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| 00:05.27 | Eryn_1983_FL | hey guys |
| 00:05.38 | Eryn_1983_FL | im trying to find some tool or boot disk to wipes some drives for me. |
| 00:05.57 | Eryn_1983_FL | i think dd? |
| 00:06.15 | Eryn_1983_FL | i tried to boot dban and its i686 and dont seem to like bios? |
| 00:08.46 | Eryn_1983_FL | dd bs=4M if=./dban-2.3.0_i586.iso of=/dev/sdd conv=fdatasync |
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| 00:30.18 | sponix2ipfw | Eryn_1983_FL: last time I checked the some live Linux like Mint have the shred command |
| 00:30.23 | ryouma | dd on devices is pretty good. there are also fs-level tools like wipe or whatever, one of which has kind of hilarious levels of paranoia-ish in the man page. some might work on devices so you don't need to boot. |
| 00:30.42 | ryouma | idk the options for dd though |
| 00:31.09 | sponix2ipfw | Of course dd with urandom does well enough for most things |
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| 00:40.32 | ryouma | it has been claimed that hdd are so dense that you only need one pass. idk if that is true. they keep getting denser which might imply otherwise. |
| 00:40.44 | ryouma | (or might not) |
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| 02:13.04 | SofS | About secure erasing whole disks, first there is the need to distinguish between SSDs and magnetic disks. On SSDs the only sure way to delete anything is by using the manufacturer provided secure erase tool as these will manage the blocks in use transparently behind the OS to prevent wear. For magnetic discs there are several tools, scrub (https://linux.die.net/man/1/scrub), shred (https://linux.die.net/man/1/shred), srm from coreutils (https://www.gnu.org/ |
| 02:13.04 | SofS | software/coreutils/manual/coreutils.html#shred-invocation) and the secure-delete toolkit (sfill, sswap, sdmem). |
| 02:16.07 | SofS | All of these have finer tuned and more expansive options than plain dd and each has its use case, read the respective manuals to be sure of what you need. |
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| 04:36.05 | *** topic/#debian is Current Debian release is buster, 10.5 point release /msg dpkg 10.5; /msg dpkg buster; /msg dpkg stretch->buster; /msg dpkg apt suite changed | Stretch has limited LTS support: /msg dpkg stretch-lts ; /msg dpkg 9.13 | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next @ irc.oftc.net | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog |
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| 05:55.01 | ryouma | badblocks can also do it |
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| 07:42.10 | jelly | > but not the end # well _that_ seems silly as well |
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| 08:38.24 | gzp | I would like to assign 3 different ip to one interfice on debian10, but seems like the second and third ip doesn't comes up. ifup says: ifup[320]: RTNETLINK answers: File exists |
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| 08:54.38 | bolt | gzp: Did you read https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkConfiguration#Multiple_IP_addresses_on_one_Interface ? |
| 08:54.58 | bolt | gzp: if you did, please show your work. what did you actually configure? use a pastebin, or ask dpkg about paste |
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| 08:59.12 | gzp | bolt, read it, and solved it |
| 08:59.46 | gzp | bolt, seems like only the manual approach works for me |
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| 09:03.56 | tmroland | i put 192.168.1.82 www.ark-fx.com www in my /etc/hosts as a solution to my hairpin NAT issue and it still doesnt work |
| 09:04.08 | tmroland | any ideas |
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| 09:27.36 | oxek | Is it possible to play DVDs on debian, without enabling non-free or contrib? |
| 09:28.37 | diogenes_ | oxek, via vlc on wine :) |
| 09:29.02 | ksk | oxek: https://wiki.debian.org/CDDVD#Watching_Video_DVDs |
| 09:30.02 | ksk | If it is protected DVD you will need to have the library to decode them - be aware that just enabling non-free and pulling a single package is not something bad per-se. |
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| 09:30.20 | ksk | s/pulling/installing/ |
| 09:30.49 | oxek | this is for a kiosk that will be in a school, where kids will be allowed to play DVDs |
| 09:30.54 | oxek | so we don't want to break any licenses |
| 09:30.58 | oxek | the DVDs are of course originals |
| 09:31.14 | oxek | I know windows license allows playing DVDs |
| 09:31.23 | oxek | (because it's included in the price) |
| 09:32.21 | ksk | eh? It is not about "paying money" or so. It is about Debian being "free software" - and the software needed to decrypt DRM of such DVDs is not "free, as in debian definition" |
| 09:33.13 | oxek | and the software to play DVDs is also not 'free' as in beer, because a license needs to be paid to decrypt DVDs, as far as I understand it |
| 09:33.25 | oxek | I'm reading through the wiki page though |
| 09:33.43 | ksk | "enable non-free; apt install $package" does not seem to invole "Put money here" :P |
| 09:34.17 | ksk | It might be that you run into legal stuff by using the library - but thats totally out of scope for #debian - contact a lawyer. |
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| 09:35.43 | ksk | Wikipedia does give some insight to that, whatever its worth. |
| 09:35.46 | SerajewelKS | regardless of legality, it is unlikely anyone would come after either an education institution or a home user |
| 09:36.00 | Oddmonger | hello, is using iptables a safe bet today ? |
| 09:36.09 | ksk | see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libdvdcss#Comparison_with_DeCSS |
| 09:36.18 | SerajewelKS | Oddmonger: nftables is the new thing but iptables still works |
| 09:37.07 | Oddmonger | ok so iptables will work for some year more, maybe ? :) |
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| 09:37.34 | SerajewelKS | probably many years still |
| 09:38.18 | Oddmonger | and i've read that nftables could be replaced by « something else » due to low nftables using rate |
| 09:39.40 | Oddmonger | but if i can still use iptables, that's ok for me |
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| 09:40.26 | SerajewelKS | nftables was only fairly recently released |
| 09:40.36 | SerajewelKS | i'm not sure where you read that but it sounds like uninformed FUD |
| 09:41.14 | SerajewelKS | well, i guess it's been in the kernel since 2014 but distros are starting to adopt it |
| 09:41.49 | SerajewelKS | iptables is now a layer on top of nftables so it's unlikely nftables is going anywhere |
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| 09:46.59 | Oddmonger | yes i've seen iptables was in «legacy mode» (but that's doesn't seem to be the case on my installed iptables) |
| 09:47.39 | Oddmonger | i have this version: Version: 1.6.0+snapshot20161117-6 |
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| 09:48.19 | Oddmonger | but the Debian has been installed quite a long time (may be one year or even more) |
| 09:50.01 | Oddmonger | /etc/debian_version: 9.13 |
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| 09:51.14 | ueb | Hello |
| 09:51.33 | ueb | mysql is ignoring server-id on cnf file |
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| 09:52.37 | ueb | even if the file /etc/mysql/mysql.conf.d/mysqld.cnf should be ok |
| 09:52.58 | ueb | here is my config https://pastebin.com/zeRs0c2q |
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| 09:54.23 | ueb | mysql service is running with: /usr/sbin/mysqld --daemonize --pid-file=/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.pid |
| 09:59.52 | jelly | ,v iptables |
| 09:59.55 | judd | Package: iptables on amd64 -- jessie: 1.4.21-2+b1; stretch: 1.6.0+snapshot20161117-6; stretch-backports: 1.6.2-1.1~bpo9+1; buster: 1.8.2-4; buster-backports: 1.8.3-2~bpo10+1; bullseye: 1.8.5-2; sid: 1.8.5-2 |
| 10:00.29 | Oddmonger | seems ok |
| 10:00.49 | Oddmonger | hope the nf_conntrack won't be lost too fast |
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| 10:02.00 | ueb | MySQL version is 5.7.31, how come is it ignoring server-id on file /etc/mysql/mysql.conf.d/mysqld.cnf ? |
| 10:02.19 | Oddmonger | iptables 1.8 seems «legacy» |
| 10:03.13 | jelly | Oddmonger, there are two different versions of "iptables" tools in Debian 10, one is legacy, one is nft backed and creates nftables rules in background |
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| 10:04.02 | jelly | I don't think it will take anything less than 10 years for "legacy" to disappear. They said ifconfig was legacy back in 2000 with 2.4 kernel. It still exists. |
| 10:04.56 | Oddmonger | well i've spent quite a lot of time on iptables, now it works as i want to, so i'm not in a hurry |
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| 10:05.40 | Oddmonger | now i'm using ipset for large range of filtering, but that's all i've added to iptables |
| 10:06.07 | jelly | ipset is just a performance addition to iptables |
| 10:06.27 | Oddmonger | i'm more annoyed with FTP conntracking which seem to have up and down in the kernel support |
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| 10:08.06 | Oddmonger | so i've used a kernel backport, but that's far from the ideal solution |
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| 10:22.44 | ueb | please help, any idea? |
| 10:23.07 | ueb | MySQL version 5.7.31 is ignoring server-id on file /etc/mysql/mysql.conf.d/mysqld.cnf |
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| 10:26.50 | ratrace | ueb: which debian version is that |
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| 10:27.43 | ueb | ratrace Debian 10 |
| 10:28.06 | RoyK | hm⦠do people still use mysql? |
| 10:28.06 | ratrace | ,v mysql-server |
| 10:28.07 | judd | Package: mysql-server on amd64 -- jessie: 5.5.60-0+deb8u1; jessie-security: 5.5.62-0+deb8u1; stretch: 5.5.9999+default; sid: 5.7.26-1; sid: 8.0.21-1 |
| 10:28.34 | ratrace | there is no 5.7.31 in debian 10. also, debian migrated to mariadb now, so should you if at all possible. |
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| 10:34.32 | ueb | ratrace mysql Ver 14.14 Distrib 5.7.31, for Linux (x86_64) using EditLine wrapper |
| 10:35.17 | jelly | ueb, you probably got that from mysql.com |
| 10:35.19 | ueb | installed .deb from mysql website |
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| 10:35.23 | ueb | jelly yes |
| 10:36.18 | jelly | we don't always know how packages coming from outside Debian work |
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| 10:36.38 | ueb | what do you suggest? |
| 10:37.01 | ueb | it's a slave which should replicate a MySQL master.. |
| 10:37.34 | jelly | ask vendor for support, or see if there's a mysql channel |
| 10:37.48 | jelly | or read docs? :-) |
| 10:38.08 | ueb | sure :( |
| 10:38.32 | ueb | I'm reading docs for weeks to solve this problem |
| 10:38.34 | jelly | that's the risk of using non-distro packages |
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| 10:38.46 | jelly | distro people might not know how to help |
| 10:40.07 | ueb | but you could know config file permissions, daemon and boot config |
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| 10:58.12 | oxek | does debian provide a supported way of running the longterm linux kernel version 5.4 as opposed to the current version in debian-stable which is 4.19? |
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| 11:01.56 | oxek | I see there are packages in buster-backports linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.2-amd64 linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.3-amd64 linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 |
| 11:02.05 | oxek | and I don't understand what that 2 3 4 means |
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| 11:03.43 | ratrace | oxek: debian uses LTS kernels in stable releases. bullseye's kernel will be available through backports on buster, but that won't be 5.4, but next LTS |
| 11:04.55 | oxek | both 4.19 and 5.4 are LTS releases, so I was wondering if the 5.4 LTS would be available in buster |
| 11:05.04 | oxek | (through backports presumably) |
| 11:05.18 | oxek | but there are 3 different packages, and I don't know if they even do what I think they do |
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| 11:06.08 | ratrace | oxek: bullseye and sid are past 5.4 now, so no, 5.4 is gone |
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| 11:06.55 | ratrace | ,v linux-image-amd64 |
| 11:06.56 | judd | Package: linux-image-amd64 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-security: 3.16+63+deb8u7; stretch-security: 4.9+80+deb9u6; stretch: 4.9+80+deb9u11; stretch-backports: 4.19+105+deb10u4~bpo9+1; buster: 4.19+105+deb10u5; buster-backports: 5.7.10-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 5.7.10-1; sid: 5.7.10-1 |
| 11:07.10 | oxek | so what do packages like linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.2-amd64 do then? |
| 11:07.11 | ratrace | there's no more 5.4 |
| 11:07.35 | ratrace | oxek: it's a backport but that's no longer available, did you run apt update any time recently? |
| 11:07.45 | oxek | let me check |
| 11:08.17 | oxek | hmm, it is still available to me |
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| 11:09.13 | ratrace | ,v linux-image |
| 11:09.14 | judd | No package named 'linux-image' was found in amd64. |
| 11:09.30 | oxek | apt list linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.2-amd64 linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.3-amd64 linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 |
| 11:09.39 | oxek | all 3 are available, and I now understand the difference |
| 11:10.02 | oxek | one is 5.4.8, then 5.4.13, and 5.4.19 |
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| 11:11.03 | oxek | obviously that means they are very much behind the upstream 5.4.60 |
| 11:11.09 | oxek | so I understand they are not to be used |
| 11:11.17 | oxek | (and I will not use them) |
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| 11:11.54 | oxek | odd that those packages are still available then |
| 11:11.59 | ratrace | the packages you mention are no longer offered in offician debian repos. I have no idea why you see them. can you pastebin apt-cache policy linux-image-amd64 ? |
| 11:12.30 | oxek | https://0x0.st/igGZ.txt |
| 11:12.33 | oxek | it does not offer them |
| 11:12.40 | oxek | but I can still install them with apt |
| 11:13.32 | oxek | probably because linux-image-amd64 does not depend on those packages, but those packages can be installed directly |
| 11:14.40 | ratrace | linux-image-($uname a) is the actual package name, the rest are metapackages, like linux-image-amd64 which will pull in specific package version |
| 11:15.35 | oxek | linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 looks like an actual package name |
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| 11:16.43 | oxek | presumably, if that kernel were installed, then linux-image-$(uname -r) would output linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 |
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| 11:19.29 | ratrace | (and yeah, uname -r not -a, typo'd) |
| 11:20.23 | ratrace | oxek: I don't understand how your apt is seeing that but policy doesn't show the versions |
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| 11:20.33 | oxek | are you on debian stable? |
| 11:20.36 | ratrace | yes |
| 11:20.52 | oxek | what happens if you do apt list linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.2-amd64 linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.3-amd64 linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 |
| 11:20.56 | ratrace | your own apt-cache policy list didn't show 5.4 |
| 11:21.37 | oxek | 'apt policy linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64' https://0x0.st/igGT.txt |
| 11:21.41 | oxek | it is there |
| 11:22.21 | ratrace | it shows the package. I never really used list and I'm not sure what it's supposed to do exactly. |
| 11:22.49 | oxek | ok then 'apt show linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64' still shows the package |
| 11:22.51 | ratrace | that package is maybe available in the archives, but it's not referenced throught the metapackage version, so shouldn't really be installed |
| 11:22.58 | oxek | I can even 'apt -s install linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.4-amd64' successfully |
| 11:23.08 | ratrace | at any rate, it's not official for buster, and won't be. bullseye/sid are moving on 'till the next LTS |
| 11:23.45 | ratrace | right if you apt policy _that_ specific package name, it shows. it doesn't show the version for policy of linux-image-amd64 |
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| 11:24.03 | ratrace | so, it's in the archive but not referenced through metapackage |
| 11:24.09 | oxek | correct |
| 11:24.11 | ratrace | ie, don't install it. |
| 11:24.22 | oxek | good advice |
| 11:24.29 | oxek | it confused me that it's still available in debian |
| 11:24.51 | jelly | judd, kernels |
| 11:24.52 | judd | Available kernel versions are: experimental: 5.7.0-rc5-686 (5.7~rc5-1~exp1); sid: 5.7.0-2-686-pae (5.7.10-1); bullseye: 5.7.0-2-686-pae (5.7.10-1); buster-backports: 5.7.0-0.bpo.2-686 (5.7.10-1~bpo10+1); buster: 4.19.0-10-686 (4.19.132-1); stretch-backports: 4.19.0-0.bpo.9-686-pae (4.19.118-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.19.0-0.bpo.10-686-pae (4.19.132-1~deb9u2); jessie-backports: |
| 11:24.53 | judd | 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.12-686 (4.9.210-1+deb9u1~deb8u1) |
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| 11:25.31 | jelly | that'd be a "no" on 5.4 |
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| 11:25.59 | ratrace | jelly: but weirdly it still shows installable by apt |
| 11:26.17 | oxek | exactly |
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| 11:26.34 | jelly | where does it show that? |
| 11:26.35 | ratrace | https://bpa.st/YJ4A |
| 11:27.01 | jelly | someone forgot to apt-get update? |
| 11:27.01 | ratrace | it doesn't show in policy for the metapackage, not in apt search; it's just available directly named |
| 11:27.23 | ratrace | jelly: no, fresh up to date |
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| 11:27.34 | jelly | what does "apt-cache policy linux-image-5.4.0-0.bpo.2-amd64" say |
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| 11:28.03 | oxek | I like how jelly is asking ratrace exactly what ratrace was asking me :D |
| 11:28.36 | jelly | doesn't look _exactly_ the same to me |
| 11:28.42 | ratrace | jelly: it shows it available through buster-backports/main |
| 11:28.52 | oxek | jelly: https://0x0.st/igGB.txt |
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| 11:29.12 | ratrace | I see this too ^^ |
| 11:29.34 | jelly | ah, backport repos often have outdated packages still present, they're not cleaned automatically |
| 11:29.39 | ratrace | (yea it's not exactly the same, I asked about policy of the metapackage, linux-image-amd64) |
| 11:30.03 | ratrace | right, so it's in the archives but not in search nor referenced through metapackages |
| 11:30.37 | jelly | which search |
| 11:30.54 | jelly | should be there with eg. apt-cache search linux-image-5.4 or similar |
| 11:31.13 | ratrace | eh, ignore, it is yes, dunno what I type up before then.... |
| 11:31.17 | ratrace | *typed |
| 11:31.36 | ratrace | apt search --names-only linux-image- shows 5.4....bpo.... thingy |
| 11:32.22 | jelly | I have no idea what apt search does, sorry |
| 11:32.39 | ratrace | same as apt-cache search |
| 11:33.31 | jelly | 15+ years of apt-cache search mechanical memory prevents me from caring about it |
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| 11:38.30 | oxek | so the answer to my question is that buster-backports is not automatically cleaned of 'stale' packages? |
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| 11:39.10 | jelly | yup |
| 11:39.21 | jelly | lots of cruft there |
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| 11:39.46 | ratrace | some big cruft it seems, 5.4 has been gone for months |
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| 11:41.08 | jelly | I think we use custom 5.4 somewhere for some reason |
| 11:42.15 | ratrace | 50% packet loss between ovh and hetzner, this is "brillant". Paula "Brillant". *flips table* |
| 11:42.46 | jelly | ovh is in .fr? |
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| 11:42.54 | ratrace | yes, but this i in FRA, .de |
| 11:43.17 | ratrace | inside .de, FRA to NÃR I think |
| 11:43.38 | jelly | I keep some of my crap in Dusseldorf |
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| 11:44.35 | ratrace | I'd like to move our backup servers from OVH.de/FRA to Hetzner.fi/HEL |
| 11:44.42 | algun | THe download button on the homepage leads to a 404 instead of the netinst |
| 11:44.52 | ratrace | thing is, I'm afraid of keeping both production and backups within the same company. |
| 11:45.06 | algun | nvm, that's just my "very old" translation |
| 11:45.14 | jelly | algun, which language? |
| 11:45.38 | algun | answers via PM |
| 11:45.51 | jelly | english page links to https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/current/amd64/iso-cd/debian-10.5.0-amd64-netinst.iso correctly |
| 11:46.03 | algun | yep |
| 11:46.25 | algun | is there still an exe installer perhaps? |
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| 11:47.01 | ratrace | like... windows exe? |
| 11:48.01 | algun | yes |
| 11:48.06 | *** join/#debian Dimitris (~dimitris@unaffiliated/dimitris) |
| 11:48.13 | algun | or maybe it was an msi, not sure |
| 11:48.32 | ratrace | not that I know of |
| 11:49.12 | jelly | there used to be a method to boot linux directly from win32, but that stopped working around uh... win7? |
| 11:49.43 | jelly | and a "goodbyewindows" custom installer web page used that |
| 11:49.48 | algun | yeah |
| 11:50.02 | ratrace | wasn't that just ubuntu.... what was it called.... thing something you start in windows and it reboots into iso |
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| 11:50.16 | oxek | that was in ubuntu, yes |
| 11:50.28 | algun | twas deb |
| 11:50.41 | algun | http://cdn-fastly.deb.debian.org/debian/tools/win32-loader/ was last updated 2019 |
| 11:50.46 | oxek | Wubi was the name of it |
| 11:50.52 | algun | not sure if that's related |
| 11:50.55 | ratrace | wubi, that's the one, thanks oxek |
| 11:51.25 | ratrace | meanwhile there's windd or google for "dd for windows" |
| 11:52.06 | oxek | between cygwin and WSL, there's little need for dd.exe or wget.exe unless as part of some project |
| 11:52.40 | ratrace | but dd.exe or whatsitcalled, ist just something oyu click, install, run, and bake your iso. cygwin and wsl are way more involved, right? |
| 11:53.02 | oxek | oh, then I am thinking of a different dd.exe |
| 11:53.30 | algun | don't remember it looking like this: https://web.archive.org/web/20110513175034/http://goodbyewindows.com/ |
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| 11:53.34 | ratrace | I had to use something like that last year. my computer broke and the USB thingy with recovery ubuntu live env was broken, so I had to bake a new one through friend's win machine |
| 11:53.36 | jelly | wsl or a VM (or wsl2, which is both) seem to be the easy ways of getting linux to run if you're mostly using windows |
| 11:54.09 | H4ndy | for bootable ISO/thumb drivers there are much better ways on Windows like that (usbit, Rufus, etcher, etc.) |
| 11:54.15 | H4ndy | WSL is a godsend, it works so well |
| 11:54.25 | algun | hey, here it is: https://www.goodbye-microsoft.com/ |
| 11:54.33 | oxek | etcher... using Electron framework to do dd |
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| 11:54.48 | H4ndy | Yeah don't go into specifics, I just talk about user experience ;) |
| 11:54.56 | H4ndy | Electron can die in a fire |
| 11:54.56 | ratrace | wsl is a gateway to allow (linux baseD) developers continue to use windows when MS switches to apple-lind of closed garden with MS store only installables |
| 11:55.27 | ratrace | apple-*kind |
| 11:55.51 | H4ndy | they tried and failed, I doubt it will happen anytime soon |
| 11:56.00 | ratrace | meanwhile, I'm happy my windows xperience is limited only to running it in a VM for the sole purpose to play win-only games that won't even run on steam+proton |
| 11:56.03 | oxek | I don't know how I feel about wsl yet. It's nice that I can run debian userspace in windows. |
| 11:56.07 | jelly | installing Debian from said store is still fun. |
| 11:56.38 | jelly | and very useful when you have too new hardware that works like crap natively |
| 11:57.02 | ratrace | there's so much betrayal in this channel now, I feel nauseus |
| 11:57.14 | algun | seems you're right jelly, I get an error trying to run http://cdn-fastly.deb.debian.org/debian/tools/win32-loader/testing/win32-loader.exe |
| 11:57.39 | ratrace | praises to WSL..... ugh.... how can you.... it's the tool in disguise for the final E |
| 11:57.46 | H4ndy | "betrayel" ha. I use the tool that I think is best for a task and this often involves Windows for me 𤷠|
| 11:57.54 | oxek | talking of newer hardware in debian, how much breakage is expected by running the backports kernel (linux-image-amd64)? |
| 11:58.25 | jelly | oxek, very little. Don't forget to grab matching backported firmware if you need any |
| 11:59.13 | oxek | thanks for the reminder, I would have forgotten about all this firmware crap |
| 12:00.15 | algun | can debian iso boot from an sd card like it can from a usb stick? |
| 12:00.38 | jelly | if your system can boot from an sd card, probably |
| 12:01.17 | cybercrypto | algun: I personally dont know any system (PC) that boots from sdcards. |
| 12:01.17 | jelly | I've only see bootable SD card readers on servers. |
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| 12:03.35 | jelly | a rackmount server these days usually has an internal usb port and/or an internal SD card place, so you can get otherwise diskless servers booting without having to set up netboot or boot from SAN |
| 12:03.44 | yanmaani | ratrace: agreed, it's sickening |
| 12:03.47 | yanmaani | LSW when?? |
| 12:04.57 | H4ndy | WINE? ;) |
| 12:04.59 | oxek | LSW? |
| 12:05.11 | oxek | oh... like WSL but other way round |
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| 12:05.27 | ratrace | you mean WINE? |
| 12:05.53 | oxek | wine is a good project, but somebody should throw a lot of money at them |
| 12:06.06 | jelly | it's called a VM and people already run Windows VMs on Linux and vice versa |
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| 12:07.36 | algun | oxek, Valve? |
| 12:08.01 | oxek | valve? |
| 12:08.17 | oxek | oh, that gaming company |
| 12:08.23 | oxek | I thought they are doing their own thing |
| 12:08.23 | algun | yes |
| 12:08.26 | oxek | proton or somesuch |
| 12:08.29 | yanmaani | jelly: Well yes but with nice performance, and WM integration |
| 12:08.40 | hwm4rgs | with office suites being good enough in the browser and supertuxkart having everything one needs for multiplayer gaming, there's no reason left ;) |
| 12:08.44 | yanmaani | Actually I think WM integration and some hacks for the hadrware accep would be fine |
| 12:08.53 | algun | it's a fork of wine |
| 12:09.02 | yanmaani | why fork it? |
| 12:09.15 | algun | because companies i guess |
| 12:10.05 | H4ndy | As someone involved with a OSS project, if the maintainer is not able to access the mass of code influx or wants the project in another direction, forks are just fine a solution |
| 12:10.32 | algun | this doesn't seem to be going in another direction |
| 12:10.38 | ratrace | and this particular fork is contributing back |
| 12:10.39 | algun | not that going in another direction is always justified |
| 12:10.54 | algun | or even most of the time imho |
| 12:11.01 | ratrace | has to be a fork, just like to use github code (with contrib in mind) you have to fork it too |
| 12:11.41 | algun | i'm not sure you do, but it's definitely unrelated |
| 12:12.01 | oxek | I don't think I played a single game since switching to linux |
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| 12:12.23 | ratrace | that's terrible |
| 12:12.33 | algun | me neither, though i wonder if this is a good thing (assuming i would be careful to choose only mind-expanding games) |
| 12:12.43 | algun | well, i did play a lot of minetest |
| 12:12.48 | algun | and hedgewars |
| 12:12.59 | oxek | I wanted to play some games out of nostalgia, but could not get wine to install them from CDs |
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| 12:13.23 | algun | eh, gotta run |
| 12:13.25 | algun | thanks for the chat |
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| 12:13.28 | ratrace | checked steam? I found some rather old games like Blood on steam |
| 12:14.12 | oxek | I'm not a fan of steam. It works for others, but I prefer fully offline games that I actually own as opposed to license. |
| 12:14.38 | ratrace | oxek: you never own a game even "offline". you own the piece of plastic it came with, but the software is licensed to you |
| 12:14.39 | oxek | plus steam has weird packaging in debian |
| 12:15.01 | oxek | ratrace: true. But at least I can't have some 3rd party terminating my account. |
| 12:15.05 | ratrace | dunno what you mean. apt install steam worked fine here |
| 12:15.24 | oxek | ratrace: yeah, but that does not install steam, that installs the steam installer which then installs steam |
| 12:15.34 | oxek | that's what I call weird packaging |
| 12:16.30 | ratrace | ah that. yes. well, that's because only the installer is dfsg compliant, iirc. also, steam needs timed and coordinated updates. debian maintainership process would nuke that. |
| 12:16.31 | oxek | and it requires dpkg addarchitecture i386 |
| 12:16.43 | ratrace | yea, the steam client is still 32-bit |
| 12:16.58 | ratrace | has to be, to support still-32-bit games |
| 12:17.21 | ratrace | (and by client I really mean the ubuntu12.04 runtime it comes with) |
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| 12:18.10 | ratrace | but all that is annoying a bit, I agree; which is the reason I'm running Steam appArmored, and am considering to switch to another linux VM entirely, since I have a windows VM for games too |
| 12:18.32 | oxek | I see steam has a flatpak version |
| 12:18.41 | ratrace | I hear it's very well curated |
| 12:19.05 | ratrace | ironically, there's no snap of it. and steam uses ubuntu runtime.... |
| 12:19.39 | oxek | I probably remember it wrong then, I thought steam's linux support was heavily based on debian - they even gave all debian developers free games |
| 12:19.51 | ratrace | you're thinking of SteamOS |
| 12:20.00 | ratrace | the steam linux client always had ubuntu runtime |
| 12:20.05 | oxek | probably, it's been a long time since I played games |
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| 12:21.16 | oxek | I might play around with dosbox to see if I can get some dos games working, and maybe some emulator for some other platforms |
| 12:21.20 | oxek | windows is a pain |
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| 12:22.19 | ratrace | windows is torture. |
| 12:23.09 | ratrace | I installed it with gpu passthrough few weeks ago, and thought the VM was being sluggish and in need of tuning until my windows using friend (also a windows admin) came and told me that's normal behavior.......... |
| 12:23.29 | ratrace | the games run fine tho, but otherwise, the ui, everything, it's.... unbearable. |
| 12:23.54 | oxek | modern UI in any system is unbearable. |
| 12:24.18 | yanmaani | Protip: If you ever need to do anything with Windows, use Windows Server or the Enterprise versions |
| 12:24.23 | ratrace | I've set up steam big picture mode so I don't even see windows under it |
| 12:24.32 | yanmaani | much more sanity, less tracking, etc |
| 12:24.47 | oxek | and the licenses cost 10x more |
| 12:25.01 | oxek | (and you can't even buy enterprise ones as a home user) |
| 12:25.02 | ratrace | well.... chances are you can find very cheap ones on ebay |
| 12:25.12 | ratrace | I got mine for w10 home for like 5⬠|
| 12:25.19 | ratrace | and! it's all legal. |
| 12:25.35 | oxek | I don't know about the ebay ones. I'd question the legality and I want all my stuff to be legal. |
| 12:25.42 | oxek | hence, debian. |
| 12:25.44 | yanmaani | Do people actually pay for Windows licenses? |
| 12:25.54 | yanmaani | (I don't use Windows, to be clear here) |
| 12:25.58 | oxek | I did, too many times |
| 12:26.03 | yanmaani | :O |
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| 12:26.21 | ratrace | it's very much legal. the EULA says you need an _invoice_ . I have an invoice, I bought it from a company that has EU VAT ID. It is not my responsibility or legal requirement, to check where _they_ got it from. I satisfied the EULA. |
| 12:26.25 | oxek | and a lot of the times I could not avoid it, e.g. when buying a laptop |
| 12:26.31 | ratrace | yanmaani: yes, I pay. |
| 12:26.40 | ratrace | I also donate to FOSSy software |
| 12:27.13 | yanmaani | it's not criminal to violate an EULA, just breach of contract |
| 12:27.28 | ratrace | and the contract says nothing about buying form third parties :) |
| 12:27.47 | ratrace | is that a loophole? dunno. but it's not illegal, and not in violation of EULA. |
| 12:27.53 | oxek | ianal, so I'd rather be safe than in jail |
| 12:28.11 | oxek | hence, debian |
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| 12:29.01 | ratrace | the friend who recommended this procedure, who is the said windows admin, told me he once bought a license key from microsoft.com directly. turned out, microsoft.com used a third-party vendor and later revoked the keys. |
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| 12:29.16 | ratrace | so.... yeah... legal. even MS does it through microsoft.com. |
| 12:30.11 | ratrace | if MS thinks the key is not legit, they're free to revoke it, but I have an invoice of legal purchase from a company with EU VAT ID. I'm within my consumer rights. |
| 12:30.38 | oxek | yeah, but how do you get MS to fix it? They are just like google - no way of contacting them. |
| 12:30.46 | ratrace | to fix what? |
| 12:31.02 | H4ndy | you contact your seller as they need to fix the situation |
| 12:31.10 | H4ndy | at least under EU law |
| 12:31.12 | oxek | and the ebay seller is long gone |
| 12:31.22 | ratrace | also it's not true, unlike google, microsoft has a 0800 number in most EU countries, and I called them a number of times in the past |
| 12:31.27 | yanmaani | Oksana: send a letter? call them? |
| 12:31.31 | yanmaani | oxek: * |
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| 12:32.05 | oxek | ratrace: with an actual human there? I only ever called the 0800 to get the license codes and it was a bot |
| 12:32.09 | ratrace | if they revoke the key, I just get a new one or reinstall anew. you can freely download the ISO from MS site, and it's free to use without activatoin key for 30 days, after which you just get a nag message about the key, but you can still continue to use it. |
| 12:32.43 | oxek | using the software after 30 days is in breach of license though. I even paid for winrar. |
| 12:32.44 | ratrace | oxek: yes, with an actual human. I used that line to fix windows xp licenses activation, windows 7 and 8 activation. with 10 I don't need it any more, it's all auto. |
| 12:33.01 | oxek | neat, so MS is better than google |
| 12:33.32 | ratrace | much better. I can get them to fix deliverability issues to @hotmail and @outlook.com. I can't get google, google doesn't have any email, contanct form, phone, nothing. |
| 12:33.39 | ratrace | MS >>>> Google. |
| 12:33.44 | yanmaani | Google does, I've contacted them |
| 12:33.57 | yanmaani | they're not very helpful but it is possible |
| 12:34.26 | ratrace | maybe if you called their switchboard in moountain view |
| 12:34.38 | yanmaani | that, or send e-mail, or send letter |
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| 12:34.43 | ratrace | but I can already imagine that convo if I called to say that they're blocking our email server for no apparent reason lol |
| 12:34.47 | ratrace | yanmaani: send email where? |
| 12:34.59 | yanmaani | ratrace: I remember there was a contact form somewhere |
| 12:35.05 | ratrace | maybe 10 years ago |
| 12:35.11 | yanmaani | 1-2 years |
| 12:35.13 | ratrace | while they still had "Do no evil" in their tagline |
| 12:35.16 | jelly | ratrace, where do you contact MS with SMTP issues? Asking for a friend |
| 12:35.50 | ratrace | jelly: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/supportrequestform/8ad563e3-288e-2a61-8122-3ba03d6b8d75 |
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| 12:35.59 | oxek | I still wish this was real https://xkcd.com/806/ |
| 12:37.49 | ratrace | lol that last panel...... I really wish that'd be the case too, yeah. |
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| 12:40.59 | Oddmonger | «is your computer on ?» «yes» / «have you reinstalled windows» «HAHA it doesn't work from my phone too, find something else !» |
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| 13:56.22 | mandeep | i have an encrypted disk that im trying to resize so i can create another partition. ive tried using google resources to find a method but keep running into problems where the free space on the drive isnt recognized |
| 13:58.20 | jelly | mandeep, what does your block device hierarchy look like? Pastebin the output of "lsblk" and "pvs" and "lvs" (run as root) |
| 14:00.10 | jelly | it's okay if you don't have pvs and lvs commands available |
| 14:00.22 | mandeep | jelly: http://paste.debian.net/1161144/ |
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| 14:01.01 | mandeep | pvs says only a few megs free, but i have 70gb free |
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| 14:03.45 | jelly | mandeep, the LV and filesystem containing your root filesystem is too big. To shrink ext4 it needs to be unmounted and freshly fscked; so, if you're going to do it that way, you need to boot some other linux, maybe a live usb or livecd |
| 14:04.22 | mandeep | yeah that's fine but since im not too familiar with this, ive been looking for a step by step guide but haven found anything that works |
| 14:05.12 | jelly | how much of your / is filled up? |
| 14:05.27 | jelly | df / or df -h / or just df |
| 14:05.35 | mandeep | 69% |
| 14:05.56 | jelly | and you need a new filesystem how big? |
| 14:06.06 | mandeep | i'd like to use 40gb |
| 14:06.13 | mandeep | so i guess 15-20% |
| 14:06.51 | jelly | if you have a second disk, make a backup before doing anything |
| 14:06.58 | mandeep | no second disk :( |
| 14:07.28 | jelly | what do you need that 40GB for? Maybe you can use an image file within the existing filesystem |
| 14:07.41 | mandeep | have to install ubuntu 18.04 for some work software |
| 14:08.00 | jelly | ouch. Do it in a VM? |
| 14:08.11 | mandeep | thought about it but i need speed |
| 14:08.38 | jelly | depending on what software it is, a chroot or systemd-nspawn container might work as well |
| 14:08.54 | jelly | you can use debootstrap to make a bionic chroot |
| 14:09.00 | mandeep | hmm' |
| 14:09.18 | mandeep | i tried a docker container and it came with its own set of problems. i wonder if a chroot would be similar |
| 14:09.23 | jelly | yes |
| 14:09.38 | mandeep | similar in that it has problems :( |
| 14:09.52 | jelly | but a different set of problems! |
| 14:10.17 | mandeep | haha |
| 14:10.19 | jelly | brb lunch |
| 14:10.21 | mandeep | i can give it a try atleast |
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| 14:10.53 | mandeep | problem is that i need a gui, so i dont think a container will work |
| 14:11.34 | jelly | sure it will work, just needs some coercing |
| 14:12.33 | jelly | GUIs are not magical, they just need a few resources from the X server or Wayland server accessible, and that can be added to a chroot or a container |
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| 14:12.58 | nvz | schroot does it for you |
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| 14:13.19 | neoclust | hello |
| 14:15.42 | neoclust | i try to install virtualbox on debian 10 but it fails to start |
| 14:15.47 | neoclust | the error message is: |
| 14:15.50 | neoclust | where: supR3HardenedMainInitRuntime what: 4 VERR_VM_DRIVER_VERSION_MISMATCH (-1912) - The installed support driver doesn't match the version of the user. |
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| 14:16.20 | mandeep | so what can i read about how to do the debootstrap with ubuntu? |
| 14:16.23 | ratrace | neoclust: VB is not supported on Debian 10 |
| 14:16.23 | neoclust | i have searched, and tried as asked to launch rcvboxdrv setup |
| 14:17.50 | ratrace | mandeep: did you try googling from "debootstrapping debian"? |
| 14:18.11 | neoclust | ratrace: oh :-( |
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| 14:18.30 | mandeep | of course, but i have no clue if something from 2010 is still relevant |
| 14:19.09 | ratrace | mandeep: should be, very little changed there. and you can always just TIAS |
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| 14:19.52 | mandeep | this seems like a lot more work than partitioning and installing a new system |
| 14:20.14 | mandeep | especially for someone who is not familiar with any of this |
| 14:21.01 | ratrace | mandeep: debootstrap effectively just unpacks the base distribution into a directory. that means you need to prepare the directoy with partitioning and other layers (lvm, mdadm, luks, anything you might want) |
| 14:21.15 | mandeep | argh |
| 14:21.20 | ratrace | mandeep: then you need to setup the resulting distribution with some basic configs like network, root/user password |
| 14:21.47 | ratrace | and in case of kernel/grub installation, you need to chroot into the directory for grub/initramfs hooks to autodetect and set themselves up |
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| 14:22.08 | mandeep | :( |
| 14:22.11 | ratrace | mandeep: it's worth learning. I use debootstrap only to install debians and ubuntus. primarily due to zfs, btrfs and luks interacting. |
| 14:22.51 | mandeep | yeah i agree but unfortunately im on limited time due to this being something needed for work and i needed to be up and running by yesterday |
| 14:23.36 | ratrace | mandeep: I'm sorry, there aren't any shortcuts really. debootstrap is the very low level way of installing |
| 14:24.19 | mandeep | gotcha. i guess worse case scenario i just nuke the drive and install ubuntu. and then along the way i learn about deboostrap |
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| 14:27.49 | amprxc | Hello, I want to transfer backup files with rsync. They are ZFS snapshots encrypted and compressed as bz2 files. Then, it is worth using the --inplace option ? I plan to use the options "-av --append" to resume stopped transfers. Is it ok ? Thanks |
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| 14:29.49 | ratrace | mandeep: why not install debian? |
| 14:30.13 | mandeep | ratrace: the software i need to install for work is only available on ubuntu. im already on a debian machine |
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| 14:30.45 | ratrace | amprxc: shouldn't need any special flags, rsync does delta transfers so in case of resuming, it'll continue only chunks that are not there |
| 14:30.58 | ratrace | mandeep: oh so you were asking how to debootstrap ubuntu... |
| 14:31.05 | mandeep | yeah |
| 14:31.26 | ratrace | well yeah maybe it's better to just use the installer if you don't have experience with deboostrapping. |
| 14:31.28 | mandeep | well i asked how to resize an encrypted lvm drive, but then the deboostrap idea was given to me |
| 14:31.32 | amprxc | @ratr |
| 14:31.42 | amprxc | ratrace oh ok ! thanks ! |
| 14:32.05 | ratrace | amprxc: btw... bad idea to use zfs snaps as files for backups |
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| 14:32.28 | amprxc | ratrace whyy ? |
| 14:32.45 | ratrace | because if the send or receive stream format changes, you'll lose them all |
| 14:33.14 | amprxc | ratrace I don't understand what you mean ? I already sent and receiced snaps successfuly |
| 14:33.55 | ratrace | amprxc: also, assuming you'll store them on an fs that doesn't do integrity checks like zfs or btrfs, then a bug mid-stream will basically destroy it, and you _will_ need to apply them all in order to restore |
| 14:34.19 | ratrace | amprxc: you're rsyncing snapshot _files_, correct? |
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| 14:34.50 | ratrace | somehow you made the snaps into bz2 files, and you want to transfer the bz2 files.... where? |
| 14:35.25 | ratrace | assuming not to another zfs system (as that would be very stupid), therefore I assumed you want to store them as individual files until the time you need to restore from them |
| 14:35.27 | amprxc | ratrace I did a ZFS send to a file, then compressed it with bunzip, then encrypted it |
| 14:35.50 | amprxc | ratrace I transfer bz2 files on another server |
| 14:36.01 | ratrace | amprxc: and this other server also has zfs? |
| 14:36.17 | amprxc | ratrace no it doesn't |
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| 14:36.47 | ratrace | okay so you're storing zfs snapshots as............. waitaminute, you're not talking about outputs of zfs send, are you? |
| 14:37.04 | ratrace | or you've literally tarballed a mountpoint? |
| 14:39.06 | amprxc | ratrace I use Proxmox and a ZFS FS. I export the VM ZFS FS with "zfs send", send it to a file, then compress it and encrypt it. And I transfer the bz2 file on another server. I also do that for ZFS snapshots... I don't see the prob |
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| 14:39.41 | ratrace | amprxc: the problem MAY happen at the time when you `zfs receive` from those files |
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| 14:40.03 | ratrace | and if those are incremental backups, then if there's a problem near the beginning, all your subsequent streams will fail |
| 14:40.04 | amprxc | ratrace It works well and I'm able to restore the backups... I never had aa prob with that... |
| 14:40.19 | amprxc | ratrace oooh yeah, i know that |
| 14:40.21 | ratrace | amprxc: so far, and what I'm telling you is that if the ZFS format of the send stream changes, you're done |
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| 14:40.41 | ratrace | ALSO... if there's corruption on the storage here you keep the zfs snaps, then the snaps are worhtless, esp. if incremental |
| 14:40.49 | amprxc | ratrace that's why I ALWAYS keep a FULL ZFS backup |
| 14:40.58 | amprxc | ratrace (at least one) |
| 14:41.08 | ratrace | which is worse than simply rsyncing at the filesystem level and then losing one file, instead of whole stream, in case of corruption, if you don't have something like zfs or btrfs on the receiving end |
| 14:41.10 | amprxc | ratrace then I can restore the incremental snaps |
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| 15:44.18 | sgo11_ | How can I make a terminal start with zsh? Thanks. |
| 15:46.25 | sney | just once, or do you want to change the default |
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| 15:47.44 | sgo11_ | sney: I want to change the default for terminal only. I am not familiar with these things. So I am not sure what will happen if I use zsh for everything. I think the booting process will need bash? |
| 15:48.21 | sney | you can change your user shell without changing the system shell. run 'chsh' and then enter /bin/zsh when it asks |
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| 15:50.20 | sgo11_ | sney: Will that affect anything except terminal? I am afraind changing default user shell will affact some user or system scripts? Thanks. |
| 15:50.31 | sgo11_ | s/afraind/afraid |
| 15:50.54 | sney | no, you can use anything for your user shell and it will have no effect on system scripts |
| 15:51.26 | sney | plus, most shell scripts specify what shell to use, so if you have a bash script and you execute it from zsh, zsh will call bash to run the script |
| 15:52.03 | alexrelis[m] | Hey guys, so I'm putting a CD in my server and when I try to access it in my file manager in an X2go session, I am able to access the Audio CD layer but not the CD-ROM layer. |
| 15:52.16 | ratrace | sgo11_: what do you mean by "terminal"? is that some gui application? |
| 15:52.22 | alexrelis[m] | I added my user to the `cdrom` group and I'm able to burn discs with Xfburn. |
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| 15:52.52 | sgo11_ | sney: got it. thanks a lot. I think I will need to re-define all environment variables in .zshrc again right? I defined them in .bashrc before. |
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| 15:53.04 | sney | sgo11_: yes, zsh won't read .bashrc |
| 15:53.40 | sgo11_ | sney: got it. thank you very much. :) |
| 15:53.45 | sney | np |
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| 15:55.02 | sgo11_ | Btw, I just want the zsh multi-line paste protection actually. Is that possible to enable it in the default bash? |
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| 15:55.58 | sney | I don't know offhand but zsh and bash do share a lot of features. look it up |
| 15:56.01 | sgo11_ | If that is possible, I don't need to swtich to zsh. multi-line paste is really dangerous. I made mistakes sometimes. Ctrl+Shift+V to paste the wrong thing. |
| 15:56.55 | sgo11_ | ok. thanks. I will google this. zsh supports this out-of-box. |
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| 15:57.59 | diogenes_ | sgo11_, xfce 4.14 terminal warns you by default when pasting multiple lines. |
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| 15:59.21 | sgo11_ | diogenes_: yeah, I realized that. But I am using kitty now. :) |
| 16:01.08 | jelly | ,i kitty |
| 16:01.10 | judd | Package kitty (x11, optional) in buster/amd64: fast, featureful, GPU based terminal emulator. Version: 0.13.3-1; Size: 1018.1k; Installed: 5911k; Homepage: https://sw.kovidgoyal.net/kitty/; Screenshot: https://screenshots.debian.net/package/kitty |
| 16:02.12 | sgo11_ | I found it. Bash supports it now. Just need to put "set enable-bracketed-paste on" to "~/.inputrc". Very cool. no need to switch to zsh. Not very familiar with it. |
| 16:02.59 | jelly | sgo11_, you would typically set env. vars in .zshenv if they needed to apply to all zsh instances, be they interactive or not, login shells or not |
| 16:03.18 | sgo11_ | GPU based terminal is very fast. I just started to use it today. |
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| 16:03.51 | sgo11_ | jelly: thanks for the tip. :) |
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| 16:43.18 | Eryn_1983_FL | hey guys |
| 16:43.33 | Eryn_1983_FL | what packages do i need for netork wired interfaces? |
| 16:44.02 | Eryn_1983_FL | dell inspirion 15 |
| 16:44.06 | sney | not much. ifupdown if you want to use /etc/network/interfaces. everything else is priority:required afaik |
| 16:44.09 | Eryn_1983_FL | qualcom atheros |
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| 16:44.29 | sney | it is very rare for wired nics to require firmware. |
| 16:44.29 | Eryn_1983_FL | i only see a wifi cared |
| 16:44.38 | Eryn_1983_FL | but i do got a hardwird network card |
| 16:44.39 | sney | might be disabled in efi then |
| 16:44.48 | Eryn_1983_FL | was working before. nothing disabled |
| 16:45.00 | Eryn_1983_FL | had reinstaled |
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| 16:46.17 | sney | do you see it in 'lspci'? |
| 16:46.42 | Eryn_1983_FL | nada |
| 16:46.45 | Eryn_1983_FL | just the wifi |
| 16:47.03 | Eryn_1983_FL | let me check the bios.. |
| 16:47.06 | Eryn_1983_FL | just incase |
| 16:47.07 | sney | then the hardware is disabled somehow. yes, go check |
| 16:47.12 | Eryn_1983_FL | yeah |
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| 16:47.57 | Eryn_1983_FL | got it |
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| 16:56.21 | Lady_Aleena | Quick question, how long does it take between a utility being modified, and it being part of update->upgrade? |
| 16:57.36 | yanmaani | Lady_Aleena: Quick answer: A long time, assuming you're on stable |
| 16:58.12 | sney | IDFMA. too many variables. |
| 16:58.43 | petn-randall | Lady_Aleena: Your question is quite vague. Are we talking packages? What do you mean with modified? Security updates might comes pretty quick, feature updates however only with a new Debian release. |
| 16:58.45 | Lady_Aleena | yanmaani, I'm on stable. So, something I really really wanted added to something that was will not be available to me for a while. â¹ |
| 16:59.24 | yanmaani | Lady_Aleena: Consider using backports, maybe |
| 16:59.29 | sney | a feature update could go from upstream to stable-backports in as little as 3 weeks, or as much as several years |
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| 16:59.38 | sney | !idfma |
| 16:59.38 | dpkg | Insufficient Data For Meaningful Answer |
| 16:59.40 | yanmaani | or, depending on what it is, they might have their own repo |
| 16:59.49 | Lady_Aleena | petn-randall, I asked for a new option for the linux-util column. My wish was granted, but I wanted to know how long it would take before I can use that neat new option. |
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| 17:00.48 | sney | I'd say look at tracker.debian.org to see if the update is in sid yet, but tracker is down |
| 17:00.53 | petn-randall | Lady_Aleena: Probably next release then, or you might get it via stable-backports. |
| 17:00.53 | jelly | hmm. Should update-pciids from pciutils use dpkg-divert instead of just overwriting /usr/share/misc/pci.ids |
| 17:01.09 | jelly | it's a packaged file after all |
| 17:02.11 | Lady_Aleena | petn-randall, I will wait until it is in stable. It's been so long since I installed anything from backports I've forgotten how to do it. |
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| 17:02.39 | sney | then you will be waiting until (minimum) Q3 2021 |
| 17:02.48 | Lady_Aleena | Darn. |
| 17:03.06 | sney | because the earliest stable it would be in is Debian 11 |
| 17:03.26 | jelly | my column comes from bsdmainutils |
| 17:03.45 | jelly | judd, find bin/column |
| 17:03.50 | judd | Search for bin/column in buster/amd64: bsdmainutils: usr/bin/column |
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| 17:04.20 | Lady_Aleena | sney, it is no fair! I see all kinds of updates whenever I apt update and apt upgrade. |
| 17:04.39 | sney | Lady_Aleena: you've been here for long enough to understand what Stable means |
| 17:05.02 | Lady_Aleena | sney, I know, I know...it's still not fair. :( |
| 17:05.02 | jelly | ,v firefox-esr |
| 17:05.03 | judd | Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-updates: 60.6.3esr-1~deb9u1; jessie-security: 68.9.0esr-1~deb8u2; stretch: 68.10.0esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 68.10.0esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 68.10.0esr-1~deb9u1; buster: 68.10.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-proposed-updates: 68.11.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 68.11.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: |
| 17:05.04 | judd | 68.11.0esr-1; sid: 68.11.0esr-1 |
| 17:05.47 | Lady_Aleena | Why do things like python get updates and upgrades, but something like column has to wait until the next stable? |
| 17:06.00 | petn-randall | Lady_Aleena: They get security updates. |
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| 17:06.29 | jelly | is your column in danger of collapsing |
| 17:06.55 | Lady_Aleena | jelly, no, but to use it as I want, I have to surround it by two seds. |
| 17:08.00 | jelly | that probably helps with stability |
| 17:08.11 | Lady_Aleena | (grep|find) ... | sed regex | column ... | sed xeger | sort |
| 17:08.24 | jelly | nods |
| 17:08.42 | Lady_Aleena | With the new option it would be... |
| 17:08.54 | jelly | aren't you a perl person, those might most/all be a single perl -pe oneliner |
| 17:08.59 | Lady_Aleena | (grep|find) | column -l 2 | sort |
| 17:10.14 | Lady_Aleena | jelly, I find that when I start trying to write a Perl one-liner, I end up writing a full blown script with more bells and whistles than I originally intended. The linux utilities keep me from going down rabbit holes. |
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| 17:13.07 | jelly | that can happen. |
| 17:13.34 | Lady_Aleena | And even with linux utils, I sometimes end up doing weird stuff. |
| 17:14.15 | jelly | or bsd, main, utils, as the case may be |
| 17:14.28 | jelly | hides |
| 17:15.27 | Lady_Aleena | Whatever...I learn how to do something new and then begin playing and doing more stuff. |
| 17:16.31 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.120.242) |
| 17:17.33 | Lady_Aleena | just had a "HAH!" moment. ⺠|
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| 17:23.51 | alexrelis[m] | Anyone know what I need to do to mount a CD-ROM as a regular user? |
| 17:24.04 | alexrelis[m] | I am able to mount Audio CDs but not CD-ROMs. |
| 17:24.24 | yanmaani | Is there any software like mousepad, but with autosave support? |
| 17:24.34 | yanmaani | I have a bad habit of opening a mousepad window to jot something down and then not saving it anywhere |
| 17:24.45 | yanmaani | I don't want full-fledged anything functionality |
| 17:24.49 | yanmaani | just mousepad with autosave |
| 17:26.13 | diogenes_ | yanmaani, not sure if any default text editors have autosave. |
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| 17:38.56 | leorat | I use knotes to jot things down, it saves it, then copy to text file later if i want to keep it |
| 17:39.03 | anonzzz | alexrelis[m]: maybe look at bashmount |
| 17:39.59 | yanmaani | leorat: Is that like a post-it note? |
| 17:40.05 | yanmaani | Or a proper notepad-style notepad? |
| 17:40.29 | leorat | yea like post-it |
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| 17:54.33 | Eryn_1983_FL | hey guys |
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| 17:54.41 | Eryn_1983_FL | whats the amd video driver called |
| 17:55.09 | greycat | There are a couple. "radeon" for most of the not-bleeding-edge cards. |
| 17:55.34 | diogenes_ | Eryn_1983_FL, radeon, amdgpu, amdgpu-pro. |
| 17:55.57 | anonzzz | Eryn_1983_FL: https://linuxconfig.org/how-to-install-the-latest-amd-drivers-on-debian-10-buster |
| 17:56.06 | greycat | use "lspci -nn" to see what your video devices are |
| 17:56.10 | sney | typically, install 'firmware-amd-graphics' and the kernel/xorg will handle the rest automatically |
| 17:56.26 | diogenes_ | there used to be ati, fglrx. |
| 17:56.41 | Eryn_1983_FL | 0300 amd |
| 17:56.52 | Eryn_1983_FL | apd family 15h |
| 17:57.08 | Eryn_1983_FL | models 60h-6fh io memory management unit |
| 17:57.21 | Eryn_1983_FL | [12033:2576] |
| 17:57.33 | Eryn_1983_FL | 1022:1576 |
| 17:57.41 | sney | ,pciid 1022:1576 |
| 17:57.42 | judd | [1022:1576] is 'Family 15h (Models 60h-6fh) Processor Root Complex' from 'Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]' with kernel modules 'ahci', 'sdhci-pci', 'snd-hda-intel' in stretch. See also http://kmuto.jp/debian/hcl/index.rhtmlx?check=1&lspci=1022:1576 and the out-of-tree 'snd-hda-intel' module. |
| 17:57.52 | sney | welp |
| 17:57.58 | Eryn_1983_FL | sorry |
| 17:58.13 | Eryn_1983_FL | 1002:98e4 |
| 17:58.17 | Eryn_1983_FL | rec c0 |
| 17:58.19 | Eryn_1983_FL | rev |
| 17:58.27 | sney | Eryn_1983_FL: install 'firmware-amd-graphics' from non-free and reboot. if you're still having video problems after that, provide details |
| 17:58.49 | Eryn_1983_FL | kk |
| 17:58.57 | Eryn_1983_FL | ty man i knew it was amd something |
| 17:59.01 | Eryn_1983_FL | installing now |
| 17:59.51 | greycat | Drivers and firmware are different things. Drivers are loaded into the kernel and run on your CPU. Firmware is loaded into the miniature computer on the device, and runs on the device. |
| 18:00.04 | Eryn_1983_FL | its working now |
| 18:00.06 | Eryn_1983_FL | ok |
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| 18:04.34 | Eryn_1983_FL | how do i get a uuid lsblk? |
| 18:04.40 | sney | blkid |
| 18:05.28 | Eryn_1983_FL | not installed |
| 18:05.53 | greycat | there's also lsblk -o +UUID |
| 18:05.58 | Eryn_1983_FL | was not in path lol |
| 18:06.04 | sney | !sbin |
| 18:06.05 | dpkg | Some binaries, particularly system utilities are installed to /sbin or /usr/sbin rather than /bin or /usr/bin. The former directories are not in a standard user's PATH. Try calling them directly, e.g. /sbin/ifconfig, or running them as root. |
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| 18:06.39 | diogenes_ | lsblk -o mountpoint,label,uuid |
| 18:10.17 | jhutchins | Eryn_1983_FL: When working with programs that affect the whole system rather than just one user, you generally need to be root. |
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| 18:10.32 | Eryn_1983_FL | i was root |
| 18:10.40 | Eryn_1983_FL | /usr/sbin/ was not in path like he said |
| 18:10.44 | sney | !buster su |
| 18:10.44 | Eryn_1983_FL | didnt know that |
| 18:10.44 | dpkg | In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). To approximate the previous behaviour, put "ALWAYS_SET_PATH yes" in /etc/login.defs. See https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster#Changes for details. |
| 18:10.57 | Eryn_1983_FL | ok |
| 18:11.12 | sney | resets the "days since someone admitted to using su wrong all this time" counter |
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| 18:12.16 | greycat | They're not using it wrong. Debian broke it and refused to consider how much pain they were causing, even after we told them, over and over. |
| 18:12.54 | ndegruchy | I use su and sudo wrong all the time. But I can remember stupid `tar` arguments, no problem |
| 18:13.07 | greycat | Being Like Red Hat was more important to them than supporting their users, or being backward compatible with themselves. |
| 18:13.32 | jhutchins | greycat: What other distributions (besides ubuntu) had the cludge? |
| 18:13.47 | sney | I've always been in mixed environments so I've always used su the non-debian way then, I guess. |
| 18:13.48 | greycat | It was not a kludge! It was the way su was SUPPOSED to work! |
| 18:14.14 | jhutchins | greycat: So who else did it that way? |
| 18:14.16 | greycat | Debian used a different source code for su before buster. One that worked the way most commercial Unixes work. One that works sensibly. |
| 18:14.29 | greycat | HP-UX, AIX, .... |
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| 18:18.16 | greycat | The fact that the workaround is to edit some other program's config file, which causes the OTHER program to emit a warning, is also reprehensible. |
| 18:19.31 | SpeedyG | hi, i've got two usb sticks which both seem to have a similar issue so i'm not sure if its the ubs sticks or the usb port.... when using dd, it says it wrote 3+GB/s to it and is done in less than a second but the partition table of the usb stick is all messed up... is there a way to fix it? |
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| 18:20.16 | sney | sync |
| 18:21.25 | SpeedyG | just the sync command? Or any options required? |
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| 18:22.08 | sney | just sync |
| 18:22.44 | SpeedyG | doesnt do a thing unfortunately... system still thinks there's 3 partitions on there |
| 18:22.45 | sney | iirc there's a dd option that writes directly without caching, which makes this unneccessary, but I don't remember what it is and I always just sync after |
| 18:24.31 | SpeedyG | dd'ing /dev/zero to the device also does not 'clean' anything... just finishes in a millisecond and doesnt change a thing on it... |
| 18:25.02 | sney | that sounds like bad flash then. |
| 18:25.17 | greycat | or you're using the wrong device |
| 18:25.37 | sney | or that. or some kind of read-only switch that's not visible in software? |
| 18:26.04 | greycat | hardware write-protect should give you an error, though |
| 18:26.06 | SpeedyG | hm, my guess would be bad flash then... |
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| 18:26.22 | SpeedyG | toshiba usb stick... has no switches on it |
| 18:26.56 | SpeedyG | thx |
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| 18:27.06 | SpeedyG | gonna try and find another one that does work |
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| 18:40.24 | jhutchins | SpeedyG: Do non-destructive things to it first, like mount and read. |
| 18:40.35 | jhutchins | SpeedyG: You're not mounting it before you do the dd are you? |
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| 18:45.54 | SpeedyG | jhutchins: automount... but then unmounting it first yeah |
| 18:46.24 | SpeedyG | the whole thing is kinda messed up.. wont mount, wont read, thinks there are partitions there which shouldnt be there |
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| 18:48.42 | jhutchins | SpeedyG: That is a common mode of failure on USB sticks, particularly if they report DOS partitions. |
| 18:49.17 | jhutchins | SpeedyG: I suppose another test would be to partition and format it. |
| 18:49.40 | jhutchins | SpeedyG: I presume you have checksummed the image you're using. |
| 18:50.09 | SpeedyG | yep, md5sum checks out ok |
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| 18:50.35 | SpeedyG | I think the partition table is messed up.. as it only sees 350M of the 8G (which is approx the size of the image0 |
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| 19:07.18 | oxek | I have a mystery to solve. I am on debian stable, and run the backports 5.7 kernel. When I look at the package 'wireguard', it depends on wireguard-dkms. But when I install wireguard, it does not install the wireguard-dkms dependency. |
| 19:07.33 | oxek | I know wireguard is part of the newer linux kernels |
| 19:07.37 | oxek | but how does apt know that? |
| 19:08.04 | sney | it's expressed in control somehow |
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| 19:09.38 | oxek | sney: doesn't control only happen after the packages are downloaded though? |
| 19:10.10 | sney | no, that is where dependency relationships are defined |
| 19:10.37 | oxek | ah, thanks for correcting me |
| 19:10.47 | oxek | apt is smarter than I thought then |
| 19:11.04 | ratrace | oxek: dependency on kernel version |
| 19:11.10 | ratrace | kernel *package |
| 19:11.36 | oxek | ratrace: that would make sense, but I don't see the dependency listed |
| 19:12.06 | ratrace | well that's how it _would_ ensure kernel version |
| 19:12.19 | oxek | ,depends wireguard --release buster-backports |
| 19:12.20 | judd | Package wireguard in buster-backports/amd64 -- depends: wireguard-modules (>= 0.0.20191219) | wireguard-dkms (>= 0.0.20200121-2), wireguard-tools (>= 1.0.20200513-1~bpo10+1). |
| 19:12.42 | oxek | and I have neither wireguard-modules nor wireguard-dkms installed |
| 19:13.23 | oxek | this leads me to believe that there are some 'hidden' dependencies for packages |
| 19:13.31 | oxek | and I'd like to know how I can see them |
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| 19:17.08 | SpeedyG | jhutchins: windows to the rescue.. after inserting the usb stick into a windows laptop, it started yapping about unreadable disks... reformatted it to fat32 7.8G and, after another reboot of my debian box, I was finally able to dd the image and use the usb stick as bootable debian stick |
| 19:17.50 | ratrace | oxek: I think that's a bit of a red herring. there are package that won't automatically install their dkms members. zfs or nvidia, you need to explicitly pull in the dkms packages too |
| 19:18.28 | oxek | ratrace: I don't have dkms installed though. |
| 19:18.44 | oxek | and the installation was very quick, there was no building kernel module step |
| 19:18.48 | ratrace | well that's my point, packages with -dkms need to have them installed explicitly |
| 19:19.09 | oxek | but when I try that on a debian-stable with the usual kernel, it pulls in those dkms dependencies |
| 19:21.08 | ratrace | are you sure it doesn't do that with the bpo'd kernel too? does here |
| 19:21.32 | oxek | I'm absolutely sure, no dkms installed. |
| 19:21.38 | ratrace | apt install wireguard pulls in wireguard, wireguard-tools and wireguard-dkms |
| 19:22.14 | oxek | uname -r |
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| 19:24.16 | ratrace | huh wait, I'm on stable kernel, I thought I was no bpo'd |
| 19:24.38 | oxek | I have a theory |
| 19:25.08 | oxek | If the backports kernel had a note 'Provides: wireguard-modules' then it would make sense |
| 19:25.13 | oxek | but I don't see such a note |
| 19:25.26 | ratrace | but that just can't be. assuming you're installing wireguard-1.0.20200513-1~bpo10+1, the dependency on -dkms is ther expressed in the package, unconditionally |
| 19:25.40 | ratrace | you sure you don't have some other version there? |
| 19:25.46 | ratrace | from bullseye or sid that maybe altered behavior? |
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| 19:26.20 | ratrace | (actually dependency is on wireguard-tools which in turn wants wireguard-dkms) |
| 19:26.25 | oxek | this is a fresh installation of debian stable, where I then installed the backports kernel using 'apt -t buster-backports install linux-image-amd64' and then installed wireguard |
| 19:26.58 | ratrace | oxek: did you reboot after installing bpo'd kernel? |
| 19:27.09 | oxek | yes |
| 19:27.28 | ratrace | and then you ran apt install wireguard and it didn't pull in wireguard-dkms ? |
| 19:27.30 | anonzzz | oxek: can you select the bpo'd kernel in grub? |
| 19:28.00 | oxek | anonzzz: yes |
| 19:28.19 | oxek | this is result of 'apt list wireguard*' https://paste.debian.net/hidden/acf25c6b/ |
| 19:28.35 | oxek | this is 'uname -r' 5.7.0-0.bpo.2-amd64 |
| 19:28.42 | ratrace | that list doesn't matter really. you should look for relationships with policy on metapackages |
| 19:30.01 | oxek | as I said, it's a mystery to me |
| 19:30.29 | oxek | ratrace: just like the mystery we had earlier about kernel 5.4 being in backports |
| 19:31.19 | oxek | oh and of course I should mention that wireguard works - I can generate keys, and connect |
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| 19:31.41 | oxek | and yes, I am definitely on debian-stable, not testing nor sid |
| 19:32.10 | ratrace | I'm firin' up mah kvm lazer! |
| 19:33.33 | oxek | this is my sources.list https://paste.debian.net/hidden/fe7be636/ |
| 19:33.50 | ratrace | ugh, wait, I have to bump it from 10.3 to 10.5 |
| 19:34.30 | oxek | I'm willing to provide any information necessary |
| 19:34.35 | ratrace | oh look, a xorg advisory.... |
| 19:34.44 | oxek | because I'd like to understand how apt know |
| 19:34.46 | ratrace | oxek: I'll try it in my test VM, just have to bump it to 10.5 first |
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| 19:35.11 | oxek | there's no rush, thank you for trying to replicate |
| 19:35.33 | Tyszka | what can I use to transfer a 100M file to someone using a Smart phone in Buster? |
| 19:37.41 | diogenes_ | tyzoid, bluetooth, usb, email. |
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| 19:38.00 | diogenes_ | Tyszka, sorry |
| 19:38.05 | oxek | obligatory xkcd https://xkcd.com/949/ |
| 19:39.22 | oxek | Tyszka: you could try https://0x0.st/ |
| 19:39.35 | oxek | max file size is 512MiB |
| 19:39.38 | sney | there are sftp and samba utilities for (at least) android, I've used those for transferring files to my phone in the past |
| 19:40.19 | sney | fx file manager is probably the most user friendly but I think you have to pay $3 or so for the network modules |
| 19:40.41 | ratrace | connect the phone, use file manager? |
| 19:40.55 | oxek | I made the assumption that the PC and the phone are not in the same room |
| 19:41.14 | ratrace | reading xkcd, they could very well be in the same room with an usb stick :))) |
| 19:41.24 | oxek | yeah :D |
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| 19:42.03 | greycat | "Transfer a file to someone who has a smart phone" doesn't necessarily say that the file must be *stored* on the phone in the end. You could just hand the person a CD with the file burned on it. Or USB stick for you younguns. |
| 19:43.01 | ratrace | seriously greycat, a CD. those things went extinct even before we sow our lawns. |
| 19:43.08 | Tyszka | ratrace, its a friends phone who is remote country |
| 19:43.24 | oxek | I made the right assumption then |
| 19:43.31 | jhutchins | Tyszka: email usually works. |
| 19:43.40 | oxek | not for 100MB |
| 19:43.50 | ratrace | email _should_ work for 100MB in 2020 |
| 19:43.56 | ratrace | esp. if freemail |
| 19:44.04 | oxek | should, but I'd not rely on it |
| 19:44.12 | Tyszka | doesn't gmail allow 4gb ? |
| 19:44.14 | jhutchins | Compressed. |
| 19:44.18 | oxek | in theory, there's no limit to filesize in the RFCs, is there? |
| 19:44.19 | Tyszka | sorry to ask |
| 19:44.20 | greycat | ratrace: I still have quite a few left on a few different spindles. Sadly, the burner in my PC stopped working a little while back, but I do have a USB CD burner I can hook up in a pinch. |
| 19:45.06 | ratrace | I diched mine with the 2015 computer upgrade. first one without a cdrom or floppy |
| 19:45.12 | jhutchins | oxek: AFIK there isn't, but in practicality you're going to hit limits on relay boxes. |
| 19:45.28 | Tyszka | oh gm is up to 50M |
| 19:45.29 | jhutchins | oxek: I think I've managed 20M. |
| 19:45.34 | oxek | jhutchins: yeah, and those relay boxes can have a limit as small as 20MB |
| 19:45.44 | jhutchins | oxek: I've seen 10M. |
| 19:45.59 | oxek | I remember when freemail had 10MB free |
| 19:46.21 | oxek | which was like thousands of emails, so who would ever need more? |
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| 19:46.52 | oxek | on the other hand, I remember when SIM cards were used for storing text messages, and the limit was 10 |
| 19:46.57 | oxek | 10 *messages* |
| 19:47.11 | ratrace | "640k ought to be enough for everyone." -- Billy the Vaccine Boy Gates |
| 19:47.33 | SpeedyG | we had an 8MB harddisk when I was young :D |
| 19:47.36 | Tyszka | oxek, was that when you had the Bee Gees poster? |
| 19:47.37 | oxek | yeah, 640k vaccines should be enough to start a zombie epidemic |
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| 19:47.52 | oxek | Tyszka: how did you know?? |
| 19:48.53 | Tyszka | mebbe i'll have to try dropbox or some such |
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| 19:49.18 | oxek | Tyszka: what's preventing you from using https://0x0.st/ |
| 19:49.36 | oxek | no ads, no captchas, no accounts, 512MiB limit |
| 19:49.45 | Tyszka | oxek, link looks scary |
| 19:49.58 | oxek | isn't it a null byte? |
| 19:51.34 | ratrace | oxek: okay I think I found it |
| 19:51.49 | ratrace | first, indeed, doesn't pull in -dkms with 5.7.0 bpo'd kernel |
| 19:52.12 | ratrace | second, I think that's because it depends on wireguard-modules OR wireguard-dkms, BUT the 5.7.0 kernel _provides_ wireguard-modules virtual |
| 19:53.11 | ratrace | oxek: https://sources.debian.org/src/linux-signed-amd64/5.7.10+1/debian/control/#L647 |
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| 19:53.36 | ratrace | so the only magick here is that the 5.7. kernel is providing the virtual that wireguard depends upon conditionally in "OR" relationship with wireguard-dkms |
| 19:53.54 | ratrace | in other words, the kernel carries the modules so dkms is not needed. which isn't the case with 4.19 stable kernel |
| 19:54.13 | oxek | ah, that's what I suspected. |
| 19:54.25 | oxek | but how can I get apt to show these 'Provides' lines? |
| 19:54.39 | ratrace | and sorry, wrong link anchor, the relevant line is #619 |
| 19:55.20 | oxek | nevermind, I see the line now |
| 19:55.42 | oxek | I forgot that if I do 'apt-cache show linux-image-amd64', it will show the non-backports kernel |
| 19:55.50 | oxek | which doesn't have the Provides line |
| 19:55.56 | ratrace | oxek: apt info linux-image-amd64 | grep Provides |
| 19:56.16 | ratrace | maybe dpkg-query has a way too, haven't looked |
| 19:56.18 | oxek | ratrace: ok yeah, I'm just blind |
| 19:56.23 | ratrace | like, list all them packages that provide package-x |
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| 19:56.35 | cVsup | somebody can say what this error? squid3: symbol lookup error: squid3: undefined symbol: _ZN7libecap4NameC1ERKNSt7__cxx1112basic_stringIcSt11char_traitsIcESaIcEEE |
| 19:56.46 | oxek | maybe I should run all output through lolcat, to give it some color distinguishing |
| 19:57.49 | oxek | ratrace: thank you very much for getting to the bottom of this |
| 19:57.52 | ratrace | np |
| 19:58.02 | oxek | I learned something new |
| 19:58.09 | ratrace | I was curious too. I hate blackboxes and magic. forgot about "provides" ability of packages. |
| 19:59.32 | greycat | cVsup: libecap4, eh? The squid package in buster depends on libecap3. |
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| 20:00.23 | cVsup | greycat, squid_3.5.23-5+deb9u3_amd64.deb |
| 20:00.34 | cVsup | depend libecap2 and libecap3 |
| 20:01.00 | greycat | I still suspect you've somehow mixed up packages from other releases, or upstream binaries. |
| 20:01.39 | greycat | Where do you see the error? How do you reproduce it? How does squid attempt to start on your system? Are there multiple installations of squid? |
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| 20:08.54 | jelly | ,depends squid --release stretch |
| 20:08.55 | judd | Package squid in stretch/amd64 -- depends: libc6 (>= 2.15), libcap2 (>= 1:2.10), libcomerr2 (>= 1.01), libdb5.3, libecap3 (>= 1.0.1), libexpat1 (>= 2.0.1), libgcc1 (>= 1:3.0), libgssapi-krb5-2 (>= 1.14+dfsg), libkrb5-3 (>= 1.10+dfsg~), libldap-2.4-2 (>= 2.4.7), libltdl7 (>= 2.4.6), libnetfilter-conntrack3, libnettle6, libpam0g (>= 0.99.7.1), libsasl2-2, libstdc++6 (>= 5.2), libxml2 (>= 2.7.4), netbase, |
| 20:08.56 | judd | logrotate (>= 3.5.4-1), squid-common (>= 3.5.23-5+deb9u1), lsb-base, libdbi-perl,adduser. |
| 20:09.13 | jelly | libcap2 and libecap3, different libs |
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| 20:10.52 | jelly | cVsup, pastebin the output of ldd /usr/sbin/squid3 |
| 20:11.13 | jelly | perhaps there are custom or leftover builds of some libraries |
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| 20:12.41 | greycat | also look for things like /usr/local/sbin/squid* |
| 20:13.03 | greycat | basically, any sign that someone at any point attempted to install a local copy |
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| 21:16.55 | anonzzz_3 | hi |
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| 21:17.31 | jelly | !qotd0 |
| 21:17.31 | dpkg | <MaXoM> hello i have a problem with squirrelmail can i help you? |
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| 21:18.33 | dvs | ??? |
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| 21:22.00 | FuzzyByte | â²_â² |
| 21:22.50 | tomreyn | yes, i also want to have a problem with squirrelmail, please help me! |
| 21:23.14 | dvs | formats the drive |
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| 21:23.23 | FuzzyByte | 0. What's squirrelmail? |
| 21:23.49 | LtL | web mail app |
| 21:23.55 | tomreyn | an old php web mail application |
| 21:24.35 | UncleCidd | It's taken me a good while for me to find this solution... is this the only workaround the people here are aware of off the top of your head? |
| 21:24.52 | UncleCidd | https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=210439 |
| 21:26.28 | FuzzyByte | sgo11_: "Multi-line paste is dangerous" Yes, but not a problem with zsh. |
| 21:32.16 | Aavar | How can i dissable showing contents of windows while dragging in cinnamon |
| 21:32.18 | Aavar | ? |
| 21:33.38 | FuzzyByte | Aavar: this isn't cinnamon support, but I'd guess somewhere in the graphical tools |
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| 21:38.31 | SerajewelKS | cinnamon is in debian, it's on topic here |
| 21:41.55 | Aavar | Thank you. Still can't find it though... Can find it on google eighter... |
| 21:42.39 | FuzzyByte | SerajewelKS: true, but there are dedicated channels for cinnamon afaik. |
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| 21:50.37 | n4dir | UncleCidd: if cinnamon is somehow related to the old gnome, i doubt that, then gconf-editor might be worth for a google search. |
| 21:51.00 | n4dir | related in how it does things. |
| 21:51.50 | flayer | a toast to democracy |
| 21:52.39 | n4dir | damnit, sorry, i meant Aavar . |
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| 22:59.16 | alex11 | i'm trying to copy files using Thunar onto an external hd to do a system backup/restore but the permissions get reset to rwxrwxrwx when i do that, any ideas how to remedy? |
| 22:59.59 | sney | the filesystem on your external drive may not support permissions. fat32 in particular does not. |
| 23:00.19 | sney | if you want to make a backup with the permissions intact, use tar. |
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| 23:01.39 | sney | e.g. tar cf /mnt/whatever/backup-date.tar /dir1 /dir2 /dir3 etc |
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| 23:45.45 | alex11 | sney, could i just rewrite the filesystem on it? |
| 23:46.24 | alex11 | i wonder if i could just mkfs.ext4 on it but i don't have too much experience with that |
| 23:48.33 | sney | alex11: yes, ext2 might be more sane since you probably don't need a journal on a backup drive, but that would work |
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| 23:49.07 | alex11 | does the drive need to be unmounted first? |
| 23:49.28 | sney | yes and then you run your mkfs on the partition |
| 23:49.45 | FuzzyByte | n o t the entire thing |
| 23:50.26 | alex11 | yeah, thanks for the reminder, i've definitely done it to /dev/sdc before and not /dev/sdc1 or whatever |
| 23:50.31 | alex11 | it does not turn out well |
| 23:50.48 | FuzzyByte | yes, which is why i was warning you, id di it mself |
| 23:50.55 | sney | I mean if it's a removable drive that will only have the one volume, it doesn't matter, but best practice is to use the partition |
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| 23:52.12 | alex11 | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:52.24 | alex11 | so... unmount it? |
| 23:52.42 | sney | [17:49:07] <alex11> does the drive need to be unmounted first? |
| 23:52.42 | sney | [17:49:28] <sney> yes and then you run your mkfs on the partition |
| 23:52.49 | alex11 | oh, i'm stupid |
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| 23:55.08 | alex11 | i swore i typed mount |
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