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| 00:06.18 | PBeck | bye |
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| 00:21.38 | thomasg | ScaredyCat: is your u-boot image from http://buildhost.automated.it/u-boot-good-for-sd-boot-r13_0_2632_0.bin SDHC-capable? |
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| 02:19.59 | techindian | hi |
| 02:20.33 | techindian | why am i getting this error when using the USB networking in qemu "dummy_hcd dummy_hcd: Unlink after no-IRQ? Controller is probably using the wrong IRQ." |
| 02:21.36 | techindian | its works fine with the old version (machine type "neo") |
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| 03:17.30 | rockets | Anybody gotten openmoko running on a treo 700? |
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| 04:05.38 | jelousbuddy | what does stupid paki mean? has any of you ever felt any great pain? how was it? !!! was it accident? how bad can it be if i am in a car accident for ex got hit by a train but still alive? or half burnt my entire skin including eyes? how about heart attack / failure? |
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| 04:12.23 | ewon | ok then |
| 04:12.56 | balrog-kun | if you intended to be the first #openmoko troll then you're late :) |
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| 04:56.53 | linuxxr | its december an im ready!!! |
| 04:57.12 | linuxxr | gta03 |
| 05:01.02 | SpeedEvil | :/ |
| 05:01.57 | *** topic/#openmoko by SpeedEvil -> The OpenMoko Project - http://openmoko.org - Neo1973 GTA01 on sale at https://direct.openmoko.com || Do not ask about GTA02 (Maybe March as of last update - yes, that's with WiFi, and no, there's no cam). Latest official update is at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates |
| 05:02.52 | balrog-kun | Do not ask about GTA >=02 :-) |
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| 05:13.54 | ewon | lawl |
| 05:14.11 | ewon | march? jeebus. |
| 05:14.18 | ewon | is that hardware or software bound? |
| 05:14.21 | SpeedEvil | Hardware. |
| 05:14.34 | SpeedEvil | At the moemnt they are evaluating the current version of the 05 hardware |
| 05:14.35 | ewon | nuts |
| 05:14.38 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 05:14.41 | SpeedEvil | 04 hardware |
| 05:14.48 | SpeedEvil | and seeing if wifi works. |
| 05:14.52 | SpeedEvil | (first code wifi) |
| 05:14.57 | ewon | nice |
| 05:15.00 | linuxxr | shhhhhhhhh |
| 05:15.01 | balrog-kun | wifi does work |
| 05:15.11 | SpeedEvil | but does it work flawlessly? |
| 05:15.38 | balrog-kun | hard to say after less than three days of working |
| 05:15.38 | SpeedEvil | enough to commit to a new PCB revision without any potential wifi-related fixes, incorporating the known needed battery bug fix |
| 05:16.04 | SpeedEvil | (which I don't think is actually needed, but for other reasons) |
| 05:16.47 | SpeedEvil | s/other/philosophical/ |
| 05:17.04 | balrog-kun | from what i read the most important delay reason now was due to shortage of parts |
| 05:17.15 | linuxxr | yoooo nos |
| 05:18.39 | SpeedEvil | (In that the battery life can be quite adequately computed in software - hopefully I should be able to demonstrate this in the next week) |
| 05:18.50 | linuxxr | best way to drive up the price of anything is to have a shortage |
| 05:19.17 | SpeedEvil | Unless you live in Zimbabwe. |
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| 06:19.29 | SpeedEvil | Does anyone have an eeepc? |
| 06:19.44 | SpeedEvil | (off-topic) |
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| 07:32.53 | atul | Anjuta Ide gives problem new version install 2.2 when go for new project option it says Could not find autogen version 5, please install the autogen package. You can get it from http://autogen.sourceforge.net |
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| 07:48.55 | ahven | SpeedEvil: got one temporarily for testing for some days |
| 07:49.01 | ahven | was nice :) |
| 07:49.27 | SpeedEvil | never mind - I found out what I wanted - which was the driver for my new videocamera. |
| 07:49.48 | SpeedEvil | Though if anyone was giving away free eeePC's I'd have one. |
| 07:49.58 | ahven | same here :) |
| 07:50.03 | SpeedEvil | I'd just be dissapointed at how little better it is over my current laptop. |
| 07:50.14 | SpeedEvil | though I suppose that was a lot more expensive. |
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| 07:51.01 | ahven | GTA02 currently is more attractive than Eee :) |
| 07:51.06 | ahven | for me |
| 07:52.22 | SpeedEvil | What I'd really like is a modest upgrade of my Toshiba 3110CT which - though I've added bluetooth and wifi to it - is getting a bit long-in-the-tooth. Yes, it has 8 hours, and weighs 1.1Kg, but USB1 only, no SD/... slot, ... |
| 07:53.02 | SpeedEvil | But it does have a 2.5" hard drive - which rather makes the eeePC's storage look silly. |
| 07:53.41 | ahven | you can't have them all, just not yet :) |
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| 08:19.05 | infurnus | anybody got openmoko booting on a treo? |
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| 08:47.03 | ahven | anyone has networked Neo through a mobile phone with bluetooth? |
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| 09:22.35 | Tepse | michael lalonde |
| 09:22.37 | Tepse | mike lalonde |
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| 09:26.57 | opo|away | hi all |
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| 09:35.51 | mbuf | December 8 build successful; see a lot of new images; which ones need to be flashed? http://pastebin.ca/809170 |
| 09:36.11 | SpeedEvil | Flash! Ahaaa! |
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| 09:49.05 | mbuf | SpeedEvil, i only need to flash openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01.jffs2, and uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr3238-r9-neo1973.bin ? |
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| 09:59.11 | ahven | mbuf: yes |
| 09:59.21 | mbuf | ahven, ok |
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| 10:05.28 | Reilithion | What would be a rough timeframe before OpenMoko and the Neo1973 are ready for end users? A couple months? Years? |
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| 10:13.00 | ifeel | Reilithion: a couple of months... |
| 10:13.26 | Reilithion | That's what I like to hear. ^_^ |
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| 10:17.33 | ahven | I would say half a year |
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| 10:19.44 | ifeel | I read it in mailing list!! |
| 10:20.03 | ifeel | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-December/012124.html |
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| 10:22.09 | ahven | the hardware will be ready in 1 or 2 months, but the software (in my point of view) needs more polishing |
| 10:22.30 | ahven | delevopment, to be exact |
| 10:23.08 | ifeel | ah...ok??there will be a fifth revision of hardware?? |
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| 10:24.33 | ifeel | I'm waiting for the hardware to be stable and then I will buy it |
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| 10:26.14 | ahven | GTA02 should be that thing |
| 10:27.17 | ahven | (Note regarding above: per the IRC and comments on bug 957, there is to be a fifth revision of the GTA02 hardware, so I suspect the timeline is pushed out a bit again.) |
| 10:27.26 | ahven | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02#.22Phase_2.22_.28GTA02.2C_.22Mass_Market.22.29 |
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| 10:28.16 | ifeel | ok...so I'll wait for the fifth revision...no scheduling yet |
| 10:28.23 | ifeel | ?? |
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| 10:31.10 | thomasgruebler | sry my connecton aborted shortly. did already sombody answered to "[11:25] <thomasgruebler> so we cannot buy neo gta02 on 20th december?" |
| 10:31.36 | Mononoke | ifeel: if you didn't notice scheduling is not much effective, because each time something pops out it totaly breaks schedule |
| 10:31.48 | mbuf | ping to neo is not working (usb0: no IPv6 routers present) from Debian Etch or Gutsy Gibbon; usb0 is configured to 192.168.0.200; what could be the problem? |
| 10:32.02 | ahven | thomasgruebler: not yet, the last time it was pushed to february |
| 10:32.32 | thomasgruebler | oh |
| 10:33.02 | ifeel | Mononoke: yeah...you're right... |
| 10:33.19 | thomasgruebler | i wanted to use the phone for a project but i see i have to change to another platform because the competition is in februrary |
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| 10:36.59 | blindcoder | moin |
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| 10:39.10 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 10:42.10 | *** join/#openmoko fsteinel (n=fsteinel@pD9FBC66E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:43.48 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 10:44.20 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p508B20DA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 10:44.23 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-153-105-154.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 10:50.50 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.137.154) |
| 10:50.54 | mbuf | when Neo is connected to PC, it boots; after sometime, it shuts down! while connected, it gets charged for sometime, and then boots again; after few minutes it shuts down again! |
| 10:51.39 | mbuf | could it be a battery problem? ping to Neo is not working when image is up and running; |
| 10:52.14 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 10:58.07 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.137.154) |
| 10:59.07 | *** join/#openmoko you_three (n=frankenf@84.119.52.189) |
| 11:00.15 | kinneh | hiall I just got my gta01 last week, so far I've tried 2007.02 out (not good) 2007.11(better) but know I'm ready to jump onto something else, newer or something else, qtopia |
| 11:00.51 | kinneh | what do you recommend to be able to do more stuff |
| 11:01.48 | ahven | help the development or wait, but yes, qtopia is currently a little better than openmoko |
| 11:02.03 | ahven | but that time will come, when it will be the opposite |
| 11:02.04 | ajbrun | help the dev tbh |
| 11:02.51 | *** join/#openmoko GNAM (n=xxyyzz@host12-174-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 11:02.53 | ajbrun | what is qtopia? A closed source phone OS similar to everything else out there at the moment, but can be used on most phones? |
| 11:03.04 | ajbrun | making openmoko better because it's open source? |
| 11:04.41 | ifeel | ajbrun: GNOME:KDE=OPENMOKO:QTOPIA |
| 11:04.44 | kinneh | ahven: I'm just trying stuff out |
| 11:05.35 | kinneh | want input what's cool and I will surly help out, but one needs to look around to see whats out there |
| 11:05.38 | ahven | yep, if you don't like something in qtopia - you will have to live with that, you can't change it |
| 11:05.45 | ajbrun | ok - i don't know much about linux. I know they're both desktop environments, but i thought they all had their advantages? |
| 11:06.05 | ajbrun | ah - closed source still |
| 11:06.06 | ajbrun | kk |
| 11:06.06 | kinneh | ahven: we still can loan ideas ... |
| 11:08.16 | AVee | Qtopia is not closed source |
| 11:08.33 | AVee | Let me repeat, Qtopia is not closed source |
| 11:08.49 | ajbrun | why would you have to live with it if you don't like something? |
| 11:10.09 | ifeel | Qtopia has a double license...GPL and proprietary |
| 11:10.24 | opo|away | because you must live with much more things you don't like |
| 11:10.29 | opo|away | ;D |
| 11:10.38 | AVee | ifeel: Yeah, and that makes it as open as anything will be. |
| 11:10.56 | ifeel | Openmoko uses GTK graphics library while Qtopia uses QT... |
| 11:11.51 | AVee | True, Qtopia skips the X server, which is smart performance wise, but a real PITA when trying to port existing applications, etc.. |
| 11:11.55 | ifeel | AVee: I think so... |
| 11:11.59 | AVee | Each has it's use. |
| 11:13.10 | AVee | In general, Qtopia is a good thing when you what a phone, OpenMoko is better when you want a PDA. For me, that is about the difference for the user. |
| 11:13.51 | AVee | The rest is mostly technical blabla and personal preference (much like the whole KDE vs Gnome thing) |
| 11:14.20 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 11:14.53 | kinneh | ahven: I'd say qtopia is opensource http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qtopia |
| 11:15.21 | *** join/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 11:15.27 | ifeel | so Qtopia will have slower development because of the problem porting existing applications...is it true?? |
| 11:16.53 | AVee | Depends, Qtopia fans claim it provides far easier development which might compensate for the extra work. |
| 11:19.18 | ifeel | how many years is Qtopia in development phase? |
| 11:19.47 | AVee | No idea, it been around for a while now. |
| 11:20.29 | ifeel | much more than openmoko I think...so History rules... |
| 11:20.42 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@p5485D3DA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:21.09 | ifeel | openmoko is not so far from Qtopia I think... |
| 11:22.32 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 11:22.32 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=fredsiba@p54951752.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:23.15 | AVee | Frankly, i like the fact that they are around. Different ideas, different people, different ideas, all of that helps when making great software. |
| 11:23.27 | *** part/#openmoko GNAM (n=xxyyzz@host12-174-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 11:28.42 | mickeyl | morning folks |
| 11:28.46 | mickeyl | so |
| 11:28.55 | mickeyl | benchmarking session now |
| 11:29.32 | mickeyl | ifeel: qtopia has been developed since 2002 |
| 11:31.07 | kinneh | mickeyl: expedite what is that ? |
| 11:31.13 | ifeel | mickeyl: wow!! we're running so fast!! |
| 11:31.33 | mickeyl | kinneh: graphic intensive benchmark suite from the Enlightenment project |
| 11:31.41 | kinneh | ah |
| 11:32.15 | kinneh | I say some credits to raster, is that it or is he involed ? |
| 11:32.19 | kinneh | saw |
| 11:32.41 | mickeyl | yeah, that's his baby |
| 11:32.48 | mickeyl | i'm doing some backend tests |
| 11:32.55 | mickeyl | letting run fb against x11 |
| 11:33.00 | mickeyl | later also sdl and directfb |
| 11:33.04 | mickeyl | to get some idea of numbers |
| 11:33.13 | *** join/#openmoko elven (n=elven@sternenfall.org) |
| 11:33.32 | kinneh | in 2007.11 is it just me or is PIN code activation working better if you wait a while before you enter the code ? |
| 11:33.48 | kinneh | mickeyl: thinking about not using X ? |
| 11:35.48 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 11:38.01 | mbuf | trying to do a standalone makefile cross-compilation (pkg-config --libs libgsm), and get this error "No package libgsmd found", what needs to be done for this? |
| 11:38.03 | atul | CM, I do update my build " make update-makefile && make setup update openmoko-devel-image" but it gives me error like |
| 11:38.03 | atul | NOTE: package openmoko-today2-0.1.0+svnr3478-r2: task do_fetch: failed |
| 11:38.04 | atul | ERROR: TaskFailed event exception, aborting |
| 11:38.04 | atul | NOTE: package openmoko-today2-0.1.0+svnr3478: failed |
| 11:38.06 | atul | ERROR: Build of /home/qvantel/moko/openembedded/packages/openmoko2/openmoko-today2_svn.bb do_fetch failed |
| 11:38.08 | atul | ERROR: Task 290 (/home/qvantel/moko/openembedded/packages/openmoko2/openmoko-today2_svn.bb, do_fetch) failed |
| 11:38.11 | atul | NOTE: Tasks Summary: Attempted 3964 tasks of which 3730 didn't need to be rerun and 1 failed. |
| 11:38.15 | atul | ERROR: '/home/qvantel/moko/openembedded/packages/openmoko2/openmoko-today2_svn.bb' failed |
| 11:38.17 | atul | make: *** [openmoko-devel-image] Error 1 |
| 11:38.19 | atul | Any Idia |
| 11:40.34 | mickeyl | mbuf: PKG_CONFIG_PATH ? |
| 11:40.38 | mickeyl | kinneh: always |
| 11:40.48 | mickeyl | I'm always questioning the use of X on a phone. performance vs. flexibility |
| 11:40.58 | mickeyl | and now i finally can get some numbers |
| 11:41.48 | mbuf | mickeyl, ok |
| 11:41.53 | mudyc | mickeyl: in where do you publish the results? |
| 11:41.57 | ifeel | mickeyl: show us the numbers!! |
| 11:42.11 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.177) |
| 11:42.14 | mickeyl | i'll blog about it tomorrow |
| 11:42.21 | mickeyl | what can i use to get bar graphs? |
| 11:42.53 | ajbrun | this a comparision between openmoko (X-server) and qtopia (non X-server)? |
| 11:43.59 | ifeel | qtopia uses directfb? |
| 11:44.18 | mickeyl | not really, since EFL is neither used in OpenMoko (yet) nor Qtopia. I would need to do this test with Gtk and Qt as well, but let me start w/ EFL since they have a nice benchmark tool |
| 11:44.32 | mudyc | mickeyl: i haven't tried this out but looks nice: http://www.burningcutlery.com/derek/bargraph/ |
| 11:44.53 | mickeyl | mudyc: ah, that looks quite nice |
| 11:46.19 | atul | mbuf, export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/home/qvantel/moko/build/tmp/staging/arm-linux/lib/pkgconfig |
| 11:46.51 | mbuf | atul, comment it in ~/.bashrc |
| 11:48.42 | vikas | hi, i'm trying to build openmoko for the first time using the mokomakefile and the build is errorring out |
| 11:48.51 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@78.42.60.129) |
| 11:49.04 | PBeck | hi |
| 11:49.09 | vikas | the error is like so: |
| 11:49.23 | vikas | Applying patch arm-thumb-mutex.patch |
| 11:49.23 | vikas | Get file ../dbinc/mutex.h from Perforce with lock? [y] |
| 11:49.23 | vikas | sh: p4: not found |
| 11:49.23 | vikas | patch: **** Can't get file ../dbinc/mutex.h from Perforce |
| 11:49.26 | vikas | Patch arm-thumb-mutex.patch does not apply (enforce with -f) |
| 11:49.29 | vikas | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:49.43 | vikas | anybody knows how to overcome this? |
| 11:50.23 | mickeyl | sounds like balrog-kun broke qemu |
| 11:50.40 | vikas | why is it trying to look at p4? does any project use p4? |
| 11:50.43 | mickeyl | where did you get your database to? |
| 11:50.46 | mickeyl | s/to/from/ |
| 11:51.30 | vikas | mickeyl: are you asking me? |
| 11:51.52 | mickeyl | yes. are you pulling from openembedded or openmoko? |
| 11:51.56 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A55F46.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:52.33 | vikas | well, looking at the dir structure, it's trying from openembedded |
| 11:52.56 | vikas | ERROR: Task 4863 (/media/disk/backup/moko/openembedded/packages/db/db-native_4.3.29.bb, do_patch) failed |
| 11:52.56 | vikas | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:53.09 | mickeyl | i don't think you can tell that from the directory structure |
| 11:53.15 | vikas | Ah, ok |
| 11:53.16 | mickeyl | since both openembedded.org and monotone.openmoko.org serve org.oe.dev |
| 11:53.21 | vikas | then i have no idea :( |
| 11:53.22 | mickeyl | but it's important from where you pull |
| 11:53.39 | mickeyl | i never seen mokomakefile, so i can't comment in more detail |
| 11:53.50 | mickeyl | but somewhere it should mtn pull from a monotone server |
| 11:54.00 | mickeyl | and if you're using openembedded.org, you're on your own |
| 11:54.10 | mickeyl | i will not support that now that OpenMoko has their own server |
| 11:54.24 | mickeyl | since we did it exactly for the reason not always to build bleeding edge |
| 11:54.45 | vikas | does bitbake save the build log somewhere? |
| 11:55.01 | mickeyl | usually it prints it out |
| 11:55.11 | mickeyl | if you call it manually. again, i have no experience with mokomakefile |
| 11:55.50 | mickeyl | i should use it at some point of time, but calling bitbake is natural to me since i was one of the guys who invented it ;) |
| 11:55.50 | vikas | oh ok |
| 11:55.56 | vikas | :) |
| 11:56.17 | vikas | it did print it out, but the terminal got killed :( |
| 11:56.46 | *** join/#openmoko rami_ (n=rami@87.109.3.128) |
| 11:57.11 | ajbrun | is there definatly a GTA02v5 now? |
| 11:58.03 | vikas | so, if i start off with the 'build openmoko from scratch' article on the openmoko wiki, will the build start from where it left off? |
| 11:58.20 | vikas | since it downloaded a lot of stuff, i don't want to restart from the beginning :) |
| 11:58.48 | atul | libmokoui2 is not available in recent builds? |
| 12:02.43 | mickeyl | atul: why do you think so? |
| 12:03.06 | mickeyl | http://downloads.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.11/ipk/armv4t/libmokoui2-0_0.1.0+svnr3229-r2_armv4t.ipk |
| 12:03.23 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 12:03.26 | atul | mickeyl, in October moko build environment, i am able to build code; in yesterday's build, i get "gtk/gtk.h: no such file or directory" |
| 12:03.37 | mickeyl | hmm |
| 12:03.50 | atul | mickeyl, libmokoui2 includes all gtk.h files, right? |
| 12:03.52 | mickeyl | yes |
| 12:05.12 | atul | mickeyl, forgot to include libmokoui2 in Makefile; oops; works now, thanks! |
| 12:05.21 | mickeyl | :) |
| 12:05.23 | mickeyl | np |
| 12:05.48 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 12:08.45 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-172-041.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:10.36 | rwhitby | mickeyl: mokomakefile pulls from openmoko server with the 'update' target and pulls from openembedded with the 'update-bleeding-edge' target. I can make that 'update-bleeding-edge-no-support-from-mickey' if you like ;-) |
| 12:11.16 | *** join/#openmoko rami__ (n=rami@87.109.4.242) |
| 12:11.17 | mickeyl | haha |
| 12:11.26 | mickeyl | rwhitby: well, i guess it's ok like that ;) |
| 12:11.33 | mickeyl | don't make it even longer |
| 12:12.00 | vikas | rwhitby: any idea about the build error i got? is it specific to mokomakefile or some recent checkin? |
| 12:12.19 | mickeyl | if mr. monotone.openmoko.org admin updates the server without checking that it builds, I expect some flames to distro-devel |
| 12:12.23 | mickeyl | so please do that :)) |
| 12:13.01 | rwhitby | vikas: do you use perforce in your environment at all? It looks to me like some perforce thing in your environment is overriding some standard tool. |
| 12:13.29 | rwhitby | mickeyl: ah, but he only checks one host distro, right? |
| 12:13.54 | rwhitby | so you should publish which one that is, so people can replicate it if they really want to be safe. |
| 12:14.41 | mickeyl | rwhitby: good point. i'll tell him |
| 12:14.48 | mickeyl | i guess he's using debian 4 |
| 12:14.49 | vikas | rwhitby: yeah, our office uses perforce, but i have only one envar set for it, i'll try unsetting and re-try |
| 12:15.53 | rwhitby | vikas: does it override quilt or patch or something like that? |
| 12:16.32 | vikas | well, i just unset it and it worked. the setting is just "P4CONFIG=.p4config" |
| 12:16.43 | vikas | i'm not even sure if any other s/w uses this apart from p4 |
| 12:17.04 | rwhitby | spooky voodo |
| 12:17.06 | rwhitby | o |
| 12:23.08 | vikas | so, is e17 going to come to openmoko, now that raster is also part of the project? |
| 12:23.51 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be) |
| 12:25.00 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423__ (n=chatzill@A7093.a.strato-dslnet.de) |
| 12:28.06 | hhf423 | moin |
| 12:28.38 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-112-46.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 12:29.41 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@kaar72.airix.fi) |
| 12:33.52 | mbuf | replacing old battery with new battery sustains the Neo when connected to the PC; the old battery got recharged at times and booted fine, but, suddenly died down; urgh! |
| 12:34.29 | mbuf | with low power on the battery, and whenever it booted for a short time, ping didn't work with the Neo |
| 12:36.05 | hhf423 | whut? |
| 12:36.09 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 12:36.27 | mbuf | 1. is there any way the old battery can be re-charged? 2. where can i buy more FIC batteries? |
| 12:37.00 | mickeyl | buy a DT-14 + charger |
| 12:37.09 | mickeyl | charges it up to 75% |
| 12:37.33 | hhf423 | I recommend charging batteries by hooking the Neo up to a dumb charger and then put it into FAST charge mode using uboot |
| 12:37.45 | mbuf | mickeyl, i see |
| 12:45.07 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@193.52.24.125) |
| 12:45.09 | bedboi | hi all |
| 12:45.19 | balrog-kun | is current qemu broken? |
| 12:51.45 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423__ (n=chatzill@A7093.a.strato-dslnet.de) |
| 12:54.50 | ajbrun | i know these will be massivly expensive atm, but is there any reson these won't work in a neo1973 on release? |
| 12:54.51 | ajbrun | http://gadgets.fosfor.se/64-gb-compact-flash-from-samsung/ |
| 12:54.57 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 12:55.07 | ajbrun | just wondering how big you can go :p |
| 12:58.24 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 12:58.44 | *** join/#openmoko kaizo (n=kaizo@87-194-74-128.bethere.co.uk) |
| 12:59.21 | ahven | nice, the synergy client is working 5+ :) |
| 12:59.51 | balrog-kun | they are CF, CF are bigger and i believe more power hungry |
| 13:00.07 | *** join/#openmoko Hoolxi (n=df@218.79.137.154) |
| 13:00.28 | balrog-kun | they are exactly same form as microdrives and maybe about the same power usage, not sure, but you could also put a harddisk instead |
| 13:02.28 | balrog-kun | there are pda's/phone's/cameras with CF or microdrives in them so it's certainly possible |
| 13:03.50 | AVee | I doubt normal CF cards use significantly more power, all these cards mostly contain the same flash chips anyway |
| 13:04.45 | AVee | But the CF harddisks will draw more power (moving parts) and the specification might require more power to be available on a CF slot which could be a problem |
| 13:08.01 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 13:19.30 | mbuf | what is the reason for this error "dfu_download error -71" when trying to reprogram rootfs; have already done "nand erase rootfs"; have flashed uImage already |
| 13:20.22 | *** join/#openmoko hansmbakker (n=kde-deve@ip5657905b.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 13:22.06 | ajbrun | so what's the biggest SD card that will be compatible in a neo? 8GB? |
| 13:25.49 | SP8472 | is it SDHC? if no: 2GB. if yes: 2048GB. |
| 13:26.00 | SP8472 | (note: the latter are not on the market yet.) |
| 13:27.12 | ajbrun | i thought 8GB SDHC cards were available? |
| 13:27.30 | SP8472 | ajbrun: yes, but not 2TB ones :-) |
| 13:27.32 | *** part/#openmoko hansmbakker (n=kde-deve@ip5657905b.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 13:27.37 | SP8472 | also, remember that the neo is microSD. |
| 13:27.50 | SP8472 | i think there are 4GB microSD now...? |
| 13:28.13 | SP8472 | yes, some. wicked expensive. |
| 13:29.41 | ajbrun | http://www.mymemory.co.uk/Micro-SDHC |
| 13:29.41 | abraxa_ | ajbrun: The Neo is SDHC-compatible so you don't have to worry about the card size you buy. |
| 13:29.44 | SP8472 | oh, sandisk even has 8GB microSD. 85 EUR. |
| 13:30.00 | ajbrun | £54 - not as bad as i thought |
| 13:30.00 | mbuf | the dfu-util built in moko build environment has a different file size compared to the one, I had earlier downloaded from openmoko website; which one to use? |
| 13:31.47 | *** join/#openmoko komar007 (n=komar@alane2.gl.digi.pl) |
| 13:35.09 | *** join/#openmoko vikas (n=user@124.125.206.78) |
| 13:35.31 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p508B163D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:36.43 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 13:38.32 | *** join/#openmoko p0seid0n_ (n=poseidon@X4190.x.pppool.de) |
| 13:39.52 | p0seid0n_ | enjahova you're there ? |
| 13:40.58 | mbuf | nevermind, flashing on different system, works |
| 13:45.29 | torpor | yo |
| 13:50.47 | *** join/#openmoko p0s_e_id0n_ (n=poseidon@X4190.x.pppool.de) |
| 13:52.13 | *** part/#openmoko a2n (n=a2n@163.26.225.208) |
| 13:52.33 | p0s_e_id0n_ | I'm pretty new to openmoko coding. I have some trouble compiling the openmoko image to run within xephyr x-sever on my desktop. has anyone of you done this ? |
| 13:53.13 | *** join/#openmoko p0s_e_id0n__ (n=poseidon@X4190.x.pppool.de) |
| 13:56.12 | *** join/#openmoko p0s_e_id0n (n=poseidon@X4190.x.pppool.de) |
| 13:59.07 | mbuf | phone calls work with December 8th build! |
| 13:59.11 | *** join/#openmoko xkr47^ (n=xkr47@a88-112-31-228.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 14:00.06 | SpeedEvil | and nov too |
| 14:00.41 | mbuf | SpeedEvil, sms is working? i just sent one from another phone, but, haven't received it on the Neo |
| 14:01.02 | *** join/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 14:01.22 | ahven | where can I find that dec 8th build? |
| 14:01.34 | mbuf | ahven, i just built one from scratch, 11 hours |
| 14:01.43 | ahven | oh :) |
| 14:03.07 | *** join/#openmoko techindian (n=karthik@125.130.84.253) |
| 14:07.00 | kinneh | ahven: dec 7 is here anyway http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/ |
| 14:07.44 | Mononoke | hmm to automatic building: http://searchsecurity.techtarget.com/tip/0,289483,sid14_gci1284677,00.html?track=NL-427&ad=614651&asrc=EM_NLT_2721823&uid=4169286 |
| 14:08.33 | *** join/#openmoko Marcel_M (n=Marcel_M@86.59.65.236) |
| 14:09.40 | kinneh | Mononoke: well you really cant trust anyone you dont know, but ... |
| 14:11.25 | *** join/#openmoko p0s_e_id0n_ (n=poseidon@X4190.x.pppool.de) |
| 14:16.42 | *** join/#openmoko ifeel_ (n=ifeel@151.70.154.40) |
| 14:17.14 | bedboi | is there any simple voodoo to set my neo back in life? |
| 14:18.12 | abraxa_ | bedboi: Depends on what your Neo is (not) doing |
| 14:18.36 | bedboi | my neo is not booting, i mean it's completely discharged i guess |
| 14:18.37 | torpor | bedboi: whats wrong with your neo? |
| 14:18.46 | torpor | give it time to recharge the battery |
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| 14:19.51 | abraxa_ | bedboi: If it's just that then you can unplug USB, take out the battery to make sure all circuits turn off, then put it back in and re-attach USB to let it charge |
| 14:20.19 | abraxa_ | After about an hour it should power up again |
| 14:20.47 | abraxa_ | Then you can switch to fast-charging via u-boot (I think entering u-boot and just shutting the Neo off again from there suffices) |
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| 15:23.50 | bedboi | is the latest image by scaryedcat ok? |
| 15:23.59 | bedboi | the openmoko one, obviously |
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| 15:29.34 | kinneh | bedboi: I've only tested the qtopia version, but that works |
| 15:29.55 | kinneh | (OpenMoko-qtopia-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20071207-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2) |
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| 15:45.30 | *** join/#openmoko Kristoffer (n=kristoff@h81172249135.kund.kommunicera.umea.se) |
| 15:45.42 | Kristoffer | Hi! |
| 15:45.54 | ajbrun | lo |
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| 15:49.40 | Kristoffer | When will I be able to buy a Openmoko in Sweden? |
| 15:49.48 | ajbrun | you can atm i think |
| 15:49.56 | ajbrun | it's not the full release version |
| 15:50.16 | Kristoffer | Okey. |
| 15:50.24 | ajbrun | GTA02 is scheduled for a developer release soon (start of 2008 probably) |
| 15:50.25 | Kristoffer | I'd like to know where. |
| 15:50.29 | *** join/#openmoko br3n (n=bren@79-67-137-87.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 15:50.37 | ajbrun | same site that's in the topic |
| 15:50.45 | ajbrun | i'd just wait for GTA02 though |
| 15:50.56 | Kristoffer | That's the English site. |
| 15:51.01 | ajbrun | for faster cpu, graphics, wifi, accelerometers and more |
| 15:51.03 | zash | Kristoffer: international |
| 15:51.08 | Kristoffer | I mwant to buy it from a retail-store. |
| 15:51.11 | Kristoffer | want |
| 15:51.14 | ajbrun | then we don't know |
| 15:51.20 | ajbrun | could be months |
| 15:51.45 | zash | Kristoffer: dont expect to be able to do that ever |
| 15:51.49 | ajbrun | as far as i know, the gta02 version will be the same as the full release |
| 15:52.13 | ajbrun | why do you want it in a shop, rather than online? |
| 15:52.26 | opo|away | buy it at ebay |
| 15:52.28 | opo|away | ;D |
| 15:54.01 | Kristoffer | I'd like to see more Linux-stuff in retail-stores. |
| 15:54.05 | Kristoffer | Is it so wrong? |
| 15:54.09 | zash | we all want that |
| 15:54.31 | zash | go to stores and say you want more linux stuff |
| 15:54.32 | Kristoffer | Yes, and the phone is a start. |
| 15:54.44 | zash | maby they will order a bunch |
| 15:54.59 | zash | if there is enough interest |
| 15:54.59 | Kristoffer | I've done that. They don't know what their HQ say. |
| 15:55.03 | ajbrun | nothing wrong with that, but i can see it either being released shortly after gta02, or being in contact dev as many open source projects are |
| 15:55.30 | ajbrun | *constant |
| 15:55.35 | Kristoffer | Can I use Mandriva & Gnome on it as well? |
| 15:55.42 | Kristoffer | How much memory does it have? |
| 15:55.57 | ajbrun | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware |
| 15:56.01 | zash | Kristoffer: those are more for desktops than phones |
| 15:56.01 | Kristoffer | Can I play all the formats of video & audio that exists? |
| 15:56.05 | ajbrun | yes |
| 15:56.16 | Vegar | no, you can't run mandriva on it |
| 15:56.18 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host178-223-dynamic.11-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 15:56.35 | ajbrun | if you can make the software for it, and there's the hardware that support it, then yes |
| 15:56.57 | Kristoffer | What about USB? |
| 15:57.05 | ajbrun | it has 1 port |
| 15:57.12 | ajbrun | read the hardware list |
| 15:57.14 | zash | mini-usb |
| 15:57.24 | ajbrun | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware#USB_Device |
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| 15:57.57 | ajbrun | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_GTA02_Hardware <---- or rather this one |
| 15:58.08 | ajbrun | for a more "release" version |
| 15:58.29 | Kristoffer | How's the sound compared to other cellphones/PDA's? |
| 15:58.38 | ajbrun | monotone |
| 15:58.44 | ajbrun | or rather mono |
| 15:58.49 | ajbrun | not stereo |
| 15:58.54 | ajbrun | not monotone obviously |
| 15:58.55 | zash | the gta01 has stereo |
| 15:59.12 | zash | and ppl says its good |
| 15:59.21 | zash | with quality |
| 15:59.22 | ajbrun | gta doesn't - i think Kristoffer is looking for release (gta02) specs? |
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| 16:05.15 | Kristoffer | I'd like to test it. |
| 16:05.17 | Kristoffer | hehe |
| 16:06.07 | ajbrun | then either get a gta01 now, or wait a month and get a gta02 |
| 16:06.30 | ajbrun | i'm waiting for the gta02 as i don't see the point in getting a gta01 atm when a new version is just around the corner |
| 16:07.03 | balrog-kun | i wouldn't call that just around the corner |
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| 16:07.21 | balrog-kun | gta01 was just around the corner for like 8 months |
| 16:07.24 | opo|away | buy a gta01 and sell it when you can get the gta02 |
| 16:07.27 | opo|away | ^^ |
| 16:07.42 | ajbrun | but will people want to buy it when it's only a dev version? |
| 16:08.10 | opo|away | some people yes |
| 16:08.31 | Kristoffer | Does gta02 come in Swedish? |
| 16:08.32 | ajbrun | balrog-kun - just around the corner: can't be much longer after the start of the year can it? |
| 16:08.37 | ajbrun | 4-6 weeks? |
| 16:08.53 | ajbrun | Kristoffer - don't see why not |
| 16:09.09 | ajbrun | anything can be done with the software |
| 16:09.24 | ajbrun | if software can come in sweedish, then yes it can |
| 16:10.43 | kinneh | Kristoffer: I just bought one and using it with telia right know |
| 16:11.00 | kinneh | still problems with standby time, sms and suspend |
| 16:11.31 | kinneh | If I dont allow openmoko to suspend I can make and recive calls right now with 2007.11 |
| 16:11.52 | ajbrun | what happens if you do allow suspend? |
| 16:12.30 | kinneh | gsm problems |
| 16:12.51 | kinneh | I havent been able to get is working again after ... |
| 16:13.02 | kinneh | I've tried to enable loggin in gsmd |
| 16:13.15 | kinneh | but I've came that far with that |
| 16:14.15 | Kristoffer | ki9nneh: How much did you pay for it? |
| 18:00.18 | *** join/#openmoko apt (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 18:00.18 | *** topic/#openmoko is The OpenMoko Project - http://openmoko.org - Neo1973 GTA01 on sale at https://direct.openmoko.com || Do not ask about GTA02 (Maybe March as of last update - yes, that's with WiFi, and no, there's no cam). Latest official update is at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates |
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| 18:02.59 | Kero | the calendar thingy stopped doing its thing, a while ago. |
| 18:03.31 | Kero | still weird, since my calendar is absolutely empty (afaik, I didn't put anything in it) |
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| 18:33.15 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=Kevin@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 18:35.21 | kdean06 | Anyone here use their Neo GTA01 to remotely administer servers via command line? I was planning to wait for the Wifi, but I figure that I'll use the internet so seldomly while mobile that there's no real need... I'm wondering if anyone else has real-world experience doing that... |
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| 18:37.25 | mwester | kdean06: The device is barely functional ATM - I don't think anyone can use it in any way one would consider "real-world" yet. |
| 18:38.23 | mwester | kdean06: The on-screen keyboard would make command-line work tedious in the extreme, but there's no reason you couldn't ssh via the built-in terminal emulator, assuming you managed to get the network running via the GSM modem. |
| 18:38.59 | abraxa_ | kdean06: GPRS can (and often is) extremely laggy, so ssh over GPRS is no fun |
| 18:39.10 | abraxa_ | can be* |
| 18:41.19 | kdean06 | Hrm... |
| 18:43.03 | kdean06 | The OSK isn't a problem. I'm thinking more in terms of emergency work where "slow" is better than "nothing". If the Neo's "readiness" is anything comparable to the qemu image, then it's fine by me, I understand it's not a user-friendly rival to the iPhone but if the damn thing boots I can work with it. :) |
| 18:43.27 | *** join/#openmoko bruce_ (n=chatzill@S0106001217ad494a.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 18:43.46 | kdean06 | But the GPRS lag might be an issue. |
| 18:44.04 | Kero | it... booots... and then some process munches up 100% CPU until you kill it. |
| 18:44.11 | kdean06 | :) |
| 18:44.14 | Kero | after that I seem to be fine |
| 18:44.49 | kdean06 | No fear. :) I have practice doing that... I'm a Firefox user. |
| 18:45.13 | kdean06 | gtk-gnash is a killer there. |
| 18:45.40 | Kero | iceweasel can take the heat, apparently. no such issues here |
| 18:47.32 | kdean06 | :) |
| 18:47.55 | abraxa_ | kdean06: For that purpose it would be fully usable, yeah |
| 18:47.55 | kdean06 | I'm an Iceweasel user too but I've had to answer too many questions... |
| 18:48.40 | kdean06 | Awesome, thanks. |
| 18:49.05 | Kero | hehe. I already have to answer questions when ppl see my window manager |
| 18:49.27 | kdean06 | I really think I just need an excuse to pull the trigger on a GTA01 rather than waiting till the 02 hits... |
| 18:49.32 | kdean06 | What WM do you use? |
| 18:49.35 | Kero | wmii |
| 18:49.42 | kdean06 | I see. |
| 18:49.52 | Kero | well, *when* will gta02 it. that can be your excuse! :) |
| 18:50.01 | Kero | +h |
| 18:51.02 | kdean06 | Sorry, I didn't understand that (and it wasn't the typo). |
| 18:51.21 | Kero | kdean06: if you wait for gta02, how long will you have to wait? |
| 18:51.44 | Kero | do you want to wait to "maybe march" or maybe august? |
| 18:51.45 | kdean06 | That's the rub. :) At this moment, GTA02 is vaporware. :P It might NEVER come out. |
| 18:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@Mb071.m.pppool.de) |
| 18:53.07 | kdean06 | But at the same time, I don't "need" Moko. My phone is currently on it's last legs and I plan Moko to be it's replacement. But I'd be extremely pissed dropping that much money on a phone that's signifigantly better that is released 3 weeks later... |
| 18:53.47 | kdean06 | Please ignore the inconsistant use of "Moko"... I'm aware it's the framework/toolkit and the Neo is the phone, but I assume you all know what i mean. :P |
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| 18:56.03 | OJW | of course, GTA01 is also significantly cheaper than 02 ;) |
| 18:57.11 | kdean06 | I was under the impression that at the release that would change... What is the current understanding of the GTA02 price? |
| 18:57.47 | Kero | my phone is ooold, but running nicely on a spare battery from a friend. |
| 18:58.08 | Kero | But I do not think Neo runs even one day on its battery :( |
| 18:58.53 | kdean06 | I have no display on mine. :) It's a Razr which has got to be the crappiest phone in existance from a reliablity standpoint... Both mine and my wife's had signifigant hardware failures in less than a year. |
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| 19:02.44 | Kero | moto lost its touch? mine is a Timeport, still going strong |
| 19:04.26 | kdean06 | I've never been fond of Motorola's phones. |
| 19:04.36 | kdean06 | Though I've never had problems this bad before. |
| 19:11.19 | ahven | <kdean06> I was under the impression that at the release that would change... What is the current understanding of the GTA02 price? << according to the wiki, $450 for the base model |
| 19:11.35 | ahven | though yesterday someone said $300 |
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| 19:12.49 | *** join/#openmoko dinamich (n=damjan@ub141-7.static.adsl.volja.net) |
| 19:13.48 | kdean06 | Yeah... Currently the 01 is $300. I recall reading that the 01 price would drop when 02 came out, and that 02 would sell for the same price that the 01 does now... |
| 19:13.54 | gi-el | kdean06: i've got a pebl that won't recharge anymore |
| 19:14.19 | Mononoke | kdean06: meanwhile USD has fallen |
| 19:15.09 | Mononoke | *had (?) |
| 19:15.27 | OJW | so are there many GPA01 remaining at openmoko HQ? |
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| 20:09.50 | ajbrun | does anyone have a source for the march date in the topic? It mentions "as of last update", but the community update section does mention march at all? |
| 20:10.30 | ajbrun | i mean doesn't obviously... |
| 20:10.43 | abraxa_ | From what I know it's pure speculation |
| 20:11.09 | abraxa_ | My personal estimation for the release date is before then |
| 20:11.51 | ajbrun | problem is, i would like a new phone soon, but march does seem quite far away |
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| 20:12.14 | ajbrun | i don't want to get a gta01 now and to have the next version appear a week later |
| 20:13.57 | ajbrun | i don't even know how much the gta01 would sell on ebay for once the next one's out. So many unknowns, but I guess there's no other way with things like this... |
| 20:14.57 | abraxa_ | My suggestion? Get a cheap phone on eBay that'll get you by until GTA02 comes out. |
| 20:15.05 | ajbrun | well... |
| 20:15.17 | ajbrun | it's not that i *need* a new phone i suppose |
| 20:15.26 | ajbrun | more of "i'd like one" |
| 20:15.31 | ajbrun | and "i'd like a neo" |
| 20:15.34 | abraxa_ | Ahh |
| 20:15.46 | abraxa_ | Well, then there's only the "wait for GTA02" option :) |
| 20:16.00 | abraxa_ | GTA01 is a mere developer preview |
| 20:16.09 | abraxa_ | You won't be happy with it in the long run |
| 20:17.01 | ajbrun | i know, but i wouldn't call myself a non-developer either |
| 20:17.18 | ajbrun | all depends on what's going to happen in the future which can't always be predicted |
| 20:19.57 | ajbrun | abraxa_ - seems i'm not allowed to talk, but i know what you mean and i didn't take it the wrong way :) |
| 20:21.08 | abraxa_ | Okay |
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| 20:46.16 | linuxxr | THEN GO GET A NEO ADVANCED OFF EBAY SHURELY THERES SOMEBODY THAT WANTS TO SELL |
| 20:46.35 | linuxxr | BETTER YET BUY A NEW 1 |
| 20:46.41 | Mononoke | ? |
| 20:46.55 | Mononoke | please don't shout :) |
| 20:47.01 | linuxxr | mee sorry |
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| 20:47.52 | Fatal | I though capslock day was in october |
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| 20:50.10 | linuxxr | http://pdavila.homelinux.org:8080/blog/?p=251 |
| 20:51.05 | linuxxr | wiill gta02v5 correct this? |
| 20:51.33 | ajbrun | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates#850_MHz_band_not_supported_in_USA.2BCanada_.28e.g._comment_24_on_bug_.23256.29 |
| 20:51.44 | ajbrun | Conversion of GTA02 to quad band would require major changes and so will not happen. |
| 20:52.01 | ajbrun | i guess not |
| 20:52.29 | ajbrun | you living in the US? |
| 20:52.40 | abraxa_ | linuxxr: Did you write that post? |
| 20:52.59 | linuxxr | nope |
| 20:53.17 | linuxxr | y i live in the us |
| 20:53.49 | ajbrun | nah - don't think he wrote it abraxa_ |
| 20:54.00 | ajbrun | linuxxr = brian |
| 20:54.04 | linuxxr | yyup |
| 20:54.07 | abraxa_ | linuxxr: Ah okay. Yeah, the GTA02 won't have 850MHz support for now but it seems likely that there will be a different triband version of it released as well, including 850MHz support and dropping one of the other frequencies |
| 20:54.09 | ajbrun | blogger = patrick |
| 20:54.20 | linuxxr | y i didnt write it i FOUND it |
| 20:54.35 | ajbrun | lol |
| 20:54.35 | linuxxr | googled it |
| 20:54.40 | ajbrun | it's like "finder keepers!" |
| 20:55.24 | mwester | abraxa_: source for the "seems likely" part? |
| 20:55.47 | linuxxr | so basicly the us prolly will follow later |
| 20:55.49 | ajbrun | i think i read that too somewhere - can't remember where though |
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| 20:56.24 | abraxa_ | mwester: One of the countless posts on community... I didn't save an URL I'm afraid. It was either Michael or roh who said it, I forgot |
| 20:56.33 | linuxxr | y i think the us market would be HUGE |
| 20:56.34 | mwester | There was speculation, but I have never seen any comment from FIC/Openmoko to followup in any way. |
| 20:56.47 | ajbrun | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates#850_MHz_band_not_supported_in_USA.2BCanada_.28e.g._comment_24_on_bug_.23256.29 <---- maybe in here? |
| 20:56.53 | ajbrun | 11/29/2007 - We would like to offer an 850/1800/1900MHz version of GTA02 for areas that need it. We are looking into whether this is feasible or not. This requires a number of changes (components, firwmare, calibration, etc.) and so is uncertain until we test it. |
| 20:57.13 | mwester | The last was that they would look into converting the Euro triband to a NA triband, but they did not say anything to confirm if they were or were not going to do so. |
| 20:57.55 | mwester | ajbrun: That's the post. There's been no follow up to say what the results of "looking into whether this is feasable or not" actually were. |
| 20:58.02 | ajbrun | rgr |
| 20:58.06 | linuxxr | ahh |
| 20:58.35 | mwester | So at this time, in addition to not even knowning when the GTA02 is expected to ship, we don't even know if there will be a version of it that will work on this side of the planet. |
| 20:58.47 | linuxxr | yup |
| 20:58.57 | linuxxr | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:59.19 | ajbrun | i'm sure they'd try get it sorted, if only to boost sales |
| 20:59.23 | jelousbuddy | has anyone ever shot infrared fire/energy from eyes? do you know if i do it or learned how to do it? are my eyes dangerous for glasses (ex windows)? |
| 20:59.32 | ajbrun | don't know how they could have overlooked something like this though |
| 20:59.35 | mwester | And it's safe to say that there will be a delay measured in months, not weeks, from the GTA02 Euromoko device to a GTA02 NA device even if only due to FCC approvals. |
| 21:00.52 | linuxxr | this is the first in a line of devices |
| 21:00.53 | mwester | Meanwhile, in the real universe, the GTA01 is still awaiting power managment, implementation of a MUX for the GSM, and other basics. So I guess the GTA02 is rather a moot point, really. |
| 21:01.29 | mwester | linuxxr: It's only a line of devices if the first ones are successful. FIC/Openmoko is a business. |
| 21:01.34 | ajbrun | will gta02 be the same as release, or will they tweak it a little more first? |
| 21:01.41 | ajbrun | or is that unknown at this stage? |
| 21:01.46 | mwester | unknown |
| 21:01.54 | linuxxr | y but with gta02v3 it gets unmooted |
| 21:02.02 | mwester | No. |
| 21:02.13 | mwester | gta02 is euro only. |
| 21:02.19 | linuxxr | oo |
| 21:02.36 | linuxxr | y sos we get the gta03 |
| 21:02.40 | linuxxr | lolol |
| 21:03.00 | linuxxr | y with even more bells an whistles |
| 21:03.09 | mwester | dream on |
| 21:03.33 | linuxxr | y so im dreaming |
| 21:03.42 | abraxa_ | mwester: I stand corrected then. |
| 21:03.58 | linuxxr | dangle that worm |
| 21:04.18 | Writchie | the 1800/1900 side will always be the same in current design. |
| 21:04.31 | Writchie | the 900 part is what has to change to 850 for Americas version |
| 21:04.52 | linuxxr | y |
| 21:05.00 | Writchie | this is relatively simple change - different component and then testing for compliance. |
| 21:05.05 | linuxxr | its an old tribes habit |
| 21:05.20 | ajbrun | what's old tribes? |
| 21:05.28 | Writchie | the testing is a lab IIRC - no big deal other than $$ |
| 21:05.29 | mwester | Writchie: "relatively" being the key word there. |
| 21:05.41 | linuxxr | starseige tribes an old game |
| 21:05.55 | Writchie | 900 -> 850 normally not a problem unless the 900 was marginal to begin with. |
| 21:06.09 | mwester | Oh, I agree that technically it's a no-brainer. |
| 21:06.31 | linuxxr | then were good then correct? |
| 21:06.33 | jelousbuddy | if i move my eyes does fire starts? or do i instant transmission some kind of fire energy so things can burn up? |
| 21:06.54 | ajbrun | if it's such a small change, then why are they saying that they're looking into it etc? Surley it's yes or no if it's such a "no-brainer" |
| 21:07.07 | mwester | That's the question indeed. |
| 21:07.11 | linuxxr | thats correct |
| 21:07.18 | Writchie | you still have to source the parts and test |
| 21:07.29 | linuxxr | whos got no brain |
| 21:07.40 | Writchie | so it's understandable that they aren't committed. |
| 21:07.48 | linuxxr | noooo |
| 21:08.06 | Writchie | But what is #$^&*@#* unbelievable is that didn't they know it wasn't going to work quad band to begin with one year ago. |
| 21:08.09 | ajbrun | well, i guess that can't say yes until they're certain i suppose |
| 21:08.17 | ajbrun | no matter how likley it is |
| 21:08.33 | Writchie | that's mind bongling and no one has said yet - I @#$&*( up or she $@#$*(& up |
| 21:08.47 | linuxxr | lolol |
| 21:08.48 | ajbrun | ??? |
| 21:08.56 | linuxxr | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:09.00 | ajbrun | is this server sensored? |
| 21:09.04 | mwester | I suspect there's also another concern. Somebody dropped the ball in a major way. So if it took them a year to figure out that it wasn't quad-band to begin with, I can see that they would be concerned abou the ability of whatever company did the design, and hence the mod to 850. |
| 21:09.19 | linuxxr | that would be fic |
| 21:09.21 | Writchie | 3 != 4 and san != si in chinese |
| 21:09.46 | abraxa_ | Writchie: Taiwanese mentality might play a role in this also |
| 21:09.48 | mwester | I don't know that FIC designed it -- it's common to outsource everything. |
| 21:10.11 | linuxxr | fic is a MAJOR mfg. |
| 21:10.12 | mwester | Yeah, I've heard what abraxa_ is referring to in other matters. |
| 21:10.34 | ajbrun | what's this? |
| 21:10.38 | Writchie | well I doubt FIC every screwed up a spec like this for NOKIA |
| 21:10.54 | mwester | This is true. But then, NOKIA wouldn't let them get away with that. |
| 21:11.18 | Writchie | and given the design appears top shelf quality in other regards I suspect a communication screw up. |
| 21:11.33 | ajbrun | you got one Writchie? |
| 21:11.36 | mwester | I work with Motorola (vendor), and I know for a fact that if we ever screwed up like this, we'd be out of business -- Motorola wouldn't do business with us ever again, and because of that nobody else would either. |
| 21:11.46 | Writchie | ajbrun: one what? |
| 21:11.49 | ajbrun | a neo |
| 21:11.53 | Writchie | no |
| 21:11.55 | Writchie | i have two |
| 21:12.00 | ajbrun | lol |
| 21:12.02 | ajbrun | how come? |
| 21:12.13 | ajbrun | it's good to know the design is good anyway :) |
| 21:12.15 | mwester | Writchie is privileged. :) |
| 21:12.27 | linuxxr | that would be retail this is still project status |
| 21:12.33 | Writchie | because I was (an for the moment still am) serious about this - one is not enuf - i fully expected to fry one of them |
| 21:12.51 | ajbrun | not going to sell up then :p |
| 21:13.11 | abraxa_ | Writchie: It would be interesting to find out what GSM frequencies China uses. The Neo was supposed to be a mainstream phone for China mainland so maybe the GSM part just wasn't changed |
| 21:13.17 | Writchie | software doesn't care about 4 bands |
| 21:13.27 | mwester | No, but testing it does. |
| 21:13.31 | Writchie | China is 900/1800 |
| 21:13.53 | mwester | There's not much I can do here to test anything that requires the GSM modem. :( |
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| 21:14.15 | Writchie | mwester: no t-mobile? |
| 21:14.45 | mwester | t-mobile, weak signal on the side of my desk nearest the window, on good days. |
| 21:15.04 | Writchie | i've been using tri-band (euro) GSM phones here for 8 years now |
| 21:15.17 | mwester | To actually make a call, I need to take the devcie with me closer in towards Chicago. |
| 21:15.25 | Writchie | bummer |
| 21:15.27 | linuxxr | wow |
| 21:15.46 | Writchie | for US you really have to have 850 unless you are in a prime t-mobile service area |
| 21:16.02 | Writchie | and then 1900 still sucks compared to low band |
| 21:16.27 | Writchie | 1900 was intended as an overlay for dense areas - not primary coverage |
| 21:16.33 | mwester | Yep. and even if you are in the urban jungle, coverage is often spotty. Works on one side of the restaraunt, not on the other sort-of-thing. |
| 21:16.41 | Writchie | the cell spacing economics suck for 1900 |
| 21:17.08 | mwester | Ah, but its perfect for coverage of very dense small areas -- malls, airports, |
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| 21:17.11 | Writchie | you need to build a network with lo-band and use 1900 for extra capacity in dense areas. |
| 21:17.29 | Writchie | (like every other block in Hong Kong or Helsinki) |
| 21:17.50 | mwester | Exactly, that's why without 850, the fact that it has 1900 doesn't really make it better. |
| 21:18.24 | Writchie | the operator want you to have both 1900 and 850 so the channels can be off-loaded. |
| 21:18.40 | Writchie | its not fair to occupy the 850 channels when you are next to a 1900 tower |
| 21:18.53 | Writchie | and they can enforce this if they want to |
| 21:18.55 | mwester | Hmm.. isn't there somewhere in NA where the operator uses both bands for call setup and the call itself? |
| 21:19.27 | Writchie | the MS goes where its told to go |
| 21:19.50 | Writchie | it will scan all enabled bands |
| 21:21.18 | linuxxr | so will 850 mhz cause 900mhz to lagg or other problems interference? |
| 21:21.20 | Writchie | in Hong Kong I had a 30 minute commute to the country and never ever lost coverage - tunnels, between mountains, etc. |
| 21:21.57 | Writchie | the 850 and 900 versions must be different variants (parts only) with the current design AFAIK |
| 21:22.49 | Writchie | while the calypso can technically do quad band it only has one LNA for low-band and requires some funkies to do quad band. |
| 21:23.18 | Writchie | such funkies are not in the present layout/design |
| 21:23.48 | Writchie | more modern RF sections have 5 LNA's, 850/900/1800/1900/2100 |
| 21:24.03 | jelousbuddy | what would happen if there is a hidden camera in my room or your room? |
| 21:24.09 | linuxxr | thats wat we want |
| 21:24.38 | Writchie | and i've seen 7 |
| 21:24.54 | Stephmw | jelousbuddy: ... eh? |
| 21:28.02 | mwester | Stephmw: it's an annoy-bot, I think. Somebody with the permissions needs to ban it. |
| 21:28.20 | jelousbuddy | are you stupid and is it cold and depressing outside when it has stopped snowing in January but snow is still on the ground? |
| 21:29.15 | Stephmw | mwester: *sigh* |
| 21:29.29 | jelousbuddy | is love depressing or how does it feel? |
| 21:29.57 | ajbrun | good plan |
| 21:30.19 | *** join/#openmoko MHazem (n=GoD@62.135.96.207) |
| 21:32.23 | jelousbuddy | any sexy girls/sexy women/sexy females here? |
| 21:32.45 | I-MOD | dude...you're on irc |
| 21:33.40 | I-MOD | mkay...bot |
| 21:33.42 | I-MOD | didn't see that |
| 21:33.51 | ajbrun | 21:30:32 Now ignoring 11jelousbuddy. |
| 21:34.38 | xcasex | hmm. |
| 21:38.39 | jelousbuddy | am i in danger just by existing and being seen by others? |
| 21:40.37 | jelousbuddy | can i be repetitive please? |
| 21:40.44 | jelousbuddy | can i be repetitive please or do the same thing over and over? |
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| 21:42.17 | jelousbuddy | why do i feel about ladies down there? |
| 21:42.50 | linuxxr | yooooo nooossssss its a cop-bot |
| 21:43.56 | jelousbuddy | how many of you re really ignoring me? do you actually do it just not see what i do/say next? thank you |
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| 21:49.20 | rwhitby | interest bot |
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| 21:50.36 | jelousbuddy | is everything OK/alright? |
| 21:52.59 | *** part/#openmoko Ganneff (i=joerg@freenode/staff/debian.joerg) |
| 21:53.12 | ahven | thank you :) |
| 21:53.21 | *** join/#openmoko Ganneff (i=joerg@freenode/staff/debian.joerg) |
| 21:56.32 | linuxxr | tyay |
| 22:00.44 | kinneh | anybody that has taken a look at the contact db (how to edit it off the neo)? |
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| 22:35.53 | ultracool | what is violent and threatening behavior? can jerking movement a fidgeting around counts? |
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| 22:52.22 | zash | kinneh: afaik openmoko uses the same db-format as evolution |
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| 23:14.57 | rwhitby | anyone here with an OM server montone checkout of openembedded that is the stable version, not the bleeding edge version? |
| 23:15.10 | rwhitby | (I need to check the contents of a file for a manual merge) |
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| 23:22.28 | linuxxr | http://buglabs.net/products |
| 23:23.17 | linuxxr | those plugs proly break fast |
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| 23:30.09 | linuxxr | 73 modules omg |
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