IRC log for #openmoko on 20071023

`00:02.27`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.192.57)`
`00:03.44`	`*** join/#openmoko CIA-13 (i=cia@208.69.182.149)`
`00:07.03`	`*** join/#openmoko jleong_ (n=chatzill@cparch01.ecn.purdue.edu)`
`00:08.12`	`jleong_`	`nelson, what kind of capabilities does the current 1973 have?`
`00:08.31`	`mjr`	`you can play nifty games on it`
`00:08.36`	`jleong_`	`basically how manipulable is it?`
`00:08.42`	`SpeedEvil`	`At the moment.`
`00:08.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`IT's a small linux box.`
`00:08.51`	`jleong_`	`what distro?`
`00:08.59`	`nelson`	`jleong_: openmoko`
`00:09.01`	`SpeedEvil`	`Which can run normal desktop software - pretty much.`
`00:09.04`	`nelson`	`produced using openembedded.`
`00:09.08`	`SpeedEvil`	`And has some prototype apps.`
`00:09.17`	`SpeedEvil`	`which implement the phone part of it.`
`00:09.38`	`jleong_`	`nelson, can you explain a little more about openembeded what does that mean`
`00:09.47`	`nelson`	`it's a build system.`
`00:09.50`	`jleong_`	`does it have graphics libraries and such or sdk to develop on it?`
`00:10.04`	`nelson`	`It's Linux running X and gtk.`
`00:10.21`	`jleong_`	`hmm, ok. how does one program or interface with the phone part`
`00:10.27`	`jleong_`	`to make calls etc`
`00:10.31`	`nelson`	`it's a modem. ATDT`
`00:10.40`	`*** join/#openmoko mookid (i=mookid@n00b.name)`
`00:10.49`	`nelson`	`although, rather, I expect there's a demon that you talk to.`
`00:11.00`	`mjr`	`there is the libgsmd library for that. Which talks to the gsmd daemon.`
`00:11.03`	`jleong_`	`nelson, doesn't it support gsm?`
`00:11.08`	`mjr`	`Which isn't very stable at the moment.`
`00:11.12`	`jleong_`	`like sim?`
`00:11.14`	`mjr`	`but anyway, that's how you do it.`
`00:11.15`	`nelson`	`it would be insane if everybody tried to open teh serial port and play with it.`
`00:11.26`	`nelson`	`jleong_: yes, it uses a sim card`
`00:11.45`	`jleong_`	`how much flexability does one have to hack the hardware.. integrate gps and other modules?`
`00:11.56`	`mjr`	`it has gps`
`00:12.30`	`nelson`	`it's a cellphone. It has to be sturdy and not allow ingress of ESD.`
`00:12.34`	`jleong_`	`ah right`
`00:12.38`	`mjr`	`otherwise, not much, but a bit. SpeedEvil knows better...`
`00:12.47`	`nelson`	`It has a USB port, which may or may not support USB OTG.`
`00:13.00`	`jleong_`	`does it interface with things via i2c?`
`00:13.04`	`SpeedEvil`	`nelson: it doesn't`
`00:13.13`	`SpeedEvil`	`nelson: but it can do host mode`
`00:13.17`	`nelson`	`client only?`
`00:13.25`	`nelson`	`Oh, okay, well, THAT doesn't suck.`
`00:13.31`	`SpeedEvil`	`jleong_: there are solderable-to pads on the motherboard, and it's brought out on the debug`
`00:13.35`	`SpeedEvil`	`jleong_: there are solderable-to pads on the motherboard, and it's brought out on the debug connector`
`00:13.41`	`SpeedEvil`	`nelson: no, client/host`
`00:13.48`	`*** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z58ac.z.pppool.de)`
`00:13.57`	`jleong_`	`hmm ahh`
`00:14.09`	`SpeedEvil`	`jleong_: I suggest you look at the wiki.`
`00:14.20`	`SpeedEvil`	`The neo1973 page - and the harware specs`
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`00:15.30`	`jleong_`	`ah ok`
`00:15.42`	`jleong_`	`SpeedEvil, do you have a neo?`
`00:16.05`	`jleong_`	`What kind of things have you done with it? or anybody for that matter? personally modifications`
`00:16.25`	`nelson`	`I think people are trying to get the software to work, and work well.`
`00:16.30`	`SpeedEvil`	`yes, not much, planning to make a hardware accellerometer addon`
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`00:17.10`	`jleong_`	`SpeedEvil, was thinking bought that - so let's say we solder onto the pads. How would we communicate to it via code?`
`00:18.16`	`SpeedEvil`	`jleong_: as you would with any other i2c device.`
`00:18.24`	`jleong_`	`ah ok, so it is i2c`
`00:18.27`	`SpeedEvil`	`Read the source`
`00:18.28`	`*** join/#openmoko merriam (n=merriam@85-211-68-26.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk)`
`00:18.34`	`jleong_`	`ah ok`
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`01:14.45`	`nelson`	`Hmmm..... the "arp pub" method of getting a USB device online isn't mentioned.`
`01:14.50`	`nelson`	`(in the wiki)`
`01:17.07`	`*** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@bas4-ottawa23-1177770380.dsl.bell.ca)`
`01:19.12`	`*** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD953AD29.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`01:21.11`	`*** join/#openmoko eikonos (n=eikonos@S0106001c104ae594.gv.shawcable.net)`
`01:29.35`	`nelson`	`Hmmmm.... the GTA01 has an AGPS chip? Not a real GPS receiver?`
`01:29.45`	`*** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@134.219.164.14)`
`01:34.26`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.192.57)`
`01:36.43`	`*** join/#openmoko prav33n (n=praveen@c-67-164-79-226.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`01:36.56`	`ckuethe`	`GTA01 can do standalone GPS`
`01:37.11`	`ckuethe`	`AGPS just mean that the solver can use external assistance data`
`01:37.21`	`*** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@189.70.76.81)`
`01:41.55`	`nelson`	`Reading Hammerhead/Protocol. Wow, this looks like the GPS receiver is just a radio, and relies on the ARM processor for GPS computations.`
`01:46.50`	`*** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60.241.37.3)`
`01:52.28`	`*** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@122-124-68-118.dynamic.hinet.net)`
`02:01.05`	`*** join/#openmoko Pengu1n (i=7c108a38@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-af7a9088149897e8)`
`02:01.16`	`Pengu1n`	`hi there.`
`02:01.40`	`Pengu1n`	`how do I restart openmoko ui from remote ssh shell ? (today crashed)`
`02:02.07`	`sagacis_`	`Pengu1n: /etc/init.d/xserver-nodm restart`
`02:02.14`	`Pengu1n`	`thax`
`02:02.45`	`sagacis_`	`nelson: Nope. The US ones were watching Heroes`
`02:03.06`	`Pengu1n`	`yeah, we also got some debug info in this way:)`
`02:09.53`	`*** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)`
`02:12.08`	`*** join/#openmoko mwester-road (n=chatzill@nslu2-linux/mwester)`
`02:17.54`	`Pengu1n`	`why I cann't access internet in the neo1973? usb net has been setup. 192.168.0.202 -> 200, resolv.conf has ben set. host iptables -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE.`
`02:18.02`	`*** join/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net)`
`02:18.32`	`sagacis_`	`Pengu1n: can the neo ping the host?`
`02:18.56`	`*** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD953A10F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`02:19.44`	`nelson`	`sagacis_: I have to download it. No NBC for me.`
`02:19.52`	`nelson`	`Pengu1n: hi.`
`02:20.12`	`nelson`	`Pengu1n: how do you get on the Internet?`
`02:21.42`	`Pengu1n`	`through eth0 on my host`
`02:22.30`	`Pengu1n`	`is there any API documents/reference manual for libmokoui2?`
`02:23.05`	`nelson`	`Pengu1n: what does your eth0 connect to?`
`02:23.18`	`nelson`	`Pengu1n: is there a DHCP server`
`02:23.57`	`*** join/#openmoko pezed (n=Miranda@www.cadpro.co.nz)`
`02:24.14`	`Pengu1n`	`no, I can access internet on my host.`
`02:24.39`	`nelson`	Pengu1n: can you run ``route'' on your host and /msg me with the output?
`02:24.46`	`Pengu1n`	`and I can ping from 0.200 to 0.202, and vice vesa`
`02:24.47`	`*** part/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@189.70.76.81)`
`02:25.09`	`sagacis_`	`Pengu1n: You may need a default route on your neo (although it should be there)`
`02:27.02`	`*** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=fredsiba@p54952CBD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`02:27.18`	`Pengu1n`	`It's here already.`
`02:27.36`	`Pengu1n`	`set to 192.168.0.200 (my host)`
`02:28.24`	`Pengu1n`	`echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward`
`02:28.30`	`nelson`	`well, what I did on my machine was to switch to using "real" addresses on my eth0,`
`02:28.33`	`Pengu1n`	`I missed this one:)`
`02:28.58`	`nelson`	`turn on ip_forward, and use sudo arp -i eth0 -s 192.168.1.202 5A:E6:4C:AF:36:26 pub`
`02:29.05`	`Pengu1n`	`Yes, I can access internet from my neo now:) wowo`
`02:29.38`	`nelson`	`cool. Yes, the MASQUERADE is what does it.`
`02:30.27`	`Pengu1n`	`I'm familiar with the NAT, but forgot the must not missed configure: ip_forward:)`
`02:31.44`	`Pengu1n`	`I've upgrade all pkg on my neo to svn trunk, everything same to far fast than before`
`02:32.17`	`*** join/#openmoko Jumb0 (n=Jimmy@c-76-22-221-126.hsd1.tn.comcast.net)`
`02:33.49`	`*** join/#openmoko olv (n=olvaffe@rd.tw.openmoko.org)`
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`02:36.47`	`sagacis_`	`crap. I think I left my neo off yesterday.`
`02:36.54`	`Pengu1n`	`how can I copy a new pkg into qemu, and intall it in the qemu?`
`02:37.40`	`Pengu1n`	`sagacis_ make call to you neo, then you would find it by the ring tone`
`02:38.18`	`sagacis_`	`The problem is if you power off the neo and don't remove the battery, it will drain down too far to boot.`
`02:38.26`	`*** join/#openmoko Moniker42 (n=sean@87-194-119-253.bethere.co.uk)`
`02:38.47`	`sagacis_`	`I was plugged into my computer usb, so I thought it would be safe, but powered down.`
`02:38.53`	`Moniker42`	`hey, i was wondering if there are any plans yet for the design of the phone that comes after GTA02?`
`02:38.56`	`sagacis_`	`Now I can't boot.`
`02:39.44`	`Moniker42`	`i really like the idea, the phone... almost everything about openmoko and the neo1973 but i don't know if i like that big loop for a belt/lanyard :P`
`02:40.07`	`sagacis_`	`Moniker42: It's a mic input/gsm antenna`
`02:40.17`	`Moniker42`	`oh`
`02:40.23`	`sagacis_`	`It's actually a great thumbhold for landscape mode`
`02:40.40`	`Moniker42`	`now that's different...`
`02:40.58`	`Moniker42`	`i thought the phone was just an unnecessary 2-3cm longer for the sake of a lanyard :P`
`02:41.41`	`Moniker42`	`any pictures of the phone with gsm aerial/mic plugged in?`
`02:42.22`	`sagacis`	`Moniker42: I mean the gsm aerial is inside the loop`
`02:42.31`	`Moniker42`	`ah`
`02:42.38`	`sagacis`	`Moniker42: The hole for onboard mic input is inside there, too.`
`02:42.38`	`Moniker42`	`now that makes a lot of sense, now i think about it.`
`02:42.46`	`nelson`	`Hmmmm.... not obvious from the user interface how to exit a program.`
`02:43.03`	`sagacis`	`The lanyard idea is hokey. Who's gonna have their phone flopping about like that?`
`02:43.09`	`Moniker42`	`=)`
`02:43.15`	`*** join/#openmoko romu1us (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net)`
`02:43.18`	`sagacis`	`Somebody with a good source of touch-screens, I guess.`
`02:43.19`	`Moniker42`	`the neo just made my christmas shopping list`
`02:43.22`	`nelson`	`it does seem a little silly.`
`02:43.33`	`Moniker42`	`wait, will i be able to buy it in the UK?`
`02:43.37`	`sagacis`	`Sure.`
`02:43.41`	`sagacis`	`You can buy it anywhere.`
`02:43.50`	`*** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@office.tw.openmoko.org)`
`02:43.50`	`sagacis`	`It's freedom, maaaan....`
`02:44.31`	`sagacis`	`Moniker42: It won't fit.`
`02:45.07`	`Moniker42`	`is there any scope for using the usb port to power peripherals like a small usb camera?`
`02:45.28`	`raster`	`it's unpowered`
`02:45.31`	`raster`	`so - no`
`02:46.15`	`nelson`	`powered USB hub.`
`02:46.56`	`*** join/#openmoko StylusEater (n=adutko@ip70-191-114-7.cl.ri.cox.net)`
`02:46.58`	`raster`	`i guess that would work :)`
`02:47.21`	`Moniker42`	`hmmm`
`02:47.31`	`Moniker42`	`should i get it in orange or black thought? :)`
`02:47.33`	`Moniker42`	`*though`
`02:48.44`	`nelson`	`black`
`02:48.59`	`Moniker42`	`ack, all the phones are black`
`02:49.07`	`Moniker42`	`my phone is black and has been for nearly two years`
`02:50.11`	`StylusEater`	`hi. I've determined my kernel version is 2.6.20-7-moko8... I'm looking to upgrade but I'm not sure if it's "safe" to move to the 20070916 snapshot...`
`03:00.48`	`*** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@h-68-164-2-25.chcgilgm.dynamic.covad.net)`
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`05:09.21`	`mbuf`	`qemu has emulation support for SD/MMC ?`
`05:09.40`	`mbuf`	`or can you emulate/test the Neo images for SD/MMC with qemu?`
`05:17.03`	`CM`	`It does ask for mkdosfs and mtd-utils when you run it, but I don't really know`
`05:17.45`	`mbuf`	`CM, ok`
`05:18.33`	`CM`	`And what do you mean with "images for SD/MMC"? I just put some random files in /media/card :)`
`05:18.52`	`CM`	`Haven't tried in qemu though, it won't boot for me with the latest images`
`05:25.38`	`*** join/#openmoko wooKieface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k511.webspeed.dk)`
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`06:03.50`	`ttneo`	`Had anyone had problem with the SD card controller? I can't seem to get my SD card mounted, regardless what flash images I used`
`06:04.27`	`ttneo`	`this is for a new P1`
`06:05.04`	`ttneo`	`the latest images I used are`
`06:05.07`	`ttneo`	`OpenMoko-scaredycat-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20071021-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2`
`06:05.09`	`ttneo`	`and`
`06:05.24`	`nelson`	`wheeeee! Let's all use different images!`
`06:05.29`	`ttneo`	`uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr2937-r3-neo1973.bin`
`06:05.37`	`*** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@archangel.kolej.mff.cuni.cz)`
`06:05.43`	`nelson`	`I used these and had no problems:`
`06:05.54`	`nelson`	`OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-September-Snapshot-20070916-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2`
`06:06.07`	`nelson`	`uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr2937-r0-fic-gta01.bin`
`06:06.20`	`ttneo`	`I used those too`
`06:06.41`	`ttneo`	`I start to think there may be a problem with the controller`
`06:06.48`	`nelson`	`You see, if we all use different images, then we'll all have different problems, and nothing will get fixed. Mu-hahaha! A great plan for enemies of the OpenMoko.`
`06:07.16`	`nelson`	`(I'm not picking on you; just pointing out that the release management of OpenMoko is severely lacking.`
`06:07.27`	`nelson`	`And that's because OpenEmbedded encourages non-repeatable builds.`
`06:07.27`	`ttneo`	`I agree, for sake of the moko testers`
`06:07.46`	`ttneo`	`there needs to be some type of lock stepped release cycles`
`06:08.13`	`nelson`	`the best thing the OpenMoko folks could do for the project is to stop using CVS head.`
`06:08.30`	`gcb77`	`What hepened to the hang-up button on the dialer?`
`06:09.00`	`gcb77`	`Had to yank out the battery before the TMobile operator came on line :)`
`06:09.05`	`nelson`	`good question! What software are you using? Why, you're using CVS head, of course.`
`06:09.20`	`gcb77`	`I just did an ipkg update/upgrade`
`06:09.35`	`gcb77`	`Was using the 9/16 image`
`06:10.14`	`*** join/#openmoko taneli (i=vahakang@shell.hiit.fi)`
`06:10.27`	`gcb77`	`on the plus side, tones work now`
`06:12.04`	`ttneo`	`besides that I can keep trying different combinations of the images(doubt it will matter), here is errors I got which seems not to happen to others, by searching from all the openmoko lists`
`06:12.40`	`ttneo`	`$ dmesg \| grep mmc`
`06:12.40`	`ttneo`	`<7>mmc_set_power(power_mode=0, vdd=0`
`06:12.40`	`ttneo`	`...`
`06:12.40`	`ttneo`	`<7>mmc_set_power(power_mode=2, vdd=20`
`06:12.40`	`ttneo`	`<6>mmcblk0: mmc0:e624 SU512 495488KiB`
`06:12.40`	`ttneo`	`<6> mmcblk0:<3>mmcblk0: error 1 transferring data`
`06:12.42`	`ttneo`	`<4>end_request: I/O error, dev mmcblk0, sector 0`
`06:12.45`	`ttneo`	`<3>Buffer I/O error on device mmcblk0, logical block 0`
`06:12.46`	`ttneo`	`<3>mmcblk0: error 1 transferring data`
`06:12.48`	`ttneo`	`<4>end_request: I/O error, dev mmcblk0, sector 0`
`06:13.13`	`ttneo`	`so I never had the mmcblk0p1 device created to get the card mounted.`
`06:16.04`	`ttneo`	`I read from a previous post where someone did a mmcinit from the bootloader connection, here is what I got`
`06:16.18`	`ttneo`	`GTA01Bv4 # mmcinit`
`06:16.18`	`ttneo`	`trying to detect SD Card...`
`06:16.18`	`ttneo`	`Manufacturer: 0x03, OEM "SD"`
`06:16.18`	`ttneo`	`Product name: "SU512", revision 8.0`
`06:16.18`	`ttneo`	`Serial number: 281088817`
`06:16.19`	`ttneo`	`Manufacturing date: 8/2007`
`06:16.21`	`ttneo`	`CRC: 0x21, b0 = 1`
`06:16.23`	`ttneo`	`READ_BL_LEN=15, C_SIZE_MULT=7, C_SIZE=3453`
`06:16.25`	`ttneo`	`size = 2329935872`
`06:16.27`	`ttneo`	`mmc_block_read: err SDIDSTA=0x00000024`
`06:16.29`	`ttneo`	`GTA01Bv4 #`
`06:16.48`	`mbuf`	`ttneo, use pastebin.ca, don't flood the channel`
`06:16.51`	`stefan_schmidt`	`~lart ttneo for not using pastebin`
`06:16.51`	`apt`	`takes a rusty axe and swings it violently, taking ttneo's head off for not using pastebin`
`06:20.16`	`*** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X0d3d.x.pppool.de)`
`06:22.29`	`ttneo`	`sorry folks, irc rookie mistake. all the error logs are now at http://pastebin.ca/746475`
`06:22.56`	`ttneo`	`any idea will be greatly appreciated.`
`06:23.01`	`Hopscotch`	`good morning`
`06:23.57`	`*** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFF6DF.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`06:25.10`	`mbuf`	`Hopscotch, good morning`
`06:31.52`	`*** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch)`
`06:32.45`	`*** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host98-171-dynamic.0-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`06:33.10`	`*** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@alcatraz.cendio.se)`
`06:34.54`	`*** join/#openmoko Longfield (n=valentin@138.131.206.172)`
`06:36.22`	`*** join/#openmoko mickey-tw (n=mickeyl@rd.tw.openmoko.org)`
`06:38.40`	`*** join/#openmoko Robwoerle (n=bob@M86c4.m.pppool.de)`
`06:43.57`	`CM`	`~hail ctr+shift+t in firefox`
`06:43.58`	`apt`	`ACTION bows down to ctr+shift+t in firefox and chants, "I'M NOT WORTHY!!"`
`06:45.00`	`mickey-tw`	`yawn`
`06:50.19`	`*** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au)`
`06:56.43`	`*** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at)`
`06:57.20`	`*** join/#openmoko Hokky (n=chatzill@195.1.22.156)`
`06:57.59`	`*** join/#openmoko rmoravci1 (n=rmoravci@setnip01.ericsson.net)`
`07:04.01`	`Batalyx`	`any news on the gps driver?`
`07:06.41`	`CM`	`Batalyx: Depends on what you heard last time ;)`
`07:07.33`	`CM`	`Batalyx: Mickeyl wants to distribute the oabi gllin in a chroot in the next official rootfs release, but the lawyers are not done with their silly papers yet, so nothing can be released.. :(`
`07:07.39`	`Batalyx`	`I heard that they are going to be released. Made me really happy :)`
`07:08.04`	`Batalyx`	`oh... hope they'll get it done`
`07:08.40`	`*** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-85-164.dsl.scarlet.be)`
`07:08.41`	`Batalyx`	`oabi? not eabi? (or do I understand this wrong, wasn't eabi the new abi?)`
`07:10.27`	`alphaone`	`Batalyx: It's oabi with a wrapper so it does work on eabi`
`07:10.33`	`stefan_schmidt`	`hmm, did we broke the icon for the gsm applet?`
`07:10.34`	`stefan_schmidt`	`root@fic-gta01:~$ ** (matchbox-panel-2:1168): DEBUG: gsm_applet_update_signal_strength: signal strength = 17`
`07:10.34`	`stefan_schmidt`	` (matchbox-panel-2:1168): WARNING : Icon "" not found`
`07:10.50`	`alphaone`	`eabi for some reason does not work`
`07:10.55`	`stefan_schmidt`	`And I still have the non-signal icon and not one with some bars`
`07:11.18`	`mickey-tw`	`ya, strange`
`07:11.24`	`mickey-tw`	`that´s broken only since short`
`07:11.26`	`mickey-tw`	`ly`
`07:12.28`	`alphaone`	`Wasn't me. And I have the commit logs to prove it!`
`07:13.53`	`*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)`
`07:15.21`	`oryn`	`I cant get last nights fs image to boot, plus there is no ssh :(`
`07:19.21`	`mickey-tw`	`i won't do anything on the applet until i know about the gsmd status and outlook`
`07:19.36`	`mickey-tw`	`hopefully i can get the gsmd group meeting done tomorrow`
`07:20.30`	`*** join/#openmoko kloeri (i=kloeri@freenode/staff/kloeri)`
`07:22.53`	`*** join/#openmoko mypapit (n=mypapit@pdpc/supporter/active/mypapit)`
`07:24.06`	`*** join/#openmoko atul (n=Atul@202.63.103.2)`
`07:28.50`	`*** join/#openmoko hardskinone (n=hardskin@158.102.66.32)`
`07:29.46`	`*** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl51B66418.pool.t-online.hu)`
`07:31.27`	`*** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@62.8.133.124)`
`07:31.35`	`*** join/#openmoko Zenton (n=vicente@212.166.192.134)`
`07:35.32`	`*** join/#openmoko Maledictus (n=Malebob@f054170160.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`07:35.40`	`*** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-236-193.eunet.yu)`
`07:46.08`	`*** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@79-66-29-98.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`07:53.49`	`*** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@dyn167185.wlan.jku.at)`
`07:55.40`	`*** join/#openmoko DarkFoxDK (n=martin@0110ds1-ro.0.fullrate.dk)`
`07:57.26`	`*** join/#openmoko disguy__35 (i=disguy__@gateway/tor/x-1c170650867b8956)`
`08:00.53`	`DarkFoxDK`	`hmm, it might just be my oppinion... but the "Delete All" screenshot is a bit irrellevant... it should be something like the dialer instead > http://openmoko.com/products-neo-base-02-screenshots.html`
`08:01.43`	`DarkFoxDK`	`considering that the battery low screen is almost exactly the same`
`08:02.11`	`CM`	`DarkFoxDK: Well, that whole page should be updated`
`08:02.21`	`CM`	`It looks totally different now`
`08:02.24`	`DarkFoxDK`	`ok`
`08:02.57`	`DarkFoxDK`	`any screenshots of the new interface?`
`08:03.25`	`CM`	`DarkFoxDK: Some are here: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/index.php?page=6`
`08:04.04`	`CM`	`But there's all kinds of screenshots there`
`08:04.12`	`mickey-tw`	`hmm`
`08:04.13`	`DarkFoxDK`	`mmmmnice`
`08:04.25`	`mickey-tw`	for some reason i don`t get the openmoko watermark on my mediaplayer
`08:04.37`	`mickey-tw`	`do you see this also on the device?`
`08:04.43`	`mickey-tw`	`or is it too subtle and only appearing on scap`
`08:04.44`	`mickey-tw`	`?`
`08:04.59`	`CM`	`mickey-tw: What watermark?`
`08:05.02`	`*** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@ipanema.nitnet.com.br)`
`08:05.09`	`CM`	`You mean in the background?`
`08:05.11`	`mickey-tw`	`ya`
`08:05.14`	`mickey-tw`	`mokoman`
`08:05.21`	`mickey-tw`	`don´t see this in my build`
`08:05.47`	`CM`	`Hmm.. I think I had it on my Neo`
`08:06.00`	`*** join/#openmoko Partizan (n=alex@port-85-adslby-pool36.infonet.by)`
`08:06.02`	`CM`	`DarkFoxDK: Screenshot of the mediaplayer: http://claesmogren.com/~cm/neo/Screenshot-6.png`
`08:06.14`	`alphaone`	`Looks like it is too faint to be visible from certain angles.`
`08:06.21`	`alphaone`	`Even on my notebook`
`08:06.36`	`DarkFoxDK`	`:)`
`08:09.37`	`*** join/#openmoko Bernte (i=schoelle@monty.inf.ethz.ch)`
`08:09.50`	`DarkFoxDK`	`so, i was wondering, will the phone be shipped with navigation software and maps, or will i have to download/buy those seperate?`
`08:11.04`	`DarkFoxDK`	`i am guessing that with at least the maps, i have to get some seperate, as the open source maps in denmark is... well... less than complete`
`08:11.48`	`CM`	`DarkFoxDK: I'm hoping there will be some nice OpenStreetmap integration :)`
`08:11.56`	`DarkFoxDK`	`ok :)`
`08:14.33`	`DarkFoxDK`	`google maps integration could be nice too... although a bit heavy on bandwidth...`
`08:17.02`	`*** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@147.87.129.235)`
`08:17.12`	`SpeedEvil`	`DarkFoxDK: Have you considered moving to the netherlands? Free maps there :)`
`08:17.31`	`SpeedEvil`	`As to openstreetmap.`
`08:17.33`	`DarkFoxDK`	`heh :)`
`08:18.03`	`SpeedEvil`	`There has not been much interest in developing routing software for it, as in 99% or so of all countries it's not been usable for routing.`
`08:18.24`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03mickey * r3250 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard-2-qvga/gtk-2.0/ (gtktreeview treeview/ treeview/header.png): openmoko-theme-standard-2-qvga: catch up w/ VGA treeview theming`
`08:18.40`	`SpeedEvil`	`Now, in the netherlands and USA, there is now mostly complete coverage`
`08:20.05`	`emdete`	`SpeedEvil: there are not that much streets in the netherlands... :D`
`08:21.13`	`DarkFoxDK`	`well, you could allways get "free" maps. question is if its legal...`
`08:22.02`	`SpeedEvil`	`I was meaning freely distributable without legal problems.`
`08:22.12`	`SpeedEvil`	`I have used google-maps over GPRS.`
`08:22.18`	`SpeedEvil`	`It's not exactly quick`
`08:22.36`	`*** join/#openmoko Pengu1n (i=7c108a38@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-371941c0fd490bac)`
`08:22.38`	`DarkFoxDK`	`and not exactly cheap, if you pay-per-mb`
`08:22.49`	`Pengu1n`	`hi, there.`
`08:22.56`	`SpeedEvil`	`For me once I hit 136K/1 pound, it caps for the day.`
`08:23.13`	`Pengu1n`	`openmoko-today missed some source files in the svn trunk: today-clock.[hc]`
`08:24.14`	`DarkFoxDK`	`seems like there is a possibility of obtaining a map legaly though`
`08:24.15`	`DarkFoxDK`	`http://www.gpsy.com/maps/`
`08:24.48`	`Pengu1n`	`chris is not here?`
`08:25.23`	`SpeedEvil`	`DarkFoxDK: you mean pay-for-maps?`
`08:25.30`	`DarkFoxDK`	`exactly`
`08:25.50`	`SpeedEvil`	`You can actually buy GPS navigators with no maps.`
`08:25.59`	`SpeedEvil`	`Which actually would be really cool to put OM on.`
`08:34.09`	`*** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@251.9.39-62.rev.gaoland.net)`
`08:36.37`	`SpeedEvil`	`Hmm. http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5179`
`08:37.39`	`*** join/#openmoko _buz (n=buz@dhcp-204-119-vpn.unizh.ch)`
`08:42.15`	`SpeedEvil`	`(GPSs without map) http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.8545`
`08:42.55`	`CM`	`Pengu1n: No, but add a bug to buzilla about it :)`
`08:44.25`	`Pengu1n`	`Is it worth to fill a bug repport?:)`
`08:44.52`	`CM`	`It's quick, and it's the best way for the devs to figure out something is wrong :)`
`08:45.18`	`*** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-200-177.37-151.net24.it)`
`08:45.21`	`CM`	`Pengu1n: Or poke XorA\|gone or mickey-tw about it here.. ;)`
`08:45.49`	`Pengu1n`	`:)`
`08:46.04`	`mickey-tw`	`wats up?`
`08:46.23`	`*** join/#openmoko cb30 (n=unkdfnow@dsl-245-169-167.telkomadsl.co.za)`
`08:47.12`	`*** join/#openmoko grasu (n=christia@fire2.tngtech.com)`
`08:47.26`	`Pengu1n`	`mickey-tw, I cann't build the openmoko-today2 svn trunk, because there some files missed. today-clock.c\|h`
`08:47.45`	`mickey-tw`	`hmm`
`08:49.42`	`*** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@sr-fw1.router.uk.clara.net)`
`08:50.05`	`*** join/#openmoko rajivr (n=rajivr@61.4.178.178)`
`08:50.21`	`*** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X05d9.x.pppool.de)`
`08:50.49`	`mickey-tw`	`yes`
`08:50.50`	`mickey-tw`	`missing`
`08:50.53`	`mickey-tw`	`not much i can do about :)`
`08:50.57`	`mickey-tw`	`i don´t have these files`
`08:53.42`	`hrw`	`mickey-tw: authors are not yet at work`
`08:54.46`	`mickey-tw`	`lazy bastards`
`08:54.48`	`mickey-tw`	`:D`
`09:01.02`	`XorA`	`hrw: tell them get to work or we phone them at 4am :-D`
`09:01.15`	`mickey-tw`	`right. given my new timezone i can do that`
`09:01.20`	`mickey-tw`	`good morning XorA`
`09:01.33`	`stefan_schmidt`	`mickey-tw: Not really... ;)`
`09:02.48`	`mickey-tw`	`well, literally`
`09:07.37`	`abraxa_`	`mickey-tw: Today builds fine if you comment the files out in autoconf.ac`
`09:07.47`	`abraxa_`	`err configure.ac`
`09:08.24`	`mickey-tw`	`ah`
`09:16.01`	`cdbot2`	`* * OM Bug 955 has been created by stefan(AT)openmoko.org`
`09:16.02`	`cdbot2`	`* * Icon about signal level gets not displayed`
`09:16.03`	`cdbot2`	`* * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=955`
`09:22.12`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03mickey * r3251 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/daemons/neod/src/buttonactions.c:`
`09:22.13`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: neod: short click on AUX now toggles showing today`
`09:22.13`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: (instead of previously just showing it unconditionally)`
`09:23.10`	`alphaone`	`yay :-)`
`09:23.51`	`*** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lumison.wolfsonmicro.com)`
`09:24.30`	`abraxa_`	`Wish I were in .tw, too`
`09:24.37`	`abraxa_`	`Looks like you guys have lots of fun there ;)`
`09:25.02`	`mickey-tw`	`yeah`
`09:25.15`	`mickey-tw`	`it´s work, but fun as well`
`09:25.39`	`mickey-tw`	`as long as you like your coworkers and what you are doing, work is pretty fun`
`09:25.44`	`abraxa_`	`"it's work, but fun as hell"`
`09:25.45`	`abraxa_`	`;)`
`09:25.49`	`mickey-tw`	`hehe`
`09:25.58`	`stefan_schmidt`	`abraxa_: But in the night we are dancing nude on the tables in the office`
`09:26.21`	`abraxa_`	`With some nice FIC-paid girls, I hope`
`09:26.39`	`abraxa_`	`Ah crud, shouldn't have said that`
`09:26.48`	`stefan_schmidt`	`abraxa_: No really. FIC just not pays enough`
`09:27.02`	`abraxa_`	`Maybe your girlfriends are list... ah okay`
`09:27.08`	`stefan_schmidt`	`heh`
`09:27.24`	`stefan_schmidt`	`She is not on IRC. :)`
`09:28.03`	`abraxa_`	`1:0 for you`
`09:28.16`	`abraxa_`	`If mine were I wouldn't get anything done`
`09:28.30`	`*** join/#openmoko Maledictus (n=Malebob@f054216207.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`09:30.29`	`*** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69)`
`09:31.44`	`mickey-tw`	`hehe`
`09:31.54`	`mickey-tw`	`mine hates computers`
`09:32.08`	`mickey-tw`	`she needs to work using them, but outside work she almost never touches`
`09:32.11`	`mickey-tw`	`computers`
`09:32.11`	`ScaredyCat`	`http://www.engadget.com/2007/10/19/eye-fis-2gb-sd-wireless-card-hits-the-fcc/`
`09:33.37`	`abraxa_`	`"google stalk" as in... entering your name and seeing what comes up?`
`09:34.09`	`abraxa_`	`CM: Is it time for minors to leave the channel? ;)`
`09:34.25`	`CM`	`abraxa_: :P :D`
`09:34.39`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: thats it yes`
`09:35.08`	`CM`	`Well, she's a nurse, but also have a full body massage diploma. ;)`
`09:35.15`	`*** join/#openmoko lalo (n=lalo@sourcemage/mage/lalo)`
`09:35.58`	`abraxa_`	`XorA: looks at bugzilla... time to see what does come up`
`09:37.03`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03chris * r3252 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/Makefile.am):`
`09:37.03`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/Makefile.am:`
`09:37.03`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Revert change that I didn't mean to commit`
`09:38.43`	`abraxa_`	`XorA: http://profiles.friendster.com/graemegreg ...rofl`
`09:40.14`	`mickey-tw`	`hrw: you´re at home or in the uk officeß`
`09:40.15`	`mickey-tw`	`?`
`09:40.22`	`mickey-tw`	`could you ask chris to join IRC, if so`
`09:40.25`	`CM`	`abraxa_: Hehe`
`09:40.28`	`mickey-tw`	`[so being the uk office]`
`09:40.56`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: heh heh`
`09:41.56`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: I wonder if I should steak his life`
`09:42.00`	`hrw`	`mickey-tw: home`
`09:42.13`	`mickey-tw`	`greetings to Ania`
`09:42.17`	`mickey-tw`	`how´s she doing?`
`09:42.50`	`XorA`	`steal`
`09:43.32`	`hrw`	`mickey-tw: quite ok, but has to stay in bed for most of time`
`09:43.38`	`CM`	`XorA: Bah, roast him instead ;)`
`09:44.15`	`*** join/#openmoko dread (n=madmas@xdsl-87-79-220-142.netcologne.de)`
`09:45.42`	`blindcoder`	`abraxa_: what's so funny about that site?`
`09:45.53`	`blindcoder`	`or i this one of this web-2.0-thingies that I justdon'tget?`
`09:46.48`	`CM`	`blindcoder: XorA = Graeme Gregory`
`09:47.07`	`CM`	`blindcoder: But not 16, and not from asia ;)`
`09:47.17`	`blindcoder`	`aah`
`09:47.20`	`XorA`	`in fact exactly 2x16 :-D`
`09:47.30`	`CM`	`Twice the man! :P`
`09:49.37`	`hrw`	`mickey-tw: when you plan to work on having new generation of lauers?`
`09:49.45`	`*** join/#openmoko nepumuck (n=nepumuck@dslb-088-066-058-110.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`09:50.23`	`mickey-tw`	`hrw: we talked about it during our vacation. a lot (of talk). i think we are almost convinced to do it. then probably working on it starting mid 2008 :)`
`09:51.24`	`XorA`	`mickey-tw: stop project managing everything :-D`
`09:53.06`	`stefan_schmidt`	`XorA: You need a good schedule for such things. Minutes based. ;)`
`09:53.41`	`hrw`	`mickey-tw: gratulations then`
`09:53.52`	`mickey-tw`	`heh`
`09:53.55`	`mickey-tw`	`thanks, but lets see`
`09:53.58`	`mickey-tw`	`XorA: :D`
`09:54.09`	`mickey-tw`	`word is on the street i need to work more product-oriented`
`09:54.09`	`*** join/#openmoko mypapit (n=mypapit@pdpc/supporter/active/mypapit)`
`09:54.20`	`stefan_schmidt`	`mickey-tw: for sure`
`09:55.04`	`stefan_schmidt`	`XorA: To late. Already dropped a mail to your GF.`
`09:56.17`	`*** join/#openmoko Partizan (n=alex@port-141-adslby-pool39.infonet.by)`
`09:56.58`	`abraxa_`	`XorA: Be strong. You can withstand the pressure ;)`
`09:57.13`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03mickey * r3253 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokopanelui2/libmokopanelui/moko-panel-applet.c: moko-panel-applet.c: add code to debug recent gsm icon breakage`
`09:57.51`	`XorA`	`damn kids would steal my lego :-(`
`09:58.23`	`CM`	`XorA: Amen`
`09:58.31`	`Gismo_C`	`:)`
`09:59.09`	`*** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@222-154-185-81.jetstream.xtra.co.nz)`
`09:59.24`	`XorA`	`my lego advent calendar arrived today all the way from Germany`
`09:59.50`	`alphaone`	`XorA: Have you been in legoland yet? That's really cool.`
`09:59.55`	`alphaone`	`The one in Denmark`
`10:00.20`	`XorA`	`alphaone: only the one in Windsor UK so far`
`10:00.36`	`ewon`	`morning`
`10:00.43`	`XorA`	`alphaone: for some reason Denmark from Scotland is a massive journay`
`10:00.46`	`stefan_schmidt`	`XorA: You could go there with a small child...`
`10:01.03`	`alphaone`	`XorA: Damn instable wormholes`
`10:01.32`	`alphaone`	`Haven't been to the one in Windsor so I can't compare`
`10:02.03`	`stefan_schmidt`	`alphaone: There are places you never were until now? wowo`
`10:04.01`	`XorA`	`alphaone: Windsor one is a bit wierd for me, I was there as a kid when it was a zoo, and its still pretty similar layout`
`10:04.39`	`*** join/#openmoko Agiofws (n=agiofws@85.72.74.192)`
`10:04.44`	`Agiofws`	`hello can someone tell me the difference between Openmoko and Qtopia ?`
`10:05.12`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: short version: openmoko use X11, qtopia do not`
`10:05.12`	`abraxa_`	`Agiofws: You know GNOME? You know KDE? There you go ;)`
`10:05.25`	`Agiofws`	`yes i do`
`10:05.39`	`Agiofws`	`so open moko is a GUI ?`
`10:05.40`	`hrw`	`abraxa_: its more then gnome<>kde`
`10:05.50`	`mjr`	`openmoko is a distribution, but also an application stack`
`10:06.03`	`*** join/#openmoko _buz (n=buz@dhcp-204-119-vpn.unizh.ch)`
`10:06.03`	`abraxa_`	`hrw: Of course, hence the smiley :)`
`10:06.20`	`Agiofws`	`a gui application stack ?`
`10:06.31`	`Agiofws`	`whats it got to do with cell phones ?`
`10:07.02`	`Agiofws`	`is qtopia a gui aswell ?`
`10:07.16`	`mjr`	`cell phones whose user interface is entirely composed of gui applications?`
`10:07.18`	`mjr`	`you tell me...`
`10:07.27`	`mjr`	`and yes it is, in effect`
`10:07.41`	`mudyc`	`Agiofws: Qtopia is a GUI widget toolkit wherein openmoko is a proejct which aims to provide an open hardware and software for cellphone`
`10:08.24`	`Agiofws`	`ok something like a linux distro specialized for cell phones ?`
`10:08.26`	`Vegar`	`openmoko is only the software stack`
`10:08.32`	`Vegar`	`yes, like a distro`
`10:08.48`	`mjr`	`in fact it's exactly a distro`
`10:08.48`	`Agiofws`	`under rthe GPL licience ...`
`10:09.03`	`mjr`	`GPL, LGPL, X11, BSD, yes`
`10:09.08`	`Agiofws`	`ok`
`10:09.41`	`Agiofws`	`so say ia havea cell phone .... does it depend on the H/w if i can get open moko on it ?`
`10:09.50`	`mjr`	`obviously yes`
`10:09.59`	`*** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@dre84.lss.supelec.fr)`
`10:10.27`	`Agiofws`	`so what h/w is compatible for openmoko ?`
`10:10.34`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: as long as your hardware runs linux it can runu openmoko`
`10:10.51`	`hrw`	`and has screen ofcourse ;)`
`10:11.04`	`Agiofws`	`can i run it on my motorola razr v3x`
`10:11.16`	`mjr`	`Agiofws, maybe, if you port it :]`
`10:11.19`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: does it run linux?`
`10:11.40`	`mjr`	`OpenMoko is currently geared towards the FIC Neo1973, unsurprisingly`
`10:12.04`	`mjr`	`people have made prelim ports to some Palms, iPaqs and HTCs at least, iirc`
`10:12.12`	`Agiofws`	`yes but will it pay off ? maybe openmoko is to heavy for it ?`
`10:12.12`	`hrw`	`mjr: and EZX and HTC phones`
`10:12.18`	`*** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@toi.yeu.phu.nu)`
`10:12.23`	`Xx13`	`it does run on some motorolas...`
`10:12.29`	`Agiofws`	`kk`
`10:13.03`	`_buz`	`openmoko on a tytn II would be neat`
`10:13.55`	`Agiofws`	`why doesn't Troltechs green phone use open moko but instead use Qtopia ? is that another specialized cell phone linux distro ?`
`10:14.04`	`*** join/#openmoko Partizan (n=alex@port-219-adslby-pool42.infonet.by)`
`10:14.15`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: because Qtopia is Trolltech product`
`10:14.20`	`ewon`	`yes.`
`10:14.22`	`hrw`	`they make money on it`
`10:14.23`	`ewon`	`what hrw said.`
`10:14.41`	`ewon`	`counter`
`10:14.51`	`hrw`	`there are 'many' phones on market (asia mostly) with qtopia already in use`
`10:14.57`	`ewon`	`really?`
`10:15.00`	`ewon`	`interesting`
`10:15.10`	`hrw`	`ewon: atleast thats what TT say ;)`
`10:15.17`	`ewon`	`heh :)`
`10:15.28`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03mickey * r3254 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokopanelui2/ (ChangeLog libmokopanelui/moko-panel-applet.c):`
`10:15.28`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: libmokopanelui2: strdup the string that gets passed from outside the`
`10:15.28`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: glib mainloop to the inside. should fix recent icon breakage in gsm panel`
`10:15.31`	`Agiofws`	`ok`
`10:15.33`	`ewon`	`pity no stack ever came out for the Dv007, looks like a nice phone`
`10:15.37`	`hrw`	`ewon: many motorolas used it but limited user ability to install soft`
`10:15.45`	`ewon`	`hrw: ah, ok`
`10:15.56`	`Agiofws`	`whats the advatage of having opensource on a cell phone can you give me an example ?`
`10:16.12`	`ewon`	`porting of applications`
`10:16.25`	`mjr`	`Agiofws, the same as on a desktop`
`10:16.30`	`ewon`	`instead of relying on some retarded j2me VM, you can write your code in C, as god intended`
`10:16.33`	`Agiofws`	`and which companies willopen there specs so you can install linux on them i take it they are feeeling threatend`
`10:16.41`	`mickey-tw`	`openess means no one can control the platform. very useful for solution providers / vertical markets.`
`10:16.43`	`ewon`	`meh, not really`
`10:16.53`	`ewon`	`I reckon we have a long way to go before nokia gets antsy`
`10:16.58`	`mjr`	`ewon, yeah`
`10:17.23`	`Stephmw`	`ewon: C?? God obviously wrote in assembly.`
`10:17.25`	`Agiofws`	`same as on desktop can you give me an example ?`
`10:17.31`	`_buz`	`ewon: i'm still wondering why nokia doesnt put GSM into N810`
`10:17.41`	`mjr`	`Agiofws, anyway, as said, the project is geared for the Neo1973, which is made pretty much to run OpenMoko. Others may adopt if they choose, we'll see.`
`10:17.44`	`ewon`	`_buz: I thought the very same thing.`
`10:17.48`	`hrw`	`_buz: to sell more phones`
`10:17.59`	`_buz`	`hrw: like nokia cares what form factor your phone is in`
`10:18.05`	`ewon`	`Stephmw: according to xkcd, it was supposed to be written in lisp, but ended up being hacked together in perl :)`
`10:18.08`	`hrw`	`_buz: probably one part of nokia makes phones and other makes tablets`
`10:18.12`	`Agiofws`	`<PROTECTED>`
`10:18.23`	`Agiofws`	`is that a cell phone vendor ?`
`10:18.23`	`Stephmw`	`ewon: clearly, He has a sense of humour`
`10:18.30`	`ewon`	`Stephmw: indeed.`
`10:18.41`	`mjr`	`Agiofws, it's a phone. From FIC.`
`10:18.42`	`ewon`	`Agiofws: that's the hardware openmoko currently runs on`
`10:18.57`	`mjr`	`and if you don't know about the Neo, you really should read up a bit more independently`
`10:19.17`	`Agiofws`	`so i assume that you could use mplayer to whatch you videos on you cell phone ?`
`10:19.22`	`ewon`	`if the GTA03 had a slide out keyboard like the n810, I may very well spontaneously combust with joy.`
`10:19.27`	`ewon`	`Agiofws: yes.`
`10:19.29`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: yes`
`10:19.44`	`ewon`	`Agiofws: there is a video on youtube showing mplayer running on the phone, iirc`
`10:19.47`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: go to http://wiki.openmoko.org/ and spend some time on reading`
`10:19.58`	`Agiofws`	`or even use kismet on your wifi can embeded in you cell p hone ?`
`10:20.03`	`ewon`	`yes.`
`10:20.13`	`Agiofws`	`kk`
`10:20.16`	`abraxa_`	`Stephmw / ewon: Clearly, http://www.xkcd.com/224/ is right.`
`10:20.18`	`ewon`	`it even has an atheros chipset, so packet injection should be possible`
`10:20.43`	`Agiofws`	`the thing is that i doubt it that vendors will allow linux to run on there devices`
`10:20.45`	`mjr`	`ewon, note that it's different from the desk/laptop atheros chipsets`
`10:21.08`	`ewon`	`mjr: true, but I presume the HAL atheros uses will be similar?`
`10:21.10`	`mjr`	`(I don't know what the ar6k supports, but thought I'd make sure you knew that)`
`10:21.11`	`Agiofws`	`and what about iphone can linux run on that ?`
`10:21.25`	`mjr`	`ewon, the HAL-equivalent for the 6k is in firmware`
`10:21.29`	`ewon`	`oh, cock.`
`10:21.35`	`ewon`	`in that case all bets are off :)`
`10:21.46`	`hrw`	`Agiofws: if someone will port linux to iphone..`
`10:22.43`	`raster`	`pffft`
`10:22.50`	`raster`	`iphone schmiphone`
`10:24.01`	`raster`	`seriously`
`10:24.08`	`raster`	`its nice industrial design`
`10:24.13`	`raster`	`if you like apples style`
`10:24.14`	`raster`	`hw not bad`
`10:24.17`	`raster`	`but its not open`
`10:24.20`	`raster`	`not "hackable"`
`10:24.23`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03chris * r3255 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (5 files in 2 dirs):`
`10:24.23`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * configure.ac:`
`10:24.24`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/Makefile.am:`
`10:24.24`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/today-main.c: (set_time_idle), (today_create_home_page),`
`10:24.24`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: (main):`
`10:24.24`	`raster`	`you wont get long term support`
`10:24.25`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/today.h:`
`10:24.27`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Use libjana-gtk/libjana-ecal and put an analog clock on the main screen`
`10:24.35`	`raster`	`just nasty hacks that happen to work- until a hw revision or something else`
`10:25.08`	`Xx13`	`someone will eventially put linux on iphone, but it won't happen soon`
`10:25.18`	`Robot101`	`a never ending cat and mouse game, and in nature the mouse usually ends up getting eaten or ripped in two... :P`
`10:25.19`	`abraxa_`	`<Apple Fanboi> ...but they're releasing an SDK!`
`10:25.47`	`ewon`	`you guy's see maddox's review of the iphone?`
`10:25.55`	`ewon`	`s/guy's/guys/`
`10:25.56`	`Stephmw`	`<SDK>Browser+iTextEdit</SDK>`
`10:26.06`	`Agiofws`	`if i don't know C but i do know linux should i purchase ?`
`10:26.28`	`Agiofws`	`are there ready example apps out there to install compile or what ever /?`
`10:26.31`	`raster`	`purchase a neo?`
`10:27.06`	`Stephmw`	`Agiofws: tbh, it sounds like it could be a little early for you`
`10:27.38`	`raster`	`too early`
`10:27.45`	`raster`	`if you are into hacking low level stuff`
`10:27.53`	`raster`	`or buildign entire user environments from the ground up`
`10:27.55`	`raster`	`now is a good time`
`10:28.09`	`raster`	`if you just want to make high level apps/toys/games/trinkets`
`10:28.11`	`raster`	`it can wait`
`10:28.12`	`Xx13`	`Agiofws: it is not yet at the stage where it can be easily used as a phone ;)`
`10:28.47`	`Agiofws`	`is the phone workingthough can you do simple tasks like phone someone ?`
`10:29.00`	`mjr`	`not reliably, no`
`10:29.16`	`Agiofws`	`why not ? no s/w yet ?`
`10:29.22`	`Jiten`	`the phone functinality doesn't seem to be a priority.`
`10:29.25`	`Xx13`	`hopefully soon`
`10:29.27`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03mickey * r3256 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/panel-plugins/openmoko-panel-gsm/ (ChangeLog src/openmoko-panel-gsm.c): openmoko-panel-gsm: update the panel icon once we receive a connection event`
`10:29.34`	`*** join/#openmoko rd__ (n=dr@202.71.102.186)`
`10:29.54`	`Jiten`	`except that it looks like it might be now. Someone is actually doing something related.`
`10:30.13`	`Xx13`	`?`
`10:30.21`	`mjr`	`Agiofws, yes, it's a (set of) software issue(s)`
`10:30.31`	`nepumuck`	`ewon: can you post a link to madoxx review?`
`10:30.40`	`Jiten`	`Xx13: that commit message just now.`
`10:30.55`	`mjr`	`Jiten, indeed, go mickey`
`10:31.00`	`Jiten`	`nice timing mickey :)`
`10:31.43`	`Xx13`	`heh, like i said, very soon now ;)`
`10:32.29`	`*** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host98-171-dynamic.0-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`10:32.34`	`Jiten`	`the wonders of open development process :)`
`10:32.43`	`Xx13`	`i told my dad, i'll call him in a month, he was sceptical ;)`
`10:33.03`	`mudyc`	`how is the PhoneKit doing?`
`10:33.19`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: why is media player so jumpy when it only appears to use about 33% cpu`
`10:33.32`	`Agiofws`	`so i assume the Qtopia is more mature than open moko ?`
`10:34.16`	`Agiofws`	`XorA, codecs ?`
`10:35.21`	`Agiofws`	`but as i can see in screen shots the gui is ready`
`10:35.28`	`Jiten`	`Agiofws: the last I checked, the phone was mostly usable with qtopia.`
`10:35.30`	`abraxa_`	`XorA: It's not jumpfy for me, however I haven't tried with a recent rootfs - maybe the settings mickey chose for the pulsesink are colliding with the settings the player forces... I'll look into it, thanks`
`10:35.49`	`Jiten`	`only reports from others since I don't have a neo myself`
`10:36.00`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: it seems to pause for short periods, and occasionally you get a really distorted chunk`
`10:36.14`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: I have have to investigate more later`
`10:37.26`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: sound on Neo is stunning compared to my HTC wizard though :-)`
`10:37.32`	`*** join/#openmoko gwicke (n=Gabriel_@91.65.57.234)`
`10:37.36`	`abraxa_`	`XorA: How so?`
`10:38.05`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: its loud, not tinny`
`10:38.20`	`abraxa_`	`Ahh, yep :)`
`10:38.34`	`abraxa_`	`And let me know if/when you go about investigating, I'd like to assist`
`10:39.13`	`Agiofws`	`Jiten, you mean neo1973 was running on Qtopia ?`
`10:39.41`	`Agiofws`	`Jiten, you run yours on what ?`
`10:40.18`	`zash`	`hardware on software ftw`
`10:40.32`	`Jiten`	`Agiofws: I just finished saying I don't have one (my last line actually)`
`10:42.21`	`*** join/#openmoko Cyorxamp (n=Cyorxamp@212.57.232.254)`
`10:42.34`	`Jiten`	`Agiofws: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Qtopia_on_Neo_1973`
`10:47.17`	`mickey-tw`	`ok, the icon bug has been fixed`
`10:47.21`	`mickey-tw`	`i introduced it`
`10:47.23`	`mickey-tw`	`:D`
`10:48.21`	`abraxa_`	`Icon bug?`
`10:48.22`	`mickey-tw`	`(mediaplayer) works almost without stutters here`
`10:48.27`	`abraxa_`	`Which one? ;)`
`10:48.27`	`mickey-tw`	`gsm icon was not getting updated`
`10:48.30`	`abraxa_`	`oh`
`10:49.34`	`mickey-tw`	`seriously`
`10:49.39`	`mickey-tw`	`whips and stuff`
`10:50.03`	`abraxa_`	`haha awesome`
`10:50.24`	`*** part/#openmoko sixfeet (i=sixfeet@p5484D885.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`10:53.24`	`*** join/#openmoko gordonsyme (n=gordon@62.231.57.138)`
`10:54.00`	`*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)`
`10:54.45`	`Agiofws`	`did you know this`
`10:54.48`	`Agiofws`	`Please note: Trolltech has sold out of Qtopia Greenphones and will not be producing more. To purchase phone hardware for Qtopia development, Trolltech suggests Open Moko's Neo 1973.`
`10:54.58`	`ewon`	`nice`
`10:55.06`	`Robot101`	`ehe`
`10:55.09`	`raster`	`yum yum`
`10:55.13`	`Agiofws`	`wonder why that happened`
`10:56.42`	`CoreDump`	`that is unfortunate`
`11:01.00`	`abraxa_`	`stefan_schmidt: Can I use the 7 patches you posted to the hardware list or did you update/merge them in the meanwhile?`
`11:01.08`	`abraxa_`	`(regarding QVGA)`
`11:02.03`	`mickey-tw`	`http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/eb2417ce2af500534379dc22cd3a455e.png`
`11:02.06`	`stefan_schmidt`	`abraxa_: Patches are already in the latest patchset in our svn`
`11:03.15`	`hrw`	`mickey-tw: sux`
`11:05.31`	`*** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be)`
`11:07.23`	`*** part/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net)`
`11:07.26`	`mbuf`	`if a GPL code says "All Rights Reserved", can we quote it and still enhance it, and release it under GPL?`
`11:08.14`	`alphaone`	`All rights reserved under the terms of the GPL`
`11:08.18`	`robtaylor`	`mbuf: if it says "All Rights Reserved", its not distributable`
`11:08.22`	`Robot101`	`mbuf: it sounds like the author wasn't thinking... if it says all rights reserved, it's not GPL...`
`11:08.27`	`robtaylor`	`mbuf: apply cluestick to author`
`11:08.31`	`Robot101`	`mbuf: you should contact the author and get them to correct it`
`11:08.35`	`Robot101`	`lol, cluestick. yes :)`
`11:08.40`	`robtaylor`	`heh :)`
`11:09.46`	`mbuf`	`Robot101, robtaylor ok`
`11:09.47`	`mbuf`	`Robot101, Robot101 in libgsmd-tool.c`
`11:09.50`	`mbuf`	`robtaylor, in libgsmd-tool.c`
`11:10.16`	`robtaylor`	`mbuf: bot a websvn link to that?`
`11:10.19`	`robtaylor`	`*got`
`11:11.27`	`mbuf`	`robtaylor, where do i look? it is in openmoko/trunk/src/target/gsm/src/util directory`
`11:13.14`	`robtaylor`	`Robot101,mbuf: maybe Harald thinks that the gpl following the all rights reserved' implies a releasing of he rights he's previously reserved?! shrug`
`11:14.03`	`mbuf`	`robtaylor, so its ok to modify it and release it under GPL, right?`
`11:14.13`	`abraxa_`	`stefan_schmidt: Ahh, nice. Can you give me a hint on how to switch terminal and enable graphics mode on it? The ioctl/termio man pages aren't too straightforward in that regard`
`11:14.27`	`mbuf`	`robtaylor, will shoot an e-mail, anyways`
`11:15.03`	`cjb_ie`	`i would have read it as meaning "i'm releasing it under GPL, but i still reserve the right to do whatever else i want with it"`
`11:15.09`	`cjb_ie`	`however IANAL :)`
`11:15.11`	`robtaylor`	`mbuf: Yep, certainly ask for a clarification from the copyright holder`
`11:15.24`	`mbuf`	`robtaylor, thanks`
`11:16.48`	`robtaylor`	`http://homepages.tesco.net/~J.deBoynePollard/FGA/law-copyright-all-rights-reserved.html`
`11:16.51`	`robtaylor`	`interesting!`
`11:17.08`	`stefan_schmidt`	`abraxa_: chvt #`
`11:17.28`	`stefan_schmidt`	`abraxa_: X is on 3 IIRC, so you need to switch to another one`
`11:17.32`	`mjr`	`yeah it's just something some people think they should put in there to assert their copyright`
`11:17.46`	`mjr`	`and something that some companies put there to intimidate`
`11:17.46`	`stefan_schmidt`	`abraxa_: What do you mean with graphics mode?`
`11:18.33`	`alphaone`	`abraxa_: Enable graphics mode is just the fbset and echo and then use mplayer to output to fbdev`
`11:19.06`	`abraxa_`	`alphaone: Ohh okay then`
`11:19.17`	`abraxa_`	`Thanks guys :)`
`11:19.35`	`alphaone`	`No problem :-)`
`11:19.48`	`alphaone`	`Looking forward to the player`
`11:24.45`	`abraxa_`	`Me, too ;)`
`11:24.53`	`mbuf`	`robtaylor, sent e-mail to openmoko-gsmd`
`11:27.05`	`*** join/#openmoko Cap_J_L_Picard (n=ewanm89@134.219.172.80)`
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`11:47.46`	`mbuf`	`what could be the reason that lgsm_passthrough segfaults?`
`11:49.20`	`*** join/#openmoko agoode (n=agoode@2001:4830:1633:0:212:3fff:fe70:6222)`
`11:55.42`	`mbuf`	`how can i add a .Desktop file to autotools source package, and make it build with .bb to create a .ipk?`
`11:56.11`	`*** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132)`
`11:57.20`	`*** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@ip-217-18-181-130.static.reverse.dsi.net)`
`11:57.47`	`*** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@sunbeam.ipv6.gnumonks.org)`
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`12:00.52`	`federico`	`hello guy!! 1 question....open moko have a gps reciver but where software available for navigation?`
`12:02.22`	`LaF0rge`	`federico: gpsdrive? navit? whatever FOSS projects on linux exists for that.`
`12:02.49`	`*** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@mathias.residence.ens-lyon.fr)`
`12:04.09`	`*** join/#openmoko markit (n=marco@88-149-177-66.static.ngi.it)`
`12:05.07`	`federico`	`LaF0rge: gpsdrive ....tomtom style`
`12:07.19`	`*** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@sunbeam.ipv6.gnumonks.org)`
`12:07.21`	`hrw`	`anyway do not assume that you will get maps with it`
`12:07.38`	`hrw`	`iirc only openstreetmaps are free to use and their coverage is low`
`12:10.20`	`ScaredyCat`	`libjana ???`
`12:10.39`	`_buz`	`are tomtom maps drm'ed or something?`
`12:10.39`	`loufoque`	`what about google maps?`
`12:10.53`	`hrw`	`loufoque: you cant use them officially rather`
`12:11.00`	`ScaredyCat`	`did somehting jst break :(`
`12:11.00`	`_buz`	`you can buy the maps alone, after all`
`12:11.20`	`ScaredyCat`	`[2007-10-23 11:22:47] <CIA-13> openmoko: Use libjana-gtk/libjana-ecal and put an analog clock on the main screen`
`12:12.56`	`hrw`	`http://maps.google.com/help/terms_maps.html`
`12:13.07`	`*** join/#openmoko ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)`
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`12:13.07`	`*** mode/#openmoko [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net`
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`12:14.34`	`*** join/#openmoko DarkFoxDK[away] (n=martin@0110ds1-ro.0.fullrate.dk)`
`12:16.37`	`*** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X05d9.x.pppool.de)`
`12:16.51`	`_buz`	`google maps are useless for navigation`
`12:17.05`	`*** join/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B05A592.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`12:17.14`	`_buz`	`afaik you cant get them in vector form, anyway`
`12:17.34`	`_buz`	`besides without some meta data � la this is one way street, navigation is kinda hard`
`12:18.01`	`loufoque`	`hrw: I don't see anything that would prevent a phone from using it`
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`12:18.56`	`*** join/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B05A592.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`12:30.59`	`hrw`	`who boot Neo from SD?`
`12:31.35`	`*** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X05d9.x.pppool.de)`
`12:32.41`	`*** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo)`
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`12:35.29`	`vciaglia`	`hi, i want to suggest this problem while upgrading`
`12:35.31`	`vciaglia`	`Configuring openmoko-icon-theme-standard2`
`12:35.32`	`vciaglia`	`Failed to write hash table`
`12:35.32`	`vciaglia`	`postinst script returned status 1`
`12:35.32`	`vciaglia`	`ERROR: openmoko-icon-theme-standard2.postinst returned 1`
`12:35.32`	`vciaglia`	`Nothing to be done`
`12:37.55`	`torpor`	`just got a new apple bluetooth keyboard.`
`12:38.01`	`torpor`	`gonna set it up with the neo1973...\`
`12:38.32`	`vciaglia`	`and...i can't hear the audio while using mediaplayer. Why?`
`12:38.47`	`markit`	`will qtopia replace openmoko, or you will just ignore it and keep going with gtk stuff? (Ignorant but curious user here)`
`12:39.01`	`torpor`	`openmoko isn't going to be replaced by qtopia`
`12:39.01`	`ScaredyCat`	`you can use either or..`
`12:39.07`	`ScaredyCat`	`but this is openmoko dev...`
`12:39.07`	`torpor`	`they're both cross compatible`
`12:39.12`	`ScaredyCat`	`which will continue`
`12:39.22`	`torpor`	`me, personally, i'm sticking with gtk personally`
`12:39.29`	`torpor`	`i don't like trolltech, nor qtopia.`
`12:39.40`	`markit`	`ehm, KDE user here...`
`12:39.52`	`hrw`	`Could not open //usr/lib/ipkg/info/xserver-kdrive-common.list for writing: No space left on device`
`12:39.52`	`torpor`	`there is no really good reason, other than packaging, that openmoko can't do as good a job as the qtopia images, as of right now`
`12:39.55`	`hrw`	`argh..`
`12:39.58`	`markit`	`but sad TT made qtopia GPL so late`
`12:40.07`	`torpor`	`hrw: hah hah, you need a gta02`
`12:40.11`	`ScaredyCat`	`qtipia is further along - it's had a headstart...`
`12:40.24`	`torpor`	`ScaredyCat: i don't think so, apart from the packaging issue`
`12:40.29`	`ScaredyCat`	`qtopia even`
`12:40.38`	`ScaredyCat`	`yes it is torpor...`
`12:40.38`	`torpor`	`qtopia is well-integrated, OE hasn't got that luxury`
`12:40.40`	`*** join/#openmoko disguy__35 (i=disguy__@gateway/tor/x-798bdc7ab8146a60)`
`12:40.56`	`torpor`	`ScaredyCat: name a function that qtopia can do that OE can't`
`12:41.07`	`ScaredyCat`	`qtopia's got 4 years head start`
`12:41.11`	`markit`	`just sad many efforts to produce more software instead of few software of better quality, I guess`
`12:41.19`	`torpor`	`qtopia is ahead in packaging and not much else.`
`12:41.23`	`ScaredyCat`	`torpor: you mean m not OE`
`12:41.33`	`markit`	`i.e. in CAD there are 10 FOSS programs, but no one decent ...`
`12:41.33`	`torpor`	`'m'?`
`12:41.44`	`ScaredyCat`	`om`
`12:41.52`	`torpor`	`om=OE`
`12:41.55`	`ScaredyCat`	`no`
`12:41.59`	`torpor`	`yes`
`12:42.02`	`ScaredyCat`	`no`
`12:42.03`	`torpor`	`yes`
`12:42.08`	`CM`	`markit: You can always ask around in #qtopia too :)`
`12:42.09`	`ScaredyCat`	`OM is openMoko`
`12:42.15`	`ScaredyCat`	`oe is openembedded`
`12:42.17`	`torpor`	`which is based on OE`
`12:42.22`	`ScaredyCat`	`the two are different`
`12:42.23`	`markit`	`CM thanks for the tip`
`12:42.28`	`torpor`	`bah`
`12:42.28`	`ScaredyCat`	`om uses oe to build`
`12:42.34`	`torpor`	`the difference is only in the packaging`
`12:42.42`	`ScaredyCat`	`rubbish`
`12:43.01`	`abraxa_`	`vciaglia: Did you hear anything from your speakers yet at all? If not, do an "alsactl -f /etc/stereoout.state restore"`
`12:43.05`	`CM`	`torpor: OE is a build system, OM a distro like �ngstr�m or so`
`12:43.10`	`ScaredyCat`	`what you're effectively saying is that oe=om=qtopia which is rubbish`
`12:43.38`	`u_l-lap`	`markit: qtopia has been gpl for years`
`12:43.50`	`u_l-lap`	`markit: it was just the phone specific stuff that wasn't until recently`
`12:43.56`	`ScaredyCat`	`u_l-lap: parts of ir`
`12:43.58`	`ScaredyCat`	`it`
`12:44.07`	`markit`	`u_l-lap: sure, but is the most important part for neo ;)`
`12:44.32`	`u_l-lap`	`markit: the neo only existed for about two months when they gpled the phone bits`
`12:44.43`	`ScaredyCat`	`wtf!`
`12:44.50`	`markit`	`in any case, FOSS will die because of SW patents and restricted, not open standard :( sad days these days`
`12:44.57`	`u_l-lap`	`not counting the pre-public hardware`
`12:45.05`	`u_l-lap`	`markit: just ignore the patents`
`12:45.26`	`markit`	`u_l-lap: mm I asked about why not using qtopia long time ago, and I was told that was because was not a viable option not being GPL`
`12:45.45`	`u_l-lap`	`markit: because the phone bits were proprietary at the time`
`12:46.11`	`u_l-lap`	`markit: I think it is really more trolltech is a cathederal type deal`
`12:48.48`	`markit`	`unfortunatly I have to leave now`
`12:49.05`	`markit`	`thanks a lot for your work, I will buy one phone for sure as soon as stable`
`12:49.18`	`markit`	`see you later`
`12:50.36`	`CM`	`ScaredyCat: Hehe`
`12:55.32`	`torpor`	`bah`
`12:55.45`	`torpor`	`as long as there are more than one company making hardware, there will be F/OSS`
`12:55.53`	`torpor`	`GPL exists in the space between hardware vendors.`
`12:56.17`	`CM`	`And in some countries we don't care much about silly patents..`
`12:57.04`	`*** join/#openmoko J-23 (i=aldwulf@a187.net131.okay.pl)`
`12:57.08`	`J-23`	`Hello!`
`12:57.15`	`CM`	`:)`
`12:57.25`	`torpor`	`hardware patents too`
`12:57.35`	`torpor`	`in fact, down with all information ownership!`
`12:57.57`	`CM`	`torpor: That's utopia and unlikely to happen any time soon, sadly ;)`
`12:58.29`	`CM`	`torpor: Btw, listen to this podcast: http://www.webdirections.org/resources/mark-pesce/`
`12:58.44`	`zash`	`like well-functioning communism`
`12:59.45`	`*** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@200.184.118.132)`
`13:00.00`	`torpor`	`communism is not lack-of-info-ownership.`
`13:00.07`	`torpor`	`CM: i don't do podcasts`
`13:00.22`	`zash`	`torpor: but it is unlikely to happen any time soon`
`13:00.29`	`CM`	`torpor: Too bad, you're missing out on a lot of stuff`
`13:00.47`	`torpor`	`like what?`
`13:01.28`	`CM`	`Like ted-speaches, lug radio, open season.. :)`
`13:01.42`	`torpor`	`bah`
`13:01.49`	`torpor`	`i can see all that live. ;)`
`13:01.59`	`CM`	`Hrmpf.. Unfair! :P`
`13:02.28`	`*** join/#openmoko gordonsyme (n=gordon@62.231.57.138)`
`13:02.49`	`CM`	`torpor: There's a transcript of that speech too, http://blog.futurestreetconsulting.com/?p=39`
`13:03.36`	`CM`	`Anyway, he talks about "the mob" or "the network" routing around problems`
`13:03.39`	`CM`	`Or limits..`
`13:05.13`	`abraxa_`	`Yes. Work. On OM.`
`13:05.14`	`abraxa_`	`xP`
`13:05.24`	`torpor`	`abraxa_: mplayer is nice.`
`13:05.28`	`torpor`	`mediaplayer i mean`
`13:05.36`	`abraxa_`	`Thanks, but not nice enough ;)`
`13:05.37`	`torpor`	`been using it lately .. ;)`
`13:06.04`	`*** join/#openmoko wildfire (n=wildfire@203.7.227.146)`
`13:06.33`	`*** join/#openmoko funktio (n=funktio@80-248-242-86.cust.suomicom.fi)`
`13:07.03`	`\|R`	`How easy is it to share between OM and Maemo?`
`13:07.55`	`CM`	`\|R: Depends on the program. If it's not Hildon specific it should be easy`
`13:09.22`	`\|R`	`ok :)`
`13:09.45`	`\|R`	`same goes for the OLPC without sugar?`
`13:10.16`	`CM`	`I'd guess so but I know nothing.. ;)`
`13:10.18`	`J-23`	`can I use QEMU on OpenMoko?`
`13:10.20`	`\|R`	`hehe :)`
`13:10.26`	`torpor`	`sure`
`13:10.27`	`torpor`	`just port it`
`13:10.31`	`J-23`	`;)`
`13:12.29`	`J-23`	`Five thousands of U.S. dollars, please :D`
`13:13.30`	`J-23`	`(http://www.theserverside.com/news/thread.tss?thread_id=47195)`
`13:21.41`	`cjb_ie`	`coo - http://url.ie/6b1 - a thousand disassembled cell phones of every description running 24/7 for real-time remote testing.`
`13:22.44`	`\|R`	`J-23: I'd take canadian $ right now if i were you ;)`
`13:26.08`	`*** part/#openmoko Writchie (n=writchie@195.230.118.70.cfl.res.rr.com)`
`13:26.18`	`enjahova`	`you know, if you could buy an olpc i think it would get much more community support`
`13:26.41`	`enjahova`	`oh wait, you can now?`
`13:27.56`	`*** join/#openmoko Cap_J_L_Picard (n=ewanm89@134.219.164.5)`
`13:28.09`	`*** join/#openmoko woglinde (n=heinold@muenster.mi.fu-berlin.de)`
`13:28.10`	`abraxa_`	`cjb_ie: I wonder how the phone's flash is handled between customer rentals... maybe you can find competitor programs on there, heh`
`13:30.47`	`*** join/#openmoko Writchie (n=writchie@195.230.118.70.cfl.res.rr.com)`
`13:39.36`	`ScaredyCat`	`CM:ping`
`13:40.41`	`CM`	`ScaredyCat: Pong`
`13:42.44`	`sandos`	`cjb_ie: I think we tried that out here`
`13:42.48`	`sandos`	`kinda cool`
`13:43.06`	`cjb_ie`	`a lot easier when you've access to the hardware specs :-)`
`13:43.53`	`sandos`	`although the iphone wasnt hooked in when we tested ;)`
`13:44.00`	`sandos`	`just lots of motorola handsets basically`
`13:46.28`	`*** join/#openmoko IfWorkCouldKill (i=57c1876b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-111db59ff10eaaa2)`
`13:47.07`	`sandos`	`we did not really know if they told the truth about it being "real" hardware though, so we just had to try connect phones via bluetooth and that of course worked`
`13:47.43`	`cjb_ie`	`for the harder cases they could always set up web cams facing the screens :-)`
`13:47.53`	`ScaredyCat`	`CM: language wise how close is Finnish and Swedish ..`
`13:48.10`	`sandos`	`ScaredyCat: far far far away`
`13:48.11`	`Xx13`	`ScaredyCat: тще фе фдд`
`13:48.18`	`CM`	`ScaredyCat: About as close as english and japanese`
`13:48.21`	`sandos`	`finnish is like a pretend language to swedes ;)`
`13:48.22`	`Xx13`	`<PROTECTED>`
`13:48.41`	`cjb_ie`	`iirc the only language remotely similar to finnish is hungarian, and even that's not very close.`
`13:48.53`	`ScaredyCat`	`lol - thanks`
`13:49.23`	`cjb_ie`	`(though someone said something to me about estonian before?)`
`13:49.28`	`CM`	`But the finns say that they have a lot of words of swedish descent, but I can't tell from seing or hearing it`
`13:49.34`	`Xx13`	`CM: somewhat closer, at least (almost)same alphabet`
`13:49.44`	`CM`	`cjb_ie: Estonian and finnish is a bit like swedish and danish`
`13:49.55`	`CM`	`At least that's what my ex used to say. :)`
`13:50.26`	`atul`	`how to list the files present in an .ipkg file?`
`13:51.36`	`jeddy3`	`aloril, ipkg files <pkg>`
`13:51.38`	`cjb_ie`	`CM: well, in denmark i got by quite well on swedish+dutch+german+english`
`13:51.39`	`hrw`	`dpkg-deb -c ipk-file`
`13:51.44`	`jeddy3`	`oops`
`13:51.53`	`jeddy3`	`atul, ipkg files pkg`
`13:51.59`	`atul`	`jeddy3, thanks`
`13:52.45`	`CM`	`cjb_ie: All I have to do to sound danish is to take a huge spoon of sticky porridge in my mouth and only half swallow it, that's what it sounds to me..`
`13:53.07`	`jeddy3`	`atul, no sorry, that displays the files in a installed package`
`13:53.18`	`cjb_ie`	`CM: to me it sounds like an english person who's never heard swedish, trying to read swedish out loud`
`13:53.22`	`jeddy3`	`atul, what hrw said sounds reasonable`
`13:53.37`	`atul`	`jeddy3, that is what i wanted`
`13:53.37`	`hrw`	`I use it ;)`
`13:53.57`	`cjb_ie`	`all the vowels are... strange`
`13:54.32`	`zash`	`CM: danish ~= swedish dialect with hot potatoe in mouth`
`13:54.35`	`zash`	`;)`
`13:54.38`	`torpor`	`just got an apple bluetooth keyboard trying to get it working with the neo1973..`
`13:54.53`	`CM`	`zash: hehe.. You're not from Sk�ne either I guess.. ;)`
`13:54.54`	`zash`	`torpor: coul`
`13:54.54`	`*** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@66.83.208.218.nw.nuvox.net)`
`13:55.22`	`zash`	`CM: no, AC`
`13:55.49`	`CM`	`zash: Heh, jag �r fr�n Uuuume ;)`
`13:56.09`	`zash`	`jäh, umeå ftw`
`13:56.42`	`faern`	`gbg h�r (men ursprungligen fr�n G�vle)`
`13:57.09`	`CM`	`faern: Heh, Jag bor i gbg nu men flyttar till sthlm om 2 m�nader`
`13:57.09`	`Batalyx`	`I tried to speak Swedish in Norway, and people answered to me in English... should've tried Finnish...`
`13:57.29`	`faern`	`CM, nice`
`13:57.30`	`jeddy3`	`<-sthlm, usprungligen borlänge :)`
`13:57.45`	`faern`	`CM, att du �r h�r ass�. inte att du ska dra :/`
`13:58.01`	`CM`	`jeddy3: Och sommarstuga i H�gakusten precis som jag.. ;)`
`13:58.11`	`jeddy3`	`indeed :D`
`13:58.37`	`zash`	`har farsa i gbg`
`13:58.45`	`*** join/#openmoko mickey-tw (n=mickeyl@122-124-68-118.dynamic.hinet.net)`
`13:58.49`	`ScaredyCat`	`yoink!`
`14:00.52`	`jeddy3`	`:)`
`14:00.59`	`CM`	`cjb_ie: Hehe.. True (But I pictures a Hyrax)`
`14:01.10`	`CM`	`s/res/red/`
`14:01.16`	`Batalyx`	`:) 'batalyx' var en stjärna i en brian aldiss bökken, och en gammalt datorn spel. (possibly humiliating myself with my rusty Swedish skills)`
`14:01.37`	`CM`	`C64?`
`14:01.42`	`Batalyx`	`ju visst`
`14:01.51`	`CM`	`:D`
`14:04.44`	`*** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-085-216-001-036.hsi.kabelbw.de)`
`14:04.52`	`PBeck`	`hi`
`14:05.23`	`*** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2)`
`14:06.25`	`torpor`	`okay, the apple bluetooth keyboard + neo works just fine. and it is great!`
`14:06.39`	`ewon`	`sweet`
`14:06.53`	`meus`	`torpor: wow, sweet!`
`14:06.56`	`CM`	`torpor: Cool!`
`14:07.08`	`*** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi)`
`14:07.08`	`meus`	`i wonder if the logitech diNovo edge will work aswell then`
`14:07.30`	`torpor`	`i know its obvious, but it just plain works.`
`14:07.42`	`CM`	`meus: Any bluetooth hid that works with bluez should work :)`
`14:07.44`	`torpor`	`so i can now just carry around the neo and the keyboard. ;) well, once battery life is sorted that is ..`
`14:07.52`	`meus`	`CM: sweet.`
`14:08.35`	`CM`	`Hmm.. Would a bluetooth mouse work?`
`14:08.44`	`*** join/#openmoko bengl (n=benglish@bas10-ottawa23-1088819520.dsl.bell.ca)`
`14:10.30`	`torpor`	`i suppose i should get one and find out. ;)`
`14:10.30`	`nelson`	`CM: oh, really?? kewl! That means that http://blog.russnelson.com/chordite will also work`
`14:11.24`	`CM`	`nelson: Sure. Cool thing btw.. Hmm... :)`
`14:11.41`	`meus`	`what a strange keyboard :)`
`14:11.51`	`meus`	`i guess these fold out keybarods could also be nice`
`14:11.57`	`meus`	`keyboards..`
`14:12.33`	`torpor`	`wow its really nice to play scummvm .. ;)`
`14:13.30`	`alphaone`	`:-)`
`14:13.39`	`alphaone`	`torpor: Day of the tentacle?`
`14:13.40`	`*** join/#openmoko MeTa[AwAy] (n=khmhm@dsl54009FAE.pool.t-online.hu)`
`14:14.15`	`meus`	`dott!`
`14:14.30`	`CM`	`Sam & Max... :)`
`14:14.30`	`nelson`	`meus: fold out keyboards have a usability problem.`
`14:14.42`	`meus`	`nelson: ok, in what way`
`14:14.52`	`nelson`	`meus: in order to type, you need a flat surface on which to place the keyboard.`
`14:15.06`	`nelson`	`and, in order to see the screen, you need to have something to put the device on, as well.`
`14:15.07`	`meus`	`nelson: ahhh`
`14:15.22`	`nelson`	`So ... fold out keyboards are not mobile keyboads. They are portable keyboards.`
`14:15.24`	`meus`	`yeah I kinda agree on those observations`
`14:15.52`	`ewon`	`the fold-out keyboard for the palm was a good solution`
`14:15.57`	`mbuf`	`if i inherit autotools, do i still need to add do_compile() for bitbake to build the executable?`
`14:16.07`	`nelson`	`you could dial your phone with a chordite. Less plausible to use a fold-out keyboard for the same thing.`
`14:16.11`	`woglinde`	`mbug no`
`14:16.15`	`woglinde`	`ups mbuf`
`14:16.18`	`nelson`	`mbuf: no.`
`14:16.41`	`woglinde`	`mbuf do_compile is to override the function to set some variables`
`14:16.50`	`woglinde`	`lilke BLA=moo oe_make()`
`14:17.10`	`torpor`	`i have a few foldouts`
`14:17.14`	`torpor`	`but i really love the apple keyboard`
`14:17.20`	`torpor`	`i think its perfect for such devices as the neo`
`14:17.35`	`torpor`	`wow, its a whole new machine with a keyboard.`
`14:17.38`	`woglinde`	`torpor the bt kb for the mac mini?`
`14:17.53`	`*** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132)`
`14:17.54`	`mbuf`	`woglinde, nelson my .bb is not creating the executable; what am I missing here? http://pastebin.ca/746800`
`14:18.21`	`*** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi)`
`14:18.35`	`*** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132)`
`14:18.38`	`woglinde`	`mbuf whats the error?`
`14:19.04`	`torpor`	`woglinde: this one: http://www.apple.com/keyboard/`
`14:19.14`	`mbuf`	`woglinde, it builds with hello-dev_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipkg, hello-dbg, hello-doc; there is no executable generated`
`14:19.19`	`*** join/#openmoko rmoravci1 (n=rmoravci@setnip01.ericsson.net)`
`14:19.35`	`woglinde`	`mbuf than to it step by step`
`14:19.40`	`woglinde`	`and look whats happen`
`14:19.55`	`torpor`	`mbuf: check this out: http://w1xer.de/OpenMoko_DevNotesDRAFT.txt`
`14:19.55`	`woglinde`	`bitbake bla -c unpack /patch/configure/compile`
`14:20.07`	`torpor`	`do you have a do_install() phase?`
`14:20.31`	`*** join/#openmoko unmadindu (n=sayamind@gnu-india/admin/unmadindu)`
`14:20.31`	`woglinde`	`tropor with autotools its automagic`
`14:21.02`	`torpor`	`woglinde: thats what i wrote in this draft ..`
`14:21.58`	`woglinde`	`torpor dont you want to help to get the oe-doku in better shape?`
`14:22.05`	`torpor`	`what do you mean?`
`14:22.10`	`torpor`	`that i'm not putting this on the wiki?`
`14:22.22`	`torpor`	`this is just a draft for an article i'm in the process of writing, introducing openmoko ..`
`14:23.06`	`woglinde`	`http://www.openembedded.org/user-manual`
`14:23.29`	`torpor`	`i might help add to that at some point, but i ant to cover a 'bootstrap' article first ..`
`14:24.11`	`woglinde`	`torpor ;)`
`14:27.26`	`*** join/#openmoko aexin (n=brootvor@unaffiliated/aevin)`
`14:27.36`	`*** join/#openmoko lysanderslair_ (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM000a7363f3b6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`14:28.41`	`mickey-tw`	`torpor: good stuff`
`14:29.41`	`*** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz)`
`14:29.57`	`woglinde`	`hm I should make a xteddy .bb`
`14:31.02`	`CM`	`torpor: Nice work! :)`
`14:31.04`	`*** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@251.9.39-62.rev.gaoland.net)`
`14:31.40`	`woglinde`	`torpor for pkgconfig there is an inherit too`
`14:31.49`	`woglinde`	`but I have to look what it really does`
`14:32.31`	`torpor`	`mickey-tw: thx`
`14:32.33`	`torpor`	`CM: thx`
`14:32.55`	`woglinde`	`http://www.openembedded.org/repo/org.openembedded.dev/classes/pkgconfig.bbclass`
`14:32.58`	`woglinde`	`ah`
`14:33.40`	`CM`	`Has anyone here been able to run openmoko in qemu lately?`
`14:33.41`	`nelson`	`Yes, I was running it yesterday.`
`14:33.55`	`CM`	`For me it borks and hangs completely when starting X, but I suspect it's something with the modem`
`14:33.56`	`nelson`	`Off an image built on Thursday.`
`14:34.02`	`CM`	`nod`
`14:34.15`	`CM`	`That was yesterday`
`14:34.30`	`rwhitby`	`morning`
`14:34.41`	`CM`	`rwhitby: Hiya :)`
`14:34.58`	`rwhitby`	`midori should be fixed now - I submitted an OE bug report and koen fixed it overnight.`
`14:35.16`	`rwhitby`	`(just building to test now)`
`14:35.49`	`zash`	`le trötthet`
`14:36.25`	`zash`	`of DOOM!`
`14:37.16`	`nelson`	`fly well.`
`14:37.35`	`nelson`	`are you using an airplane or are you flapping very hard?`
`14:37.59`	`*** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com)`
`14:38.05`	`rwhitby`	`only 31 hours door to door.`
`14:38.08`	`ewon`	`heh`
`14:38.12`	`ewon`	`31 hours, jesus wept`
`14:38.28`	`rwhitby`	`AUS->ORD->SFO->SYD->ADL`
`14:38.31`	`rwhitby`	`31 hours`
`14:38.46`	`*** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi)`
`14:39.55`	`zash`	`<zash's boss> OMG IPHONE!!!`
`14:40.42`	`*** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh)`
`14:43.18`	`*** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@128.8.37.122)`
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`14:46.53`	`*** part/#openmoko korpios (n=korpios@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com)`
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`14:49.57`	`CM`	`It's not a micro SD, but still cool: http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/34463/118/`
`14:51.44`	`ewon`	`hmm, thought there was an sdio-wifi card out before now with integrated storage`
`14:51.59`	`nelson`	`sandisk.`
`14:52.19`	`ewon`	`does this do it independently of the OS or something?`
`14:52.33`	`nelson`	`it looks like yes.`
`14:53.03`	`*** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@132.213.238.4)`
`14:53.14`	`ewon`	`now that is interesting`
`14:53.47`	`LittleIdiot`	`i couldn't get that sandisk to work and afaik there is no way or driver for linux yet`
`14:55.29`	`CM`	`ewon: Read the first comment here: http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/wireless/eye+fi-wi+fi-sd-card-gets-fcc-approval-313713.php`
`14:57.04`	`CM`	`ewon: Sounds like it's just copying over stuff from the card to some disk continously. Wonder how and where.. :)`
`14:58.28`	`*** join/#openmoko mypapit (n=mypapit@pdpc/supporter/active/mypapit)`
`14:58.46`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.193.4)`
`14:59.06`	`nelson`	`I saw something about having to run it in your PC first.`
`14:59.37`	`nelson`	`if I were them, I'd have a bit of read-only flash which contains the PC (Windows, sigh) driver.`
`15:00.45`	`*** join/#openmoko ^leo^ (n=user@r190-64-51-231.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy)`
`15:02.30`	`*** join/#openmoko DarkFoxDK (n=martin@0110ds1-ro.0.fullrate.dk)`
`15:07.02`	`abraxa_`	`I love parents... my mom opens Opera, it says "A new version of Opera is available. Do you want to update?" and the first thing she asks is "Does it cost anything?"`
`15:08.43`	`ewon`	`my father is still suspicious of the fact that it doesn't cost more to view websites in countries further away`
`15:09.08`	`woglinde`	`abraxa so your mom learned you how to use money`
`15:10.04`	`abraxa_`	`hehe`
`15:10.04`	`XorA`	`abraxa_: only one soul`
`15:10.16`	`*** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@70.55.82.31)`
`15:10.23`	`cjb_ie`	`ewon: well, it doesn't cost _him_ more :-)`
`15:10.23`	`*** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@70.55.82.31)`
`15:10.53`	`abraxa_`	`XorA: I do love Opera but I don't love Opera that much ;)`
`15:11.32`	`*** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AFECA.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`15:11.49`	`CM`	`abraxa_: 12 years ago or so I told my mom I was going to bike to the store in town and get the drivers for the modem, and she replied "Can you carry them on your bike?" :D`
`15:12.16`	`abraxa_`	`rofl`
`15:12.30`	`viq`	`"they'll drive me back" ;)`
`15:12.46`	`CM`	`But at least the she says "Click on Internet" and points to "the fox thing" :)`
`15:13.08`	`*** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@3e44a665.adsl.enternet.hu)`
`15:14.39`	`cjb_ie`	`CM: it took me about a year to figure out the icon was actually of a fox`
`15:14.48`	`cjb_ie`	`thought it was just a sort of orange swirl`
`15:15.05`	`nelson`	`don't they have foxes in Ireland?`
`15:15.38`	`cjb_ie`	`sure, but it doesn't translate that well to a little icon.`
`15:15.48`	`nelson`	`squeeze them harder.`
`15:16.25`	`*** join/#openmoko aevin (n=brootvor@unaffiliated/aevin)`
`15:17.32`	`gordonsyme`	`nelson: and they tend to be mangey scrawny things rather than the paragon of fox-ness that the FF logo is`
`15:17.33`	`CM`	`cjb_ie: All swedish foxes look just like that! I never understood what the blue ball they were playing with was though.. :P`
`15:18.43`	`cjb_ie`	`i saw it as an orange blob with some blue spilled on it`
`15:19.09`	`XorA`	`that a fox?`
`15:19.50`	`XorA`	`I thought it was a flaming whoooosh`
`15:19.53`	`cjb_ie`	`apparently :-)`
`15:20.11`	`nelson`	`for you, XorA, it can be a flaming whoooosh.`
`15:20.24`	`faern`	`lol`
`15:20.30`	`XorA`	`bean powered foxes`
`15:21.03`	`faern`	`how is it possible not to see it's a fox. look at the about dialog. there is a big version`
`15:21.26`	`cjb_ie`	`faern: who looks in the about dialog?`
`15:21.51`	`faern`	`me everytime I upgrade :P`
`15:22.12`	`*** join/#openmoko behdad (i=behdad@nat/redhat-ca/x-a7622582ce08d1ca)`
`15:22.39`	`faern`	`bah. pure evil`
`15:23.22`	`CVirus`	`looks like ubuntu inc. rather`
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`16:11.03`	`orospakr`	`It's a fox humping the Earth, of course.`
`16:11.56`	`ScaredyCat`	`your dirty mind caused a netsplit`
`16:12.12`	`orospakr`	`through time, apparently!`
`16:12.38`	`ScaredyCat`	`:)`
`16:15.00`	`goxboxlive`	`hi ScaredyCat . Is there any sound working on the ficphone yet with the latest source?`
`16:15.21`	`*** join/#openmoko Lunpa (n=lunpa@rch85-2-88-163-221-31.fbx.proxad.net)`
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`16:20.01`	`abraxa__`	`goxboxlive: Yes, sound has always been working`
`16:20.05`	`*** join/#openmoko MeTa[AwAy] (n=khmhm@3e44a665.adsl.enternet.hu)`
`16:20.44`	`rwhitby`	`woohoo! openmoko-feed now builds again.`
`16:21.37`	`goxboxlive`	`abraxa_: i posted in wrong channel, i ment Qtopia on the Ficphone`
`16:21.54`	`abraxa__`	`goxboxlive: Ah :)`
`16:24.27`	`Kero`	`mwester: your kernel is much better that the one I had.`
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`16:50.26`	`RalphEichelberge`	`hello guys :)`
`16:51.22`	`RalphEichelberge`	`I need to alter that splash picture that comes up while booting / or shutdown`
`16:51.33`	`mickey-tw`	`why?`
`16:51.46`	`RalphEichelberge`	`is ist just a picture or do I have to compile it into the kernel?`
`16:51.56`	`*** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at)`
`16:52.04`	`mickey-tw`	`psplash is a userspace program`
`16:52.06`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03chris * r3257 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-main.c):`
`16:52.06`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/today-main.c: (set_time_idle):`
`16:52.06`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Return FALSE instead of TRUE so the callback doesn't get added more`
`16:52.06`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: and more over time`
`16:52.11`	`RalphEichelberge`	`well - my boss would like to have some nice graphics there`
`16:52.23`	`mickey-tw`	`so you don't think the openmoko logo is nice? :D`
`16:52.44`	`RalphEichelberge`	`me - i dont care`
`16:52.58`	`mickey-tw`	`right. well, have a look at the psplash recipe`
`16:53.08`	`RalphEichelberge`	`do you kown where it is?`
`16:53.09`	`mickey-tw`	`and/or look at projects.o-hand.com -> psplash`
`16:53.22`	`RalphEichelberge`	`psplash?`
`16:53.48`	`*** join/#openmoko eikonos (n=eikonos@frrrc01.vic.sfl.net)`
`16:53.56`	`mickey-tw`	`yes, psplash`
`16:54.10`	`mickey-tw`	`that's the name of the program that shows the init splash`
`16:54.18`	`*** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@e178244235.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
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`16:55.48`	`cjb_ie`	`one of the ilug guys was cursing about psplash on ubuntu gutsy choosing a video mode that made his machine unusable 'til power cycle.`
`16:56.03`	`RalphEichelberge`	`ok it says that " Its visual look is configurable by basic source changes. " - what does that mean?`
`16:56.29`	`mickey-tw`	`you compile the image into a .h file`
`16:56.32`	`mickey-tw`	`with some tool they provide`
`16:57.12`	`RalphEichelberge`	`so its in a c header file? - then i have to build it`
`16:57.16`	`RalphEichelberge`	`right?`
`16:57.24`	`mickey-tw`	`ya`
`16:57.32`	`RalphEichelberge`	`where can i find the picture`
`16:57.47`	`RalphEichelberge`	`or the psplash?`
`16:57.55`	`mickey-tw`	`in OE`
`16:58.00`	`mickey-tw`	`(openembedded.org)`
`16:58.18`	`RalphEichelberge`	`i have the complete development envioremnt`
`16:58.31`	`mickey-tw`	`packages/psplash/...`
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`17:02.16`	`RalphEichelberge`	`well there is a "psplash-bar-img.h"`
`17:02.34`	`mickey-tw`	`yes`
`17:02.49`	`mickey-tw`	`i don't have the source image handy that was used to generate that`
`17:03.09`	`mickey-tw`	`see the psplash readme for details`
`17:04.22`	`RalphEichelberge`	`http://svn.o-hand.com/repos/misc/trunk/psplash/README`
`17:04.32`	`RalphEichelberge`	`this Readme?`
`17:04.50`	`RalphEichelberge`	`doesnt say anything`
`17:05.06`	`CM`	`RalphEichelberge: Hehe, was just about to say "not that verbose.." :)`
`17:06.19`	`Kero`	`header files say /* GdkPixbuf RGBA C-Source image dump 1-byte-run-length-encoded */`
`17:06.34`	`Kero`	`so I'd look into gdkpixpuf :)`
`17:06.41`	`CM`	`And make-image-header.sh seems to make one of those ;)`
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`17:08.08`	`Kero`	`CM: my psplash in OE seems sparser than that (no such sh-file)`
`17:08.13`	`abraxa_`	`Kero: gdk-pixbuf-csource, to be precise`
`17:08.40`	`Marcel_M`	`RalphEichelberge: you can take a look at psplash_svn.bb`
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`17:08.56`	`CM`	`Kero: I looked at the repo: http://svn.o-hand.com/repos/misc/trunk/psplash/make-image-header.sh`
`17:09.01`	`Kero`	`hehe. I removed psplash completely. I want to see my kernel f*ck up.`
`17:10.47`	`CM`	`Oohhh.. Shiny: http://chrislord.net/images/openmoko-today-digital.png`
`17:11.42`	`CM`	`The rounded grey corners look so-so though with the white sharp cornesr behind`
`17:11.50`	`RalphEichelberge`	`allright thanks`
`17:11.57`	`RalphEichelberge`	`i got a go now`
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`17:12.19`	`SpeedEvil`	`Far out in the uncharted backwaters of the unfashionable end of the Western Spiral arm of the Galaxy lies a small unregarded yellow sun. Orbiting this at a distance of roughly ninety-eight million miles is an utterly insignificant little blue-green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly primitive that they still think digital watches are a pretty neat idea.`
`17:12.59`	`CM`	`SpeedEvil: Hehe`
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`17:13.23`	`SpeedEvil`	`You can buy them.`
`17:13.31`	`CM`	`I know, but I meant on the phone`
`17:13.34`	`CM`	`:)`
`17:13.35`	`SpeedEvil`	`yeah.`
`17:13.39`	`*** join/#openmoko melunko (n=hmelo@200.184.118.132)`
`17:13.42`	`SpeedEvil`	`I want an e-ink back.`
`17:13.45`	`cjb_ie`	`CM you can program them.`
`17:13.57`	`CM`	`cjb_ie: True too.. Hmm.. ;)`
`17:14.09`	`CM`	`But not right now`
`17:14.24`	`Kero`	`my digital watch is a Neo1973, why do you ask?`
`17:14.45`	`Kero`	`(well, my digital watch should be my Neo1973)`
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`17:19.57`	`encompass`	`mickey-tw: thanks`
`17:20.16`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03chris * r3258 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-main.c src/today.h):`
`17:20.16`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/today-main.c: (digital_clock_notify), (main):`
`17:20.16`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: * src/today.h:`
`17:20.16`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Listen to /desktop/poky/interface/digital_clock to determine whether`
`17:20.16`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: to display a digital or analogue clock`
`17:20.41`	`cjb_ie`	`it's almost like a coincidence...`
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`17:21.57`	`mickey-tw`	`encompass: :) welcome to #openmoko`
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`17:22.27`	`raster`	`encompass: :)`
`17:23.21`	`abraxa_`	`Ohh, a fellow SoCler`
`17:23.34`	`mickey-tw`	`hehe, no worries. however he's not supposed to give people that password :)`
`17:23.55`	`encompass`	`abraxa_: hey, how did you know that!`
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`17:24.18`	`abraxa_`	`encompass: I saw your name on the payment list before ;)`
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`17:25.25`	`encompass`	`abraxa_: hehe yeah`
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`18:24.04`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03mickey * r3259 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/artwork/pixmaps/wallpaper.png: artwork: add wallpaper for today`
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`19:00.46`	`hozer`	`/server scinet.supercomp.org`
`19:01.03`	`*** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z4e3a.z.pppool.de)`
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`19:04.43`	`SrRaven`	`im back with dumb questions,would it be possible to put windows mobile on the neo1973?`
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`19:07.29`	`abraxa_`	`SrRaven: Yes, though anyone who does that could face severe punishment from the linux community ;)`
`19:08.01`	`SrRaven`	`linux dont have good tomtom :P`
`19:08.21`	`abraxa_`	`Then buy a windows mobile phone, it'll be cheaper`
`19:09.04`	`SrRaven`	`a windows mobile that got a big nice screen,supports tomtom and cheaper than the neo1973 ?`
`19:09.05`	`SrRaven`	`doubt it :P`
`19:09.53`	`abraxa_`	`Alright, your choice :)`
`19:10.24`	`enjahova`	`how about OS X ;P`
`19:10.36`	`viq`	`enjahova: AIX :P`
`19:10.41`	`viq`	`Or solaris ;)`
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`19:20.14`	`buz_`	`tomtom has a good linux version, they just dont sell it`
`19:20.23`	`buz_`	`without hardware that is`
`19:21.45`	`abraxa_`	`XorA\|gone: You around by chance?`
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`19:23.23`	`*** join/#openmoko torpor (n=torpor@zone79a.de)`
`19:25.58`	`torpor`	`hi all`
`19:26.09`	`torpor`	`i gotta say: neo with apple keyboard == great! :)`
`19:26.14`	`*** join/#openmoko Cap_J_L_Picard (n=ewanm89@unaffiliated/ewanm89)`
`19:26.18`	`abraxa_`	`hiho torpor`
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`19:35.45`	`kousu`	`torpor: how'd you get that connected up? USB hub?`
`19:36.04`	`torpor`	`kousu: bluetooth! :)`
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`19:51.51`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: 03abraxa * r3260 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-mediaplayer2/ (52 files in 3 dirs):`
`19:51.51`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Fix alignment of label #2 when #1 is hidden (frame surrounding label #1 was still visible)`
`19:51.51`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Drop now unneeded images`
`19:51.51`	`CIA-13`	`openmoko: Add GConf support, part I`
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`21:00.05`	`ph\|ber`	`hey guys..`
`21:00.26`	`ph\|ber`	`is there an end user phone yet?`
`21:00.42`	`tuukkah`	`nope`
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`21:00.48`	`ph\|ber`	`damn.`
`21:01.39`	`tuukkah`	`you can help speed it by getting what's currently available and helping out :-)`
`21:02.11`	`ph\|ber`	`if i had time and/or was a programmer i would`
`21:02.48`	`tuukkah`	`money is enough to get a cool toy :-)`
`21:03.18`	`ph\|ber`	`i already have a nokia n95`
`21:03.25`	`ph\|ber`	`it is pretty damn cool`
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`21:03.33`	`tuukkah`	`can't be`
`21:03.41`	`ph\|ber`	`is be`
`21:03.56`	`tuukkah`	`well ok, it's from finland and all :-)`
`21:04.17`	`tuukkah`	`but it's not Open`
`21:04.27`	`ph\|ber`	`no, not open.`
`21:04.32`	`ph\|ber`	`but is cool as hell.`
`21:04.41`	`ph\|ber`	`wifi, gps, fm tuner`
`21:04.43`	`ph\|ber`	`etc etc`
`21:04.49`	`ph\|ber`	`5 megapixal camera`
`21:04.49`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.193.193)`
`21:05.51`	`ozarka`	`ph\|ber: Now you're just bragging. :-)`
`21:05.59`	`don-o`	`im building with the mokomakefile and i get: File "/home/donp/src/moko/bitbake/lib/bb/persist_data.py", line 66, in delDomain: self.connection.execute("DROP TABLE IF EXISTS %s;" % domain): pysqlite2.dbapi2.OperationalError: near "EXISTS": syntax error`
`21:06.03`	`ph\|ber`	`stating the facts mam..`
`21:06.23`	`ozarka`	`How's the touch screen on that N95?`
`21:06.54`	`ph\|ber`	`no touch.`
`21:06.56`	`ph\|ber`	`dont want a touch`
`21:07.33`	`ozarka`	`Sure you don't... :-)`
`21:08.02`	`ph\|ber`	`i dont`
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`21:09.56`	`StealthCP`	`what lies`
`21:11.17`	`abraxa_`	`don-o: Maybe update your pysqlite package?`
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`21:11.53`	`don-o`	`abraxa_: maybe. it looks like domain = ""`
`21:12.05`	`don-o`	`abraxa_: a config setting i havent set, perhaps`
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`23:32.58`	`debo`	`hi this is my 1st time on a openmoko forum..... have a few qns ....`
`23:33.46`	`debo`	`i want to play with a openmoko device and wanna buy one .... but is the gta02 version coming out soon (in which case i would like to wait and get the better device)?`
`23:34.09`	`don-o`	`debo: it is unclear when gta02 will be for sale`
`23:34.18`	`don-o`	`debo: also, check the topic`
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`23:35.24`	`debo`	`thanks .... sorry .... also with the current one, can i actually use the device on a daily basis for phone and gps related stuff (want to do some experiments and maybe help in the dev :)`
`23:36.00`	`don-o`	`debo: i cant say for sure. i dont have a gta01. im pretty sure its not ready for daily use.`
`23:36.33`	`debo`	`hmmm .... how do you dev without a real gta01. Don, do you have a emulator for this?`
`23:36.57`	`Vegar`	`you can use qemu`
`23:37.20`	`Vegar`	`debo: check out the FAQ`
`23:37.21`	`Vegar`	`http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ`
`23:37.24`	`don-o`	`debo: there is a good emulator.`
`23:38.12`	`debo`	`thanks folks ...`
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`23:39.21`	`mwester-road`	`debo: the currently-available device is not usable either as a phone or gps device at present.`
`23:39.22`	`debo`	`does the agps module work well.... can i 1) read my current location and 2) send it out to another homing server using GPRS?`
`23:39.34`	`debo`	`ok`
`23:39.43`	`debo`	`then i need to wait for gta02?`
`23:39.58`	`mwester-road`	`It's not a hardware issue so much as a software issue right now.`
`23:40.12`	`debo`	`I see`
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`23:41.08`	`loufoque`	`LarstiQ: why aren't you using it as your main phone?`
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`23:42.20`	`debo`	`I know I am sounding silly but I was looking for a device with GPS and some form of internet connectivity through GPRS. Of course it needs to be open to some decent degress and I was very excited to read all about openmoko etc :)`
`23:42.46`	`mwester-road`	`Well, that's what the device will be able to do, as soon as some software issues are worked out. :)`
`23:43.18`	`debo`	`I guess :) Is tehre a page where I can read off the current status instead of bugging folks out here`
`23:43.35`	`LarstiQ`	`loufoque: Mainly because of sms. If that is done I can live with the small bugs.`
`23:44.17`	`loufoque`	`LarstiQ: how long does it stay charged?`
`23:44.26`	`loufoque`	`i mean, how long does the battery last?`
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`23:44.38`	`LarstiQ`	`debo: you could monitor CIA, the wiki, planet, etc`
`23:44.39`	`LarstiQ`	`heya behdad`
`23:45.03`	`*** part/#openmoko Devestate (n=Devestat@75.129.169.149)`
`23:45.04`	`loufoque`	`debo: it can't do GRPS`
`23:45.07`	`LarstiQ`	`loufoque: I haven't done scientific tests, but today it still had power after and 9+ hour workday`
`23:45.17`	`behdad`	`hey LarstiQ`
`23:45.17`	`*** join/#openmoko Devestate (n=Devestat@75.129.169.149)`
`23:45.52`	`debo`	`loufoque: then how does one transmit data?`
`23:46.07`	`mwester-road`	`LarstiQ: that's impressive. Most folks are finding 3 - 4 hours max -- do you have power management working, then?`
`23:46.20`	`LarstiQ`	`behdad: I just ran 12to13.py trying to learn cairo, thanks :)`
`23:46.22`	`debo`	`LArstiq: do you use ATT or tmobile to make calls?`
`23:46.55`	`LarstiQ`	`debo: KPN (I'm across the atlantic)`
`23:47.02`	`LarstiQ`	`debo: oh, and Vodaphone`
`23:47.08`	`debo`	`ooops! sorry ....`
`23:47.16`	`loufoque`	`debo: oops yes it does, I thought I had read EDGE`
`23:47.22`	`LarstiQ`	`mwester-road: I haven't done anything special, it's set to No PM though`
`23:47.41`	`debo`	`ok .... so right now, the phone works and the gps?`
`23:48.05`	`mjr`	`"phone works" is an overstatement`
`23:48.08`	`mjr`	`you might get lucky`
`23:48.37`	`debo`	`I am asking all these stupid qns to figure out whether I should buy a GTA01 now or just wait a bit :) I know folks are working very hard to get it done .....`
`23:48.40`	`mjr`	`gta-01 gps pending legalese for the proprietary gps daemon (which will not be necessary on gta-02)`
`23:49.35`	`LarstiQ`	`mwester-road: well, unless you count flashing a kernel built by alphaone (iirc) that should have the fix to not keep the WM8753 powered.`
`23:49.41`	`debo`	`so it doesnt run gpsd?`
`23:50.08`	`LarstiQ`	`mjr: what do you mean with lucky?`
`23:50.58`	`mwester-road`	`The gps hardware in the current device is closed and requires a proprietary driver, which has not been released. If that driver were available, then gpsd would run.`
`23:51.09`	`mjr`	`debo, I'm not sure what's the canonical gps daemon plan right now; it may be gpsd, but it'll need a preprocessor of sorts`
`23:51.28`	`mwester-road`	`Sigh - why is the build suddenly downloading qtopia?`
`23:51.59`	`debo`	`mjr: has anyone talked to the gps chip using openmoko as yet`
`23:52.04`	`mjr`	`yes`
`23:52.50`	`mwester-road`	`In the interest of full disclosure, that "yes" should be "yes, but the binary driver to do so is not available at present".`
`23:53.09`	`mjr`	`legally, anyway`
`23:53.20`	`behdad`	`LarstiQ: glad you liked it`
`23:53.30`	`mwester-road`	`:) I don't discuss non-legal options, at least on IRC :)`
`23:53.51`	`debo`	`ok got it :)`
`23:54.00`	`guaqua`	`as far as i know, there will be a solution to the global locate agps used in gta01, but it's a hack (the chroot one)`
`23:54.00`	`debo`	`i guess the gta02 wont have these issues`
`23:54.46`	`mjr`	`It won't have that issue, but as most of the issues are software ones, the new hardware won't magically solve them either`
`23:54.58`	`mjr`	`one would hope though that by the time it's out the software is more mature also`
`23:55.05`	`debo`	`but we wont have the driver issues with teh gps, right?`
`23:55.11`	`mwester-road`	`If someone would pay the d*#(&%# lawyers to get them off their fat butts, then maybe, just maybe, a driver of sorts will be available for the current hardware. There's a lot of people who are pretty unhappy about that situation.`
`23:55.19`	`mjr`	`debo, correct`
`23:55.41`	`mjr`	`it'll spew out nmea over serial`
`23:56.00`	`guaqua`	`the problems with the gsm chip are pretty sad`
`23:56.09`	`guaqua`	`by this time those should've been solved`
`23:56.11`	`mwester-road`	`totally sad.`
`23:56.12`	`debo`	`i was trying to hunt for devices and the openmoko seems ideal (iphone doesnt have gps, nokia 810 doesnt have gsm) .... now need to wait for the community to deliver the cool platform :)`
`23:56.32`	`cjb_ie`	`debo: let's keep our fingers crossed`
`23:57.00`	`cjb_ie`	`i just took delivery today of a treo 680 which i should hopefully get talking to a bluetooth gps soon`
`23:57.08`	`debo`	`i guess i could have tried to use the iphone for my pranks if it had the gps :) ...... but i prefer to go completely open if possible`
`23:57.23`	`mwester-road`	`debo: it's got all the right stuff, the main problem is the lawyers. If the community had the GPS driver, and if we had a copy of the GSM modem documentation, we'd have most of the issues worked out long ago.`
`23:57.24`	`debo`	`will the 680 run openmoko?`
`23:58.06`	`cjb_ie`	`debo: not that i know of, though some people have booted linux on its siblings`
`23:59.37`	`debo`	`mwester-road: i can imagine that .... but what would be the best thing ... suppose i want some device to read my location and tell my home computer that i was there at this time ...... thats all i want to do ...... and it would be great if i could make phone calls then i could only carry this one device ..... everything else for me is a bonus :)`

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