24 | Mononoke | it did \o/ |
| 14:50.31 | geocode | awsome |
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| 14:53.17 | Dave | You require the blue key! |
| 14:53.42 | geocode | strangest thing, phone was working fine last night, now its all broken! No in or out calls or sms |
| 14:53.53 | geocode | I guess I'll reboot again |
| 14:53.59 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 14:54.28 | TAsn | geocode, you got hacked. |
| 14:55.15 | *** join/#openmoko tkep (n=travisk@nat/redhat/x-2537d5a5e565a2fd) |
| 14:55.15 | stevenSn | geocode: Did you install gsmmuxd using the instructions at http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=295 ? |
| 14:55.40 | *** join/#openmoko pea (n=pea@adsl-68-23-85-172.dsl.dytnoh.ameritech.net) |
| 14:56.25 | geocode | probably |
| 14:56.51 | geocode | With instructions from the wiki? |
| 14:56.57 | geocode | option 1 |
| 14:57.26 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@221-7.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 14:57.28 | stevenSn | yes thats the link in option 1 |
| 14:57.42 | geocode | So yes I did. |
| 14:57.44 | geocode | :-0 |
| 14:57.52 | geocode | Is that bad? |
| 14:58.36 | beni_ | the "locked" mode in FSO, where the screen becomes black - is that supsendet already? |
| 14:58.41 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84-75-29-40.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 14:59.04 | geocode | stevenSn: Is your comment related to TAsn's comment? |
| 14:59.12 | geocode | hopes not... |
| 14:59.16 | stevenSn | geocode: no, I just wasn't sure if you were following option 3, where you wouldn't expect the SMS/phone to work |
| 15:00.17 | geocode | gotcha. Thanks. I got a little scared for a minute because I just noticed the strangest thing before that was posted... I had a eth0:avah which I've never seen before |
| 15:01.09 | geocode | okay now my wifi's working again |
| 15:01.10 | hipitihop | tangogps on my 2008.8 upgraded looses its config between sessions, something I should know or is that a distro problem |
| 15:01.31 | geocode | strange hipitihop I don't have that problem |
| 15:01.39 | geocode | I have it set to get my maps off the sd card |
| 15:01.48 | TAsn | geocode, i was just kidding. |
| 15:01.55 | TAsn | nothing to worry about. |
| 15:01.57 | TAsn | :) |
| 15:02.17 | TAsn | though i guess the moko is pretty hackable. |
| 15:02.27 | *** join/#openmoko arzej1 (n=arzej@dgs23.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 15:02.34 | geocode | after a reboot everything is working great |
| 15:02.37 | TAsn | everything running as root, and everything was programmed fast and is still in beta. |
| 15:02.55 | geocode | Oh its very hackable :-) |
| 15:02.56 | stevenSn | TAsn: And the root password is blank by default |
| 15:03.34 | geocode | I don't understand that I've typed blank so many times trying to get in... it never works for me :-) |
| 15:04.07 | TAsn | stevenSn, hehe, yeah. |
| 15:07.22 | *** join/#openmoko igor321_ (n=igor@221-7.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 15:07.24 | geocode | What an awesome device though |
| 15:07.33 | geocode | Software still lagging, but still.... |
| 15:08.59 | hipitihop | geocode, what version of tangogps ? |
| 15:12.24 | hipitihop | hmm, seems testing feed for 2008.8 has older version http://downloads.openmoko.org/repository/testing/armv4t/tangogps_0.9.2-r1_armv4t.ipk |
| 15:15.32 | hipitihop | is there a way to bring up the whole fr desktop as window over ssh ? as opposed to individual app |
| 15:16.36 | ShellEvil | spots a name. |
| 15:16.38 | ShellEvil | http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/09/01/0023245 |
| 15:17.26 | geocode | hipitihop: let me check |
| 15:17.31 | geocode | brb |
| 15:17.56 | geocode | 9.2 |
| 15:18.03 | geocode | I know there's a newer version out |
| 15:18.09 | geocode | but I haven't installed it yet |
| 15:18.41 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g228003164.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 15:18.59 | stevenSn | You can get a tango 9.3 package from the tangogps website (www.tangogps.org, I think) |
| 15:20.31 | geocode | Hey anybody using the testing feeds for 2008.8-updates? |
| 15:21.44 | *** join/#openmoko geraldgn (n=geraldgn@Z9349.z.pppool.de) |
| 15:21.51 | geraldgn | hello |
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| 15:24.24 | hipitihop | geocode, I have used a couple of packages from there |
| 15:25.38 | hipitihop | geocode, if you have many deps for a given package then it is easier to add the feed to your opkg feeds but would never recommend doing an upgrade, just do an update, install whatever package you want, remove the feed and update again |
| 15:26.21 | *** part/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=filip@d5152E303.access.telenet.be) |
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| 15:32.16 | Tanuva | does the neo charge in suspend (running debian, don't know if that matters...)? |
| 15:32.19 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 15:32.34 | Tanuva | since the charger circuit is independent, that should work, shouldn't it? |
| 15:34.09 | hipitihop | Tanuva, not exactly. Not sure if there is wiki page about it, but I have heard some people have problem if totally discharged. in my case 2008.8 it does not seem to chanrge when in suspend |
| 15:34.45 | hipitihop | Tanuva, at least the led goes out when charging and it suspends |
| 15:35.32 | Tanuva | the leds don't work at all on debian.. *g* |
| 15:35.44 | Tanuva | or they simply aren't used |
| 15:36.08 | Tanuva | and since it makes the neo wake up all the time I dont have zhone running |
| 15:36.16 | *** join/#openmoko marcel_m (n=marcel_m@86.59.65.236) |
| 15:36.44 | mjr | afaik it at least needs to negotiate the current draw awake, don't know otherwise |
| 15:37.42 | Tanuva | I put it to sleep while on usb, so that should have been possible |
| 15:37.45 | ShellEvil | It will - as I understand it - slow charge if it's completely dead. |
| 15:37.53 | ShellEvil | oh |
| 15:38.18 | Tanuva | (and it's not completely dead, just works. I'm just wondering if charging while asleep works) |
| 15:38.38 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
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| 15:41.50 | *** part/#openmoko pabs3 (n=pabs@d122-105-78-204.per9.wa.optusnet.com.au) |
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| 15:48.34 | johngay | alx___ Where was that good libtododb? |
| 15:48.45 | evolux | is there some "good" audio player for the freerunner already? I don't really like the one that comes with 2007.07... Perhaps there is a player in development? |
| 15:50.55 | Tanuva | uses mpd+sonata on debian |
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| 15:58.26 | hipitihop | Tanuva, could the reason for tangogps losing config between sessions be caused by the fact that I run it from ssh session ? |
| 15:58.36 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@78-20-187-243.access.telenet.be) |
| 15:58.45 | joss | hmm, are there such gadgets as battery powered bluetooth usb adapters available? |
| 15:59.15 | ShellEvil | joss: why? |
| 15:59.16 | joss | found a battery powered serial adapter, that wouldn't feed the external gadget:( true? |
| 15:59.27 | ShellEvil | joss: the FR has internal power |
| 15:59.46 | joss | ShellEvil: to extend some wireless devices |
| 16:00.53 | joss | ShellEvil: usb port you mean is powered, still would need a wire contact with the device |
| 16:00.58 | joss | external device |
| 16:01.10 | *** join/#openmoko SiNiESTrO (n=siniestr@179.Red-80-33-148.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 16:01.12 | Tanuva | hipitihop: I don't know why that should be the cause since it runs in the neo's environment anyway |
| 16:01.24 | ShellEvil | joss: what do you mean - what are you trying to do? |
| 16:02.14 | joss | ShellEvil: was just thinking, if it is possible to communicate with other device, like usb bluetooth wireless adapter that is attached to cdma usb modem |
| 16:02.35 | joss | ShellEvil: and communicate over bluetooth |
| 16:03.30 | joss | ShellEvil: but those adapters would still need power i guess, those sold, only some bluetooth serial adapters available, but they wont pass power to cdma modem again:( |
| 16:03.36 | ShellEvil | what do you mean? |
| 16:03.41 | ShellEvil | what do you want on the far end? |
| 16:03.46 | ShellEvil | Of the bluetooth link? |
| 16:04.51 | joss | communicate over bluetooth with cdma modem, but i do not want this modem to be feeded with ac, but with battery:( |
| 16:05.09 | ShellEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:05.12 | Zork|gone | geocode: where did you get the screensaver? I have illume-config-illume and rasters keyboard, but i don't see a screensaver |
| 16:06.02 | joss | ShellEvil: there are some which are with battery included, anydata makes them, but usuing three chargers, is quite lame all the time, charging serial bluetooth port, and cdma modem all the time |
| 16:06.42 | ShellEvil | What are you aiming to do? |
| 16:06.44 | joss | ShellEvil: usually powered via usb power lines |
| 16:07.21 | ShellEvil | There are portable batteries that have USB outputs. |
| 16:07.26 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=rudi@dsbg-4db5e6fc.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 16:07.32 | *** join/#openmoko polz__ (n=polz@cpe-90-157-225-127.dynamic.amis.net) |
| 16:07.42 | joss | ShellEvil: oh, ok, can you link me one? |
| 16:09.40 | joss | seems they are way too big |
| 16:10.55 | ShellEvil | http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.4505 |
| 16:10.57 | ShellEvil | for example |
| 16:11.31 | ShellEvil | Dimensions: 3.54 in x 1.89 in x 0.67 in |
| 16:12.30 | ShellEvil | http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.3060 |
| 16:12.31 | ShellEvil | or |
| 16:12.35 | ShellEvil | slightly smaller |
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| 16:20.16 | hipitihop | being totally new to python dev, what would anyone recommend as a good environment to setup on my ubuntu desktop to start to experiment for fr |
| 16:20.41 | johngay | anyone know where I can get a good libtododb? |
| 16:20.42 | joss | ShellEvil: seems bit pointless, wont charge them both anyways, bt usb adapter and modem and too pig |
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| 16:22.00 | sicu | hey all =) |
| 16:22.11 | all | hey sicu |
| 16:22.13 | sicu | ^^ |
| 16:22.39 | sicu | what's new? |
| 16:23.14 | sicu | that much...huh? :p |
| 16:23.14 | dPeS | hipitihop: pydev or eric |
| 16:23.19 | johngay | Still tryin to get gpe-todo working. |
| 16:23.23 | MadTBone | wow.... the channel topic no longer says that the freerunner is not a stable phone... it's been a few weeks since I've updated my image... things progressing that well? |
| 16:23.30 | *** join/#openmoko marcel_m (n=marcel_m@86.59.65.236) |
| 16:24.27 | hipitihop | dPeS, pros and cons ? whatabout ui, what should I concentrate on learning ? |
| 16:26.25 | joss | ShellEvil: http://www.gameseek.co.uk/pd/PCrjukxmhu6s2vp9fa/Nyko-iBoost-Mini-Battery-Pack--ipod |
| 16:26.31 | joss | looks better |
| 16:26.37 | dPeS | hipi: in fr topic and python i'm begginer also, but i'm python dev for a while... right now i'm looking for sdk for qtopia and pyqt but there nothing special afaik |
| 16:27.23 | dPeS | about python's ide both are good - You should try them both |
| 16:28.04 | joss | ShellEvil: ah no, still has some size, i counted first only that bottom part:( |
| 16:28.49 | evolux | i'm trying to compile mpd in the toolchain. compilation works but in the final linking step, it tries to link against my desktop libraries and then gets a "file in wrong format" error... |
| 16:28.56 | hipitihop | dPeS, thanks, what about e & illume |
| 16:29.19 | evolux | some libraries are linked correctly, like libi3tag but libpulse is taken from /usr/lib, for example |
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| 16:29.42 | dPeS | hipi: well ... when U compare qtopia & other... well... choise is simple for me |
| 16:29.59 | dPeS | framebuffer is much faster |
| 16:30.21 | evolux | the final command is: ccache arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi-gcc -march=armv4t -mtune=arm920t -isystem/usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/include -fexpensive-optimizations -fomit-frame-pointer -frename-registers -Os -Wl,-rpath-link -Wl,/usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib -Wl,-O1 -o mpd mpd-audioOutput_alsa.o [...] -L/usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib -lnsl /usr/lib/libpulse-simple.so /u |
| 16:30.32 | evolux | (sorry, that got a bit long) |
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| 16:33.20 | hipitihop | dPeS, but neither asu or fso are going framebuffer, although they both seem to be qtopia on x11 |
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| 16:34.24 | johngay | X11 allows everyone to share the display. framebuffer via qtopia means only qtopia apps can have a display. |
| 16:35.06 | hipitihop | johngay, that was my understanding |
| 16:35.27 | johngay | That's why they ported qtopia on top of X. |
| 16:35.33 | hipitihop | but which of the ui frameworks is considered the state of the art ? |
| 16:35.33 | mjr | qtopia on framebuffer is certainly much faster than qtopia on x11 (which is what asu does), but that reflects mostly on qtopia... |
| 16:36.21 | joss | ShellEvil: isn't there like a really small one available like mobile battery? |
| 16:37.47 | hipitihop | whate is zhone written in ? |
| 16:38.05 | Tanuva | hipitihop: python |
| 16:39.23 | hipitihop | Tanuva, and the ui components are done to what ? |
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| 16:41.54 | Tanuva | hipitihop: enlightenment libs, mostly evas/edje |
| 16:42.48 | Tanuva | but I don't know the exact relation of these libs yet. edje does the actual gui and gui can be done independently from code, but how do you get data from the code into the gui then... other way round's simple... :/ |
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| 16:43.49 | hipitihop | Tanuva, which is the easiest to develop to if I'm just starting out with python ... mind you veteran developer but never used any of those ui libs |
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| 16:45.10 | Tanuva | hipitihop: gtk imho. I knew bits of qt before and gtk was simple then. etk seems to be a completely different approach |
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| 16:45.49 | johngay | I think the main difference is gtk is C and qt is C++ |
| 16:46.00 | hipitihop | Tanuva, sometimes completely different approach is not necessarily bad or harder |
| 16:46.17 | johngay | There's lots of good boks on either. |
| 16:46.58 | hipitihop | johngay, did C too many moons ago and managed to bypass C++ altogether when I went OOP so not sure that helps me |
| 16:47.00 | Tanuva | hipitihop: correct, but from my POV gtk is easier than etk, and that's what you asked for :) |
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| 16:47.14 | hipitihop | :-) |
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| 16:47.45 | johngay | Well, if you code OOP, I'd say qt might make more sense to you. |
| 16:47.53 | Tanuva | johngay: i'm using gtk from pygtk, so that's no reason :) |
| 16:48.06 | johngay | Whereas gtk is more procedural. |
| 16:48.26 | johngay | Just giving pointers, since he doesn't seem to know where to go. |
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| 16:48.29 | Tanuva | but qt on the neo is quite hard to get to run from what I've heard about this strange qmake toolchain |
| 16:48.56 | johngay | Help him decide based on his un-related experience. |
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| 16:49.29 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r8043af8488b5 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/objects.py: ogsmd: fix wrong dbus namespace for IncomingUssd signal. Thanks quickdev! |
| 16:50.31 | Tanuva | at the end it would be best to have a look at each of them and then choose |
| 16:50.40 | johngay | I've got both gtk and qt programming books in pdf format if that helps. |
| 16:50.50 | hipitihop | it woul dbe nice since I have to scale the python curve and a ui curve, not to have to also fumble with platform complications so that makes me lean away from qt |
| 16:51.20 | Tanuva | I've never seen pyqt on the neo yet |
| 16:52.02 | johngay | OK, sounds like pygtk may be a good fit for you. |
| 16:52.05 | hipitihop | but then I'm a bit of an OO diehard.... mind go look at which way E goes too then |
| 16:53.01 | hipitihop | s/mind/might |
| 16:53.12 | Zork|gone | i'm still a bit confused a bout which micro sd card to buy |
| 16:53.22 | Zork|gone | will class 6 have better performance than class 4? |
| 16:53.24 | Tanuva | if you figure out e I'll be interested in your code :D |
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| 16:53.50 | Tanuva | Zork|gone: that was on the ml some time ago, afaik the neo's not fast enough to benefit from class 6 |
| 16:54.48 | Zork|gone | yeah, i read those mails but I forgot the conclusion (if there was one :)) |
| 16:54.48 | hipitihop | so how do any of these ide on my ubuntu desktop interact with something like pygtk or the E libraries ? |
| 16:54.48 | Rupert_ | I was going to replace the Contacts application on my 2008.08 (Raster) image with openmoko-contacts2. I can't see a presently installed Contact application to remove |
| 16:54.48 | Tanuva | has there ever been a conclusion on the mls? :D |
| 16:54.48 | hipitihop | btw, installed eric |
| 16:55.25 | Tanuva | hipitihop: I hated eric the moment I couldn't get the font to a readable size, and am using kate now for python coding. (+ api docs :) ) |
| 16:56.28 | dPeS | hipi: there is nice build of eclipse with pydev @ easyeclipse.org |
| 16:56.50 | dPeS | if U also want to try pydev |
| 16:57.34 | hipitihop | Ihow does it run, I find a lot of the eclipse stuff is just sush a slug |
| 16:58.07 | joss | ShellEvil: http://www.tradekey.com/product_view/id/312951.htm such wouldnt, suite?:) |
| 16:58.18 | hipitihop | but since I'm doing current stuff in a plugin (Actionscript/Flex Builder) then might be a bit more familiar |
| 16:58.41 | dPeS | it's my base ide for python at work... basicly i'm java dev but python has very nice rapid pros :) |
| 17:01.05 | hipitihop | I'll have a look at pydev then to I guess. |
| 17:01.40 | hipitihop | do any python ide's have proper class browsers ? |
| 17:02.01 | hipitihop | appreciate your pov dPeS 7 Tanuva. |
| 17:04.09 | dPeS | i was talking about python & rapid app dev... well those app doesn't have lot class ;) |
| 17:04.47 | dPeS | i didn't compared it to eric... i just better fits under my hands... |
| 17:06.48 | *** join/#openmoko wolfgang_spraul (n=wolfgang@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 17:07.31 | hipitihop | so last question and I'll stop bugging you guys... a link to a simple python app currently running on neo so that I can see how things are done |
| 17:08.08 | *** join/#openmoko sudharsh_ (n=sudharsh@59.92.47.171) |
| 17:08.49 | Tanuva | I could send you the beginnings of my mpd client.. zhone's already quite complex imho |
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| 17:09.25 | hipitihop | Tanuva, is that using the e libs or something else ? |
| 17:09.36 | Gromgull | anyone knows about om2008.08 package repositories? There are some funky community repositories with more recent versions and more stuff somewhere? |
| 17:09.37 | Tanuva | no, pygtk and pympd |
| 17:09.57 | Tanuva | I want to do a etk gui later on, but atm I want to finish my highlevel mpd lib first |
| 17:10.07 | hipitihop | I guess a good intro to pygtk |
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| 17:10.43 | hipitihop | so what's the easiest way Tanuva email or upload somewhere ? |
| 17:10.47 | Tanuva | might be, yes. although my treeview doesn't work like it should yet |
| 17:10.55 | Tanuva | I could nopaste it |
| 17:11.01 | Tanuva | or upload if you like |
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| 17:11.21 | hipitihop | sorry, what's nopaste ? is that pastebin or something else ? |
| 17:11.39 | Tanuva | yes, a pastebin |
| 17:12.11 | hipitihop | sure, whatever is simplest for you, I've been enough of a distraction for you as it is |
| 17:12.48 | Tanuva | oh, if I would feel distracted I had to close the irc window :) |
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| 17:14.06 | hipitihop | so how long have you been a pythonista Tanuva |
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| 17:15.07 | Tanuva | it's d-etch.homelinux.net/files/tanump.tar.gz - I also left the other stuff of an unfinished etk gui there, although it's kinda outdated. I modified the code of a tutorial for it. the important parts are tanump.py (gui), tanumpd.py (access layer to pympd, shall also manage library/playlists later), helpers.py (just a storage) |
| 17:15.41 | Tanuva | hipitihop: hmm... 1 or 1.5 months I guess |
| 17:16.25 | Tanuva | hipitihop: it's not the first language I'm coding in, although everything noncommercial :) |
| 17:16.53 | hipitihop | :-) |
| 17:17.21 | Tanuva | gotta finish school first... *g* |
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| 17:26.11 | hipitihop | ok pydev installed too. .. I'll have a look through all this and your tanump.py tomorrow. time for some sleep 3:25 here. Thanks for your pointers |
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| 17:26.57 | hipitihop | waves g'nite to Tanuva , dPeS and other residents |
| 17:27.05 | Tanuva | hipitihop: gn8 :) |
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| 17:28.01 | dPeS | hipi: bye |
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| 17:31.00 | Tanuva | from my experience of this afternoon: the neo does indeed charge while suspended on usb - at least if it was connected before going to sleep. |
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| 17:35.28 | johnsu01 | pjz: unfortunately the solution of moving read mail to another folder doesn't work either, as qtmail errors when a message that was there isn't anymore, and won't even open the box... |
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| 17:38.30 | ronny | yo |
| 17:38.42 | dPeS | \quit |
| 17:38.45 | ronny | how usable is fso milestone 2 ? |
| 17:39.08 | Tanuva | if you just want simple contacts (name+number) and calling, you're good to go |
| 17:39.22 | Tanuva | there's basic sms support, but no notifying of new ones etc |
| 17:39.30 | ronny | hmm |
| 17:39.41 | Tanuva | but sms is to come with m3 afaik |
| 17:39.58 | ronny | hmmk, then i cant use the phone until fso3 |
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| 17:56.28 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03mickey * r4616 10/trunk/src/target/ (kernel/ u-boot/ xserver/): |
| 17:56.28 | CIA-22 | openmoko: remove packages that are no longer maintained in SVN: |
| 17:56.28 | CIA-22 | openmoko: * u-boot |
| 17:56.28 | CIA-22 | openmoko: * kernel |
| 17:56.28 | CIA-22 | openmoko: * xserver |
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| 18:01.29 | Gromgull | my 2008.8 never seems to do anything with my sim card - it only says "GSM phone is not registered. No Network" |
| 18:01.34 | Gromgull | .. :( |
| 18:08.51 | md2k7 | is there an easy way to make 2008.8 *not* enter suspend after 30 secs? |
| 18:08.59 | md2k7 | except settings -> suspend, which doesnt work for me |
| 18:09.42 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03mickey * r4617 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/buttonactions.c: |
| 18:09.42 | CIA-22 | openmoko: neod: Be more relax in keycode used for detecting activity on touch screen. |
| 18:09.42 | CIA-22 | openmoko: Different drivers may report different key code. We don't really |
| 18:09.42 | CIA-22 | openmoko: need to care which keycode is used, just if there was a key press |
| 18:09.42 | CIA-22 | openmoko: at all. So use a range test to look for any 'tool' like button press. |
| 18:09.45 | CIA-22 | openmoko: Signed-off-by: NeilBrown <neilb@suse.de> |
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| 18:12.36 | TeLLuS | md2k7: Change back to the file that can read or change the Suspend setting from an old packet or image.. Do we know witch one? Or reflash with an older 080827 image and not run opkg upgrade |
| 18:15.30 | admiral0 | hi everyone |
| 18:16.53 | Gromgull | md2k7: for me it works to set it from the illume-config panel |
| 18:18.46 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 18:19.36 | md2k7 | interesting... maybe i just download a new fs image |
| 18:19.49 | md2k7 | who knows what i've already bricked :P |
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| 18:25.38 | sylar91 | Hi, is there an gnome-volume-control like sw for om? |
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| 18:33.23 | baird | Getting up to speed with the Enlightenment Foundation Libraries? Google finds sites from 2005 that're all dead. :/ |
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| 18:35.21 | Tanuva | try enlightenment.org |
| 18:35.59 | Tanuva | there's a wiki that seemed helpful to me |
| 18:36.18 | baird | -_- ... duh, the site and wiki is content-free, and the links it gives are all those dead ones from 205. |
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| 18:37.13 | Tanuva | hm. I just looked at the compiling instructions which are at least there... |
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| 18:37.24 | Tanuva | maybe you ask raster about docs |
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| 18:43.18 | *** join/#openmoko marcinsoo (n=fdsaf@aczf109.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 18:44.23 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 18:46.48 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r8911eab6d722 10/ (3 files in 2 dirs): enable global log_level in [frameworkd] section |
| 18:48.21 | *** part/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=Filip@213.219.157.251.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net) |
| 18:50.50 | *** join/#openmoko rooly|away (n=chris@ip70-188-121-225.lf.br.cox.net) |
| 18:52.48 | *** join/#openmoko ndrs_ (n=ndrs___@89.100.134.136) |
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| 18:54.54 | *** join/#openmoko Fradeve (n=fradeve@87.19.77.118) |
| 18:57.51 | md2k7 | my freerunner still always suspends after 30 secs in the newest, freshly flashed 2008.08 |
| 18:58.21 | md2k7 | it is getting on my nerves, being connected to usb and still have to tap at least every 30 secs |
| 18:58.38 | md2k7 | what is this settings thing anyway? it doesnt seem to be an app |
| 19:00.17 | *** part/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@78.42.25.235) |
| 19:01.22 | Mononoke | md2k7: try installing illume-config |
| 19:01.42 | Mononoke | and set it there |
| 19:01.48 | timo2k | md2k7: ive had the same problem |
| 19:02.23 | timo2k | I have no solution to it, in the image from last thursday it worked. |
| 19:03.10 | md2k7 | yaay great |
| 19:04.07 | *** join/#openmoko MichaelShiloh (n=chatzill@adsl-75-62-110-138.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net) |
| 19:04.28 | Zork|gone | shhht, it's the boss! |
| 19:04.32 | Zork|gone | everybody act casual :) |
| 19:04.44 | Fradeve | Mononoke: I've installed illume-config, but what I've to do now? There isn't any icon on desktop.... -.- |
| 19:04.58 | Zork|gone | Fradeve: you need illume-config-illume |
| 19:05.04 | Fradeve | Mononoke: any icon referred to illume-config, obviously ;) |
| 19:05.04 | Zork|gone | that will give you back the wrench/spanner |
| 19:05.10 | Zork|gone | illume-config is only the qwertybutton |
| 19:05.33 | saurabh1403 | hello all |
| 19:05.41 | Zork|gone | hi |
| 19:05.50 | saurabh1403 | i am getting a problem in executing a program in freerunner |
| 19:06.02 | saurabh1403 | i compiled the program using toolchain |
| 19:06.21 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201.45.49.162) |
| 19:06.30 | saurabh1403 | and then i scp the resultant binary to /home/ directory in freerunner |
| 19:06.55 | saurabh1403 | but when i executed it, it says an error : ./hmm: eval: line 1: ccache: not found |
| 19:07.04 | saurabh1403 | hmm is the name of my binary |
| 19:07.07 | saurabh1403 | any suggestions |
| 19:08.21 | Zork|gone | let me guess: hidden markov model :) |
| 19:08.25 | saurabh1403 | yes |
| 19:08.35 | saurabh1403 | now, i am trying it on the phone |
| 19:09.17 | Zork|gone | did you search for it in the repositories? |
| 19:09.37 | saurabh1403 | yes..i searched the previous mails |
| 19:09.37 | Zork|gone | opkg update && opkg list |grep ccache |
| 19:09.45 | Zork|gone | (don't have the phone near me so can't check it myself) |
| 19:09.46 | saurabh1403 | hmmmm |
| 19:09.50 | TeLLuS | Mononoke: opkg -V3 install illume-config-illume show in the end.. Nothing to be done An error ocurred, return value: 2. |
| 19:10.09 | *** join/#openmoko adjaxio (n=adjaxio@lns-bzn-49f-81-56-215-221.adsl.proxad.net) |
| 19:10.12 | saurabh1403 | ok...let me try |
| 19:10.13 | Mononoke | hmm illume-config-illume ? it shouldn't be in standard repo |
| 19:10.18 | Mononoke | so you need to give it link |
| 19:10.30 | *** part/#openmoko sylar91 (n=sylar@91.80.224.221) |
| 19:10.40 | Mononoke | opkg -force-overwrite install # |
| 19:10.41 | Mononoke | http://downloads.openmoko.org/repository/testing/all/illume-config-illume_0.0+svnr35693-r13_all.ipk |
| 19:10.42 | md2k7 | yeah what is this "return value 2" |
| 19:10.47 | Mononoke | without # ^.^ |
| 19:10.48 | md2k7 | ah. ok |
| 19:10.50 | md2k7 | lol |
| 19:11.21 | *** join/#openmoko sylar91 (n=sylar@91.80.224.221) |
| 19:11.47 | sylar91 | Hi, I need help, somebody could help me please? |
| 19:11.50 | saurabh1403 | opkg update && opkg list |grep ccache: it is failing ..Signature check failed |
| 19:11.51 | Mononoke | from this: 16:38 < kwek> http://pastebin.com/d4f45d2fb - thats from the mailinglist.. was it that? |
| 19:12.07 | sylar91 | What are the features of illume-config-illume? oO |
| 19:12.14 | saurabh1403 | An error occured:return value :8 |
| 19:12.15 | Zork|gone | saurabh1403: signatures are not yet implemented, thay always fail and it is normal |
| 19:12.17 | *** join/#openmoko ndrs_ (n=ndrs___@89.100.134.136) |
| 19:12.23 | Zork|gone | that error code is not normal... |
| 19:12.30 | saurabh1403 | Failed to download http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily-feed/all/Packages.gz, error 0 |
| 19:12.35 | Zork|gone | do you get an error when opkg list |grep ccache? |
| 19:12.59 | Zork|gone | aha, there is something wrong with your internet settings |
| 19:13.00 | sylar91 | Zork: what are the features of illume-config-illume? |
| 19:13.00 | saurabh1403 | zork: nope |
| 19:13.03 | *** join/#openmoko ndrs_ (n=ndrs___@89.100.134.136) |
| 19:13.06 | Zork|gone | i bet you can't ping www.google.com |
| 19:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko mosez (n=mosez@mosez.net) |
| 19:13.46 | saurabh1403 | zork: pinging google.com says "bad address: www.google.com" |
| 19:14.12 | dolf1074 | Zork|gone: you won :p |
| 19:14.33 | Mononoke | nameserver missing :) resolv.conf ? |
| 19:14.58 | Zork|gone | saurabh1403: everything you need to get internet working on the neo is on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking |
| 19:15.07 | Zork|gone | it's pretty straightforward and easy |
| 19:15.17 | *** join/#openmoko dos1 (n=dos1@unaffiliated/dos1) |
| 19:15.24 | saurabh1403 | zork: ko..thanks..let me fix my internet connection...thanks again |
| 19:15.24 | sylar91 | how can I play video on om 2008.8? |
| 19:15.33 | Mononoke | not easy |
| 19:15.57 | sylar91 | mononoke: what sw are aviable to do that? |
| 19:16.00 | Zork|gone | sylar91: the features of illume-config-illume are things like double tap to launch applications, frameraten, full qwerty keyboard, customizing the top bar.... |
| 19:16.08 | Zork|gone | sylar91: you can try playing with mplayer |
| 19:16.16 | Zork|gone | there is some mpeg4acceleration also |
| 19:16.33 | sylar91 | mplayer? |
| 19:16.45 | Zork|gone | opkg install mplayer :) |
| 19:16.47 | Mononoke | opkg install mplayer |
| 19:16.51 | sylar91 | lol |
| 19:16.53 | Mononoke | -,- |
| 19:17.00 | Zork|gone | don't expect a gui though sylar91 |
| 19:17.06 | sylar91 | what formats are supported? |
| 19:17.10 | *** join/#openmoko Deubeuliou (n=david@AFontenayssB-151-1-27-199.w83-114.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 19:17.19 | lloyd_fedora | where can i get illume-config-illume running 2008.8 update |
| 19:17.25 | *** join/#openmoko Wonka (i=produzie@chaos.in-kiel.de) |
| 19:17.31 | sylar91 | I quote lollyd :D |
| 19:17.32 | Zork|gone | lloyd_fedora: http://downloads.openmoko.org/repository/testing/all/illume-config-illume_0.0+svnr35693-r13_all.ipk |
| 19:17.38 | *** join/#openmoko LuYu (n=whatever@118-168-235-243.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 19:17.43 | sylar91 | I installed but nothing changed... |
| 19:17.55 | sylar91 | I mean illume-config-illume |
| 19:18.00 | Zork|gone | sylar: press the top window and look in the left upper corner |
| 19:18.04 | Zork|gone | (after a reboot) |
| 19:18.14 | LuYu | does anybody here use debian? |
| 19:18.19 | sylar91 | ah ok, I don't reboot |
| 19:18.30 | Zork|gone | (could be you don't need reboot, I don't know) |
| 19:18.36 | rooly|away | reboot takes way too long |
| 19:18.43 | lloyd_fedora | LuYu: ive installed it on the sd card |
| 19:18.49 | sylar91 | I don't rebooted and nothing appeared... |
| 19:19.03 | LuYu | me too |
| 19:19.20 | phrozen77 | LuYu, check out #openmoko-debian |
| 19:19.40 | *** join/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=Filip@213.219.157.251.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net) |
| 19:19.44 | LuYu | i was wodering why the wifi goften changes addresses |
| 19:20.08 | sylar91 | ehm... but... mplayer plays also video? not only mp3? |
| 19:20.21 | lloyd_fedora | Zork|gone: thanks .. rebootin .. hopefully itll work |
| 19:20.35 | dos1 | sylar91: lol, yes, naturally |
| 19:20.54 | LuYu | onmy wifi network, it keeps jumping from x.x.x.58 to x.x.x.59 and back again |
| 19:20.56 | Zork|gone | lloyd_fedora: you probably need to rm -rf ~/.e/e/config/illume |
| 19:21.05 | *** join/#openmoko mmaestri (i=c9fe56a5@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-929b5f6336e42955) |
| 19:21.05 | sylar91 | what formats are supported? |
| 19:21.13 | Zork|gone | lloyd_fedora: and echo 'E_PROFILE="-profile illume"' > /etc/enlightenment/default_profile |
| 19:21.26 | LuYu | about evevry 15 minutes |
| 19:21.27 | Zork|gone | lloyd_fedora: and add add "export QTOPIA_NO_VIRTUAL_KEYBOARD=1" in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89qtopia |
| 19:21.29 | dos1 | sylar91: many |
| 19:21.38 | sylar91 | flv? |
| 19:21.42 | dos1 | sylar91: but with acceleration - mp4 |
| 19:21.46 | lloyd_fedora | Zork|gone: damm its already rebootin .. will do that ... thanks |
| 19:21.59 | dos1 | sylar91: yes, but with low framerate |
| 19:22.05 | sylar91 | ... |
| 19:22.06 | sylar91 | ok |
| 19:22.09 | dos1 | very low |
| 19:22.13 | Mononoke | so I need to export everything to mp4 |
| 19:22.14 | Zork|gone | lloyd_fedora: if you look on the community mailing list your will find good instructions there in a mail titled "illume-config-illume on 2008.8-updates" |
| 19:22.31 | LuYu | on the other hand, im rather impressed that i could install kstars |
| 19:22.48 | lloyd_fedora | Zork|gone: thanks .. will look into that |
| 19:22.56 | dos1 | sylar91, Mononoke: search for "accelerating in my pocket" by balrog-kun |
| 19:23.03 | Zork|gone | LuYu: there is something called Orrery |
| 19:23.08 | Mononoke | dos1: http://unadventure.wordpress.com/2008/06/08/accelerating-in-my-pocket/ ? |
| 19:23.10 | Zork|gone | that works very nice |
| 19:23.17 | dos1 | Mononoke: yep |
| 19:23.23 | sylar91 | dos1: to obtain what? |
| 19:23.38 | dos1 | sylar91: mp4 acceleration (glamo) in mplayer |
| 19:23.44 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey (n=emonkey@118-223-221-213-pool.cable.fcom.ch) |
| 19:23.48 | sylar91 | but glamo works? oO |
| 19:24.28 | dos1 | sylar91: lol, yes |
| 19:24.52 | LuYu | what about orrery? |
| 19:25.12 | Zork|gone | it does what kstars does I think (and I like the program) |
| 19:25.13 | dos1 | sylar91: why should it not work? (hmm, my english is strange, is it? :]) |
| 19:25.25 | dos1 | isn't it?* ^^" |
| 19:25.27 | Zork|gone | LuYu: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Orrery |
| 19:25.28 | KenYoung | Zork|gone, Thanks! |
| 19:25.34 | Zork|gone | hehe :) |
| 19:25.38 | sylar91 | it runs!!! |
| 19:25.55 | KenYoung | A newer, prettierr version will be released tonight. |
| 19:26.02 | Zork|gone | nice! |
| 19:26.02 | sylar91 | of what? |
| 19:26.06 | KenYoung | orrery |
| 19:26.15 | zash | le what now |
| 19:26.16 | rooly|away | hurricane party! |
| 19:26.25 | Zork|gone | I really like having the universe in my pocket :) |
| 19:26.32 | Zork|gone | bye |
| 19:26.32 | *** join/#openmoko lol_h (n=laurent@ip-213-49-85-70.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 19:28.44 | sylar91 | Thx all!!!! |
| 19:29.05 | LuYu | wow,that looks pretty nice |
| 19:29.25 | *** join/#openmoko admiral0_is_a_gh (n=admiral0@151.57.167.99) |
| 19:29.25 | *** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=SirBob17@pool-70-110-186-164.phil.east.verizon.net) |
| 19:29.39 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@91-65-91-60-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 19:29.44 | white_gecko | hello |
| 19:29.51 | white_gecko | i want to learn python now |
| 19:29.53 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@212-183-113-12.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 19:29.57 | white_gecko | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Python |
| 19:29.57 | LuYu | still, i want to see kstars work now that ive installed it |
| 19:29.58 | xt | white_gecko: good call |
| 19:30.15 | white_gecko | should i learn gtk or etk? |
| 19:30.22 | white_gecko | what exact is etk? |
| 19:30.43 | white_gecko | and how can i produce suche nice interfaces, in black and green |
| 19:31.12 | white_gecko | or better, is there some python qt for the freerunner? |
| 19:31.24 | white_gecko | because i know ruby qt and c++ qt |
| 19:31.46 | dos1 | white_gecko: black and green = efl |
| 19:31.57 | dos1 | enlightment libs |
| 19:32.11 | dos1 | etk* |
| 19:32.21 | sylar91 | is there a method to spedd flv? |
| 19:32.31 | dos1 | or something like that :x |
| 19:32.32 | white_gecko | efl aha |
| 19:33.00 | white_gecko | where can i find information about python and efl? |
| 19:33.08 | dos1 | sylar91: yes, but only to fix desynchronizing video and audio |
| 19:33.40 | white_gecko | there is no efl http://paste.debian.net/16170/ |
| 19:34.02 | dos1 | etk |
| 19:34.17 | sylar91 | sorry I can't understand what I have to do for xglamo... with this link http://unadventure.wordpress.com/2008/06/08/accelerating-in-my-pocket/ somebody could help me please? |
| 19:34.27 | feitingen | white_gecko: i think efl =~ etk |
| 19:34.30 | white_gecko | etk is installed, but etk is not he black-green thin |
| 19:35.05 | white_gecko | the http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Python#Minimal_ETK_gui example looked like standart enlightment |
| 19:36.26 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84-75-29-40.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:36.49 | *** part/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=Filip@213.219.157.251.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net) |
| 19:37.06 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@pdpc/supporter/active/bluelightning) |
| 19:37.24 | sylar91 | ehi glamo speeds up only mp4 videos or also flv? |
| 19:37.59 | *** join/#openmoko hanez (n=hanez@c198214.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 19:38.27 | dos1 | sylar91: only mp4 |
| 19:39.02 | sylar91 | ehm the site says I have to type on my linux box cg-clone git://repo.or.cz/mplayer/glamo.git |
| 19:39.08 | sylar91 | but I have no cg-clone |
| 19:39.11 | sylar91 | ... |
| 19:39.17 | sylar91 | how can I install it? on ubuntu? |
| 19:39.27 | Mononoke | git clone git://repo.or.cz/mplayer/glamo.git ? =] |
| 19:40.02 | sylar91 | thx :D |
| 19:40.11 | Mononoke | sylar91: better read discussion under blog and use link on prebuilt mplayer |
| 19:40.28 | sylar91 | ah |
| 19:41.21 | *** join/#openmoko bricode (n=bricode@190.10.109.40) |
| 19:41.32 | sylar91 | lol comments are by 3v1no, I know who he is :D an italian user like me |
| 19:42.46 | sylar91 | ehm files should be here ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/ but the folder is empty |
| 19:44.57 | balrog-kun | sylar91: it lists 4 files for me |
| 19:45.02 | Zork|gone | DocScrutinizer: did you read my mail about accelerators? (no hurry, you can read it anytime you want) |
| 19:45.07 | sylar91 | oO for me no... |
| 19:45.16 | sylar91 | could you link me the exact url plz? |
| 19:45.24 | sylar91 | in firefox it shows ftp folder empty... |
| 19:45.59 | dos1 | balrog-kun: i see empty folder too |
| 19:46.27 | *** part/#openmoko tomjoad440 (n=tomjoad4@adsl-70-130-240-250.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
| 19:48.09 | *** join/#openmoko Finiras (n=mizo666@unaffiliated/finiras) |
| 19:48.50 | balrog-kun | hmm hmm |
| 19:49.01 | sylar91 | ehi balrog! |
| 19:49.03 | balrog-kun | just opened in firefox, too and it shower four files |
| 19:49.05 | sylar91 | your server... is empty |
| 19:49.11 | balrog-kun | *showed |
| 19:49.16 | sylar91 | No... not for me |
| 19:49.18 | white_gecko | does anybody know how to cahnge the gtk theme on 2008.8 (update), because i cant read black letters on black background |
| 19:49.23 | sylar91 | could you link me the file directly please? |
| 19:49.52 | sylar91 | files are hidden for me |
| 19:50.04 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201.45.49.162) |
| 19:50.39 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 19:50.50 | Zork|gone | can see the files |
| 19:51.02 | balrog-kun | weird |
| 19:51.24 | Zork|gone | balrog-kun: are they for on the FR? |
| 19:51.25 | sylar91 | balrog I can't see the file |
| 19:51.36 | sylar91 | could you link me files plz? |
| 19:51.49 | Zork|gone | ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-balrog |
| 19:51.53 | Zork|gone | ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-abraxa |
| 19:51.56 | balrog-kun | sylar91: ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-abraxa is the abraxa's build |
| 19:51.58 | Zork|gone | ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/config_cmd |
| 19:52.11 | sylar91 | for neo fr? |
| 19:52.16 | balrog-kun | it's slow as hell though, for me |
| 19:52.24 | dos1 | binnaries? |
| 19:52.31 | balrog-kun | plus i'm irc'ing from the same ip the ftp is on |
| 19:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko mattl_ (n=mattl@c-76-119-239-181.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 19:52.52 | balrog-kun | so typing is slow as hell too |
| 19:53.06 | dos1 | sylar91: for neo fr, because gta01 doesn't have glamo ;p |
| 19:53.08 | balrog-kun | sylar91: please don't message me |
| 19:53.17 | sylar91 | ok... sorry |
| 19:53.23 | sylar91 | ehm... I have a problem |
| 19:53.51 | sylar91 | I can't show files in folder, so please somebody could send me a direct link to the package file? |
| 19:53.56 | *** join/#openmoko marcel_m (n=marcel_m@86.59.65.236) |
| 19:54.03 | Zork|gone | sylar91: i already posted the links |
| 19:54.17 | sylar91 | it shows me a folder |
| 19:54.20 | sylar91 | empty |
| 19:54.35 | Zork|gone | sylar I ALREADY COPY PASTED THEM |
| 19:54.40 | Zork|gone | <Zork|gone> ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-balrog |
| 19:54.41 | Zork|gone | <Zork|gone> ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-abraxa |
| 19:54.42 | Zork|gone | <Zork|gone> ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-balrog |
| 19:54.42 | Zork|gone | <Zork|gone> ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-abraxa |
| 19:54.44 | sylar91 | could you host the file on rapidshare or on another service? |
| 19:54.52 | sylar91 | those link don't work for me!! |
| 19:54.53 | Zork|gone | (sorry for double) |
| 19:54.54 | Zork|gone | <Zork|gone> ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/config_cmd |
| 19:54.59 | Zork|gone | very strange.... |
| 19:55.00 | sylar91 | they shows me an empty folder.... |
| 19:55.05 | sylar91 | in firefox |
| 19:55.18 | Zork|gone | sylar91: try to wget them |
| 19:55.21 | balrog-kun | chances are rapidshare won't work for you either, then |
| 19:55.22 | sylar91 | ok |
| 19:56.01 | Tanuva | the url seems to work here, starts to d/l something large |
| 19:56.22 | sylar91 | sylar@sylar91-laptop:~$ wget ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-abraxa |
| 19:56.23 | sylar91 | --21:55:37-- ftp://balrog.myftp.org/mplayer/mplayer-abraxa |
| 19:56.23 | sylar91 | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:56.23 | sylar91 | Resolving balrog.myftp.org... 83.31.124.187 |
| 19:56.23 | sylar91 | Connecting to balrog.myftp.org|83.31.124.187|:21... connected. |
| 19:56.23 | sylar91 | Logging in as anonymous ... Logged in! |
| 19:56.25 | sylar91 | ==> SYST ... done. ==> PWD ... done. |
| 19:56.27 | sylar91 | ==> TYPE I ... done. ==> CWD /mplayer ... done. |
| 19:56.29 | sylar91 | ==> PASV ... |
| 19:56.31 | sylar91 | Error in server response, closing control connection. |
| 19:56.32 | str4nd | ~pastebin |
| 19:56.32 | apt | [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste |
| 19:56.33 | sylar91 | Retrying. |
| 19:56.35 | sylar91 | (sorry for spam...) |
| 19:57.09 | sylar91 | so please can somebody send me files via email? |
| 19:57.53 | Zork|gone | syloar: i'll upload them somewhere |
| 19:57.59 | balrog-kun | sylar91: these builds don't support audio anyway |
| 19:58.11 | abraxa_ | sylar91: Sounds like a problem with your router, as passive FTP doesn't work for you |
| 19:58.12 | balrog-kun | i doiubt you will have much use of them |
| 19:58.29 | Zork|gone | do you need the abraxa one or the balrog one? |
| 19:58.35 | sylar91 | I don't need audio, I want test it |
| 19:58.41 | *** join/#openmoko harzi (n=dani@84-73-143-231.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:58.47 | sylar91 | The one with glamo support |
| 19:58.56 | SpeedEvil | ~pastabin |
| 19:59.20 | sylar91 | hosted? |
| 19:59.21 | Mononoke | hmm someone could build latest git and put it into some repo |
| 19:59.29 | Zork|gone | download is working at 4.1kb/sec sylar91 |
| 19:59.33 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@host-84-221-254-115.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 19:59.49 | sylar91 | maybe I'm a router problem because I'm using a 3g usb modem |
| 20:00.05 | dos1 | i'm finishing download |
| 20:00.07 | dos1 | :] |
| 20:00.11 | sylar91 | somebody could host them somewhere? |
| 20:00.11 | Zork|gone | 28minutes remaining, i'm gonna cancel it sylar, i'm going away from the computer for a while |
| 20:00.23 | sylar91 | ok, dos1 could you send me the file? |
| 20:00.38 | balrog-kun | is not surprised at the 4.1 KB/s :( |
| 20:01.22 | sylar91 | somebody could send me the file please? I have to go away from the pc in some minutes... |
| 20:03.20 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTuby (n=maarten@195-241-125-243.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 20:04.36 | dos1 | ok, i downloaded it |
| 20:04.49 | dos1 | i will send it to polish openmoko server |
| 20:05.12 | DocScrutinizer | Zork|gone: yup, read it. Anyway, calculations i've seen on one of the ML some time ago clearly suggested it's not exact enough for e.g. dead recconing in navisystems |
| 20:05.25 | darkjames | sylar91, you could try passing --no-passive-ftp to wget. |
| 20:05.47 | *** join/#openmoko SiNiESTrO (n=siniestr@179.Red-80-33-148.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:06.03 | sylar91 | gone! it is downloading, thx |
| 20:06.15 | sylar91 | but how many bytes does it need? |
| 20:06.32 | sylar91 | How it is large? |
| 20:06.35 | sylar91 | How many kbs? |
| 20:07.32 | SpeedEvil | Zork|gone: the accelerometers on the fr have a resolution of 16mg - this is 16cm/s^2. After 10 seconds, your velocity is out by around 1.6m/s, and position by 8m. After 2 mins, 20m/s, and 1Km. |
| 20:08.17 | sylar91 | lol |
| 20:08.37 | SpeedEvil | Zork|gone: see technical:accelerometers in the wiki |
| 20:08.38 | *** join/#openmoko alexxy (n=alexxy@79.173.81.171) |
| 20:09.07 | *** join/#openmoko Siph0n (n=siph0n@c-98-221-218-112.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:09.26 | sylar91 | dos1: how many kbs is? |
| 20:09.31 | *** join/#openmoko Cthobs (n=cerebus@fl-76-1-160-181.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 20:09.32 | white_gecko | where can i find information, how to read from the accelerometers? |
| 20:10.02 | *** join/#openmoko tomer (n=tomer@89-139-138-186.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 20:10.20 | *** join/#openmoko fenfir (n=fenfir@adsl-75-23-45-121.dsl.lgvwtx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 20:10.38 | edistar | white_gecko: wiki.. wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/accelerometers |
| 20:10.43 | sylar91 | cat /dev/input/event3 |
| 20:10.45 | white_gecko | thx |
| 20:11.40 | SpeedEvil | hexdump -C /dev/input/event3 is nicer |
| 20:11.44 | SpeedEvil | human readable. |
| 20:11.53 | SpeedEvil | (for skilled humans) |
| 20:12.10 | cjb | white_gecko: you could also look at a program I wrote that does it. |
| 20:12.11 | white_gecko | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Technical:Accelerometer_Fundamentals |
| 20:12.23 | cjb | white_gecko: http://github.com/cjb/freerunner-rotate/tree/master/rotate.c |
| 20:13.04 | dos1 | balrog_kun: i have sound with your build |
| 20:13.10 | white_gecko | cool |
| 20:13.29 | white_gecko | i think i saw your youtube video |
| 20:13.41 | white_gecko | if it is with the rotation omoko logo |
| 20:15.12 | white_gecko | no ok |
| 20:15.50 | *** join/#openmoko snp (n=snp@c-4f668ddb-74736162.cust.telenor.se) |
| 20:19.15 | md2k7 | is there a way to customize the illume/Rasters keyboard? |
| 20:19.44 | *** part/#openmoko sylar91 (n=sylar@91.80.224.221) |
| 20:19.47 | md2k7 | e.g. i would like to have some localized keys for German or Hungarian |
| 20:20.13 | *** join/#openmoko toxx_ (n=toxx_@157-228-dsl.kielnet.net) |
| 20:20.15 | edistar | md2k7: yes, decompile the edj file and modify it |
| 20:20.22 | edistar | then recompile |
| 20:20.57 | md2k7 | eh, bit too fast for me... recompile what, where?! :P |
| 20:21.18 | md2k7 | where is that file? how to (de)compile it? |
| 20:21.38 | edistar | there should be instructions in the wiki |
| 20:23.52 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@host-84-221-254-115.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 20:24.34 | md2k7 | nice. found it under "Keyboard Toggle" |
| 20:24.39 | *** join/#openmoko Kriegy (n=Kriegy@rue92-3-82-232-51-132.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:24.47 | Kriegy | hi here / salut ici |
| 20:25.10 | edistar | md2k7: good |
| 20:25.17 | *** join/#openmoko marcinsoo (n=fdsaf@adab158.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 20:25.58 | Kriegy | i have a question about the Neo FreeRunner phone : is it multi touch ? |
| 20:26.18 | baze | no, it's not |
| 20:26.29 | Kriegy | it's bad :/ |
| 20:27.23 | Kriegy | I'm interested by this device, but i'm not sure... it's a lot of money so :/ |
| 20:29.59 | *** join/#openmoko skorzen (n=skorzen@89-180-27-95.net.novis.pt) |
| 20:31.05 | *** join/#openmoko [Rui] (n=Rui@81.84.181.241) |
| 20:31.06 | dolf1074 | For what do you want to use it? |
| 20:32.11 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@220-115.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 20:32.15 | [Rui] | waves... I installed back raster's image, but it needed zeckes updates for it to work. now they're gone, which should I use? |
| 20:32.27 | [Rui] | I need to make a call but the current suspend issue is quite darned :) |
| 20:33.13 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@76-10-173-74.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 20:33.59 | johnsu01 | So, I'm using qtopia, but I have a set of bugs to file against the keyboard. Should I file these at openmoko.org, or is there an upstream place that's better? I'm reading through all the keyboard bugs at docs.openmoko.org/trac now |
| 20:34.23 | *** join/#openmoko snp_ (n=snp@c-4f669444-74736162.cust.telenor.se) |
| 20:34.47 | lpotter | if you got it from qtopia.net use http://trolltech.com/trolltech/bugreport-form |
| 20:35.42 | dolf1074 | and is there a way to see the bugs that are posted on trolltech? |
| 20:35.55 | dolf1074 | So I can follow them? |
| 20:36.14 | johnsu01 | hm, I don't see a tracker there :/ |
| 20:37.07 | eliasp | http://trolltech.org/developer/task-tracker/ |
| 20:38.22 | johnsu01 | eliasp: thanks |
| 20:38.32 | Kriegy | i want to use it as a multimedia player, for the main usage, phone also, but i'm not sure the device is enough resistant |
| 20:39.14 | Kriegy | i mean, very good components, and a good life time |
| 20:40.24 | johnsu01 | hm, so I take it the om version of the keyboard has diverged a lot from the qtopia version? |
| 20:41.58 | lpotter | om does not use any qtopia inputmethodfs |
| 20:44.17 | johnsu01 | lpotter: The keyboard is the same, when I tried om2008 and this qtopia install |
| 20:44.51 | lpotter | its not the same. the om is based on the qtopia one |
| 20:46.57 | johnsu01 | I do see a bug talking about cleaning up code for qtopia upstream |
| 20:49.15 | *** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@knet-gip124.prod.bolignet.dk) |
| 20:50.53 | *** join/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=Filip@213.219.157.251.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net) |
| 20:53.57 | johngay | Anyone know how to debug charger_type? |
| 20:54.09 | johngay | Sorry, decode |
| 20:55.01 | johngay | I bought a crackberry car charger which claims to be rated 500mA. |
| 20:55.02 | *** part/#openmoko rooly|away (n=chris@ip70-188-121-225.lf.br.cox.net) |
| 20:55.57 | johngay | When I plug it into my FR, /sys/devices/platform/s3c2440-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/charger_type reports host/500mA usb mode 1A |
| 20:56.39 | johngay | When I plug my FR into the 1A wall adaptor, it says charger 1A mode 1A |
| 20:58.10 | johngay | When I plug it into my PC, it says host/500mA usb mode 500mA |
| 20:58.41 | RedFlash2000 | mabe this helps http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=297&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=battery&start=15#p3525 |
| 20:58.43 | *** part/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e181172156.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 21:01.35 | *** join/#openmoko DieMumiee (n=DieMumie@W2c28.w.pppool.de) |
| 21:05.19 | *** join/#openmoko ||Leto|| (n=tomboy64@dslb-088-075-218-145.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 21:05.58 | *** join/#openmoko undrwater (n=root@pool-71-160-231-186.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 21:07.38 | johngay | I stopped in Radio Shack on the off chance they would have something to let me plug USB devices into my FR. The sales droid claimed he'd seen lots of phones just like mine (-= |
| 21:09.12 | *** join/#openmoko jo0ma (n=milos@92.36.159.223) |
| 21:09.57 | undrwater | john /cable?t |
| 21:10.00 | slaxxin | that is funny |
| 21:11.24 | johngay | He kept trying to get me to buy a USB hub. |
| 21:11.44 | slaxxin | anybody using the latest qtopia? |
| 21:12.00 | slaxxin | is gps there? |
| 21:12.20 | undrwater | powdered hub will help |
| 21:12.29 | *** join/#openmoko marcel_m (n=marcel_m@86.59.65.236) |
| 21:12.38 | undrwater | powered |
| 21:13.02 | slaxxin | shach didnt have ant cable accessoties? |
| 21:13.36 | *** join/#openmoko leinir (n=leinir@amarok/usability/leinir) |
| 21:13.36 | undrwater | predictive keyboard |
| 21:13.42 | johngay | Only to connect the FR to a PC as a device. Not for connecting devices to the FR acting as host. |
| 21:13.42 | *** join/#openmoko admiral0 (n=root@151.57.196.79) |
| 21:14.19 | johngay | Best Buy has a Bluetooth keyboard I almost bought for $129.95 |
| 21:14.44 | johngay | But I think I can get a better deal on Black Friday. |
| 21:14.45 | slaxxin | what brand / modlel |
| 21:15.31 | johngay | The big brand. Can't remember the name, but it folded in half with full-size keys. |
| 21:15.34 | *** join/#openmoko Psi_ (n=benw@ip-58-28-158-238.static-xdsl.xnet.co.nz) |
| 21:15.40 | undrwater | iriver cable? |
| 21:15.58 | slaxxin | http://www.apple.com/keyboard/ |
| 21:16.01 | *** part/#openmoko admiral0 (n=root@151.57.196.79) |
| 21:16.06 | undrwater | for host mode |
| 21:16.17 | johngay | iGo Stowaway |
| 21:16.20 | [Rui] | any hints on how to prevent suspend? |
| 21:16.32 | *** join/#openmoko PermBan (n=SuN@82-170-225-106.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 21:16.55 | *** part/#openmoko undrwater (n=root@pool-71-160-231-186.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 21:17.13 | slaxxin | is it 2008.8? |
| 21:18.01 | johngay | That apple BT Keyboard looks nice |
| 21:18.31 | slaxxin | i saw it a best buy |
| 21:18.38 | slaxxin | but i want this |
| 21:18.55 | slaxxin | http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/input/8193/?cpg=ab |
| 21:19.16 | slaxxin | i think that apple keyboard is glass |
| 21:19.50 | slaxxin | http://www.amazon.com/Stowaway-Ultra-Slim-Bluetooth-Blackberry-Handhelds/dp/B0002OKCXE |
| 21:20.49 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@220-115.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 21:21.57 | *** join/#openmoko ftnt (n=yo@81.202.151.120.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 21:23.04 | johngay | No, it says it's anodized aluminum |
| 21:23.38 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@220-115.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 21:23.53 | johngay | Does it work with FR, or does it use special Apple-only protocols? |
| 21:26.46 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178008090.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 21:28.26 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@78-22-6-189.access.telenet.be) |
| 21:28.37 | johngay | I also got a 2G SD card for $15 |
| 21:28.55 | *** join/#openmoko reet (n=r33t@gw.ptr-80-238-187-45.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 21:29.18 | *** join/#openmoko pea (n=pea@adsl-68-23-85-172.dsl.dytnoh.ameritech.net) |
| 21:32.41 | *** part/#openmoko lloyd_fedora (n=darkstar@86.99.63.11) |
| 21:39.53 | *** join/#openmoko Tig| (n=user@82.153.215.237) |
| 21:40.21 | Cthobs | johngay: Scroll down to HID here -> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_Bluetooth |
| 21:40.51 | white_gecko | how to use opkg's autoremove? |
| 21:41.28 | white_gecko | "opkg -autoremove" gives me the help screen |
| 21:43.11 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84-75-29-40.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 21:45.07 | *** join/#openmoko skorzen (n=skorzen@89-180-27-95.net.novis.pt) |
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| 21:51.27 | Kriegy | bye here ! |
| 21:53.50 | viq | For which images/distributions is OpenVPN available? |
| 21:53.58 | lindi- | viq: debian |
| 21:54.07 | viq | only? |
| 21:54.37 | ftnt | viq it's on the repos |
| 21:55.13 | viq | ftnt: which ones? Sorry, from my side it's still a theoretical question as I don't have the hardware yet |
| 21:55.15 | lindi- | viq: i haven't managed to compile many others |
| 21:55.57 | lindi- | viq: oe seems to have ./openembedded/packages/openvpn/openvpn_2.0.9.bb |
| 21:56.03 | lindi- | which may or may not build :P |
| 21:56.08 | viq | lol |
| 21:56.20 | ftnt | viq http://www.angstrom-distribution.org/feeds/2008/ipk/glibc/armv4t/base |
| 21:56.22 | lindi- | sorry for being a pessimist |
| 21:56.30 | ftnt | it's compatible with 2008.8 and fso |
| 21:56.40 | viq | ftnt: thank you |
| 21:58.31 | viq | Hm, there's kismet as well in there ;) |
| 21:59.06 | ftnt | and and aircrack :p |
| 21:59.21 | viq | hehe |
| 21:59.44 | lindi- | not to mention ettercap :) |
| 21:59.53 | viq | hehe |
| 22:00.06 | viq | Thanks |
| 22:00.09 | viq | and bath time ;) |
| 22:02.59 | reet | hi |
| 22:03.03 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:03.13 | rwhitby | the wifi in FR doesn't support anything like aircrack |
| 22:03.15 | reet | I'm using qtopia 4.3.2 with freerunner |
| 22:03.39 | rwhitby | viq: openvpn is in the fso feeds at shr.bearstech.com |
| 22:03.54 | reet | after wakeup from suspend, the aux led is always on |
| 22:03.58 | rwhitby | since it's in task-openmoko-feed.bb, it should be in all well-run openmoko distro feeds |
| 22:03.58 | reet | is this a bug or a feature? :) |
| 22:07.33 | ftnt | mmm, how can I detected if the aux button is pressed? |
| 22:08.34 | lindi- | ftnt: http://iki.fi/lindi/openmoko/right-click-with-aux |
| 22:08.48 | ftnt | thx <lindi-> |
| 22:11.00 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt (n=chomwitt@adsl45-23.ath.forthnet.gr) |
| 22:15.50 | viq | rwhitby: thank you |
| 22:17.30 | Fradeve | how can I start the spanner-menu from terminal? |
| 22:19.12 | OMBugsBot | [Bug] #1947: om2008.8: Bluetooth icon isn't properly aligned next to the wifi, battery and gsm icon ( http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1947 ) |
| 22:26.07 | *** join/#openmoko tunys (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 22:29.27 | Dave | Freedom Day! |
| 22:29.34 | *** part/#openmoko ndrs_ (n=ndrs___@89.100.134.136) |
| 22:29.53 | SpeedEvil | Oh noes! Does that mean I have to release the hounds? |
| 22:29.57 | *** join/#openmoko adorableidiot (n=fabian@p50824E17.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:30.13 | tomcatek | yes! |
| 22:30.46 | Dave | Eeeeeeeeexcellent >:) |
| 22:33.24 | *** join/#openmoko bobbychou (i=Bobb_@modemcable067.255-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 22:33.28 | *** part/#openmoko bobbychou (i=Bobb_@modemcable067.255-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 22:34.35 | *** join/#openmoko tomjoad440 (n=tomjoad4@adsl-70-130-143-107.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
| 22:35.47 | Dave | lul |
| 22:35.56 | Dave | opkg: fork failed |
| 22:35.56 | Dave | Segmentation fault |
| 22:36.01 | Dave | \o/ |
| 22:36.40 | tomcatek | huehue |
| 22:37.23 | tomcatek | i've tried OM2007.?? and OM2008 and FR still hungs sometimes :/ |
| 22:46.30 | Mononoke | wonders how to take screenshot on 2008.9 |
| 22:46.39 | Dave | Who'd want to? |
| 22:46.49 | Dave | scap'ing the fail, are you? |
| 22:46.56 | white_gecko | how can i remove packages which where installed automaticaly |
| 22:47.11 | tomcatek | what for? |
| 22:47.15 | Mononoke | opkg remove ? |
| 22:47.28 | tomcatek | they might beneeded by some software installed |
| 22:47.48 | white_gecko | but some programms install dependencies and i dont know which packages i don't need anymore? |
| 22:50.01 | *** join/#openmoko Reid (n=stealthc@user-514d0b9d.l3.c1.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 22:54.11 | white_gecko | there is the -autoremove option |
| 22:54.20 | white_gecko | but i don't know how to use it |
| 22:54.38 | tomcatek | opkg -autoremove? |
| 22:54.46 | white_gecko | no |
| 22:54.53 | white_gecko | this shows me the help screen |
| 22:56.42 | *** part/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=Filip@213.219.157.251.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net) |
| 23:01.53 | slaxxin | Mononoke i started the screenshot then quickly went to the page i wanted to shoot an it worked |
| 23:03.41 | *** join/#openmoko shoragan (n=shoragan@debian/developer/shoragan) |
| 23:03.44 | *** join/#openmoko Ganneff (i=joerg@freenode/staff/debian.joerg) |
| 23:03.52 | *** join/#openmoko UhCLem (n=Ken@pool-68-160-2-138.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:06.28 | *** join/#openmoko KenYoung (n=Ken@pool-68-160-2-138.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:08.05 | *** join/#openmoko shoragan_ (n=shoragan@sicherheitsschwankung.de) |
| 23:17.40 | *** join/#openmoko Henrique (n=henrique@189.100.129.247) |
| 23:17.55 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201009022123.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 23:18.20 | johngay | So, where do I get an adaptor that lets me plug devices into my FR? |
| 23:22.35 | white_gecko | in usb? |
| 23:23.22 | KenYoung | Dave, are you there? |
| 23:23.32 | *** join/#openmoko hb9egm (n=bram@cl-103.zrh-01.ch.sixxs.net) |
| 23:27.01 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 23:27.35 | KenYoung | Is there a way to adjust the backlight brightness on an OM phone besides writing to the /sys,.../brightness files, that would be independent of the phone model? |
| 23:29.27 | tomcatek | in OM2008 there is a possibility to costomize that in settings |
| 23:30.49 | *** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=SirBob17@pool-70-110-186-164.phil.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:30.52 | KenYoung | tomboy64, Yes, but I want to do that from within a program. |
| 23:33.15 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-254.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 23:38.06 | MadTBone | can we access accelerometers in Debian? |
| 23:40.51 | slaxxin | howto copy from notes an paste into terminal i fail |
| 23:41.23 | *** join/#openmoko gambler_ (n=gambler@124-171-206-63.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
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| 23:47.43 | Dave | Hi KenYoung! |
| 23:47.49 | Dave | It's a pleasure to see you. |
| 23:48.17 | KenYoung | Hi Dave, I just wanted to check with you again - you want the orrery category changed to PIM, right? |
| 23:53.39 | *** join/#openmoko Tanuva (n=tanuva@e177224095.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 23:54.55 | *** join/#openmoko xmpp (n=uhsf@modemcable080.251-20-96.mc.videotron.ca) |
