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| 05:31.03 | JaMa | moin |
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| 07:38.47 | morphis | heyho |
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| 07:45.55 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * r5eb6a9cc4874 10/libfsoframework/fsoframework/interfaces.vala: libfsoframework: add application service names |
| 07:45.59 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * rf85fc695094b 10/fsoappd/ (28 files in 10 dirs): fsoappd: add initial skeleton |
| 07:46.01 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * r1fb417bfa09c 10/fsoappd/ (5 files in 4 dirs): fsoappd: add skeleton of windowctrl_illume plugin |
| 07:46.02 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * r53e878722d2b 10/fsoappd/src/plugins/manager/ (Makefile.am plugin.vala): fsoappd: applications can now register and release a session with the daemon |
| 07:46.05 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * r30406e27ec10 10/fsoappd/src/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fsoappd: initialize window controller according to configuration |
| 07:46.06 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * rd5c08627fa55 10/fsoappd/vapi/gio-hacks.vapi: fsoappd: import gio-hacks.vapi from fsotdld |
| 07:46.08 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * r6b9d30b68ebb 10/fsoappd/src/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fsoappd: use provided library in all plugins |
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| 08:01.44 | antrik | appd? what's that? |
| 08:12.14 | morphis | antrik: a approach to implement lifecycle management for applications |
| 08:14.21 | Any_Key | morphis, like stop play on incoming call? |
| 08:15.05 | morphis | Any_Key: you mean stop playing music when a call arrives? |
| 08:15.48 | Any_Key | morphis, yes |
| 08:16.03 | morphis | yes and no |
| 08:16.18 | morphis | thats part of audio stream handling and application lifecycle handling |
| 08:16.38 | morphis | but in the end it should be enforced by the system that every audio mutes when a call should be enabled |
| 08:17.11 | morphis | this will be done with fsoaudiod by offering several alsa audio channels like media, alarms, etc. |
| 08:17.30 | morphis | when a call arrives now fsoaudiod will mute all these channels |
| 08:17.48 | morphis | thats not really part of application lifecycle |
| 08:18.49 | morphis | fsoappd will get information about all open windows from E/Illume and then handle the states of the windows by sending events to the registered applications |
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| 08:42.58 | mickey|office | morning folks |
| 08:43.09 | JaMa | morning |
| 08:43.10 | mickey|office | bummer, it's already monday? |
| 08:43.14 | mickey|office | looking for the lost weekend |
| 08:43.22 | JaMa | :) |
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| 08:48.45 | morphis | mickey|office: morning, you didn't enjoyed the sunny weekend? sounds like you were working :) |
| 08:49.54 | mickey|office | morphis: depends on the definition of working... saturday i had to help my wife organizing her birthday party (in her current state, she can't carry things any more, so i need to), sunday we had a curse for taking care of babies the whole day and at the evening a family dinner... so i had 0 time for anything. |
| 08:50.24 | morphis | hehe |
| 08:50.39 | morphis | so you enjoyed the weekend in real life ... sometimes a very good thing :D |
| 08:50.47 | mickey|office | *nod* |
| 08:50.52 | mickey|office | err, s/curse/seminar/ |
| 08:51.13 | mickey|office | heh |
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| 08:51.13 | mickey|office | or course, for that matter |
| 08:51.45 | mickey|office | and now i have to review two papers about stuff i don't know anything about, but for some reason i'm on the list of reviewers for IEEE conferences *cough* |
| 08:52.49 | morphis | for IEEE conferences? and whats the topic of those papers? |
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| 08:53.11 | PaulFertser | curse for taking care, lol |
| 08:53.27 | PaulFertser | Hi everybody :) |
| 08:53.42 | morphis | PaulFertser: heyho :) |
| 08:53.59 | mickey|office | morphis: one is about dynamic resource allocation for cloud computing, the other one is about watermarking using wavelet transformations :D |
| 08:54.18 | mickey|office | hi PaulFertser |
| 08:55.42 | morphis | uhno, wavelet transformations ... |
| 08:57.07 | PaulFertser | It's great the things are moving on despite you guys are so busy. 3g working on Pre is the real thing! |
| 08:58.05 | mickey|office | :) |
| 08:58.35 | mickey|office | ya, that's quite cool. and thanks to mrmoku's work on the ISI dissector, we may have progress again on the 900 |
| 08:59.29 | morphis | :) |
| 08:59.51 | morphis | there will be more progress in other directions than hardware support ... :) |
| 09:00.38 | morphis | mickey|office: how do I emit a signal with plain dbus methods? |
| 09:01.02 | morphis | construct a message with dbus_message_new_signal(...)? |
| 09:03.36 | mickey|office | morphis: yes, then dbus_message_append_args_valist |
| 09:03.45 | mickey|office | is the easiest way |
| 09:04.09 | morphis | ok |
| 09:04.32 | mickey|office | but this is only useful, if you absolutely don't want to link against gio |
| 09:04.58 | morphis | it's e-module ... |
| 09:05.03 | mickey|office | ah, heh, ok |
| 09:05.09 | morphis | s/it's/it's a/ |
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| 09:05.44 | morphis | it's a WindowController for E so we can show/hide/destroy windows from FSO |
| 09:05.54 | mickey|office | ok |
| 09:06.48 | morphis | you maybe saw my commits for fsoappd |
| 09:07.40 | morphis | as I though and experimented a little bit with our idea about a fully integrated telephony application and I think it's better when we do it with X11 integration but still the simple waay |
| 09:13.03 | mickey|office | as long as the X11 integration is optional, i'm all ears |
| 09:13.40 | mickey|office | i still have the EZX devices in my mind, they are coming with 48 megs of RAM and QVGA, i don't think i want X there |
| 09:13.59 | mickey|office | actually i know i don't want it there ;) |
| 09:14.20 | morphis | sure, it's not suitable for X11 |
| 09:15.18 | morphis | thats up to the way how do we can separate different rendering processes for the framebuffer |
| 09:15.36 | morphis | as I don't want to have on big process who does all |
| 09:16.51 | morphis | but framebuffer support of Efl is not in a very good shape |
| 09:17.12 | mickey|office | really? last time i used it it was ok |
| 09:18.47 | mickey|office | probably only few people are using it still |
| 09:19.02 | morphis | don't last time I had various issues with touchscreen integration |
| 09:19.14 | morphis | s/don't/don't know/ |
| 09:20.22 | morphis | the environment I am currently thinking about is: X11 + Illume + Elfe + E DBus WindowController + fsoappd + fsoeventsd |
| 09:20.40 | morphis | so be simple with using plain FSO to handle all system stuff |
| 09:21.11 | mickey|office | touchscreen, ya, i had to patch EFL in OE to make it work last time. |
| 09:22.45 | mickey|office | hmm, ok, multiple processes are basically a no-go for framebuffer access. one could imagine a cooperative scheme where only the active process draws and all the inactive are not, but that means the active process always must carry out additional duties, such as drawing the panel, alerts, etc. |
| 09:23.31 | mickey|office | which is actually what Trolltech did, btw. |
| 09:25.20 | morphis | I played a little bit with it like I told you already |
| 09:25.32 | morphis | but it was not what I really want to have |
| 09:25.54 | morphis | think about the small environment above + some small applications for doing calls, settings, etc. |
| 09:26.17 | morphis | no more legacy stuff |
| 09:26.26 | mickey|office | yes, so far we're on one line |
| 09:26.30 | morphis | only things that fit well into the env |
| 09:26.42 | mickey|office | we split where the processes and the dependencies are coming in :) |
| 09:26.53 | morphis | yes |
| 09:27.10 | mickey|office | but if the individual components are written properly, it might be able to take them and fit them into my idea as well |
| 09:27.16 | mickey|office | we'll see |
| 09:27.47 | morphis | for example fsoappd you can use as well as it takes a window-controller plugin to manage the windows |
| 09:28.05 | morphis | so there is no real X11 or E dependency if you want |
| 09:28.26 | morphis | so you are really going to do it as plain framebuffer application? |
| 09:28.51 | mickey|office | i want it to be able to, yes |
| 09:29.06 | mickey|office | not necessarily limited to being _just_ that |
| 09:29.26 | morphis | ok |
| 09:29.30 | mickey|office | e.g. zhone and zhone2 are usable standalone or in X11 |
| 09:30.08 | morphis | jepp |
| 09:31.24 | morphis | maybe we can share even things like design etc. |
| 09:35.11 | mickey|office | a bunch of highlevel EFL widgets would be good as well |
| 09:35.20 | mickey|office | like a full-featured self-contained dial pad in a widget or so |
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| 09:36.11 | morphis | jepp |
| 09:36.18 | morphis | think about a libaurora |
| 09:36.45 | mickey|office | *nod* |
| 09:37.20 | morphis | I am on the way creating it .. |
| 09:37.34 | morphis | (or it's the next step after basics of fsoappd are done) |
| 09:39.41 | morphis | so I am on the way home |
| 09:39.43 | morphis | cya |
| 09:39.45 | mickey|office | cu |
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| 10:08.08 | mickey|office | morning GNUtoo, what's up |
| 10:08.38 | GNUtoo | hi |
| 10:09.01 | GNUtoo | JaMa, hi, how can I start debugging the ubifs boot issue? |
| 10:09.26 | GNUtoo | I tried the dfu-util from git |
| 10:09.33 | GNUtoo | it didn't work |
| 10:09.43 | GNUtoo | device:om-gta02 |
| 10:14.30 | GNUtoo | mickey|office, any news on SHR+FSO? |
| 10:15.59 | mickey|office | GNUtoo: not from me, no time to work on anything the last days. mrmoku making great progress with ISI packet dissection for wireshark. i plan to revisit the ISI modem any time soon. morphis started with a small smartphone framework based on FSO. at some point of time i will start with a small featurephone framework based on FSO. |
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| 10:16.41 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 10:17.04 | GNUtoo | better than aurora/zhone2 ? |
| 10:17.04 | mickey|office | (note that the last two sentences refer to UI projects) |
| 10:17.08 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 10:17.13 | mickey|office | better is relative |
| 10:17.17 | mickey|office | no more demo |
| 10:17.21 | mickey|office | something that works and is usable |
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| 10:18.22 | mickey|office | i.e. not just quickly putting something together, but putting a bit more thought into how a user will interact with the software |
| 10:18.48 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 10:18.52 | GNUtoo | can I try it? |
| 10:19.48 | GNUtoo | or is it too early? |
| 10:19.49 | mickey|office | morphis' stuff will soon land in some git, my stuff hasn't even begun, but will of course also be checked in |
| 10:20.24 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 10:21.59 | GNUtoo | http://www.pastie.org/1782173 |
| 10:22.07 | GNUtoo | finally got it with a lot of trial |
| 10:22.15 | GNUtoo | (my serial cable is broken) |
| 10:27.39 | PaulFertser | Does anyone remember the utility (present in OE) capable of editing uboot env? |
| 10:32.26 | DocScrutinizer2 | ummm |
| 10:32.47 | DocScrutinizer | I seem to remember it didn't |
| 10:32.49 | JaMa | GNUtoo: maybe you can dump whole image written by dfu-util and nandwrite and compare them |
| 10:33.05 | JaMa | GNUtoo: or first few blocks maybe would be enough |
| 10:33.13 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 10:33.19 | GNUtoo | I should find a free microsd then |
| 10:33.19 | JaMa | but I don't know internal ubi structure |
| 10:33.28 | GNUtoo | neither do I |
| 10:33.39 | GNUtoo | hmmm |
| 10:35.46 | DocScrutinizer | http://labs.igep.es/index.php/How_to_modify_the_uboot_environment_from_userspace |
| 10:38.08 | DocScrutinizer | (first hit on google) |
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| 11:05.33 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: oh yes, u-boot-utils it is, thanks :) |
| 11:06.05 | DocScrutinizer | I seem to recall it failed for me |
| 11:07.02 | DocScrutinizer | had a short look back when errr... I prepared that moki11-FWflash-SD-image? |
| 11:11.25 | DocScrutinizer | for sth completely different: You all heard about N900 speakers blow when xprot wasn't protecting them? I got 4 nice replacement speakers from ownta.com. Just in case. Make sure they send you the right ones (picture as of the N81?, compare with my people.om.org N900 disassembly picture of speakers) |
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| 11:32.28 | DocScrutinizer | http://www.ownta.com/original-nokia-n82-e72-e66-x6-n85-cell-phone-speaker.html has a picture of correct speakers. I chatted with ownta via "Ask..." and pointed them to the non-matching photo, and they sent me the correct speakers plus one like on N900-speaker photo for free :-D |
| 11:32.54 | DocScrutinizer | No idea why they don't fix their website |
| 11:34.05 | DocScrutinizer | anyway, if you're in development of a N900 distro that has no xprot, I guess you might want a pair of these, they are cheap as well |
| 11:35.18 | DocScrutinizer | here's what I ordered (with the wrong picture): http://www.ownta.com/original-nokia-n81-n900-cell-phone-speaker.html |
| 11:38.07 | mickey|office | lets see if we ever get a GSM voice call done ;) |
| 11:38.19 | mickey|office | but good to see there are replacement speakers |
| 11:40.27 | DocScrutinizer | not for long I guess |
| 11:41.38 | DocScrutinizer | well, Nokia is supposed to keep spare parts on stock for quite some years, but I bet they ask to pay for them in gold |
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| 11:43.09 | morphis | heyho |
| 11:44.35 | mickey|office | wb |
| 11:44.55 | DocScrutinizer | btw speaker pop on mp3 playback usually |
| 11:45.35 | DocScrutinizer | still problems with GSM calls? what's the issue? audio, or modem init? |
| 11:48.01 | DocScrutinizer | mickey|office: speaker burnout issue is caused by the "too good" amp that has no (1uF like FR :-P XD ) decoupling capacitor and so is well capable of driving speaker with insanely low freq high amplitude signal |
| 11:49.16 | morphis | starts his first shr-core build now! |
| 11:49.19 | mickey|office | we've been sidetracked by modem init just when we started with inspecting the cmtspeech thing |
| 11:49.38 | morphis | what's cmtspeech? |
| 11:49.59 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07aurora * ra1772330ba9a 10/aurora-e-gadgets/ (23 files in 4 dirs): fso-illume-connector: add first working version |
| 11:50.03 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07aurora * rcd2ffa8471af 10/aurora-e-gadgets/ (3 files in 2 dirs): |
| 11:50.03 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: aurora-e-gagdets: improve dbus-window-control to be able to control windows over dbus |
| 11:50.03 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: Please note: The code is not finished yet and need improvements like error handling, |
| 11:50.03 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: proper dbus return types and more. |
| 11:50.04 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07aurora * r9ce74fd17123 10/aurora-e-gadgets/ (11 files in 4 dirs): aurora-e-gadgets: rename fso-illume-connector to dbus-window-controller |
| 11:50.17 | DocScrutinizer | mickey|office: spy at meego&ofono? |
| 11:50.20 | mickey|office | libcmtspeechdata implements the audio data forwarder |
| 11:50.40 | mickey|office | on the n900 you need to grab the PCM data and forward it by hand :) |
| 11:50.58 | mickey|office | DocScrutinizer: yep, that's what we're doing right now with mrmoku enhancing the wireshark dissector |
| 11:51.03 | morphis | uuh |
| 11:51.27 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, and you for sure don't want to duplicate that nonsense implemented by Nokia, about syncing audio to GSM timeslots |
| 11:52.04 | mickey|office | morphis: ya, it sounds odd, but it's actually relatively cool, since it's the first device i know where we could - theoretically - now add audio processing |
| 11:53.18 | mickey|office | bbl, lunch |
| 11:53.31 | DocScrutinizer | they're trying to adapt cmtspeech buffer according to some parameters from GSM regarding RTT etc, so they keep delay to less than 20ms(!!!) and even as constant as possible |
| 11:53.32 | morphis | but whats the linux kernel doing else? just forwards the pcm data to userspace too, or do I miss something? |
| 11:53.47 | morphis | or it's the pcm data of the modem? |
| 11:54.35 | DocScrutinizer | yes, modem has a PCM audio interface, userspace cares about forwarding digitally to audiocard |
| 11:55.03 | DocScrutinizer | via PA (yuck!) |
| 11:56.08 | DocScrutinizer | http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2009/slides/Jyri-Sarha-audio_miniconf_slides.pdf |
| 11:57.00 | DocScrutinizer | madness starts at page 9 |
| 11:57.26 | DocScrutinizer | actually page 8 |
| 11:59.42 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:59.43 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:59.45 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:59.46 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:59.47 | morphis | and that works nice? |
| 11:59.48 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:59.53 | DocScrutinizer | YUCK ohmy |
| 12:00.09 | DocScrutinizer | well it works |
| 12:00.33 | DocScrutinizer | but in my book that's a friggin lot of absolutely useless overkill |
| 12:01.10 | morphis | as who will use the advantages? it's only a nokia thing so we will never see it again with a linux phone :) |
| 12:01.11 | DocScrutinizer | even cruft, as audio domain is completely unrelated to GSM timebeat |
| 12:03.57 | DocScrutinizer | there's a 3GPP rule that says "keep latency as low as possible", and Jyri Sarha obviously took this *very* literally and tried to optimize latency to another 5ms down, by adding tons of complicated and partially useless stuff |
| 12:05.53 | captainigloo | hi guys |
| 12:08.13 | captainigloo | if there is french people here, you migh be interrested by the EFL development day that will take place in Paris the 7th May |
| 12:09.25 | morphis | captainigloo: heyho, how was your holiday? |
| 12:09.47 | captainigloo | perfect :) |
| 12:10.40 | captainigloo | it's hard to come back to the reality |
| 12:12.25 | DocScrutinizer | ohmy last page: "thanks to Lennart Poettering" - so it's absolutely clear what mindset this crap is based on |
| 12:12.53 | CIA-10 | SHR: 03Martin.Jansa 07shr-chroot * r9136fd4fb003 10/ (1901 files in 112 dirs): system upgrade |
| 12:13.51 | CIA-10 | SHR: 03Martin.Jansa 07shr-chroot * rce5ed87862eb 10/usr/bin/json_pp-2.271.50-JSON-PP-2.271.50: system upgrade |
| 12:16.52 | DocScrutinizer | there are at least 2 wrong assumptions in this paper/concept: 1) AEC is done on AP, so the loop is AP->speaker->mic->AP and latency from AP to modem is completely irrelevant. 2) "AEC can work only when we got a proper 'constant' RTT on loop" is wrong, as a proper AEC is Adaptive as the acronym implies. It evaluates the RTT adaptively and dynamically |
| 12:17.38 | DocScrutinizer | this is the typical "tricks" Poettering is using all the time to explain why everybody need PA |
| 12:20.19 | DocScrutinizer | damn, they used proper AEC in FAX devices like back in 1985 |
| 12:21.12 | DocScrutinizer | there were problems with intercontinental FAX transmissions as the buffer wasn't large enough to do proper AEC for the echo >1s, on some devices. |
| 12:21.51 | DocScrutinizer | nevertheless *none* of those AEC needed a constant predefined echo (RTT) delay time to work |
| 12:23.13 | morphis | DocScrutinizer: it seems you are not a friend of Lennarts ideas :) |
| 12:23.43 | DocScrutinizer | I'm president of the lennart haters club |
| 12:24.57 | morphis | oh :D |
| 12:25.21 | morphis | you even don't like his systemd approach? |
| 12:26.32 | DocScrutinizer | :x |
| 12:28.47 | morphis | ok :) |
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| 12:52.16 | mickey|office | heh |
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| 13:12.19 | DocScrutinizer | heh? |
| 13:14.14 | morphis | ? |
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| 13:23.16 | mickey|office | heh is a mild sound of amusement |
| 13:31.09 | DocScrutinizer | aah |
| 13:37.56 | DocScrutinizer | btw about AEC: a good one deals with multiple echos at varying delay, with individual equalization for each one (the echo from your cheek will have different frequencies attenuated than the direct in-case feedback from speaker to mic, and the reflection from table surface when using speakerphone). Of course the freq response of earpiece also is quite different to that of speakers, and a AEC will deal with all those constantly |
| 13:37.57 | DocScrutinizer | changing parameters, for at least some 3..5 main echoes |
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| 13:42.19 | DocScrutinizer | it's quite a bit of correlating, attenuating and equalizing computational load, but nothing like rocket science, easily implementable on weaker CPUs than those found in FR and N900, and for sure you don't need that cruft sketched in that pdf-paper |
| 13:44.20 | mickey|office | hmm |
| 13:44.27 | mickey|office | we'll see how it sounds in 'bare' mode |
| 13:44.34 | mickey|office | if/when we ever get this to work :) |
| 13:45.08 | DocScrutinizer | sure |
| 13:46.13 | DocScrutinizer | I guess this BB5 RAPUYAMA modem has an internal AEC anyway, like probably most GSM chipsets do |
| 13:46.23 | mickey|office | that's what i would expect |
| 13:46.49 | mickey|office | however given the black box it is... if it's not activated by default, we might have a hard time activating it |
| 13:47.03 | DocScrutinizer | yoh |
| 13:47.07 | mickey|office | AT%N wasn't exactly straightforward either ;) |
| 13:47.13 | DocScrutinizer | lol |
| 13:48.24 | DocScrutinizer | mickey|office: it seems there are quite a number of feature phones with BB5 chipset, and for a lot of them the FW image is available (it's arm as well) |
| 13:49.26 | DocScrutinizer | disassembling those might yield some knowledge |
| 13:51.28 | DocScrutinizer | I wonder if Nokia is selling modem modules with BB5 - and possibly some better documentation than we got from those ISI papers and ofono |
| 13:53.17 | DocScrutinizer | anyway N900 BB5 isn't exactly a completely black box, you can extract the modem firmware from fiasco image, and disassemble |
| 13:54.15 | DocScrutinizer | jacekowski did that |
| 13:55.05 | DocScrutinizer | he told me a few "tricks" (like start addr, cmdset switching, similar things). Can dig them out if anybody's interested |
| 14:01.15 | DocScrutinizer | I'd be surprised if the osmocon guys didn't have a look at it as well |
| 14:01.16 | mickey|office | hmm, sounds definitely interesting, but i guess these things only come in handy, once we managed to talk to the modem properly in the first place |
| 14:01.42 | DocScrutinizer | :nod: |
| 14:02.30 | DocScrutinizer | though OTOH you remember the bug in moko FW with RTS/CTS? |
| 14:03.13 | DocScrutinizer | you could work around such flaws if you know exactly what's the issue on modem FW side |
| 14:04.27 | DocScrutinizer | plus the workaround on AP side might be burried deep in the structure of the communication layer, not bound to a few particular lines of code, and of course not commented at all |
| 14:04.44 | DocScrutinizer | (in ofono for example) |
| 14:06.21 | DocScrutinizer | basically of the class race-condition |
| 14:06.56 | morphis | captainigloo: ping |
| 14:07.04 | DocScrutinizer | well, I honestly hope we don't run into such buggers |
| 14:07.11 | mickey|office | ya, me too |
| 14:07.35 | DocScrutinizer | ...as I have a hard time publishing a fixed modem firmware for N900 ;-D |
| 14:08.03 | mickey|office | it's almost as if those vendors were bid-rigging so that we run into a different problem on every device... |
| 14:09.42 | DocScrutinizer | ~dict bid-rigging |
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| 14:10.17 | DocScrutinizer | woohoo |
| 14:10.23 | DocScrutinizer | apt: hi! |
| 14:10.24 | apt | hi |
| 14:10.43 | mickey|office | Absprachen treffen |
| 14:10.57 | DocScrutinizer | aah |
| 14:11.59 | DocScrutinizer | what happened to infobot? did she leave automatically when apt joined? |
| 14:19.01 | captainigloo | morphis, pong |
| 14:27.15 | morphis | captainigloo: I wanted to ask you what your further plans with elfe are |
| 14:28.30 | captainigloo | morphis, first fix bugs and regressions added 2 weeks ago |
| 14:28.46 | morphis | ok |
| 14:28.54 | captainigloo | than we already talked about the possibility to have a config per phone |
| 14:29.12 | morphis | jepp, we already did that in the shr e-wm config |
| 14:29.24 | captainigloo | it's already done ? |
| 14:29.33 | morphis | the e-wm-config-illume2 currently already has machine specific things for the palmpre |
| 14:29.36 | morphis | Slyon did it |
| 14:29.43 | captainigloo | ok todo-- :) |
| 14:29.46 | morphis | hehe |
| 14:30.08 | morphis | but I have another question, how do you currently launch applications? with a simple system(...) call? |
| 14:30.13 | captainigloo | so you keep have a 64x64px icons ? |
| 14:30.25 | captainigloo | -keep |
| 14:30.40 | captainigloo | nope I use a ecore_exe |
| 14:30.56 | captainigloo | wich is more or less a wrapper arround system call |
| 14:31.09 | morphis | ok |
| 14:31.14 | captainigloo | but with asynchronous concept |
| 14:31.21 | morphis | currently there is no elfe configuration in it |
| 14:31.45 | morphis | as we thought about switch to elfe as default home but defered that because the bugs and regressions you mentioned already |
| 14:32.04 | morphis | captainigloo: can you make the exec call exchangable? |
| 14:32.05 | captainigloo | yep the fact taht you can't hide the application list |
| 14:32.11 | morphis | for example |
| 14:32.20 | morphis | or the app-list button doesn't work |
| 14:32.32 | morphis | as I am currently working on a thing called fsoappd |
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| 14:32.35 | captainigloo | what you mean by exchangeable ? |
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| 14:32.45 | morphis | which implements a lifecycle API for applications |
| 14:32.52 | morphis | and that includes a Launcher API to |
| 14:32.54 | morphis | o |
| 14:33.08 | captainigloo | ok to launch application only once ? |
| 14:33.17 | morphis | so you launch a application with it like org.freesmartphone.Application.Launch("org.shr.dialer") |
| 14:33.28 | morphis | thats open |
| 14:33.40 | morphis | but to have a concept to tell applications about their state |
| 14:33.57 | morphis | and that a system component can control them |
| 14:34.18 | morphis | I already thought about putting each application in a cgroup so we can control it's memory usage later |
| 14:34.22 | morphis | for example |
| 14:34.40 | captainigloo | which are the sate of the app ? |
| 14:34.48 | captainigloo | state* |
| 14:35.03 | captainigloo | i mean i cant' see other than lauched and not launched |
| 14:35.35 | morphis | http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=specs.git;a=blob;f=org.freesmartphone.Application/org.freesmartphone.Application.Session.xml.in;h=eac21122fe52eee57397c0ef0737f972fa0f0062;hb=HEAD |
| 14:36.04 | morphis | you have three states RUNNING, PAUSED and STOPPED |
| 14:36.13 | captainigloo | hum |
| 14:36.55 | morphis | but it's in development, so nothing is decided to 100% |
| 14:36.56 | captainigloo | IMO it's the role of the WM to handle that |
| 14:37.10 | captainigloo | and e17 already knows that |
| 14:37.16 | morphis | I know |
| 14:37.24 | morphis | and e17 tells FSO about it |
| 14:37.36 | morphis | and FSO tells the application about it over DBus |
| 14:37.46 | morphis | but fsoappd can decide what to do |
| 14:38.02 | captainigloo | ok i see |
| 14:38.08 | morphis | so if some application has a higher priority than another one it can hide it |
| 14:38.21 | morphis | I did a e-module for that |
| 14:38.39 | morphis | which overs a DBus-API so FSO can control the window-management in e17 |
| 14:38.58 | captainigloo | ok that's interresting but i wonder if it doesn't overlapped with illume2 policies |
| 14:39.07 | morphis | ? |
| 14:39.33 | morphis | tell me more about it |
| 14:39.45 | captainigloo | i don't knwo more about it |
| 14:39.58 | captainigloo | but i think that that question should be asked on the e17 ML |
| 14:40.22 | captainigloo | devilhorns or raster already think about this kind of problem |
| 14:40.47 | captainigloo | and iirc there is code to do that, but as alwaus undocumented |
| 14:41.26 | captainigloo | but i missunderstood the role of illume2 policies |
| 14:41.30 | captainigloo | maybe |
| 14:41.57 | morphis | as far as I can see the illume2-policy offers to excute some code when some of the E_EVENT_BORDER* events occur |
| 14:42.04 | captainigloo | yep |
| 14:42.28 | captainigloo | so you should be informed via dbus the state of the APP |
| 14:42.43 | captainigloo | directly in this code |
| 14:43.14 | captainigloo | i don't know |
| 14:43.33 | captainigloo | your solution is more simpler IMO |
| 14:43.45 | morphis | sounds interesting |
| 14:44.41 | captainigloo | but it's always better to have that upstream i guess |
| 14:44.59 | morphis | captainigloo: look at http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=aurora.git;a=blob;f=aurora-e-gadgets/src/dbus-window-controller/e_mod_main.c;h=c34457d0f80f8436931ecb594b672718ca0c23d7;hb=HEAD |
| 14:45.08 | morphis | currently it's some dirty hacked code |
| 14:45.13 | morphis | something I can play with |
| 14:45.26 | morphis | but fsoappd is flexible in this case |
| 14:46.12 | captainigloo | ok so if I understand correctly as soon as a border is displayed on screen a message is sent ? |
| 14:46.46 | captainigloo | border==window |
| 14:47.01 | morphis | jepps, thats what my code does |
| 14:47.25 | morphis | and you can get a list of all windows with ListAll(), destroy them with Destroy(window_id) and the same with hide and show |
| 14:47.38 | captainigloo | yep i see |
| 14:48.03 | morphis | but maybe the illume policies are the better place to hook in |
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| 14:48.30 | captainigloo | yes i think |
| 14:48.37 | GNUtoo | captainigloo, hi |
| 14:48.38 | captainigloo | you should ask on the ML |
| 14:48.39 | GNUtoo | JaMa, what about OOB? |
| 14:48.42 | captainigloo | Hi GNUtoo |
| 14:48.47 | captainigloo | how are you guy ? |
| 14:49.01 | GNUtoo | captainigloo, there is written that you made a software keyboard in the news |
| 14:49.11 | GNUtoo | is there something to try or at least some screenshot? |
| 14:49.21 | captainigloo | oh well just a litle bit |
| 14:49.53 | morphis | captainigloo: but back to the launching capability of elfe, can you make it exchangeable? |
| 14:50.04 | captainigloo | morphis, yes it's trivial |
| 14:50.13 | captainigloo | it's just a matter of #ifdef |
| 14:50.16 | captainigloo | in the code |
| 14:50.21 | morphis | ok |
| 14:50.21 | captainigloo | to depends on your API |
| 14:50.43 | morphis | so we can add later a --enable-fso-support switch |
| 14:50.48 | captainigloo | yep |
| 14:51.34 | captainigloo | btw i need to add fso support to add user interraction like vibration when you enter/quit the edit mode for example |
| 14:52.12 | captainigloo | and i wonder if elfe should handle lock screen as well |
| 14:52.31 | morphis | captainigloo: it should |
| 14:53.14 | morphis | captainigloo: but to let elfe play well with fsoappd the class name of all windows opened by elfe should have some uniform name so we can exclude them from the application handling |
| 14:53.25 | morphis | like the illume windows already have "Illume-*" |
| 14:53.56 | captainigloo | yes, i'm not really aware of application classes |
| 14:54.01 | captainigloo | and it's why i keep illume-home as application name for elfe |
| 14:54.20 | captainigloo | but i should look more deeply in that concept |
| 14:55.04 | morphis | ok |
| 14:55.31 | captainigloo | you would like that each application launched by elfe has a specific class ? |
| 14:55.47 | captainigloo | or only internal elfe windows ? |
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| 14:56.00 | captainigloo | (i'm really lost with the concept of class and windows ...) |
| 14:57.25 | morphis | captainigloo: no, only the window elfe hosts itself |
| 14:57.48 | captainigloo | ok |
| 14:57.53 | morphis | as far as I know the class name of a X11 window is only a identifier the application can choose on it's own |
| 14:57.55 | DocScrutinizer | well, I discussed that appstate management with raster 2008 in Taipei, so I'd be surprised if there's nothing at all in illume/e |
| 14:57.56 | morphis | as the title can change |
| 14:57.59 | JaMa | GNUtoo: what with OOB? you think that dfu-utils writest to OOB while nandwrite doesn't? or something like that? |
| 14:58.01 | morphis | the class name should not |
| 14:58.20 | morphis | DocScrutinizer: what was the result of that discussion? |
| 14:58.28 | captainigloo | currently there is only 1 window in elfe |
| 14:58.30 | GNUtoo | maybe: |
| 14:58.36 | DocScrutinizer | a list of requirements |
| 14:58.37 | GNUtoo | *difference between uboot |
| 14:58.39 | JaMa | GNUtoo: btw pushed rebased n900-2.6.37+V3 branch after pushing phonet changes to oe |
| 14:58.42 | GNUtoo | 's oob and the kernel |
| 14:59.05 | GNUtoo | JaMa, are the changes pushed to oe.dev too (not oe-core) |
| 14:59.15 | GNUtoo | or absence of oob like you told |
| 14:59.29 | morphis | captainigloo: http://tronche.com/gui/x/icccm/sec-4.html#s-4.1.2.5 |
| 14:59.36 | JaMa | GNUtoo: yes both, oe and oe-core |
| 14:59.48 | JaMa | oe-core has also kernel from n900-2.6.37+V3 |
| 15:00.04 | GNUtoo | nice |
| 15:00.05 | JaMa | or meta-shr to be exact |
| 15:00.14 | captainigloo | morphis, ok i need to find a mail where raster was talking about cgroup in e17 |
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| 15:00.56 | DocScrutinizer | one point on that list iirc been a per-app configuration how to handle it |
| 15:01.30 | morphis | ok, so I should really talk to raster |
| 15:01.34 | captainigloo | http://www.mail-archive.com/enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net/msg29410.html |
| 15:02.00 | DocScrutinizer | another a differentiated set of states, that stop particular subfunctions, like X refresh, timers, whatnot |
| 15:02.09 | JaMa | GNUtoo: oob - strange that it would be broken/changed only in last month or so, because we're still using same u-boot in nor |
| 15:02.45 | GNUtoo | the headers are different |
| 15:02.57 | JaMa | GNUtoo: IIRC I have seen first report about broken ubi images (when written with dfu-util) after nand-utils upgrade in OE |
| 15:02.57 | GNUtoo | but a different kernel |
| 15:02.58 | DocScrutinizer | 3rd a central instance to query if it's ok with state of all apps to suspend device |
| 15:03.05 | GNUtoo | and we're using maybe a different QI |
| 15:03.17 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:03.33 | JaMa | s/nand-utils/mtd-utils/ |
| 15:04.07 | GNUtoo | http://pastie.org/1783080 |
| 15:04.12 | JaMa | GNUtoo: you can try to regenerate image after reverting this http://git.openembedded.org/cgit.cgi/openembedded/commit/?id=09e47006b8c877d043c11caf646b0cfb8a78f98c |
| 15:04.24 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:04.42 | DocScrutinizer | 4th a GUI to monitor and change states and config per app |
| 15:04.59 | DocScrutinizer | all disclaimer IIRC |
| 15:05.08 | JaMa | going home, bbl |
| 15:05.10 | morphis | captainigloo: ok, he's talking about the general appraoch with the cgroup thing to get a nice running system |
| 15:05.15 | DocScrutinizer | dude, that's like 3 years gone now |
| 15:05.24 | captainigloo | :) |
| 15:05.40 | morphis | DocScrutinizer: no problem, but could you remembered some points |
| 15:05.47 | morphis | but I will even talk to raster about that |
| 15:06.09 | morphis | captainigloo: I want cgroup more as a feature to control a process and it's child processes |
| 15:06.23 | morphis | as if one process forks the child process is still in the same cgroup |
| 15:06.39 | captainigloo | yep |
| 15:06.42 | morphis | and if I want to kill the application I can simply kill the cgroup |
| 15:06.51 | morphis | and it will kill even the child proceses |
| 15:07.38 | morphis | currently fsoappd is an experiment |
| 15:07.46 | morphis | we will see where it ends |
| 15:07.59 | captainigloo | another feature i would like |
| 15:08.14 | morphis | which one? |
| 15:08.15 | captainigloo | is the live snapshots of apps when you slide sown the top bar |
| 15:08.21 | captainigloo | down* |
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| 15:08.30 | morphis | you mean freezing it's state? |
| 15:08.44 | captainigloo | nope having a scrolled list of running apps |
| 15:08.49 | captainigloo | like in webos |
| 15:08.49 | morphis | ah ok |
| 15:08.56 | morphis | jepp that would be great |
| 15:09.13 | morphis | could be even another e-module |
| 15:09.13 | captainigloo | but it's only if the composite module is active |
| 15:09.29 | captainigloo | or the one that we already have on shr |
| 15:09.37 | morphis | that one is very simple |
| 15:09.39 | captainigloo | but instead of left/right/close |
| 15:09.51 | captainigloo | a list of snaphots of windows |
| 15:09.57 | captainigloo | and mouse gesture to close them |
| 15:10.04 | morphis | like in webOS |
| 15:10.07 | captainigloo | yep |
| 15:10.24 | morphis | we really need composite for this? |
| 15:10.32 | captainigloo | i think so |
| 15:10.40 | morphis | for doing the snapshot? |
| 15:10.47 | captainigloo | that's another option |
| 15:11.00 | morphis | or the feature to render the active content of the application window in the snapshot-window? |
| 15:11.06 | captainigloo | but i think it will consume to much ressources |
| 15:11.21 | captainigloo | that the role of the composite module |
| 15:11.43 | morphis | hm |
| 15:11.48 | morphis | we can do it the simple way |
| 15:11.51 | captainigloo | but if you don't have opengl-es accelerated hardware, you lose 30% of perfs |
| 15:12.01 | captainigloo | with composite sofware |
| 15:12.07 | DocScrutinizer | thought we got such a list long ago... :-S |
| 15:12.31 | morphis | DocScrutinizer: really? |
| 15:13.15 | DocScrutinizer | a dropdown list with all the running apps/windows to select which one to bring to front? sure |
| 15:13.54 | DocScrutinizer | was a big WTF to find it missing when I touched SHR some weeks ago |
| 15:14.30 | morphis | ah yes, but it was much simpler than captainigloo and I thought about |
| 15:14.41 | GNUtoo | can it be done with 2d acceleration? |
| 15:14.55 | DocScrutinizer | well, now it's definitely too simple :-P |
| 15:14.58 | captainigloo | GNUtoo, yes composite in e17 can be done by softsware |
| 15:15.24 | sChannall | morphis: you are involved in SHR on the Pre, right? If yes: do you also want to read the errors or do you want to have GarthPS all the fun? ;) .. If no: im sorry, don't mind me :) |
| 15:15.25 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, Hi I was advised to ask you about android wisdom, I wanna try to run SHR on Samsung Galaxy S, any hints? |
| 15:15.26 | captainigloo | but you need a 32bpp screen |
| 15:15.28 | GNUtoo | by 2d acceleration I mean stuff like xf86-video-omapfb or xf86-video-leofb |
| 15:15.42 | GNUtoo | captainigloo, ok |
| 15:15.44 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, hi |
| 15:15.46 | DocScrutinizer | but honestly that's what I found SHR doing since >>1 year now, spinning in circles |
| 15:16.38 | morphis | sChannall: read the errors and fix them? for sure I want do this |
| 15:16.44 | morphis | sChannall: why are you asking? |
| 15:16.47 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, I'll have to laucnh a build and then I'm back |
| 15:17.21 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, OK I hope I'll be still online |
| 15:17.23 | morphis | captainigloo: I think we can do such a nice window switcher without composite support |
| 15:17.27 | sChannall | morphis: because GarthPS is aleady looking at it.... its only when "make install-all" |
| 15:17.34 | captainigloo | morphis, yes |
| 15:17.49 | morphis | sChannall: ah you mean bugs with the fso-installer? |
| 15:17.58 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, so basically you have a galaxy S, do you already know how to boot debian or something like that on it? |
| 15:18.17 | captainigloo | morphis, it coule be to detect if current session has composite and swith back to screenshot of window if compostite is not present |
| 15:18.32 | morphis | jepp |
| 15:18.35 | sChannall | morphis: yep, it fails on mounting and is all very strange.. if you want i would send you the log either |
| 15:18.52 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, nope, I know how to run Ubuntu in chroot (seen on youtube) |
| 15:18.58 | morphis | sChannall: can you open a bug report about in FSO trac? |
| 15:19.05 | morphis | and attach the log there? |
| 15:19.11 | morphis | sChannall: so you have a Pre device? |
| 15:19.15 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, try to find how to boot something else than android |
| 15:19.22 | sChannall | yep it arrived finally :) |
| 15:19.45 | sChannall | ill open one .. give me two minutes :) |
| 15:19.57 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, I read troug XDA forums for last three days to collect information, still nothing |
| 15:19.58 | morphis | ah you are sC ... damn it, was confused by the "different" nickname :) |
| 15:20.02 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:20.11 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, does it speak fastboot? |
| 15:20.36 | Any_Key | there is two projects on github in early stage |
| 15:20.45 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, AFAIK - no |
| 15:21.29 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, the very first thing to do is to find out how to boot a kernel |
| 15:21.36 | GNUtoo | be it android or GNU/Linux |
| 15:22.09 | GNUtoo | I bet it's already rooted, since it's easily rootable by default |
| 15:22.29 | sChannall | does one have to be registered at FSO to post an issue to the trac? |
| 15:23.25 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, yes rooted of course, next step is to flash custom "ROM"s. |
| 15:23.28 | captainigloo | morphis, and to finish with elfe there is always unity API and notification to add |
| 15:23.33 | captainigloo | too much things .... |
| 15:23.41 | GNUtoo | Any_Key, ok, try to find that out, and then come back to me |
| 15:23.55 | GNUtoo | and document your steps |
| 15:24.02 | GNUtoo | like on SHR or FSO wiki |
| 15:24.43 | morphis | captainigloo: but it's the same for |
| 15:24.43 | morphis | me |
| 15:24.57 | morphis | I have msmcommd/fsogsmd/fsoaudiod/fsoappd/fso-connman-plugin |
| 15:25.05 | morphis | thats a lot things |
| 15:25.17 | morphis | but I have a lot of free time the next three weeks |
| 15:25.28 | captainigloo | and i want to create a dedicated phone theme for Enna also |
| 15:25.40 | GNUtoo | morphis, is there some screenshots of your featurephone app? |
| 15:26.01 | captainigloo | what's the featurephone app ? |
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| 15:26.07 | Any_Key | GNUtoo, hope it'll be easy doable |
| 15:26.44 | GNUtoo | morphis, sorry never mind |
| 15:26.51 | GNUtoo | I read badly what mickeyl said |
| 15:27.28 | captainigloo | there is a port of SHR on HTC magic ? |
| 15:27.29 | morphis | GNUtoo: what did he said? |
| 15:28.09 | GNUtoo | <mickey|office> GNUtoo: not from me, no time to work on anything the last days. mrmoku making great progress with ISI packet dissection for wireshark. i plan to revisit the ISI modem any time soon. morphis started with a small smartphone framework based on FSO. at some point of time i will start with a small featurephone framework based on FSO. |
| 15:28.50 | GNUtoo | captainigloo, you've got an htc magic? |
| 15:29.12 | morphis | GNUtoo: mickey|office and I talked about doing a completly integrated telephony application and I played a little bit with some code |
| 15:29.13 | captainigloo | nope but a guy of enlightenement-fs has |
| 15:29.15 | morphis | GNUtoo: but I don |
| 15:29.24 | morphis | GNUtoo: but it is not what I want |
| 15:29.50 | morphis | GNUtoo: I think more about a little environment based on: E17 + Elfe + FSO + fsoappd +fsoeventsd |
| 15:29.58 | morphis | so only plain FSO + E17 |
| 15:30.03 | GNUtoo | morphis, maybe you need to see how n900 look like |
| 15:30.21 | morphis | with the aspect to do most things simple as possible |
| 15:30.23 | GNUtoo | because you seem to like too much the framebuffer because you're influenced by palm-pre |
| 15:30.31 | morphis | no |
| 15:30.34 | morphis | I want X11 |
| 15:30.34 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:30.38 | GNUtoo | ok nice!!!! |
| 15:31.01 | morphis | mickey|office wants framebuffer as he even wants to target old phones |
| 15:31.06 | GNUtoo | most games depends on X11 |
| 15:31.16 | morphis | but there should be someting like a libaurora where things come together |
| 15:31.26 | morphis | like widgets, configuration stuff, etc. |
| 15:31.30 | arcol | hi |
| 15:31.32 | GNUtoo | adapting everything including GTK....would be very hard with framebuffer |
| 15:31.44 | arcol | does elfe has a webpage/git/svn whatever? |
| 15:31.50 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:31.53 | morphis | I don't want any legacy apps anymore like piding etc. |
| 15:32.23 | captainigloo | arcol, on the Enlightenment SVN in E-MODULES-EXTRA |
| 15:32.30 | arcol | thanks |
| 15:32.46 | captainigloo | http://svn.enlightenment.org/svn/e/trunk/E-MODULES-EXTRA/elfe/ |
| 15:32.53 | GNUtoo | morphis, maybe but we need a transition |
| 15:32.59 | GNUtoo | else we're left without: |
| 15:33.01 | GNUtoo | *irc client |
| 15:33.03 | GNUtoo | *console |
| 15:33.10 | GNUtoo | *im client |
| 15:33.11 | GNUtoo | etc... |
| 15:33.17 | GNUtoo | not sure about the im client |
| 15:33.38 | DocScrutinizer | no more legacy apps -> go for android |
| 15:34.06 | GNUtoo | lol indeed |
| 15:34.14 | GNUtoo | we need at least a transition |
| 15:34.33 | DocScrutinizer | well, I don't like any transition to android |
| 15:34.58 | GNUtoo | hmmm |
| 15:35.03 | sChannall | morphis: i have not yet recived an email from the fso trac so i was not able to post the issue... |
| 15:35.04 | DocScrutinizer | the whole purpose of a linux phone is to enable "legacy" apps |
| 15:35.11 | GNUtoo | efl is nice |
| 15:35.17 | GNUtoo | the legacy apps too |
| 15:35.25 | GNUtoo | we need both |
| 15:35.37 | captainigloo | IMO if every app was written with EFL you don't need framebuffer :P |
| 15:35.41 | GNUtoo | but if we can efl-ize every app, why not? |
| 15:36.46 | captainigloo | the problem is that it must be done in the right way :) |
| 15:37.08 | GNUtoo | the n900 way is good |
| 15:37.18 | GNUtoo | I mean there are legacy app that are integrated |
| 15:37.27 | arcol | GNUtoo: like? |
| 15:37.27 | captainigloo | GNUtoo, you are not in Paris the 7th May ? |
| 15:37.51 | GNUtoo | captainigloo, why? I've family in paris |
| 15:38.02 | captainigloo | GNUtoo, there is a EFL dev day |
| 15:38.07 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:38.15 | captainigloo | the 7th with french presentation of Edje and elementary |
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| 15:38.21 | captainigloo | i'm doing the edje presentation |
| 15:38.29 | captainigloo | it's of course completly free |
| 15:38.32 | GNUtoo | how big is the presentation? |
| 15:38.38 | GNUtoo | *presentations |
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| 15:39.06 | captainigloo | GNUtoo, http://enlightenment.fr/2011/03/31/enlightenment-france-et-ordissimo-une-journee-de-presentation-des-efls/ |
| 15:39.41 | GNUtoo | ah ok |
| 15:39.44 | captainigloo | and after that we have a stand at Solution linux |
| 15:39.47 | GNUtoo | I saw an ordissimo |
| 15:40.13 | captainigloo | they are doing great job with e17, but some code is closed |
| 15:40.15 | captainigloo | :( |
| 15:40.20 | GNUtoo | yes indeed |
| 15:40.38 | captainigloo | and there are using more and more efl for core applications |
| 15:40.42 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:40.53 | GNUtoo | they didn't even integrate well the GTK apps it seems |
| 15:41.05 | GNUtoo | their gtkrc don't seem good if I remember well |
| 15:41.20 | captainigloo | it's not so bad |
| 15:41.26 | GNUtoo | note that I only saw one in a shop in France |
| 15:41.38 | captainigloo | me too |
| 15:42.30 | captainigloo | ok go back to elfe code :) |
| 15:43.03 | GNUtoo | hmmm |
| 15:43.07 | GNUtoo | it's a saturday |
| 15:43.12 | GNUtoo | maybe I could try to come |
| 15:43.16 | GNUtoo | in train... |
| 15:43.26 | captainigloo | you're welcome |
| 15:43.43 | arcol | captainigloo: efreet version 1.0.0 required |
| 15:43.49 | GNUtoo | ok thanks |
| 15:44.01 | captainigloo | arcol, all efl in 1.0.0 is required |
| 15:44.07 | captainigloo | for elfe |
| 15:44.11 | arcol | mine is from svn and it versions as 0.5.0.xxx |
| 15:44.21 | arcol | it is like one month old or so |
| 15:44.24 | captainigloo | ouch a very old version |
| 15:44.32 | captainigloo | i guess not |
| 15:44.40 | captainigloo | efl 1.0 was released in february |
| 15:44.54 | captainigloo | and efreet is part of them |
| 15:45.05 | arcol | hmm |
| 15:45.07 | arcol | dunno then |
| 15:45.11 | captainigloo | arcol, wich distro ? |
| 15:45.12 | GNUtoo | morphis, btw how long the pre takes to arrive, it's still not there, because If it arrives before the 7th may, I could go at the efl presentation and give it to captainigloo |
| 15:45.27 | arcol | I use e svn |
| 15:45.42 | GNUtoo | captainigloo, btw cotulla is still working on alsa |
| 15:46.05 | captainigloo | arcol, you maby have old .pc |
| 15:46.15 | arcol | mabye |
| 15:46.25 | arcol | I installed today's efreet |
| 15:46.33 | arcol | just like 20sec ago |
| 15:46.50 | captainigloo | mine is Version: 1.0.999.58544 |
| 15:46.58 | captainigloo | 2 hours ago |
| 15:47.08 | arcol | I want to test this elfe stuff, because I only sawn youtube video, and there were some things which I didnt like |
| 15:47.26 | arcol | so before complaining I want to test the newest version:) |
| 15:47.34 | captainigloo | comments are more than welcome |
| 15:47.45 | captainigloo | and help even better ;) |
| 15:48.17 | arcol | :) |
| 15:48.32 | arcol | make finished |
| 15:48.45 | arcol | no executable. there is no x-ui.sh |
| 15:49.09 | captainigloo | ah yes you need to have x-ui.sh in your path |
| 15:49.20 | captainigloo | it's a scripted present in e directory |
| 15:49.22 | arcol | do I need xephyr or so to be able to launch it? |
| 15:49.27 | captainigloo | yes |
| 15:49.33 | captainigloo | it's for test purpose |
| 15:49.37 | arcol | hmm |
| 15:49.43 | captainigloo | it's easyer for me to test like that |
| 15:49.48 | arcol | so I cant run it as a separate applictiona? |
| 15:49.53 | captainigloo | nope |
| 15:49.56 | captainigloo | it's a e module |
| 15:50.07 | captainigloo | and you need to use illume2 profile |
| 15:50.14 | captainigloo | disable illume-home module |
| 15:50.18 | captainigloo | and activate elfe |
| 15:50.28 | captainigloo | it's a replacement for illume-home |
| 15:50.42 | captainigloo | wich is part of illume2 set of modules |
| 15:50.49 | arcol | that seems complicated |
| 15:51.06 | captainigloo | go in e sources directory |
| 15:51.22 | arcol | into trunk? |
| 15:51.23 | captainigloo | and launch like that x-ui.sh --profile=illume-home --screen=480x800 |
| 15:51.26 | captainigloo | yep |
| 15:51.45 | captainigloo | sorry ./x-ui.sh --profile=illume-home --screen=480x800 |
| 15:52.17 | arcol | segmentation fault |
| 15:52.18 | arcol | :) |
| 15:52.20 | arcol | and a black window |
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| 15:52.47 | captainigloo | ahah :) |
| 15:53.20 | arcol | I assume, I need to install the 'e' directory too |
| 15:53.29 | arcol | e/trunk/e/ |
| 15:53.46 | morphis | GNUtoo: mine is even not here |
| 15:53.58 | morphis | GNUtoo: but I will ping Palm today |
| 15:54.07 | morphis | and ask whats the state of shipping |
| 15:54.33 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 15:54.45 | arcol | hmm |
| 15:54.57 | arcol | is palm is the best target for shr development?;-) |
| 15:59.08 | mickey|office | right now it's the best compromise between age of hardware and level of support |
| 16:01.09 | arcol | hmm |
| 16:01.25 | arcol | I always thought n900 will be the natural target... |
| 16:01.39 | arcol | but maybe it is just outpriced and more like a mini computer then a phone |
| 16:02.47 | morphis | a Palm Pre is very cheap these days |
| 16:02.52 | morphis | and a N900 not |
| 16:04.02 | arcol | dunno, here (hungary) nor palm pre nor n900 can be bought from providers |
| 16:04.24 | arcol | so one is like 280EUR the other is like 300EUR |
| 16:07.09 | captainigloo | if we could have alsa on the htc desire/nexus One it could be a good target too |
| 16:07.19 | morphis | arcol: you will get a Palm Pre very cheap at ebay |
| 16:07.42 | GNUtoo | yes the first version should be cheap |
| 16:07.49 | arcol | I own an n900, and all I lack on that phone is python-elementary. |
| 16:07.51 | arcol | :) |
| 16:08.15 | arcol | I do have 3 applications what I developped myself, and cant use on a phone. |
| 16:08.17 | GNUtoo | arcol, what do you run on it? |
| 16:08.34 | GNUtoo | maemo,meego,or SHR? |
| 16:08.38 | arcol | GNUtoo: maemo |
| 16:09.14 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 16:09.15 | arcol | I use daily: calls, 3G internet, wifi, camera I use weekly: sms |
| 16:09.21 | captainigloo | arcol, developped with python elm ? |
| 16:10.04 | arcol | captainigloo: I developped a dictionary application, an application what I use for work, and a tipping point application. (you know when you are going to dinner, and you are 6 people, and you are dividing the receipt) |
| 16:10.33 | arcol | I used the dictionary app back in my openmoko days. Was awesome |
| 16:11.09 | arcol | I use the application what I developped for work on a laptop in 800x480 window like 1.5 years already:), and the tipping point is demo only this time |
| 16:12.53 | arcol | I would share with world two apps (dict, tipping point) once I could run it on maemo:) |
| 16:14.56 | arcol | captainigloo: ok, now I can run e in xephyr and ../../x-ui.sh --profile=illume-home --screen=480x800 |
| 16:15.07 | arcol | but it does not really look like yours on the video |
| 16:15.23 | captainigloo | did you activaate elfe module ? |
| 16:15.30 | arcol | I have a [switch][back][forward][close] buttons at the very bottom |
| 16:15.32 | arcol | captainigloo: how to? |
| 16:15.50 | captainigloo | you should have a button with a key |
| 16:15.55 | captainigloo | on top |
| 16:16.02 | captainigloo | to activate e configuration panel |
| 16:16.03 | arcol | with a wrench? |
| 16:16.53 | captainigloo | yep |
| 16:17.13 | arcol | I dont see elfe anywhere? |
| 16:17.15 | captainigloo | then you slide the button bar and click on the Extensions menu |
| 16:17.28 | captainigloo | an in the list on modules |
| 16:17.44 | captainigloo | then you click on the module section |
| 16:17.58 | captainigloo | and you should see illume-home with a green button and Elfe without |
| 16:18.08 | captainigloo | unload illume-home and load elfe |
| 16:18.14 | morphis | mickey|bbl: what about trac registration these days? |
| 16:18.39 | arcol | utilities, system, look, files, launcher, core, mobile, settings |
| 16:19.04 | captainigloo | mobile |
| 16:19.06 | arcol | in mobile |
| 16:19.11 | arcol | I dont have elfe |
| 16:19.26 | captainigloo | so you don't have installed it |
| 16:19.39 | arcol | illume, illume-bluetoothe, illume-home, illume-home-toggle, illume-indicator, illume-keyboard... |
| 16:20.18 | captainigloo | did you run make install in elfe directory ? |
| 16:20.51 | arcol | hmm |
| 16:21.00 | arcol | there was an error loading module named elfe |
| 16:21.11 | arcol | heh |
| 16:21.23 | arcol | maybe I do need to run ldconfig or something like that |
| 16:21.54 | arcol | hmm |
| 16:22.11 | captainigloo | what the the error ? |
| 16:22.17 | arcol | module named elfe/linux-gnu-i686-ver-pre-svn-08/module.so coul |
| 16:22.20 | arcol | and it is truncated |
| 16:22.24 | arcol | cant move the window |
| 16:22.33 | arcol | there was an error loading module named elfe |
| 16:22.35 | arcol | module named elfe/linux-gnu-i686-ver-pre-svn-08/module.so coul |
| 16:22.41 | arcol | module search directories |
| 16:22.51 | arcol | would you like to unload this module? |
| 16:22.54 | captainigloo | in the terminal they should be the ecaxt error message |
| 16:22.54 | arcol | [yes][no] |
| 16:23.34 | arcol | http://paste.pocoo.org/show/369733/ |
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| 16:29.33 | arcol | lol |
| 16:29.47 | arcol | Enlightenment Error |
| 16:29.56 | arcol | This is very bad. Enlightenment SEGV'd. |
| 16:30.00 | arcol | ok. I gave up |
| 16:30.23 | arcol | I hate when I need to make install things, sooner or later somethin will correlate with some older verison |
| 16:30.25 | arcol | version |
| 16:32.47 | arcol | dunno why e searching for svn-08, when elfe installs svn-05 |
| 16:32.56 | arcol | when I make symlink, it does that |
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| 17:13.26 | morphis | mickey|bbl: ping |
| 17:17.38 | GNUtoo | JaMa|Off, it's not the mtd-utils |
| 17:17.49 | GNUtoo | where are older kernels with older images? |
| 17:18.07 | GNUtoo | *working older |
| 17:20.49 | JaMa|Off | http://build.shr-project.org/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/old/ |
| 17:23.02 | GNUtoo | what was the last working one? |
| 17:23.30 | JaMa|Off | later 2.6.32 should be fine |
| 17:23.36 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 17:23.38 | JaMa|Off | any later.. |
| 17:24.58 | GNUtoo | I'll try |
| 17:25.01 | GNUtoo | thanks a lot |
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| 17:39.34 | mickey|bbl | morphis: pong |
| 17:42.06 | morphis | mickey|bbl: I am currently doing some work related libfsosystem, whats our prupose about logging there? Should we use a AbstractObject to simplify this or use plain info/debug/error from glib? |
| 17:51.06 | GNUtoo | JaMa|Off, I've other errors: |
| 17:51.17 | GNUtoo | bad scanning informations, error 1 |
| 17:51.40 | GNUtoo | maybe it's better to forget about fixing it |
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| 18:51.10 | sC1 | jiha |
| 18:51.16 | sC1 | got shr working on the pre :) |
| 19:01.34 | pespin | sC1, nice :D |
| 19:02.06 | sC1 | pespin: oh yes took me two days :) |
| 19:05.48 | pespin | sC1, feel free to add infromation were you found problems please :) |
| 19:05.52 | pespin | *where |
| 19:06.10 | sC1 | pespin: i will, i will |
| 19:06.30 | sC1 | but i will talk to GarthPS about it because im not any farther than installing it :) |
| 19:08.57 | pespin | ok :) |
| 19:08.59 | pespin | dinner |
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| 19:39.55 | mickey|bbl | morphis: i think we should try not to depend on libfsobasics for libfsosystem, so lets use info/debug/error |
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| 20:00.38 | sC1 | shr on the pre is sooo fast :) |
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| 20:49.03 | morphis | mickey|bbl: ok |
| 20:54.46 | CIA-10 | freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07msmcomm * r4b0e59936eb1 10/libmsmcomm/COPYING: libmsmcomm: it should be GPLv2 and not GPLv3 |
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| 22:10.02 | GNUtoo | mrmoku, hi, did the phonet-utils went into oe with GPLV2 instead of GPLv2 ? |
| 22:17.43 | GNUtoo | *were the phonet-utils pushed to oe with the wrong license spelling |
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