IRC log for #openmoko on 20080118

00:02.43*** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro)
00:06.43*** join/#openmoko orion__ (n=orion@124-171-194-117.dyn.iinet.net.au)
00:09.15*** join/#openmoko gambler (n=orion@124-171-181-173.dyn.iinet.net.au)
00:09.59*** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@dsl093-060-111.pit1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
00:26.44*** join/#openmoko merriam_ (n=merriam@wmerriam.gotadsl.co.uk)
00:28.44*** join/#openmoko rtp (n=rtp@2a01:5d8:58a6:7960:20e:cff:fedc:7859)
00:30.43*** join/#openmoko Weteor (n=Weteor@i59F6096D.versanet.de)
00:32.19*** join/#openmoko TobiX (i=tobias@zoidberg.org)
00:35.39*** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@adsl-69-149-55-173.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net)
00:42.39*** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-70-202.dyn.iinet.net.au)
00:44.48*** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117)
00:52.05*** join/#openmoko merriam__ (n=merriam@wmerriam.gotadsl.co.uk)
00:55.42*** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
01:05.37*** join/#openmoko demaledetti (n=ste@151.16.94.105)
01:13.23*** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@74-132-81-162.dhcp.insightbb.com)
01:57.20*** join/#openmoko mzb (n=ubernut@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net)
02:18.47*** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-98-199-135-173.hsd1.tx.comcast.net)
02:30.03*** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@c-24-118-78-158.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
02:31.07*** join/#openmoko fgau_ (n=fgau@pD953A8DF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
02:31.54*** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=mcginley@139.84.102.124)
02:43.08*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p5491A815.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
02:49.32*** join/#openmoko shenki (n=joel@202.174.42.5)
02:51.24*** join/#openmoko gambler (n=orion@124-171-224-67.dyn.iinet.net.au)
02:53.59*** join/#openmoko moko-bunny (n=reik@CPE-76-178-148-218.natnow.res.rr.com)
03:13.18*** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39)
03:19.44*** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@69.229.198.200)
03:22.14*** join/#openmoko [1]koko (n=hoho@adsl-71-132-208-73.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)
03:25.38*** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=Kevin@fsf/member/kdean06)
03:39.51*** join/#openmoko freeflying (n=freeflyi@ubuntu/member/freeflying)
03:41.03*** join/#openmoko wildfire (n=wildfire@203.7.227.146)
03:41.38*** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7be0f.pool.einsundeins.de)
03:42.04freeflyinghi all, after flash the kernel and rootfs, the system can not run, stopped at the splash process about 90%
03:42.22SpeedEvilOk.
03:42.29SpeedEvilHave you ever upgraded u-boot?
03:42.38freeflyingno
03:42.43SpeedEvilRight.
03:42.50freeflyingusing the rootfs and kernel here: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/
03:42.55SpeedEvilYour problem is probably that jffs2 sucks
03:43.10SpeedEvilIt gets confused if you copy a smaller image over a larger one
03:43.15freeflyingSpeedEvil: but the rootfs was mounted
03:43.16SpeedEvilthis can result in partial booting
03:43.25SpeedEviland massive filesystem corruption
03:43.44SpeedEvileven though the copy is OK, the bit left unwiped corrupts.
03:43.47freeflyingSpeedEvil: need I erase the rootfs before flash new one?
03:44.22SpeedEvilyes
03:44.22SpeedEvillook at http://www.airdisaster.com/forums/
03:44.23SpeedEvilerr
03:44.23SpeedEvilhttp://www.arrowne.com/arrow_worldwide/uk/main.html
03:44.23freeflyingSpeedEvil: any new rootfs and kernenl?
03:44.23SpeedEvilargh
03:44.24SpeedEvilhang on
03:44.48freeflyingthx
03:45.57SpeedEvilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko
03:46.07SpeedEvilsearch for erase rootfs
03:46.12SpeedEviland do read the cautions
03:46.59freeflyingSpeedEvil: and where can I find the latest kernel and rootfs? thx
03:47.18SpeedEvilDon't know, I use mokomakefile to build my own
03:48.29freeflyingr u using neo1973 now?
03:49.19SpeedEvilhttp://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/?M=D seems current
03:49.21SpeedEvilyea
03:49.56SpeedEvilhttp://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080115-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 in that directory
03:50.17freeflyingthanks
03:50.58*** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any@bzq-219-165-186.static.bezeqint.net)
03:50.58SpeedEvilI think http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr3801-r13-neo1973.bin is the matching kernel
03:52.25Any_Keymorning all
03:53.01cdbot2* * OM Bug 1188 has been created by kevin(AT)foreverdean.info
03:53.02cdbot2* * Entering e-mail address causes "phantom" button presses
03:53.03cdbot2* * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1188
03:53.15SpeedEvilHowever, the images you have should work adter doing nand erase rootfs
03:54.33freeflyingSpeedEvil: I got to try, thanks
03:54.35*** join/#openmoko linuxxr (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net)
03:57.05freeflyingSpeedEvil: firstly flash the kernel or rootfs?
03:57.34kdean06I asked earlier and nobody responded, but for the app where one adds contact to the address book, is that application called openmoko-contacts2 and if so, where is it located in SVN? I do not see it in applications and I'm wondering if this is an oversight or if it's actually part of another application.
03:58.30*** join/#openmoko olv (n=olvaffe@firewall.tw.openmoko.org)
04:02.53SpeedEvilfreeflying: kernel is fine
04:03.00freeflyingSpeedEvil: thanks
04:03.15SpeedEvilfreeflying: it's only the rootfs that needs the nand erase rootfs done
04:03.38*** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net)
04:06.31freeflyingSpeedEvil: I also erase the kernel :)
04:07.29SpeedEvilWon't do any harm - but isn't needed - the kernel doesn't suffer from the problem with leftover data
04:13.32*** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=mcginley@139.84.102.124)
04:34.27*** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@122-57-172-4.jetstream.xtra.co.nz)
04:38.39*** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo)
04:40.05*** join/#openmoko justin111 (n=justin_r@71-34-83-170.ptld.qwest.net)
04:40.17justin111anyone there
04:40.56justin111i have a few ?s on the neo before i buy
04:42.32mwesterer, "3", "Yes", and "Sometimes, but not on alternate Tuesdays".     Do those answers match any of your questions?  :p
04:43.32SpeedEvilAnd also 'yes, but it's not waterproof, and the vibrate function will drain the battery rapidly'.
04:43.49mwesterjustin111:  just ask.  those who are able to answer will do so when they happen to glance back in on this channel from whatever they might be doing right now...
04:43.50SpeedEvil@find harald friedman
04:43.52SpeedEviloops
04:44.27justin111is the GTA02 the final hardware for the consumer version
04:44.34SpeedEvilNo
04:44.42SpeedEvilThere will hopefully never be final hardware
04:44.51justin111well
04:44.55SpeedEvilopenmoko will succeed and eventually more and more phones will be released
04:45.04justin111will GTA02 be sold as the consemer version
04:45.21SpeedEvilAs we understand it, those are the current plans
04:45.43SpeedEvilit's going to be at least several months before hardware - with debatably complete software will be available.
04:46.24justin111ok so if i buy one now will i be able to upgrade to consumer software
04:46.38SpeedEvilyes - that's the entire point
04:46.49rasterwell final for the GTA02
04:46.54rasterlike any company that makese a product
04:47.02rasterit will make a "newer product"
04:47.18SpeedEvilThe whole idea of openmoko is that you have a tiny bit of per-phone software
04:47.31SpeedEvilThe kernel drivers basically, and any userspace handlers for them.
04:47.39justin111what is the extent of this linux kernal is it like uclinux or a full blown 2.6
04:47.42rasterthat depends
04:47.43SpeedEvilthen the rest of the phone stack is 'just' linux
04:47.47SpeedEviljustin111: full
04:47.47rasterif phone has no camera
04:47.51rasterno need to put it on
04:47.54rasteradd camera for phhone
04:48.02rastercustomised ui layout/look to match phone design
04:48.12rasteror screen resolution
04:48.13rasteretc.
04:48.17justin111KDE or GNOME (quick poll)
04:48.21rasterthe principle is right
04:48.23SpeedEviljustin111: it's basically more similar in many ways to desktop environment software-wise than anything else.
04:48.27rasteravoid doing massive work per phone
04:48.32rasterbut it still needs work per phone
04:48.41rasterjustin111:  neither
04:49.12justin111whats the CPU clock on the neo
04:49.20SpeedEvil266Mhz
04:49.29raster266 on the gta01
04:49.31SpeedEvil400 on the newer version to yet be released
04:49.35rastergta02 currently is stable at 400
04:49.35justin111isnt that right round pentium I
04:49.40SpeedEvilPretty much
04:49.41rasterbut in theory we can do 500
04:49.47rasterif we fiddle with volatages a bit
04:49.51SpeedEvilIt's about the same class as a
04:49.53SpeedEvilP100
04:49.56rasterbut we dont have it stable
04:50.06justin111are you a dev raster
04:50.08SpeedEvilOnly 400 is specced in the datasheet
04:50.12rasterSpeedEvil:  the 266?
04:50.29SpeedEvilraster: no - the CPU for the freerunner/gta02
04:50.39rasterSpeedEvil:  the 266 is about a p100
04:50.42rasterprobably a bit more
04:50.54rasterlast time i checked arm against x86 on a p1
04:50.57justin111is the ram on the neo Phase change RAM like on IPOD
04:51.06SpeedEvilphase change?
04:51.12justin111PRAM
04:51.16justin111like in IPOD
04:51.22rasterthe x86 has about a 20% advantage per mhz
04:51.24SpeedEvilI'm not aware of the ipod using other than flash
04:51.50rasterso a 100mhz pentium would eb about a 120mhz arm
04:51.58SpeedEvilerr - no
04:52.05rastermind u that was the strongarm in the ipaq3660
04:52.15SpeedEvilpentium has significantly faster in some cases - especially FP
04:52.30rasterok
04:52.31SpeedEvilP100-P120 is about right. I booted up my old P100 laptop
04:52.32rasternot for fp
04:52.34rasterfor integer
04:52.45justin111im a lil lost
04:52.48SpeedEvilWell - the neo CPU has no FPU
04:52.49SpeedEvilat all
04:53.07SpeedEvilYou may be thinking of other ARM devices that do
04:53.13rastermy pentium300mmx vaio  was about double the speed of my 206mhz ipaq 3660
04:53.25rastermy tests had no fp ops
04:53.28rasterinteger only
04:53.34rasterjustin111:  yes. i am
04:53.45rasterSpeedEvil:  tyhis is from memory
04:53.49rasteralso this is p1
04:54.01rastermuch shorter pipelines and much crappier branch prediciton etc.
04:54.07rastercompared to todays x86
04:54.16rasterand this was strongarm
04:54.22rasterwhhic reportedly was kick-arse
04:54.26rasterits memory bus rocked
04:54.27justin111i wish i could program for neo but im only 15 >.> all i have ever done is set up a web server
04:54.35rasterunlike everythnig since
04:54.49rasterjustin111:  then start learning
04:55.00rasterwhen i was 15 i was writing games in 68kasm
04:55.00justin111where on earth do i start
04:55.11*** part/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net)
04:55.12rasterbuy a book
04:55.43justin111what languages does neo support atm python C++
04:56.01justin111ohoh i think someone needs to port doom to neo
04:56.10justin111i wish i could do that
04:56.48rasterits a linux machine
04:56.54rasterwhatever you can put on linux
04:57.04rasterits a full linux kenel, userspace etc.,
04:57.13rastermost stuff is done with c/c++ thouhg
04:57.21rasteras its well supported by toolchains and fast
04:57.34justin111could i write simple open GL stuff i
04:57.47rasterneo has no opengl accel
04:57.52justin111oh
04:57.58SpeedEvilIt's a simple framebuffer
04:57.59rasterporting doom is not useful
04:58.03rasteralready been done
04:58.03justin111any 3d
04:58.05SpeedEvilthough at QVGA it's not so bad
04:58.07SpeedEvilIt's a simple framebuffer
04:58.19SpeedEvilThere is _no_ 2d or 3d accel - in this current version
04:58.29justin111oh
04:58.40SpeedEvilIt can do virtual windows, pallette, and that's about it
04:58.42justin111doom isnt technaclly 3d too
04:58.43justin111right
04:59.30SpeedEvilAs a benchmark - my PII/300 is 10 times as fast at md5sum /dev/zero as the neo
04:59.58SpeedEvilI forgot to time a kernel compile
05:00.04justin111raster what dev are you whats your name
05:00.31justin111im trying to figure out what you do
05:01.09rasterJanC:  i'm raster
05:01.13SpeedEvilHe wanders from side to side, while descending slowly.
05:01.14rasterjustin111: i'm raster
05:01.15raster:)
05:02.51justin111where are you on the dev page are you one of the paid guys
05:03.07rasterSpeedEvil:  i did some detailed speed analysis on my gta01 and gta02
05:03.12rastertrying to find my spreadsheet for it
05:03.21rasterjustin111: i work at openmoko
05:03.36SpeedEvilAnyway - P100-P150 is probably reasonable for 01
05:03.46justin111hey i have an idea could you run damn small linux on neo (you know that distro right)
05:03.46SpeedEvilmaybe more or less in extreme tasks
05:03.51*** join/#openmoko wildfire (n=wildfire@203.7.227.146)
05:03.55rasteraha
05:03.56SpeedEviljustin111: you can run whatever you like
05:04.06SpeedEviljustin111: the only problem is some distros are broken on arm
05:04.08rasterthese are rendering benchmarks
05:04.15raster3.0ghz core2 duo
05:04.18raster863
05:04.24rastergta01
05:04.34justin111serioulsy i could run a full desktop linux distro from my phone
05:04.35raster13.77
05:04.35justin111oh
05:04.37justin111rendering
05:04.42rastergtao2@400mhz
05:04.52raster13.55
05:05.03SpeedEvilraster: is that simply ignoring the accel chip?
05:05.15rasterno
05:05.35rasterwell there is nothing it can do to help
05:05.40SpeedEvilO)h - you can't ignore it and get output, I forgot.
05:05.56rasterif i remove the gfx chip entirely from the picutre and just render to memory
05:06.03raster15.31 for gta01
05:06.08raster20.23 for gta02
05:06.16rasterso the speedup for the cpu helps
05:06.21rasterbut the video bus slows it down
05:06.24SpeedEvilThe gfx chip is where - on the memory bus?
05:06.31rasterno
05:06.34rastergta01 it is
05:06.38rastergta02 its offboard
05:06.48rasterwrite speeds to video ram are 30mb/sec
05:07.00SpeedEvilI mean writing to the accel chip
05:07.05SpeedEvilIt's memory mapped?
05:07.08rasteryup
05:07.14rasterits just sloooow
05:07.20SpeedEvilThat sounds quite slow.
05:07.22rasterwe dont have dma yet
05:07.25rasterthats planned - eventually
05:07.26justin111raster: will neo ever have 2d or 3d accel
05:07.27SpeedEvilCompared to the memory bus, which is snappy
05:07.28rasteryup
05:07.29SpeedEvilah
05:07.38rasterin the end the gta02 will be about the same as gta01 graphics-wise
05:07.42raster(speed)
05:07.51rasterwe went nowehere fast
05:07.54raster:)
05:08.05rasteranyway
05:08.05SpeedEvilI hope you mean native - before 2d/3d accel :)
05:08.08rasterthe main point is
05:08.19justin111oh
05:08.21justin111well yeah
05:08.31rasterspeed-wise if i disable display on my desktop i get about 1100
05:08.41rasterso 1100 vs. 15 vs 20
05:09.13SpeedEvilI suspect my current machine that I'm typin on is closer to 40.
05:09.14rasterso so give or take the gta02 is 2% the speed of a 3ghz core2-duo desktop
05:09.21SpeedEvilWhat's the test?
05:09.34justin111has qtopia gone stable yet
05:09.42rasterand gta01 about 1.4%
05:10.11rasteri would say this desktop is about 200x the speed of the last p300mmx i had
05:10.28rasteri rememebr benchmarks i got were about 1/10th what i got on my p3-800 dual desktop
05:10.30SpeedEvilmd5sum /dev/zero goes at 22.5M on this PII/300
05:10.33SpeedEvilas a pointless benchmark
05:10.41SpeedEvilM/S
05:10.45rasterand i get about 10-20x what that had again
05:10.51justin111how does open moko boot? from a ROM if so how big
05:10.56rasterthis is expedite
05:11.01rasterits evas's benchmark suite
05:11.09SpeedEviljustin111: basically 128M internal flash
05:11.16rasterso its relatively real-life as it covers a lot of calculations (mostly integer) and lots of mem access
05:11.21SpeedEviljustin111: and then up to 8G or so microSD
05:11.39SpeedEvilraster: C2D has what - 4 execution units?
05:11.39justin111the ROM is SD internally
05:11.48justin111is there and external one for media
05:11.49SpeedEviljustin111: no - there is an additional SD
05:11.51rasterno idea
05:12.01justin111oh ok
05:12.08SpeedEviljustin111: microSD
05:12.34*** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@61.16.248.242)
05:13.02justin111i wish i could sound smarter sorry for all the annoying questions thanks for answering them
05:13.07SpeedEvilnp
05:13.16justin111im pretty sure im gettin a neo now
05:13.25SpeedEvilIt is _not_ consumer ready
05:13.25ljpqtopia has been stable
05:13.32SpeedEvilAt least with openmoko
05:13.40SpeedEvilI can't speak of Qtopia.
05:13.47orospakrnot necessarily with power management, though.
05:13.51SpeedEvilAs a phone, the most basic phone for $20 beats it.
05:14.19justin111how ridiculous is the PM
05:14.32SpeedEvilsilly.
05:14.35SpeedEvilAt the moment.
05:14.40SpeedEvilThere is work going on.
05:14.48SpeedEvilBut at the moment, 8h standby or so.
05:14.53justin111oh
05:15.01justin111thats not as bad as i thought
05:15.14justin111thats enought to get me thru the day
05:15.29SpeedEvilIt looks like 40h standby is probably possible - from preliminary tests.
05:15.38SpeedEvilAnd there is work going on on getting to that point
05:16.20justin111neo is GSM correct i think i might have to change carriers if so
05:16.33justin111at first neo would be my toy tho
05:16.34SpeedEvilyes - the current one will not work in large slices of america
05:16.37justin111not really a phone
05:16.41SpeedEvilThere is no 850Mhz support
05:17.21justin111this majorly change my decision
05:17.28justin111idk on buying neo
05:17.44justin111what carrier does GSM that is compatible for neo
05:17.58rasterSpeedEvil:  no phont is $20
05:18.00rasterphone
05:18.01raster:)
05:18.12SpeedEvilraster: $35 then
05:18.21rasteri think the minimum is about $200
05:18.25justin111prepaid phones are down 2 $15
05:18.28rasteru are talking a subsidised phone
05:18.30rasterdfoesnt count
05:18.31raster:)
05:18.33SpeedEvilNo.
05:18.41SpeedEvilI'm talking of a _basic_ phone.
05:18.52justin111?
05:19.41justin111why is it that out of 247 people its us 3 talking
05:19.48justin111297
05:20.02ljpeveryone else is asleep
05:20.08justin111?
05:20.15justin111its only 9:30
05:20.16justin111well
05:20.17rasterok
05:20.24justin111at least here in oregon
05:20.27SpeedEvilUS has gone to sleep, UK isn't awake
05:20.30raster3ghx core2 gets an evas bench of 29.5
05:20.35RakshasaYou know, there are other timezones too, justin111.
05:20.42justin111ha
05:20.44justin111yeh
05:20.44rastermy p3-800 i originally baselined at 1.0
05:20.45ljpthat leaves us aussies
05:20.58justin111really aussies
05:21.00rasterand i am very sure a p300mmx was getting about 0.1 to 0.15 at the time
05:21.31ljpcrickie, mate, ya
05:21.32justin111i wish i could leave USA sometimes just maybe live somewhere else for a year or 2 you know
05:21.33rasterso 30 * 7 at a worst is 210 times faster than a p300mmx
05:21.51rasterthe p300mmx is probably about 4x an original p100
05:21.52SpeedEvilI don't think there was p300
05:21.57rastergfiven faster mem bus etc.
05:21.59SpeedEvilPII300 I think
05:22.00rasterthere was
05:22.08SpeedEvilI think PI topped out at 233
05:22.12rastermy sony vaio was a p300mmx
05:22.14rasternup
05:22.22rastermade it to 300 in its later days
05:22.29justin111like mexico where everyone goes home from 1:00 to 3:00 and takes a nap
05:22.33*** join/#openmoko diego71 (n=diego@host-84-222-11-188.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)
05:22.43SpeedEvilraster: overclocked?
05:22.48rasternup
05:22.50rasterfrom the factory
05:22.52rasterback in 1999
05:22.57justin111hellz yes for measure ## for mandatory seista
05:23.00rasterVA gave them to all the engineers
05:23.37rasterthe 505
05:23.39rasternot the x505
05:23.54rasterhttp://content.answers.com/main/content/img/CDE/_SONY505.GIF
05:23.56rasterthat one
05:24.03SpeedEvilOk - looking I guess it's $40 ish
05:24.05SpeedEvilhttp://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/mobile-phones/phones/pay-as-you-go/nokia/2310-silver/overview/
05:24.08SpeedEvilfor example
05:24.20SpeedEvil(cheapest PAYG phone from my current provider)
05:24.37SpeedEvilPay As You Go
05:25.07RakshasaWikipedia says pentium tillamook was 300mhz at best.
05:25.22rasterthere u go :)
05:25.28rasteranyway
05:25.42rasterslight problem is that i've been optimising this rendering engine for a long time
05:25.45SpeedEvilah - tillamook - I vaguely remember that
05:25.50rasteri may have it 3 times faster than it was back then
05:26.02rasterso lets make it201/3
05:26.05raster== 70
05:26.09rastererr
05:26.10raster210/3
05:26.12raster== 70
05:26.59rasterwhihc actually puts the gta01@266mhz about a p300
05:27.01raster:)
05:27.11rasternow - if i had a p300 to run benchmarks on...
05:27.21*** join/#openmoko [PI]Sami (n=sami@a9b.pirttimaki.jyu.fi)
05:27.34SpeedEvilraster: which I have slight doubts on to some degree - but the memory bus is much faster - so it's probably not way out.
05:27.36rasteranyone have one?
05:27.45SpeedEvilNo - Just PII/300
05:27.49rasterhmm
05:27.51rasteralive?
05:28.01SpeedEvilUsing it at the moment.
05:28.05rasterthaqt u can run somehting on? (and have an actual display/screen)?
05:28.09rastercool
05:28.10SpeedEvilIt's 1.1Kg laptop with 8 hour uptime
05:28.17SpeedEvil(after re-celling)
05:28.24SpeedEviland internal bluetooth and wifi.
05:28.30SpeedEvil(after butchery)
05:28.51rastergimme 30 secs
05:29.51rasterok
05:29.52raster1 min
05:29.53rasterrsyncing
05:30.37RakshasaI got one pII300 desktop down in the basement. =P
05:30.45rasterhehehe
05:31.04justin111will neo have windows support dont think it should windows users should have the privlage of touching neo they might contaminate it
05:31.10rasterhttp://www.rasterman.com/files/evas-0.9.9.041.tar.gz
05:31.11rasterthat
05:31.12justin111windows is all GUI ewwwwww
05:31.14rasterdownload
05:31.16SpeedEviljustin111: unless windows supports it - no
05:31.21rasterconfigure && make && make install
05:31.23RakshasaCoupled with an Athlon xp 2000+ =P
05:31.25SpeedEvilMS could port it
05:31.36justin111skrew MS
05:31.49SpeedEvildling
05:31.54rasterhttp://www.rasterman.com/files/expedite-0.6.0.tar.gz
05:31.56rasterthen same with that
05:31.59justin111yay my kubuntu iso is done
05:32.18rasteru might want to do
05:32.28rasterexport PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig
05:32.37rasterbefore building expedite
05:32.50rasterwhen u have that done
05:32.58rasterrun expedite -e x11
05:33.06rasteractually
05:33.10rasterrun expedite -e x11 -a
05:33.14rasterthat will do all the tests
05:33.21rastersame as i did
05:33.23rasterjust wait
05:33.28rasterit will spew out results to stdout
05:34.43justin111jon phillips = raster = head of open moko right?
05:34.51ljpheh
05:34.55ljphe wishes
05:35.06justin111head dev at least right
05:35.06rasterjon philips is head of openmoko?
05:35.54justin111http://rejon.org//media/2007/12/jon_lu_beijing.jpg          http://www.rasterman.com/photos/2005-12-xx_europe_holiday-getting_there/pict2555.jpg
05:36.02justin111resemblance
05:36.51justin111wait
05:36.53rasterhahahaha
05:36.55rasterno way
05:36.56justin111second thinking
05:37.02justin111grrr im dumb
05:37.04justin111nvm
05:37.25SpeedEvilconfiguring evas
05:37.44justin111wow i just made an idiot out of myself great first impression eh?
05:37.54ljpraster: the one on the right or the left?
05:38.17justin111i have to go install kubuntu be on l8r tonight or tommarow
05:38.22rasterjon isnt in openmoko
05:38.28rasterhe doesnt work for the company at any rate
05:38.53*** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net)
05:38.53rasterSpeedEvil:  this may take a while....
05:38.54raster:)
05:39.10*** join/#openmoko xamindar (n=xamindar@c-67-174-253-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
05:40.19*** part/#openmoko dkenzior (n=dkenzior@203.94.178.46)
05:41.12freeflyingSpeedEvil: how to configure the sound volum with latest rootfs? thx
05:41.24SpeedEvilI have no idea other than alsactl
05:41.38SpeedEvilI haven't been using it as much as a phone as I should
05:41.45SpeedEvilor using the software in normal ways
05:43.30freeflyingok, thanks
05:47.53rasterSpeedEvil: still compiling?
05:48.01SpeedEvil12756 irc       25   0 12268 9.8m 2916 R 53.8  5.2   0:01.63 cc1                
05:48.17rasterugh
05:51.00SpeedEvilMy fan went off.
05:51.05SpeedEvillooking at other package
05:51.47*** join/#openmoko dbmoodb (n=david@unaffiliated/dbmoodb)
05:51.58dbmoodbhi just a q is it possible to preorder a freerunner ?
05:52.10dbmoodbor should i talk to openmoko.com about that
05:53.02SpeedEvilNot yet
05:53.06rasterdbmoodb: no - not possible yet
05:53.35dbmoodbok
05:53.48dbmoodband with the gps, will openmoko be getting some maps for it ?
05:53.56dbmoodblike google maps maybe from the andriod team ?
05:54.17SpeedEvilno
05:54.29SpeedEvilLicensing maps is a _horrid_ process
05:54.31rasternup
05:54.38rastermaps are not open
05:54.40rasterand are expensive
05:54.49SpeedEvilSome maps are open.
05:54.54rasterand u'd need to license them per country, state or even city
05:54.57SpeedEvil(but not very good yet in most places)
05:55.03rasterSpeedEvil: yes - openstreemaps for example
05:55.56dbmoodbcan't we just launch the google andriod framework for the maps part ?
05:55.56rasterdbmoodb:  android *IS* google
05:56.02dbmoodbi know
05:56.04rasterand google has licensed use of its maps
05:56.07dbmoodbbut if they get maps lets use them
05:56.09rastergoogle has lots of money to do so
05:56.11dbmoodbif it is possible
05:56.12rasterwe dont
05:56.18dbmoodbok can we ask them ?
05:56.29rasterand no we cant
05:56.39rasterwe cant just use android at this tage
05:56.45rasterwe dont even know how it would fit in
05:57.06SpeedEvilGoogle pays stupid amounts of money to the primary map-creating companies to have the rights to show maps to users
05:57.08rasterand using their apps doesnt license us use of google maps
05:57.18dbmoodbsure
05:57.24dbmoodbnar i'm asking if we can ask google to use their maps
05:57.35rasterwe could
05:57.36SpeedEvilFor them to get the rights to distribute these maps would be an insane amount of money.
05:57.50rasterbut right now we aren't
05:57.53SpeedEvilGoogle has apparent interests in not doing so though.
05:58.07rasteralso we cant distribute googles maps
05:58.10rasternever goign to happen
05:58.11SpeedEvil(letting others have freeer use of their maps.
05:58.12rasterthey are too big
05:58.20rasterwe'd need subsets
05:58.27rasteralso it'd be a legal minefield
05:58.34rastergoogle licenses from X
05:58.37SpeedEvilThat's not perhaps correct - you don't know the size of the underlying vector data
05:58.47rasterwe license from google who now needs to invole party X, Y, Z
05:58.48rasteretc.
05:58.51dbmoodbsure
05:58.55rasterand you want the whole world's maps?
05:58.57rasterwhihc regions?
05:58.58rasteretc.
05:59.01rasterits just not sane
05:59.05dbmoodbno i would want the region i'm in
05:59.16rasterSpeedEvil: for the world - it'd be monsterous
05:59.31rastera few gb at least
05:59.45rastereven for a single country map data can be several hundred mb
06:00.03rasterand thats countires like german, france, uk
06:00.06rastermore for the usa
06:00.08rasteretc.
06:00.10rasteragain
06:00.15rasterits all a very big problem
06:00.27dbmoodbso what is the plan with the gps then ?
06:02.14*** join/#openmoko Atul_ (n=qvantel@61.16.248.242)
06:03.01SpeedEvilraster: it's sitting on a grey blob
06:03.08SpeedEvilafter a few mins
06:03.14SpeedEvilwith a text notice if I click it
06:03.17rasterdbmoodb: its a piece of hardware that tells u were you are
06:03.19rastertyhats about it
06:03.20raster:)
06:03.29dbmoodbgreat... i think we can do more than that soon
06:03.58rasterSpeedEvil: grey blob?
06:03.59SpeedEvilŸOh - there it goes.
06:04.06SpeedEvilAbout how long does it take?
06:04.11rasterhmm dunno
06:04.22rasterit takes like a few seconds here
06:04.24raster10 or so)
06:04.28rastercould take a few mins
06:04.31rasterfor you
06:05.05*** part/#openmoko dbmoodb (n=david@unaffiliated/dbmoodb)
06:05.27SpeedEvilIt's on slowly moving loops of text
06:05.43rasterdud u see lots of images?
06:05.54rastergolden e logos and images (photos) move?
06:06.19rasterit almost sounds like evas didnt build the png or jpeg loaders
06:06.22SpeedEvil;3~yes
06:06.30rasterooh ok
06:06.35SpeedEvilthose happened - it's just slow I think
06:06.41SpeedEvil22046 irc       25   0  7104 4204 3236 R 97.2  2.2   6:22.52 expedite          
06:07.43rasterit will consume all your cpu
06:07.48rasterit always does
06:07.50raster:)
06:07.55rasterits a benchmark suite
06:07.56raster:)
06:08.03SpeedEvilIt doesn't seem to be using any of hte X server
06:08.14rasterit does
06:08.20SpeedEvil(well - 1/10th of the time in X
06:08.20rasterits just so little compared to the cost of rendering
06:12.45SpeedEvilraster: where is the overall number?
06:12.46*** join/#openmoko gambler (n=orion@124-171-224-67.dyn.iinet.net.au)
06:14.10rasterat the end
06:14.14rasterEVAS_SPEED
06:14.17*** join/#openmoko trivex` (n=trivex@CPE00112f8785ab-CM000f9f50281e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
06:14.17SpeedEvil9
06:14.22raster9
06:14.24rasterOUCH
06:14.31SpeedEvilWhich is odd.
06:14.51SpeedEvilI recently reinstalled X - and XV and accel haven't been working
06:14.58SpeedEvilActually
06:15.01raster847.64 , EVAS SPEED
06:15.03SpeedEvilIt may have been thermal throttling
06:15.05rasteris what i get
06:15.13rasterand the numebrs i quoted before for the gta01 & 02
06:15.22rasterit doesnt use XV anywhere
06:15.25rasterso that wont matter
06:15.39rasterthrottling will definitely kill u
06:16.01SpeedEvilthe compiling before will have heat soaked it I think
06:16.05SpeedEvilAnd the room is hot
06:16.16rasterpossibly
06:16.29rasterbut the neo is beating u by 50%
06:16.47raster(as your box stands while its running that)
06:18.41SpeedEvilI have serious doubts as to that as a benchmark - everything else - without exception - runs at least a fair bit faster on this box.
06:19.01SpeedEvilCompiling, md5sum, mpeg/avi, ...
06:19.03rasterits a valid benchmarkl as such
06:19.39rasterin terms of comput and mem access its heavy
06:19.45rasternote it DOESNT test IO
06:19.54rasterthe speed of flash (jff2) on the neo is abysmal
06:20.09SpeedEvilIs it unaligned single byte access heavy?
06:20.09rasterthe gta01 i think i got 2.5mb/sec read off flash
06:20.34rasterthe gta02 is even worse - 190kb/sec from flash
06:20.39rasterno
06:20.42SpeedEvilSD or flash?
06:20.44rasterits all aligned mem access
06:20.54rasterunaligned mem access youlr absolutely be murder on an ARM
06:20.59rasterflash
06:21.07rasterSd doesnt work on gta02 yet
06:21.10SpeedEvilI mean random bytes from mem.
06:21.37rasterit will mostly be reading dwords
06:21.42raster(32bit)
06:21.46rasterand writing lots of them
06:21.52rasterlots of read/modify/write cycles
06:21.52SpeedEvilI think this box is SDR33
06:22.02rasterit may jump about memory a fair bit
06:22.21rasterbut within a region it is also likely to have very linear accesses - especially writes
06:22.23SpeedEvilIn that case it's possible it's wiping out the cache advantage that I usually see
06:22.37rasterit likely is completely destroying your cache
06:22.53rasterbut then again - the neo doesnt have any cache to help there either
06:22.57rasterit will be killed off too
06:22.59rasterso same boat
06:23.02SpeedEvilwhich is only 256K, but helps lots
06:23.28SpeedEvilNo - but for 'real' workloads - the cache usually helps lots
06:23.40SpeedEviland 256vs 16 is generally a big help
06:23.57rasterrendering is a real workload
06:24.02rastermore real than compiling
06:24.03raster:)
06:24.13rasteron a phone....
06:24.47rastervideo decode is also not a fair compariosn unless you run your desktop @ 16bpp
06:24.57SpeedEvilNot usually.
06:24.58rasterand disable any xvideo support/use by the player
06:25.07rasterthen its closer to even
06:25.09SpeedEvilI do have a 4bpp mode I occasionally use
06:25.14SpeedEvilFor battery saving
06:25.29*** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-127-194.mpls.qwest.net)
06:25.54rasteron your laptop?
06:26.09SpeedEvilyes
06:26.33SpeedEvilIt's a (IIRC) 10%ish saving at dim screen, with the HD off
06:26.48rasteraaah
06:26.53rasterwell that wont help anyway
06:27.06rasterif u want to compare between your p2-300 laptop and a neo
06:27.07SpeedEvilNo - I wasn't running that now.
06:27.12rasteru need to try and make the playing field as even as possible
06:27.25SpeedEvilThough I plan on trying to implement 8 bit mode on the neo - for other reasons.
06:27.37rasterfor games?
06:27.53SpeedEvilUsing it as a dev platform for soemthing else 2410 based
06:28.25rasteraaah
06:28.34rasterbut as such the gta01 and 02 are fairly powerful
06:28.49rasteri still think they are a match for a pentium-300
06:29.54SpeedEvilFor every app I've tried (CPU bound) apart from that one - the neo is significantly slower.
06:30.49rasteryou may have been throttled
06:30.52SpeedEvilIt is moderately to a fair bit faster than my P100 in some limited tests
06:31.03rastercat /proc/acpi/....
06:31.04rasterand see
06:31.09SpeedEvil(the P100 laptop has lots its structural integrity)
06:31.45SpeedEvilIt wasn't
06:32.10rasterth only thing it could be is an abysmal video bus on your laptop
06:32.22rasterso copies to the screen are just incredibly slow
06:33.56SpeedEvildunno. Anyway - I'm going back to datasheet reading :/
06:34.04*** join/#openmoko peter__b (n=biertrin@p5497AB90.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
06:34.08rasterheheheh
06:35.56SpeedEvilThanks for all the work on the 02 :)
06:36.30rasternp
06:36.37rasterworking on it
06:37.23*** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-127-194.mpls.qwest.net)
06:44.58*** join/#openmoko [[thufir]] (n=[[thufir@S01060016ec23af88.vc.shawcable.net)
06:45.11*** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-121-213.mpls.qwest.net)
06:47.16*** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net)
06:51.03*** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host88-205-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
06:58.46*** join/#openmoko gambler (n=orion@124-171-224-67.dyn.iinet.net.au)
07:01.17*** join/#openmoko jannu_ (n=jannu@hoas-fe3cdd00-15.dhcp.inet.fi)
07:04.35*** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07C4F1.dip.t-dialin.net)
07:04.49*** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244)
07:06.07*** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-196-5.dyn.iinet.net.au)
07:09.32*** join/#openmoko orion__ (n=orion@124-171-196-5.dyn.iinet.net.au)
07:11.08*** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-196-5.dyn.iinet.net.au)
07:17.48*** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net)
07:29.38*** join/#openmoko xaid|work (n=zaid@d39-33-195.home1.cgocable.net)
07:30.31SpeedEvilras: latest run gives 36 - must have been throttled
07:37.17*** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net)
07:38.50*** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFFC70.dip.t-dialin.net)
07:46.26*** join/#openmoko lalo (n=lalo@sourcemage/mage/lalo)
07:49.03*** join/#openmoko grummel (n=Grummel@p5B16E730.dip.t-dialin.net)
07:51.17*** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-88-75.dclient.hispeed.ch)
07:51.25*** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-80-142.dsl.scarlet.be)
07:56.28*** join/#openmoko wvdschel (n=wvdschel@d51A562BE.access.telenet.be)
08:08.22*** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@62.8.133.125)
08:09.03Hopscotchgood morning
08:14.58*** join/#openmoko N-Mi (n=nicolas@calvix/staff/N-Mi)
08:14.59*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)
08:18.50*** join/#openmoko TRIsoft (n=mac@p57A2CFFA.dip.t-dialin.net)
08:19.24TRIsoftmorning
08:19.27*** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz)
08:25.31*** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo)
08:36.05*** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@lbcsi.fri.uni-lj.si)
08:42.21*** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-88-75.dclient.hispeed.ch)
08:45.56*** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net)
08:52.42*** join/#openmoko smhar (n=salman@217.17.246.28)
08:55.23*** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@61.16.248.242)
09:00.37*** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@c-24-118-78-158.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
09:03.33*** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@zux006-058-029.adsl.green.ch)
09:03.36*** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net)
09:06.18*** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl)
09:12.33*** join/#openmoko Field (n=Field@ip-185.emscb.ruhr-uni-bochum.de)
09:14.44CIA-15openmoko: 03erin_yueh * r3876 10/trunk/src/target/gsm/ (4 files in 4 dirs): gsmd: add 'lgsm_open_n_get' to retrieve the current country code (Sean Chiang)
09:16.44*** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@net-pbx.demon.nl)
09:21.24*** join/#openmoko diego71_ (n=diego@host-84-222-6-174.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)
09:21.26*** join/#openmoko Tjikkun_work (n=sander@kantoor.jronline.nl)
09:21.39*** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@78-86-213-209.zone2.bethere.co.uk)
09:28.49*** join/#openmoko nurgle_ (n=nurgle@pirates.ivistar.de)
09:36.51*** join/#openmoko rob_w|laptop (n=rob_w@193.46.183.2)
09:48.06*** join/#openmoko aspire (n=aspire@77-98-142-8.cable.ubr07.stav.blueyonder.co.uk)
09:48.16aspirehello
09:49.04aspireis any one here developing on a ubuntu OS?
09:57.03aspireis any one here?
09:58.22cjb_iei'm awake, and an ubuntu user, but not an OM dev :)
09:58.27Fieldaspire: maybe someone can help you without developing on a ubuntu OS? how can we help you
09:59.47aspireright
09:59.58aspiream trying to setup my environment
10:00.16aspireand got to step 4
10:00.22aspirebut this does not seem to work
10:00.27aspiremake openmoko-devel-image
10:01.00aspirehave found this for ubuntu as a solution, work around
10:01.07aspireCheck that /bin/sh (ls -l /bin/sh) is not symbolically linked to dash. "dash" is a POSIX compliant shell that is much smaller than "bash" -- however some broken shell scripts still make use of bash extensions while calling into /bin/sh.
10:01.18aspirebut that does not seem to work
10:01.31aspireTo work around this issue:
10:01.31aspire<PROTECTED>
10:02.15CIA-15openmoko: 03werner * r3877 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.24.x/patches/gta02-bt-fixes.patch:
10:02.15CIA-15openmoko: Bring back initialization of BT power and enable for GTA02.
10:02.15CIA-15openmoko: gta02-bt-fixes.patch:"
10:02.15CIA-15openmoko: - arch/arm/plat-s3c24xx/neo1973_pm_bt.c (gta01_bt_probe): disable LDO and
10:02.15CIA-15openmoko:  assert reset also for GTA02
10:03.20aspirewhat can I do to start building?
10:05.00aspiremake openmoko-devel-image
10:05.01aspire[ -e stamps/patches ] || \
10:05.01aspire<PROTECTED>
10:05.07aspiremake: *** [stamps/patches] Error 127
10:06.46aspireField: is there any thing you can tell me about this?
10:09.15*** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@canonical/launchpad/danilos)
10:10.44*** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@81-208-88-100.ip.fastwebnet.it)
10:12.12Fieldaspire: hm - I'm sorry, no. But if I find the time..I'll try this out this evening.
10:13.25*** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com)
10:15.11XorAljp: ping
10:21.28*** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@dyn167240.wlan.jku.at)
10:23.16*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p5491AAD1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
10:23.16*** join/#openmoko Kryczek (i=kryczek@faked.name)
10:24.05*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p5491AAD1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
10:24.06*** join/#openmoko florian_ (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69)
10:34.53*** join/#openmoko Grummel69 (n=Grummel@p5B16D229.dip.t-dialin.net)
10:35.34*** join/#openmoko dorje77 (n=astanese@81-174-61-89.staticnet.ngi.it)
10:38.57*** join/#openmoko Christian__ (n=Grummel@p5B16D421.dip.t-dialin.net)
10:43.06*** join/#openmoko Mitacheto (n=chatzill@90-154-143-115.btc-net.bg)
10:46.04*** join/#openmoko Gwaihir_ (n=Gwaihir@88-149-173-250.static.ngi.it)
10:46.21*** join/#openmoko Atul_ (n=qvantel@61.16.248.242)
10:46.28*** join/#openmoko tobmaster (n=tobmaste@gw.sinnerschrader.com)
10:47.16*** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@sr-fw1.router.uk.clara.net)
10:53.29*** join/#openmoko grummel (n=Grummel@p5B16F136.dip.t-dialin.net)
10:54.05*** join/#openmoko Virtuall (n=virtuall@87.110.198.224)
10:57.02*** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-133-218.pools.arcor-ip.net)
10:59.49zedstarhttp://www.thenewfreedom.net/wp/2008/01/16/richard-stallman-cranking-dat-soulja-boy/
11:00.26zedstaropps wrong window...funny tho
11:04.09*** join/#openmoko BenO (n=BenO@dhcp203-213.sers.ox.ac.uk)
11:04.57CIA-15openmoko: 03chris * r3878 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (4 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
11:04.57CIA-15openmoko: * src/phone-kit/moko-listener.c: (moko_listener_on_network_number):
11:04.57CIA-15openmoko: * src/phone-kit/moko-listener.h:
11:04.57CIA-15openmoko: Add on_network_number for new lgsm_oper_n_get function
11:04.57CIA-15openmoko: * src/phone-kit/moko-network.c: (retry_oper_get),
11:05.01CIA-15openmoko: (retry_opern_get), (stop_retrying), (on_network_registered),
11:05.03CIA-15openmoko: (on_network_number), (listener_interface_init), (net_msghandler),
11:08.07*** join/#openmoko orino (n=orino@84-74-193-114.dclient.hispeed.ch)
11:14.20*** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@61.16.248.242)
11:15.14*** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net)
11:17.09*** join/#openmoko ShawnS (n=8d16bd65@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-f63c29e8ebc51c2f)
11:23.37*** join/#openmoko _Krieger_ (n=warsword@80.90.233.15)
11:28.16CIA-15openmoko: 03thomas * r3879 10/trunk/src/target/ipkg/ (106 files in 4 dirs): * Rename ipkg to opkg
11:29.54*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
11:30.17CIA-15openmoko: 03thomas * r3880 10/trunk/src/target/ (156 files in 5 dirs): * Rename top level ipkg directory to opkg
11:39.48*** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@dyn167240.wlan.jku.at)
11:53.19*** join/#openmoko henrylaw_hk (n=henrylaw@m203-78-33-135.smartone-vodafone.com)
11:57.59*** part/#openmoko henrylaw_hk (n=henrylaw@m203-78-33-135.smartone-vodafone.com)
11:58.41*** join/#openmoko ShawnS (n=8d16bd3e@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-22ce3e7ad354473e)
12:00.55*** join/#openmoko Cyorxamp (n=Cyorxamp@212.57.232.254)
12:02.54*** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be)
12:09.01*** join/#openmoko StealthCP (n=stealthc@ACD49851.ipt.aol.com)
12:10.32*** join/#openmoko amir (n=Miranda@gentoo/developer/amir)
12:11.46CIA-15openmoko: 03laforge * r3881 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (series uboot-machtypes.patch):
12:11.46CIA-15openmoko: uboot-machtypes.patch no longer required since upstream u-boot has now picked
12:11.46CIA-15openmoko: up a much more recent machine type file
12:13.03*** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl)
12:18.05*** join/#openmoko Pupeno_- (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net)
12:21.06CIA-15openmoko: 03chris * r3882 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/panel-plugins/openmoko-panel-memory/ (10 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
12:21.06CIA-15openmoko: * AUTHORS:
12:21.06CIA-15openmoko: * autogen.sh:
12:21.06CIA-15openmoko: * configure.ac:
12:21.06CIA-15openmoko: * src/Makefile.am:
12:21.08CIA-15openmoko: * src/openmoko-panel-memory.c: (blink_idle), (memory_full_cb),
12:21.10CIA-15openmoko: (mb_panel_applet_create):
12:31.01*** join/#openmoko Gybrush (n=Gybrush@f053153097.adsl.alicedsl.de)
12:31.01*** join/#openmoko amir (n=Miranda@gentoo/developer/amir)
12:32.27*** join/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org)
12:53.57*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky_ (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)
12:56.11*** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21)
12:56.47*** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz)
13:01.53*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm2 (n=Mathias@vpnd008.ugent.be)
13:02.51*** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@59.160.224.98)
13:15.19mjrmuhahahaa
13:15.41mjrboth my XO and my 8GB microSD arrived today (the latter for the Neo, of course; got a 16GB standard-size SD for the XO :)
13:16.16Stephmwcool timing ;)
13:16.49mjryes, time to tinker on the weekend
13:16.57jorgenptXO?
13:17.04mjrthe OLPC laptop
13:17.18StephmwI'll give Android on my Zaurus a go, see what breaks ;)
13:17.44mjrnow that I've storage space for my neo, a question:
13:18.30mjrhaven't followed the QVGA thingy that closely, is QVGA support in the main tree or can one get some patches somewhere? :)
13:18.40jorgenptAndroid runtime released, Stephmw?
13:19.46Stephmwjorgenpt: naah, someone just hacked their image for the Zaurus in december
13:20.18jorgenptWhat image?
13:20.57Stephmwlooking for the link ;)
13:21.14jorgenptAh, the emu image?
13:21.38*** join/#openmoko Bubbi (n=bubbi@firewall.dwarf.dk)
13:21.50Stephmwyeah, http://euedge.com/blog/2007/12/06/google-android-runs-on-sharp-zaurus-sl-c760/
13:22.00kristian-mStephmw which zaurus do you have?
13:23.35Stephmwthe 860
13:25.34xcasexi cant believe there's not been a cool hack w. or using the motorola f3
13:27.40*** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl5402D6C7.pool.t-online.hu)
13:27.51*** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@tobias.residence.ens-lyon.fr)
13:30.56kristian-mStephmw wow, i envy you
13:33.54CIA-15openmoko: 03werner * r3883 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.24.x/patches/gta02-bt-fixes.patch:
13:33.54CIA-15openmoko: Reversed sanity check cause PCF50633 driver to BUG.
13:33.54CIA-15openmoko: gta02-bt-fixes.patch:
13:33.54CIA-15openmoko: - drivers/i2c/chips/pcf50633.c (pcf50633_ena_voltage): fail if we don't have a
13:33.54CIA-15openmoko:  valid register, not if we do
13:34.07Stephmwkristian-m: I bought it used ;) which reminds me... I need to get a new battery as this one doesn't hold a charge
13:35.36CIA-15openmoko: 03thomas * r3884 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/opkg_download.c: opkg: fix progress bar
13:36.26*** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132)
13:36.51kristian-mStephmw batteries are the only thing i could get for this deveice in germany :(
13:41.47*** join/#openmoko waldt (n=WP-Gast@77-56-70-119.dclient.hispeed.ch)
13:41.52waldtOPENMOKO
13:42.30kristian-mhi waldt :-)
13:42.38waldthi
13:45.12waldtpoor kristian-m
13:47.26zash^^
13:47.44waldtwhy
13:47.46*** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AE568.dip.t-dialin.net)
13:48.23zashASS
13:48.38waldtpoor Zash
13:48.59zashSLASHIGNORE
13:49.08*** join/#openmoko Julietta2 (n=Julietta@85.106.147.99)
13:49.10Julietta2hi all !  There is a new forum called Exotics Forum and it has free membership option !  Exotics Adult Forum ::: http://exotics.heavenforum.com/index.htm !...
13:49.13*** part/#openmoko Julietta2 (n=Julietta@85.106.147.99)
13:49.20*** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@165.138.40.200)
13:49.20zashhm, tourettes + irc
13:49.37waldtyes, you are
13:51.13XorAoooh, neoporn.com
13:51.18waldtwhy
13:51.35zashoh?
13:51.56zashbah :( linkfarm
13:52.01waldtwhy
13:52.04CIA-15freesmartphone.org: 03emdete * r45 10/trunk/software/gsm0710muxd/data/gsm0710muxd: exec on
13:52.21waldtwhy
13:52.34*** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AE568.dip.t-dialin.net)
13:56.24*** join/#openmoko magellan (n=c6fd1776@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-74932525950f224c)
14:01.21*** join/#openmoko BenO (n=BenO@dhcp203-213.sers.ox.ac.uk)
14:02.28*** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132)
14:04.52magellanusing toolchain, you have to do some setup of the enviroment before starting, namely: source /usr/local/openmoko/arm/setup-env            if you want to go back to programing for your own computer, how do you undo these changes
14:05.03magellanare they refreshed automatically?
14:05.55*** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132)
14:07.05magellanby the way, Hi All!
14:08.36*** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132)
14:14.26_Krieger_magellan, maybe source /etc/profile ?
14:16.01magellanI wouldn't know. I have been making an app on my lappy and am ready to try it out on the device. but I want to continue development on the lappy once I try it on the neo
14:16.56kristian-mmagellan just open an other shell for your locaal build
14:17.17kristian-msource is only setting the environment in the current shell
14:17.18magellanso the changes are local to the shell
14:17.22kristian-mack
14:17.29magellanok great, thanks
14:17.34kristian-mhave fun
14:24.28CIA-15openmoko: 03thomas * r3885 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/ (libopkg.h opkg_download.c): opkg: add a download progress callback hook to libopkg
14:28.18*** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peepsalo@bwext.kpimdp.com)
14:48.19*** join/#openmoko C7_ (n=C7@14-46.76-83.cust.bluewin.ch)
14:56.12*** join/#openmoko DENTiST (n=DENTiST@81.215.63.72)
14:56.53*** join/#openmoko Grarg_ (n=bert@ool-4355b0c2.dyn.optonline.net)
14:57.37*** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo)
14:58.00*** join/#openmoko shenki (n=joel@202.174.42.5)
14:58.02DENTiSTselam
15:04.06CIA-15openmoko: 03thomas * r3886 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/opkg_download.c: * Add proxy username/password support
15:09.08magellanis anyone haveing build problems out of openmoko-terminal2? I have to remove if from my build to get the moko makefile to do a full build. the probem is that the fetch from the server fails. how can I get a copy of the app so it doesn't have to go to the server?
15:09.32*** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@209.195.169.219)
15:11.24*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p5491AAD1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
15:18.08*** join/#openmoko ArteK (i=ArteK@gateway/tor/x-9de7b111cc31b7b7)
15:20.42*** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@65.91.166.175)
15:24.14wurp2Does anyone have experience with arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi-as: unrecognized option `-Qy' while building mokomakefile?
15:24.42wurp2I'm having a hard time understanding how the build could pass an invalid argument to an exe that same build created
15:24.56wurp2Especially an exe I would expect to be stable, like 'as'
15:25.19SpeedEvilSomeone being an ashat.
15:28.50*** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco)
15:33.45*** join/#openmoko Audiomind (n=Audiomin@newhost71-217.imm.dtu.dk)
15:34.31*** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust61.tnt1.ber2.deu.da.uu.net)
15:35.17*** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132)
15:35.19zedstarso speedevil wanted to chat some more about cpu cycles/battery life thing....
15:36.35zedstarsay u have a app which runs continually processing say some xml and u have same app running but using some less intensive method....so overall less cpu cycles...would it be possible to show differences in battery life say on neo now with no power management
15:36.52zedstaror insignificant difference
15:37.54SpeedEvilzedstar: less significant.
15:37.56*** join/#openmoko ArteK (i=ArteK@gateway/tor/x-461387b93c849d80)
15:38.13SpeedEvilIdle-maximum is only 75% or so
15:38.38*** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust61.tnt1.ber2.deu.da.uu.net)
15:38.50SpeedEvilOnce clock frequency stuff goes in, it gets _much_ more significant - like maybe 10%
15:39.18zedstarreason im curious is ive heard mention at mobile events of the impact of say java script etc on battery life
15:39.27*** join/#openmoko tnb (n=tnb@24.154.118.23)
15:39.54SpeedEvilBasically - once PM is properly implemented, battery life scales much more accurately to CPU usage
15:40.14zedstarok right so need that working for this kind of study
15:40.15SpeedEvilSomething like CPU% active*0.9 + 10%
15:40.36SpeedEvilso at 0% CPU it's 10% battery use, 50%, 45% battery use
15:40.41mickeylmagellan: _how_ does the fetch at the server fails?
15:41.01mickeylmagellan: you may want to try bumping your SRCREV
15:41.17SpeedEvilzedstar: There is little impact going from 0-3% in your code - but 10-30% may make a perceptible difference.
15:42.25zedstarso let me try and understand this... unless the app is hitting up to a certain % of overall cpu it is not gonna be easy to spot difference?
15:42.26*** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=kdean06@fsf/member/kdean06)
15:42.54SpeedEvilzedstar: yes - as there is 10% or so power used even at idle.
15:43.06*** join/#openmoko trivex (n=trivex@CPE00112f8785ab-CM000f9f50281e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
15:43.23SpeedEvilzedstar: so going from 1-2% CPU use may be the difference between 11% and 12% of maximum battery use
15:45.01zedstar<PROTECTED>
15:45.47*** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132)
15:46.31zedstardo u remember the engergiser bunny adverts.....would like to see that on mobile with different kinds of intensive processing
15:46.31SpeedEvilThere is little really complex in this. Unless you can suspend-RAM between user interactions - and turn the screen off - CPU idle is always going to be a large slice of power at low speeds.
15:46.31SpeedEvillow loads
15:46.44zedstarok can assume screen is off
15:46.59zedstarcos this is something continually in background lets say
15:47.21SpeedEvilhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_GTA01_Power_Management may be of use
15:48.51zedstarthanks will go through that also......im just wondering if talk about different network protocol processing techniques on mobile etc is hype
15:49.18zedstarin relation to battery i mean
15:49.22*** join/#openmoko savar|nothimself (n=svr@141.62.63.37)
15:49.33SpeedEvilIt's irrelevant
15:49.50SpeedEvilat the speeds involved, tcp/ip handling by the kernel at least is in the noise
15:50.01SpeedEvileven with 802.11g
15:50.17SpeedEvilIf you mean lowest level protocol
15:50.59*** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@81.80-202-132.nextgentel.com)
15:51.03zedstarno from higher up the stack....mallocing of memory for processing data of xml or whatever
15:52.14SpeedEvilFor GSM, it's irrelevant, as the data rate is near zero
15:52.38SpeedEvilAnd unlesss you're especially stupid, you can't make that use apprecible CPU
15:52.58SpeedEvilThe CPU inn the GTA01/freerunner is actually quite fast.
15:53.20SpeedEvilIt stomps all over PCs of 10 years ago.
15:53.29zedstaryeh!
15:54.45zedstara study also then is to show talk of this is irrelevant within context
15:54.48*** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh)
15:55.37SpeedEvilBroadly - with even  semi-optimised native code, you shouldn't have problems.
15:55.39torporhey guys
15:55.55torporkristian-m: is there a new version of settingsgui around?
15:56.08torpori've tried the 0.8 beta but it just hangs and goes nowhere on the 'init' screen ..
15:56.22SpeedEvilOnce you get to the trend today of increasing layers of abstraction and multiple overlaid languages and protocols with lots of layers of conversionn to go fromm network - user - there may be a problem
15:56.43zedstarok yeh this is what i am interesting in seeing
15:57.01zedstarwherre this becomes noticable etc
15:57.09SpeedEvilFor example. XML.
15:57.20*** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2584.bb.online.no)
15:57.25SpeedEvilIt's fine when you're parsing a ten element list.
15:57.28zedstaryeh well exactly xml actually compared to a more light weight approach
15:57.58SpeedEvilIf as some apps do you use it as  a storage format that causes problems in many ways.
15:58.05*** join/#openmoko Aniruddha_NL (n=Aniruddh@s5590cf7b.adsl.wanadoo.nl)
15:58.29zedstaryeh....im quite interesting in seeing how say xml compares to say s-expressions in this context
15:58.31SpeedEvilA) It's large - so you need a decompression stage first - or alternatively get hit by slow access speeds typical on mobiles.
15:59.06SpeedEvilB) The format is variable and not trivially parsed taking in all the edge cases. This meeans it's slow.
15:59.39zedstari did some studies compressing xml with gzip and that was poor also
15:59.41SpeedEvilC) Once yyou've parsed it, you often havve to convert tthe dataa into other formatss from its 'native' xml represeentation.
15:59.54SpeedEvilThis alsso takes time.
16:00.14SpeedEvilVersus skipping  the whole lot, and using a binary or simplle flat-text savefile
16:00.25zedstaryeh most people dont take c) into account.... s-expressions are in built in languages like lisp and scheme for example
16:01.18XorAfor embedded ASN.1 is far more suitable than XML and 90% of the time you can manipulate the values directly in memory
16:01.19*** join/#openmoko Pupeno_- (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net)
16:01.23zedstarive costed some stuff with PAYG with xml etc compared to other stuff but what i havent done is examined CPU issues
16:01.40SpeedEvilAs a horribly overbroad statement, you shouldn't be coding anything on a mobile platform if you don't know how many machine cycles your next line of code will take.
16:02.18zedstari actually use the ASN.1 approach and use packed encoding rules myself
16:02.29*** join/#openmoko StealthCP (n=stealthc@user-514d6d9b.l2.c2.dsl.pol.co.uk)
16:02.31zedstarbut it is not easy for developers compared to xml etc
16:02.42XorAzedstar: then they should learn to count :-)
16:02.58zedstarlol XorA yeh
16:03.01SpeedEvils/on.*form//
16:03.16*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
16:04.54zedstara big issue with XML stuff if u on GPRS is the extra packets over very poor latency
16:04.55zedstarnot good
16:05.00*** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7be0f.pool.einsundeins.de)
16:05.41zedstari am racking up ping times in seconds on my vodafone payg frequently
16:07.05*** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk)
16:10.35*** join/#openmoko xpgs (n=pradeep@203.193.154.146)
16:13.50*** join/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com)
16:16.10*** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@66.83.208.218.nw.nuvox.net)
16:19.34wurp2SpeedEvil: re cycles per line of code, I think that's a pretty excessive stance to take for app code
16:20.00wurp2If you're spending time thinking about # of cycles taken on a machine that's running 200 million cycles per second, you're wasting time
16:20.03cjb_iewurp2: depends on the app
16:20.31SpeedEvilI don't mean absolute cycles - I mean orders of magnitude.
16:20.39wurp2cjb_ie: Sure, if it's low level 3d rendering code, or encoding/decoding mp3s
16:20.48wurp2SpeedEvil: I'll certainly buy that
16:21.14SpeedEvil'printf takes 1000 cycles' or 'xmlparsemegabyte takes a hundred million'
16:21.35wurp2There is the danger in high level languages of naively issuing a 'objTree = xmlParser.loadFrom(somefile)' and not realizing what that entails
16:21.50wurp2heh
16:21.54SpeedEvilYeah.
16:22.13SpeedEvilA simple line of code can often result in an explosion of recursion into libraries.
16:22.20wurp2very true
16:22.43SpeedEvilWhen  in some cases, it can be done easily in one or two lines of lower-level code with no significant loss of readability, portability.
16:22.52wurp2agreed
16:23.04wurp2especially in the xml vs binary formatted file case
16:23.13SpeedEvilyeah. Or even text vs xml
16:23.53zedstarthere is definitely a trend to gloss over all this now......i would just like to see some concrete figures for impact on things like the network, battery life etc
16:24.20*** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@cpe-213-157-235-31.dynamic.amis.net)
16:25.19kdean06I was musing on that generally in my blog yesterday, the sheer amount of energy (and waste) used due to inefficient code and the cascading effect it has... Embedded certainly makes you look at that much more.
16:26.01zedstarbe interesting to see how the dumbing down approach of android has on this as well
16:26.53*** part/#openmoko savar|nothimself (n=svr@141.62.63.37)
16:30.34*** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at)
16:30.48*** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at)
16:31.29*** join/#openmoko orino (n=orino@84-74-193-114.dclient.hispeed.ch)
16:34.51*** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.229)
16:35.13zedstarwhats the url of your blog kdean06? any openmoko stuff in it? i like reading openmoko blog stuff me
16:36.40kdean06I've only had my Neo for a few days and I'm not (much of) a programmer so there's nothing technical. I've got a pretty wordy account of my first day with the Neo (including pictures).
16:36.56kdean06My site is http://www.monochromementality.com/
16:37.18kdean06The most current blog post, and the one prior to it, are OpenMoko/Neo related.
16:39.05zedstarthanks
16:39.32kdean06No problem.
16:42.21*** join/#openmoko haakeyar (n=haakeyar@c9C364BC1.dhcp.bluecom.no)
16:45.52*** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@32.60.107.139)
16:47.48*** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@53d8392d.adsl.enternet.hu)
16:48.16*** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com)
16:51.09*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm2 (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
16:55.10*** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@78-86-213-209.zone2.bethere.co.uk)
16:59.08*** join/#openmoko nwps (n=niko@dna243-249.satp.customers.dnainternet.fi)
16:59.29*** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com)
17:00.00*** join/#openmoko Larry_jr (n=larry@200.184.118.132)
17:01.45*** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@c-24-118-78-158.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
17:02.17nwpsi just installed todays devel-image; is there any solution to this: "alsactl: load_state:1327: No soundcards found..." ? http://opensource.wolfsonmicro.com/~gg/neo1973/gsmheadset.working.state worked with septembers image, but not todays.
17:07.13*** join/#openmoko StealthCP (n=stealthc@user-514d6d9b.l2.c2.dsl.pol.co.uk)
17:10.30*** join/#openmoko Weteor (n=Weteor@i59F603E7.versanet.de)
17:12.07*** join/#openmoko Grummel69 (n=Grummel@p5B16D6AF.dip.t-dialin.net)
17:12.34El_Salvadornew package system in om?
17:12.38El_Salvadorhttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Opkg
17:13.25kdean06I noticed the commit, I forgot to check up on it.
17:13.44kdean06I think it's just a re-name to avoid confusion, but thanks for the reminder. :)
17:14.02*** join/#openmoko Pupeno_- (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net)
17:14.07El_Salvador:)
17:14.19kdean06Oh, no, there are some actual improvements. Cool.
17:14.29El_Salvador:O
17:14.33El_Salvadorgreat
17:15.26kdean06So, is this official or just a proof-of-concept thing? Will Opkg be replacing ipkg as OpenMoko's package manager and how will that affect the toolchain
17:16.02mickeylOM Inc. is trying to put some fresh blood into the stale ipkg
17:16.15mickeylsubtle changes first
17:16.19kdean06Makes sense. :)
17:16.21mickeylmore radical things later
17:16.28kdean06opkg makes more sense from a branding perspective too.
17:16.49El_Salvadorthanks :)
17:17.31*** join/#openmoko zash_ (n=zash@82.182.247.191)
17:19.45nwpsplease, anyone have any idea how to get the soundcard working? everything else is finally working perfectly, except sound. :/
17:20.59*** join/#openmoko Christian__ (n=Grummel@p5B16FFDB.dip.t-dialin.net)
17:22.36*** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net)
17:32.59*** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132)
17:33.24*** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@165.138.40.200)
17:34.15tonygnwps, have you tried alsactl -f /etc/alsa/stereoout.state restore ?
17:34.40tonygthere are other *.state files that correspond to different routes for getting sound into and out of the system in /etc, too.
17:35.53*** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@65.91.166.175)
17:37.17nwpstonyg: yeah, i tried that. it gives me "No soundcards found". also:
17:37.18nwpsroot@fic-gta01:/etc$  cat /proc/asound/cards
17:37.18nwps--- no soundcards ---
17:40.14tonygeep. that's scary, nwps.
17:40.20tonygI'll try it on mine
17:41.31tonygroot@fic-gta01:~$ cat /proc/asound/cards
17:41.31tonyg<PROTECTED>
17:41.31tonyg<PROTECTED>
17:41.46tonygwhat kernel are you running?
17:41.47tonygmine is:
17:41.52tonygLinux fic-gta01 2.6.22.5-moko11 #1 PREEMPT Sat Dec 1 03:40:58 CET 2007 armv4tl unknown
17:41.58tonyg(uname -a)
17:42.18nwpsexactly the same.
17:42.48nwpsLinux fic-gta01 2.6.22.5-moko11 #1 PREEMPT Fri Jan 18 09:32:57 GMT 2008 armv4tl unknown
17:43.21nwpsi guess there's something broken with the latest dev-image / rootfs?
17:43.50SpeedEvilSome others have reported that too
17:43.53tonygPerhaps. You could try an older kernel.
17:43.57SpeedEvilIn recent days
17:44.07SpeedEvilMaybe the last week?
17:44.21tonygftr, the dec 1 kernel I'm running has been usably stable for me
17:45.38kdean06The only problems I've had that are viable to me were in today's snapshot, actually.
17:46.40nwpscan you name a developer i should maybe contact, so we could get this fixed?
17:47.27nwpsunless they already know about this.
17:48.29tonygnwps, do you have any dmesg output?
17:48.36tonyg... relevant to the problem, I mean
17:50.46nwpswait a second and i'll check..
17:53.56nwpshttp://upload.nwps.ws/files/openmoko-dmesg.txt
17:55.05*** join/#openmoko |R (i=bob@modemcable241.28-203-24.mc.videotron.ca)
17:55.12tonygnwps, my untrained eyes can't see anything obvious there :/
17:56.15*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm2 (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
17:56.38mickeylcheck whether your modules match
17:58.27*** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@65.91.166.175)
17:59.25nwpsmickeyl: sorry, what do you mean by that?
18:00.23summatusmentisis it remotely feasible that fic would release a cdma phone?
18:00.51mickeylsummatusmentis: very unlikely
18:00.57mickeylnwps: check /lib/modules/<...>
18:01.04mickeylperhaps your installed modules don't match your kernel version
18:01.13mickeylat least that's what I would read out from the dmesg
18:01.23mickeylsince there are so many unresolved symbols
18:01.30summatusmentismickeyl: ok, so then the only way that'd happen would be to hack a current cdma phone
18:01.45mickeyli'm afraid so, yes
18:01.48*** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@AOrleans-152-1-10-180.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr)
18:01.53mickeyli can't comment on the strategy, of course
18:01.57summatusmentisis OM running on any that we know of?
18:01.59mickeylbut as an insider, i'd say it's unlikely at this point
18:02.14summatusmentisok, bummer
18:02.54*** part/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@sr-fw1.router.uk.clara.net)
18:03.02SpeedEvilAs an outsider - the companies control access to the CDMA market in ways that just aren't there in the GSM one. Anyone at all can make a GSM phone  (barring appropriate RF authority licensing issues)
18:03.28SpeedEvilAll you then need to do is to plug your SIM into your new phone.
18:03.34nwpsmickeyl: i have only /lib/modules/2.6.22.5-moko11/ there.
18:03.43summatusmentisyeah, I figured that might be the barrier. Although verizon is opening up it's network soon
18:03.52mickeylnwps: hmm, strange. then i'd advise to use an earlier version
18:04.04mickeylthe daily builds are not tested
18:04.14mickeylyou should only use them if you're _really_ into bleeding edge
18:04.19SpeedEvilFor CDMA, the phone is per-network, and not authorised in the same way - the SIM is integral to the phone. It's not possible to make a phone and use it on a CDMA network without permission
18:04.21mickeyland can fix problems
18:05.46summatusmentisso then I should probably just switch providers assuming I want to use OM
18:05.50*** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@165.138.40.200)
18:05.59mickeylyeah
18:06.00mickeylgo gsm
18:06.01mickeyl:)
18:06.10SpeedEvilsummatusmentis: or pick a GSM phone if your existing provider does thart.
18:06.17mjr'ndeed
18:06.24SpeedEvilHowever, at the moment the GTA01 will not work on 850Mhz - so beware of that
18:06.44mickeyltrue
18:06.48summatusmentisSpeedEvil: no, my existing provider is cdma, and cdma works best in the places I'll be 90% of the time
18:07.07mickeylyou'd have to wait for the FreeRunner
18:07.13SpeedEvilsummatusmentis: some do both as I understand it.
18:07.30summatusmentissome providers do both?
18:07.38SpeedEvilsummatusmentis: yes
18:07.43anrpat&t/cingular has a nasty grandfathered mix
18:07.55kdean06summatusmentis, Verizon is indeed migrating to a GSM based network, but last I knew they've never actually said the move was to actually be more open - they could still find ways to restrict people on their networks.
18:08.17mwesteralthough they AT&T is really only growing the GSM part of their (patchwork) network.
18:08.23summatusmentiskdean06: they just came out and said they'll be allowing 3rd party devices on their network, in 08
18:08.42summatusmentisI was under the impression that vzw was all cdma
18:08.45*** join/#openmoko [[thufir]] (n=[[thufir@S01060016ec23af88.vc.shawcable.net)
18:09.54kdean06Open works the otehr way too. :) Will they stop offering their "Verizon Exlcusive" phones? Will all plan options be there for "3rd party" phones that support them? That has yet to be seen. I really DO hope they're opening, but Verizon is one of the most restrictive companies I've ever dealt with and I can't easily fathom such a dramatic change.
18:10.10nwpsmickeyl: can i use an older kernel with todays root filesystem?
18:10.28mickeylnwps: i don't know that
18:10.30summatusmentiskdean06: agreed, but it's at least an option
18:10.37mickeyli'm not building these files
18:10.45mickeylbut generally, due to changes in defconfig
18:10.51summatusmentiskdean06: a quick google shows that vzw will be moving to gsm for 4g network
18:10.55mickeylmatching kernel and rootfs always sounds like a good thing
18:11.03summatusmentisfreerunner doesn't support 3g, let alone 4g
18:12.18maitothere's no 4g networks deployed anywhere yet?
18:12.35maitoonly 3,5, hsdpa 7.2Mbps or hsupa?
18:13.03*** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
18:13.16*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)
18:13.30summatusmentismaito: I don't know if there are or not, but my point is, if I wanted to go to verizon because I wanted a gsm provider, I'd be waiting quite a while to use a neo product, you know?
18:14.55*** join/#openmoko Pupeno_- (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net)
18:19.12*** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132)
18:20.36*** join/#openmoko C7_ (n=C7@40-22.76-83.cust.bluewin.ch)
18:27.27*** join/#openmoko toxx_ (n=toxx_@81-234-dsl.kielnet.net)
18:31.47*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p5491AAD1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
18:33.45playyaanyone knows if there is any gsm provider in germany which is going to offer a openmoko compatible phone?
18:34.36SpeedEvilUnlikely any
18:34.57XorA|gonedepends if you wish to remove wm6 from t-mobiles phones :-)
18:34.58SpeedEvilI personally would be astonished at any compatible phones coming out before christmas 2009.
18:37.48SpeedEvilOr rather.
18:38.03SpeedEvilPhones with openmoko installed on them and sold in the shops as any other phone.
18:39.52playyamaybe i can scrounge a flasher for nokia devices. but do i really want to buy any nokia mobiles again?
18:40.00*** join/#openmoko C7__ (n=C7@128-6.76-83.cust.bluewin.ch)
18:43.02*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)
18:44.02*** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54B8F.dip.t-dialin.net)
18:44.07*** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-078-042-060-129.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de)
18:44.17PBeckhoi
18:44.31playyahoi
18:45.13PBeckhoi playya :)
18:50.38*** join/#openmoko Mathias (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
18:51.41*** join/#openmoko biberao (n=bz@a83-132-168-54.cpe.netcabo.pt)
18:53.30magellancan someone help me with this problem  =>  http://pastebin.com/d458b42a3
18:57.01*** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-98-199-135-173.hsd1.tx.comcast.net)
18:57.11anrpmmm colors
18:58.43playyaanrp, abused some lsd. or why do you taste colors?
19:02.53Marcel_Mmagellan: you can grab the source from here http://celtune.morb-design.com/openmoko-terminal2_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target.OM-2007.2.applications_3542_.tar.gz
19:02.54nwpsmickeyl: i got it work! whee!
19:04.08nwpsto work, even.
19:04.23mickeylnwps: excellent. how?
19:04.24nwpsi downloaded modules-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr3874-r13-neo1973.tgz, unpacked it to /media/card and copied lib/modules/2.6.22.5-moko11/kernel/sound to /lib/modules/
19:04.30*** join/#openmoko ewon (n=ewan@skynet.skynet.ie)
19:04.32mickeylgood.
19:04.34mickeylmodule mismatch then
19:04.36mickeylas i expected
19:04.44biberaohow much is openmoko?
19:04.58biberaowhen do you start offering a cellphone like that
19:05.03biberaoin poor countries?
19:05.03biberao:P
19:06.25*** join/#openmoko retracile_ (n=eli@65.91.166.175)
19:06.47*** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro)
19:09.01biberaohihih
19:09.50*** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host81-159-128-249.range81-159.btcentralplus.com)
19:11.11*** join/#openmoko Maxous (n=Maxous@76.97.3.24)
19:12.26*** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@betelgeuse.theinternetco.net)
19:16.36*** part/#openmoko Maxous (n=Maxous@76.97.3.24)
19:18.02wurp2biberao: $300 for neo1973 GTA01 phone
19:18.11wurp2OpenMoko is free and Free
19:18.25wurp2But you need compatible hardware to get an use out of the openmoko free software
19:18.56biberaowurp2 ya
19:19.00biberaoi meant the phone
19:19.00biberao:P
19:19.03wurp2And the best hardware is the FIC phone, which is $300.  And of course that's not consumer ready; it's for ppl who want to hack.
19:19.13biberaodistribution to the poor countries
19:19.14biberaolol
19:19.29biberaook im joking
19:19.30biberao:P
19:19.33wurp2I think you'll have to wait 5 years for the phones to be $10
19:19.36wurp2:-)
19:19.59biberaoihhi
19:20.07wurp2I think as long as you're never away from a charger for more than 4 hours at a time you can use the 01 as your primary phone
19:20.40biberaowhats wrong with it?
19:20.45ewon4 hours, christ on a bike
19:20.50wurp2otherwise it really can't be a phone for you, just a toy that runs linux, and is a gps, and plays audio & video media, and as a mobile programming platform
19:21.01wurp2power management software isn't done
19:21.06biberaoah i see
19:21.16biberaoso why not doing whats needed first
19:21.17biberao:P?
19:21.22wurp2And there are intermittently problems with phone calls
19:21.26wurp2Well, they are
19:21.42wurp2What's needed right now is the drivers for the '02 so they can validate the hardware and start producing the next model
19:21.58wurp2I believe there's something coming soon for power management, though
19:22.07anrp"something"!
19:22.20biberaoso what makes me buy a phone
19:22.21anrpas in "see that second battery we shipped you? use it"
19:22.24biberaothat i need to charge everyday?
19:22.25biberao:p
19:22.31wurp2It's more complicated than it sounds - you have to put all drivers in a compatible state before going into low power mode, then recover them properly
19:22.40biberaoi see
19:22.44biberaowurp2 you're a developer too?
19:22.51wurp2Uh, it is very clear on the site that the phone right now is for people who want to hack with it
19:22.53*** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@151.77.167.31)
19:23.12biberaoso offer the phones
19:23.12wurp2I am a developer, although not much of an openmoko developer yet
19:23.12biberao:P
19:23.13biberaoLo
19:23.17biberao:PP
19:23.27wurp2I have only written a few little python programs on it
19:23.39biberaomy sis
19:23.43biberaohates snakes
19:23.43biberao.P
19:24.48*** join/#openmoko ejdav_gon (n=james@75.157.13.250)
19:27.19*** join/#openmoko ArteK (i=ArteK@82.177.19.205)
19:28.41biberaoim enjoying be here
19:28.47biberaothis network has a lot of developers
19:28.47biberao.p
19:30.25*** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro)
19:32.56*** join/#openmoko smlsfb (n=jkoenig@cpe-69-201-198-180.hvc.res.rr.com)
19:40.52*** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@179.84-49-131.nextgentel.com)
19:42.00*** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@64.213.69.17)
19:44.43*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p4FD0B0DE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
19:46.54*** join/#openmoko daMaestro|isBack (n=jon@fedora/damaestro)
19:55.24*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm2 (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
19:58.23*** join/#openmoko Mathias (n=Mathias@vpnf061.ugent.be)
20:07.25*** join/#openmoko Audiomind (n=Audiomin@62.79.42.233.adsl.kj.tiscali.dk)
20:07.30*** join/#openmoko aspire (n=aspire@77-98-142-8.cable.ubr07.stav.blueyonder.co.uk)
20:08.05*** join/#openmoko BBishop (n=bbishop@unaffiliated/blackbishop)
20:08.17*** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=user@p5485E7D5.dip.t-dialin.net)
20:09.48wurp2Restarting my mokomake from scratch (yet again)
20:10.12wurp2I hacked a little script to get past the problems with the *-as exe not understanding -Qy
20:10.47wurp2but apparently the *-as exe was screwed up way more than just that, because then I get a ton of error messages indicating that *-as doesn't understand any of the assembler code it's being sent
20:12.39nwpsany way to debug gprs connection failing. all i'm getting is: "Connect script failed"?
20:13.00*** join/#openmoko eikonos (n=eikonos@S0106001c104ae594.gv.shawcable.net)
20:13.20*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
20:13.40*** join/#openmoko pH7 (n=user@p5485E7D5.dip.t-dialin.net)
20:14.55wurp2Sorry, I have no idea
20:15.47*** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@32.60.107.139)
20:17.31*** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@pcp022158pcs.dhcp.calpoly.edu)
20:17.48*** join/#openmoko quicksand (i=clarke@gateway/tor/x-8d9ec865b2a0bdc1)
20:19.53magellanMarcel_M: you sent me a message a few hours back and It helped and I am back up and running. I wanted to say thanks even though its a bit late
20:22.44*** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD953A8DF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
20:25.07Marcel_Mmagellan: np, nice to see it helps
20:25.34nwpshttp://www.flickr.com/photos/nwps/2201113153/  :)
20:29.02*** join/#openmoko [THE]StealthCP (n=stealthc@user-514d6d9b.l2.c2.dsl.pol.co.uk)
20:32.07*** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@59.160.224.98)
20:37.32*** join/#openmoko shred2008 (n=shred200@p4FD0B0DE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
20:38.14wurp2nwps: What was your connection script problem?
20:38.58*** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39)
20:40.29*** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net)
20:47.40*** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@212-41-107-81.adsl.solnet.ch)
20:49.55*** join/#openmoko jamescarey (n=jamescar@client-82-25-188-107.brnt.adsl.virgin.net)
20:51.42*** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132)
20:52.26*** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-47-114.dialup.xtra.co.nz)
20:52.59nwpswurp2: didn't actually solve it. i used usbnet to take that picture. :(
20:54.28wurp2:-(
20:54.35biberaoback
20:54.37wurp2I didn't notice the cord in the pic
20:54.48nwpsit was unplugged. :D
20:54.53zash_haha
20:54.56wurp2nwps: I actually beat on bluetooth for a while before I finally gave up
20:54.57wurp2hah
20:55.03wurp2bluetooth networking
20:55.04magellanMarcel_M: what are you using your neo to do?
20:55.33wurp2I could get local networking going, and I think at one point I even had routing going, but I never got DNS up
20:55.51wurp2I started getting fancy & broke my local networking before I got any farther
20:56.34maitowhat do you need a dns server for? isnt there a /etc/resolv.conf?
20:56.42biberaosagem my411x sucks?
20:56.55SpeedEvilthe /etc/resolv.conf is set to 192.168.0.202
20:56.57SpeedEvilthe /etc/resolv.conf is set to 192.168.0.200
20:57.15maitofor example 4.2.2.2 is free and open :P
20:57.35wurp2I didn't mean a dns server, I mean I never got /etc/resolve.conf with the right value while I had the rest of it working
20:57.44wurp2I seemed to lose connections very frequently
21:03.09*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.193.51)
21:03.21Marcel_Mmagellan: right now not much (mostly routing), ill think the gta01 will become my car-cp (routing, musik,gsm) when the freerunner is out
21:04.00CVirusWhat's this "gold" port on the right side of the Neo1973 ?
21:04.08VegarGPS antenna
21:04.18kdean06The USB icon on the taskbar, does that incicate that a USB connection is plugged in or does it indicate that USB networking is up? I'm working on some documentation but i'm not sure exactly what that signifies. :)
21:04.20borg_right, you can put a gps antenna in there
21:04.31CVirusto amplify the GPS signal ?
21:04.37borg_yes
21:04.40SpeedEvilCVirus: yes
21:04.44CVirusI see
21:04.46CVirusthanks alot
21:04.47borg_and it really is a huge improvemend if you do it
21:04.48SpeedEvilCVirus: or to put it in a better place
21:06.18borg_CVirus: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_as_radio_replacement
21:06.24borg_there is a gps antenna in use ;)
21:06.52*** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host88-205-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
21:07.03CVirusborg_: thanks
21:07.14borg_http://wiki.openmoko.org/images/c/c0/Neo_golf2_1.jpg
21:07.20borg_137 fixes, no fails
21:07.24borg_thats really nice :)
21:08.38*** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@sunbeam.ipv6.gnumonks.org)
21:09.31maitoborg_: that is quite nice
21:09.45*** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@adsl-dyn240.91-127-61.t-com.sk)
21:10.03borg_i used this it to find the 24c3 in berlin with navit :) works quite nice
21:10.14borg_s/it//
21:11.15LarstiQborg_: heh, not that that is hard to do once you hit the Alexanderplatz ;)
21:11.29borg_right
21:12.02borg_i had some problems to find a parking space after finding the congress center
21:12.04*** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@64.213.69.17)
21:12.10borg_and the neo couldn help me there either ;)
21:12.23LarstiQah hmm no, I tend to come by train.
21:14.31*** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be)
21:17.03*** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peepsalo@bwext.kpimdp.com)
21:24.58*** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-133-218.pools.arcor-ip.net)
21:25.36*** join/#openmoko playya__ (n=playya@p508B0CED.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
21:25.40*** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7be0f.pool.einsundeins.de)
21:25.57*** join/#openmoko gopi_ (n=gopi@adsl-065-012-206-033.sip.bct.bellsouth.net)
21:28.13wurp2Agh, I just found out my phone wasn't shipped until Tuesday night, and isn't expected here until Monday :-(
21:28.17biberaobye gtg
21:28.23biberaotake care
21:28.44kdean06Weekend shipping SUCKS.
21:28.49kdean06I feel your pain.
21:29.24biberaoyou should take a look at france
21:29.26biberaoshipping
21:29.26biberao:P
21:29.31biberaoi got two digital cameras
21:29.34biberaofor de price of one
21:29.38biberaotwo equal
21:29.38biberao:P
21:33.16staroxDid you had problem with your credit-card ? Mine is refused, my bank can't help me and openmoko sale don't answer :'(
21:42.01wurp2starox: nope
21:42.29staroxOh YES ! http://www.pulster.eu/ have decreased their price, hope I'll be more lucky with them :)
21:44.45wurp2It's very weird to see the neo in a product line up like it was any other phone :-)
21:44.49staroxwurp2: I don't understand why my mastercard is refused, there is no reason. I made 4 tries to make sure and absolutely certain I don't had make typo. I'm unlucky, that's all
21:45.09LarstiQstarox: could be a couple of reasons.
21:45.14wurp2I notice also that they say Freerunner w/ sw due in early summer 2008
21:45.23wurp2which I don't think I believe
21:45.31LarstiQstarox: in my case it's usually different spelling of my name, or address the card is registered to.
21:45.40SpeedEvilstarox: note however that the shipping is less than $100 now
21:45.49SpeedEvil$50 is typ
21:46.09starox80$ :) on openmoko for france
21:46.15SpeedEvilk
21:46.51SpeedEvil<PROTECTED>
21:46.52staroxLarstiQ: I check that, I copy exactly what was written on my card including "mr"
21:46.54SpeedEvilthat may be of use
21:47.13SpeedEvilFICs 'warranty' would be normally illegal herer
21:47.34staroxSpeedEvil: I think the 2 years warranty is in the european law
21:48.04kdean06I find that kind of funny, actually. :P
21:48.34staroxI'm not sure though, I notice german products had these 2 years warranty
21:49.01*** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be)
21:52.46LarstiQstarox: I forget the distinctions, but there is a basic level of warranty you have to offer and can not get out of. But anything extra you are free to do whatever you want.
21:57.56nwpshttp://buildhost.automated.it/screenshots/neo1973_011_main.jpg  < is that qtopia?
21:59.59univacno
22:01.18nwpsshould i have the same settingsgui somewhere? i have latest kernel-image & rootfs, but can't find that.
22:01.18*** join/#openmoko nielsle_ (n=nielsle@2610ds3-fb.0.fullrate.dk)
22:02.20*** join/#openmoko voi1 (n=void@M4179P013.adsl.highway.telekom.at)
22:03.03kdean06This is crazy, snapshots that worked without issue two days ago are crapping out on me today. :S
22:03.31quicksandnwps: settingsgui is optional -- you can build it or ipkg install it
22:03.56nwpsquicksand: ah, thanks!
22:05.51*** join/#openmoko amir (n=Miranda@gentoo/developer/amir)
22:05.51*** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@192.117.42.49.static.012.net.il)
22:16.33*** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@189.70.16.210)
22:36.36*** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-219-036.pools.arcor-ip.net)
22:37.31*** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz)
22:37.58*** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39)
22:50.31*** part/#openmoko nielsle_ (n=nielsle@2610ds3-fb.0.fullrate.dk)
22:58.44*** join/#openmoko pike_ (n=happy@74-140-134-102.dhcp.insightbb.com)
22:59.39kdean06QT is now GPLv3
22:59.52kdean06http://trolltech.com/company/newsroom/announcements/press.2008-01-18.1601592972
23:05.40wurp2kdean06: You have a working version of MokoMake?
23:07.00kdean06Not any time recently.
23:07.06wurp2:-(
23:07.19wurp2I have built & rebuilt, and it always fails the same way
23:07.44wurp2I hacked around it, but that exposed that the failure is much bigger than it first appears
23:09.49wurp2Time to go home
23:14.57*** join/#openmoko AVee (n=AVee@edsger.d6.nl)
23:20.23*** join/#openmoko grummel (n=Grummel@p5B16FFDB.dip.t-dialin.net)
23:30.19*** join/#openmoko pipomolo42 (n=pipomolo@ALille-152-1-72-107.w86-207.abo.wanadoo.fr)
23:32.52*** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@psnet.cc)
23:34.39*** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=fredsiba@nrbg-4dbff7f7.pool.einsundeins.de)
23:40.30*** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz)
23:51.23*** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@adsl-69-149-55-173.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net)

Generated by irclog2html.pl Modified by Tim Riker to work with infobot.